Why a Four-Time Super Bowl Champ Didn’t Get Help for His Depression | Terry Bradshaw

Hello, everybody, welcome to the 10 Percent Happier podcast, I'm your host, Dan Harris. We are all most of us, I think, at least occasionally performing versions of ourselves. And my guest is already laughing about this because he sees himself in this. These personas, these masks that we sometimes have to wear can create a lot of stress because often there's this huge gap between how we act and how we actually feel, which is why I am so excited to speak to my guest, whose laughter you're already hearing. His name is Terry Bradshaw. He is, I don't think he needs much of an introduction, but he has won many Super Bowls as a quarterback and has now created this legendary career as a sports broadcaster. And he's got a new memoir called Looking for Terry, in which he talks about the fact that beneath his good old Terry persona has long lurked clinical depression. Terry Bradshaw, welcome to the show. Sorry, I laughed. No, no, no. But you were spot on. Who doesn't wear a mask? Right? Yeah. I mean, and eventually you got to take it off. I mean, people put masks on when they're dating. They put that good foot forward. That's why when you get married after so many years, you think you know them. You really don't because there is a mask that comes off when you get married, which is good. It's good. I like that. But yeah, sorry, I got a kick out of it. I have to say I'm so excited to meet you because I watch every Sunday. Thank you. I was telling you before we started recording, I have an 11 year old boy who's obsessed with football. So we consume a lot of Terry Bradshaw content. And I'm just grateful to you for what you're doing because I don't I think you're going to reach a lot of people. You already are reaching a lot of people who would not be comfortable talking about their mental health, especially men. I get it. And you're like, hey, I won four Super Bowls and I have clinical depression. That is so helpful. It's so hard. Can I explain something? It was 21 years since I did my last book. So much has happened to me in my life. And not that I'm so vain to think with America's just can't wait to get my book. Right. So I'm not that vain. I wrote the book for me, for my kids. And I wrote it for people out there that are curious about me because look, a lot of a lot of young people have no clue that I even played football. You know, a lot of them don't even know who I am. My son is very aware. And that's wonderful because he's a football fan. But I did this book and I said, so much has happened. I just want to not necessarily clear the air. I just want to refresh the air a little bit and just tell everyone that, you know, that I've been divorced three times. Am I proud of it? No, I got it right now. How did that happen? And in the book, I talk about how it happened. I had to take relationships and realize that all three were alike. Nothing wrong with those women. They're wonderful women. It's me because it didn't work. And so I had to find out what it was. And then I had to cut the chain for that. And I had to they had to be another me to come in and fall in love with something different for me. And man, that was that was a great lesson, but it was hard to do. Hard to do. And then depression, the depression was who's going to believe this? Because celebrities get I hate to use that word, but I got it. I got to tell you, I know I am one fits. Yeah. OK. And we get depressed and then we say, oh, you know, bless his heart. He's got depression. Oh, my God. Let me go buy his book. You know what I'm saying? Or I just got arrested. Here's my mugshot. Oh, if I told you I'm clinically depressed, but I've been drinking and or I'm on drugs or I'm running around on my, you know, significant other to try to find my happy place. And I open up about both of these because these are these are the demons, the two big demons in my life. And the more I talked about it, the better I felt about it, the more I liked myself because I sought help. And that was the difference. I recognized the problem in both and I sought to rectify the problem if it could be. And that's what this book's about. It's also about my faith. A lot of people don't know I'm a Christian, probably because I don't act like one, which is very I apologize. I try to be everybody, you know, I don't know which, but my faith means a lot to me. But I also own a bourbon company. So there's a little bit of guilt there. How can you do bourbon and be a Christian? I even had to tell my preacher, I said, look, I'm not drinking, getting drunk every day. I just enjoy the bourbon business and the company. So, so much in this book. And there's a lot of humor in it. And when I got through with the book, Dan, I just thought, God, you know, this is good. And so that's why I said looking for Terry, because it's a journey. You know, it's a wonderful journey. It's a journey filled with great events, great moments, great successes, but multiple failures. So maybe it helps. Maybe it doesn't. On the bourbon thing, didn't Jesus turn water into wine? You know what? I reminded my preacher that you keep the party going. No, you're right. Yeah, it's it's one of those things that that I'm Baptist. And so we'll we'll kind of eat our own if we can. You know, we'll punish us real badly. Maybe people don't know. I give all the money to church or give it to help people, people that are in need. They don't know that. So it's but yeah, I had to get past