The Manifestation SECRETS You Were Never Told! | Katherine Woodward Thomas

Key Takeaway

You can't outwork or analyze your way past trauma. Start with a positive possible future - not a goal based on your current identity, but the grandest vision coded in your soul. The future you're living into determines your current motivation and actions even more than your past does. When you feel triggered, ask yourself: 'How old are you, sweetheart?' Differentiate your wise adult self from your wounded younger self, then take action from wisdom, not wounds.

Episode Overview

Katherine Woodward Thomas, licensed therapist and bestselling author, reveals why traditional therapy often keeps us stuck analyzing our past instead of creating our future. She explains how core beliefs like 'I'm not enough' and 'I'm alone' form in childhood through relational wounding, and more importantly, how we unconsciously perpetuate these patterns by 'enrolling' others to validate our false stories. The breakthrough: start with your greatest possible future, then develop the capacity to embody that future self today.

Full Transcript

Transcript of The Manifestation SECRETS You Were Never Told! | Katherine Woodward Thomas from The School of Greatness. Auto-generated from episode audio; may contain minor errors.

The thing about the I'm not good enough and that is the most pervasive one. Although the second runner up is I'm alone. Everything that is not working, if I'm not getting fed properly, people are ignoring my needs. If I'm aware that my mother didn't want to be pregnant with me, I might form a self sense of I'm not wanted. Wow. Whether she said it or not. Absolutely. And it happens in the womb. She is a licensed marriage and family therapist, a New York Times bestselling author, and an internationally recognized teacher of personal transformation.

Katherine Woodward Thomas, Thomas, Thomas, you actually cannot progress in your life when you are making a home of victimization. victimization. victimization. What if all these bad things happened to us? We were traumatized, someone hurt us, they abused us, they abandoned us. Shouldn't we feel victimized? So, you want to look at how was I the source of it? Who was I being that allowed that to happen? No, you have to kind of put your big girl, big boy panties on and really show up for yourself. yourself.

yourself. It's hard to create from a victimhood is what appears. what appears. what appears. You can't create from victimhood. The first entry to creativity is giving up victimity. Welcome back everyone to the School of Greatness. I'm very excited about our guest. We have the inspiring Katherine Woodward Thomas in the house. She is a licensed marriage and family therapist, a New York Times bestselling author, and an internationally recognized teacher of personal transformation. She spent decades helping people clear emotional blocks, align their inner world, and consciously create the life and relationships they desire.

And I'm excited that you're here because the last time you're on was over a decade ago. And it was such a powerful conversation to help people heal. And you have a new book out called What's True About You? Seven Steps to Move Beyond Your Painful Past and Manifest Your Brightest Future. And the first thing I want to ask you, Katherine, is about why so many people don't feel like they are enough. You have You have You have these different core beliefs that you talk about in your book that block people from manifesting their greatest future and from feeling enough.

Yeah. Why do you think one of the biggest core blocks that holds people back is I am not good enough? Where does that come from and how can we start to overcome that? Well, when we're young, our our our task is to form a sense of self and to understand who we are for others and where we fit into this world. Mhm. And so when you're young and you can't do things for yourself and you have parents who are trying their best or you know overburdened or whatever and so there maybe older siblings who can do things that you cannot do.

There's a lot of ways that we would get the message that somehow I'm small. Uh somehow I don't have the power that I need to do the things that I would need to do. I can't get what I want. Also, children take on the emotional uh troubles of their parents. So, if their parents are depressed and they can't fix their parent or their parent is an alcoholic, they can't fix that. They don't internalize it. They have they don't have the cognitive or we didn't have the cognitive capacity to recognize the situation with any kind of complexity or holistic understanding that oh my mother needs AA or my parents are having money problems.

It became who I am that somehow I am inadequate here. I cannot help this situation. I cannot do anything in this situation. I am too small. I am too insignificant. But there are also so these are these are what I call relational woundings. The I'm not good enough is in relationship to someone. That's interesting. So it's you have to feel I'm not good enough based on what someone else thinks of you or says about you or your interpretation of what they think or say about you.

Your interpretation Your interpretation Your interpretation interesting interesting interesting of what they must feel about you. All beliefs have three components to them. Okay, what are they? We're a little unsophisticated. We'll say, okay, I I think I'm not enough. But what that means really is that when I'm with others, what I'm projecting onto others is that others are better than me. M me. M me. M or that others don't value me. And then also in there's a projection onto life that somehow I'm insignificant that no matter what I do, I cannot get ahead.

I have to do twice as much for half the reward. So there's a whole world view that's centered on who I am, what is or is not possible for me, how other people are going to treat me or how other people will feel about me. The thing about the I'm not good enough and that is the most pervasive one. Although the second runner up is I'm alone particularly in America where we you know kind of live with rugged individualism and we're also separate and we're on our little devices which is only increasing that but there are actually you know 22 of them which I've determined are the most common ones.

22 core beliefs. Core beliefs at the level of identity that will actually serve as the inner glass ceilings on our potentials. Now, why they get perpetuated is what's interesting to me, right? So, that's where they come from. We're forming identity before we have the cognitive capacity capacity capacity to understand the complexities of what's happening around us. So everything that is not working, if I'm not getting fed properly, people are ignoring my needs, um if I'm, you know, aware that my mother didn't want to be pregnant with me, I might form a self sense of I'm not wanted.

wanted. wanted. Wow. Um whether she said it or not, maybe she said something about it or maybe she just gave energy that she's frustrated with you and you think, "Oh, she really didn't want me." Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Could be any interpretation, right? And it happens in the womb. Oh, man. There are there's scientific evidence and I I cite the evidence in the book. There's scientific evidence about how consciousness at the level of identity is often imprinted at in the womb womb womb based on the mother's identity based on the mother's feeling towards the fetus.

the fetus. the fetus. Oh my goodness. So, there's one study that um I one story that I I put in the book about uh uh this this baby that was born that would not take her mother's breast when she was born. She refused the mother's breast. So, of course, the doctors are crazy and they're trying to figure out what's going on because the mother has milk, but the baby won't drink the milk. They bring her to another mother who has milk. And the baby drinks that milk.

Oh, not really. So, the doctor comes to her and says, "Wait a minute. What's going on? What really was happening?" And the mother finally admitted, "Well, I didn't want her. I only had her because my husband wanted her and I really want nothing to do with me." Oh my gosh. So the baby knew that as a new baby felt it like the the immune system or the nervous system felt like rejected almost probably or something. Absolutely. Right. So so but the danger is and and what we are all struggling because we're all like you know this is interesting like how did these beliefs form?

Where do they come from? What I'm interested in as a person who is committed to helping people to actualize their potentials, become the highest and best, most authentic version of themselves, live out loud, be like a shining star shooting through the sky in this lifetime. Like, you know, really, that's why we all came here. So, what I'm interested in is why does that pattern keep showing up over and over and over again? And that's what the book is deconstructing. is deconstructing. is deconstructing. Well, yes. I guess one is identifying, you know, you might be living with one of these beliefs which is I am alone.

I am bad. I don't belong. I'm a burden. I am crazy. I am damaged goods. I'm different. I'm disgusting. I'm not enough. I'm a failure. I'm not I'm not important. I'm invisible. All these things. things. things. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like I felt all those at some point in my life. Right. It's like every one of those I could identify with a time where I I am stupid. I'm not safe. I am powerless. I don't matter. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, I am too much. I'm unworthy.

I am not valuable. I'm not wanted. I am wrong. I can relate to all those. Yes, Yes, Yes, at some point in my life and I can think back to when I was a child or my teens or 20, even a few years ago and say, "Oh, there's a point of this where yeah, I could relate to that. Maybe I don't live into those anymore, but I can definitely relate to feeling that and not knowing how to break free from those feelings." feelings." feelings." Exactly. Like Exactly.

