LAYLA TAYLOR EXCLUSIVE: The Truth She Kept Hidden Her Entire Life

Ila, you came here today because there's Ila, you came here today because there's something you haven't shared. something you haven't shared. something you haven't shared. >> It's something that I have known since I >> It's something that I have known since I >> It's something that I have known since I was little. It's just something that I was little. It's just something that I was little. It's just something that I honestly didn't really know how to honestly didn't really know how to honestly didn't really know how to formally address for a long period of my formally address for a long period of my formally address for a long period of my life. We're only on this earth for life. We're only on this earth for life. We're only on this earth for however long we are here. And I'll be however long we are here. And I'll be however long we are here. And I'll be damned if I'm not able to be fully who I damned if I'm not able to be fully who I damned if I'm not able to be fully who I am. Hey everyone, welcome back to OnPurpose. Hey everyone, welcome back to OnPurpose. My guest today is Leila Taylor. Many of My guest today is Leila Taylor. Many of My guest today is Leila Taylor. Many of you know Ila from her show, The Secret you know Ila from her show, The Secret you know Ila from her show, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, where she shared Lives of Mormon Wives, where she shared Lives of Mormon Wives, where she shared her journey through motherhood, divorce, her journey through motherhood, divorce, her journey through motherhood, divorce, dating, and navigating faith in Utah. dating, and navigating faith in Utah. dating, and navigating faith in Utah. Today, she's opening up about Today, she's opening up about Today, she's opening up about experiences she hasn't fully shared experiences she hasn't fully shared experiences she hasn't fully shared before and the journey that brought her before and the journey that brought her before and the journey that brought her into a new chapter today. Please welcome into a new chapter today. Please welcome into a new chapter today. Please welcome Ila to OnPurpose. Leila Taylor, welcome Ila to OnPurpose. Leila Taylor, welcome Ila to OnPurpose. Leila Taylor, welcome to OnPurpose. to OnPurpose. to OnPurpose. >> Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be >> Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be >> Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here. here. here. >> I am so grateful that you're here today. >> I am so grateful that you're here today. >> I am so grateful that you're here today. People know your work. They know parts People know your work. They know parts People know your work. They know parts of your story. They see you on TV. But of your story. They see you on TV. But of your story. They see you on TV. But you came here today because there's you came here today because there's you came here today because there's something you haven't shared before. something you haven't shared before. something you haven't shared before. >> And I wanted to give you this space and >> And I wanted to give you this space and >> And I wanted to give you this space and ask you what's on your heart. ask you what's on your heart. ask you what's on your heart. >> Yeah. It's just something that I >> Yeah. It's just something that I >> Yeah. It's just something that I honestly didn't really know how to honestly didn't really know how to honestly didn't really know how to formally address for a long period of my formally address for a long period of my formally address for a long period of my life. Um, and that it's I'm gay and I'm life. Um, and that it's I'm gay and I'm life. Um, and that it's I'm gay and I'm by and date women and men. And it's just by and date women and men. And it's just by and date women and men. And it's just I think growing up I didn't fit in for a I think growing up I didn't fit in for a I think growing up I didn't fit in for a lot of reasons in my childhood. I grew lot of reasons in my childhood. I grew lot of reasons in my childhood. I grew up in a very predominantly white area up in a very predominantly white area up in a very predominantly white area and being a little black girl, I already and being a little black girl, I already and being a little black girl, I already stood out so much to my peers and kind stood out so much to my peers and kind stood out so much to my peers and kind of took that on a lot more than I feel of took that on a lot more than I feel of took that on a lot more than I feel like I realized. And I always kind of like I realized. And I always kind of like I realized. And I always kind of had these thoughts and I kind of laugh had these thoughts and I kind of laugh had these thoughts and I kind of laugh about it now cuz I would be watching about it now cuz I would be watching about it now cuz I would be watching shows like Pretty Little Liars and I shows like Pretty Little Liars and I shows like Pretty Little Liars and I would watch like Shane Mitchell kissing would watch like Shane Mitchell kissing would watch like Shane Mitchell kissing a girl. I was like wait like why is that a girl. I was like wait like why is that a girl. I was like wait like why is that like hot? But I didn't know like what like hot? But I didn't know like what like hot? But I didn't know like what those feelings were cuz I didn't have those feelings were cuz I didn't have those feelings were cuz I didn't have queer representation around me of like I queer representation around me of like I queer representation around me of like I could look at it and be like, "Okay, could look at it and be like, "Okay, could look at it and be like, "Okay, like this is normal." And it wasn't like this is normal." And it wasn't like this is normal." And it wasn't necessarily that I had parents or I was necessarily that I had parents or I was necessarily that I had parents or I was I was Mormon at one point, but I didn't I was Mormon at one point, but I didn't I was Mormon at one point, but I didn't necessarily have that pressure to not do necessarily have that pressure to not do necessarily have that pressure to not do that. I just didn't have people around that. I just didn't have people around that. I just didn't have people around me that modeled that. And it's just it's me that modeled that. And it's just it's me that modeled that. And it's just it's just something that I for a long time just something that I for a long time just something that I for a long time didn't know if it was just didn't know if it was just didn't know if it was just a phase or something that you know maybe a phase or something that you know maybe a phase or something that you know maybe I'm just curious and I would just kind I'm just curious and I would just kind I'm just curious and I would just kind of underplay it for a long period of my of underplay it for a long period of my of underplay it for a long period of my life. And I don't know I just feel like life. And I don't know I just feel like life. And I don't know I just feel like I'm finally in the era that I I'm over I'm finally in the era that I I'm over I'm finally in the era that I I'm over not being truly myself and I'm over not not being truly myself and I'm over not not being truly myself and I'm over not showing every part of Ila to the world. showing every part of Ila to the world. showing every part of Ila to the world. And yeah, I'm very proud to be by and And yeah, I'm very proud to be by and And yeah, I'm very proud to be by and I'm very proud now to be out. And I hope I'm very proud now to be out. And I hope I'm very proud now to be out. And I hope that if anyone's in a situation that I that if anyone's in a situation that I that if anyone's in a situation that I am as well that for a long time there, I am as well that for a long time there, I am as well that for a long time there, I didn't know if I could come out and didn't know if I could come out and didn't know if I could come out and truly be myself, I hope that they can truly be myself, I hope that they can truly be myself, I hope that they can feel safe to do so and proud to do so. feel safe to do so and proud to do so. feel safe to do so and proud to do so. >> First of all, I'm so happy for you. >> First of all, I'm so happy for you. >> First of all, I'm so happy for you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I can't imagine how good it feels to >> I can't imagine how good it feels to >> I can't imagine how good it feels to >> share it out into the world. >> share it out into the world. >> share it out into the world. This is the first time you've talked This is the first time you've talked This is the first time you've talked about it publicly, right? about it publicly, right? about it publicly, right? >> Yeah. I haven't addressed it yet. >> Yeah. I haven't addressed it yet. >> Yeah. I haven't addressed it yet. >> Why was now the right time for Ila to >> Why was now the right time for Ila to >> Why was now the right time for Ila to share this? share this? share this? >> Honestly, I went through a breakup at >> Honestly, I went through a breakup at >> Honestly, I went through a breakup at the beginning of this year and I feel the beginning of this