that, too. But I'm OK with that. Take me back to your childhood, this this gap between how you felt and how you acted. I have to imagine it started there. Oh, it did. For sure. You can you only know me 10 minutes. And, you know, I like I'd rather laugh. I'd rather smile. I get that. And as a child, I was, as I found out, also later in life, I deal with ADD. And so that explains it's like, oh, my God, I had ADD. Well, no wonder I couldn't focus in, you know, in math. No wonder I didn't like history or school. Why? It was such a struggle for me. And when my mother took me to a doctor, you know, basically, do I need to be on some? It was like, you know, he's a happy boy. He's he's got lots of energy, you know, so on and so forth. But they didn't treat that back then. They didn't treat that. And so as a child, yeah, always in trouble, always in trouble, good trouble, not bad trouble, always in trouble, always getting a spanking, always doing the wrong thing. You know, I was always pursuing football. Can you believe that at seven years old, seven years old? Tell your son he's at 11 at seven. I I want to play in the NFL. I loved it. I couldn't get enough of it. But as a young man, I needed to be busy, needed to be busy. I stayed busy. My mother never knew where we were because when we got up in the morning, my brother and I were gone. We had to worry about it. We were gone on our bikes. See you later. Come back for lunch. Gone. See you later for dinner. We were gone. And it's just kind of a cool way to grow up, grow up, grew up loving the country, grew up on my grandmother and grandfather's farm. That's where my happy moments were. My grandfather plowed with Tony and shorty, a pair of Clydesdales. I used to sit on him while he plowed. I used to fall asleep on the yolks. And he was always afraid I'd fall off. It made him nervous. But I always fall asleep. I love the smell of a horse of horse sweat. I love the cows. My grandmother would let me milk the Jersey cow. We raised pigs, chickens. That's how I grew up. And I grew up in a family, my grandfather especially, who was I know I'm just like him because he never met a stranger, always friendly, always given everybody anything. He had the sweetest, kindest man, you know, and he loved gospel music and he couldn't sing a lick. That was my environment. And that's what I love. And that's what I've carried with me till I'm 78 years old today. Did you find, though, that you were rewarded in the family for being cheerful and not so much for when you were sad? I don't think I was rewarded for being cheerful because I got a lot of spankings. I was an irritant. Did you know back then that there was that there was some sadness lurking in your psyche that. You're talking about depression that came later on in college. And then college, you carried over into the pros, I didn't know what the heck was going on. I just I just thought I was just sad, you know, for no reason. Sad. I had no idea. And it got worse when you had bad things and bad things happening. It got worse. I didn't understand it. There's a scene in the book where you're on the Steelers and weeping on the field after one of your divorces. I got sacked right before half. And when I'm on the field playing, my entire family could have been killed in a plane crash and I could have played. Because that's that's where I found my happy place when my dad died, I couldn't do the Fox pregame show because I'm the caretaker of my family, my mom and my family needed me. I don't think Fox understood that, but I did. And I wasn't going to do a Super Bowl, you know, and somebody else can take my place and somebody else can present the trophy. But I'm here for my family. When I was playing football, when I was going through divorce and as much as I hurt because of failure and all the things that you would think of when I played, I was fine. Matter of fact, Dan, when I played, played my best football. Go answer that. I don't know why I played. You know, I played my best. This is a moment you're talking about. I got hit right before half and I landed and basically the gun goes off and everybody leaves. And for some reason, I just broke, I just broke down, just started bawling. On the field, on the field, can you could you see it on the film? You saw me get sacked, but I don't recall them putting a camera on me and I couldn't get up. So they thought I was hurt. So the doctors and the medical people, our trainer, two trainers, two doctors came out, set me up. I was laying on my back and they set me up and I put my, just like I'm doing right now, I put my hands like this and I was just, I was just waylaying. I just couldn't stop and thank God for Ralph Berlin, who was our trainer and our doctor. And they just said, just don't worry about a thing. We got you. When you're ready to get up, we'll get up. If you're not ready to get up, we're not getting up. And I'll never forget that. And I just sat there and I was trying to get it together, but it just emptied. It just emptied on me. It just all that hurt and pain just just piled on me. And I, all because I got hit, sacked, and I was down for a while. And when I got up, the fans started cheering, yeah, you know, I had no idea I wasn't hurt. You know, nobody knows about that story. Till now. If you're a regular listener of this show, you know that we're always adding amazing new teachers and new guided meditations and hosting live sessions over on my app, which is called 10% with Dan Harris. What you might not know is that we also now have a full library of not just guided meditations, but also short courses and challenges. We've got a meditation masterclass with Joseph Goldstein. We've got Sharon Salzberg covering the Eightfold Path. We've got Diana Winston with her Reset Challenge. And next week we are dropping a new course from Sharon Salzberg and Andy Gonzalez. It's called Taking Care of Yourself So You Can Take Care of the World. It's an eight part course to help you develop skills for resilience and clear seeing. 