Like Exactly. Like right right right first you have to identify okay I'm saying over and over again that no one loves me loves me loves me that I'm always left behind or I'm not enough or I don't matter or whatever one of these beliefs is I'm a burden I'm bad I'm wrong all these things first I'm hearing you say is like learning to identify of what's you know keeping us playing small from these feelings and then figuring out how do we break free of each one that we identify with which is really hard if you don't have the tools tools tools Well, and I think people have been trying to do it for years.

I mean, I became a psychotherapist kind of from the inside out only because I was so committed to breaking free of my own unconscious false beliefs. I actually called them source fracture stories, the original break and belonging, right? The original wounding. Um, so and that I I went to therapy for years and yes, it helped. Oh my gosh, it saved my life actually. Really? Because I was a compulsive overeater. I had an addiction that was severe. I was nonfunctional. So therapy really helped. Overeater. Is that what you said?

Yeah, overeater. I was a binge eater when I was in my early teens and early 20s. It was out of control. Like I was even unemployable. So it kind of was a great thing really because it forced me to do my own work. I couldn't progress in life unless I handled that. So I went to therapy. I went to 12step programs. I did all sorts of things to try and heal it. Now, it helps to go back. You've got to grieve. You got to you got to see what happened.

You you have to understand it. But after that, if you just stay stuck in analyzing why you are the way you are, which I did for years because that was all that was really available, you kind of solidify the self of that story. Yeah. You stay stuck in the past as your identity, right? It's like you're staying in it rather than integrating the healing and transforming beyond it and creating a new story. Well, what we focus on grows. Yes. Yes. Yes. So, if you're constantly, oh, there it is again.

I'm not, oh, it's because my father and oh, it's because my mother actually it is because your father. It is because of what happened and how you interpreted that and you know, and then it's how you started to show up. This is another piece of it. How we are the source of our own experience. So in the I'm not good enough, what we tend to do is we overfunction. We overgive. Yes. We do do. That was me for a long time. Which then Which then Which then achieve accomplish or whatever it is.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and and and and you start overfunctioning with other people so that they start underfunctioning. So in a way you're training people that your time is not as valuable as theirs. You're not really as good as them. You're more subservient to them. This is how we then enroll a relational field that validates that story. Yes. Yes. Yes. Because self is not a solo phenomenon. Self is relational. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so what's happening for most of us is that we're working on our issues, but we keep going back to the past.

And what happens where we get stuck is that we get victimized get victimized get victimized by our own imprinting. now right now. My my father was this way and now this is how I am and I can't get out of it and I we get mad at ourselves and we don't know how to figure out to reprogram ourselves and but so we keep going backwards to do it. I did this for well over a decade until I finally figured out when I was like around 40 and I'd been working on myself since my, you know, early 20s.

Okay. For a long time to be swimming and analyzing why I am the way that I am and then going to school to help other people analyze why they are the way they are. It's the future that actually pulls us forward. forward. forward. So, so understanding the past is a good thing, but staying there is not is what I'm hear you say. That is true. It will save your life, but it won't change. Interesting. So, we need we can't just bypass the past and just say, "Oh, I'm not going to think about it.

and I'm just going to only focus on the future. It's almost like we need to heal the memories of the past, make sense and meaning of them, but then but then say, okay, that is a different chapter in my life, and I'm creating a new chapter with a new vision, and I don't have to be stuck in that belief anymore. anymore. anymore. But I will tell you, I I have a new form of psychotherapy that I've developed, and I have a group of therapists. We've been working on this together.

you can actually bring the a positive possible future into your preliminary work on healing the past. Right? So in other words, it's like I know you have a big destiny and I know that your life has been really handicapped by this, you know, history that you have with trauma. with trauma. with trauma. The commitment is the context of our work is within two years you're going to be standing on that stage or you're going to be in that happy relationship. Let's get to work and clear that now so that the context is still the future because the future what you initiate with the future is development.

Who will I need to be in order to manifest and sustain that future? You don't necessarily initiate development in just healing the past. You look at it, you feel it, you grieve it, you know, you learn how to regulate yourself. It's not necessarily developmental in, you know, and most of us can't actualize our potential yet because in being stuck in past trauma, we were actually missing certain skills and capacities that would allow us to create something other than the patterns we feel stuck in. It's probably hard to think of a a beautiful possible future if we're stuck in past trauma as well.

It's probably hard to like step into it if we're always have something kind of dragging us back or weighing us down emotionally. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, you know, I don't know. It's going to be like in fight or flight trying to accomplish it. accomplish it. accomplish it. Well, you're in non-possibility. And by that time, if living in the story of I'm invisible because you had a narcissistic parent who punished you every time you, you know, dared speak your truth or or shamed you. you know, inside of the I'm invisible, what's underdeveloped is the capacity to even recognize your own feelings feelings feelings or your own needs and then to be able to bring that forth to others and negotiate those needs with the assumption that other people might actually care about those needs if you brought them forward.

That's like a whole new concept to someone with invisibility because the invisibility projection onto others is that other people don't really care about my feelings and needs. So why would I would I would I every time I try to talk they shut me down or they don't pay attention or it's the interpretation of what happens in relationship to others. Right. Yes. And then there's a deeper level of complexity. I'm going to bring it all in because you have such a great audience who's following you and knows all this stuff already.

But if you're in a and now I'm invisible and you know that you need to speak up and tell your truth, what you might not know is that you're speaking through the filter of other people don't really care about me and other people are selfish. If you ask somebody for what you need through the filter of other people don't care about me, you're going to it's going to come out like well I want a glass of water too, you know, you know, you know, as opposed to hey honey, would you get me a glass of water?

Right. Right. Right. Right. which then makes people defensive and we'll get your own. Right. Which it that's how we're generating our own experience through the consciousness that we're centered in. Yeah. And you used a word earlier about enrolling people. We're enrolling people in our relationship on how we we show up and how we communicate based on an interpretation of our past and based on our beliefs. our beliefs. our beliefs. Yeah. Globalizing that. This happens a lot with I'm not safe. people feel I'm not safe, not safe, not safe, you know.

So they're going into their close relationships like this. Okay, prove yourself to because because the projection onto others, something I'm not safe is others have ill intent, others are going to hurt me. So this is where you get love avoidant behavior or people crazy making, destabilizing in, out, push, pull, long distance, you know, all that stuff. trying to manage how you can have love but not have commitment, not have anybody too close to you because people will hurt you. So in order to really evolve beyond something like love addiction or love avoidance um you really have to get to the root of it which is this is the core belief.

How old is that part of me? You have to differentiate your wise self from your wounded self. Mhm. Usually when we get triggered, the wounded self is in charge and running the shop. the shop. the shop. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So we have to learn how to hold and contain our own younger selves that were wounded with deep compassion, presence, love, but get that little baby buckled up in the backseat of the car and not driving the car. That's got to be so hard. I mean, it was so hard for me for so many years to figure out how do I have a a wise self in me when my wounds are running my life.

life. life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so hard to like when you feel like you're suffocating because one of these these these um beliefs is just feels so true to you. I'm not enough. People don't listen to me. I'm wrong. I'm whatever it is. If you are if you're just like this is true to my core. Yeah, your wounds are running your life. Not the wise version of yourself. Not like this, this, this, you know, 10 year in the future version of you that's had all the experience.

It's so hard for It was so hard for me and it's so hard for I think a lot of people to breathe and not feel some type of tension in their nervous system or clenching in their throat or pain in their stomach or fear or anxiety around how is someone going to respond to me or react to me if I don't do X Y or Z. Yeah, it's such a fear if you haven't grown up with the experience of having a safe environment emotionally, I guess.

So, what's the process from identifying? Okay, I know something is off in my life and I feel anxious sometimes. I feel avoidant. I have these patterns in relationships. relationships. relationships. Once someone is able to identify that and they know they want a greater future, they want to be able to create something more beautiful in their life. What is the process afterwards to start healing and start leading with their wise self rather than the wound itself? Ah, as I step into 2026, one of my big wellness goals is consistency.

