The surprising product that built Italy's richest family

Well, I got to bleep this out, but Well, I got to bleep this out, but and he's extremely multi-billionaire. and he's extremely multi-billionaire. and he's extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely. [laughter] >> Sam, I have here in front of me >> Sam, I have here in front of me a letter that I need to read for you. a letter that I need to read for you. a letter that I need to read for you. So, I I open the mail and I see a So, I I open the mail and I see a So, I I open the mail and I see a invitation invitation invitation like this to a graduation. And I think, like this to a graduation. And I think, like this to a graduation. And I think, that's not my cousin, that's not my that's not my cousin, that's not my that's not my cousin, that's not my nephew. Who is this? nephew. Who is this? nephew. Who is this? Dear Shawn, my name is Quinton Wood. Dear Shawn, my name is Quinton Wood. Dear Shawn, my name is Quinton Wood. I've been listening to MFM for I've been listening to MFM for I've been listening to MFM for since 2021. Over the last 5 years, you since 2021. Over the last 5 years, you since 2021. Over the last 5 years, you and Sam's podcast has made a huge impact and Sam's podcast has made a huge impact and Sam's podcast has made a huge impact on my life, shaping how I see the world, on my life, shaping how I see the world, on my life, shaping how I see the world, investing in stocks, my goals, my life. investing in stocks, my goals, my life. investing in stocks, my goals, my life. Your podcast brought me a lot of joy and Your podcast brought me a lot of joy and Your podcast brought me a lot of joy and helped me through long runs and study helped me through long runs and study helped me through long runs and study sessions. sessions. sessions. You and Sam have directed my life for You and Sam have directed my life for You and Sam have directed my life for the better, so thank you. I'm a high the better, so thank you. I'm a high the better, so thank you. I'm a high school senior this year, and because of school senior this year, and because of school senior this year, and because of the profound impact you've made in my the profound impact you've made in my the profound impact you've made in my life, I want to invite you to my life, I want to invite you to my life, I want to invite you to my graduation and graduation party. He graduation and graduation party. He graduation and graduation party. He lives in He lives in Colorado. Thank you lives in He lives in Colorado. Thank you lives in He lives in Colorado. Thank you for Thank you for taking the time to for Thank you for taking the time to for Thank you for taking the time to read this and everything you do. Keep read this and everything you do. Keep read this and everything you do. Keep making more episodes. Sincerely, Quinton making more episodes. Sincerely, Quinton making more episodes. Sincerely, Quinton Wood, high school senior. Wood, high school senior. Wood, high school senior. Isn't this amazing? Isn't this amazing? Isn't this amazing? >> Baller. Congrats, Quinton. Congrats, Quinton. >> Take a bow, Quinton. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> How good is that, man? I I love this >> How good is that, man? I I love this >> How good is that, man? I I love this kid. kid. kid. >> If you're under the age of 24, you >> If you're under the age of 24, you >> If you're under the age of 24, you should do some of these things that should do some of these things that should do some of these things that might sound insulting, like we said might sound insulting, like we said might sound insulting, like we said that's endearing or I would never say that's endearing or I would never say that's endearing or I would never say that's cute, but like you feel like that that's cute, but like you feel like that that's cute, but like you feel like that emotion. emotion. emotion. You should 100% embrace doing those You should 100% embrace doing those You should 100% embrace doing those things because you can only get away things because you can only get away things because you can only get away with this at a very for the very small with this at a very for the very small with this at a very for the very small time, and it's totally appropriate and time, and it's totally appropriate and time, and it's totally appropriate and totally awesome. totally awesome. totally awesome. >> It's like pooping your pants. You can >> It's like pooping your pants. You can >> It's like pooping your pants. You can only do it for so long. [laughter] only do it for so long. [laughter] only do it for so long. [laughter] >> Well, then we could do it like later in >> Well, then we could do it like later in >> Well, then we could do it like later in life, but like life, but like life, but like you like this type of stuff 100% is you like this type of stuff 100% is you like this type of stuff 100% is awesome. awesome. awesome. >> And by By way, >> And by By way, >> And by By way, okay, a bunch of people have written but okay, a bunch of people have written but okay, a bunch of people have written but just inviting to the high school just inviting to the high school just inviting to the high school graduation is so endearing. I just graduation is so endearing. I just graduation is so endearing. I just thought. I was like, "Oh, that's so like thought. I was like, "Oh, that's so like thought. I was like, "Oh, that's so like so wonderful." And Diego was like, "So, so wonderful." And Diego was like, "So, so wonderful." And Diego was like, "So, we're going to go?" I was like, we're going to go?" I was like, we're going to go?" I was like, "No, hell no. We're definitely not "No, hell no. We're definitely not "No, hell no. We're definitely not going." But but I I will play him the going." But but I I will play him the going." But but I I will play him the song and and give him the clap. This is song and and give him the clap. This is song and and give him the clap. This is great. great. great. Okay, I want to tell you about this this Okay, I want to tell you about this this Okay, I want to tell you about this this business story that that business story that that business story that that to me this is this is a billy of the to me this is this is a billy of the to me this is this is a billy of the week. So, this is a week. So, this is a week. So, this is a a billionaire family that I I found a billionaire family that I I found a billionaire family that I I found really fascinating. I've been into these really fascinating. I've been into these really fascinating. I've been into these like family dynasties. Last last week I like family dynasties. Last last week I like family dynasties. Last last week I think we were talking about Cargill. And think we were talking about Cargill. And think we were talking about Cargill. And this one is this one is this one is >> Wait, can I want to try and guess these? >> Wait, can I want to try and guess these? >> Wait, can I want to try and guess these? I like trying to guess. I like trying to guess. I like trying to guess. >> Let me give you a couple of clues so you >> Let me give you a couple of clues so you >> Let me give you a couple of clues so you know which direction you're going. know which direction you're going. know which direction you're going. The richest man in Italy. The richest man in Italy. The richest man in Italy. >> Sunglasses or chocolate? >> Sunglasses or chocolate? >> Sunglasses or chocolate? >> Chocolate. >> Chocolate. >> Chocolate. >> Okay. [laughter] >> Okay. [laughter] >> Okay. [laughter] >> Do you know who it is? >> Do you know who it is? >> Do you know who it is? >> Yeah. I >> Yeah. I >> Yeah. I Roche Roche is it called Roche Roche Roche is it called Roche Roche Roche is it called Roche something? For for Ferrero Roche. something? For for Ferrero Roche. something? For for Ferrero Roche. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, >> So, >> So, okay. Well, you got that pretty quick. okay. Well, you got that pretty quick. okay. Well, you got that pretty quick. >> [laughter] >> It's a lot less fun when you just know >> It's a lot less fun when you just know the answer, huh? the answer, huh? the answer, huh? If I was a teacher, I would just be If I was a teacher, I would just be If I was a teacher, I would just be like, "Well, fine. Teach yourself then." like, "Well, fine. Teach yourself then." like, "Well, fine. Teach yourself then." And walk out of the classroom. And walk out of the classroom. And walk out of the classroom. Um Um Um Dude, this family story is amazing. So, Dude, this family story is amazing. So, Dude, this family story is amazing. So, I love Ferrero Roche the chocolate. I I love Ferrero Roche the chocolate. I I love Ferrero Roche the chocolate. I don't know if you've like if do you're a don't know if you've like if do you're a don't know if you've like if do you're a fan? Do we have Do we have one? Oh, fan? Do we have Do we have one? Oh, fan? Do we have Do we have one? Oh, here. So, if for those who don't know, I here. So, if for those who don't know, I here. So, if for those who don't know, I have some here. have some here. have some here. Got this from from the grocery store Got this from from the grocery store Got this from from the grocery store this morning cuz I was so inspired by this morning cuz I was so inspired by this morning cuz I was so inspired by these guys. I was like, "I'm going to go these guys. I was like, "I'm going to go these guys. I was like, "I'm going to go support their small business." support their small business." support their small business." >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah, you bought local. >> Yeah, you bought local. >> Yeah, you bought local. >> He's worth 32 billion dollars. >> He's worth 32 billion dollars. >> He's worth 32 billion dollars. Um so, the these chocolates are kind of Um so, the these chocolates are kind of Um so, the these chocolates are kind of amazing. They're The packaging is amazing. They're The packaging is amazing. They're The packaging is amazing. If you've ever had one of amazing. If you've ever had one of amazing. If you've ever had one of these, you really feel like you're these, you really feel like you're these, you really feel like you're eating something special. And that got eating something special. And that got eating something special. And that got me kind of interested in like, "What's me kind of interested in like, "What's me kind of interested in like, "What's the back story of this?" Turns out this the back story of this?" Turns out this the back story of this?" Turns out this family invented Nutella. They invented family invented Nutella. They invented family invented Nutella. They invented Tic Tacs. They invented like a whole Tic Tacs. They invented like a whole Tic Tacs. They invented like a whole bunch of Kinder the Kinder bars and bunch of Kinder the Kinder bars and bunch of Kinder the Kinder bars and Kinder eggs. They invented like several Kinder eggs. They invented like several Kinder eggs. They invented like several of these like really big things. And now of these like really big things. And now of these like really big things. And now they own a whole bunch of other they own a whole bunch of other they own a whole bunch of other businesses. So, I want to tell you that businesses. So, I want to tell you that businesses. So, I want to tell you that the story of this this company that's the story of this this company that's the story of this this company that's it's one of the most secretive it's one of the most secretive it's one of the most secretive family-owned businesses in the world. family-owned businesses in the world. family-owned businesses in the world. They do like $20 billion a year in They do like $20 billion a year in They do like $20 billion a year in revenue. The founder is the the the main revenue. The founder is the the the main revenue. The founder is the the the main guy that this the heir. He runs the guy that this the heir. He runs the guy that this the heir. He runs the company and is the richest man in Italy. company and is the richest man in Italy. company and is the richest man in Italy. And the way they did it is really And the way they did it is really And the way they did it is really fascinating. So, fascinating. So, fascinating. So, um back in the day this was post right um back in the day this was post right um back in the day this was post right after World War II, Italy, which was after World War II, Italy, which was after World War II, Italy, which was like, you know, not in great shape like, you know, not in great shape like, you know, not in great shape post-World War II, post-World War II, post-World War II, um it was trying to kind of bounce back. um it was trying to kind of bounce back. um it was trying to kind of bounce back. And so, this guy uh the grandfather uh And so, this guy uh the grandfather uh And so, this guy uh the grandfather uh of of this guy, he decides, "I'm going of of this guy, he decides, "I'm going of of this guy, he decides, "I'm going to start to start to start um making chocolate." Chocolate was um making chocolate." Chocolate was um making chocolate." Chocolate was really expensive. It was like this really expensive. It was like this really expensive. It was like this luxury item. It wasn't like a little luxury item. It wasn't like a little luxury item. It wasn't like a little common thing you found at every store. common thing you found at every store. common thing you found at every store. Not everybody was eating it. And so, he Not everybody was eating it. And so, he Not everybody was eating it. And so, he starts and he the he had the form factor starts and he the he had the form factor starts and he the he had the form factor wrong. He was trying to make a a bar wrong. He was trying to make a a bar wrong. He was trying to make a a bar like a a spread. So, it's like butter. like a a spread. So, it's like butter. like a a spread. So, it's like butter. It would be like this kind of hard It would be like this kind of hard It would be like this kind of hard chocolate like butter stick essentially. chocolate like butter stick essentially. chocolate like butter stick essentially. And his idea was like people would put And his idea was like people would put And his idea was like people would put this on toast and you'll have like a this on toast and you'll have like a this on toast and you'll have like a chocolatey toast. chocolatey toast. chocolatey toast. >> And I think at the time like chocolate >> And I think at the time like chocolate >> And I think at the time like chocolate was like something like it was it was was like something like it was it was was like something like it was it was like the equivalent of caviar. Like if like the equivalent of caviar. Like if like the equivalent of caviar. Like if you went to like a fancy dinner party, you went to like a fancy dinner party, you went to like a fancy dinner party, you would see it. And if I remember you would see it. And if I remember you would see it. And if I remember correctly, I don't even think it tasted correctly, I don't even think it tasted correctly, I don't even think it tasted nearly like it tastes now. It wasn't nearly like it tastes now. It wasn't nearly like it tastes now. It wasn't like like like >> They've just added butter and sugar over >> They've just added butter and sugar over >> They've just added butter and sugar over the years to the mix. It's like cuz if the years to the mix. It's like cuz if the years to the mix. It's like cuz if you have like a cacao bean or cacao you have like a cacao bean or cacao you have like a cacao bean or cacao powder, it's like bitter. It's like very powder, it's like bitter. It's like very powder, it's like bitter. It's like very bitter, right? So, so you you really bitter, right? So, so you you really bitter, right? So, so you you really have to like butter and sugar it up. So, have to like butter and sugar it up. So, have to like butter and sugar it up. So, he he tries the bar. People don't like he he tries the bar. People don't like he he tries the bar. People don't like it. They're complaining. They're like, it. They're complaining. They're like, it. They're complaining. They're like, "It's too hard. Doesn't spread easily." "It's too hard. Doesn't spread easily." "It's too hard. Doesn't spread easily." So, he's like, "Okay, I got to solve the So, he's like, "Okay, I got to solve the So, he's like, "Okay, I got to solve the spread problem." And he comes up with a spread problem." And he comes up with a spread problem." And he comes up with a jar with like a creamy chocolate, like a jar with like a creamy chocolate, like a jar with like a creamy chocolate, like a a jam basically. And it's like a a jam basically. And it's like a a jam basically. And it's like a precursor to Nutella. It wasn't quite precursor to Nutella. It wasn't quite precursor to Nutella. It wasn't quite Nutella yet. Um but the idea was like Nutella yet. Um but the idea was like Nutella yet. Um but the idea was like make it super spreadable, put it in a make it super spreadable, put it in a make it super spreadable, put it in a jar. jar. jar. And it was called Supercrema. And so, he And it was called Supercrema. And so, he And it was called Supercrema. And so, he starts trying to sell Supercrema and starts trying to sell Supercrema and starts trying to sell Supercrema and it's doing okay. It's him he's like the it's doing okay. It's him he's like the it's doing okay. It's him he's like the chef and he's just trying to make like chef and he's just trying to make like chef and he's just trying to make like delicious pastries basically. And he's delicious pastries basically. And he's delicious pastries basically. And he's got the brother who's the business side. got the brother who's the business side. got the brother who's the business side. And they're they're doing all right, not And they're they're doing all right, not And they're they're doing all right, not great. But, over time, the son takes great. But, over time, the son takes great. But, over time, the son takes over, And and the son is a bit more of over, And and the son is a bit more of over, And and the son is a bit more of an innovator. So, first, I think the an innovator. So, first, I think the an innovator. So, first, I think the government like bans the use of Crema in government like bans the use of Crema in government like bans the use of Crema in the name, so he's got to rebrand it the name, so he's got to rebrand it the name, so he's got to rebrand it anyways, and he decides to call it anyways, and he decides to call it anyways, and he decides to call it Nutella. And Nutella. And Nutella. And it was hazelnuts are a big ingredient it was hazelnuts are a big ingredient it was hazelnuts are a big ingredient for the thing, and he makes it he tweaks for the thing, and he makes it he tweaks for the thing, and he makes it he tweaks the recipe, makes it better, and the son the recipe, makes it better, and the son the recipe, makes it better, and the son starts innovating. He gets in the lab, starts innovating. He gets in the lab, starts innovating. He gets in the lab, and he basically creates he notices that and he basically creates he notices that and he basically creates he notices that breath mints are great, but there's all breath mints are great, but there's all breath mints are great, but