Stop Trying to Eliminate Self-Doubt — Do This Instead | Chloe Kim

Key Takeaway

True grit isn't about never doubting yourself—it's about showing up anyway. Olympic champion Chloe Kim competed with just eight days on snow after a shoulder injury, proving that perseverance through uncertainty and believing in your muscle memory can carry you through impossible situations. When self-doubt creeps in, remind yourself: you can't eliminate the noise completely, but you can choose to rely on the preparation you've already done.

Episode Overview

Olympic snowboarding champion Chloe Kim shares her journey from childhood athlete to three-time Olympic medalist, discussing how she navigates pressure, self-doubt, and injury while maintaining mental resilience. She reveals how her recent ADHD diagnosis helped explain her hyperfocus on snowboarding, her struggles with identity beyond sports, and the true grit required to compete at the highest level with severe limitations.

Full Transcript

Transcript of Stop Trying to Eliminate Self-Doubt — Do This Instead | Chloe Kim from The School of Greatness. Auto-generated from episode audio; may contain minor errors.

I did not give up when I could have. People were telling me that maybe it wasn't a good idea to do this. I was not going to let up. Like I wanted to believe in myself and show myself that I could deal with this. I don't know if you can ever truly eliminate self-doubt, I think you can maybe quiet the noise a bit. But the minute something doesn't go your way, that self-doubt's going to come right back. At just 17 years old, she became the youngest woman to win Olympic gold in snowboarding, establishing herself as one of the most dominant athletes in her sport.

We have the inspiring Chloe Kim in the house. My dad later on told me that if I didn't make it by the time I was 13, we wouldn't be able to afford it anymore. The most pressure I felt from them was actually as we got closer to my first Olympics. I had to have a sit down with my parents. Like, guys, this doesn't feel good. feel good. feel good. Really, Really, Really, this feels really intense. I am so grateful that I got to go through some really intense moments at such a young age because now I feel like I can get through whatever and accomplish whatever I put my mind to.

And what was the greatest lesson you learned from that experience? I think grit, like true grit. Before I had you on here today, we had another snowboarder on. I don't know if you know Amy Pertie. Love Amy. and she was just singing your praises, saying how much she loves you. I love her to death. And I was like, Amy, if you could ask her one question, you know, about about Chloe, what would it be? And she goes, how does she perform under pressure and just look so free?

And that was one of the things she was asking about, like, how does she look so free at the highest stages in the world? And I'm curious, how do you perform under pressure and make it look so effortless? I just made a face when you said that because I feel like I feel the same way about her. about her. about her. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. So, I feel like the call is coming from within Amy. Um, no, Amy's amazing. She's such an inspiration. She has such an incredible story and everything she's done for her sport.

It's been like so cool and she's so cool, so gorgeous and smart. Like, yeah, it's kind of not fair. Yeah, she's everything to me. Um, I would say for me personally, I don't know. I don't think I think about it too much. I think pressure. pressure. pressure. Yeah. I mean, obviously I do feel pressure, but I think I need a moment to just sit with myself and recognize that the pressure is actually I feel like outside voices, people with expectations and people who want things for me, which is such a blessing in disguise sometimes, but I see it as a blessing.

blessing. blessing. Um, I really appreciate that people believe that I could accomplish all these things. So I think I had to make that mental shift at a pretty young age really really really and kind of recognize that, you know, there's a lot of voices out there, but at the end of the day, it's because, you know, they believe I can do it. So I feel like I have cheerleaders instead of, you know, all these like scary expectations. I think I kind of when I started to make that shift, things felt a lot easier and smoother for me.

Do you feel like when you compete, you're not thinking about the pressure then, or is it more about just wanting to have fun? It's a little bit of both. I love competing. I'm a very competitive person, even outside of my sport, you know, video games, any like PE was my favorite day at school growing up. And I just loved competing. I loved playing games, like all of it. So, it's very rewarding for me when I get to compete in something that I'm really good at. And yeah, but I also do want to have fun.

I try to have fun. Um, you know, transparently, I never like wanted a snowboard. That was the sport of my choice. choice. choice. What was this the choice you wanted? Oh my gosh. Well, I wanted to a lot. I wanted to be a jockey. A jockey. A jockey. A jockey. I love horses. Okay. And I loved just anything horse related. And in my mind, it was like horse racing. Really? This is when I was like three, four. Cuz you grew up in SoCal, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I I don't know. I was just always obsessed with horses. My favorite movie growing up was Spirit. Okay. I don't know if you know your kid, maybe your girls are like be obsessed with it one day, but yeah, I really wanted to be a jockey. I really loved figure skating. Um, but my dad was the one that, you know, kind of wanted me to get into a sport. And so when I told him figure skating, he was like, "Well, what about speed skating or hockey?" And I was like, "No, like I'm not going to do that." So we started snowboarding, right?

Snowboarding was what he, you know, thought. But you were grew up in was it Torrance you grew up in or like you grew up socal area or I grew up all over? We moved a bunch. Um so I've lived in Cypress, La Palma, Torrance, Torrance, Torrance, La Habra. La Habra. La Habra. Okay. Okay. Okay. And then I moved to LA. I lived in Newport for a year and then I moved to LA. LA. LA. But you started was it more in Mammoth where you started really snowboarding then?

So you'd go up there and Yeah. Well, I actually learned in Mountain High and I always want to give credit to Mountain High. I love it there. good mems, good mems, bad mems, crazy mems, all the mems. All of it. That's where it started. And then as I started getting better and getting, you know, more serious, we started going to Mammoth. Mammoth. Mammoth. Yeah, that's cool. I mean, your dad, you mentioned your dad, and he he he really started to invest in you early on then, right, with snowboarding, didn't he leave his career to kind of like go all in with you?

Yeah. So when you when you have a parent who's that much of a cheerleader and supporting you supporting you supporting you how did you not also feel the pressure then of like oh this needs to work out like I need to actually be good and succeed because he's invested his life in this as well. Yeah, I think that is definitely something that I thought about a lot and my dad later on told me that if I didn't make it by the time I was 13, like we wouldn't be able to afford it anymore cuz my parents invested everything into my sport, which is such a risky decision honestly to make, but I didn't know that.

And funny enough, at 13, I started doing really well and started to like, you know, kill it in my sport. But I think the most pressure I felt from them was actually as we got closer to my first Olympics cuz I think that was the dream. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. We finally did it. I qualified for Sochi when I was 13. Wow. Wow. Wow. I don't know if you know this. Um was too young to compete. So you qualified but you couldn't compete. compete. compete. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I qualified in second. Oh my gosh. So I wasn't able to go. So I feel like there was so much anticipation that built from that moment and once I was getting closer like that 201617 season was the scariest season of my life. Just the air every time I walked into the like spaces was just so tense and stressful. Feel like everyone's getting really intense hoping to qualify for the games. Now I'm in contention to qualify for the games. Like my I had to have a sit down with my parents.

It's like guys, this doesn't feel good. feel good. feel good. Really, Really, Really, this feels really intense. Like, I understand that you guys, you know, obviously want this for me and I do too, but I need a sense of normaly cuz everywhere else I go does not feel normal either. So, I just need home to feel like home. Wow. Wow. Wow. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, it's a lot of I mean, you were 16 going in 17, I guess, around that time. So, it's it's almost like, oh, what if I make a mistake or don't qualify or I fall?

then all this this like expectation like crumbles I guess. Yeah. And I want to say too into my first games qualifying was hardcore. Like there Like there Like there I mean there still still are, you know, really good US snowboarding girls, but like back then it was mostly, you know, US podium suites for the most part. Like they were awesome. Um, and so qualifying was really intense cuz it's almost like you had to bring your agame. Like if you qualified for the Olympics in the US, it was almost just felt like you were guaranteed a medal at that point cuz they were so good.

Yes. And so so it wasn't guaranteed. It wasn't like, oh, this is going to be easy, you know? No, I knew I had a good shot cuz I was podiuming consistently, but I've never experienced that type of pressure and like that type of expectation before. And so I remember like going into all my runs for the qualifying events. So a little more about the qualification process or process or process or tell me tell me. Okay. So basically it's the season before the Olympics. There are I might be completely wrong but there's somewhere but I think it's five events four or five events and basically it's the top four girls based on all those events.

So the way the best way to guarantee a spot is to like win a couple of them. Um, top four go. Top four. Top four. If USA, yes, top four go. And based on your results in those events, they'll I think they take like the top three results or something and then they average them out and then that's how they decide who goes. So that was So you kind of have to be awesome for at least three events, right? Over like a six-month window or is that like a year or how long is that?