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I didn't know what was wrong with me. I've been like that my whole life. Everybody's like that, aren't they? You know, how am I what makes me different? It probably is the very reason. And I say to men, primarily men, we won't seek help because we're macho man, you know, we're, we're big, powerful football players and football players don't cry. How many times you heard that football players don't cry? You know, you get up, you play hurt and so on and so forth, but be into our brains our whole life. That's why I tell in this book, I tell, Hey, look, not that I'm speaking to men, but I'm speaking to women also, but I just know that men are the worst. They're not going to get help. They're going to drink. You know, we're going to, I'm going to fix this with some booze or they're going to, they're going to do drugs. I'll just smoke or whatever it is I'm going to do, or I'll just run around on my spouse or my girlfriend because you know, that, that happiness right there is going to really, you know, and it's not, none of it works. What it does in my case, I can only answer for me. The depression would come and then I would sink. I would accept the low. All right. I, I would accept it not knowing what it was, never even thinking about depression and slowly get out of it. All right. And then you go a while back down, you go again, no reason, no explanation. When I finished playing, I get back to, I moved to Texas, I get divorced. That was tough to kids. So naturally I'm depressed. That's just a given. And then it just kept getting worse and I'm flying, I'm working, I'm, you know, I'm, I'm traveling around the country, miserable and just miserable. Coming home to my horse farm, going through the horses, miserable, nothing pleased me. Breakdowns. A friend of mine came over one day and I just, he said, man, are you okay? I said, I don't know what the hell is wrong with me. I don't know what this is. He says, you're depressed. I said, well, yeah, I get depressed, but what's this? I just don't press it. Yeah. Yeah. You have a bad day at work. You get depressed. You press tomorrow. You're okay. Right. You move on. Up and down, up and down. Boy, it was just, Dan, it was, it was just a feeling. I just couldn't, I couldn't grasp it. And so finally I decided I, I gotta go get some help. Maybe something really wrong. Maybe something's really wrong. So I went and saw a doctor, family doctor. And I went in and he, we started talking and he asked me questions. We just kept talking. We talked for a while. Then he says, you ever thought about counseling? I said, no. They said, maybe we should get you some counseling. We could get you a Christian counselor. No, no, no, I don't want to do that. So he says, well, I've gone as far with you as I can go, uh, here, you need to go see this psychologist. So I went and spent a year with this psychologist going, going over my entire life. Then from him, I ended up going to a psychiatrist, another doctor, you know, tested me, do all the stuff they do. And he said, Terry, you're, you're, you're clinically depressed. We're going to do this. We're going to do that. And I'll never forget when he told me you're clinically depressed. I asked him, could you give me a shot? I didn't know. So that tell you how bad I was hurting. Can you give me a shot for this? And he said, no. So they started me on a medicine, which took a while, took a while for it to work. That is a dark period of my life that I'm just like, God, you know, thank God. I thank God I had the courage to go and seek help. That was the key. And one past man, one said, this is as far as I can go with you. The other guy says, we're going as far as I can go with you. So on. So on. And it's exhausting to talk about it. Actually, if we, you and I keep talking about it, I mean, let me tell you what will happen. It'll start creeping in the depression. Yes. It'll trigger. The other day I was talking with a gentleman and he, he kept, kept, no, I'm not complaining. I'm not just telling you. I'm just giving you an example. He kept on about this negative, this negative, this negative, this negative, this negative. And I kept talking and talking. And I said, I'm sorry, you're going to have to stop because, you know, I'm sinking here. Wow. I'm sinking. I can't talk about this anymore. And we stopped and got on to something good. Well, let me make that pivot myself because I don't want to trigger it. No, no, no. I would tell you, I would say, no, I'm fine. I'm just trying to explain. I want everybody to know I didn't seek help at first. I didn't know what was wrong with me. You get divorced. You, of course you're depressed. You have a bad game. Of course you're depressed. I mean, negative is negative. But now in my life, I have no reason to be negative about anything. I'm the happiest guy and, and I'm always a jovial guy. Here comes the demon. And thank God I'm, I married a woman that knows me better. She knows me well. And she senses