year and I feel the beginning of this year and I feel like for just a long period of my life, like for just a long period of my life, like for just a long period of my life, I was constantly living my life for I was constantly living my life for I was constantly living my life for other people, whether if that was, you other people, whether if that was, you other people, whether if that was, you know, being a mom or I was in a marriage know, being a mom or I was in a marriage know, being a mom or I was in a marriage at one point. I was married and I just at one point. I was married and I just at one point. I was married and I just feel like I was always fulfilling other feel like I was always fulfilling other feel like I was always fulfilling other people around me. And it honestly just people around me. And it honestly just people around me. And it honestly just caused me to never really focus on caused me to never really focus on caused me to never really focus on myself and never be able to like really myself and never be able to like really myself and never be able to like really just sit alone with who I am as a person just sit alone with who I am as a person just sit alone with who I am as a person and my feelings and kind of just really and my feelings and kind of just really and my feelings and kind of just really get to the root of why I felt certain get to the root of why I felt certain get to the root of why I felt certain ways. And I just kind of always just ways. And I just kind of always just ways. And I just kind of always just pushed it aside. And again, just I was pushed it aside. And again, just I was pushed it aside. And again, just I was just like, "Oh, this is just like a just like, "Oh, this is just like a just like, "Oh, this is just like a phase. Like you're not actually phase. Like you're not actually phase. Like you're not actually attracted to girls. Like you're just attracted to girls. Like you're just attracted to girls. Like you're just you're drunk at a party and you kissed a you're drunk at a party and you kissed a you're drunk at a party and you kissed a girl. Like it's no big deal. Like you're girl. Like it's no big deal. Like you're girl. Like it's no big deal. Like you're not you're not gay. Like just ignore not you're not gay. Like just ignore not you're not gay. Like just ignore that." And I just feel like I just never that." And I just feel like I just never that." And I just feel like I just never was in a place that I feel like I could was in a place that I feel like I could was in a place that I feel like I could truly authentically focus on it. And I truly authentically focus on it. And I truly authentically focus on it. And I think honestly that breakup was like a think honestly that breakup was like a think honestly that breakup was like a blessing in disguise cuz I feel like now blessing in disguise cuz I feel like now blessing in disguise cuz I feel like now I've been fully able to just focus on I've been fully able to just focus on I've been fully able to just focus on Leila and yeah, just focus on who I Leila and yeah, just focus on who I Leila and yeah, just focus on who I truly am. truly am. truly am. >> How does it feel to actually say it out >> How does it feel to actually say it out >> How does it feel to actually say it out loud and get it off your chest? loud and get it off your chest? loud and get it off your chest? >> Good. Honestly, I just feel like it's >> Good. Honestly, I just feel like it's >> Good. Honestly, I just feel like it's like, girl, this should have happened like, girl, this should have happened like, girl, this should have happened forever ago. I don't know why for so forever ago. I don't know why for so forever ago. I don't know why for so long I was so afraid, but it I mean long I was so afraid, but it I mean long I was so afraid, but it I mean there are people that are probably going there are people that are probably going there are people that are probably going to judge me and there's people that to judge me and there's people that to judge me and there's people that aren't going to be supportive of it. And aren't going to be supportive of it. And aren't going to be supportive of it. And luckily for me, like I'm in a position luckily for me, like I'm in a position luckily for me, like I'm in a position that I'm surrounded by so much love and that I'm surrounded by so much love and that I'm surrounded by so much love and so much support. And I know that I so much support. And I know that I so much support. And I know that I haven't told a lot of people around me haven't told a lot of people around me haven't told a lot of people around me that I am. So this is honestly they're that I am. So this is honestly they're that I am. So this is honestly they're going to be finding out for themselves going to be finding out for themselves going to be finding out for themselves on this podcast. And I know that they're on this podcast. And I know that they're on this podcast. And I know that they're going to be nothing but supportive going to be nothing but supportive going to be nothing but supportive though. And I know that's not the case though. And I know that's not the case though. And I know that's not the case for everybody. And I'm so grateful that for everybody. And I'm so grateful that for everybody. And I'm so grateful that I am in the position that I am that I I am in the position that I am that I I am in the position that I am that I can truly be myself and feel the love can truly be myself and feel the love can truly be myself and feel the love and support. And I just wish that was and support. And I just wish that was and support. And I just wish that was the same for like everyone. the same for like everyone. the same for like everyone. >> Yeah, you're so right. Who Who was the >> Yeah, you're so right. Who Who was the >> Yeah, you're so right. Who Who was the first person you told? first person you told? first person you told? >> My best friend Kate. Okay. >> My best friend Kate. Okay. >> My best friend Kate. Okay. >> Yeah. We were actually on a trip >> Yeah. We were actually on a trip >> Yeah. We were actually on a trip together for Miami Swim Week and I was together for Miami Swim Week and I was together for Miami Swim Week and I was getting a text from somebody and she's getting a text from somebody and she's getting a text from somebody and she's like, "Who's who's this person like like, "Who's who's this person like like, "Who's who's this person like texting you and calling all the time?" texting you and calling all the time?" texting you and calling all the time?" And I was like, "Oh, like it's no one." And I was like, "Oh, like it's no one." And I was like, "Oh, like it's no one." At first, she thought it was my ex and I At first, she thought it was my ex and I At first, she thought it was my ex and I was like, "No, like no, I I I'm don't was like, "No, like no, I I I'm don't was like, "No, like no, I I I'm don't circle back with exes. It's not an ex." circle back with exes. It's not an ex." circle back with exes. It's not an ex." But I was like and I finally was like, But I was like and I finally was like, But I was like and I finally was like, "Hey, like Kate, I have to I have to "Hey, like Kate, I have to I have to "Hey, like Kate, I have to I have to tell you like it's a girl. Like I'm I'm tell you like it's a girl. Like I'm I'm tell you like it's a girl. Like I'm I'm by she's like, "Oh my gosh, like I'm so by she's like, "Oh my gosh, like I'm so by she's like, "Oh my gosh, like I'm so excited for you. Like that's amazing." excited for you. Like that's amazing." excited for you. Like that's amazing." So, I she was obviously the best person So, I she was obviously the best person So, I she was obviously the best person for me to tell first because she's just for me to tell first because she's just for me to tell first because she's just she just knows me so well and yeah, she just knows me so well and yeah, she just knows me so well and yeah, she's very supportive. she's very supportive. she's very supportive. >> It must be so relieving when the first >> It must be so relieving when the first >> It must be so relieving when the first person you tell actually sees you. person you tell actually sees you. person you tell actually sees you. >> Yeah. Yeah. I feel like >> Yeah. Yeah. I feel like >> Yeah. Yeah. I feel like >> she's just like, "Okay, awesome." Like, >> she's just like, "Okay, awesome." Like, >> she's just like, "Okay, awesome." Like, "Cool." I don't know. I just feel like "Cool." I don't know. I just feel like "Cool." I don't know. I just feel like she didn't really like care. Not in a she didn't really like care. Not in a she didn't really like care. Not in a bad way, but she's like, "Okay, bad way, but she's like, "Okay, bad way, but she's like, "Okay, awesome." Like, "I'm glad that you know awesome." Like, "I'm glad that you know awesome." Like, "I'm glad that you know you're happy. That's all I care about." you're happy. That's all I care about." you're happy. That's all I care about." >> Yeah. Have you shared this with any of >> Yeah. Have you shared this with any of >> Yeah. Have you shared this with any of the other cast members of Secret Lives? the other cast members of Secret Lives? the