there's all these problems. They come in these like these problems. They come in these like these problems. They come in these like big tins, hard to carry around, right? big tins, hard to carry around, right? big tins, hard to carry around, right? It's like big giant rectangle. To open It's like big giant rectangle. To open It's like big giant rectangle. To open it up, you had to like kind of find the it up, you had to like kind of find the it up, you had to like kind of find the seam and pop it open, and then, you seam and pop it open, and then, you seam and pop it open, and then, you know, if you wanted to like share it know, if you wanted to like share it know, if you wanted to like share it with somebody, they had to like dig with somebody, they had to like dig with somebody, they had to like dig through, touch all of them. And so, he through, touch all of them. And so, he through, touch all of them. And so, he creates the Tic Tac form factor. So, way creates the Tic Tac form factor. So, way creates the Tic Tac form factor. So, way easier to open, smaller box, smaller easier to open, smaller box, smaller easier to open, smaller box, smaller form factor, and the ads were all like form factor, and the ads were all like form factor, and the ads were all like one person's hand out, and then putting one person's hand out, and then putting one person's hand out, and then putting a Tic Tac in. And it was basically like a Tic Tac in. And it was basically like a Tic Tac in. And it was basically like a Tic Tac was almost like a social gift. a Tic Tac was almost like a social gift. a Tic Tac was almost like a social gift. It was a social icebreaker, something It was a social icebreaker, something It was a social icebreaker, something you want from somebody else. So, you want from somebody else. So, you want from somebody else. So, carrying it was almost like a a thing of carrying it was almost like a a thing of carrying it was almost like a a thing of power. power. power. >> These old Tic Tac ads are so good. If >> These old Tic Tac ads are so good. If >> These old Tic Tac ads are so good. If you Google vintage Tic Tac Italian ads, you Google vintage Tic Tac Italian ads, you Google vintage Tic Tac Italian ads, the old ads are like pretty awesome. the old ads are like pretty awesome. the old ads are like pretty awesome. >> A lot of the ads would have a question >> A lot of the ads would have a question >> A lot of the ads would have a question mark, which you would not normally do. mark, which you would not normally do. mark, which you would not normally do. You wouldn't say, Tic Tac, question You wouldn't say, Tic Tac, question You wouldn't say, Tic Tac, question mark, but the whole thing is basically mark, but the whole thing is basically mark, but the whole thing is basically it's an offer to somebody else. And um it's an offer to somebody else. And um it's an offer to somebody else. And um it's just a way to be smooth. Way way to it's just a way to be smooth. Way way to it's just a way to be smooth. Way way to It's a It's It's a It's It's a It's It's small talk for the mouth. It's small talk for the mouth. It's small talk for the mouth. >> Was Tic Tac the original name? >> Was Tic Tac the original name? >> Was Tic Tac the original name? >> Hey, I want to tell you about something >> Hey, I want to tell you about something >> Hey, I want to tell you about something pretty cool. We have a database of all pretty cool. We have a database of all pretty cool. We have a database of all of the business ideas that have been of the business ideas that have been of the business ideas that have been discussed on this podcast. So, hundreds discussed on this podcast. So, hundreds discussed on this podcast. So, hundreds of episodes, the team at HubSpot went of episodes, the team at HubSpot went of episodes, the team at HubSpot went through, they pulled out all the simple, through, they pulled out all the simple, through, they pulled out all the simple, relatable, interesting, profitable uh relatable, interesting, profitable uh relatable, interesting, profitable uh ideas that we have brainstormed, and ideas that we have brainstormed, and ideas that we have brainstormed, and they're all available for download for they're all available for download for they're all available for download for free. Just click the link in the free. Just click the link in the free. Just click the link in the description below. Thank you to our description below. Thank you to our description below. Thank you to our friends at HubSpot for sponsoring this friends at HubSpot for sponsoring this friends at HubSpot for sponsoring this podcast and putting together this free podcast and putting together this free podcast and putting together this free resource for you guys. Back to the show. resource for you guys. Back to the show. resource for you guys. Back to the show. Yeah, so so Tic Tac was a, you know, a Yeah, so so Tic Tac was a, you know, a Yeah, so so Tic Tac was a, you know, a brilliant name also, and it starts brilliant name also, and it starts brilliant name also, and it starts getting used in movies because the name getting used in movies because the name getting used in movies because the name is just like fun to say. And um and then is just like fun to say. And um and then is just like fun to say. And um and then he he's like, you know, we've talked he he's like, you know, we've talked he he's like, you know, we've talked about Touchland soap, this this this about Touchland soap, this this this about Touchland soap, this this this woman who who sold this company for I woman who who sold this company for I woman who who sold this company for I think $800 million or something think $800 million or something think $800 million or something recently. And what she does is she took recently. And what she does is she took recently. And what she does is she took Purell like hand sanitizer, this Purell like hand sanitizer, this Purell like hand sanitizer, this utilitarian ugly product, and she made utilitarian ugly product, and she made utilitarian ugly product, and she made it look like women's perfume and it came it look like women's perfume and it came it look like women's perfume and it came in different scents and it was all hand in different scents and it was all hand in different scents and it was all hand sanitizer, but you know, it's something sanitizer, but you know, it's something sanitizer, but you know, it's something small you'd want to carry in your in small you'd want to carry in your in small you'd want to carry in your in your purse that looked cool, smelled your purse that looked cool, smelled your purse that looked cool, smelled great, and didn't have like, you know, great, and didn't have like, you know, great, and didn't have like, you know, change of just change of just change of just competed in a different dimension than competed in a different dimension than competed in a different dimension than hand sanitizer. Not trying to kill more hand sanitizer. Not trying to kill more hand sanitizer. Not trying to kill more germs per second, but say your hands germs per second, but say your hands germs per second, but say your hands aren't going to smell like ethanol at aren't going to smell like ethanol at aren't going to smell like ethanol at the end of this, right? So So then then the end of this, right? So So then then the end of this, right? So So then then you have the the Ferrachet like you have the the Ferrachet like you have the the Ferrachet like packaging where it's like this this, you packaging where it's like this this, you packaging where it's like this this, you know, these golden nuggets, these like know, these golden nuggets, these like know, these golden nuggets, these like special things that are that are put special things that are that are put special things that are that are put into this. And so just brilliant all into this. And so just brilliant all into this. And so just brilliant all around in terms of like how they how around in terms of like how they how around in terms of like how they how they did uh the marketing genius behind they did uh the marketing genius behind they did uh the marketing genius behind some of these things. And so the brand some of these things. And so the brand some of these things. And so the brand takes off. It's doing really really takes off. It's doing really really takes off. It's doing really really well. He's an innovator. And now they're well. He's an innovator. And now they're well. He's an innovator. And now they're super secretive. I think for like super secretive. I think for like super secretive. I think for like up until four or five years ago they had up until four or five years ago they had up until four or five years ago they had never done an interview. They had never never done an interview. They had never never done an interview. They had never let anyone into the factory. It was like let anyone into the factory. It was like let anyone into the factory. It was like on some real Willy Wonka They um, on some real Willy Wonka They um, on some real Willy Wonka They um, you know, it was like the one journalist you know, it was like the one journalist you know, it was like the one journalist who got in was like, "This is actually who got in was like, "This is actually who got in was like, "This is actually less like Willy Wonka, it's more like less like Willy Wonka, it's more like less like Willy Wonka, it's more like Area 51." There was armed guards. They Area 51." There was armed guards. They Area 51." There was armed guards. They cuz they build their own machinery to cuz they build their own machinery to cuz they build their own machinery to produce the the chocolate. So they produce the the chocolate. So they produce the the chocolate. So they didn't want anyone to know the didn't want anyone to know the didn't want anyone to know the engineering behind their machinery, the engineering behind their machinery, the engineering behind their machinery, the recipes behind Nutella. They didn't want recipes behind Nutella. They didn't want recipes behind Nutella. They didn't want to know anything and they weren't really to know anything and they weren't really to know anything and they weren't really even using it for marketing purposes. even using it for marketing purposes. even using it for marketing purposes. Like the the grandfather it all the Like the the grandfather it all the Like the the grandfather it all the photos of him you'll see he's wearing photos of him you'll see he's wearing photos of him you'll see he's wearing dark sunglasses. He just never wanted to dark sunglasses. He just never wanted to dark sunglasses. He just never wanted to be seen, never wanted to be known. And be seen, never wanted to be known. And be seen, never wanted to be known. And so it only very recently did they start so it only very recently did they start so it only very recently did they start doing anything. doing anything. doing anything. And so then you have the grandson, the And so then you have the grandson, the And so then you have the grandson, the third gen. And so gen so gen one was third gen. And so gen so gen one was third gen. And so gen so gen one was kind of like kind of like kind of like um the pioneer trying to make it happen. um the pioneer trying to make it happen. um the pioneer trying to make it happen. It was sort of kind of like uh, you It was sort of kind of like uh, you It was sort of kind of like uh, you know, pioneers or what what is settlers know, pioneers or what what is settlers know, pioneers or what what is settlers get pioneers get slaughtered then the get pioneers get slaughtered then the get pioneers get slaughtered then the settlers do whatever then the settlers do whatever then the settlers do whatever then the townspeople build the empire. It's kind townspeople build the empire. It's kind townspeople build the empire. It's kind of that same thing. So, you know, he of that same thing. So, you know, he of that same thing. So, you know, he didn't really make it but the son had didn't really make it but the son had didn't really make it but the son had the breakthrough innovations and then the breakthrough innovations and then the breakthrough innovations and then that guy's son that guy's son that guy's son took on a totally different strategy. He took on a totally different strategy. He took on a totally different strategy. He went Warren Buffett. He was basically went Warren Buffett. He was basically went Warren Buffett. He was basically like, all right, inventing these like, all right, inventing these like, all right, inventing these products really hard, really expensive, products really hard, really expensive, products really hard, really expensive, really low hit rate. What if we went and really low hit rate. What if we went and really low hit rate. What if we went and found value brands that we could turn found value brands that we could turn found value brands that we could turn around? And so he went and bought around? And so he went and bought around? And so he went and bought Butterfingers and Baby Ruth and Crunch Butterfingers and Baby Ruth and Crunch Butterfingers and Baby Ruth and Crunch and like all these brands, acquired and like all these brands, acquired and like all these brands, acquired them, tried to revitalize the brand and them, tried to revitalize the brand and them, tried to revitalize the brand and then bring them back. And so he's built then bring them back. And so he's built then bring them back. And so he's built this portfolio of other brands now and this portfolio of other brands now and this portfolio of other brands now and he took like an M&A approach and I just he took like an M&A approach and I just he took like an M&A approach and I just thought thought thought what's the Italian word for private what's the Italian word for private what's the Italian word for private equity? Cuz that's what these guys equity? Cuz that's what these guys equity? Cuz that's what these guys >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> This is some beautiful private equity >> This is some beautiful private equity >> This is some beautiful private equity that I've been seeing in play here for that I've been seeing in play here for that I've been seeing in play here for the last the last the last >> That is so cool. >> That is so cool. >> That is so cool. >> 80 years. >> 80 years. >> 80 years. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I bought a I bought a Butterfinger last >> I bought a I bought a Butterfinger last >> I bought a I bought a Butterfinger last night. I I freaking love Butterfinger. I night. I I freaking love Butterfinger. I night. I I freaking love Butterfinger. I feel old but I like I eat them. feel old but I like I eat them. feel old but I like I eat them. I did. I I bought the uh the I did. I I bought the uh the I did. I I bought the uh the >> and Sam having a Butterfinger or what? >> and Sam having a Butterfinger or what? >> and Sam having a Butterfinger or what? >> I went to the CVS and I got the the >> I went to the CVS and I got the the >> I went to the CVS and I got the the movie style. You know how they like put movie style. You know how they like put movie style. You know how they like put like like movie style candy like in the like like movie style candy like in the like like movie style candy like in the box with like mini Butterfingers. I box with like mini Butterfingers. I box with like mini Butterfingers. I totally had a whole box to myself last totally had a whole box to myself last totally had a whole box to myself last night. So I'm on board with this guy. night. So I'm on board with this guy. night. So I'm on board with this guy. >> I don't like Butterfinger. Love Crunch. >> I don't like Butterfinger. Love Crunch. >> I don't like Butterfinger. Love Crunch. Uh Baby Ruth. Uh Baby Ruth. Uh Baby Ruth. By the way, not named after Babe Ruth. By the way, not named after Babe Ruth. By the way, not named after Babe Ruth. >> It's not? >> It's not? >> It's not? >> No. It's named after Ruth Cleveland, >> No. It's named after Ruth Cleveland, >> No. It's named after Ruth Cleveland, daughter of President Grover Cleveland. daughter of President Grover Cleveland. daughter of President Grover Cleveland. >> Oh, is Babe Ruth the baseball player >> Oh, is Babe Ruth the baseball player >> Oh, is Babe Ruth the baseball player named after her then? named after her then? named after her then? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I don't think so. >> I don't think so. >> I don't think so. >> Dude, you can't have two Babe Ruth I >> Dude, you can't have two Babe Ruth I >> Dude, you can't have two Babe Ruth I mean that's like there's not like mean that's like there's not like mean that's like there's not like >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I don't know how they got away they got >> I don't know how they got away they got >> I don't know how they got away they got away with that. Uh this is this is away with that. Uh this is this is away with that. Uh this is this is pretty awesome. Why are you pretty awesome. Why are you pretty awesome. Why are you um um um fascinated by this this topic? Because fascinated by this this topic? Because fascinated by this this topic? Because it's a clearly a trend. it's a clearly a trend. it's a clearly a trend. >> Well, I have all these like themes. So >> Well, I have all these like themes. So >> Well, I have all these like themes. So one is like huge businesses hidden in one is like huge businesses hidden in one is like huge businesses hidden in plain sight is always something that's plain sight is always something that's plain sight is always something that's interesting to me. So like, you know, interesting to me. So like, you know, interesting to me. So like, you know, I've been eating this but I never took I've been eating this but I never took I've been eating this but I never took the time to think "Who made this? What's the time to think "Who made this? What's the time to think "Who made this? What's the story of this? Why does this the story of this? Why does this the story of this? Why does this packaging look [clears throat] so packaging look [clears throat] so packaging look [clears throat] so different than any other product that in different than any other product that in different than any other product that in the entire store? And why don't more the entire store? And why don't more the entire store? And why don't more people do this? Why isn't like like how people do this? Why isn't like like how people do this? Why isn't like like how can you apply this marketing principle can you apply this marketing principle can you apply this marketing principle to another category? Like I just can't to another category? Like I just can't to another category? Like I just can't believe people aren't doing that. So believe people aren't doing that. So believe people aren't doing that. So that immediately my brain starts firing that immediately my brain starts firing that immediately my brain starts firing and I start fantasizing about these and I start fantasizing about these and I start fantasizing about these products I'm going to create before I products I'm going to create before I products I'm going to create before I remember I'm already rich. I don't want remember I'm already rich. I don't want remember I'm already rich. I don't want to work and I have just way too much to work and I have just way too much to work and I have just way too much work to do any of that, but if somebody work to do any of that, but if somebody work to do any of that, but if somebody ever did it, you know, like you know, ever did it, you know, like you know, ever did it, you know, like you know, kudos to them. And then I start thinking kudos to them. And then I start thinking kudos to them. And then I start thinking about about about >> Wait, really quick. Uh >> Wait, really quick. Uh >> Wait, really quick. Uh Rory Sutherland who we had on, he talked Rory Sutherland who we had on, he talked Rory Sutherland who we had on, he talked about uh what's the name of the soda about uh what's the name of the soda about uh what's the name of the soda that has the piece of foil on top? that has the piece of foil on top? that has the piece of foil on top? You know, the Italian also Italian You know, the Italian also Italian You know, the Italian also Italian actually. actually. actually. >> Uh >> Uh >> Uh no. no. no. >> You're close. Pella something. It starts >> You're close. Pella something. It starts >> You're close. Pella something. It starts with a P and it's a with a P and it's a with a P and it's a >> that lemonade-y type thing, right? >> that lemonade-y type thing, right? >> that lemonade-y type thing, right? >> a lemon flavored Italian soda. Is it San >> a lemon flavored Italian soda. Is it San >> a lemon flavored Italian soda. Is it San Pellegrino? Okay. I thought San Pellegrino? Okay. I thought San Pellegrino? Okay. I thought San Pellegrino was also water, but this is Pellegrino was also water, but this is Pellegrino was also water, but this is like San Pellegrino like soda. like San Pellegrino like soda. like San Pellegrino like soda. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And he was explaining how >> And he was explaining how >> And he was explaining how the tin over it, he's like that's a the tin over it, he's like that's a the tin over it, he's like that's a really small thing, but they did it to really small thing, but they did it to really small thing, but they did it to be like this can is extra clean and be like this can is extra clean and be like this can is extra clean and special. It's special. It's special. It's >> Fresh when you >> Fresh when you >> Fresh when you >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Pop in the seal. >> Pop in the seal. >> Pop in the seal. >> He was explaining the importance of >> He was explaining the importance of >> He was explaining the importance of something fairly insignificant in the something fairly insignificant in the something fairly insignificant in the grand scheme and how it and he was grand scheme and how it and he was grand scheme and how it and he was explaining the psychology behind it and explaining the psychology behind it and explaining the psychology behind it and and that really got me thinking and and that really got me thinking and and that really got me thinking and you're you're describing the exact same you're you're describing the exact same you're you're describing the exact same thing with the with the candy. It's thing with the with the candy. It's thing with the with the candy. It's wrapped in like a gold tin. wrapped in like a gold tin. wrapped in like a gold tin. And I was thinking about that a lot. I And I was thinking about that a lot. I And I was thinking about that a lot. I guess it's another Italian company guess it's another Italian company guess it's another Italian company pulling it off. pulling it off. pulling it off. >> Yeah, so I love the marketing mind. >> Yeah, so I love the marketing mind. >> Yeah, so I love the marketing mind. That's always a fascinating thing. I That's always a fascinating thing. I That's always a fascinating thing. I love businesses in plain sight. I'm love businesses in plain sight. I'm love businesses in plain sight. I'm always a sucker for you know the rich always a sucker for you know the rich always a sucker for you know the rich rich man in Italy and I'm like, "Sure rich man in Italy and I'm like, "Sure rich man in Italy and I'm like, "Sure don't." You know, tell me like this is don't." You know, tell me like this is don't." You know, tell me like this is this going to be an interesting story. this going to be an interesting story. this going to be an interesting story. And then I am also interested in these And then I am also interested in these And then I am also interested in these kind of family dynasty businesses um kind of family dynasty businesses um kind of family dynasty businesses um because because because I I think it's the businesses that I I think it's the businesses that I I think it's the businesses that really like really like really like withstand the test of time, they have to withstand the test of time, they have to withstand the test of time, they have to do like several miracles and one of the do like several miracles and one of the do like several miracles and one of the great miracles is that it has to get great miracles is that it has to get great miracles is that it has to get passed down to somebody who doesn't passed down to somebody who doesn't passed down to somebody who doesn't screw it up. And what I thought was kind screw it up. And what I thought was kind screw it up. And what I thought was kind of cool, there was a story about one of of cool, there was a story about one of of cool, there was a story about one of the one of the generations. I don't know the one of the generations. I don't know the one of the generations. I don't know if it's the current one. if it's the current one. if it's the current one. Um, by the way, I'm opening one of these Um, by the way, I'm opening one of these Um, by the way, I'm opening one of these up. I don't know if it's the current one up. I don't know if it's the current one up. I don't know if it's the current one or it's the the middle son, but he said or it's the the middle son, but he said or it's the the middle son, but he said something like he didn't even realize something like he didn't even realize something like he didn't even realize they were rich until he was like 15 they were rich until he was like 15 they were rich until he was like 15 years old. He's like, "I had no idea." years old. He's like, "I had no idea." years old. He's like, "I had no idea." Uh, they kept that from me. Uh, they kept that from me. Uh, they kept that from me. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> It's like the four housekeepers didn't >> It's like the four housekeepers didn't >> It's like the four housekeepers didn't tip you off. Uh, so I don't know exactly tip you off. Uh, so I don't know exactly tip you off. Uh, so I don't know exactly how that was possible, but you know, how that was possible, but you know, how that was possible, but you know, that apparently there was something in that apparently there was something in that apparently there was something in the upbringing where uh, I think they the upbringing where uh, I think they the upbringing where uh, I think they were they just spent so much time were they just spent so much time were they just spent so much time actually working in the like factory and actually working in the like factory and actually working in the like factory and and on the product that it wasn't clear and on the product that it wasn't clear and on the product that it wasn't clear like it there was more about the work like it there was more about the work like it there was more about the work and the craft than it was about the the and the craft than it was about the the and the craft than it was about the the prizes. prizes. prizes. >> That's awesome. I would love to um, I >> That's awesome. I would love to um, I >> That's awesome. I would love to um, I listened to a the reason I know very listened to a the reason I know very listened to a the reason I know very little about it, but I know some about little about it, but I know some about little about it, but I know some about it is because um, Founders, the Founders it is because um, Founders, the Founders it is because um, Founders, the Founders podcast, he did an episode on the podcast, he did an episode on the podcast, he did an episode on the family. And it's a pretty old one, so I family. And it's a pretty old one, so I family. And it's a pretty old one, so I listened to it a while ago. Uh, but it listened to it a while ago. Uh, but it listened to it a while ago. Uh, but it would be curious I would be curious to would be curious I would be curious to would be curious I would be curious to see like see like see like >> you ever like to listen to Founders >> you ever like to listen to Founders >> you ever like to listen to Founders without the research? MFM, we're here without the research? MFM, we're here without the research? MFM, we're here for you. for you. for you. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> While you're stuffing your face with >> While you're stuffing your face with >> While you're stuffing your face with food, which is like food, which is like food, which is like the that sounds great on a mic. Let me the that sounds great on a mic. Let me the that sounds great on a mic. Let me hear you chew. hear you chew. hear you chew. >> This 9:00 a.m. chocolate is hitting the >> This 9:00 a.m. chocolate is hitting the >> This 9:00 a.m. chocolate is hitting the spot. spot. spot. >> Um, dude, I had Sweethearts for >> Um, dude, I had Sweethearts for >> Um, dude, I had Sweethearts for breakfast, so I feel you. breakfast, so I feel you. breakfast, so I feel you. >> fasting, but you intermittently eat a >> fasting, but you intermittently eat a >> fasting, but you intermittently eat a Ferrero Rocher while [laughter] you're Ferrero Rocher while [laughter] you're Ferrero Rocher while [laughter] you're fasting. >> Uh, I would I want to know like the >> Uh, I would I want to know like the family dynamics. I'm so curious. I think family dynamics. I'm so curious. I think family dynamics. I'm so curious. I think that that that like the stories of Succession, the the like the stories of Succession, the the like the stories of Succession, the the movie or the TV show and like the drama, movie or the TV show and like the drama, movie or the TV show and like the drama, I don't think that is actually the I don't think that is actually the I don't think that is actually the common thing. I think that like there is common thing. I think that like there is common thing. I think that like there is a way where you could be like harmonious a way where you could be like harmonious a way where you could be like harmonious and loving and also like good at this and loving and also like good at this and loving and also like good at this whole business thing. And I it's just whole business thing. And I it's just whole business thing. And I it's just less interesting to write or read about less interesting to write or read about less interesting to write or read about that or make a movie or uh, TV show that or make a movie or uh, TV show that or make a movie or uh, TV show about it. about it. about it. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> Yeah, [laughter] >> Yeah, [laughter] >> Yeah, [laughter] but it would be really exciting to like but it would be really exciting to like but it would be really exciting to like read read read a book on how they do it effectively. a book on how they do it effectively. a book on how they do it effectively. Uh, another family that don't that that Uh, another family that don't that that Uh, another family that don't that that did it effectively is the Rothschild did it effectively is the Rothschild did it effectively is the Rothschild family. Do you know about those guys? family. Do you know about those guys? family. Do you know about those guys? >> I mean, I just know the name. I don't >> I mean, I just know the name. I don't >> I mean, I just know the name. I don't know what they did in the family. know what they did in the family. know what they did in the family. >> Like there's a crazy story where the >> Like there's a crazy story where the >> Like there's a crazy story where the uh, uh, uh, like the the original clan so they're like the the original clan so they're like the the original clan so they're known now as like Illuminati-esque where known now as like Illuminati-esque where known now as like Illuminati-esque where it's like mysterious but the original it's like mysterious but the original it's like mysterious but the original story is I believe they were in Germany story is I believe they were in Germany story is I believe they were in Germany in the 1800s and the dad was into in the 1800s and the dad was into in the 1800s and the dad was into business and banking and he had five business and banking and he had five business and banking and he had five sons and he seemed very loving and sons and he seemed very loving and sons and he seemed very loving and respectful with them and he purposely respectful with them and he purposely respectful with them and he purposely asked them to go move when they became asked them to go move when they became asked them to go move when they became adults to different countries and do the adults to different countries and do the adults to different countries and do the banking trade that he was doing and banking trade that he was doing and banking trade that he was doing and teaching them and that is how they teaching them and that is how they teaching them and that is how they became this like amazingly successful became this like amazingly successful became this like amazingly successful European family but the kids were like European family but the kids were like European family but the kids were like no he was he was a really loving guy he no he was he was a really loving guy he no he was he was a really loving guy he like he taught us good values and and we like he taught us good values and and we like he taught us good values and and we like doing this with them and and so like doing this with them and and so like doing this with them and and so like I've been reading a little bit like I've been reading a little bit like I've been reading a little bit about the that family as well. about the that family as well. about the that family as well. >> Yeah >> Yeah >> Yeah it's I mean I don't know if I'm ever it's I mean I don't know if I'm ever it's I mean I don't know if I'm ever going to do that but I did have a random going to do that but I did have a random going to do that but I did have a random idea recently that I just kind of like idea recently that I just kind of like idea recently that I just kind of like fascinated me. So I was listening to fascinated me. So I was listening to fascinated me. So I was listening to some interview with some interview with some interview with the chef from Carbone and he said the chef from Carbone and he said the chef from Carbone and he said something like the interview actually something like the interview actually something like the interview actually was a little bit boring but he said one was a little bit boring but he said one was a little bit boring but he said one thing that I thought was was pretty thing that I thought was was pretty thing that I thought was was pretty interesting he goes interesting he goes interesting he goes Oh I was always obsessed with food I was Oh I was always obsessed with food I was Oh I was always obsessed with food I was 12 years old and I was 12 years old and I was 12 years old and I was absolute foodie I was always watching absolute foodie I was always watching absolute foodie I was always watching cooking shows I knew about every cooking shows I knew about every cooking shows I knew about every restaurant I knew I wanted to be a chef. restaurant I knew I wanted to be a chef. restaurant I knew I wanted to be a chef. And you know one of the greatest gifts And you know one of the greatest gifts And you know one of the greatest gifts that nobody really talks about right that nobody really talks about right that nobody really talks about right like you want you want your kid to be like you want you want your kid to be like you want you want your kid to be you know really good at school or really you know really good at school or really you know really good at school or really good at sports really whatever I mean good at sports really whatever I mean good at sports really whatever I mean really one of the best things you can do really one of the best things you can do really one of the best things you can do is figure out what you actually love to is figure out what you actually love to is figure out what you actually love to do in life. The earlier you figure that do in life. The earlier you figure that do in life. The earlier you figure that out that's actually the big advantage out that's actually the big advantage out that's actually the big advantage and so you know and so you know and so you know >> was Warren Buffett's advantage. >> was Warren Buffett's advantage. >> was Warren Buffett's advantage. >> It's Warren Buffett's it's everyone if >> It's Warren Buffett's it's everyone if >> It's Warren Buffett's it's everyone if you read these guys they you know you read these guys they you know you read these guys they you know Mr. Beast is like yeah at 12 I just at Mr. Beast is like yeah at 12 I just at Mr. Beast is like yeah at 12 I just at 11 years old I decided I was going to be 11 years old I decided I was going to be 11 years old I decided I was going to be a YouTuber like I just wanted to be a a YouTuber like I just wanted to be a a YouTuber like I just wanted to be a YouTuber that's all I wanted to do and YouTuber that's all I wanted to do and YouTuber that's all I wanted to do and so from he's like yeah so I'm whatever so from he's like yeah so I'm whatever so from he's like yeah so I'm whatever he is now 28 he's like yeah but I'm he is now 28 he's like yeah but I'm he is now 28 he's like yeah but I'm doing this for 20 years he's like you doing this for 20 years he's like you doing this for 20 years he's like you know it's like I've been doing this 17 know it's like I've been doing this 17 know it's like I've been doing this 17 years now and so he's literally just years now and so he's literally just years now and so he's literally just spent more time on this than everyone spent more time on this than everyone spent more time on this than everyone else. Warren Buffett bought first stock else. Warren Buffett bought first stock else. Warren Buffett bought first stock at seven and basically was thinking at seven and basically was thinking at seven and basically was thinking about businesses, money, and stocks about businesses, money, and stocks about businesses, money, and stocks since he was very young. And and had since he was very young. And and had since he was very young. And and had time during that a golden window. And time during that a golden window. And time during that a golden window. And and when I interviewed Monish Pabrai, he and when I interviewed Monish Pabrai, he and when I interviewed Monish Pabrai, he was I was asking about these books on was I was asking about these books on was I was asking about these books on the wall. He had a whole section on like the wall. He had a whole section on like the wall. He had a whole section on like science and neuro neuroscience and science and neuro neuroscience and science and neuro neuroscience and psychology. psychology. psychology. And I go, "What's something