when it's coming and she comes over and she, this is kind of cute, I guess. She gave it a name, Roy. And she says, is Roy trying to make a house call? And I'll say, yeah, Roy. She said, yeah. And she says, well, let's talk about it. And we start talking. So thank God for that. Right. Just to say, Tammy's a major figure in the book, which is, and the book is called Looking for Terry. And I just met Tammy. She's lovely. And this thing of naming the depression Roy, in my, in my opinion, a stroke of brilliance because, and there's a real tradition of, of this, both in religious traditions, but also in modern psychology of naming difficult parts of our person. Are you aware of that? No. Okay. No. So in modern psychological circles, there's a whole school of therapy called IFS, internal family systems, where you name different parts of your personality, which helps you deal with them more effectively. So we had a stroke of genius there and didn't know it. You know it now and it worked for you. Yeah. It's Roy. Yeah. And the great thing is I, I feel it coming. I feel it coming physically. She senses it coming mentally, emotionally. She senses, she knows before I, before I know. And so she named it Roy and it's kind of a chuckle, you know, cause it's got a name and it's Roy. And it, you know, so it works. It's more manageable when you name it. Yeah. Yeah. So when I talk about Roy and people do get a kick out of it, no one's ever told me what you just said, which makes me go on my wife. It's pretty frigging smart and she's smart. Yeah. Very smart. It reminds me of, uh, do you remember Peter Jennings? Yes. Yes. So Peter was my mentor for many years when I was at ABC Newscaster. And he once told me, this was a man who like you had been married four times. And he said to me, I have a piece of advice for you, Harris, marry well at least once. Oh. And it sounds like that happened for you. Yeah. And you can bet one thing that once is going to be the last time you marry unless something drastic happens. In the book, I really enjoy talking about all this because it's therapeutic. This is like when I was going to all these doctors and I'm just talking, I'm talking about Terry from a kid till current time, same as you and I right now. And it's, the more you talk about it, more stuff pops up, you know, the more I, I said, I never cried at my mother's funeral and I have to go back and look, my wife tells you right off the bat why I didn't cry because as a caretaker of the family, I'm the one that got punished the most. I'm the one that's more was expected of, I'm the one that was the biggest disappointment and I'm the one that sought out her love constantly, constantly. And after a while, I think you resent that you have to constantly seek approval from someone that you had done so much for, so much for because I financially could, right? Because I could. And yet at the end, you still don't feel appreciated. And it, and then when she ended, how come you haven't called me? You should call me. You did this and that. Well, mom, I'm traveling. You don't have to work so hard, you know? No, I have to work hard because, because I bought you that damn house and that thing cost me $600,000. Yeah, well, I bought you that Mercedes Benz you always wanted to, and that cost me $100,000. Yeah, well, I'll give you, and then you, you don't say this. I said it just now, but I started thinking about all the things that I've done to let her know how much I love her, how much, even those, those are materialistic things. She couldn't afford them. My dad couldn't afford them. And it's, I want her to have a better life, a quality of life. It seems to be never enough. But when she died, I didn't go look at her. I didn't view her at all. I didn't want to see her in a casket. And I just, I walked in and sat down with Tammy. The other day, my brother was listening to one of these podcasts and he said, uh, did you really mean what you said about mom, that you didn't cry at the funeral? I said, and I thought, oh boy, he's really hurt by what I, I said, Gary, yeah, I'm sorry. I don't know why, but when dad, when my father died, I couldn't talk. It killed me, destroyed me for a long time. He said, I felt the same way. Oh wow. I went, I didn't know about it. He didn't know about it with me. I didn't know about it with him. So and then you go back and you look, oh, your mother, how she was raised, why she was like this. And you go, bless her heart. I'm not punishing her for it. It's just, I loved her, you know, I just didn't cry. But it can create a lot of pain for a kid to be constantly attempting to please their mother and to not feel that it ever is enough. Yeah. Oh, how many kids out there are young people are listening to this podcast are going to go, ah, yeah. And you know what? My mother's been dead three years now. I have to be very careful or I'll put myself through guilt. I don't want to feel guilty. I don't want that now because there's nothing I can't undo it. You know, so do I have to forgive myself? Do I have to say, Terry, you're a good man. You're a good son. And I was, but I didn't cry at her funeral. Am I okay with this? Is that normal? Do I have to go back and see a doctor and say, well, I got some more stuff for you. How are you with that? I'm good. Most of it. Most of it. When I do talk about it, I tell, I tell Tammy, my wife, I tell her, dang, you know, and we'll get to talk. And she says, well, this is how she did. And she starts naming every time your mother treated you. She