Showing up for my body, my mindset, my health every single day, even when life feels overwhelming. And that is why I love simple habits that support the bigger picture for my life. And starting off the new year strong with protein beverages at Starbucks is a big thing because Starbucks now offers a whole lineup of delicious protein beverages, including the brand new caramel protein latte, caramel protein matcha, and new protein drinks with no sugar added. This is huge. You can even add protein cold foam or protein boosted milk to your favorite drink.

So getting extra protein fits naturally into your routine. My go-to is the iced vanilla protein latte. It is so good at Starbucks. Oo, that first sip feeling is amazing. Bold signature espresso with protein boosted milk and sweet vanilla flavor. This is amazing. And what's so crazy is a grande has 29 g of protein. I mean, talk about staying consistent with your wellness goals. Now, my morning ice latte can make it feel effortless to hit my protein target. For me, this is just one of those small moments every day that starts it off right, a little bit stronger, and knowing I've gotten protein in my drink as well.

So, make sure to level up and add protein to your favorite drink at Starbucks. Yeah, beautiful question. Okay. So, in the the seven steps of moving beyond your painful past, where we begin is with a positive possible future. possible future. possible future. Now, I'm not talking about a goal because goals are kind of like to me, and this is my definition, so you know, people could argue with me, but to me, a goal is like the best possible situation that you could imagine given who you are and your resources.

Like, what's what's the best outcome that could possibly be predicted here? predicted here? predicted here? Okay. Okay. Okay. When I talk about intention, I'm talking about let's get right to the gold. Let's get outside of your current identity because the I'm not good enough is not going to think big enough. And the truth is is that what's coded in our souls is so much grander. I mean, this is what you're waking up in people. It's why people love you. School of great, you know, school of great school of average.

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Or the or school of best you could think you could be, you know. know. know. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's school of greatness. Like, what is that seed of greatness? Even if you have no evidence, what did you come here to create? What were you born for? And yeah, let's go. So, somebody's hungry for love. I don't want you just dating better people. I want you to go for the gold. Even though you've never had you always had crappy relationships, go for the highest and the best.

Go for like a Louisis and Martha situation. You know what I'm saying? So, so or or with finances. So you know whatever it is your career your self-expression your artistry your music whatever it is that you have in you now what I have found is when I sit with people people people and I can see that with them as the practitioner that's why I'm creating this new form of therapy and I have a coach training too but because the practitioner sponsors that dream most of us were not sponsored in our dreams and as a matter of fact if you kind of bring in the element of fairy tales most of us were kind of cursed.

Who do you think you are to do that? Oh, don't you too big for your britches. Sit down. Quiet. You know, you're causing too much trouble. So, a lot of us were kind of cur fell under the spell of that curse. So, we really begin with a positive possible future. There was studies, there was a study done by two women in 1986, 1986, 1986, Paulaurius and Hazel Marcus, and they wrote an academic paper on it about positive possible cells. and what they saw. Now, positive possible cells is like the best case an Olympic gold medal winner or you know, you know, the the actor standing on stage receiving an Oscar, right?

Or it could be, you know, a negative possible self, which many of us have and are trying desperately to avoid avoid avoid dead or go to jail or whatever. Yeah. Homeless or whatever it is, right? But the the the future that we're living into, what they found is the future that we're living into actually determines our current motivation and actions even more than the past does. The future we're living into or dreaming about. about. about. Yes. Yes. Yes. Has more impact than what? What? Say it again.

again. again. Than the past. Wow. Wow. Wow. So here we are doing our work on personal development. Looking at the past, the past. The past. The past. The past as though there's some kind of mystery. like if I get to the bottom of all of it, then I'll finally be free. But it's actually the future that holds the key. the key. the key. So claim a positive possible future. Even if it just seems like the craziest idea, think about it. What you're saying, saying, saying, especially if it's the craziest and claim it.

How do we claim it? Is it a way of writing it down, speaking it into existence? Is it thinking about it? It's an intention. It's a visioning practice. Like what does it feel like? You know, we bring the future into the present. We're all starting to get hipped to this mental rehearsal of seeing yourself. Obviously, athletes and musicians have been doing this for years. So, you bring the future into the present and it is ace. I mean, for some people who live in a very small identity, I'm not good enough.

I'm not worthy is a big one. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. I'm not worthy. Just the idea like just trying to get the idea of I have a million dollars just sitting in my bank account that I don't even need for someone who has an I'm not worthy. You feel like you're on a you're being your identity is stretched on a rack. Right? So we sit with that. We open ourselves up to it. We open our receptivity and then we bring it in like a like our imagination.

What does it look like, feel like, sound like, taste like? Who am I here? How are others relating to me? What's the intention that I could set that would initiate what I call a future pull? I think that was a Wayne Guyer uh originally created that a future pull that begins to inform my development in the direction of that dream dream dream in my decision- making today. Yes. Because in order for that to be possible, I have to start doing things differently, thinking differently, acting differently, different routines, different habits, right?

It's like you can't be living based on the past story anymore. It's towards a possible future. Yes. You're living into the self of your future. I mean, this is the practical way that this looks like. So, back in my 30s when I first started to discover this, I was so shy. I could not look people in the eye. I was painfully shy. Obviously, I had problems making friends, you know. I I I couldn't really get work that I wanted. I mean, life was not working for me.

I'd been like kind of screwing up for many years trying to figure myself out. I really hadn't had any successes. But I started to have this what I thought at the time was this bizarre bizarre bizarre sixth sense. And I remember even telling my mother at one point, I think I'm going to be talking to thousands of people one day. This is even before the internet, internet, internet, right? Like, how is that going to happen? Like, you never know the how to. You can't get stopped by the howto.

So, I didn't know how to create something like that. I wasn't even sure I wanted something like that. That was just my sense like that's the future that's calling me. We have to tune into that. Instead of dismissing it, I took it seriously. And the only thing I could think to do was to start articulating, you know, who I was in that future. I am a worldclass leader of love. I'm a world impacting, you know, hundreds of thousands of people to awaken and to expand their hearts to love.

That that was what I did at the time. And then I'd practice walking down the street from that center. And I remember going into Starbucks. Now, my usual way of ordering my morning coffee was, um, I'll have a a a latte, please. You know, my little shy way walk in. I'll have a a a grande latte, please. You just just try on a new way of being. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Because so much of it is like where we're centered at the level of identity is informing who we're being.

So, that's how I started to discover that that's how you begin to find your way to that future. And then what's that going to require of me? Well, at the time I made a very good decision, thank goodness. I thought, well, I don't know how I would even begin on that, but I do know that if I'm going to be speaking to thousands of people, I better make sure I have something to say. Yeah, of course. Right. So, then wisdom became my north star. Like, star.

Like, star. Like, get some wisdom. Yeah, exactly. Let's get some wisdom here. But the first step is not thinking about the past is actually claiming a positive possible future. Yes. And the second step is to name your source fracture story. Is that essentially the first time you felt wounded that caused the belief for you? So in every area of life, we tend to have one specific source fracture story that's really holding us back. One moment, one instance. Not like someone might have a lot of things that happened to them.

Yes. But you're saying one kind of core I am I am not good enough to do this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. that becomes the core identity in that area. I know mine. Yeah. Being sexually abused when I was five because that was like the first memory that I have. Wow. Wow. Wow. And then it was just like, oh, I'm not lovable. I'm not enough. I'm abusable. All these things, right? It's like and then it was almost like I emotionally emotionally emotionally found that in every other area of my life life life until I was about 30 until I was like, "Oh, I'm I'm living in this kind of what you call source fracture story wound still.

And I'm driven to kind of overcome that wound, but I haven't healed it yet. I'm driven to try to like feel enough to feel worthy by accomplishing and getting bigger and stronger and all these different things, different things, different things, right? Well, the overensating is a big deal. Driven to overensate, but it still didn't feel enough. enough. enough. It doesn't do it right. So, it's like what am I, you know, and it was like, why don't I still feel enough when I'm accomplishing all these things?