No, it's like a twomonth window. Oh. Oh man. If you mess up in two months, you're done. Yeah. So, it's like you start the season being like, "Okay, like I might go to the Olympics and it's like boom, it's over." And then people are going to the Olympics. It's so fast. It's back to back. I think the first qualification events in December, like early December, and then the rest of them are low-key in January and then we go, you leave like a couple weeks later, February.

Yeah. So, it's really intense. How did you feel going into this recent Olympics then? Because you were injured. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, how was your feel? you didn't feel good because you'd previously won two gold medals, but then you're going into this next Olympics a little injured, not feeling good like you said. How do you stay confident and also not let the fear of the pressure or what if I fail or what if my injury holds me back or back or back or the expectations of the world now?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How do you navigate that? I mean, it was tough. You know, I think that was definitely a really hard moment. Um, probably one of the more difficult things I've had to navigate in my career. I've had I've been so blessed and fortunate to go into every single games completely healthy. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. Um and luckily I had actually qualified for the games the season prior. So you didn't have that stress. I didn't need to qualify that season which was great. That's great. Yeah.

Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. But you got to be healthy. Exactly. And so, you know, the plan was, okay, I'm not going to compete that much this season. I'm going to just train for the games and then go. And that's what I did going into Beijing as well. But unfortunately, the first training camp I had planned in the winter, that's when it happened, like the second or third day. So, I had no reps going into this. this. this. Wow. Wow. Wow. Came straight back home, rehabbed as much as I could, cuz it wasn't necessarily a pain issue.

It was more that my shoulder kept coming out. And if your shoulder comes out, there's like not much you can do. Yes, you can pop it back in, but it will just keep coming out. out. out. Is this your left shoulder? your right shoulder, my left shoulder. And so it was one of those things where I think I spent a week, maybe 10 days here in LA doing my rehab and then trying to get back on snow as soon as possible to get a little reps in.

Um it's also probably the fear of if I fall and hurt the shoulder, like the damage that that could have too, right? Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. And I don't want to get hurt before I go into the games. Totally. But I had already come up with a plan in my mind that was maybe insane. But I was like, "Well, if it comes out, just put it back in, you know? Let's just pop it back in. It's fine." It wasn't painful. Like, yeah, it hurts, but like also put it back in.

You're an athlete. I live in a world of pain. Like, I am always in pain. So, this let's just add this to the list of things that hurt. Um, but no, I think I was like, "All right, well, we'll just pop it back in. I'll do everything I can. We'll get a brace." But the most annoying thing was just that I had to relearn how to do all my tricks without this arm because you really need to like use the force of it, right? Yeah. And so how did you do that to like hyper extend it almost and that's when it's the most vulnerable.

Like when I'm throwing my tricks, I need all my arms cuz you're really swinging in the air. I'm literally doing the most like flailing, like twisting, all of it. cuz people watching might think, "Oh, it's actually a lot of twisting of like the hips," which I guess it is, but you need the wind up with the the upper body as well, right? Interesting. Yeah. So, it was really hard. So, the very limited days I had on snow, I just had to like try to relearn how to do all my tricks my tricks my tricks with one arm.

With one arm. And it's so disappointing because it's almost annoying. I almost wish that it was this kind of dark, but I had almost wished that it was a more serious injury if that makes sense cuz then it was just clear that like I couldn't do it or like I you know, but this whole gray area was really rough for me to navigate cuz I'm like I feel fine. I I feel like I can do this but my shoulder comes out in the middle of my run.

There's nothing you can do. I have to stop. So that's where it's really frustrating and that's also where it was frustrating because I felt like people wouldn't understand wouldn't understand wouldn't understand what that was like either. Yeah. And I I mean I don't know if did you ever have the fear of like okay I'm going whatever 50t in the air and if I fall on it then also the pain of that you know I might be done I guess if it's already vulnerable. vulnerable. vulnerable. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. For me I'd be afraid of that. I mean I was never one to worry about pain again. Like I have had chronic back pain since I was 15. So it's not a big deal. It was just more inconvenient for me, I think, is the best way to put it. So, how do you navigate that, I guess? How do you visualize before going out for a run at the Olympics when you're uncertain if you can actually complete the run? the run? the run? I think it's hard like mentally there's always this little voice in your head that's like, "All right, well, this could happen." You know, prepare yourself for that.

I did the best that I could. You know, I knew that I was at a severe disadvantage because everyone else has trained, ridden all winter long and I'm coming in. I think the night of the final was my eighth day on snow. Wow. Wow. Wow. Total like in like six months or something, something, something, right? So, it's like I'm not where I could be, but I'm also dealing with this, which is part of the sport. I'm just going to do my best and whatever. That's what I had to get to just like whatever.

So what is the mental rehearsal that you have then either you know the morning of an hour before or right before to eliminate the self-doubt? self-doubt? self-doubt? I think that's interesting and I'm curious to see what our listeners will think. But I don't know if you can ever truly eliminate self-doubt. I think you can talk yourself up to, you know, maybe quiet the noise a bit, but the minute something doesn't go your way that self-doubt's going to come right back. Yeah. back. Yeah. back. Yeah. And so it is hard to truly get rid of it.

And I think that's just normal too. It's like natural, you know, human brains and minds. We're kind of like always fearful of the unknown. And that's where I was at too. So I'm not going to sit here and be like, well, I didn't doubt myself at all. I felt so confident. That's not the case. But I think I kind of have to sit there and remind myself that I have to rely on body muscle memory. Yes, Yes, Yes, muscle memory is going to be my best friend here.

friend here. friend here. And I'm just going to hope for the best. You know, maybe things won't go my way. That's okay. I feel really fortunate to be in a position in my career where I've accomplished everything under the sun and more. And so, I didn't feel like really strongly about, you know, winning, if that makes sense. sense. sense. Really? So, you weren't you weren't really concerned like if I get the gold or if I don't get any medals, you were going to be okay. My goal was to get a medal, right?

And you did it. I did it. Let's go. Let's go. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You did it. I did it, you know, and that was really challenging in itself because there's so much new talent. I've been doing this for over 10 years professionally, professionally, professionally, you know. I'm 26 now. And you've won everything. Pretty. I've won everything multiple times. times. times. X game, world championships, Olympic gold multiple times. Multiple times. And I think I'm really grateful to have had that experience. I've done it all.

There literally isn't a single thing I want. You feel complete. which feels funny, you know, and I kind of got to that place in my early 20s. That's incredible. That's incredible. That's incredible. So, I feel like this last time I this past one, I just wanted to have fun. Just wanted to like enjoy it. You know, obviously this didn't make it as enjoyable as it could have been, but I think I enjoyed every minute of it and there's not a thing I would change. Really? That's beautiful.

So, you don't feel like, you know, you wanted your goal was to get a medal. It didn't matter if it was any metal. any metal. any metal. Yeah. And but you've won multiple golds. Yeah. So, was there anything inside of you that was like, okay, you know, I got a silver, but it wasn't the gold. Was there any part of you that felt like maybe I don't know that was let down in any way? any way? any way? Yeah. I mean, I think that there's always going to be a sentiment of like disappointment, of course.

Like, this is again something that I've trained for for 3 years going into it. So, I'm also not going to sit here and be like, "Oh, well, I'm fine with that." But I think it's important to be kind to yourself in these moments and give yourself that reminder that like I also wasn't coming into this games like I had the two other times you know I can't yeah healthy and fully ready and right and like going into the other games I had like two three months of training under my belt going into the games and I here I go into my third one with eight days period crazy crazy crazy like that it's not fair for me to Yes.

I can dream and yes I can hope but if we're going to be realistic it I do it's going to be very very difficult and I am going to need some sort of miracle here you know you know you know and you gave your best and so your mind you're like you're like you're like best yes and also I want to say the first two days I had training because now we have to count the days the first two days I had I had to learn to not get scared of snowboarding again yeah not like falling and then day three it's like I'm throwing myself as hard as I can to do all my tricks that I hadn't done in so long.

And thinking of your routines and what you're going to do yet, right? Like I haven't done my run, like I haven't learned my tricks back. Now I have to do it with one arm. Like it's hectic. There's like yes, winning is awesome, but being able to show up on such short notice and just like do what I could is something that I've never done before. And I think at the end of the day though it wasn't the outcome that you know maybe I would have hoped for and everyone else would have hoped for I still walked away with a very valuable lesson that I don't think I could have learned what was in any other way.