you really And I go, "What's something you really And I go, "What's something you really took away from reading a bunch of took away from reading a bunch of took away from reading a bunch of these?" And he goes, "We have a certain these?" And he goes, "We have a certain these?" And he goes, "We have a certain hardwiring hardwiring hardwiring that's kind of baked by the time you're that's kind of baked by the time you're that's kind of baked by the time you're six or seven. Like your your core six or seven. Like your your core six or seven. Like your your core nature, your DNA. You kind of know who nature, your DNA. You kind of know who nature, your DNA. You kind of know who that person is." But he goes, "And that person is." But he goes, "And that person is." But he goes, "And there's a golden window. And I think the there's a golden window. And I think the there's a golden window. And I think the golden window was something like, you golden window was something like, you golden window was something like, you know, know, know, six to 16 years old. six to 16 years old. six to 16 years old. And during that 10-year window, And during that 10-year window, And during that 10-year window, if you found something that's that you if you found something that's that you if you found something that's that you can obsess over and you can um can obsess over and you can um can obsess over and you can um you get free rein to actually obsess you get free rein to actually obsess you get free rein to actually obsess over it during that window, you will over it during that window, you will over it during that window, you will hyper-specialize when the brain is in hyper-specialize when the brain is in hyper-specialize when the brain is in this certain period and you'll become this certain period and you'll become this certain period and you'll become world-class. Like you're you're the rest world-class. Like you're you're the rest world-class. Like you're you're the rest of your life happens and if you really of your life happens and if you really of your life happens and if you really don't And so he talks about this with don't And so he talks about this with don't And so he talks about this with investing. He's like, "I don't invest in investing. He's like, "I don't invest in investing. He's like, "I don't invest in companies where the CEO doesn't have an companies where the CEO doesn't have an companies where the CEO doesn't have an evidence of the lemonade stand when they evidence of the lemonade stand when they evidence of the lemonade stand when they were 10 or 11 because if you really If were 10 or 11 because if you really If were 10 or 11 because if you really If you're an entrepreneur, you were an you're an entrepreneur, you were an you're an entrepreneur, you were an entrepreneur at an early stage." Now, I entrepreneur at an early stage." Now, I entrepreneur at an early stage." Now, I don't 100% believe this, but I did think don't 100% believe this, but I did think don't 100% believe this, but I did think it's interesting and you do see this it's interesting and you do see this it's interesting and you do see this pattern a lot where pattern a lot where pattern a lot where >> have that? Did Monish have that? >> have that? Did Monish have that? >> have that? Did Monish have that? >> Uh yeah, so he I asked him that and he >> Uh yeah, so he I asked him that and he >> Uh yeah, so he I asked him that and he was like He's like, "Yes." And he goes, was like He's like, "Yes." And he goes, was like He's like, "Yes." And he goes, "It wasn't for entrepreneurship. It was "It wasn't for entrepreneurship. It was "It wasn't for entrepreneurship. It was basically for like basically for like basically for like his dad had a jewelry business or a gold his dad had a jewelry business or a gold his dad had a jewelry business or a gold business or something like that." He business or something like that." He business or something like that." He said, "Like basically my MBA was every said, "Like basically my MBA was every said, "Like basically my MBA was every day my dad would come home and the day my dad would come home and the day my dad would come home and the business was failing and me and my business was failing and me and my business was failing and me and my brother had to figure out something we brother had to figure out something we brother had to figure out something we could try to get this business to not could try to get this business to not could try to get this business to not fail, to have enough cash to be like in fail, to have enough cash to be like in fail, to have enough cash to be like in business next month." And so in doing business next month." And so in doing business next month." And so in doing that, he's like, "I basically got my MBA that, he's like, "I basically got my MBA that, he's like, "I basically got my MBA when I was eight years old every day when I was eight years old every day when I was eight years old every day helping my dad with his jewelry helping my dad with his jewelry helping my dad with his jewelry business, working in the store, coming business, working in the store, coming business, working in the store, coming home, hearing the problems, hearing the home, hearing the problems, hearing the home, hearing the problems, hearing the inventory struggles, the cash flow inventory struggles, the cash flow inventory struggles, the cash flow management problem. If we have all these management problem. If we have all these management problem. If we have all these sales, why don't we have any money? Oh, sales, why don't we have any money? Oh, sales, why don't we have any money? Oh, because there's a difference between because there's a difference between because there's a difference between revenue and profit, between profit and revenue and profit, between profit and revenue and profit, between profit and cash flow. And you know, he's like cash flow. And you know, he's like cash flow. And you know, he's like learning these things without knowing learning these things without knowing learning these things without knowing the names of them. Like they're sort of the names of them. Like they're sort of the names of them. Like they're sort of intuitive gut learning that's happening intuitive gut learning that's happening intuitive gut learning that's happening during that phase. during that phase. during that phase. >> And for the record, you don't need that >> And for the record, you don't need that >> And for the record, you don't need that to be pretty successful. I do think to be pretty successful. I do think to be pretty successful. I do think >> But to be world class. >> But to be world class. >> But to be world class. >> Yes, I think that that's the advantage >> Yes, I think that that's the advantage >> Yes, I think that that's the advantage that the best of the best of the best that the best of the best of the best that the best of the best of the best have over have over have over >> see like oh, in the world a World Cup >> see like oh, in the world a World Cup >> see like oh, in the world a World Cup right now it is like um Lamine Yamal and right now it is like um Lamine Yamal and right now it is like um Lamine Yamal and it's like you what how come the US it's like you what how come the US it's like you what how come the US doesn't produce players like this? And doesn't produce players like this? And doesn't produce players like this? And it's like well, because at age seven he it's like well, because at age seven he it's like well, because at age seven he would have moved in to the soccer would have moved in to the soccer would have moved in to the soccer academy and he was there from 7 to 17 academy and he was there from 7 to 17 academy and he was there from 7 to 17 and guess what? He's amazing now at 18. and guess what? He's amazing now at 18. and guess what? He's amazing now at 18. You know, like [laughter] You know, like [laughter] You know, like [laughter] which which maybe your kid would have which which maybe your kid would have which which maybe your kid would have been too had they left the house and been too had they left the house and been too had they left the house and moved in um you know, to the soccer moved in um you know, to the soccer moved in um you know, to the soccer academy at age six or seven and that's academy at age six or seven and that's academy at age six or seven and that's like really all they trained and focused like really all they trained and focused like really all they trained and focused on for a long period of time. Are you on for a long period of time. Are you on for a long period of time. Are you willing to do that? Uh the book Outliers willing to do that? Uh the book Outliers willing to do that? Uh the book Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell talked a little bit by Malcolm Gladwell talked a little bit by Malcolm Gladwell talked a little bit about this like you know, at a young age about this like you know, at a young age about this like you know, at a young age Bill Bill Gates and Paul Allen the Bill Bill Gates and Paul Allen the Bill Bill Gates and Paul Allen the founders of Microsoft, their school was founders of Microsoft, their school was founders of Microsoft, their school was the first one of the only schools in the the first one of the only schools in the the first one of the only schools in the country to have a computer. So he got to country to have a computer. So he got to country to have a computer. So he got to mess around with the computer mess around with the computer mess around with the computer for free at free access to it after for free at free access to it after for free at free access to it after school for like a very long period of school for like a very long period of school for like a very long period of time. You know, Furkan my old co-founder time. You know, Furkan my old co-founder time. You know, Furkan my old co-founder he would tell me like yeah, his dad he would tell me like yeah, his dad he would tell me like yeah, his dad worked at a computer company. So when he worked at a computer company. So when he worked at a computer company. So when he was 5 years old like his earliest memory was 5 years old like his earliest memory was 5 years old like his earliest memory wasn't like playing catch with my dad. wasn't like playing catch with my dad. wasn't like playing catch with my dad. It was like building a printer from It was like building a printer from It was like building a printer from scratch. scratch. scratch. It's like yeah, no no no joke that now It's like yeah, no no no joke that now It's like yeah, no no no joke that now he can like build anything um because he can like build anything um because he can like build anything um because during that golden window he did that. during that golden window he did that. during that golden window he did that. Anyways, long way of saying Anyways, long way of saying Anyways, long way of saying I've thought about how you could be I've thought about how you could be I've thought about how you could be somewhat intentional about this. Meaning somewhat intentional about this. Meaning somewhat intentional about this. Meaning if my kid shows an interest in something if my kid shows an interest in something if my kid shows an interest in something I think I'm going to lean in way harder I think I'm going to lean in way harder I think I'm going to lean in way harder than most people would during the golden than most people would during the golden than most people would during the golden window and I've thought about taking window and I've thought about taking window and I've thought about taking like a sabbatical year where I'm just like a sabbatical year where I'm just like a sabbatical year where I'm just like going to pluck him out of school like going to pluck him out of school like going to pluck him out of school for you know, in fifth or sixth grade for you know, in fifth or sixth grade for you know, in fifth or sixth grade and just be like hey, we're going to and just be like hey, we're going to and just be like hey, we're going to travel the world and like we're I'm just travel the world and like we're I'm just travel the world and like we're I'm just going to develop you. I'm going to shape going to develop you. I'm going to shape going to develop you. I'm going to shape you now not like when I'm 65 and I you now not like when I'm 65 and I you now not like when I'm 65 and I retired and I have more time because retired and I have more time because retired and I have more time because you're going to be the cookie's already you're going to be the cookie's already you're going to be the cookie's already crispy by then. You know what I mean? crispy by then. You know what I mean? crispy by then. You know what I mean? Like I got to do it when the dough is Like I got to do it when the dough is Like I got to do it when the dough is raw. And so, I'm thinking about that. Um raw. And so, I'm thinking about that. Um raw. And so, I'm thinking about that. Um does that sound crazy? Does that sound does that sound crazy? Does that sound does that sound crazy? Does that sound like like like >> No. So, it's so funny. Um a friend for >> No. So, it's so funny. Um a friend for >> No. So, it's so funny. Um a friend for my birthday, a friend gifted me the my birthday, a friend gifted me the my birthday, a friend gifted me the Andre Agassi book that I haven't started Andre Agassi book that I haven't started Andre Agassi book that I haven't started it yet. But, I was asking him what he it yet. But, I was asking him what he it yet. But, I was asking him what he learned. Uh learned. Uh learned. Uh have you ever read that? Andre Agassi's have you ever read that? Andre Agassi's have you ever read that? Andre Agassi's his biography. It's considered his biography. It's considered his biography. It's considered >> It's considered one of the best >> It's considered one of the best >> It's considered one of the best biographies and I'm not a tennis and my biographies and I'm not a tennis and my biographies and I'm not a tennis and my friend and I, neither of us are tennis friend and I, neither of us are tennis friend and I, neither of us are tennis guys, but he's like it's it's so good. guys, but he's like it's it's so good. guys, but he's like it's it's so good. And I said, "What's the big takeaway?" And I said, "What's the big takeaway?" And I said, "What's the big takeaway?" And he was like, "The crazy thing is And he was like, "The crazy thing is And he was like, "The crazy thing is Andre didn't even seem like he loved Andre didn't even seem like he loved Andre didn't even seem like he loved tennis. And he he frankly didn't seem tennis. And he he frankly didn't seem tennis. And he he frankly didn't seem like he had superstar energy. Um like he like he had superstar energy. Um like he like he had superstar energy. Um like he kind of begrudgingly did it. Uh but, he kind of begrudgingly did it. Uh but, he kind of begrudgingly did it. Uh but, he was pretty good." And I was like, "Well, was pretty good." And I was like, "Well, was pretty good." And I was like, "Well, how did he become like one of the greats how did he become like one of the greats how did he become like one of the greats of all time?" And he said, "His dad. His of all time?" And he said, "His dad. His of all time?" And he said, "His dad. His dad was maniacal. His dad like his dad dad was maniacal. His dad like his dad dad was maniacal. His dad like his dad saw that Andre showed a little bit of saw that Andre showed a little bit of saw that Andre showed a little bit of interest and he just pushed him and and interest and he just pushed him and and interest and he just pushed him and and just went all in on it." And I was just went all in on it." And I was just went all in on it." And I was joking and I was like, "Okay, so maybe joking and I was like, "Okay, so maybe joking and I was like, "Okay, so maybe he maybe he did or didn't have a good he maybe he did or didn't have a good he maybe he did or didn't have a good relationship with his father. I'm not relationship with his father. I'm not relationship with his father. I'm not sure. But, I think that like these guys sure. But, I think that like these guys sure. But, I think that like these guys like uh Serena Williams' dad, Andre like uh Serena Williams' dad, Andre like uh Serena Williams' dad, Andre Agassi's dad, like some of these harsh Agassi's dad, like some of these harsh Agassi's dad, like some of these harsh fathers, I'm like they get a lot of fathers, I'm like they get a lot of fathers, I'm like they get a lot of but like it seems pretty worth it. but like it seems pretty worth it. but like it seems pretty worth it. Like to have this like tiger dad and Like to have this like tiger dad and Like to have this like tiger dad and this tiger mom energy. And um I was this tiger mom energy. And um I was this tiger mom energy. And um I was watching uh Nadal's uh uh watching uh Nadal's uh uh watching uh Nadal's uh uh documentary on Netflix. Did you see that documentary on Netflix. Did you see that documentary on Netflix. Did you see that one? one? one? >> Uh I've seen a little bit of it. Yeah. I >> Uh I've seen a little bit of it. Yeah. I >> Uh I've seen a little bit of it. Yeah. I love Nadal. I love Nadal. love Nadal. I love Nadal. love Nadal. I love Nadal. >> his dad was the same way. His father was >> his dad was the same way. His father was >> his dad was the same way. His father was so hardcore about it and he pushed him so hardcore about it and he pushed him so hardcore about it and he pushed him and pushed him and pushed him and was and pushed him and pushed him and was and pushed him and pushed him and was his coach. And then there's this other his coach. And then there's this other his coach. And then there's this other guy named Sebastian Coe, who's a famous guy named Sebastian Coe, who's a famous guy named Sebastian Coe, who's a famous runner. So, you know, not not that many runner. So, you know, not not that many runner. So, you know, not not that many people are going to know who he is, but people are going to know who he is, but people are going to know who he is, but he's he had the world record for the he's he had the world record for the he's he had the world record for the mile and his dad, Peter, was the same mile and his dad, Peter, was the same mile and his dad, Peter, was the same way where they would run and his father way where they would run and his father way where they would run and his father would be in the car with a stopwatch would be in the car with a stopwatch would be in the car with a stopwatch timing every interval. timing every interval. timing every interval. >> Behind every great man is a great woman. >> Behind every great man is a great woman. >> Behind every great man is a great woman. It's like, "And an abusive father." It's like, "And an abusive father." It's like, "And an abusive father." >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I do think that there's a way that you >> I do think that there's a way that you >> I do think that there's a way that you can do this where you can like balance can do this where you can like balance can do this where you can like balance like being a good a good nurturer and like being a good a good nurturer and like being a good a good nurturer and also a pusher. also a pusher. also a pusher. >> clarify one thing. I'm not saying I'm >> clarify one thing. I'm