It's like I had a big future, but I wasn't able to heal the past still. Right. still. Right. still. Right. So, it's kind of masking the Well, I think that's where people are. That's why people are frustrated. Yeah. Exhausted, too. Yeah. Yeah. and exhausted because you can't work hard enough to get over that. You can't analyze it enough to get over it. it. it. Can't outrun your past. You can't. But what you can do is you can isolate it with the simple question, how old are you, sweetheart?

You, the adult, who has wisdom and depth and capacity can turn to yourself and say, "Sweetheart, how old are you? And where are you in my body? Now, there's two of you in the breath. Right. Right. Right. And what we want to make sure is that you're not taking action from the wounded self because you'll only create more evidence. more evidence. more evidence. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And learning how to then begin to mentor that younger self. And the first way you do it is to say, "I'm sorry for not loving I'm sorry for not loving you in the way you need to be loved." M you repair that within yourself because the the source factor story gets played out in the relationship with the self.

I'm sorry sweetheart for abusing you. Some men are uncomfortable with sweetheart you know. Right. Right. Right. Little Lou or Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Whatever. What do you buddy or you know son know son know son let me just tell you if people can't locate their adult self think about who you are for a friend in need. need. need. Mhm. You are that person already for other people. other people. other people. Yes. Yes. Yes. Think about the parent you are. Think about the leader that you are at work.

work. work. Yeah. Great way of I mean for people that are coming for the first time, it might sound weird that you're thinking there's two people in the room, but I've talked about this a lot in terms of like if people understand internal family systems and it's like the different parts of you and who have had these types of conversations, uh similar types of conversations. So I hopefully my core audience would understand this concept. But if someone's coming for the first time, they're thinking, "What are they talking about?

There's two parts of you and one person." You know, we we have these wounded parts of us from childhood, the psychological memory within our body that when I get triggered from something based on a wound, and if I'm not aware of it and catch myself, I'll react based on the wound versus respond based on the wisdom, like you said, that wiser part of me. And so it's just learning how to respond to things that might trigger us from the wisest version of us, from the higher version of us, rather than from the wounded version of us is what I'm hearing you say.

And that's what, you know, Katherine's talking about here is when you're coaching a friend who maybe is going through a bad dating experience and let's just say the guy is not whatever being attentive or not being kind or cheating on the girl, your your girlfriend or whatever it might be. and you give that person advice and say you're better than this, you deserve more. You know, create a boundary, leave this guy, whatever it might be. But if sometimes we don't know how to do that for ourselves, but we can coach someone else.

And so what I'm hearing you say is learning how to coach the wounded version of us inside of us. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. And how to calm down and how to say, "Hey, I've got you. I'm here for you. You're safe. I'm parenting you essentially. I'm I'm coaching you. I'm mentoring you." and let's make a a better decision together from a safer space. That's what I'm hearing you say. Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful. It's hard for people to understand that. Like if you told me this when I was 25, it' be like you're crazy.

What is this? Like just tell me how to make money, you know? Just tell me how to like get the girl. Tell me how to do something else because I'd be too afraid to address the parts of me that didn't feel enough. And I'd be too afraid to even speak them out loud that people thought I had a weakness. And I think there's a lot of specifically men in the world that are afraid to to be even speak out loud that they have one of these beliefs that I'm bad, I don't belong, I'm a burden, I'm crazy, I'm damaged, good, whatever it might be.

might be. might be. And I think the the faster we can name our source fracture story and go through these seven steps you talk about, the better our life will be in manifesting faster anything we want. Well, wherever we're centered at the level of identity is where we're generating our whole lives from. There's a lot at stake here. Say that one more time. Wherever we're centered at the level of identity is where we're generating our lives from. lives from. lives from. So, there's a lot at stake.

I can tell you a story. You know, sometimes stories help to integrate the concepts, right? So um these ideas have really been informed by my privilege of teaching tens of thousands of people in live interactive classes since 2007. since 2007. since 2007. I don't think there's many people who can say I've had the opportunity to teach 60 70,000 people in live classes where there's interactive coaching and people writing it and stuff. So, it's been a I'm a clinician, right? It's on the court and I'm a transformational teacher.

I didn't do that as a psychotherapist. I did it as a teacher. But these ideas are big ideas and they're actually they they could actually turn psychotherapy into a new direction for those who are ready to move into a future forward focus and start to really take these ideas and work with them and see how quickly the work goes. when you have the context of a positive possible future and when you're willing to uh help your client to understand themselves as the source of the patterns and get off of the victimization like take a zero tolerance for victimization which doesn't mean they weren't victimized okay it's just the most powerful place to be standing in life for those of us who are fierce about getting over this right so so yes you were victimized and let's not make a home of it right okay right okay right okay what happens if we make a home of being a victim to things we are victimized by.

You just don't progress. You actually cannot progress in your life when you are making a home of victimization. What if something really bad happened to us? We were traumatized. Someone hurt us. They abused us. They abandoned us. They left us dead. They stole from us. They robbed from us. What if all these bad things happened to us? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Shouldn't we feel victimized and pity and have everyone help and have everyone help us? It's not an eitheror. Yes, you were completely victimized. But victimization has two two parts to it.

One is who was I being, you know, that allowed that to happen. Now, that that's canceled in any childhood situation. Okay. Cancel. Can cancel. You were never ever ever responsible for anything when you were a kid. But, you know, who was I being on, you know, in that relationship that this person became so, you know, was ended up cheating on me as an adult. As an adult. Yeah. Yeah. As an adult. That's a smart question to ask yourself. Okay. So, what what might my 3% be in conscious uncoupling?

People are so angry when they're getting, you know, separated so much the other person's fault. I just say 97% then. What's your 3%? Yeah. Okay. So, you want to look at how is the source of it? But, um, and even if you were a kid and you were victimized and abandoned and abused and it wasn't your fault, why is it not worth it staying in victimhood as an adult? Well, the second part is who will I be in the face of it? Okay, that's the second part of not it's just the refusal to be in reaction to life because we really want to be creators of life and most of us are stuck in the being in reaction to life which means we're not going to be able to generate the miracles that we came here for.

for. for. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. So that's why so you have to you have to kind of you know put your big girl big boy panties on and really show up for yourself cuz it's hard to create from a victimhood is what I'm hearing you say. You can't create from victimhood. The the first entry to creativity is giving up victimization. up victimization. up victimization. Mhm. And you're not free if you're a victim. victim. victim. You're never free. The other person is bigger than you. They have the power over you over you over you or the or just the interpretation of the moment or whatever happened that you felt abandoned or abused or neglected or whatever it might be.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's and those feelings are valid. Of course. Of course. Of course. Okay. So that's where we you have to you have to hold the complexity where you sit with yourself and how long you stay in victimhood. You know it's like when you've been traumatiz it comes up and and you have to just turn towards yourself and you say, "Yeah, that hurt. Yeah, that was really crappy." And if I want to have a positive possible future, I can't stand that. that. that. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Right. It's like, yes, that happened. Well, the context is so the the context of a positive possible future will give you a way to hold your challenges now in a way that's noble that that makes them bearable. bearable. bearable. Because you know, the whole thing about a positive possible future also, you want to have a meaningful why in your positive possible future. If you're just in it for yourself, it's okay. But but if if you see that you're modeling for your kids or you care about the next generation on the planet, service to others is everything.

So then you're going to go farther, you know, in inside of your resolve. Okay. Well, I'm going to see this. This is what we're all learning now. How to be stronger, how to be wiser. This is my teacher of love. You know, some of us have very dark gurus in our lives. People who really betrayed us, really hurt us. And you know, on some level, you think about, okay, what? They woke me up. I will never give my power away to another narcissist. That won't happen again.