And what was the greatest lesson you learned from that experience? I think grit. Like true grit. I did not give up when I could have. You know people were telling me that maybe it wasn't a good idea to do this. I was not going to let up. like I wanted to believe in myself and show myself that I could could could deal with this and I could just that like I could make something out of this and like I going to the Olympics is such an honor and a privilege in itself and I you know still had the best result out of the US women's um I really think I accomplished so much more in a way cuz yeah I don't know like I know if I were healthy and it was you I had all the reps.

reps. reps. You would have crushed it. You would have have have I would have done exactly what I wanted to do. I had to do such a chill version of what I was planning to do and prepping to do. So, yeah, So, yeah, So, yeah, that's where I'm at. The grit. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it's like being at peace knowing that like, okay, I could have won has if I was healthier, if I had a full season to train. I knew I could have done.

You've already done it before. Mhm. before. Mhm. before. Mhm. But it's what I'm hearing you say is like learning how to stick through it with the uncertainty, with the pain, with having to learn my routine on eight days. days. days. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And having fun and being positive and knowing that I may win or lose. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's the real lesson. That's what I'm hearing you say. That's the real lesson. Yes. Thank you. Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful way to articulate. Now, I'm curious. I'm a I'm a big fan of just psychology and sports psychology.

really how to prepare yourself mentally for competition so that you can enjoy the most of it as well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Is there any sports psychology you've learned over the years or picked up whether it be like inner game tricks on breath work, meditation, mindset, visualization, or anything else that has supported you in believing in yourself and being ready and prepared for competition? competition? competition? H H H or have you just been a badass since the womb? You know, you just came out and you're just like, I can do this.

No problem. problem. problem. Oh my gosh. I don't know. I actually recently got diagnosed with ADHD. Okay. Like last week. Okay. Last week. Yeah. And everything made sense. Tell me more. Wow. Um I definitely had like just this I was very impulsive. M um I and it was funny cuz when I was meeting with my psychiatrist, we were like walking through the list of symptoms and I was like, I have every single one of those symptoms, but it was mass so well in my sport cuz I think in a way it helped me, you know, you know, you know, your ADHD helped you in sports.

Yes. Yes. Yes. How so? How so? How so? Well, cuz I couldn't focus, but I but with snowboarding, that was like the thing I could really lock in on cuz you got to be in the flow on the slopes. You can't be distracted in the air. air. air. Yeah. And I wasn't. And I was so focused whenever I was when I had my snowboard attached to my feet, like tunnel vision. tunnel vision. tunnel vision. You're in the zone. In the zone. And I feel like, you know, another symptom I had was just chronic exhaustion.

chronic exhaustion. chronic exhaustion. So I after snowing, like I didn't want to go hang out with friends. Like I didn't want to go out. Like I just wanted a rest. And so I feel like when I was on snow, all I did was snowboard and recover. Snowboard recover. Snowboard recover. And I also feel like I never really experienced fear. Like I wasn't really like scared of trying tricks. And I have a very vivid just imagination. So I feel like if I wanted to try a trick, I could visualize it before, you know, without even doing it.

If I watched videos of other people doing it, I could like gauge what they would be seeing. And that was always fun because then I'd go try it and I would see what I thought I would see. would see. would see. And you didn't have fear that what you would fall or hurt yourself or not make it or it or it or No. No. No. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. Which is kind of crazy, huh? huh? huh? Yeah. So that I I would say that's maybe my one superpower that I had in my sport was just was just was just I was always ready to go huck myself.

Fearless. But do you think the ADHD helped you become fearless or was it just part of it? I think it kind of huh I don't know how to describe it but it's almost like almost like almost like because I my mind was always so occupied and busy. I'm always thinking and you know snowboarding being my sport. It was always about snowboarding for the most part. part. part. And so I feel like I've thought about everything snowboarding related. And then then then I would just always think about how I could be better at that cuz that was the one thing I could focus on.

So if I had a bad day on, you know, in training, I would come back home and really just like think about where it went wrong, what I need to try, different things that I could try. Like I would just hyper analyze, focus on that. Is this like watching uh videos of yourself doing this or watching other videos of other people and seeing how you could make this happen in your mind or how or how or how or like maybe like remember seeing what I was seeing when I was training and then trying to like alter that and correct that correct that correct that in your mind.

In my mind. So, not watching video and doing this, but like a mental rehearsal. Mental rehearsal. Non-stop. Obsessive. Nonstop. My mind is so loud. So, it did affect my sleep in a lot of ways. Yeah. Would you be thinking about this all in bed at night? Like just rehearsing tricks in your mind. Yeah. Like whenever I had a moment. Interesting. Interesting. Interesting. Um because I'm competitive, you know? I want to go out there the next day and get it right. I don't I also hate wasting time.

So, I'm like, "All right, I have two more weeks here." Also sport being weather dependent. Right. Right. Right. Right. I'm like, "Okay, there's two sunny days. I need to lock in and get this done on these sunny days. So, what can I do right now to prepare for tomorrow?" tomorrow?" tomorrow?" This message is brought to you by Apple and Verizon. And if you scroll enough online, you'll hear it all. Miracle diets, fitness trends, crazes like celery juice and cold blunges, you name it. But with iPhone and Apple Watch, you get meaningful insights from a very trusted source, your body.

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Do you feel like the constraints of not having snow year round actually allowed you to be better than if you had the ability to practice, you know, every week all year round? I mean, you still can practice every week all year, but you were living here, I guess. Yeah. But, you know, when I first started and started going pro, I would go to New Zealand, I would go to um Switzerland, Switzerland, like go on Mountain Hood in Oregon. I'd always on snow. I'd maybe get a month off each year.

Got it. But then I got to a point where up to me, it's a lot, right? Yeah. I remember when I turned 20 Uhhuh. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. I was like, I don't think I can do this anymore. Like, it hurts. Hurts. I also went to college for a year. So, I feel like when I came back from that, I was like, wait, there's so many things I'm interested in. interested in. interested in. And it's sad that I don't get to experience those things. I want to give myself a little more time to become a whole person and not just snowboard.

snowboard. snowboard. Snowboard. Snowboard. Snowboard. Um, Um, Um, not just the greatest snowboarder of all time, but someone else that also has a life. life. life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would love to have a life seemingly. I don't know. Just, you know, there are other things that I love and I'm very passionate about. And I feel like I started to realize that when I was at school actually, and started meeting people that had nothing to do with sports, action sports in general, but were just so smart and passionate about other things in their lives and were working towards those things.

I wanted that, too. And I feel like I'd already accomplished it in snowboarding. And I think naturally I developed some curiosity for the other sides of the world and the other sides of things that you know maybe I could experience. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so after that awakening I'll call it I was like I don't think I can travel this much anymore. I want to cuz I also recognized that I am not going to snowboard forever. And I think when I was at school I had this scary realization of what am I going to do after after after right?

you know, what am I going to do when when when who am I after sports? Exactly. And I feel like I wanted to nurture that when I was still, you know, a teenager, you know, 20, 19, 20. Um, so I started taking more time for myself. I stopped going to New Zealand and all these places and I would start training, you know, like midfall as opposed to starting in midsummer. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. And I also I don't know, correct me if I'm wrong, but I also heard you never really worked out or you didn't like working out in the gym.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But we actually met in the gym and you're working out. When did that through Roy uh so shout out to Roy. Uh but when did you start working out or you know enjoying it or liking that process? process? process? I mean I still don't like Yeah. It's still hard. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I'd much rather be eating Yeah. sugar candy all day. eating brunch, you know, with my girls instead of being at the gym for an hour. But I think so when we first met, when was that?

Probably a year and a half, two years ago, maybe something like that. I think somewhere around there. Yeah. Is that kind of when you started going That's when I started being more consistent. consistent. consistent. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Why did you decide to from never working out or not working out that much except for on the slopes, which is a workout, but going to the gym and working out, I guess, different types of working out. Yeah. Why did you decide to take that on?

on? on? Well, that was kind my fitness journey is definitely a journey. So, let's talk about it. So, I think after the first Olympics 2018, Olympics 2018, Olympics 2018, I some people were telling me that maybe I should look into a trainer cuz I had partially torn my ACL when I was 15. And I don't know, I just wasn't that strong in that leg. And so, obviously, okay, let's work out and hit the gym. Cool. Met a trainer through Nike. That's also how I met Vinnie was through this trainer.

And I just like wasn't really consistent. Like I would do it for a bit and then I wouldn't and then I do it. Yeah. But I'm like, "Oh, I'm so young and like I want to have fun during the summers." Like I didn't really learn time management well yet, you know, like schedules and structure. So then co happened. I went to school and then co happened into going into my spring semester semester semester and I put on a lot of weight when I was at college at college at college really really really but like whatever.