not saying I'm >> clarify one thing. I'm not saying I'm going to like hypertrain them for going to like hypertrain them for going to like hypertrain them for greatness on like, you know, hey, get greatness on like, you know, hey, get greatness on like, you know, hey, get up, we're running sprints every morning. up, we're running sprints every morning. up, we're running sprints every morning. Like, you know, whatever up the hills. Like, you know, whatever up the hills. Like, you know, whatever up the hills. What I meant was really I'm going to What I meant was really I'm going to What I meant was really I'm going to give them exposure cuz I think most give them exposure cuz I think most give them exposure cuz I think most people the problem isn't that you found people the problem isn't that you found people the problem isn't that you found what you love what you love what you love and then you didn't keep doing it. Cuz and then you didn't keep doing it. Cuz and then you didn't keep doing it. Cuz when you really love something, it has a when you really love something, it has a when you really love something, it has a great amount of pull. You just do it great amount of pull. You just do it great amount of pull. You just do it anyways. I think what most people don't anyways. I think what most people don't anyways. I think what most people don't do is they don't really get to walk do is they don't really get to walk do is they don't really get to walk around Costco and sample the things. And around Costco and sample the things. And around Costco and sample the things. And I think that's actually the more I think that's actually the more I think that's actually the more interesting thing is like, how do you interesting thing is like, how do you interesting thing is like, how do you get somebody exposure because I would get somebody exposure because I would get somebody exposure because I would say the vast majority of people never say the vast majority of people never say the vast majority of people never even find out if they really love even find out if they really love even find out if they really love something cuz by the time you like something cuz by the time you like something cuz by the time you like school is such a regimented track, school is such a regimented track, school is such a regimented track, right? You're spending 8 hours a day right? You're spending 8 hours a day right? You're spending 8 hours a day doing the same exact things as every doing the same exact things as every doing the same exact things as every other kid. Did you happen to love other kid. Did you happen to love other kid. Did you happen to love photosynthesis? Did you happen to love photosynthesis? Did you happen to love photosynthesis? Did you happen to love trigonometry? Like, probably not. And trigonometry? Like, probably not. And trigonometry? Like, probably not. And so, by the and then and then it's all so, by the and then and then it's all so, by the and then and then it's all just funneling you to get into a just funneling you to get into a just funneling you to get into a college. When you get into a college, college. When you get into a college, college. When you get into a college, it's about getting a job. it's about getting a job. it's about getting a job. By the time you have a job, now you're By the time you have a job, now you're By the time you have a job, now you're working and you're trying to like working and you're trying to like working and you're trying to like pay for life. And by the time you're 30, pay for life. And by the time you're 30, pay for life. And by the time you're 30, you're like, well, I didn't really get you're like, well, I didn't really get you're like, well, I didn't really get that one that that opportunity to go that one that that opportunity to go that one that that opportunity to go figure out that actually it was figure out that actually it was figure out that actually it was podcasting that I really had an affinity podcasting that I really had an affinity podcasting that I really had an affinity to. I actually really loved that. Or it to. I actually really loved that. Or it to. I actually really loved that. Or it was, you know, whatever it is. Like, was, you know, whatever it is. Like, was, you know, whatever it is. Like, baking. It was this. It was that. It baking. It was this. It was that. It baking. It was this. It was that. It doesn't really it's hard to even know. doesn't really it's hard to even know. doesn't really it's hard to even know. And I think most people never even know. And I think most people never even know. And I think most people never even know. And so, the thing I want to make sure I And so, the thing I want to make sure I And so, the thing I want to make sure I do for my kids is do for my kids is do for my kids is get you to at least feel and see what get you to at least feel and see what get you to at least feel and see what different what the world is. What are different what the world is. What are different what the world is. What are what's even on the menu of options so what's even on the menu of options so what's even on the menu of options so that you have some exposure in life cuz that you have some exposure in life cuz that you have some exposure in life cuz I don't think the world by default does I don't think the world by default does I don't think the world by default does a good job of giving you exposure. a good job of giving you exposure. a good job of giving you exposure. >> You and I have a great friend, Ramon. >> You and I have a great friend, Ramon. >> You and I have a great friend, Ramon. So, Ramon van van Meer. And um So, Ramon van van Meer. And um So, Ramon van van Meer. And um he Ramon had a difficult situation where he Ramon had a difficult situation where he Ramon had a difficult situation where he became a single dad when his son was he became a single dad when his son was he became a single dad when his son was only 2 years old. only 2 years old. only 2 years old. And I met Victor when he was, I think, And I met Victor when he was, I think, And I met Victor when he was, I think, 3. Now, he's actually a sophomore or 3. Now, he's actually a sophomore or 3. Now, he's actually a sophomore or junior in college. And um junior in college. And um junior in college. And um he he he Ramon was crazy. Um partly he did this Ramon was crazy. Um partly he did this Ramon was crazy. Um partly he did this out of necessity, partly because he's a out of necessity, partly because he's a out of necessity, partly because he's a really amazing dad. And he would bring really amazing dad. And he would bring really amazing dad. And he would bring Victor, starting at the age of maybe Victor, starting at the age of maybe Victor, starting at the age of maybe seven, to these really big business seven, to these really big business seven, to these really big business meetings. I remember he sold one company meetings. I remember he sold one company meetings. I remember he sold one company when Victor was something like 10 years when Victor was something like 10 years when Victor was something like 10 years old. He sold it for close to $10 old. He sold it for close to $10 old. He sold it for close to $10 million, million, million, and I remember he would go to LA from and I remember he would go to LA from and I remember he would go to LA from San Francisco, and he would take Victor San Francisco, and he would take Victor San Francisco, and he would take Victor out of school and bring him. And Victor out of school and bring him. And Victor out of school and bring him. And Victor would just sit like next to him, and would just sit like next to him, and would just sit like next to him, and Victor wouldn't talk, but he would Victor wouldn't talk, but he would Victor wouldn't talk, but he would pay attention to the meeting, and pay attention to the meeting, and pay attention to the meeting, and afterwards Ramon would be like, "Victor, afterwards Ramon would be like, "Victor, afterwards Ramon would be like, "Victor, what's your opinion? What should we do?" what's your opinion? What should we do?" what's your opinion? What should we do?" Um and then another time, Victor has Um and then another time, Victor has Um and then another time, Victor has actually been to China. actually been to China. actually been to China. I think a couple times because Ramon has I think a couple times because Ramon has I think a couple times because Ramon has a company now, Afina, where they have a company now, Afina, where they have a company now, Afina, where they have manufacturers in China, and he'll bring manufacturers in China, and he'll bring manufacturers in China, and he'll bring him to China, and he'll just sit quietly him to China, and he'll just sit quietly him to China, and he'll just sit quietly and be like, and be like, and be like, "Afterwards, Victor Ramon would be like, "Afterwards, Victor Ramon would be like, "Afterwards, Victor Ramon would be like, 'Hey, okay, so what do you think? You 'Hey, okay, so what do you think? You 'Hey, okay, so what do you think? You think this guy is legit? Should we go think this guy is legit? Should we go think this guy is legit? Should we go with him? Should we do this?'" And I with him? Should we do this?'" And I with him? Should we do this?'" And I remember seeing that, and before I had remember seeing that, and before I had remember seeing that, and before I had kids, I thought it was awesome. And then kids, I thought it was awesome. And then kids, I thought it was awesome. And then after I had kids, I thought it was like after I had kids, I thought it was like after I had kids, I thought it was like a blessing, a treasure. I like it a blessing, a treasure. I like it a blessing, a treasure. I like it changed from like this is cool to changed from like this is cool to changed from like this is cool to admiration. admiration. admiration. To like you have gone from being a good To like you have gone from being a good To like you have gone from being a good dad to a deity to me. Like you are like dad to a deity to me. Like you are like dad to a deity to me. Like you are like I can't believe how special and how I can't believe how special and how I can't believe how special and how lucky Victor is to have you. And I lucky Victor is to have you. And I lucky Victor is to have you. And I remember seeing that, and I'm like, remember seeing that, and I'm like, remember seeing that, and I'm like, "That is the way to have a kid." "That is the way to have a kid." "That is the way to have a kid." >> I I agree 100%. Seen the same thing. He >> I I agree 100%. Seen the same thing. He >> I I agree 100%. Seen the same thing. He Ramon is an amazing dad, and Ramon is an amazing dad, and Ramon is an amazing dad, and it's not just I I think it's not just I I think it's not just I I think cuz I watched that, and in the moment cuz I watched that, and in the moment cuz I watched that, and in the moment you're just kind of like, well, the you're just kind of like, well, the you're just kind of like, well, the if a kid is there, didn't say anything, if a kid is there, didn't say anything, if a kid is there, didn't say anything, or maybe even after that, "What do you or maybe even after that, "What do you or maybe even after that, "What do you think?" think?" think?" "It was good. It was cool." They're not "It was good. It was cool." They're not "It was good. It was cool." They're not going to give you some satisfying answer going to give you some satisfying answer going to give you some satisfying answer as a dad like as a dad like as a dad like "You know, Dad, I really learned the "You know, Dad, I really learned the "You know, Dad, I really learned the like the virtue of hard work today. like the virtue of hard work today. like the virtue of hard work today. Actually, what I saw was they're never Actually, what I saw was they're never Actually, what I saw was they're never going to tell you the thing, but like going to tell you the thing, but like going to tell you the thing, but like you just have to trust the process and you just have to trust the process and you just have to trust the process and be like it's all soaking somewhere, be like it's all soaking somewhere, be like it's all soaking somewhere, somewhere in the mind this experience somewhere in the mind this experience somewhere in the mind this experience was imprinting somewhere in the brain in was imprinting somewhere in the brain in was imprinting somewhere in the brain in a positive direction, and that if they, a positive direction, and that if they, a positive direction, and that if they, you know, if I didn't give them this you know, if I didn't give them this you know, if I didn't give them this experience, I would have in in a way experience, I would have in in a way experience, I would have in in a way robbed them of of some of that exposure. robbed them of of some of that exposure. robbed them of of some of that exposure. So yeah, I'm a I'm a big believer in So yeah, I'm a I'm a big believer in So yeah, I'm a I'm a big believer in that. My kids are really little right that. My kids are really little right that. My kids are really little right now, but I I do similar things." now, but I I do similar things." now, but I I do similar things." >> That's awesome. Okay, let me tell you >> That's awesome. Okay, let me tell you >> That's awesome. Okay, let me tell you another story about someone. You and I, another story about someone. You and I, another story about someone. You and I, we get invited to some stuff that we get invited to some stuff that we get invited to some stuff that occasionally is interesting. Most of the occasionally is interesting. Most of the occasionally is interesting. Most of the time, we both say no, but I decided to time, we both say no, but I decided to time, we both say no, but I decided to go to one of these dinners, and it was go to one of these dinners, and it was go to one of these dinners, and it was in a beautiful apartment, and clearly in a beautiful apartment, and clearly in a beautiful apartment, and clearly some guys there were like total ballers. some guys there were like total ballers. some guys there were like total ballers. But I sit next to this one guy, But I sit next to this one guy, But I sit next to this one guy, and he's very unassuming, and I start and he's very unassuming, and I start and he's very unassuming, and I start talking to him, and he's very nice. He's talking to him, and he's very nice. He's talking to him, and he's very nice. He's kind of like Dharmesh Shah, the the one kind of like Dharmesh Shah, the the one kind of like Dharmesh Shah, the the one of the founders of HubSpot, like very of the founders of HubSpot, like very of the founders of HubSpot, like very low-key. He's like, "How are you using low-key. He's like, "How are you using low-key. He's like, "How are you using AI?" And I'm like, "Well, AI?" And I'm like, "Well, AI?" And I'm like, "Well, I made a Chrome plug-in that helps you I made a Chrome plug-in that helps you I made a Chrome plug-in that helps you select like which jeans fit you if you select like which jeans fit you if you select like which jeans fit you if you go to a store, if you like jeans." go to a store, if you like jeans." go to a store, if you like jeans." >> John, look at my ass right now. >> John, look at my ass right now. >> John, look at my ass right now. [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] Tell me that these don't fit like fit Tell me that these don't fit like fit Tell me that these don't fit like fit like they were fitted by AGI. Three like they were fitted by AGI. Three like they were fitted by AGI. Three cities don't have water right now cities don't have water right now cities don't have water right now because these pants fit so well. because these pants fit so well. because these pants fit so well. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And uh >> And uh >> And uh I was like, "How about you?" I was like, "How about you?" I was like, "How about you?" "What are you doing?" And he like starts "What are you doing?" And he like starts "What are you doing?" And he like starts explaining some stuff, explaining some stuff, explaining some stuff, and it's kind of blowing my mind, and and it's kind of blowing my mind, and and it's kind of blowing my mind, and I'm like, "Wait, who are you?" And he I'm like, "Wait, who are you?" And he I'm like, "Wait, who are you?" And he says his name, but he doesn't really say says his name, but he doesn't really say says his name, but he doesn't really say what he does. And the guy runs maybe one what he does. And the guy runs maybe one what he does. And the guy runs maybe one of the most, if not like the top three of the most, if not like the top three of the most, if not like the top three like financial services business in the like financial services business in the like financial services business in the world, and he's world, and he's world, and he's extremely multi-billionaire. extremely multi-billionaire. extremely multi-billionaire. And he's the founder of And he's the founder of And he's the founder of >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Extremely multi-billionaire. >> Yeah, extremely. Like, [laughter] >> Yeah, extremely. Like, [laughter] >> Yeah, extremely. Like, [laughter] he's so extreme, and I thought I after he's so extreme, and I thought I after he's so extreme, and I thought I after he I start talking to him like, "I he I start talking to him like, "I he I start talking to him like, "I recognize you. You have articles written recognize you. You have articles written recognize you. You have articles written about you. It's where it's like this about you. It's where it's like this about you. It's where it's like this mysterious billionaire." mysterious billionaire." mysterious billionaire." >> Wait, say his name, and then we'll bleep >> Wait, say his name, and then we'll bleep >> Wait, say his name, and then we'll bleep it. it. it. >> Okay, so he's the founder of >> Okay, so he's the founder of >> Okay, so he's the founder of >> Yes. Okay. >> Yes. Okay. >> Yes. Okay. >> So, one of the most like sophisticated >> So, one of the most like sophisticated >> So, one of the most like sophisticated financial services business, arguably financial services business, arguably financial services business, arguably potentially some of the one of the most potentially some of the one of the most potentially some of the one of the most profitable in its field, making like profitable in its field, making like profitable in its field, making like tens of billions in profit. tens of billions in profit. tens of billions in profit. >> That's that's almost an intimidating >> That's that's almost an intimidating >> That's that's almost an intimidating person to meet. It's almost like, have person to meet. It's almost like, have person to meet. It's almost like, have you ever Do you You know, I used to have you ever Do you You know, I used to have you ever Do you You know, I used to have this old Dell laptop that when it really this old Dell laptop that when it really this old Dell laptop that when it really when you when you opened up a few too when you when you opened up a few too when you when you opened up a few too many windows, the fan would kick on, and many windows, the fan would kick on, and many windows, the fan would kick on, and it would start heating up. I feel like it would start