Painful though, you know. Yeah. Life life lessons, man. So, we got to name your source fracture story. Would that be like me naming the time I was sexually abused and be like, "Okay, this "Okay, this "Okay, this what the I am." So, you're not going back into the trauma. It's looking for the identity you formed. One of those 22. Yeah. I'm not loved. Yeah. I'm not love. I'm not enough. I'm not lovable. Other I'm not lovable. Other people don't love me. And uh life is pretty barren when you're not loved.

I mean, it's just kind of you can't really expect much out of life. That's true. That's true. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, it's naming your source for action story and then waiting and then mentoring that part. Okay. Having a relationship with yourself. yourself. yourself. Step three then is then from the wise self, you you actually tell the truth because what we distinguish, you've got to distinguish trauma from truth. And you were talking about when it happens, it feels true. So the first thing you say to yourself is, "Sweetheart, that's not true.

That's trauma. trauma. trauma. I'm so sorry you were wounded like that." that." that." Well, yeah. Well, yeah. Well, yeah. But that's not true about you. How do you believe something is not true about you when it feels so true? Well, you have to really kind of, you know, look for the evidence of it. There there are parts of us that know that the story isn't true. And it can be, you know, look, psychedelics are all about this, right? Trying to wake people up out of the trance of the identity.

And they and it can be big and lofty and it can certainly be, you know, you can go off into spirituality. We're all children of God or whatever, but it has to be related to the actual story that was created by that younger part of the self. You can't just split off and just have a new identity over here. This part of you needs rescuing. Truthfully, there was no adult there, Louis, who was able to sit to you with you within 24 hours and say, "Honey, I'm so sorry that happened.

You are so loved. You are safe now. We've got you. You're okay." Even with that, you might still be traumatized and still need to be reminded over and over and have a healing journey. healing journey. healing journey. Right. So, feeling safe. Yeah. Absolutely. And what happens is when we get triggered, get triggered, get triggered, our own adult goes out the window. Mhm. Yeah. Mhm. Yeah. Mhm. Yeah. And there's still no adult presence to wake us up. So it's almost like you got to be your own fairy god parent and come down.

You Glenda the witch or whoever the warlock, you know, you got to come down with love and you got to find Now I'll tell you another story that showed me how easy this could be actually. So I was sitting in my 20s and I had I was a wannabe actor in New York, you know, and obviously nothing really worked for my life. So I had a lot of rejection, a lot of failure and I was waiting tables and I had this great group of people I was waiting tables with and a couple of them are still my friends today.

And uh one of them was named Billy and I had a really bad audition that day and I'm sitting there complaining and crying and you know crying over my wine. It was after the shift was over. girl drinking wine and I'm crying and no nothing's ever going to happen for my life. I'm never going to make anything of my life. It's it's over. You know, I was crappy again today. And Billy reaches across the table. He takes my hand and he says, "I'm so glad you're facing it now, Catherine." And I grabbed my hand away.

I said, "How dare you say that to me?" He said, "Thank you." What was the part of me that was like, "How dare you say that to me?" That was the wiser self. I was the part that just knew this is a story I'm in right now. So all of us know there is a part of all of us that do we know that that's not true. We're just so captivated by the emotions because the false centers have an emotion to them. Of course. Of course.

Of course. So we have to train ourselves to step outside to witness to mentor to find the part of us that actually knows a different story different story different story and to begin to work with that self. And that's where we come up with power statements. Power statements deconstruct. deconstruct. deconstruct. What's an example of a power statement? I am alone. I didn't come here to be alone. I was born to love and be loved. I have the power to grow my relationships healthy, strong, vibrant, and longasting.

Right. There's an assertion. There's a ferocity to it. It breaks up the I'm alone. It wakes you up out of the trance. Yeah. So, you almost have to coach yourself in that. and using those statements. statements. statements. Yes, Yes, Yes, that's good. that's good. that's good. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, because you talk about the next step is seeing yourself as source. What does that actually mean when you've been a victim or had bad breaks most of your life? life? life? This is one of the most important things that we can ever do is to see yourself as source.

Very few of us are trained in how to do it. Most of us when we go to say, well, how you know what's my part? That 3% will drop into shame. See, I'm just too stupid. I have bad karma. I too I'm too screwed up from my parent for my for my parents screwed me up too badly. You know, I'm just I'm just not good enough. We'll go back into the source fracture story. So, one of the things you have to learn is how to objectively notice your own choices and behaviors without dropping into shame.

The other thing that we will do is we will then if how am I the source of this? will go back into our psychology. Well, my sister always, you know, competed with me and so blah blah blah blah blah and that's why I am the way that I am. No power in that story. Interesting story, you know, good to know. know. know. Right. Right. There's no power for a greater future. greater future. greater future. No power to generate a greater future. So, what we're looking for is what's your access to power.

So, this skill of being able to really own your choices. So an example from my life when I was uh looking at my patterns in love right but as I was first writing calling in the one you know 20 years ago and I saw you know my pattern was unavailability and married men so from a psychological perspective you know one married guy after another it was really horrible I was horrible so to even do that but but that's what I was doing and from a psychological perspective it's just kind of like you know ABC Because my father left when I was young, married a woman who didn't want anything to do with me.

It wasn't allowed in their home. Condition of their marriage that I wasn't part of their family. So, he used to sneak out and see me. So, I'm the other woman by the age of eight. Oh my gosh. So, you kind of get it. I mean, it's very dramatic. very dramatic. very dramatic. Oh my gosh. So, you know, you were the other mistress you were the other mistress by the age of eight. Wow. You know, not a big mystery why I'm dating married men. Okay. because I'm finally getting my dad to choose differently which never actually worked.

But um so that was one way of seeing it which gave me no access to power. The other way of seeing it when I looked for myself how am I the source of this is that I realized that inside of this deep I am alone story. I had a corresponding belief that no one will ever really be there for me. M so when I would date people from that perspective, perspective, perspective, it didn't occur to me that I needed a man who would actually be able to show up for me.

Yeah. Emotionally available and yeah, yeah, yeah, not in a relationship already. I'm looking at chemistry, how cool is he, he, he, you know, like what car is he driving? I don't know what I was looking but it wasn't that. I wasn't looking at his character. character. character. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You none of the things that actually matter. So in owning that and seeing that clearly like wow I wasn't looking at the right things. There's no shame in that and actually it was off my radar. Mhm.

Mhm. Mhm. Right. So there's no shame in it but that's that was key to recreating my criteria for the man that I was looking for. for. for. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. and and and and then I was able to find a man and get married and have a great relationship and you know so that changed my life was seeing how I was the source of it because once you identify the old way of relating how you were generating that story you can just flip it to what's the new way of being okay here's my new list this is what I'm looking for I mean it's I know it's it sounds easy to say okay once you're aware of the old way of being that you've been for so We can flip it into the new way of being, but we've lived an identity of that old way for 20, 30, 40, 50, whatever, how many years of that way of being.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How do you grieve and kill off an old identity essentially? Maybe you're not killing off, but it's like you're shifting an entire lifetime of being and all of a sudden saying, "I'm just going to be different today and I'm going to think different and I'm never going to go back to this old past and it's all going to be easy." Like it's hard sometimes for people to transform into a brand new person, a new identity they've never stepped into consistently and letting go of a of a of a familiar comfort zone.

Even though they might have been living in pain and suffering, it's familiar pain and suffering of an identity, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And even if you step into a more powerful identity, powerful identity, powerful identity, people just don't know how to do it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It it's unfamiliar even if it's better. Absolutely right. That's exactly where even if it's better, it's unfamiliar, right? So that's now you're in step six and seven. and seven. and seven. Okay. Well, so we're at step five for five is new ways of of relating.