But then CO hit and it we doubled down. Yeah, it was bad. You doubled down on the weight gain or really just like eating eating, you know, chilling, not going outside. outside. outside. Yeah, of course. Um and then I I think that's also when I started to work with Roy was like during co like the 2021 2022 new one I think. And then I went back to snowboarding and it hurt like oh my gosh. Really? Yes. Cuz I gained 40 lbs. Come on. Come on. Come on.

Yeah. So I was 40 lbs of muscle though, right? You know, you were I wish I really wish. But yeah, so I was sitting at, you know, 40 lbs heavier than I was the last time I snowboarded and it hurt. Just like the recovery or I mean being on the slopes or landing or all of it? You know, and I I think that I was like, "Oh my gosh, I'm getting old because this hurts for the first time." But when you think about it, you were like 20s.

I know. I know. I should be fine. But it'd be like if I fell on my butt kind of hard, I'd be bedridden for a week. week. week. Really? Really? Really? Cuz you know, we fall from pretty high. You're like 30, 40t in the air, I feel like. like. like. Yeah. Cuz the wall's 22 feet. So then add how much you go from there and then you fall. It's like a lot. When I go snowboarding and I jump like 3 feet, I'm like scared to fall.

If I do a 180, I'm like, uh, I don't want to hit or hurt myself. You're going so high. So high. And doing all these spins and falling a lot. And it just really felt like I was getting beat up. Then I somehow made it to Beijing, but I was still, you know, carrying extra weight on me. And after that season, I was like, I can't do this anymore. This is so painful. It makes me never want to do this again. It's not enjoyable, huh? It's not.

It's so hard. And I don't like being in this much pain. I'm used to pain, but this is excessive over something so small. We fall on our butts all the time, and the fact that I couldn't handle it was just really hard for me. for me. for me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so that's when I just locked in. After Beijing, I just locked in. And I was like, I'm going to be consistent. I'm going to go every morning like, I'm really going to stick to this.

I'm going to start jogging. Roy got me on to jogging. Started doing Pilates and I feel great. feel great. feel great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You look fit. Yeah, we we met in the gym. I'd say there a few different times and I was like, "Yeah, she's fit, you know, she's shape, strong." shape, strong." shape, strong." Yes. I love it so much. Wow. And I think now I feel good like after a workout. So, I enjoy how I feel afterwards, afterwards, afterwards, but getting there and starting it's getting there is rough, you know?

You know, when he has a start on the bike, that's rough. Yeah. Roll your feet on the thing first and roll the bike. What um how do you feel getting in the gym the last four years supported you physically for this time around at the Olympics then? I think that if I hadn't put that much work in, I don't think I would have been able to come back in the way I did. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. Cuz you know, people will still compete in their respective sports with injuries.

Um, and sometimes you need like expedited rehab to get you there, you know, for something like the Olympics or like a really important game or whatever. or whatever. or whatever. Um, I think the reason why a lot of athletes are able to do that and have such a quick turnaround is because they put in the work before, you know, our muscles do protect us from a lot of things. You know, people I have a partially torn ACL and so I got my legs really strong and now everything's supported because my legs are strong.

Um, I have a thing with my shoulder. you know, my arms are strong, so like it can just support it a bit more than if I didn't have all those, you know, just put all that time into it. And I think that overall overall overall I just feel healthier. Like I feel like I'm not in as much pain as I typically would be after a season. Cuz even one trip to snow, you get pretty banged up. Yeah. you know, and so it's nice that when I come home, like, yes, I'm sore, but I can bounce back pretty quickly and find, you know, just peace and painlessness pretty quickly.

Yeah. I mean, now that when was the uh was it a couple months ago the Olympics ended, right? right? right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Couple months ago. Now that you had a little bit of time to kind of reflect, what is what's the vision for the next few years for you and you've accomplished everything like you said? you accomplish your goal this time around time around time around it, you know, is it trying to create new experiences in life? Are you still trying to train? Like what's next for your sports career?

I think, you know, I like to give myself time. time. time. Um, I feel like I still haven't fully settled. settled. settled. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz we get we are so busy post Olympics, interviews, interviews, interviews, all over the place. Yeah. So, I feel like I'm still in the midst of the chaos, but chaos, but chaos, but you're still in the Olympics. Yeah. I'm still there. Yeah. Um but I don't So yeah, I don't know. I don't I don't know. And I don't think I need to know anytime soon.

I feel like I have time to make decisions and I feel like there's a lot of like big decisions that are going to need to be made. And I also want to honor that I am a person outside of this, too. And I want to continue to nurture that side of myself. And so I'm again really blessed to be in a position where there's not something else I want really badly enough to where I'm going to have tunnel vision and just lock in on that one thing.

I think now I'm in a position where where where I can kind of do what feels right for me and makes sense. Yeah. I've been watching some of your content just of you talking about your interests outside of sports and you know you talking about your relationship a lot more online and sharing photos of you guys. I'm curious what's the biggest lesson that he's taught you through this journey as he's top in the world of what he does and shout out Cleveland Browns but I'm from Ohio but is there any lesson that he's taught you through this journey from one elite athlete to another first of all so inspirational like been really fun to be by his side and support him and watch him do all of these amazing things um there's he's the most deserving most deserving most deserving he works so hard hard hard hard and I think that's definitely a big takeaway.

takeaway. takeaway. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. So consistent. Like he's always working his butt off no matter what. Sick. When he sometimes he's like so sick. I remember one time he was like coughing all night, did not get much sleep, still shows up, goes to the gym, does his ridiculously hard 2-hour workout. The only trade-off is is he'll take like a six hour nap. He's like, I'm out. Yeah. But he's getting everything he needs to do first and then he's, you know, sleeping, body work, everything. Yeah. Me on the other hand, I'm like absolutely not like I am not doing this.

I need to be babyed. I need someone to take care of me. If I'm coughing, I'm sleeping. Yeah, exactly. Um, that's interesting. But that's something I really admire about him. about him. about him. So, he's very disciplined no matter what. what. what. So disciplined. So stubbornly disciplined. disciplined. disciplined. Wow. Wow. Wow. Like there are moments where I'm like, maybe don't push yourself so hard. Like you slept for 2 hours. Like this can't be good for you. He's like, "No, I got to go. to go. to go.

He wants to be great." And I now I'm like, "Do your thing." You know? Wow. know? Wow. know? Wow. Lesson learned. Lesson learned. Lesson learned. So that mindset, but it seems like he has a lot of fun, too, with you. I mean, at least what's the lift for you guys? That's good. That's good. That's good. Yeah. I mean, it's fun cuz we have so many things in common. So, it's really easy. And I feel like us both being athletes, we get each other, too. There are a lot of times I'm like, "Yeah, yeah, you're good.

You're good." You're good." You're good." So, when was the first time you won a big competition? What year was that? Or how old were you? I think I've won multiple big competitions for the first time. Like the first big competition I won um was like for the youth division. I was nine. Nine. Nine. Nine. Okay. Okay. Okay. It was cool. It was my first international competition. international competition. international competition. Wow. Wow. Wow. And yeah, I was like 15 and under was that you that you that you And you won at nine.

You're being 15 year olds. That's crazy. Wow. Wow. Wow. I know. I know. I know. So that was what is that 15 years ago? 15 16 years ago. like your first big competition that you won, right? International level International level International level if you could go back and speak to, you know, 9year-old with all the wisdom and lessons you've learned. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Knowing everything you're going to accomplish over the last 15, 16 years, what wisdom or advice would you share with her if she was sitting right across from you?

from you? from you? I feel like this is a very common question and I love the idea about like you know I love the idea at the same time though I don't think I would say anything and I think that's also a very common response response response because not that it's a bad question or anything I think it's more so just I became who I am because of everything I experienced in the way that I did. Yeah. And I don't think I would change anything about my journey to get here.

I think everything that I endured, whether it be amazing or incredibly difficult, was all meant to be. And I think that's how I learned to navigate such difficult moments in my life. Um, I think sport is one of the greatest lessons. lessons. lessons. Yes, it is. And you know, I I am so grateful that I got to grow in a sport and go through some really intense moments at such a young age because now I feel like I can get through whatever and accomplish whatever I put my mind to.

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, that's beautiful. What's the biggest lesson your dad taught you from all those years of supporting and coaching and encouraging and investing in time to support you in accomplishing your dreams and goals as well? well? well? H H H my dad's taught me a lot and I think very common in Asian families, but dads typically tend to be a bit more emotionally distant and that's where we butt heads the most. Really? Really? Really? Yeah. cuz I would just be having a bad day, whatever, and he would just be so frustrating to me.