saw it. I don't, you know, I don't know. I don't think you can hold yourself responsible for your emotions. They are what they are. They come and you, you are, you dictating from moment to moment. I want anger. Now I want anxiety. Now I want sadness. Now you, you can't control it. And so that's the way you felt in that moment for, and it sounds like for some very good reasons. I, what I would wish for you is no guilt. Yeah. That now I look at it, I don't want to even have that thought. I don't want to have that thought. So I have to say, ah, ah, Terry, you were a good man. Now let's move on. And even Tammy, I'll talk, I'll say, I'll bring it out of the, it'll just come out of me. I just, I'll start talking about my mom and I'll, I'll always get back. And she'll say, honey, you were a good man. You loved your, you didn't hate your mother. You loved your mother. And she was this and this and this and what mothers and fathers don't understand. If you're tough on your kid and you, you know, cause she used to ask me, why do you work so hard? Why do you work so hard? I said, mom, let me tell you why I work so hard. Cause you told me I'd never amount to shit. She said, what? Cause you told me I'd never amount to shit. You want to know why I work so hard? Cause you told me I will never amount to shit. I didn't say that. You think I'd make that up? So, and then when I had heartaches, she'd be the one I'd go and cry on her shoulder. I'd lay my head in her lap. And so it, it's just why, you know, it's like most of my kids, I love them so much. I am never hard on them. And when I am, it's, I got a soft way of going about, I don't want my kids to say, oh, my daddy, you know, love conquers all. I believe that. And just that, but I, you know, one thing you go back and you look at your mother's life and you understand how she was raised, how she was treated. And then you can say, okay, but wouldn't you not want that to happen to your children and you? I wouldn't. That's why that way I was loved, which was great. My dad, my awesome, awesome. Oh my God. Awesome. I could talk to my dad and tell my dad, look, you cannot make decisions for me. I have to grow up and make my own decisions. And if they turn out good, good for me. And if they're bad, good for me. I'm going to learn either way. But if you keep making all my business decisions dad, you're gonna die one of these days and I am going to be lost And my dad never did it again I said I will ask for your for your advice and I did and I paid attention to it But that ended, you know that ended you got to do this. You got to do that and don't do this and don't it No, no, I'm you know, I'm claimed to be a grown man. And so but my dad was awesome. 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Will climb and conquer a mountain for you if you love on me If you beat me up and you punish me You will get nothing out of me. You will get resentment hate do not Punish me All right, you can whip me and I know when I deserve weapon that fine But if you want me to excel and encourage me, I'm and there's listen, there are more people out there I think like me, you know, you'll get what you get more bees with honey or whatever They all saying is yeah, if you if you're kind to me, I will love you to death I will do for you what you never thought anybody either a friend But if you're mean and unkind me if you're a friend while this will I'll wipe you off you're I'm through with you Yeah the reason I ask the question is it struck me listening to you that it was very Powerful and it continues to be powerful for you when in moments of doubt Tammy turns to you and says you're a good man. Yeah, and I know that for my own marriage. That's very powerful for me, right? ooh, and It feels to me and and we just met but in listening to you talk about your mother that that Sense that she thought you were a good man was not really conveyed to you And so when Tammy does it is scratching a deep itch. I initially took that as I married This Tammy's what I wish my mother was Emotionally and you're probably you're probably right now my mother loved me She but when you think about it as well, and I won football games when I done nice things and you know So and so forth But yeah, Tammy is Tammy Knows when she's wrong and I'm kind to her when I say When we disagree and we and we do but not that often And she'll tell you tell me if I'm right. I'll if I'm right, I will argue my point or if I feel I'm right and If I'm not sure that I'm right point. I will I will start a debate and Then it's not important that I win a debate that I'm not sold on You know what? I mean? Yeah, you're right, babe. Yeah, so I see your point. And yeah, it might had my mother I Wouldn't have played any better, but I would have been a happier kid for sure because there's nothing worse than Yeah, you know, it's just nothing worse than being punished for being verbally punished verbally beat up God Man, just why why do that? You don't forget that stuff It's interesting to think about the fact that part of your motivation as you described it earlier was Your mother would say to you why you're working so hard and you would say because you told me I would never amount to shit right and If she had been a little bit more loving and conveyed to you that actually she was not impossible to please or satisfy Would I still felt the same way would you still have worked so hard? Well, that's a good question probably yes, huh? Probably yes, but I just remember that's what she