Identify new ways of relating, which you will not know how to do. You don't know how to do. You're like, I've never done this before. I don't know how to have boundaries. No. I don't know how to have courage courageous conversations. I don't know how to say I don't know how to have faith in the goodness of life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how to trust people. Yeah. Whatever. you you do not know how. So, it's it's it's really important that we take the how-to out of it.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. And just say, well, that's the new way of being because step six is to embrace a growth mindset. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. You're and that's what I was talking about before about when you have a positive possible future, it will initiate growth in the direction of that dream. dream. dream. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You are not yet the person you will need to be to manifest and sustain that future. If you think back to when you first saw the vision of what you have today, Lewis, today, Lewis, today, Lewis, yeah, yeah, yeah, you were not the man that you needed to be be be for that future to happen.

No, but it the future excited me though and I was like I was hungry to learn and grow and develop develop develop and you know it's in two weeks it'll be of recording this it'll be 13 years since I launched the show and I remember before launching the show like a year before and I was kind of in this transition phase and I was like I'm you know I've done a lot of things I've made money I've gotten out of like being broke I've like figured this out but I'm still not fulfilled.

I didn't have like this big future beyond future beyond future beyond just not be broke and make more money, right? That was like it was like get off my sister's couch, make money. But then once I got there, I was like, I'm not fulfilled and my relationships are falling apart. Like there's something missing. And I just kept thinking about, God, all I want to do is just sit in front of really inspiring people, learn how to be better myself, and then share that with others. And that has been every single week for 13 years showing up and doing that doing it not perfect all the time and you know go back to my old self at times all these different things but it's like I'm constantly showing up but I remember having that vision of like this is what I want to do and I just want to inspire people through interviewing and and learning as well and sharing my story of what I'm learning learning learning and it's just I'm constantly doing that 13 years still doing it you're learning all the time.

100%. 100%. 100%. Yeah. So, when you have the courage to set a bold future that's outside of who you currently know yourself to be, you can expect a jolt in the direction of growth. of growth. of growth. Yes. Yes. Yes. Which which by the way doesn't isn't always pleasant. You know, usually the first act of creation is destruction. So things start falling apart because you've got to get rid of the structures that have been locking your old identity or relationships that have been Yeah. relationship end or start things start blowing up, you get fired from your job, like all sorts of shenanigans happen.

Like that future is not kidding. That future wants you, right? But but it is to recognize. But if you know that boundaries are the key, to your new life, there's a lot of books on boundaries. There's a lot of weekend workshops on boundaries. I would rather somebody put their efforts in personal development, personal growth, transformation, and healing into that development rather than go back for the 18th time and talk about what your father did when you were four. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's that's where the real gold is.

So, we have to recognize that this is a developmental journey. When you got stuck in trauma, there were skills and capacities that were missing. when you were alone in life because you were a latch key kid or you were neglected uh you know you were left alone for hours at a time you didn't learn how to be vulnerable you didn't learn how to engage conflict in a successful way uh you didn't learn uh how to uh reciprocity or mutuality in relationships you only learn self-sufficiency self-sufficiency self-sufficiency or how to receive and rel you know it's the the the how to receive it's like all the things if you don't feel worthy how are you going to feel like you can receive receive something.

That's right. That's right. That's right. You know, you're going to say, "No, thank you, but no." Whether it's a gift or someone buying you lunch or love. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh you're going to always kind of be emotionally, psych, psychologically or physically rejecting physically rejecting physically rejecting love if you don't believe you're worthy of receiving it, right, in some way or feeling guilty by receiving it or there is a part of the person who's worthy. That's a very hard one to overcome. And you're you're basically living as a servant to others when you don't have an I'm not worthy.

you know, you're you're showing up kind of subservient there. subservient there. subservient there. That well, that's one of the ways of being that that could generate. Um, but if you there is a part of you that that knows it's a wound and not your destiny and not your truth. So that's what we're looking for. It's a you know and some the book is very it takes people very very step by step. So you know you know you know yeah and the growth mindset is the embracing the growth mindset is step six.

of seven is making those new choices and taking new actions. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which is, Which is, Which is, correct me if I'm wrong, how we integrate integrate integrate the new identity. It's like by making new choices, taking new actions. You're stepping into something you've never done. You 10, 20, 30, 40 years of an old identity. Now you're doing new actions, new choices. And it takes time to kind of integrate saying, "I'm safe in this new identity." Is that correct? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's actually where the rubber meets the road.

Yeah. It And here's the thing. Things can change so quickly once you understand how you're this you're you're creating evidence for the old story and you make a different choice. And it can be very very subtle. A lot of these things are very subtle. Yes. Um when I was uh when I divorced my husband, which was the foundation of conscious uncoupling, um I found myself back out on the dating pool, right? Which was kind of weird cuz now I'd written calling in the one. And I had some weird experiences there.

People say, "Well, I'm not the next one or whatever." You know, it was it was an awkward situation for sure. But I remember one of the things that happened is that I started automatically recreating the old pattern of unavailability. unavailability. unavailability. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. Like that pattern is just sitting there, you know, ready. Yeah. You came out. Yeah. Like you actually have to generate your life. Yes. life. Yes. life. Yes. You have to create a different future. If you don't create something consciously, your past will determine your future.

That's just what's so that's true. that's true. that's true. So, so I I noticed that that was happening. And so I went in and I did some work on it. One of my false centers, my source structure stories. And by the way, there's not only just one for every area. Sometimes they, you know, they're kind of intertwined. intertwined. intertwined. They're intertwined a little bit. You work with the one that has the most energy in that moment. Okay. So the mo one had the most energy in that moment for me was I'm not wanted.

And one of the ways of being in the I'm not wanted is overgiving your energy. Sure. you're kind of anticipating people are going to reject you. So you got to be kind of a saleserson, right? You got to be like in their face a little bit and tap dancing and you know don't don't reject me, you know. So but but what happens is of course it makes people back up again needy clingy energy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then people back up and see they don't want me.

Yeah. Exactly. That's it. That's it. So I realized that sometimes with men if I liked them liked them liked them that I would come on too strong. But that was like a nervous thing that I did. So um with my beautiful partner Michael now on our very first date, I knew this about myself. So the new way of being was to hold my energy in to just just bring my energy in. To kind of hold myself, be more self-contained. self-contained. self-contained. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that when I walked in the room, I was self-contained.

I wasn't overgiving my energy. You were like a golden retriever like ah love meh you know you know you know which gave him a chance to get to know me me me of course of course of course and he actually fell in love with me that night so you know it doesn't have to be it can be very quick how life changes changes changes it can be you know so it it a lot of it is all based on your way of being absolutely and being self-aware and self-responsible self-responsible self-responsible what would you say then is the difference between healing yourself and transforming yourself transforming yourself transforming yourself well healing I say is the domain of the past but transformation is the domain of the future.

Mhm. So healing again is about regulating yourself, facing the truth, understanding what happened, you know, recognizing that you are not that, learning to regulate yourself, all of these beautiful things. And so, you know, there's a piece of healing you just have to be witnessed and held with love. But there are parts of us that will always be healing. Of course, it's a journey. it will, you know, every know, every know, every New Year's Eve I might feel sad because someone died on that day. And so I it so a lot of it's about just some some of these pieces of ourselves.

We just need to learn how to hold them when they come up with love. We don't have to get to the bottom of them before we can have what it is that we want. And that's the message that I'm really excited to be delivering to people. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So there's healing which is the domain of the past, transformation which is the domain of the future. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it sounds like identity is the domain of like the present almost where it's like our way of being is our identity or our belief is our identity.

That's the true you. Oh yeah. That's the true you. Because the true you is in the now. Okay. Okay. Okay. Who am I really? Is it true that I'm not good enough? Oh, I was going to tell you. Do we have time for one more story? Yeah. Okay. Okay. So, I was going to tell you the story about the um the uh so here I am with these big ideas. I've got all these big ideas and I don't feel good enough to be the one to deliver them.