other cast members of Secret Lives? >> No, we've been kind of not in a bad >> No, we've been kind of not in a bad >> No, we've been kind of not in a bad place, any of us girls. I know that place, any of us girls. I know that place, any of us girls. I know that there's some friendships that are like there's some friendships that are like there's some friendships that are like in different places than they have been in different places than they have been in different places than they have been in the past, but I think right now we've in the past, but I think right now we've in the past, but I think right now we've just been kind of a little separate just been kind of a little separate just been kind of a little separate since just, you know, going on that since just, you know, going on that since just, you know, going on that pause from filming and everything like pause from filming and everything like pause from filming and everything like that. So, I just haven't seen any of that. So, I just haven't seen any of that. So, I just haven't seen any of them in person. And I feel like me them in person. And I feel like me them in person. And I feel like me coming out, it's not really like a text coming out, it's not really like a text coming out, it's not really like a text of like, "Hey, I'm bye." Feel like I of like, "Hey, I'm bye." Feel like I of like, "Hey, I'm bye." Feel like I kind of want to see them in person to kind of want to see them in person to kind of want to see them in person to like let them know. So they might see like let them know. So they might see like let them know. So they might see this before and then I'll talk to them this before and then I'll talk to them this before and then I'll talk to them in person the next time I see them. But in person the next time I see them. But in person the next time I see them. But yeah, right now no one no one from the yeah, right now no one no one from the yeah, right now no one no one from the group knows. group knows. group knows. >> Wow. How do you hope they'll react or do >> Wow. How do you hope they'll react or do >> Wow. How do you hope they'll react or do you have no expectation? you have no expectation? you have no expectation? >> I think supportive. I don't think that >> I think supportive. I don't think that >> I think supportive. I don't think that anyone would not be. I think that I anyone would not be. I think that I anyone would not be. I think that I lucked out with like a cast that we all lucked out with like a cast that we all lucked out with like a cast that we all have our things and we're all supportive have our things and we're all supportive have our things and we're all supportive of each other regardless. of each other regardless. of each other regardless. >> That's actually amazing. >> That's actually amazing. >> That's actually amazing. >> It's awesome. I'm really I'm lucky for >> It's awesome. I'm really I'm lucky for >> It's awesome. I'm really I'm lucky for the group of girls that we have. the group of girls that we have. the group of girls that we have. >> Yeah, that's incredible. Tell me about >> Yeah, that's incredible. Tell me about >> Yeah, that's incredible. Tell me about the first time you've realized you were the first time you've realized you were the first time you've realized you were into both men and women. into both men and women. into both men and women. >> I feel like I can't like necessarily >> I feel like I can't like necessarily >> I feel like I can't like necessarily pinpoint those kind of like those pinpoint those kind of like those pinpoint those kind of like those memories that I said that I was like memories that I said that I was like memories that I said that I was like watching Pretty Little Liars and I was watching Pretty Little Liars and I was watching Pretty Little Liars and I was like okay like huh or just like you know like okay like huh or just like you know like okay like huh or just like you know again like I would have like drunk again like I would have like drunk again like I would have like drunk moments. I would like kiss a girl but I moments. I would like kiss a girl but I moments. I would like kiss a girl but I would get always just downplay it. But would get always just downplay it. But would get always just downplay it. But it wasn't until recently actually that it wasn't until recently actually that it wasn't until recently actually that the girl that I'm talking to right now the girl that I'm talking to right now the girl that I'm talking to right now DM'd me and then we met up and we hung DM'd me and then we met up and we hung DM'd me and then we met up and we hung out and it was just kind of like that out and it was just kind of like that out and it was just kind of like that first kiss of like it wasn't this wasn't first kiss of like it wasn't this wasn't first kiss of like it wasn't this wasn't like a drunk moment like this was me like a drunk moment like this was me like a drunk moment like this was me intentionally going into a moment intentionally going into a moment intentionally going into a moment knowing how I felt about women and the knowing how I felt about women and the knowing how I felt about women and the first time you know actively dating a first time you know actively dating a first time you know actively dating a woman that I was like okay like this is woman that I was like okay like this is woman that I was like okay like this is what I want to do also. So, I think it what I want to do also. So, I think it what I want to do also. So, I think it was like that moment that it wasn't just was like that moment that it wasn't just was like that moment that it wasn't just like a oo gotcha moment and like a this like a oo gotcha moment and like a this like a oo gotcha moment and like a this is where I want to be. is where I want to be. is where I want to be. >> Wait, did she just send you a DM hoping >> Wait, did she just send you a DM hoping >> Wait, did she just send you a DM hoping that you would that you would that you would >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I actually I liked one >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I actually I liked one >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I actually I liked one of her TikToks that it was like I don't of her TikToks that it was like I don't of her TikToks that it was like I don't even know what it was. I think it was even know what it was. I think it was even know what it was. I think it was just something it was a thirst trap or just something it was a thirst trap or just something it was a thirst trap or something and I like liked it and she something and I like liked it and she something and I like liked it and she ended up just sending me like eye emojis ended up just sending me like eye emojis ended up just sending me like eye emojis and I was like, "Hey." So, I don't know. and I was like, "Hey." So, I don't know. and I was like, "Hey." So, I don't know. She just went on a whim. She told me She just went on a whim. She told me She just went on a whim. She told me she's like, "I didn't know if you were she's like, "I didn't know if you were she's like, "I didn't know if you were cuz I feel like on my page you can't cuz I feel like on my page you can't cuz I feel like on my page you can't obviously I feel like no one would know obviously I feel like no one would know obviously I feel like no one would know that I am into girls. Obviously not that I am into girls. Obviously not that I am into girls. Obviously not until now." She just kind of went on a until now." She just kind of went on a until now." She just kind of went on a whim. Maybe like a gut feeling. And I'm whim. Maybe like a gut feeling. And I'm whim. Maybe like a gut feeling. And I'm Yeah, I'm really glad she did. So, Yeah, I'm really glad she did. So, Yeah, I'm really glad she did. So, >> wow. That's awesome. Wow. Look at you. >> wow. That's awesome. Wow. Look at you. >> wow. That's awesome. Wow. Look at you. That's like you you haven't even got out That's like you you haven't even got out That's like you you haven't even got out there yet. That's amazing. there yet. That's amazing. there yet. That's amazing. >> Did you talk about sexuality growing up? >> Did you talk about sexuality growing up? >> Did you talk about sexuality growing up? Like was that a conversation in your Like was that a conversation in your Like was that a conversation in your family in your home? family in your home? family in your home? >> No, not at all. I think honestly that's >> No, not at all. I think honestly that's >> No, not at all. I think honestly that's one of the reasons why I probably got one of the reasons why I probably got one of the reasons why I probably got pregnant at such young young age. I got pregnant at such young young age. I got pregnant at such young young age. I got pregnant when I was 19 and I feel like pregnant when I was 19 and I feel like pregnant when I was 19 and I feel like it wasn't necessarily something that it wasn't necessarily something that it wasn't necessarily something that they avoided cuz I feel like there was they avoided cuz I feel like there was they avoided cuz I feel like there was like some moments that they would make like some moments that they would make like some moments that they