said. Mm-hmm, and I I didn't want to disappoint my mother. I Wanted to make good grades in school, but I didn't you know, I paid for it I'm not using that as an excuse for why I work hard Because I think everybody works hard, but I am also in my personality being ADD and Depression and all that stuff you deal with in your life I'm happiest and I'm freer in my spirit when I'm busy when I'm working when I'm you know What maybe I'm like a preacher, you know what a preacher needs more than anything from his flock He needs to be told by somebody man, what a great job you did today because he's giving to you he's pouring out all out to a thousand people and then he walks back to his office after the service is over and What's he got? What's his feedback? We're human beings. We need feedback I need to tell you that when I leave here today and I'm gonna tell you now I like you, you know I like you too. Yeah, so this is great. We're friends. This is great. I mean I Haven't said that and any interview I've done yet. You're the first person I've said that to and I've done 30 at least so I like so it's thank you. Can you imagine what it's like if if You get up and as a motivational speaker and I pour my heart and sell out so loud for 60 90 I mean I'm beating it and I'm creating this this This outline of success and happiness and freedom and conquering goals and Do it and you just pour it out and you've got five thousand people out there and you're lathered up with sweat You ain't got a dry thread on your body. You you have emptied the show. They got a call in the National Guard and nobody Nothing can you imagine what that's like nothing You get nothing in exchange and you walk off and what is the first thing you think about God I didn't do a good job I Don't write my speeches. My outline is in my head a lot of my stuff I already know and a lot of stuff while I'm talking comes to me I create you may lose with me, but you'll never win without me Which became a theme of our defensive line George Perlis He said what'd you say? And I came out of my mouth because Dwight White Tackled me in practice and I was steaming you don't touch quarterback practice He decked me and I got up and I took the football day and I slapped him right in the face with it And if he had come at me out, I fought him tooth and nail and I said you may lose you may lose with me Mad dog, but you'll never win without me. You got that and I went and sat on my home. I was steaming But ten minutes later he came over give me that saying what's saying, you know When you hit man favorite football and you got mad at me for a second. He's laugh That's it. I don't know what I said. Yeah, you do whether it's on but you're gonna win. We're gonna win We're gonna lose with me. How did I go? It took us? And I use it Anyway, some things come to you while you're talking. Yes, and they're like jewels You know, they're jewels. Where do they come? Where is the creative side? Where is that? Where'd that come from? It's like songwriter. Where'd you get that line? How'd you do that? How'd you write El Paso Marty Marty Robbins? Where'd that come from? How those licks fall together? You just don't know So it's just interesting How we need We need To feel that What we just did was good. We need to be appreciated. I feel it I mean, I've been a version of a performer my whole life and I definitely need it But part of me I feel a little guilty about it like what if I didn't need the if I didn't is it possible that I'd be happier if I Didn't require validation of that variety. I don't think that's human Yeah, do you in that part of our behavior maybe? one of our five sisters nine not one of our five cents, but you see my point is like I'll come up the Fox pregame show Sunday. Nobody applauds Nobody applauds. We go and we change clothes when after a 12-hour day We put on our traveling clothes to go home. And when I get back to the Hotel with my wife is waiting on me Sometimes she'll say something like oh I was real. Oh, that's a really good show But if she doesn't if she doesn't what do I do Dan Roy comes out? Oh, no Roy Well, maybe I I'll ask her. So what'd you think? How'd the show go? Yeah That's my wife and she'll say oh, it's a good show. Then what do we two weeks ago wasn't a good show for me I couldn't talk you ever had a day where you couldn't talk I couldn't make heads or tails out of nothing and I had all This information and I woke up at 2 30 in the morning and there she is I got a light on over my there and I'm going through notes to get shit. What are you doing? I said I can't I just I just feel like I'm not prepared which I'm totally I'm over prepared And it wasn't a good day. It was not a good day for me, and I I couldn't talk and So I came back and to the I didn't want to say anything because I knew it was bad. And so I said How'd it go today, babe? She said What wasn't your best show? But you know what? What if she said? Oh you were amazing now. I know it's bullshit Right now she is she is honest and she does and she knows I can handle it from her I can handle it, but I already knew it was a bad show Don't tell me I did good when I know I did bad But I I it is listen every podcast you do you may walk out of here and go home tonight And you'll go back over this maybe and you may say man That wasn't that didn't do my job today, but you know what? It's never as good as you think it is and blackness never as bad as it and that's what she honey, honey It you sounded fine Nobody knows that you didn't say what