And like my dad's such a talker. He loves talking. Like if you run into him on the street and say we know each other, like he will talk to you for hours. So much to say. Um but I think my dad is he taught me it's a good question. He's taught me so much. There's is there anything that really stands out in that way? I think he just taught me how to be like to he taught me what support like the true definition of love and just support as a parent.

Just blindly trusting that this is going to work that we're going to do everything we can on our end to make this happen and like he's going to love and support me unconditionally. you know, even though some days he's spending all this money to send me off to training and I had a terrible time training, always just like believe that it's going to work out some way, shape, or form and that he's going to support me until the very end until we go completely broke, which is when I was going to be 13.

And then you started making some money and started working out. Yeah. Yeah. Now we're moving now. Like now we can like buy tickets for planes. Well, that's great. Yeah. Now, I'm a, you know, I'm a new dad. I have twin girls, five and a half months old. Uh, is there any advice you have for me, you know, for being the best father I can be to young girls who have their own dreams and hopes and goals? Any advice you'd give to me or any other fathers out there who have daughters?

daughters? daughters? My advice to you, as someone with no kids, kids, kids, as someone who had a Sounds like a father, that was really encouraging. And I'm sure it wasn't perfect all the time and it was like maybe he was hard or whatever. But whatever. But whatever. But from what you experienced with your father, any advice of what to do, what not to do or encouragement for fathers out there? out there? out there? I would say just to be as present as possible. Honestly, I think experience is the greatest teacher.

And I can't sit here and be like, well, support them. Like that could mean different to your daughters. That could mean mean something entirely different to you. But I think you have to be open to learning and growing and evolving with them and just being present, you know, and just being there. being there. being there. Do you feel like your dad was pretty present most of the time or was he just driven on you accomplishing and getting better mostly? better mostly? better mostly? I think he was my my dad also definitely has ADHD.

has ADHD. has ADHD. He's all over the place, too. He's like all over the place, but he always showed up. Yeah. and he he is the most reliable person in my life. Um, you know, I'll call him and if I'm washing my hands on FaceTime and he hears the sink make a funny sound, he's like, "I'm coming over tomorrow afternoon to fix that." Like the water is like weird. Um, I think he always similar to me and I feel like I kind of took this from him, but before I was obsessively thinking about how to be a better snowboarder, he was doing that for me.

And so he'd always come up with cool new ideas. My dad recognized one time randomly that So I'm goofy, right? Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. Um so Um so Um so which people means what does it mean for people? people? people? You're silly in life, too. Goofy. No. So goofy and snowboarding means that your right foot is forward. Yeah. Um, but my dad felt like if my back arm was flailing while I was snowboarding, it would make me really unstable unstable unstable if your left arm was flailing.

Like my back arm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, So, So, my dad attached this like little tennis keychain. It was a little ball on my pants and he made me hold that while I was snowboarding and doing tricks pretty much. That's interesting. And so now when I snowboard it was so but it worked like my arms are very stable stable stable as opposed to like out here flailing around out there and that's what it used to do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it worked. My dad was an engineer so he has this engineer mind and he's always thinking all these things and he also this is before it was common.

So when I started doing well in competitions it was because I became really good at writing switch. So switch means I'm riding in the opposite way. So now my left foot is forward, which is unnatural to me. So hard. Every time I switch into Goofy, I'm like, I feel like I'm going to fall every day. Yeah. So you got good at riding both sides. Yeah. So my dad would make me, you know, he'd get mad when I didn't do it because it was so important to him.

And in hindsight, for me as a snowboarder now to be good at riding switch. So whenever I was getting on the chairlift, it had to be switched. Whenever I was riding down to the halfpipe had to be switched. Everything had to be switched. Um, I had to like do a whole day in the halfpipe just switch, hitting all the going off all the jumps, switch, doing everything I could switch because he really wanted me to get good at writing switch. And he recognized before I did that switch writing is going to be really really helpful.

Huge. Oh, it's going to be huge. Right. And now it's like you have to like reverse almost to be good. Yeah. Exactly. It gets you more points, right? right? right? Yes. Yes. So back then though, no one was really doing that except for the Sochi gold medalist Caitlyn Ferington. She was really good at spinning backside and was really good at writing switch. And you were what, 13 then? Is that right? right? right? So he was like, "You need to start doing this in order." He really saw the future.

future. future. He saw me do it way before then though. Wow. Wow. Wow. But he saw the future like, "Okay, when you're 16, when you're 20, when you're 24, if you're not doing this, you're not going to win." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Or this will give you a greater chance. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's some great vision from your father. father. father. Yeah. So, we definitely but had a lot because to me I'm like this is so dumb. Like I should just be working on bigger tricks in my natural way.

But he was like no. like no. like no. Wow. Wow. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So you got to listen to your dad sometimes, right? Even if you didn't want to. want to. want to. And I do. Yeah. I mean now we have a much better relationship. I think after the first Olympics he was kind of able to let me go. He definitely was a tiger parent. Really? Really? Really? A thousand%. A thousand%. A thousand%. Again, I didn't want to snowboard. Like that wasn't my sport. So I kind of just did it and you know he did it because he wanted you to do it pretty much.

pretty much. pretty much. But at least he was showing up with you all those times, right? He was like he had to be on the slopes with you. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. So you're spending some I guess quality time together too. You're spending a lot of of of Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But he was on top of you. Yeah. My dad is was a very intense person. So it was hard. It was hard. I definitely have some trauma. But but we're in such a good place now that I think as I reflect um you know whether it be in therapy or on my own I am really grateful for him.

I think you know at the end of the day regardless of how much you love somebody you can still hurt them and we definitely hurt each other. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah I think very forgiving. Like I understand where he's coming from. Like could he have been a little better? Absolutely. But I can't hold that against him. But he also helped you become the greatest of all time. So that's exactly, you know, and you didn't ruin the rel he didn't ruin the relationship, which is good.

I'm I'm curious. You've mentioned therapy. You've mentioned you've talked to a psychologist before. I've worked with sports psychologists. I've worked with different therapists over the years from my own personal healing journey. What is the biggest lessons you've learned through therapy and starting to create awareness around having ADHD and your own healing experience? I think I think I started really actually going to therapy. I think it's been almost two years now. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And it wasn't sport related. But I I tried to go to, you know, see sports psychologists and whatnot to get better in my sport, but I I was getting kind of frustrated cuz it just felt like you guys don't know what I'm talking about.

So, I don't really want to sit here and explain everything to you cuz I feel like if I have to explain it to you, you don't understand. And I'm paying you. you don't trust in the A, right? I don't trust you at all. And so I was like, okay, maybe I need therapy. And the reason for therapy, it wasn't sport related. It was mainly because I felt that I wasn't I just felt like I wasn't being a good person in life. in life. in life. In life, In life, In life, like friends, family, press, or like friends, family, relationships, all of it.

I just felt like I was not showing up in the way that I should. And I think that made me very concerned because my intentions are always good. Like I always want to be a good person, but sometimes it was so hard to be that. And did someone confront you and say, "Hey, you're really not showing up for me or you're kind of like got a bad attitude every time you're around me." Or was it more an internal uh I'm really, you know, I saw someone was hurt or whatever.

Like how did you come to this? I think it was a combination because I think that think that think that everyone in my life is so kind and so supportive and so giving and genuine. And I think that, you know, they also were very understanding that I'm experiencing a lot. You know, they see how busy my life is. They see how much pressure, you know, people are putting onto me. They're seeing They're seeing They're seeing all of it. You're so young at the time. You're 21, whatever it is.

Yeah. very unstable. Like definitely very unstable person. Well, you're trying to figure out your life. Like exactly. I didn't start figuring things out until I was my early 30s. Yeah. I was like, you really don't know who you are. You're as a 21-year-old. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you have all this pressure and everyone's asking you questions like Yeah. So really grateful for everyone being so understanding. But I think for me, I I would also catch it. You would catch it, be like, damn, I don't think that was nice.

Damn. I don't think I should have handled things that way, but it was so hard for me to recognize that in the moment, like stop myself from getting there. there. there. So, I was like, "Okay, I'm going to try to go to therapy." And I love my therapist. She's great. Um, awesome. Love catching up with her. And we made a lot of progress, like a like a lot of progress with my mentality, like the way that I expressed myself. It was a lot of hard work.

I was seeing her three times a week. I've been there. I've done that before. Three times a week. Like five hours on a weekend or Yeah. I couldn't Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You got to go all emergencies. emergencies. emergencies. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, hey, like I know it's 11, but like, oof, like, oof, like, oof, girl, I need you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so shout out to her for showing up for me always. But the ADHD, I just felt like, you know, I have been working on myself for 2 years, not expecting a full 180 in 2 years, but it still feels like a lot of time and like a lot of sessions.