would make small little comments but they never small little comments but they never small little comments but they never really sat me down like ever had like a really sat me down like ever had like a really sat me down like ever had like a talk about anything so I kind of just talk about anything so I kind of just talk about anything so I kind of just figured out everything on my own. figured out everything on my own. figured out everything on my own. >> Wow. When you look back now at that time >> Wow. When you look back now at that time >> Wow. When you look back now at that time >> what do you wish little Ila had that was >> what do you wish little Ila had that was >> what do you wish little Ila had that was different? different? different? >> I think just a little bit more support. >> I think just a little bit more support. >> I think just a little bit more support. I think I spent a lot of my childhood I think I spent a lot of my childhood I think I spent a lot of my childhood hiding things from my parents cuz I was hiding things from my parents cuz I was hiding things from my parents cuz I was just really afraid of like their just really afraid of like their just really afraid of like their reactions. just even small small things reactions. just even small small things reactions. just even small small things like I lost my virginity when I was 15 like I lost my virginity when I was 15 like I lost my virginity when I was 15 and that was something my parents and that was something my parents and that was something my parents probably still to this day don't even probably still to this day don't even probably still to this day don't even know and I was very like terrified to know and I was very like terrified to know and I was very like terrified to tell them like little small details so tell them like little small details so tell them like little small details so even like these when I started to like even like these when I started to like even like these when I started to like have these feelings and have you know have these feelings and have you know have these feelings and have you know these thoughts I would have never gone these thoughts I would have never gone these thoughts I would have never gone to them in a million years and I think to them in a million years and I think to them in a million years and I think that's honestly probably why for such a that's honestly probably why for such a that's honestly probably why for such a long time I felt like I had to stay long time I felt like I had to stay long time I felt like I had to stay closeted cuz I just didn't have the closeted cuz I just didn't have the closeted cuz I just didn't have the support system around me that I wish you support system around me that I wish you support system around me that I wish you know as a child that I did have know as a child that I did have know as a child that I did have >> and was that around the same time as >> and was that around the same time as >> and was that around the same time as Mormonism came into your life as well. Mormonism came into your life as well. Mormonism came into your life as well. >> Yeah. So, I converted to the church when >> Yeah. So, I converted to the church when >> Yeah. So, I converted to the church when I was 16. I was 16. I was 16. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> What was it about losing your virginity >> What was it about losing your virginity >> What was it about losing your virginity at 15 and converting at 16? at 15 and converting at 16? at 15 and converting at 16? >> I feel like I kind of went through like >> I feel like I kind of went through like >> I feel like I kind of went through like a I don't even know, just like a phase a I don't even know, just like a phase a I don't even know, just like a phase that I was kind of rebelling a little that I was kind of rebelling a little that I was kind of rebelling a little bit from like probably like 14 to like bit from like probably like 14 to like bit from like probably like 14 to like right before I converted. And I don't right before I converted. And I don't right before I converted. And I don't know, it just kind of set me back on know, it just kind of set me back on know, it just kind of set me back on track for like a second. But I was still track for like a second. But I was still track for like a second. But I was still kind of doing I was still like sleeping kind of doing I was still like sleeping kind of doing I was still like sleeping with my boyfriends in high school and with my boyfriends in high school and with my boyfriends in high school and stuff like that. It almost just kind of stuff like that. It almost just kind of stuff like that. It almost just kind of gave me a little bit of like a moral gave me a little bit of like a moral gave me a little bit of like a moral compass I feel like I didn't necessarily compass I feel like I didn't necessarily compass I feel like I didn't necessarily have before. have before. have before. >> I can relate to some degree because I >> I can relate to some degree because I >> I can relate to some degree because I got deep into spirituality when I was 18 got deep into spirituality when I was 18 got deep into spirituality when I was 18 years old and I obviously went and lived years old and I obviously went and lived years old and I obviously went and lived as a monk after, but it became part of as a monk after, but it became part of as a monk after, but it became part of my life so young. my life so young. my life so young. >> I have such a love for the wisdom I >> I have such a love for the wisdom I >> I have such a love for the wisdom I learned and I have such a love for my learned and I have such a love for my learned and I have such a love for my teachers, but teachers, but teachers, but >> I'm not as much of a fan of the >> I'm not as much of a fan of the >> I'm not as much of a fan of the institution. institution. institution. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it's just a really interesting >> And it's just a really interesting >> And it's just a really interesting experience as I've got older and older experience as I've got older and older experience as I've got older and older and older. I'm older than you, but as and older. I'm older than you, but as and older. I'm older than you, but as I've got older and older and older from I've got older and older and older from I've got older and older and older from that stage, it's just I have such an that stage, it's just I have such an that stage, it's just I have such an interesting relationship at that time in interesting relationship at that time in interesting relationship at that time in my life. And I'm like, what what was it my life. And I'm like, what what was it my life. And I'm like, what what was it that you were seeking apart from that you were seeking apart from that you were seeking apart from rebellion? What were you seeking at that rebellion? What were you seeking at that rebellion? What were you seeking at that time that Mormonism met or or made you time that Mormonism met or or made you time that Mormonism met or or made you feel? feel? feel? >> I think for me, one of my biggest things >> I think for me, one of my biggest things >> I think for me, one of my biggest things just having a very messy childhood where just having a very messy childhood where just having a very messy childhood where I didn't have that family consistency I didn't have that family consistency I didn't have that family consistency that like a lot of families did have in that like a lot of families did have in that like a lot of families did have in the Mormon church. I feel like I spent a the Mormon church. I feel like I spent a the Mormon church. I feel like I spent a lot of times at my friends houses kind lot of times at my friends houses kind lot of times at my friends houses kind of avoiding what was going on at home. of avoiding what was going on at home. of avoiding what was going on at home. And I feel like a common theme I would And I feel like a common theme I would And I feel like a common theme I would notice between all of them was how notice between all of them was how notice between all of them was how strong their families seemed together. strong their families seemed together. strong their families seemed together. So I think just being 16 and being young So I think just being 16 and being young So I think just being 16 and being young and kind of optimistic about the world, and kind of optimistic about the world, and kind of optimistic about the world, I was like, "Hey, like I'm missing that I was like, "Hey, like I'm missing that I was like, "Hey, like I'm missing that one thing that would make me have a one thing that would make me have a one thing that would make me have a happy family one day, and that's being happy family one day, and that's being happy family one day, and that's being Mormon." So I just it was everyone Mormon." So I just it was everyone Mormon." So I just it was everyone around me is Mormon. I think 98% of my around me is Mormon. I think 98% of my around me is Mormon. I think 98% of my school was enrolled in seminary, which school was enrolled in seminary, which school was enrolled in seminary, which is like an hour block in your schedule is like an hour