I'm not brine, you know. I'm not I'm not at that level, right? right? right? You know, so so who am I to bring this forward? And I'm struggling and I'm struggling, but they so want to be born that I'm struggling with with the uh book proposal. I think I struggled for like three years in that trying to write this book proposal. I got frustrated and I finally just sent it to my agent like my you know okay this is what I have you know and she read it and she said I don't get it right mirroring mirroring I'm not good enough she rejected it.

Wow. Wow. Wow. And uh I was crushed. I was heartbroken. Um but this is what I realized out of it. Oh, here I am writing this book about waking up from the trance of your source fracture story to be able to create the life that you came here to live. I'm writing it from the source fracture story. fracture story. fracture story. You can't create the future from the self of the past. You actually have to go into the future and begin to source yourself from there.

So, I asked myself, what's really true about this idea you're not good enough? Well, you know, all of us are imperfect and all of us are doing the best that we can and life seems to have given this teaching to me. So, I guess if life thinks I'm good enough, it's just mine to do. Yeah. Like, I don't need to get into that business about who I don't need to compete with anybody. I'm just me, right? So, I woke myself up from the trance. trance. trance.

Few months later, I called my agent because she's my friend and I needed advice and I believe that people can say no to you and they you can still love them. They get to have boundaries. right? right? right? They can have their perspective and their feedback and they can disappoint you and you don't withhold your love. So, but but I called her cuz she's smart and I wanted her opinion. By the end of that conversation, she said, "I need to revisit this book." That was cuz who I was being was different.

was different. was different. Was different. Was different. Was different. Different energy. Different energy. Different energy. It whole different energy. She got the book. She ended up shaping the book. She got me an amazing book deal. The book is integral to her. So, that's what I mean. like we're sourcing ourselves and our lives from the identity we're centered in. But the true you true you true you is actually a flexible you. If I say, "Okay, I'm not a perfect person and I'm open to learning and growing and becoming who I'd need to be to create that book.

Now I'm a fluid self." The old false centers are a fixed identity. They never change. There's no fluidity and they're shame based. So if you collapse into a shame based identity, you'll stop growing from the true you, you're open to feedback. You can learn. Setbacks don't crush you. They disappoint you, but they don't crush you. You keep going. You grow from the experience, and you can stay on track. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. To actualize the future you're committed to. M to. M to. M I mean you mentioned kind of how you had this I guess lack of self-belief or maybe I don't know if it's a insecurity I felt insec inferior imposttor syndrome is what I was thinking of thinking of thinking of imposttor syndrome imposttor syndrome imposttor syndrome so you're saying ah I'm not bay or I'm not this or I haven't done this yet like I'm sure there's a lot of people listening or watching that have this kind of imposttor syndrome how do we overcome that when we're trying to create a bigger powerful future that we've never done before before before well I think the impostor syndrome is reflective of where am I centered at the level of identity.

So you look at what it is that you're committed to creating and then you I mean the actual practice is to to um to first connect with the part of you that can be a witness to your own experience, you know, that has some wisdom. You're not going to collapse into getting blended with that younger part of you. And then you think about the pattern. What usually happens in this area, right? So I want to be, you know, I want to be a successful actor. What usually happens is I get rejected at every thing I do and you know then I get bad reviews when I get cast.

That's that's the pattern, right? So then you you say well how does it feel in my body when that pattern happens? You just imagine the patterns happening now when I get rejected or something or yeah when I get rejected how do I feel in my body where do I feel it and then you say what's the I am in the center of that feeling that feeling that feeling right? Right. And I'm not smart enough. If I'm not lovable, I'm not whatever it is. Yeah. Yeah. That's how you find the source fracture story in that particular area.

Uhhuh. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. And then you identify Well, I guess then you wake up to the true you, see yourself as source, identify new ways of relating, etc., etc. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And go through the process. Yes. Yes. Yes. But I mean, you you say that transformation lives in the future, and I know I've heard Dr. Dr. Jod Spencer say to remember the future and I like to ask questions on here like if your 10ear self in the future was giving you advice now what would that wiser version of you be saying to yourself right now when you feel stuck so how do people in this process process process when they're feeling stuck what is the process you really like to tap into that I guess wiser future self to overcome the imposttor syndrome to overcome the I'm not enoughness to overcome all these feelings so that you can actually feel good again as opposed to feeling bad.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think what you're talking about is how do I shift centers when I'm really captivated emotionally by the story of the past. Yeah. The the wound itself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The wound itself. And it does feel very it it is very pervasive. And uh that's sometimes why it's very hard to language. Yes. Um I think one of the ways that I have found helpful is to name it accurately to really name it and to give it the age because once you give it that age age age um you know if you can't get outside of it then what I sometimes do with people is I have them imagine then like a four-year-old sitting in front of them who just had a trauma and has collapsed into this meaning and they are coming as you know the Right.

And what might they say about this conclusion? We're talking about the conclusions we came to that limit our lives. Yes. Yes. Yes. Right. So, what might they say? And usually people have enough compassion if they can externalize that younger self to be able to speak to that younger self in a way that brings some light and some hope. But you're right. Before you talked about many of us are kind of rusty in that area. We're not used to that dialogue. But it is one of the most important things that we'll ever learn how to do.

It is the the thing that actually allows us to really transform beyond the pain of the past. the past. the past. I mean they talk about this in the sports world is like this self-t talk. Something that I learned all the time when I had in insecurity or fear before games. It was like a self-t talk or before a big moment if I'm shooting a free throw when the the game was on the line. And it was like what I how I spoke to myself would typically determine the results.

results. results. Wow. Wow. Wow. You know, it would influence the results. If I'm like, I'm going to be a fool. I'm I'm going to don't mess up. It's like if I'm thinking about the negative, I'm probably going to react from pain or a wound or a fear rather than seeing a bigger possible future of you've got this or stay present or be in the moment or you can do anything. Like that's right. that's right. that's right. Speaking into a bigger future. Yeah. And it's a practice.

It really and it could be a momentby-moment thing that we need to be doing to remind ourselves these mantras, this self-t talk and finding tools that we can master to overcome whatever life is throwing at our way. our way. our way. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and you know, speaking of tools to master, you've been doing this for for many decades, right? And you've mastered certain levels certain levels certain levels and gone higher and higher or deeper deeper in mastery beyond being a therapist, right? and learning about transformation and and bigger ways to transform and heal at the same time.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And when you were telling me beforehand, but before when you when you sold the book deal, you also got the call that you had cancer around the same time or that same week, two days later. Two days later. And so when when you feel like you've mastered these tools, right, for so long and you've overcome all these challenges and created a beautiful new relationship and you have this wisdom to share with the world, but then you get some news like this with a new challenge or potential obstacle in your way.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How did you not fall back into old patterns of wounds or whatever that could have shown up? And how did you stay stay stay focused on the future and not living in the past or fear? Unfortunately, you're right. I did have decades of experience of this way of being. So, it's actually organic to me now to know live from the truth of who I am. And when I collapse into an a story, which I do because that's human. Yes. Yes. Yes. It's very important people know that this doesn't really go away.

You have to learn how to work with it. Um, I don't tend to stay there for very long, thank goodness. Um, yeah, that was a really wild ride, right? On a Wednesday, you get this major book deal. Six houses were bidding on it. We went with the one we loved. We're so happy with Penguin Life. Two days later, cancer. cancer. cancer. So, and the book was due the exact same time that the cancer treatment was scheduled to be over. So I wrote the book when I was in cancer treatment.

But I the truth is is that that helped a great deal. Like it because it was so joyful to write this book. It was so uplifting and to finally be at a place I mean it's taken really decades to to to put this all together. Right. So this is out of all the work I've done calling in the unconscious uncoupling. This is my true purpose. Yes. for being born and it actually is the teachings underlying both of the other books and why they work but it lifted me every day.