heating up. I feel like it would start heating up. I feel like that dude's brain must just be like that dude's brain must just be like that dude's brain must just be like that. Is was there just heat exhaust that. Is was there just heat exhaust that. Is was there just heat exhaust coming off of them? coming off of them? coming off of them? >> I'm I'm closer to a homeless guy in >> I'm I'm closer to a homeless guy in >> I'm I'm closer to a homeless guy in terms of like accomplishments and brain terms of like accomplishments and brain terms of like accomplishments and brain power than I am to this guy. And it was power than I am to this guy. And it was power than I am to this guy. And it was so awesome that this guy walked into so awesome that this guy walked into so awesome that this guy walked into this room. He was one of the most quiet this room. He was one of the most quiet this room. He was one of the most quiet guys. He probably talked the least guys. He probably talked the least guys. He probably talked the least amount. amount. amount. >> you describe his calves and stuff, what >> you describe his calves and stuff, what >> you describe his calves and stuff, what did he say about AI? He said he was did he say about AI? He said he was did he say about AI? He said he was blowing your mind a little bit. What did blowing your mind a little bit. What did blowing your mind a little bit. What did he say? he say? he say? >> Uh I have to be somewhat vague. He was >> Uh I have to be somewhat vague. He was >> Uh I have to be somewhat vague. He was saying He was just explaining like how saying He was just explaining like how saying He was just explaining like how they do it for like trading and like they do it for like trading and like they do it for like trading and like making financial decisions. But he making financial decisions. But he making financial decisions. But he frankly he was using He clearly was frankly he was using He clearly was frankly he was using He clearly was trying to talk my level, but it was so trying to talk my level, but it was so trying to talk my level, but it was so hard without using like the jargon that hard without using like the jargon that hard without using like the jargon that he had to use. But like at one point I he had to use. But like at one point I he had to use. But like at one point I was like, "So, is your company cool? Uh was like, "So, is your company cool? Uh was like, "So, is your company cool? Uh why is it cool?" Uh he's like, "Well, why is it cool?" Uh he's like, "Well, why is it cool?" Uh he's like, "Well, I think we have a good culture. We pay I think we have a good culture. We pay I think we have a good culture. We pay really well, and uh the office is nice." really well, and uh the office is nice." really well, and uh the office is nice." And I look up how much they pay, and And I look up how much they pay, and And I look up how much they pay, and it's like the highest paying thing it's like the highest paying thing it's like the highest paying thing >> in the world, yeah. >> in the world, yeah. >> in the world, yeah. >> in the world. >> in the world. >> in the world. >> they have the most profit per employee >> they have the most profit per employee >> they have the most profit per employee or something. It is like crazy crazy or something. It is like crazy crazy or something. It is like crazy crazy numbers like that. Did they say anything numbers like that. Did they say anything numbers like that. Did they say anything with AI that surprised you, meaning with AI that surprised you, meaning with AI that surprised you, meaning like, "Oh, I just did I didn't realize like, "Oh, I just did I didn't realize like, "Oh, I just did I didn't realize that was possible, or I would have never that was possible, or I would have never that was possible, or I would have never thought to do that." Is Give me a little thought to do that." Is Give me a little thought to do that." Is Give me a little bit more if you can if you can break off bit more if you can if you can break off bit more if you can if you can break off one more piece of bread. one more piece of bread. one more piece of bread. >> Well, what what he was he what he was >> Well, what what he was he what he was >> Well, what what he was he what he was explaining, he was like, "You know, explaining, he was like, "You know, explaining, he was like, "You know, we've actually have been doing this we've actually have been doing this we've actually have been doing this before like it became popular. We were before like it became popular. We were before like it became popular. We were doing it in this particular way, and doing it in this particular way, and doing it in this particular way, and then all this new breakthrough then all this new breakthrough then all this new breakthrough technology came out, but it wasn't like technology came out, but it wasn't like technology came out, but it wasn't like a surprise to us cuz we've been a surprise to us cuz we've been a surprise to us cuz we've been tinkering with this stuff." And tinkering with this stuff." And tinkering with this stuff." And basically he was like, "It helps us make basically he was like, "It helps us make basically he was like, "It helps us make decisions like within fractions and decisions like within fractions and decisions like within fractions and fractions and fractions of seconds." fractions and fractions of seconds." fractions and fractions of seconds." Like he was using these time Like he was using these time Like he was using these time measurements that I didn't I I didn't measurements that I didn't I I didn't measurements that I didn't I I didn't even know what that word meant. And he even know what that word meant. And he even know what that word meant. And he was like he he he was like explaining was like he he he was like explaining was like he he he was like explaining like how they make decisions and how like how they make decisions and how like how they make decisions and how they use AI to make decisions. And um he they use AI to make decisions. And um he they use AI to make decisions. And um he was like, "Yeah, like we've had data was like, "Yeah, like we've had data was like, "Yeah, like we've had data centers. We've had all of this stuff centers. We've had all of this stuff centers. We've had all of this stuff before. Now it's more accessible, and before. Now it's more accessible, and before. Now it's more accessible, and it's easier cuz we But he's like, "We it's easier cuz we But he's like, "We it's easier cuz we But he's like, "We built all this stuff before." It was built all this stuff before." It was built all this stuff before." It was just like crazy that someone that is so just like crazy that someone that is so just like crazy that someone that is so epic and so world-class at what they do, epic and so world-class at what they do, epic and so world-class at what they do, they made me feel He made me feel better they made me feel He made me feel better they made me feel He made me feel better than him in a weird way. than him in a weird way. than him in a weird way. >> So, he's a great actor, too, then. >> So, he's a great actor, too, then. >> So, he's a great actor, too, then. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Wow, triple threat. >> Wow, triple threat. >> Wow, triple threat. >> Well, that's why I didn't want to be >> Well, that's why I didn't want to be >> Well, that's why I didn't want to be insulting. I don't think he was acting. insulting. I don't think he was acting. insulting. I don't think he was acting. I I think that he like he made me he was I I think that he like he made me he was I I think that he like he made me he was maybe feel good. maybe feel good. maybe feel good. >> Well, he he had true true charisma then >> Well, he he had true true charisma then >> Well, he he had true true charisma then in that he was genuinely interested in in that he was genuinely interested in in that he was genuinely interested in other people, not based off of like, you other people, not based off of like, you other people, not based off of like, you know, some weird power rankings. And know, some weird power rankings. And know, some weird power rankings. And when you're interested in people, that when you're interested in people, that when you're interested in people, that makes them feel great. And that's a makes them feel great. And that's a makes them feel great. And that's a gift. That's a that's an amazing gift. I gift. That's a that's an amazing gift. I gift. That's a that's an amazing gift. I think it sounds so simple and very few think it sounds so simple and very few think it sounds so simple and very few people know how to do that. people know how to do that. people know how to do that. >> And I've noticed that with a bunch of >> And I've noticed that with a bunch of >> And I've noticed that with a bunch of really successful people, the ones that really successful people, the ones that really successful people, the ones that I truly like, they are so curious. They I truly like, they are so curious. They I truly like, they are so curious. They are curious to the point where they will are curious to the point where they will are curious to the point where they will uh think about silly ideas very uh think about silly ideas very uh think about silly ideas very seriously and take them serious. seriously and take them serious. seriously and take them serious. >> Yeah, uh >> Yeah, uh >> Yeah, uh I had a embarrassing like reduction the I had a embarrassing like reduction the I had a embarrassing like reduction the other day where I was like describing at other day where I was like describing at other day where I was like describing at we went to an event or we hosted an we went to an event or we hosted an we went to an event or we hosted an event and it was like, "Oh, there's all event and it was like, "Oh, there's all event and it was like, "Oh, there's all these different people. I like this these different people. I like this these different people. I like this person. Oh, I really like this guy. That person. Oh, I really like this guy. That person. Oh, I really like this guy. That Oh, she was really cool." And then I Oh, she was really cool." And then I Oh, she was really cool." And then I realized, "Oh, what's the common realized, "Oh, what's the common realized, "Oh, what's the common factor?" It's just like I think I like factor?" It's just like I think I like factor?" It's just like I think I like people who like me. And I was so people who like me. And I was so people who like me. And I was so embarrassed by that being true, but it embarrassed by that being true, but it embarrassed by that being true, but it was really like the was really like the was really like the I have a very hard time liking people I have a very hard time liking people I have a very hard time liking people who I don't feel like me. So, the who I don't feel like me. So, the who I don't feel like me. So, the opposite is more true than the than the opposite is more true than the than the opposite is more true than the than the first part, meaning like I don't love first part, meaning like I don't love first part, meaning like I don't love everybody who likes me, but I can't everybody who likes me, but I can't everybody who likes me, but I can't really like anybody if I feel like they really like anybody if I feel like they really like anybody if I feel like they don't like me. And I was I was like, don't like me. And I was I was like, don't like me. And I was I was like, "What kind of junior high "What kind of junior high "What kind of junior high mindset is this?" And I didn't know what mindset is this?" And I didn't know what mindset is this?" And I didn't know what to do with it, but I definitely had that to do with it, but I definitely had that to do with it, but I definitely had that awareness at least. And I was like, "I awareness at least. And I was like, "I awareness at least. And I was like, "I think I should not have that be the think I should not have that be the think I should not have that be the kind of the heaviest weight, kind of the heaviest weight, kind of the heaviest weight, >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> you know, factor in in this stuff." Do >> you know, factor in in this stuff." Do >> you know, factor in in this stuff." Do you Do you ever do that? It sounds so you Do you ever do that? It sounds so you Do you ever do that? It sounds so stupid as I said it aloud. stupid as I said it aloud. stupid as I said it aloud. >> No, I mean I don't think that's so >> No, I mean I don't think that's so >> No, I mean I don't think that's so stupid. I I think that Dale Carnegie, stupid. I I think that Dale Carnegie, stupid. I I think that Dale Carnegie, How to Win Friends and Influence People, How to Win Friends and Influence People, How to Win Friends and Influence People, he says, "The root of everything that he says, "The root of everything that he says, "The root of everything that you read from me is basically people you read from me is basically people you read from me is basically people want to feel important." And if you want to feel important." And if you want to feel important." And if you understand that, then like life's cream understand that, then like life's cream understand that, then like life's cream cheese. Like life's good. And if you cheese. Like life's good. And if you cheese. Like life's good. And if you make people feel important, then then make people feel important, then then make people feel important, then then that is how you win friends and that is how you win friends and that is how you win friends and influence people. And what's funny is influence people. And what's funny is influence people. And what's funny is this guy and I we left the uh the the this guy and I we left the uh the the this guy and I we left the uh the the event together. And we mistakenly took event together. And we mistakenly took event together. And we mistakenly took like a service elevator. And so we get like a service elevator. And so we get like a service elevator. And so we get lost in this building for like 25 lost in this building for like 25 lost in this building for like 25 minutes like trying to get out because minutes like trying to get out because minutes like trying to get out because we took the wrong and we couldn't figure we took the wrong and we couldn't figure we took the wrong and we couldn't figure out the signs. And I'm like out the signs. And I'm like out the signs. And I'm like >> Were you like, "Come on, genius. Get us >> Were you like, "Come on, genius. Get us >> Were you like, "Come on, genius. Get us out of here." [laughter] out of here." [laughter] out of here." [laughter] >> I was like, "How many billionaires does >> I was like, "How many billionaires does >> I was like, "How many billionaires does it take to find the exit?" it take to find the exit?" it take to find the exit?" >> Be Superman. Turn on the laser. >> Be Superman. Turn on the laser. >> Be Superman. Turn on the laser. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And and then at the end I was like >> And and then at the end I was like >> And and then at the end I was like I I know that like no one can find I I know that like no one can find I I know that like no one can find photos of you on the internet. I know photos of you on the internet. I know photos of you on the internet. I know that you purposely stay off the grid, that you purposely stay off the grid, that you purposely stay off the grid, but uh you know, like but uh you know, like but uh you know, like want to come on my First Million? And he want to come on my First Million? And he want to come on my First Million? And he like like like And he even dignified it with a "I'll And he even dignified it with a "I'll And he even dignified it with a "I'll consider it." There wasn't even like a consider it." There wasn't even like a consider it." There wasn't even like a like, "Are you insane? No, I I won't do like, "Are you insane? No, I I won't do like, "Are you insane? No, I I won't do this." this." this." And I just think that like to all the And I just think that like to all the And I just think that like to all the up-and-comer up-and-comers listening up-and-comer up-and-comers listening up-and-comer up-and-comers listening like Quinton, be humble and be nice and like Quinton, be humble and be nice and like Quinton, be humble and be nice and make people feel important. And that is make people feel important. And that is make people feel important. And that is like kind of a key to life. like kind of a key to life. like kind of a key to life. >> Well, we we should tweak that, right? >> Well, we we should tweak that, right? >> Well, we we should tweak that, right? Cuz the make people feel important Cuz the make people feel important Cuz the make people feel important sounds a manipulative. What's the real sounds a manipulative. What's the real sounds a manipulative. What's the real What's the way to do that that's What's the way to do that that's What's the way to do that that's actually real? I would say, be curious. actually real? I would say, be curious. actually real? I would say, be curious. If you're genuinely curious or If you're genuinely curious or If you're genuinely curious or interested in in people, curiosity's interested in in people, curiosity's interested in in people, curiosity's like one of these um you know, like like one of these um you know, like like one of these um you know, like those like grandma's remedies where it's those like grandma's remedies where it's those like grandma's remedies where it's like, "Oh, I have uh pneumonia." And like, "Oh, I have uh pneumonia." And like, "Oh, I have uh pneumonia." And it's like, "Put some whiskey in the it's like, "Put some whiskey in the it's like, "Put some whiskey in the pancakes and that'll do it." It's like, pancakes and that'll do it." It's like, pancakes and that'll do it." It's like, "What? That doesn't make any sense." And "What? That doesn't make any sense." And "What? That doesn't make any sense." And then it like works. It's curiosity's then it like works. It's curiosity's then it like works. It's curiosity's kind of like that where almost all these kind of like that where almost all these kind of like that where almost all these unrelated problems can be solved with unrelated problems can be solved with unrelated problems can be solved with curiosity. I'll give you an example. curiosity. I'll give you an example. curiosity. I'll give you an example. Um one is what one is what we're talking Um one is what one is what we're talking Um one is what one is what we're talking about here, which is when you're when about here, which is when you're when about here, which is when you're when you're actually curious about somebody, you're actually curious about somebody, you're actually curious about somebody, you will appear interested in them you will appear interested in them you will appear interested in them because you are interested in them and because you are interested in them and because you are interested in them and then they feel interesting and they feel then they feel interesting and they feel then they feel interesting and they feel like you took an you know, because you like you took an you know, because you like you took an you know, because you took an interest in them, they uh feel took an interest in them, they uh feel