you wanted to say exactly and that you know, that's a good point But I I even text the producer on Monday and said hey, it wasn't my best day yesterday I owe you one. I never even heard back from him So, you know, he obviously didn't even notice either I I Wear a lot of t-shirts because I work from home and I'm a podcaster and so I can be as casual as I want and It's a nice little way to rebel against several decades in the news business when I had to wear a suit all the time And anyway the other day I was putting on a t-shirt and I thought man Is this one of these it looks really good and I was wondering goes this one of these expensive t-shirts that I got from My birthday that my wife got for me and then I realized no This is a t-shirt from quince which did not cost me much money at all and by the way is much nicer and More comfortable and better looking than all of the expensive t-shirts that I recently got for the aforementioned birthday You know those people The pieces in your closet that you find yourself wearing on repeat, the sweater that goes with everything, the perfect pair of pants or the tea you somehow always reach for first, those are the pieces that make getting dressed easy and that's what Quince does best. 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While I was writing the book and when I opened up about everything, bottom line is, Dan, I like me. I've got frailties, I've got scars, but I like me. I do the one thing I'm most proud of, and this is just the way God made me, I love people. I love making people happy. It makes me feel good. When I feel like I haven't done my job, I get upset. When I don't, like on the Fox show, maybe I didn't say something, I had a funny here and a funny there, then I think, well, you can't be too funny because it's a football show. No, we'll save it. Don't do it. It's a struggle. It's a struggle because I am a football guy. When I played quarterback, I wasn't funny. No, I didn't crack jokes in the huddle. I was serious. I'm calling plays. My brain's working. I'm looking at the down marker. I'm looking at this. I'm checking with the players. I'm asking questions. I'm busy trying to win a football game. Did I find him? I found him and I came away with, I'm a good man. I like me and I like the way I treat people. That makes me very happy. That's certainly my impression. Do you ever feel like, I don't want to do the Terry show? For example, the book opens with, welcome to my book. I'm the guy who plays Terry Bradshaw. See, I think that's funny. I started laughing. I think it's funny too, but you describe putting on your happy suit and things like that. Are there days where you're like, I don't want to do this? Yes. There are days I don't feel good. Maybe Roy is showing up. There's days I don't feel good. I'll tell you what, if I walk into my barn, my training center, and I'm not laughing and hugging on all my employees, which I do, when I leave and go out of there, they'll say, is he okay today? What's wrong with him? Did we do something? They feed off of my energy and my positive aura. It does wear you out because there are days when I got a lot on my mind. Flying out here, for instance, I'm quiet. I was quiet the whole way. I was reading. I was reading and reading and reading. I just finished this book by Bill McRaven. You ought to have him on your show, by the way. Admiral? Admiral Bill. Oh my God. It's the second time I've read the book. My heroes. He is so amazing. I just finished that book, and I was thinking about all these things. I was saying to myself, when I put the book down, I went, God, why can't I be this smart? Why can't I use big words like that? Why don't I have the respect? But when you're a four-star admiral, like my wife says, I said, God, these people were so nice to me. My wife sometimes just said, honey, you're Terry Bracho. Of course they're going to be nice to you. I'm a four-star admiral. Admiral, they're going to show you respect. Of course they are. You're their boss. So there are times when I'm deep into problem solving, when I'm in my vision moment where I'm trying, okay, do I do this? Do I do that? Do I need this? Do I that? I'm totally focused in on that. But I'm dialed out. I'm dialed out. And that's when a lot of times she'll say to me, are you okay? Is Roy showing up? No, no, I swear. I'll tell her, no, honey, I swear Roy's not showing up. I just got a lot. I got him thinking about some stuff, but yeah, but the top of that, the way the book starts, I love that. Put on my happy Terry, my happy, yeah, yeah. That's good. One last thing I want to ask you about from the book, you talk about having cancer twice in the same year. This was not long ago. Yeah. Three years. Three years ago. You 78 now? Yes. Um, yeah. Where are you in terms of cancer? Yeah. Like in terms of your own health and cancer free, cancer free. Yeah. Great. Yeah. I had Merkel cell cancer, which is the worst skin cancer. There is 2% of the world gets it at it over here. All this was taken out and, um, I had bladder cancer, all this big hole here. Yeah. This is, this has been the work. I mean, they're both bad. This one, your next height, I don't have any feeling and can't grow hair over here. Yeah. And this side of my mouth is dry. So food sticks, I'm always trying to eat on one side, but, uh, I got to ring the bell and, uh, MD Anderson, which is great. And then the bladder cancer was, I still have to, I still get, I get, uh, treatments every six months, preventative treatments and, uh, up