block in your schedule is like an hour block in your schedule that you can go and like learn more that you can go and like learn more that you can go and like learn more about the church. So, everyone around me about the church. So, everyone around me about the church. So, everyone around me is Mormon is like all that I knew. And I is Mormon is like all that I knew. And I is Mormon is like all that I knew. And I just thought that that was that was the just thought that that was that was the just thought that that was that was the way that you're supposed to live life. way that you're supposed to live life. way that you're supposed to live life. >> Yeah. When you look back on that, what >> Yeah. When you look back on that, what >> Yeah. When you look back on that, what what are the lessons that you feel have what are the lessons that you feel have what are the lessons that you feel have really improved your life, bettered your really improved your life, bettered your really improved your life, bettered your life, things that have stayed, and then life, things that have stayed, and then life, things that have stayed, and then the things that you're like, I need to the things that you're like, I need to the things that you're like, I need to unlearn that, need to leave that behind? unlearn that, need to leave that behind? unlearn that, need to leave that behind? >> I honestly I feel like I didn't really >> I honestly I feel like I didn't really >> I honestly I feel like I didn't really take a lot away from my experience being take a lot away from my experience being take a lot away from my experience being Mormon. I think I would go to sacrament Mormon. I think I would go to sacrament Mormon. I think I would go to sacrament meetings and I would try my best to like meetings and I would try my best to like meetings and I would try my best to like attend, but I just feel like my heart attend, but I just feel like my heart attend, but I just feel like my heart was never fully in it. I was really only was never fully in it. I was really only was never fully in it. I was really only just there to fit in and to just have just there to fit in and to just have just there to fit in and to just have one less thing that people would notice one less thing that people would notice one less thing that people would notice was different than my peers, you know, was different than my peers, you know, was different than my peers, you know, like already being black and like, you like already being black and like, you like already being black and like, you know, having these thoughts in the back know, having these thoughts in the back know, having these thoughts in the back of my head of like liking girls but not of my head of like liking girls but not of my head of like liking girls but not wanting to admit it. It was just like wanting to admit it. It was just like wanting to admit it. It was just like one more thing. And I was like, "Hey, if one more thing. And I was like, "Hey, if one more thing. And I was like, "Hey, if I check this box off, I'll fit in a I check this box off, I'll fit in a I check this box off, I'll fit in a little bit more with everyone around little bit more with everyone around little bit more with everyone around me." So, I honestly I don't feel like I me." So, I honestly I don't feel like I me." So, I honestly I don't feel like I really took a lot out of going to really took a lot out of going to really took a lot out of going to church. I truly would just show up to church. I truly would just show up to church. I truly would just show up to say that I was there. And yeah, like but say that I was there. And yeah, like but say that I was there. And yeah, like but it pulled me out of a really dark place. it pulled me out of a really dark place. it pulled me out of a really dark place. I was dealing with a lot of mental I was dealing with a lot of mental I was dealing with a lot of mental health issues in high school and health issues in high school and health issues in high school and obviously dealing with things at home. obviously dealing with things at home. obviously dealing with things at home. So it gave me a lot of purpose to kind So it gave me a lot of purpose to kind So it gave me a lot of purpose to kind of keep going and to have motivation of keep going and to have motivation of keep going and to have motivation that it was going to work out. So I am that it was going to work out. So I am that it was going to work out. So I am grateful for the church in a lot of ways grateful for the church in a lot of ways grateful for the church in a lot of ways just cuz it did pull me out of that dark just cuz it did pull me out of that dark just cuz it did pull me out of that dark place that I honestly don't think I place that I honestly don't think I place that I honestly don't think I could have pulled myself out of on my could have pulled myself out of on my could have pulled myself out of on my own. Obviously, there's a lot of things own. Obviously, there's a lot of things own. Obviously, there's a lot of things within the church that I mean, now being within the church that I mean, now being within the church that I mean, now being openly gay, like obviously that's not openly gay, like obviously that's not openly gay, like obviously that's not something that they're supportive of. something that they're supportive of. something that they're supportive of. So, there's a lot of things that like I So, there's a lot of things that like I So, there's a lot of things that like I don't love and I wasn't obviously aware don't love and I wasn't obviously aware don't love and I wasn't obviously aware of them at the time when I was little of them at the time when I was little of them at the time when I was little and converting. Um, but I'll always be and converting. Um, but I'll always be and converting. Um, but I'll always be grateful for the positive impact it had grateful for the positive impact it had grateful for the positive impact it had on me. on me. on me. >> It's such a natural experience when >> It's such a natural experience when >> It's such a natural experience when we're in our teenage years to just want we're in our teenage years to just want we're in our teenage years to just want to fit in. to fit in. to fit in. >> Yes. Exactly. just want to belong to a >> Yes. Exactly. just want to belong to a >> Yes. Exactly. just want to belong to a place where you don't feel different, place where you don't feel different, place where you don't feel different, you don't feel otherred, you don't feel you don't feel otherred, you don't feel you don't feel otherred, you don't feel >> like there's something hard to >> like there's something hard to >> like there's something hard to understand about you. And you mentioned understand about you. And you mentioned understand about you. And you mentioned then, I know you've talked about it on then, I know you've talked about it on then, I know you've talked about it on the show as well, being a black woman in the show as well, being a black woman in the show as well, being a black woman in predominantly white areas, white predominantly white areas, white predominantly white areas, white experiences. experiences. experiences. Talk to me about what that experience Talk to me about what that experience Talk to me about what that experience was like for you. Like what were the was like for you. Like what were the was like for you. Like what were the questions in your head or what were the questions in your head or what were the questions in your head or what were the things that you were struggling with, things that you were struggling with, things that you were struggling with, grappling with internally? I think I grappling with internally? I think I grappling with internally? I think I just didn't have a lot of black peers just didn't have a lot of black peers just didn't have a lot of black peers around me. So, it's just all I saw was around me. So, it's just all I saw was around me. So, it's just all I saw was just pretty blonde girls with blonde just pretty blonde girls with blonde just pretty blonde girls with blonde hair and blue eyes or green eyes. And I hair and blue eyes or green eyes. And I hair and blue eyes or green eyes. And I just think being young and very just think being young and very just think being young and very impressionable, that's what I honestly impressionable, that's what I honestly impressionable, that's what I honestly for a long time thought that that was for a long time thought that that was for a long time thought that that was the definition of beauty. I truly the definition of beauty. I truly the definition of beauty. I truly thought that that was what I needed to thought that that was what I needed to thought that that was what I needed to like look like to fit in and for guys to like look like to fit in and for guys to like look like to fit in and for guys to like me and all those things. And it was like me and all those things. And it was like me and all those things. And it was just so sad. I remember one of my like just so sad. I remember one of my like just so sad. I remember one of my like worst experiences in high school is one worst experiences in high school is one worst experiences in high school is one night I actually