took an interest in them, they uh feel an affinity towards you. Great, that's an affinity towards you. Great, that's an affinity towards you. Great, that's one. You this works with yourself, too. one. You this works with yourself, too. one. You this works with yourself, too. So a lot of times I I'll talk to my my So a lot of times I I'll talk to my my So a lot of times I I'll talk to my my trainer, my coach. And um let's say I'm trainer, my coach. And um let's say I'm trainer, my coach. And um let's say I'm feeling bad about something. What most feeling bad about something. What most feeling bad about something. What most people try to do is they say, "Don't people try to do is they say, "Don't people try to do is they say, "Don't feel bad. Feel good. It's okay." And feel bad. Feel good. It's okay." And feel bad. Feel good. It's okay." And like don't feel bad is pretty poor like don't feel bad is pretty poor like don't feel bad is pretty poor advice when you're feeling bad about advice when you're feeling bad about advice when you're feeling bad about something. And instead he just says something. And instead he just says something. And instead he just says like, "Don't feel bad, just get like, "Don't feel bad, just get like, "Don't feel bad, just get curious." And he's like, "Just get lean curious." And he's like, "Just get lean curious." And he's like, "Just get lean into it. Like, get curious about it. into it. Like, get curious about it. into it. Like, get curious about it. What is that? Why do you feel that way? What is that? Why do you feel that way? What is that? Why do you feel that way? You know, um hm, has it ever happened You know, um hm, has it ever happened You know, um hm, has it ever happened before?" And as soon as you start before?" And as soon as you start before?" And as soon as you start getting curious, it's almost like the getting curious, it's almost like the getting curious, it's almost like the cloud moves away, the sun starts to peer cloud moves away, the sun starts to peer cloud moves away, the sun starts to peer through, and cuz your brain literally through, and cuz your brain literally through, and cuz your brain literally shifts state into a into a more shifts state into a into a more shifts state into a into a more childlike curious state of mind, and it childlike curious state of mind, and it childlike curious state of mind, and it takes the edge off. It takes the guilt takes the edge off. It takes the guilt takes the edge off. It takes the guilt or the shame or the the the or the shame or the the the or the shame or the the the self-loathing off of whatever it is self-loathing off of whatever it is self-loathing off of whatever it is you're doing. It's so so weird. You you're doing. It's so so weird. You you're doing. It's so so weird. You would never expect curiosity to be a would never expect curiosity to be a would never expect curiosity to be a cure for for some some of these moments, cure for for some some of these moments, cure for for some some of these moments, of these moods, but it is. It tends to of these moods, but it is. It tends to of these moods, but it is. It tends to be. And so, just getting curious about be. And so, just getting curious about be. And so, just getting curious about something I I would say is a is kind of something I I would say is a is kind of something I I would say is a is kind of like a catch-all, like a catch-all, like a catch-all, um you know, cure for for for things. um you know, cure for for for things. um you know, cure for for for things. >> And what's funny is like I was a pretty >> And what's funny is like I was a pretty >> And what's funny is like I was a pretty awkward teenager. I would say I'm still awkward teenager. I would say I'm still awkward teenager. I would say I'm still a pretty awkward guy. Uh and I like went a pretty awkward guy. Uh and I like went a pretty awkward guy. Uh and I like went and like read books on like good and like read books on like good and like read books on like good questions to ask people to like have a questions to ask people to like have a questions to ask people to like have a conversation. And I even follow these conversation. And I even follow these conversation. And I even follow these guys on Instagram how to do it. But the guys on Instagram how to do it. But the guys on Instagram how to do it. But the best people I found was that show on the best people I found was that show on the best people I found was that show on the spectrum, the dating show with autistic spectrum, the dating show with autistic spectrum, the dating show with autistic the kids. And I stole so many questions the kids. And I stole so many questions the kids. And I stole so many questions that I ask people. So, if I'm like at that I ask people. So, if I'm like at that I ask people. So, if I'm like at like a dinner party or I'm talking to like a dinner party or I'm talking to like a dinner party or I'm talking to people, I will always say, "What are people, I will always say, "What are people, I will always say, "What are your hobbies?" your hobbies?" your hobbies?" And like it sounds like such a childish And like it sounds like such a childish And like it sounds like such a childish thing. You get the best answers. And thing. You get the best answers. And thing. You get the best answers. And then I also say, um then I also say, um then I also say, um "What do your parents think of of what "What do your parents think of of what "What do your parents think of of what you've done?" Or I ask a lot about their you've done?" Or I ask a lot about their you've done?" Or I ask a lot about their parents. And like they start opening up. parents. And like they start opening up. parents. And like they start opening up. But like I had to like learn how to like But like I had to like learn how to like But like I had to like learn how to like have small talk. have small talk. have small talk. >> [laughter] >> Yeah, everybody needs to, I think. Okay, >> Yeah, everybody needs to, I think. Okay, I like that. That's a cool That's a cool I like that. That's a cool That's a cool I like that. That's a cool That's a cool story. Can I um story. Can I um story. Can I um can I take it a totally different can I take it a totally different can I take it a totally different direction? direction? direction? >> All right, I could talk to you. Let me >> All right, I could talk to you. Let me >> All right, I could talk to you. Let me talk to you about something. Um it it's talk to you about something. Um it it's talk to you about something. Um it it's going to sound sad, and it is sad, but I going to sound sad, and it is sad, but I going to sound sad, and it is sad, but I think it's like really interesting. And think it's like really interesting. And think it's like really interesting. And uh I I have permission to talk about uh I I have permission to talk about uh I I have permission to talk about this, but I think it's cool. So, you and this, but I think it's cool. So, you and this, but I think it's cool. So, you and I had a producer named Ben Wilson. Ben I had a producer named Ben Wilson. Ben I had a producer named Ben Wilson. Ben Wilson uh was our producer for My First Wilson uh was our producer for My First Wilson uh was our producer for My First Million for a long time. Million for a long time. Million for a long time. And he now has a podcast called How to And he now has a podcast called How to And he now has a podcast called How to Take Over the World. Uh he's got four Take Over the World. Uh he's got four Take Over the World. Uh he's got four kids under the age of 5 years old. It's kids under the age of 5 years old. It's kids under the age of 5 years old. It's crazy. And 6 weeks ago he found out that crazy. And 6 weeks ago he found out that crazy. And 6 weeks ago he found out that he has stage four lung cancer he has stage four lung cancer he has stage four lung cancer uh where uh where uh where the odds are not in his favor, but he's the odds are not in his favor, but he's the odds are not in his favor, but he's got like the best doctors in the world. got like the best doctors in the world. got like the best doctors in the world. So, like some crazy things might happen. So, like some crazy things might happen. So, like some crazy things might happen. He's very optimistic. But, I went and He's very optimistic. But, I went and He's very optimistic. But, I went and met with him yesterday. He he's in New met with him yesterday. He he's in New met with him yesterday. He he's in New York to see a doctor. York to see a doctor. York to see a doctor. And I wanted to talk about my experience And I wanted to talk about my experience And I wanted to talk about my experience getting to like like talk to him cuz getting to like like talk to him cuz getting to like like talk to him cuz this is like a very like interesting this is like a very like interesting this is like a very like interesting predicament that he's in. Think about predicament that he's in. Think about predicament that he's in. Think about this. 6 weeks ago he found this out. So, this. 6 weeks ago he found this out. So, this. 6 weeks ago he found this out. So, in the 6 weeks he moved his house. He in the 6 weeks he moved his house. He in the 6 weeks he moved his house. He sold his home and got a new home closer sold his home and got a new home closer sold his home and got a new home closer to the doctor that he's going. to the doctor that he's going. to the doctor that he's going. Uh he did like a $400,000 fundraiser, Uh he did like a $400,000 fundraiser, Uh he did like a $400,000 fundraiser, which was amazing. He like got his will which was amazing. He like got his will which was amazing. He like got his will and all of his estate stuff together. and all of his estate stuff together. and all of his estate stuff together. And he's gone to like all these um And he's gone to like all these um And he's gone to like all these um like doctors' appointments, like so many like doctors' appointments, like so many like doctors' appointments, like so many of them. And I remember like talking to of them. And I remember like talking to of them. And I remember like talking to him yesterday. And I was like, "Dude, him yesterday. And I was like, "Dude, him yesterday. And I was like, "Dude, you've gone through so much. Like this you've gone through so much. Like this you've gone through so much. Like this is so heavy." And I And he was telling is so heavy." And I And he was telling is so heavy." And I And he was telling me a little bit about it. And I My me a little bit about it. And I My me a little bit about it. And I My initial reaction when I heard all this, initial reaction when I heard all this, initial reaction when I heard all this, I felt like extreme sadness. Partially I felt like extreme sadness. Partially I felt like extreme sadness. Partially because Ben's a Mormon. So, Ben has lung because Ben's a Mormon. So, Ben has lung because Ben's a Mormon. So, Ben has lung cancer and it's in his spine and in his cancer and it's in his spine and in his cancer and it's in his spine and in his brain. But, it started as lung cancer. brain. But, it started as lung cancer. brain. But, it started as lung cancer. And he has never smoked. He has never And he has never smoked. He has never And he has never smoked. He has never drank. He has really never done anything drank. He has really never done anything drank. He has really never done anything bad in his life. Uh bad in his life. Uh bad in his life. Uh and I felt like I felt like uh like we and I felt like I felt like uh like we and I felt like I felt like uh like we have an agreement with the universe have an agreement with the universe have an agreement with the universe where we put good in and we should get where we put good in and we should get where we put good in and we should get good out. And I was like, "This good out. And I was like, "This good out. And I was like, "This agreement has been broken." And I felt agreement has been broken." And I felt agreement has been broken." And I felt like pretty like pissed about it. And I like pretty like pissed about it. And I like pretty like pissed about it. And I Yeah, I felt very angry. But, then like Yeah, I felt very angry. But, then like Yeah, I felt very angry. But, then like I started like seeing how he was I started like seeing how he was I started like seeing how he was reacting to all this stuff. And like I reacting to all this stuff. And like I reacting to all this stuff. And like I would put myself in that shoes. I'm would put myself in that shoes. I'm would put myself in that shoes. I'm like, "All right. 6 weeks ago like, "All right. 6 weeks ago like, "All right. 6 weeks ago in June I find out that I have this in June I find out that I have this in June I find out that I have this illness. Like how do I react?" And I was illness. Like how do I react?" And I was illness. Like how do I react?" And I was like, "I would be I would go insane. I I like, "I would be I would go insane. I I like, "I would be I would go insane. I I would be so sad. I'd be so depressed." would be so sad. I'd be so depressed." would be so sad. I'd be so depressed." It was just like crazy how calm he was. It was just like crazy how calm he was. It was just like crazy how calm he was. And what's interesting is that Ben has a And what's interesting is that Ben has a And what's interesting is that Ben has a podcast called How to Take Over the podcast called How to Take Over the podcast called How to Take Over the World, which is about like how great World, which is about like how great World, which is about like how great leaders become great. leaders become great. leaders become great. And I was thinking about that. And he And I was thinking about that. And he And I was thinking about that. And he had this uh journal with him. And it was had this uh journal with him. And it was had this uh journal with him. And it was on the title of this journal was zero to on the title of this journal was zero to on the title of this journal was zero to 365. 365. 365. And I was like, "What's this?" He was And I was like, "What's this?" He was And I was like, "What's this?" He was like, "I have a journal where I'm going like, "I have a journal where I'm going like, "I have a journal where I'm going to document every single day, and my to document every single day, and my to document every single day, and my goal is to fill this whole thing out. goal is to fill this whole thing out. goal is to fill this whole thing out. It may not happen, but I'm going to work It may not happen, but I'm going to work It may not happen, but I'm going to work my hardest to fill this out and make it my hardest to fill this out and make it my hardest to fill this out and make it 365 days, and I pray that there's a 365 days, and I pray that there's a 365 days, and I pray that there's a sequel to this journal so my kids can sequel to this journal so my kids can sequel to this journal so my kids can like read this. But if I can't do it and like read this. But if I can't do it and like read this. But if I can't do it and I meet my maker sooner than I intend to I meet my maker sooner than I intend to I meet my maker sooner than I intend to or I want to, I'm going to be really or I want to, I'm going to be really or I want to, I'm going to be really excited about it. And I remember like excited about it. And I remember like excited about it. And I remember like thinking like I listen to his podcast thinking like I listen to his podcast thinking like I listen to his podcast all the time on like how to be great, all the time on like how to be great, all the time on like how to be great, and I listen to all these podcasts on and I listen to all these podcasts on and I listen to all these podcasts on how to be great. We just did one on like how to be great. We just did one on like how to be great. We just did one on like how to be great. And I was thinking, I how to be great. And I was thinking, I how to be great. And I was thinking, I was like, was like, was like, "What's crazy is how much dignity and "What's crazy is how much dignity and "What's crazy is how much dignity and integrity and bravery this guy is facing integrity and bravery this guy is facing integrity and bravery this guy is facing this." this." this." And I was like, "Me or you or hopefully And I was like, "Me or you or hopefully And I was like, "Me or you or hopefully and everyone listening, the odds are and everyone listening, the odds are and everyone listening, the odds are that none of us will face like a tragedy that none of us will face like a tragedy that none of us will face like a tragedy like this." But I was thinking, I was like this." But I was thinking, I was like this." But I was thinking, I was like, "In my day-to-day life, like I like, "In my day-to-day life, like I like, "In my day-to-day life, like I react to things sometimes in such a react to things sometimes in such a react to things sometimes in such a horrible way, like so negatively horrible way, like so negatively horrible way, like so negatively and uh so like not being positive or I'm and uh so like not being positive or I'm and uh so like not being positive or I'm letting little things bother me or letting little things bother me or letting little things bother me or little things distract me from what's little things distract me from what's little things distract me from what's important." important." important." But I was like, "I really should change But I was like, "I really should change But I was like, "I really should change that because I hope I never face that because I hope I never face that because I hope I never face anything like he's facing." But what anything like he's facing." But what anything like he's facing." But what I've noticed knowing Ben for a few years I've noticed knowing Ben for a few years I've noticed knowing Ben for a few years is he's always been like a pretty stoic is he's always been like a pretty stoic is he's always been like a pretty stoic brave person. And I'm like, "These brave person. And I'm like, "These brave person. And I'm like, "These little things that I face every single little things that I face every single little things that I face every single day, they can prepare me for something day, they can prepare me for something day, they can prepare me for something horrible, and I hope that horrible thing horrible, and I hope that horrible thing horrible, and I hope that horrible thing never happens. never happens. never happens. And if it doesn't, at least I will have And if it doesn't, at least I will have And if it doesn't, at least I will have like responded to like my day-to-day like responded to like my day-to-day like responded to like my day-to-day life in a way that a great man would." life in a way that a great man would." life in a way that a great man would." Because what's interesting is like Because what's interesting is like Because what's interesting is like seeing him like journal about this, and seeing him like journal about this, and seeing him like journal about this, and he was like show me a little of the he was like show me a little of the he was like show me a little of the journal. In my head, I was like, "I'm journal. In my head, I was like, "I'm journal. In my head, I was like, "I'm seeing like a great man be great in real seeing like a great man be great in real seeing like a great man be great in real time and respond