And she's great and I feel like I'm being very receptive and I'm doing my best and I can recognize the changes that I've made through our sessions. However, there's this one little thing that wouldn't quite go away and it was I I just like was a very reactive person. Like if you were triggered by something, you would react. Boom. Boom. Boom. Explode. Explode. Explode. Like how would this be? You'd scream, you'd say something you didn't like, you would walk away. Like I would feel it like my I would get so hot, like so warm, so like I I don't know.

like maybe see red kind of vibes but not really like I would never hurt anyone but anyone but anyone but you'd feel it just like just feel my heart starts racing like my mind is going a million miles an hour I'm thinking about all these things these things these things and I hated that because I always wanted to be calm understanding logical assess the situation situation situation before you know having any type of reaction but I couldn't even do that I was Instant boom. I don't like that.

That triggered me. You say whatever you said. Yeah. Or you do something or you walk away or whatever. whatever. whatever. Yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, I'm not breaking stuff. I'm like, you know, very upset. upset. upset. And I didn't like that. And so, I just felt like it was more than like I didn't feel like I felt like it was too big of an issue for me to wait another 2 3 years for it to get better, if that makes sense. Cuz it wasn't getting better by itself.

It wasn't getting Yeah. like you know I think if I wasn't good at communicating or like expressing my emotions you know outside of a really like triggering environment that okay we can take the two two to five years to work on that but like me feeling enraged in that way is not something I want to work towards for another 3 years. Wow. Wow. Wow. So you like I need this to happen now. I need to resolve this cuz I didn't like how I felt after. It made me really sad cuz it's regret, but I just felt like there was nothing I could do to get out of that in those moments.

So, moments. So, moments. So, saw a psychiatrist. And mind you, this these wouldn't happen often. That's another thing. Like it wasn't like screaming every day like freaking out every day. No, but like I like structure, I like consistency, I like all of that. And so when all of those things would fall through, like I would start feeling it. Yeah. So yeah, I saw a psychiatrist and he he he was like, "Wow, so you have like severe ADHD. It's severe and you also um have depression and anxiety." But he was like, "Your ADHD is so severe.

Let's regulate that first because the depression and the anxiety can also be caused by the ADHD." Okay. So Okay. So Okay. So yeah, I feel good. But you feel like a lot more like calm and relaxed and less reaction. Much more calm, relax. Like I feel like I had multiple situations come up in the past week where that would have been kind of not triggering, but like a little stressful to me and anxietyinducing, but I was like, "Okay, no worries." Like, "Let's just pivot." I was like, "Wow, look at you.

You start to shift." Yeah. I know. Oh, and I also had my a session with my therapist yesterday and I was like, I still want to work with you, but I feel like now during our sessions, I can actually start just healing my trauma and like talking about those things cuz I'm not so caught up emotionally about what happened two days ago. days ago. days ago. Now I can start talking about like things that I should Interesting. So, a lot of your sessions were around like this just happened.

I need to figure out what to do now because my mind just like is freaking out over something all the time. I was I am so insane. I would like talk to myself in the car because my mind is so crazy that I'm like having conversations with myself in the car because my mind will not shut up. Sleeping was terrible non-stop. So it's like snowboarding was the most chill time for me cuz I could just focus on snowboarding. You're in the zone. But the minute I got out of it, oh my gosh.

gosh. gosh. Wow. And so now what I'm hearing you say is when you meet with your therapist, you can actually go back to the root of what's causing the stress or where the trigger lies or wherever the wound is emotionally or psychologically, right? Yeah. Cuz I was going to my therapist already triggered. already triggered. already triggered. You're like, I just had this happen today. Yeah. today. Yeah. today. Yeah. I don't know how to deal with this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Wow. Wow. So I'm really excited about that.

So you haven't you haven't unpacked what that kind of deeper root cause is yet. It's just now starting. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm excited for you. Thank you. because this is where I mean it sounds like you've done a lot of work to get here in the last couple years and I I encourage you to keep diving deep because it's can be terrifying and scary. scary. scary. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But it can I used to have chest pain for years like like a sharp chest pain and I used to feel like someone was choking me.

Oh my gosh. Just because of the psychological and emotional wounds that I was holding on to to to from the past. And I remember after going deeper and deeper into deeper into deeper into therapy, I I got to a place where I could finally like heal my heart. As weird as this sounds, like the pain in a moment, it like all made sense in my nervous system where the pain went away. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And I felt free for the first time. Wow, that's amazing. The first time, this is about four or five years ago.

And how long did that process take? I mean, I've been doing different therapy. therapy. therapy. I mean, I started when I was I'm 43 now, so I started when I was 30, kind of going to workshops and doing therapy. I did that for maybe a year, two years, and it really helped me heal a lot. I mean, I went through a lot of stuff as well. well. well. And And And but then I maybe didn't go back for many years cuz I felt like a lot better.

But then new things came up from a different relationship that triggered me. And I was like, "Oh, there's still more inside of me that's holding me back and why do I have this pain and why is this going on?" on?" on?" So I went back again and and I felt like and it doesn't mean every day is perfect. I still get like frustrated. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. But I don't hold on to the pain. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I still can get triggered and reactive, but I don't explode like I did 10, 15 years ago.

years ago. years ago. Right. Right. Right. So I react in different ways. I catch myself much faster and I typically respond a lot better. Yeah. I'm not like, e, I shouldn't have done that anymore, you know? Whereas in the past, I was like, like, like, I really need to apologize, you know, about what I said or how I reacted. Now I'm just like, okay, I just didn't feel good, but I learned to respond with more peace. more peace. more peace. Or I learned to like pause and not say anything until I was ready.

Or I didn't send that email from her anger. anger. anger. I slept on it and then I edited it and then I sent that. You know, it's like it's learning. it's learning. it's learning. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I guess the psychological and emotional tools. tools. tools. Damn. You're sending off heated emails. I mean, text emails. and all sorts of stuff probably. I mean, I I couldn't remember how this stuff, you know, but it's like I got in fist fights, you know, playing basketball games in West Hollywood, probably right near right near where you train.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was on the basketball court 13 years ago and I got a fist fight for just being triggered by a guy. Oh my gosh. Yeah. It was like explosive. And so I've had to learn how to heal, but it's all coming from a root cause of like a wounds. wounds. wounds. Yeah. Totally. And you know, you had different wounds, I had wounds, everyone's got wounds, but it's learning how to mend those wounds have given me a lot of peace. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. And then it's also refreshing and staying in that process of healing because it's always it's an ongoing journey.

journey. journey. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's just like I could easily fall back into it if I'm not practicing. And so that's why I'm really excited to hear this about you because I think a lot of people might see you and say, you know, Khloe's got it all figured out. She's a world champion. She's the greatest of all time. She's got it put together. She's got the great relationship. You know, she's fashion week. She's doing all the cool things. But to hear you speak about this, it's all a facade.

Wow. It's not a facade. It's it's a part of what you've created. But what I'm hearing you say, this is the stuff I'm most excited about. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think so many people hearing this, it gives them permission to say, "Oh, okay. If I've got some triggers, it's okay for me to go and and look into it. And it's not something I could be have to be ashamed of. It's something I could be excited about figuring out how to respond differently. And so, I'm really excited that you're sharing this.

sharing this. sharing this. Thank you. And thank you for sharing. Wow. Look at us. You deserve one of these. these. these. Look at I just think it's um you know, as an athlete, I grew up playing sports and I was, you know, I played arena football, so I was never good as your boyfriend, but I played arena football and I was a dathlete and Oh, wow. And I'm currently, you know, I I was on the USA Wait, that's intense. Yeah. I mean, I've I've had my own sports journey.

sports journey. sports journey. Wow. Wow. Wow. And I love your advice as well. I don't know if you see this over here. This a handball. I'm currently I've been on the USA national team for team handball for almost a decade. So, I'm still pursuing my Olympic dream in LA 2028. And I haven't been on the USA team in about 5 years, but I played for almost a decade with the team. So, I'm trying to get back into the USA national team. Oh my gosh. my gosh.

my gosh. To go to the Olympics here in LA in 2 and 1/2 years. And it's my own journey because most of the athletes are 23 years old. I'm 43. So I'm 20 years older than most of the athletes. So I've got my own challenges that I'm and that I'm facing right now. And at this age, it's not about training 10 hours a day and over going the extra mile. It's actually about doing the bare minimum at the highest level as possible so I can recover more.