attempted to bleach my night I actually attempted to bleach my night I actually attempted to bleach my skin, which is so sad skin, which is so sad skin, which is so sad >> that I even did that, but I just thought >> that I even did that, but I just thought >> that I even did that, but I just thought I had to do all these extremes just to I had to do all these extremes just to I had to do all these extremes just to fit in. And I just wish that someone fit in. And I just wish that someone fit in. And I just wish that someone would have just told me that I was would have just told me that I was would have just told me that I was pretty and that I was worthy regardless pretty and that I was worthy regardless pretty and that I was worthy regardless of what color my skin was. And just of what color my skin was. And just of what color my skin was. And just because I don't look like people around because I don't look like people around because I don't look like people around me doesn't mean that I'm any less than me doesn't mean that I'm any less than me doesn't mean that I'm any less than them. Honestly, no. But being a mom, I them. Honestly, no. But being a mom, I them. Honestly, no. But being a mom, I feel like having little boys of my own feel like having little boys of my own feel like having little boys of my own that look up to me, I'll make sure that that look up to me, I'll make sure that that look up to me, I'll make sure that they have those affirmations about they have those affirmations about they have those affirmations about themselves that like I wasn't taught. themselves that like I wasn't taught. themselves that like I wasn't taught. And it's just honestly taught me how to And it's just honestly taught me how to And it's just honestly taught me how to be a better mom. be a better mom. be a better mom. >> Wow. Talk to me about the process of >> Wow. Talk to me about the process of >> Wow. Talk to me about the process of even trying to bleach your skin. Like even trying to bleach your skin. Like even trying to bleach your skin. Like how did that how did that how did that >> even come about? >> even come about? >> even come about? >> I just again me just being little. I was >> I just again me just being little. I was >> I just again me just being little. I was like 10. I thought that if I drew a bath like 10. I thought that if I drew a bath like 10. I thought that if I drew a bath and I put a bunch of bleach in it and and I put a bunch of bleach in it and and I put a bunch of bleach in it and then I sat in the bath and scrubbed, it then I sat in the bath and scrubbed, it then I sat in the bath and scrubbed, it would like cause my skin to lighten. I would like cause my skin to lighten. I would like cause my skin to lighten. I just think I I was just very young. I just think I I was just very young. I just think I I was just very young. I didn't know how that would work, but didn't know how that would work, but didn't know how that would work, but just anything I could possibly do to just anything I could possibly do to just anything I could possibly do to like fit in, I wanted to try to do. I like fit in, I wanted to try to do. I like fit in, I wanted to try to do. I mean, even just like my hair, I went on mean, even just like my hair, I went on mean, even just like my hair, I went on to this on my show of me kind of just to this on my show of me kind of just to this on my show of me kind of just finally like owning me being black and finally like owning me being black and finally like owning me being black and experimenting with my hair, but my whole experimenting with my hair, but my whole experimenting with my hair, but my whole entire life growing up, my mom taught me entire life growing up, my mom taught me entire life growing up, my mom taught me that my curly hair was just hard to that my curly hair was just hard to that my curly hair was just hard to manage for her. So, the second that she manage for her. So, the second that she manage for her. So, the second that she could, she started straightening my could, she started straightening my could, she started straightening my hair, and that's all I knew for a long hair, and that's all I knew for a long hair, and that's all I knew for a long time was just, okay, just straighten time was just, okay, just straighten time was just, okay, just straighten your hair. Like, don't if it starts to your hair. Like, don't if it starts to your hair. Like, don't if it starts to get curly, like straighten it really get curly, like straighten it really get curly, like straighten it really quick. again like you don't want people quick. again like you don't want people quick. again like you don't want people to know that your hair is like actually to know that your hair is like actually to know that your hair is like actually naturally curly and has texture and it's naturally curly and has texture and it's naturally curly and has texture and it's something that I hid for a long time. So something that I hid for a long time. So something that I hid for a long time. So I just think any part of myself that I just think any part of myself that I just think any part of myself that would show that I was black I was so would show that I was black I was so would show that I was black I was so afraid to and that breaks my heart to afraid to and that breaks my heart to afraid to and that breaks my heart to say but I think it's caused me to do a say but I think it's caused me to do a say but I think it's caused me to do a complete 180 now being even though it complete 180 now being even though it complete 180 now being even though it did take me 25 years to get to this did take me 25 years to get to this did take me 25 years to get to this point that I'm so incredibly proud to be point that I'm so incredibly proud to be point that I'm so incredibly proud to be black and to represent a huge community black and to represent a huge community black and to represent a huge community of the world on the show. I feel like of the world on the show. I feel like of the world on the show. I feel like I'm in such a unique position being the I'm in such a unique position being the I'm in such a unique position being the only black cast member and I'm just only black cast member and I'm just only black cast member and I'm just really really proud to be able to really really proud to be able to really really proud to be able to represent a lot of people. represent a lot of people. represent a lot of people. >> Talk to me about that journey from was >> Talk to me about that journey from was >> Talk to me about that journey from was it a sense of shame? Was it or was it it a sense of shame? Was it or was it it a sense of shame? Was it or was it just a sense of feeling otherred and just a sense of feeling otherred and just a sense of feeling otherred and different different different >> and then how do you even get from going >> and then how do you even get from going >> and then how do you even get from going there to actually developing a sense of there to actually developing a sense of there to actually developing a sense of as you just so beautifully said a sense as you just so beautifully said a sense as you just so beautifully said a sense of pride a sense of representation a of pride a sense of representation a of pride a sense of representation a sense of I actually am standing for sense of I actually am standing for sense of I actually am standing for something and that's more important than something and that's more important than something and that's more important than fitting in. Talk to me about that fitting in. Talk to me about that fitting in. Talk to me about that journey that you've been on. journey that you've been on. journey that you've been on. >> I mean, it was hard. I think again, I >> I mean, it was hard. I think again, I >> I mean, it was hard. I think again, I would just shy away from anything that would just shy away from anything that would just shy away from anything that made me feel different. And I honestly made me feel different. And I honestly made me feel different. And I honestly think the biggest shift for me was think the biggest shift for me was think the biggest shift for me was having my own kids cuz they're a quarter having my own kids cuz they're a quarter having my own kids cuz they're a quarter black. But either way, they're still black. But either way, they're still black. But either way, they're still black. And I don't want them to feel the black. And I don't want them to feel the black. And I don't want them to feel the things that I felt. And just seeing them things that I felt. And just seeing them things that I felt. And just seeing them and, you know, seeing how beautiful they and, you know, seeing how beautiful they and, you know, seeing how beautiful they are and, you know, I want them to be are and, you know, I want them to be are and, you know, I want them to be proud of themselves and proud of every proud of themselves and proud of every proud of themselves and proud of every single part of themselves. And I can't single part of themselves. And I can't single part of themselves. And I can't do that if I'm not proud of me. And I do that if I'm not proud of me. And I do that if I'm not proud of me. And I think that was where the big