So I just you know you just decide who am I going to be in the face of this and the context of the future that I was living into which is really the big future I'm living into is that this book recontextualizes how we engage our personal development work. You know, I've I've I've pioneered two other things into the world that I'm very proud of. Calling in the one, even though everybody's now aware of law of attraction and your beliefs and your manifesting love. manifesting love.

manifesting love. It was actually the first conversation in 2004. in 2004. in 2004. Nobody else was I almost didn't get a book deal because the the editors would come back and say, "Well, she's saying something nobody else is saying." And I remember saying to my agent at the time, I think that's a good thing. But I mean, I don't want to brag, but this is the reality of like who I get to be is that I pioneer new things into the world, which I feel, you know, so grateful, grateful, grateful for.

And then conscious uncoupling kind of, you know, broke the glass ceiling on how we do divorce. And now there's a lot of different books on it and teachings and but it so there's a there's a way that I'm given that privilege. And so I see this book as the privilege that it is. So that future of repositioning how we all engage personal development work to turbocharge our capacity to outgrow the imprinting of our past and create the lives that we want to be living and and and ultimately Lewis the world that we want to be living in.

This is what we need to learn how to do for ourselves so we can bring it into the world. um that future just carried me and is carrying me today. Like I'm still in treatment, right? So it got better and you know all this all the tumors went away and they shrunk and now some of them are back and you know so you're on a journey when you're dancing with atypical cells atypical cells atypical cells but you see like truthfully I'm I'm just you know this is life and we all go through hardships.

So when you have a context of the future that you're living into, it repositions the challenges that we're in we're in we're in and you can live your life not from where you are trying to get to that future but from that future which then informs who do I need to be today. today. today. Yes. Yes. Yes. Right. So, it has really only truthfully increased my strength and increased my capacity to stand in that positive possible future. I vision every day a future where my body is healthy.

I thank God every day for healing my body. And at the same time, I'm aware that we're all only here for a minute. And we better as well, you know, we might as well do what God put us on this earth to do or what we feel in our souls were put here for and get busy living into that future because time is finite on this level. And so I accept that I'm 68 and um you know, we're lucky to be living this long really because 100 years ago people were out by 40.

So, you know, I'm grateful for my life every day and I'm really committed to uh the privilege of being able to birth these ideas into the world. Wow. That's beautiful. Beautiful wisdom. If you could um I'm I'm going to turn 43 soon. I never really celebrated my birthday, but that's my my birthday's coming up in the next couple months. 43 and I just had twins, which you're aware of and my audience is aware of. Twin girls. If you could give me one piece of advice advice advice on how to best approach fatherhood for two girls.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In the world that they're entering in right now and the life that we have right now and what's happening in the world and the culture and everything. You know, I'm sure everyone's got a piece of advice on how to be a conscious parent, but if you could just give one piece of advice to myself or any new parent on how you would approach fatherhood or motherhood a such a such a such at this season, what would you say with your infinite wisdom? Such a sweet, sweet question.

I mean, the first thing that comes to me, I know you're already doing which is to sponsor their potential greatness. Oh, 100%. Oh, 100%. Oh, 100%. 100%. 100%. 100%. Speaking into it. Yeah. All Yeah. creating it with your brain, brain, brain, speaking into that. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, but the other thing that and and once once this book is out, we're we're going to be looking at doing a parenting book. Uh, children do are a little meaning making machines and making meaning out of everything. You know, you could probably have the best of intentions and they could interpret it in in in maybe not the best of ways sometimes, right?

It's like maybe, who knows? So, it's to pay attention to the meaning that they're making at the level of identity. I saw this with my daughter when she was 6 years old. My daughter has autism and she was having a hard time socially connecting and uh there was something that happened at school with the kids and they kind of, you know, weren't nice to her or something and she immediately I could just see the collapse in her the shrinking. It's not like they come to you and say, "I have a belief now that I energy shifts." The energy shifts.

They come back and they're like just quieter, more in their room or whatever. Yeah. They're not as free. Yeah. They're not as She wasn't as free. She wasn't as happy. And I caught it and I was able to sit with her and intercept it and I was able to language it. I think what you're making it mean is that honey, what it really means is this. and who you are is this. this. this. And I did see a shift back when I was able to catch that and do that for her.

So, I think there's a lot to be explored there because I hadn't done a lot of research yet in that area. But that's what I would, you know, encourage you to do. Yeah. It's probably catching the when they make a weird face or their energy shifts, it's like catching it and communicating with love on, you know, what they're trying to make meaning of, I guess, and trying to shift it. Well, you know, children don't have the cognitive capacity to hold complexity till they're about seven. So, they they they that's why if you look at I thought Santa Claus was real, you know, it's like until a certain age, you're like, "Oh, that's not real." You know, it's like you can't see the complexities of life.

Everything is very black and white. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. Everything's black and white. So, so, you know, you you have to be careful with h you know, with with what how they're interpreting their experience. So to just be the be the be the pay attention to Yeah. pay attention and be the one who helps them to this is powerful. I want everyone to go get this book uh what's true about you. Seven steps to move beyond your painful past and manifest your brightest future. If you feel stuck or if you feel like you haven't been fully living your truest gifts or you have something you want to bring into the world, but for whatever reason it's not manifesting yet, make sure you go through this book because when you break free from your past and you embrace the true you, you unleash your brightest future.

And that's what everyone deserves to be living if they're willing to do the work. Um, they can get the book anywhere. Again, what's true about you? Get it for a friend. They can check you out on your website, katherinewoodwardthomas.com. katherinewoodwardthomas.com. katherinewoodwardthomas.com. The same thing on social media. And uh I hope everyone gets this book and shares this interview with a friend as a starting point as well. I've got a couple final questions for you. Okay. Okay. Okay. I think I might have asked this to you 11 years ago when you were on the show.

Oh my goodness. But I'm not sure if I started asking these questions back then, so I'd have to actually go back and reflect and see if that was the case. But I I started at some point asking people a question at the very end of the episodes called the three truths. And maybe I did this with you. I think you did. Maybe I did. So I can't remember if I did it in the first six. You did. You did. I have no idea what I said.

said. said. All right. So we'll see where you're at now, 11 years later. And we'll reflect back on what you said then. So imagine you get to live as long as you want in this life. Amen. Amen. Amen. And you get to create everything you want from the most powerful future version of you. Wow. Wow. Wow. And it all comes to life. Um, but at the end of the day, when you pass away, many years away, okay, okay, okay, you have to take all of your work with you.

All of your messages, all of your books, all your conversations, they're gone. gone. gone. Hypothetical scenario, Hypothetical scenario, Hypothetical scenario, okay? okay? okay? But you get to leave a final message with the world, your final three lessons. I call it the three truths. What would those three truths that you would leave behind be? You are the creator of your life. The purpose of life is to create heaven on earth. And the essence of who you are is love. Yeah. Yes, it is. Before I ask the final question, Katherine, I want to acknowledge you for your constant journey of transformation for your personal life and for bringing your message to so many people one-on-one group settings and and even more so with your content and your books and your your programs that you have online as well.

You know, the fact that you live a life of service to help people heal and transform into their greatest self. I don't know a better way to live. So, I want to acknowledge you for the constant journey even through the challenges you keep facing. And it's a beautiful thing to witness how you approach life um with everything you've been through and everything you're going through right now. So I want to acknowledge you for for for the love you bring to so many people. It's really beautiful.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Of course. My final question is what is your definition of greatness? Um it's to live in the most expansive calling on your life for who you came here to be for the world. and the gifts that you the golden gifts that only you can deliver in just the way that you can. We're all needing to do that now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, as the world escalates and tensions and conflict and negativity, and negativity, and negativity, it's pushing on all of us to step into that yes to greatness, that call to greatness.

greatness. greatness. So, I'm glad we're all in it together. Amen. Catherine, thanks for being here. Appreciate it, too. Thank you. Thank you. We're all just a puzzle piece and these little humans existence and I'm here to love her and serve her. Sometimes that pleases her and sometimes that doesn't. Even with our daughter, it's been striking to me how much everywhere she goes, it's always the external. And so I really look to anchor in that she has such a beautiful