Right. Right. And so I'm curious and I really believe the emotional healing has given me the longevity as an athlete as well. So I'm curious your advice for me as an athlete trying to pursue the Olympic dream where there's no guarantee for me. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And this will be my last chance LA 2028. What advice do you have for me as I've been pursuing this for 16 years trying to being on and off the USA national team? Yeah. team? Yeah. team? Yeah. And I'm still pursuing it at this season of life.

Any advice you have for me with all the experience, wisdom, and success you have as an Olympian? Oh my gosh. I feel like I can't give you advice on this like because what you're doing is so incredible, you know, and I there's no guarantees I'm going to make the team. the team. the team. Yeah. But I don't think that matters. I think what matters right now is that when you are working so hard to accomplish this dream of yours, I think that's incredible in itself. I think the only thing I would say maybe is to not compare yourself to anybody.

You know, you truly don't know what's going on. It maybe isn't all glitz and glamour like as we're learning about ourselves. Just do what you do best. you know, there's only one you and just because you're a little bit older than everyone else doesn't mean that you won't be able to accomplish it. I think at the end of the day, hard work beats talent. And it sounds like you're working pretty damn hard. damn hard. damn hard. Working hard. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.

Yeah. Exactly. I mean, you've already won. That's the goal. But how do you not What advice would you give to me or someone pursuing a goal or a dream in life, whether it's the Olympics or anything else? How do you not how do you focus on the process without thinking about the prize of whether it's the the medal, the team, the the money, the relationship, like how do you focus on the process even though you have the goal in mind but not being attached to the outcome.

the outcome. the outcome. Control what you can control. Mhm. You know like you the things you can control. You can work hard. You can be disciplined. You can you know be mindful about your recovery. Invest in yourself. Though it may seem selfish in the beginning, it's not. I think investing in yourself is the greatest gift that you could give yourself. Um, I think set little goals. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. And I think it makes the journey much more exciting than dreadful. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's so easy to look two, five, 10 years into the future and being like, "Oh my gosh, that's so crazy.

Like, I don't know if I'll be able to do that. I'm not maybe, you know, I'm not good enough yet. I don't know if I'll be healthy. I don't know what my life is going to look like that I'm scared. My therapist tells me that humans are naturally scared of the unknown. So that anxiety, the fear, the doubt is so natural and normal. Um but at the end of the day, if you set small goals for yourself, control what you can control. I feel like you're going to look up one day and be exactly where you wanted to be.

be. be. Yeah. Yeah, Yeah. Yeah, Yeah. Yeah, that's it's so interesting now we're talking and you're saying this to me that you were actually a part of my Olympic journey dream because 2 years ago I hadn't played in 4 years cuz I got injured. I hurt my Achilles. Wow. Wow. Wow. So I was playing up until about 2020 and then CO happened. I was going through a breakup. I hurt my Achilles and I was like maybe I'm done and maybe this Olympic dream is over. And then a couple years go by and I start recovering and I actually call Vinnie and I say, "Vinnie, this dream is still alive.

This Olympic dream." I go, "Can you help me? Give me a game plan and work with me." And he goes, "Connect with Roy. Come in here. Come to Mild Detox. I'll work on you. Connect with Roy." And so I started training with Roy. And probably, I don't know, six months after that, I meet you and I see you in there and he's like, "Yeah, Khloe's in here." and she's working on her stuff and and so you're actually a part of my Olympic journey is inspiring me when we were in the gym together and it's kind of cool, you know, two years later now we're talking about this and there's two more years to go for this journey for me.

But I'm so excited for you. It's cool. I'm curious about you mentioned like this doubt again. Um and I've got a few more questions for you, but you mentioned about this doubt. How do people do people do people a lot of people tie their self-worth with their performance and the results? Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. How have you learned to not tie your inner selfworth with the results of Olympic gold or success? Mhm. I think you just have to be present. present. present. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. I think we accomplish so many great things on a day-to-day basis, you know, whether it be getting up in the morning, you know, taking care of ourselves, um spending time with our loved ones, whatever that may be.

I think that it's so again easy to look at other people's lives and compare yourselves and maybe wish that that were yours, but I always think that you're exactly where you're supposed to be. And And And like I think awards and all of that are great. It's instant gratification. You're standing at the top of the podium. You're walking away with this big trophy. big trophy. big trophy. But as somebody who's experienced it multiple times, I would say that at the end of the day, it never after the first the first gold medal, it doesn't hit the same really.

really. really. Yeah. And I think I wish that I had celebrated maybe like my smaller wins and maybe if I had done that, all my wins would have meant a bit more. Did you ever celebrate the wins or did you just kind of like on to the next, on to the next? It was always on to the next. next. next. Really? Really? Really? Yes. Like after my first gold, I started prepping for my next competition and it was a little hectic because I had to do a bunch of press after the Olympics and like you know even after my first XG games medal when I was 13 was like the youngest to get a medal.

It was just straight to the next. I went to you know Switzerland in my next event. Like I never took a moment to celebrate my wins. Do you even do you even have like dinner afterwards and say, "Okay, let's celebrate this and have a moment or was it more of like Yeah, but I feel like I also just was I am more of an introvert. I just want to lay in bed. I'm tired. I'm over stimulated. I just want to lay down." But I also think that my mindset was a bit messed up because I always felt like every time I was on the podium, I was like, well, yeah, sorry.

I should be be be I'm meant to be here. Like, I have to be here. here. here. And that was really hard for me. And I experienced that for over 10 years. Carl's like, "Yeah, well, I felt like if I didn't win, that was a problem." You know, then I did bad if I didn't win. And that was something I had to talk my way out of, like mental mental talk. Yeah. Cuz it became so toxic and I didn't like the way it made me feel.

How did you learn to talk? What did you say to talk yourself out of that? Or what did you think? I think the h I don't know if I really had to. I think it was more of a shift in perspective where I recognize that I love all the girls I compete with and I'm so happy for them and genuinely I am. And I'm not saying like I would be bummed if I didn't win. you know, I've gotten like, yes, I've won a lot, but I've also not won a lot.

And at the end of the day, I'm so happy for all the girls. And I think it had to happen to me once where, you know, I was on had a winning streak and then like one of my good friends took the gold. And I genuinely was so happy for her because in that moment, I was like, dude, we trained together. This is her dream also. Yes. Like, you are working your butt off just like I am. We're I've seen her get injured. Like I've seen her come back stronger.

I've seen her name is Coralt. She's Spanish. She's Spanish. She's Spanish. She I love her to death. Wow. Wow. Wow. Um but she kind of broke this winning streak I had and I was like I am so happy for you. And I think once I experienced that it's like okay yeah this is fine. This is great because I do love them. I just think I needed to experience it to form an opinion on it. Cuz you hadn't lost in like years probably. probably. probably. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. You're like I'm eight years in. I haven't lost. haven't lost. haven't lost. Yeah. Interesting. So, you took I mean, and you probably got second or third or something, I'm assuming. So, it wasn't like, oh, you know, but what did losing teaching you about your life? your life? your life? Well, one, I think I don't think you could ever call it losing, right? right? right? You know, and that's something you have to learn, you know, teach yourself too as you navigate this because there's no such thing as losing.

I think every it's such an easy thing to say and an easy way to describe something that is complex. So it's almost unfair. almost unfair. almost unfair. So I think you know not winning a goal doesn't mean that you failed. It means that that that you showed up. You still showed up and you still got there and you still went out there and gave it your all. And I think that alone is winning. I think that's the whole point of sport is showing up even in moments of doubt, even in moments of like, you know, just hardship and struggling and all of that.

There are so many moments where I'm like, I don't know if I could make it to tomorrow. I don't know if I can show up tomorrow. I don't know if I have it in me. I had such a hard day today. I suck. Like, I'm scared. I'm not going to do well in my competition tomorrow. And if you remove yourself from it, it doesn't matter. Like, it doesn't matter. I'm so grateful for all the experiences I've had because again, there are so many lessons I've learned through snowboarding that I would have learned so much later down the line in life that I'm at an advantage in life.

I feel like now I'm in this place where I'm turning 26 this year and I feel like I have 60 years of wisdom. Wow. Wow. Wow. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, that's beautiful. that's beautiful. that's beautiful. And I'm sure you've experienced that too through sport, right? I mean, sports taught me everything. I mean, I didn't do well in school. I was like bottom of my class and I couldn't pay attention, you know. So sports was my outlet. It's where I learned all my lessons. lessons. lessons. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's it's taught me so much. I wouldn't be where I am without sports. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. But you know what I'm hearing you say there is no losing. It's either you win or you learn. It's kind of what I'm hearing you say. It's like you're learning about how you showed up. showed up. showed up. I think that's really cool. And I'm really I'm really grateful for you showing up, Chloe. I've got two final questions if that's okay. Um, before I ask you the final questions, is there any question you wish people asked you more?

more? more? Um, Um, Um, is this one of the final questions? No, it's not. It's not. This is just I don't I don't think so. I think, you know, I really appreciate people's curiosity towards me. Um, I really do appreciate it. I think wanting to be known is to be loved. M um so you know if you see me obviously unless you're asking me like a genuinely stupid question that you know is stupid like I and I feel like I could sense that um or if you want to joke with me no worries like I'll laugh along whatever but I you know if people see me out and about I want them to ask away.