shift for think that was where the big shift for think that was where the big shift for me happened. And yeah, I mean, it was a me happened. And yeah, I mean, it was a me happened. And yeah, I mean, it was a hard thing. I remember the first time I hard thing. I remember the first time I hard thing. I remember the first time I wore a wig, I was like, "Oh my, take it wore a wig, I was like, "Oh my, take it wore a wig, I was like, "Oh my, take it off. Like, I hate this." I just, it felt off. Like, I hate this." I just, it felt off. Like, I hate this." I just, it felt so foreign to me. But I think the more so foreign to me. But I think the more so foreign to me. But I think the more I've been doing it and the more I've I've been doing it and the more I've I've been doing it and the more I've just been fully just loving myself. I just been fully just loving myself. I just been fully just loving myself. I like love it and I love, you know, just like love it and I love, you know, just like love it and I love, you know, just owning me fully. I love hearing about owning me fully. I love hearing about owning me fully. I love hearing about how your kids have inspired you to how your kids have inspired you to how your kids have inspired you to >> to want to stand on your own two feet >> to want to stand on your own two feet >> to want to stand on your own two feet and really represent who you want to be and really represent who you want to be and really represent who you want to be and what you believe in and for them to and what you believe in and for them to and what you believe in and for them to experience that and it's fascinating how experience that and it's fascinating how experience that and it's fascinating how when you're caring for a little person, when you're caring for a little person, when you're caring for a little person, there's almost like all of these lessons there's almost like all of these lessons there's almost like all of these lessons and reflections that almost make sense and reflections that almost make sense and reflections that almost make sense almost immediately. almost immediately. almost immediately. >> I feel like it just honestly alters the >> I feel like it just honestly alters the >> I feel like it just honestly alters the way you just handle life and you go way you just handle life and you go way you just handle life and you go forward and just Yeah, it changes the forward and just Yeah, it changes the forward and just Yeah, it changes the way you think about a lot of things. You way you think about a lot of things. You way you think about a lot of things. You got pregnant at 19. got pregnant at 19. got pregnant at 19. >> What was your emotion like when you >> What was your emotion like when you >> What was your emotion like when you first find out? first find out? first find out? >> Oh, terrified. I actually have kind of >> Oh, terrified. I actually have kind of >> Oh, terrified. I actually have kind of like It's funny now in the moment. It like It's funny now in the moment. It like It's funny now in the moment. It was not funny. I was obviously not being was not funny. I was obviously not being was not funny. I was obviously not being safe with my boyfriend now or ex-husband safe with my boyfriend now or ex-husband safe with my boyfriend now or ex-husband now. Um, and I knew what, you know, now. Um, and I knew what, you know, now. Um, and I knew what, you know, would potentially happen if we weren't would potentially happen if we weren't would potentially happen if we weren't being, you know, safe. But I didn't being, you know, safe. But I didn't being, you know, safe. But I didn't think it was a possibility that I would think it was a possibility that I would think it was a possibility that I would actually be pregnant. And I went to an actually be pregnant. And I went to an actually be pregnant. And I went to an urgent care because I thought I had some urgent care because I thought I had some urgent care because I thought I had some type of weird stomach bug and they're type of weird stomach bug and they're type of weird stomach bug and they're like, "Is there a possibility that like, "Is there a possibility that like, "Is there a possibility that you're pregnant?" I was like, "No, you're pregnant?" I was like, "No, you're pregnant?" I was like, "No, there's there's like literally no way there's there's like literally no way there's there's like literally no way I'm pregnant." Like, "No, no, that I'm pregnant." Like, "No, no, that I'm pregnant." Like, "No, no, that wouldn't happen." And they ended up wouldn't happen." And they ended up wouldn't happen." And they ended up testing me. That's how I found out was testing me. That's how I found out was testing me. That's how I found out was in an urgent care on my own by myself in in an urgent care on my own by myself in in an urgent care on my own by myself in Provo, Utah. And it was the most Provo, Utah. And it was the most Provo, Utah. And it was the most terrifying day of my life at that point. terrifying day of my life at that point. terrifying day of my life at that point. I didn't have a lot of family support. I I didn't have a lot of family support. I I didn't have a lot of family support. I was kind of not isolated in Utah, but my was kind of not isolated in Utah, but my was kind of not isolated in Utah, but my boyfriend at the time was like all I boyfriend at the time was like all I boyfriend at the time was like all I really like had. So when I found out I really like had. So when I found out I really like had. So when I found out I was like, "Okay, like I don't know what was like, "Okay, like I don't know what was like, "Okay, like I don't know what I'm going to do at that point." Like I I'm going to do at that point." Like I I'm going to do at that point." Like I didn't know if like I should move didn't know if like I should move didn't know if like I should move forward with pregnancy. I don't know if forward with pregnancy. I don't know if forward with pregnancy. I don't know if I should put the baby up for adoption. I I should put the baby up for adoption. I I should put the baby up for adoption. I didn't know if I should marry this guy, didn't know if I should marry this guy, didn't know if I should marry this guy, date this. I didn't know what to do. I date this. I didn't know what to do. I date this. I didn't know what to do. I think I had so many questions in my head think I had so many questions in my head think I had so many questions in my head and didn't know how to proceed. But I and didn't know how to proceed. But I and didn't know how to proceed. But I they changed my life, both my kids, for they changed my life, both my kids, for they changed my life, both my kids, for the better. And I'm so so grateful to be the better. And I'm so so grateful to be the better. And I'm so so grateful to be their mom. But it's definitely a their mom. But it's definitely a their mom. But it's definitely a terrifying experience to get pregnant terrifying experience to get pregnant terrifying experience to get pregnant when you don't really have the support when you don't really have the support when you don't really have the support around you at such like an young age. around you at such like an young age. around you at such like an young age. How did you decide that marriage was the How did you decide that marriage was the How did you decide that marriage was the option and not to actually open yourself option and not to actually open yourself option and not to actually open yourself up to other experiences or explore? up to other experiences or explore? up to other experiences or explore? >> In my head, I felt like I almost messed >> In my head, I felt like I almost messed >> In my head, I felt like I almost messed up some steps by getting pregnant before up some steps by getting pregnant before up some steps by getting pregnant before we were married that I was like, "Hey, we were married that I was like, "Hey, we were married that I was like, "Hey, at least like let me give my family like at least like let me give my family like at least like let me give my family like a chance of us being together." I think a chance of us being together." I think a chance of us being together." I think coming from a broken household and coming from a broken household and coming from a broken household and experiencing divorce and kind of the experiencing divorce and kind of the experiencing divorce and kind of the very toxic dynamic my parents had very toxic dynamic my parents had very toxic dynamic my parents had growing up with each other, I wanted the growing up with each other, I wanted the growing up with each other, I wanted the opposite of that for my kids. And I opposite of that for my kids. And I opposite of that for my kids. And I think just being so terrified of being a think just being so terrified of being a think just being so terrified of being a single mom, I was like, "Okay, like I I single mom, I was like, "Okay, like I I single mom, I was like, "Okay, like I I have to marry him." And now I'm a single have to marry him." And now I'm a single have to marry him." And now I'm a single mom. So obviously that didn't, you know, mom. So obviously that didn't, you know, mom. So obviously that didn't, you know, pan out exactly how I was envisioning pan out exactly how I was envisioning pan out exactly how I was envisioning it, too. But I'm still happy that we it, too. But I'm still happy that we it, too. But I'm still happy that we gave it a shot. I think that obviously, gave it a shot. I think that obviously, gave it a shot. I think that obviously, you know, divorce isn't easy and it's you know, divorce isn't easy and it's you know, divorce isn't easy and it's not fun. Um, but if we wouldn't have not fun. Um, but if we wouldn't have not fun. Um, but if we wouldn't have gotten married, I wouldn't have had my gotten married, I wouldn't have had my gotten married, I wouldn't have had my second baby. So I think everything second baby. So I think everything second baby. So I think everything happens for a reason. happens for a reason. happens for a reason. >> Big news. Juny just launched at Kroger >> Big news. 