at Yale, uh, Yale university hospital. And, uh, so cancer wise, you go back for all these treatments, Dan, and when you go in and you get, go through your exams, whatever they may be, cascades, whatever you got to wait, you get to, and the weight is done. The way it's, it's, it's just, what are you going to do? I try not to think about it. When I, when I was diagnosed with, um, bladder cancers is funny. We get back to Texas and, um, my wife walks in. She says, honey, I need for you to sit down. I went, I'm not sitting down. She said, I need you to sit. I'm not sitting down. I said, look, the last time I sat down, a woman came in and told me she wanted my ass out of the house at five 30 and she wanted a divorce. I am not sitting down. She said, well, you have Merkel cell cancer. I don't even know what that is. And she told me, and then can we treat it and what stages it in and so on and so forth. But I wasn't about to sit down. Were you in some way relieved that it wasn't, I want a divorce? Oh, absolutely. Oh, Dan, I wasn't sitting down. Have you not heard me yet? I wasn't sitting down. I didn't like the tone of her voice. The aging, getting older. Is that, how do you compute that? Is it scary? It's good. No, no. I love getting older. I listen, I've lived a marvelous, as most people would say, charmed life. I just, I'm sharing with everyone. It hasn't always been charmed. I'm charmed right now. I feel good. I, it hasn't been all charmed, but I, I wouldn't trade. I would, I would trade divorces for sure. I wouldn't trade my kids. I would love my children. I would, there are a lot of things I don't want to experience ever again, or I wish I never had experienced, but it may be in the person I am. I accept that I'm not perfect. And I have so much knowledge. I think that's pretty common. When you, when you live a long life, you gather a lot of knowledge and I've done a lot of things and I have a lot of experience in certain areas. And like when my kids said, dad, what's, what's secret to the happy marriage? I said, make sure you marry your best friend. Make sure they're your best friend. I couldn't, I couldn't, you know, if I'd have never been divorced, maybe that's what I would have found. You said that your last, what, your last, what was that? The line? Very well. At least once. At least once. Man, that is like classic. If I could remember it, I'll use it. But I don't regret, 78 is beautiful. I love my age. Yeah, I'm slower. I just had my hip replaced, two knees replaced, right ankles fused and got pins and plates in it. I mean, shoulder, oh man, I can just sit here and list stuff and just like, man, this is, it's okay. You know, it just, would I do it again? Okay. If this is where I'm going to end up, right here, you and I, Dan, yes, I'd do it again. If this is where I end up, I'd do it again because where I am right now, pretty good. It's an enormous pleasure to meet you and I really appreciate it. I don't like you anymore. I take it all back. I take it all back. It was not a pleasure to meet you. Yeah. No. No, thank you. This is, you know what I like about this interview? I'm talking to a pretty intelligent guy and I appreciate where you took me today. I normally, when I do podcasts and stuff, I'm normally like, well, Terry, you got a book out right now. It's called Looking for Terry and then you talk about depression and okay, good. Well, we're here in Chicago. Let's talk about those bears and it always, and I'm like, okay, I mean, out of respect, you do it, but I do appreciate this. I love doing these kinds of talks because there is more to me than the goofy guy you see on TV. Clearly. You know, there is more to me and I like the goofy guy, you know, I like the goofy guy. He's a fun guy. He really is. But there, you know, I'm not going to split atoms or cure cancer, but there is a certain amount of intellect here. I know how to do, I know how to fix a prolapse uterus on a cow. Nobody in this building can do that, but that makes me pretty smart. So there you go. Probably shouldn't have said that. You did a great job with this. Thank you very much. Thank you. This is awesome. Oh, thanks, Dan. Thank you very much for listening to the show. If you care about supporting independent media and creators who are trying to make the world a little bit saner, you can hook us up by liking or rating and reviewing and following the show wherever you watch or listen, subscribing for my newsletter on Substack, following me on social media. All of these things really do help us grow. It's a big deal to us and would just take about 30 seconds if you have the time and inclination. Thank you again for watching. Thanks for supporting what we do now to the credits. Thank you so much to everybody who works so hard to make this show 10 percent happier is produced by Tara Anderson, Marissa Schneiderman, DJ Cashmere, David Hart and Hayden Broom. Post production is handled by the great folks over at Green Horn Creative and Nick Thorburn of the great indie rock band Islands wrote our theme. Thank you for listening. Deuces. You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind. Here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Customers who switch and save with Progressive save over nine hundred dollars on average. Pop over to Progressive dot com, answer some questions and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by. In fact, 99 percent of their auto customers earn at least one discount. 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