I feel like I love sharing whatever I can. I love I would love if people could learn a little something from me. It doesn't have to be much whatever. Whether it be like the type of blush I use to like you know my mindset going into the competition whatever you need from me you well in some other interview they can ask you about the blush you use I'm going to go about the mindset you got other platforms for that for me I'm fascinated about mindset and for me it's like you are the best in the world at what you do and this is the school of greatness not the school of average so it's about understanding the way you think the way you feel how you respond and I'm just I'm grateful that you're opening up about the things you're learning at this season of life with all the success you have knowing there's deeper levels of peace and prosperity and abundance in you.

So, I'm I'm really excited about that. I think it's going to help a lot of people. So, thank you for sharing that. This is a question the final two questions. Uh before I ask them, I want people to follow you on social media. Khloe Kim on Instagram and all the different places. Um you're on a media run right now with you're still in the Olympic season. So again, I want people to watch all your stuff and check you out on social media and see what you're up to.

Is there anywhere else we should send people to to follow you or to be a part of your platforms? platforms? platforms? You know what's so funny is I am so bad on social media. I got social media a lot later than my friends did. Just your parents wouldn't let you or there was that I just had no interest. You're like, I just want to snowboard. Yeah. And I was also the kid that, you know, growing up I have two sisters. um they're my half sisters and I only say that cuz there's a quite quite a big age gap 10 and 15 years.

So while they're watching TV in the house like I was digging up isopods in the front yard like trying to find bugs and like you know finding little spiders and stuff. I just liked being outside more. more. more. That's great. That's great. That's great. So I actually got social media out of necessity because it was when I was 13 and had just qualified for the Olympics. Couldn't go and everyone was like you need to get Instagram. like that's where things are going. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um but I'm trying.

But also like don't be surprised if in five years my Instagram's completely gone and I'm on a ranch somewhere living my best life. That's my dream. That's good. Yeah. Okay, cool. Okay, cool. Okay, cool. Uh this question is something I ask everyone at the end. It's called the three truths. So it's a hypothetical question. Imagine you get to live as long as you want to live on this earth and you're as old as you want to be and you get to create and experience and accomplish all of your wildest dreams from this moment until that day.

And maybe that's you living on a ranch for the rest of your life. I don't know. But But But hypothetically, it's the end of your life. life. life. And for whatever reason, everything you've shared, this conversation, all the videos you've ever made are gone. This hypothetical world. But on the last day, you get to leave behind three lessons. Three lessons. three truths that you feel are true to you from your experiences that you would share with people and this is all we would have of your your lessons and your content.

What would those three truths or three lessons be for you? I feel like on my PR ones that were like be kind, be grateful, you know, you know, you know, but what's a real what's really what's really inside of you though? Well, I think three might take me a while, but the first one that jumped at me was keep learning. keep learning. keep learning. And I only say this because my dad is 70. He's currently in Japan, going to culinary school. That's cool. That's cool. That's cool.

And my dad Wow. Wow. Wow. is also learning Japanese. Wow. Wow. Wow. And he is walking to his classes every day. It's a two-mile walk. and he just has always had such a curious mind and just this need for knowledge and I think he's really inspired me to just no matter how old you are, you can always try something, learn something, experience something new for the first time. time. time. That's cool. That's cool. That's cool. So chills, right? He's awesome. Um I love I'll show you a picture of him in his school uniform.

He looks so cute. That's cool. Yeah, please do. Um Um Um keep learning would be your first truth. Yes. My second truth, take care of yourself. Kind of a broader lesson, lesson, lesson, but whatever that means to you. For me, taking care of myself is putting myself first. I will I will always do my best to achieve my dreams, my hopes, my ambitions. Um, and taking care of myself also means to show up for others cuz that means a lot to me. to me. to me.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I love being the supportive character in one's life. So, that's cool. that's cool. that's cool. That's a big part of it. Third, have fun. Honestly, have fun. M just have fun, live your best life. I know this is so cliche, but like I mean I guess when I was a teenager, everyone was like, "YOL, yolo, you live once." But like you do only live once. You enjoy it. That's cool. That's cool. That's cool. And I think these days whenever I'm going through a difficult time, I try to think about things that I'm grateful for, things that make me happy.

I I'm surrounded by the most incredible people. I feel like I have such a great support system. Um, you know, if I'm having a bad day, I'll call Miles and like we'll play games together and that cheers me up. Or like call my best friends. They'll always cheer me up sharing funny stories. Um, Um, Um, I think the goal is always to start my day with a smile and end it with one. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. That's what I strive for. I don't know if those are good lessons.

I'm like, so powerful. Yeah. And maybe at the end of your life, you'll have different ones, but I think that's those are three great ones. great ones. great ones. I know. Should be back here in like 30 years. years. years. Yeah. Sooner than that. Yeah. Soon that you'll be back here. Yeah. Update. Update. Update. Exactly. We'll do an update in a few years. Um before I ask the final question, Chloe, I want to acknowledge you because for me, I'm always trying to find people to bring on here who can share unique experiences of life.

And you have such a unique experience. And I just think you have a fascinating mindset. The way you analyze how you live your life. you. I know you're laughing, but for me it's like most people never have access to that this type of information. And I haven't seen you share this much on how you think about pressure, performance, overcoming challenges, therapy, healing, psychology all in one place. Maybe there's a little different things around, but so for me, this is like a master class of understanding your mindset of how to live the best life possible for yourself.

Does that make sense? For me, it does. Okay. Yeah, for me it does. No, for me it does, but it's like I've been asking these questions for people for 13 years, I guess, every week. So, week. So, week. So, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think it's fascinating because you and from this conversation, I've learned that learned that learned that for most of your life, you were driven to accomplish and achieve at the highest level. And in some ways it came easily for you because you were talented, but it became easily because you were obsessed with like going allin and visualizing and rehearsing in your mind and seeing an idea and saying all night how can I make this happen tomorrow and then doing it and acting acting on that for 20 years essentially almost you know.

So for me that level of commitment to accomplishing a dream is really inspiring. But then also on the other side saying okay I also recognize there are certain parts of me that I don't like right now or maybe I didn't like a couple years ago. And so how can I become better at those things as well? How can I use what I learned in sports for myself? I think that's beautiful. How can I be a better human, a better friend, a better partner? all these different things, a better daughter, you know, it's like, and how can you show up for yourself first at this season?

So, I think it's really beautiful. I think it's inspiring and I hope a lot of people get value from your lessons. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And I just think again, this is a master class that you've shared here on the School of Greatness. So, I'm grateful and I acknowledge you for opening up and for being real and authentic and um showing us a little bit more behind the way you think because I think a lot of people it will help them understand their own life by understanding yours.

So, So, So, I hope so. Yeah. And hopefully we get you back on in a few years and you can give us more lessons about healing and therapy and all the things you're learning. Yeah. I love yapping. Perfect. Perfect. Perfect. Just like your dad, right? Just like your your your dad. Exactly. But I'm like introverted. I know. I know. I know. But I like yapping like a shy yapper. I like it. I like a shy yapper. Hashtag shy yapping. Um, final question, Chloe. What is your definition of greatness?

My definition of greatness? Me, myself, and I. So funny. Me, myself, and I. I think Yeah, I'm great. I bet I deserve it, you know, and I think we all do. Yeah. I think there's no greater feeling than than than accomplishing everything you've wanted and more. But then it's funny because I want more than that, too. You know, there's so many other things I want to be great at. So, I feel like definition of greatness to me today is going to shift and I'm going to be achieving like the best version of myself, you know, in like whatever journey I decide to go on next.

But I'm pretty good, right? I'm gonna sit in my greatness for a couple maybe a little bit more and then I'll think about the next definition. definition. definition. I love it. But yeah, everyone's great. You're great. great. great. Yeah. Awesome. Chloe, thank you so much for being here. Appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Most people really believe they're going to change your lives with their own personal will. It will make you great to a certain extent, but you will plateau at a certain level.

You'll be dissatisfied. You'll be bored. You'll be frustrated. There's something wrong with you. Name a legend who didn't have a legendary.