to like the worst thing time and respond to like the worst thing time and respond to like the worst thing on Earth on Earth on Earth in the most dignified, wise, and like in the most dignified, wise, and like in the most dignified, wise, and like the best way I've ever seen." And it the best way I've ever seen." And it the best way I've ever seen." And it inspired me so much, and I was just inspired me so much, and I was just inspired me so much, and I was just like, what good can I take from this? like, what good can I take from this? like, what good can I take from this? How can I be great even if I don't face How can I be great even if I don't face How can I be great even if I don't face like a tragedy or like if I just live a like a tragedy or like if I just live a like a tragedy or like if I just live a boring life? Like how could I be great boring life? Like how could I be great boring life? Like how could I be great on a day-to-day basis? on a day-to-day basis? on a day-to-day basis? >> Wow. Yeah. That's a great I mean I'm >> Wow. Yeah. That's a great I mean I'm >> Wow. Yeah. That's a great I mean I'm that's a great way of putting it. Um that's a great way of putting it. Um that's a great way of putting it. Um couple of things that came up. couple of things that came up. couple of things that came up. The first is, you know, if you haven't The first is, you know, if you haven't The first is, you know, if you haven't listened already, go listen to his listened already, go listen to his listened already, go listen to his podcast where he announced it. I mean I podcast where he announced it. I mean I podcast where he announced it. I mean I I listened to that I probably listened I listened to that I probably listened I listened to that I probably listened to that two or three times. I listened to that two or three times. I listened to that two or three times. I listened the first time I myself the first time I myself the first time I myself I listened a second time when my mom was I listened a second time when my mom was I listened a second time when my mom was in the car cuz I wanted her to hear cuz in the car cuz I wanted her to hear cuz in the car cuz I wanted her to hear cuz I just thought his entire attitude I just thought his entire attitude I just thought his entire attitude towards the situation, towards what is, towards the situation, towards what is, towards the situation, towards what is, you know, you know, you know, a very devastating sort of a very devastating sort of a very devastating sort of piece of news. It it is is you have piece of news. It it is is you have piece of news. It it is is you have every right to be sad. You have every every right to be sad. You have every every right to be sad. You have every right to be bad. You have every every right to be bad. You have every every right to be bad. You have every every right to feel, you know, any of the right to feel, you know, any of the right to feel, you know, any of the feelings you want to feel and he kind of feelings you want to feel and he kind of feelings you want to feel and he kind of had such a different perspective. It had such a different perspective. It had such a different perspective. It made me think a couple of things. The made me think a couple of things. The made me think a couple of things. The first was, man, first was, man, first was, man, um you know, I haven't been a religious um you know, I haven't been a religious um you know, I haven't been a religious person person person in my life and in my life and in my life and I think it's cuz I think it's cuz I think it's cuz the way my, you know, just my my logical the way my, you know, just my my logical the way my, you know, just my my logical brain is sort of like, "Well, I don't brain is sort of like, "Well, I don't brain is sort of like, "Well, I don't know. There's no evidence." You know, know. There's no evidence." You know, know. There's no evidence." You know, like there's like literally like the like there's like literally like the like there's like literally like the definition of like definition of like definition of like faith is kind of like believing without faith is kind of like believing without faith is kind of like believing without evidence and I've always respected evidence and I've always respected evidence and I've always respected religion but I've never felt it. Um but religion but I've never felt it. Um but religion but I've never felt it. Um but when I saw his response and the way he when I saw his response and the way he when I saw his response and the way he was like, you know, "I'm excited to meet was like, you know, "I'm excited to meet was like, you know, "I'm excited to meet my maker and if you know, if God's my maker and if you know, if God's my maker and if you know, if God's calling me then that's you know, the way calling me then that's you know, the way calling me then that's you know, the way it was serving him." I was like, "Wow, it was serving him." I was like, "Wow, it was serving him." I was like, "Wow, this is the this is the this is the this is the these are the rewards for this is the these are the rewards for this is the these are the rewards for living with like such strong faith is living with like such strong faith is living with like such strong faith is that even when the worst that even when the worst that even when the worst news hits, even when and when anybody news hits, even when and when anybody news hits, even when and when anybody else would feel, you know, sorry for else would feel, you know, sorry for else would feel, you know, sorry for themselves, themselves, themselves, um you know, he he took it very very um you know, he he took it very very um you know, he he took it very very differently and it was like such a differently and it was like such a differently and it was like such a foundational thing for him. So I was foundational thing for him. So I was foundational thing for him. So I was >> He said I'm excited. He told me and I >> He said I'm excited. He told me and I >> He said I'm excited. He told me and I think he said in the pod he goes, "I'm think he said in the pod he goes, "I'm think he said in the pod he goes, "I'm He goes, can be excited about this." And He goes, can be excited about this." And He goes, can be excited about this." And I thought that was like I thought that was like I thought that was like >> Yeah, that's uncommon. Unbelievable. Um >> Yeah, that's uncommon. Unbelievable. Um >> Yeah, that's uncommon. Unbelievable. Um so, I thought that was the first thing so, I thought that was the first thing so, I thought that was the first thing that was like really highlighted like that was like really highlighted like that was like really highlighted like the virtue and the value of like being a the virtue and the value of like being a the virtue and the value of like being a person of faith and how like, you know, person of faith and how like, you know, person of faith and how like, you know, I've I've I've in my own life not in my own life not in my own life not I've had the luxury of not having to I've had the luxury of not having to I've had the luxury of not having to have that cuz life goes pretty well have that cuz life goes pretty well have that cuz life goes pretty well without it for me, right? Like without without it for me, right? Like without without it for me, right? Like without having to to have faith in in certain having to to have faith in in certain having to to have faith in in certain things. things. things. Um so, I thought that was that that Um so, I thought that was that that Um so, I thought that was that that really stood out. The second was really stood out. The second was really stood out. The second was I think you nailed it. The difference, I think you nailed it. The difference, I think you nailed it. The difference, you know, his pod- podcast is about you know, his pod- podcast is about you know, his pod- podcast is about Napoleon and Caesar and these Napoleon and Caesar and these Napoleon and Caesar and these complicated men who achieve, who complicated men who achieve, who complicated men who achieve, who conquered. I think, you know, it's how conquered. I think, you know, it's how conquered. I think, you know, it's how to take over the world. It's about to take over the world. It's about to take over the world. It's about conquerors. It's about the the world conquerors. It's about the the world conquerors. It's about the the world shapers. shapers. shapers. And there's a big difference between And there's a big difference between And there's a big difference between achieving greatness and being great. achieving greatness and being great. achieving greatness and being great. What Ben is doing right now is What Ben is doing right now is What Ben is doing right now is greatness, but it's being great, not greatness, but it's being great, not greatness, but it's being great, not achieving something. And I think there's achieving something. And I think there's achieving something. And I think there's a huge difference and I think a huge difference and I think a huge difference and I think for myself and most people that we don't for myself and most people that we don't for myself and most people that we don't really split those out. really split those out. really split those out. And it it's very easy to set goals and, And it it's very easy to set goals and, And it it's very easy to set goals and, you know, I remember being young and you know, I remember being young and you know, I remember being young and being like, I want to be Forbes 30 under being like, I want to be Forbes 30 under being like, I want to be Forbes 30 under 30. This was before it became like, you 30. This was before it became like, you 30. This was before it became like, you know, the know, the know, the FBI watchlist. But I remember thinking FBI watchlist. But I remember thinking FBI watchlist. But I remember thinking like, that would be a great achievement. like, that would be a great achievement. like, that would be a great achievement. I want to have a million dollars in my I want to have a million dollars in my I want to have a million dollars in my bank account. I want to have this. I bank account. I want to have this. I bank account. I want to have this. I want to have that. When I was like 19, want to have that. When I was like 19, want to have that. When I was like 19, 20 years old. And it's like it was all 20 years old. And it's like it was all 20 years old. And it's like it was all about achieving. And the two people about achieving. And the two people about achieving. And the two people we've talked about, Ramon and Ben, we've talked about, Ramon and Ben, we've talked about, Ramon and Ben, they're great examples of being great. they're great examples of being great. they're great examples of being great. Living day-to-day in a great way. He's Living day-to-day in a great way. He's Living day-to-day in a great way. He's really showing his greatness uh you really showing his greatness uh you really showing his greatness uh you know, in in the hardest time, which is know, in in the hardest time, which is know, in in the hardest time, which is when when it when it when it matters, when when it when it when it matters, when when it when it when it matters, when it counts, when it's real. when it counts, when it's real. when it counts, when it's real. And then yeah, like, you know, And then yeah, like, you know, And then yeah, like, you know, I just hope that there's something, you I just hope that there's something, you I just hope that there's something, you know, in the maybe the age of AI, maybe know, in the maybe the age of AI, maybe know, in the maybe the age of AI, maybe there's some there's some there's some some way that, you know, with the best some way that, you know, with the best some way that, you know, with the best doctors, with the tech, with the belief, doctors, with the tech, with the belief, doctors, with the tech, with the belief, with everything that um you know, he with everything that um you know, he with everything that um you know, he does all right. does all right. does all right. >> Yeah, and he's he's he's um he um he >> Yeah, and he's he's he's um he um he >> Yeah, and he's he's he's um he um he like the Brian Johnsons and Andrew like the Brian Johnsons and Andrew like the Brian Johnsons and Andrew Hubermans of the world, like they like Hubermans of the world, like they like Hubermans of the world, like they like opened up the Rolodex and they put him opened up the Rolodex and they put him opened up the Rolodex and they put him in touch with all these people and he's in touch with all these people and he's in touch with all these people and he's doing all this like the traditional doing all this like the traditional doing all this like the traditional stuff and some experimental stuff and stuff and some experimental stuff and stuff and some experimental stuff and yesterday he was like I feel really yesterday he was like I feel really yesterday he was like I feel really good. I feel better than I have in a good. I feel better than I have in a good. I feel better than I have in a long time. long time. long time. >> Yeah. So, um >> Yeah. So, um >> Yeah. So, um >> Uh it's looking good, but I the reason >> Uh it's looking good, but I the reason >> Uh it's looking good, but I the reason why I wanted to bring this up on My why I wanted to bring this up on My why I wanted to bring this up on My First Million because I don't think we First Million because I don't think we First Million because I don't think we say this this explicitly enough, but we say this this explicitly enough, but we say this this explicitly enough, but we have said it before. Which is have said it before. Which is have said it before. Which is we talk about like being rich here and we talk about like being rich here and we talk about like being rich here and we try to say a rich life and we try we try to say a rich life and we try we try to say a rich life and we try hard to like let people know that this hard to like let people know that this hard to like let people know that this isn't just about money. It's just It's isn't just about money. It's just It's isn't just about money. It's just It's It's about It's about It's about defining what life is um worth living defining what life is um worth living defining what life is um worth living and how it how it can be rich for you. and how it how it can be rich for you. and how it how it can be rich for you. And I just want to reiterate that like And I just want to reiterate that like And I just want to reiterate that like the million in My First Million doesn't the million in My First Million doesn't the million in My First Million doesn't necessarily mean dollars, but it means necessarily mean dollars, but it means necessarily mean dollars, but it means like like like the first like unit of richness that you the first like unit of richness that you the first like unit of richness that you can have in your life. And so can have in your life. And so can have in your life. And so that's sort of my public service that's sort of my public service that's sort of my public service announcement, but also like some of the announcement, but also like some of the announcement, but also like some of the things that I've learned in talking with things that I've learned in talking with things that I've learned in talking with him. him. him. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. Well, I'm glad you shared that. Uh Ben, Well, I'm glad you shared that. Uh Ben, Well, I'm glad you shared that. Uh Ben, we're rooting for you, man. Uh we're rooting for you, man. Uh we're rooting for you, man. Uh Yeah, he's part of the he's part of the Yeah, he's part of the he's part of the Yeah, he's part of the he's part of the MFM family. He was He was our producer MFM family. He was He was our producer MFM family. He was He was our producer for what? Like a year a year or two? for what? Like a year a year or two? for what? Like a year a year or two? Something like that. Something like that. Something like that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> He had his podcast and we met We met >> He had his podcast and we met We met >> He had his podcast and we met We met through you You put me on his podcast. through you You put me on his podcast. through you You put me on his podcast. You were like, "Dude, I've been You were like, "Dude, I've been You were like, "Dude, I've been listening to this thing. It's amazing." listening to this thing. It's amazing." listening to this thing. It's amazing." Then I remember going to the airport Then I remember going to the airport Then I remember going to the airport and I was listening to his Edison and I was listening to his Edison and I was listening to his Edison episode. episode. episode. And it's a three-parter and I drove to And it's a three-parter and I drove to And it's a three-parter and I drove to the airport, listened to part one, the airport, listened to part one, the airport, listened to part one, drove back, listened to part two, drove back, listened to part two, drove back, listened to part two, and then I just went for an extra drive and then I just went for an extra drive and then I just went for an extra drive to listen to part three. And I was like, to listen to part three. And I was like, to listen to part three. And I was like, "Wow, this is amazing." And I called him "Wow, this is amazing." And I called him "Wow, this is amazing." And I called him and I was like, "Dude, who are you? and I was like, "Dude, who are you? and I was like, "Dude, who are you? What's your story?" And then we brought What's your story?" And then we brought What's your story?" And then we brought him in, he became our producer, which him in, he became our producer, which him in, he became our producer, which helped him pay the bills while he was helped him pay the bills while he was helped him pay the bills while he was getting his podcast kind of like more getting his podcast kind of like more getting his podcast kind of like more and more off the ground, then it was and more off the ground, then it was and more off the ground, then it was time for him to kind of like focus on time for him to kind of like focus on time for him to kind of like focus on his pod. We wished him well and his pod. We wished him well and his pod. We wished him well and you know, still wishing him well. So, you know, still wishing him well. So, you know, still wishing him well. So, Ben, get get well, man. We uh we're all Ben, get get well, man. We uh we're all Ben, get get well, man. We uh we're all rooting for you. rooting for you. rooting for you. >> Yes, it was a very the I hope listener, >> Yes, it was a very the I hope listener, >> Yes, it was a very the I hope listener, I hope you don't take this as sad and I hope you don't take this as sad and I hope you don't take this as sad and I'm sure Ben's going to hear this, but I'm sure Ben's going to hear this, but I'm sure Ben's going to hear this, but it was it was it was the I I I I want to leave on a on a on a the I I I I want to leave on a on a on a the I I I I want to leave on a on a on a inspirational note not not sadness. So I inspirational note not not sadness. So I inspirational note not not sadness. So I hope you guys dug it and we'll end hope you guys dug it and we'll end hope you guys dug it and we'll end there. That's it. That's the pod.