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So head to drinkjuny.com/croger head to drinkjuny.com/croger head to drinkjuny.com/croger to claim your free can in store so you to claim your free can in store so you to claim your free can in store so you can feel better and live better. It can feel better and live better. It can feel better and live better. It feels like you've lived so much life. feels like you've lived so much life. feels like you've lived so much life. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> In like such a short amount of time. >> In like such a short amount of time. >> In like such a short amount of time. >> Whether it's conversion, whether it's >> Whether it's conversion, whether it's >> Whether it's conversion, whether it's becoming a mom, whether it's becoming a mom, whether it's becoming a mom, whether it's >> moving from dating to marriage. Like >> moving from dating to marriage. Like >> moving from dating to marriage. Like there's so many. I mean, there's so many. I mean, there's so many. I mean, >> when you look back on it now, do you >> when you look back on it now, do you >> when you look back on it now, do you kind of go, God, how did I even do all kind of go, God, how did I even do all kind of go, God, how did I even do all of that? of that? of that? >> Oh yeah. Sometimes I'm like, I don't >> Oh yeah. Sometimes I'm like, I don't >> Oh yeah. Sometimes I'm like, I don't know how I'm still standing. But I think know how I'm still standing. But I think know how I'm still standing. But I think it made me who I am. I wouldn't take it made me who I am. I wouldn't take it made me who I am. I wouldn't take back anything that I've experienced in back anything that I've experienced in back anything that I've experienced in my life. I feel like truly I've been put my life. I feel like truly I've been put my life. I feel like truly I've been put through those challenges to be able to through those challenges to be able to through those challenges to be able to help other people. I say this all the help other people. I say this all the help other people. I say this all the time, but I feel like having a platform, time, but I feel like having a platform, time, but I feel like having a platform, you're put in a position that you can you're put in a position that you can you're put in a position that you can use your platform for good or bad. And use your platform for good or bad. And use your platform for good or bad. And truly, if I'm able to just help one truly, if I'm able to just help one truly, if I'm able to just help one person by sharing my story, I feel like person by sharing my story, I feel like person by sharing my story, I feel like that's why I do what I do. And yeah, I'm that's why I do what I do. And yeah, I'm that's why I do what I do. And yeah, I'm just everything has led me to where I am just everything has led me to where I am just everything has led me to where I am today. And I wouldn't change a thing. today. And I wouldn't change a thing. today. And I wouldn't change a thing. >> Yeah. You've said that at one point your >> Yeah. You've said that at one point your >> Yeah. You've said that at one point your marriage became manipulative. Yeah. marriage became manipulative. Yeah. marriage became manipulative. Yeah. >> Was that something that was always there >> Was that something that was always there >> Was that something that was always there and you kind of ignored it and didn't and you kind of ignored it and didn't and you kind of ignored it and didn't notice it or was it something that kind notice it or was it something that kind notice it or was it something that kind of came later on? of came later on? of came later on? >> No, unfortunately we had a very toxic >> No, unfortunately we had a very toxic >> No, unfortunately we had a very toxic relationship from the start. I just relationship from the start. I just relationship from the start. I just think that we never really knew each think that we never really knew each think that we never really knew each other on a deeper level. I think it was other on a deeper level. I think it was other on a deeper level. I think it was very surface level for a long time and very surface level for a long time and very surface level for a long time and then when we got pregnant it was just then when we got pregnant it was just then when we got pregnant it was just kind of we felt like we had to get kind of we felt like we had to get kind of we felt like we had to get married like I said. Um, and I just married like I said. Um, and I just married like I said. Um, and I just think we never had the proper foundation think we never had the proper foundation think we never had the proper foundation of a relationship to be able to, you of a relationship to be able to, you of a relationship to be able to, you know, withstand being married and, you know, withstand being married and, you know, withstand being married and, you know, taking on challenges that you know, taking on challenges that you know, taking on challenges that you obviously occur that occur when you're obviously occur that occur when you're obviously occur that occur when you're married. So, I think it was always married. So, I think it was always married. So, I think it was always there, but I was so scared of being a there, but I was so scared of being a there, but I was so scared of being a single mom that I was like, "Okay, this single mom that I was like, "Okay, this single mom that I was like, "Okay, this is this is what I have to do." Like, is this is what I have to do." Like, is this is what I have to do." Like, make your husband happy, you know, take make your husband happy, you know, take make your husband happy, you know, take care of the home, have the babies, take care of the home, have the babies, take care of the home, have the babies, take care of the babies. And that's kind of care of the babies. And that's kind of care of the babies. And that's kind of all that I was doing for that time that all that I was doing for that time that all that I was doing for that time that I was married. So, I just think I I was married. So, I just think I I was married. So, I just think I ignored everything. You were saying a ignored everything. You were saying a ignored everything. You were saying a few moments ago that you didn't want to few moments ago that you didn't want to few moments ago that you didn't want to be a single mom. That's why and you were be a single mom. That's why and you were be a single mom. That's why and you were like, I deserve to give this a shot, like, I deserve to give this a shot, like, I deserve to give this a shot, which is why you got married. which is why you got married. which is why you got married. >> I can't then fathom how hard it was when >> I can't then fathom how hard it was when >> I can't then fathom how hard it was when you're like, well, this isn't working. you're like, well, this isn't working. you're like, well, this isn't working. It's toxic. It's manipulative, but the It's toxic. It's manipulative, but the It's toxic. It's manipulative, but the only other option is being single. What only other option is being single. What only other option is being single. What was the final was the final was the final straw that made you go, "No, it's okay straw that made you go, "No, it's okay straw that made you go, "No, it's okay to accept this fear." The reason I'm to accept this fear." The reason I'm to accept this fear." The reason I'm asking is there's a beautiful piece of asking is there's a beautiful piece of asking is there's a beautiful piece of Zen wisdom that says that we'd rather Zen wisdom that says that we'd rather Zen wisdom that says that we'd rather accept the pain we know than the pain we accept the pain we know than the pain we accept the pain we know than the pain we don't. don't. don't. >> And so the pain you have right now when >> And so the pain you have right now when >> And so the pain you have right now when it's toxic and manipulative, it's like, it's toxic and manipulative, it's like, it's toxic and manipulative, it's like, >> well, that's better than leaving and >> well, that's better than leaving and >> well, that's better than leaving and being alone. And a lot of people stay in being alone. And a lot of people stay in being alone. And a lot of people stay in jobs, relationships with parents, family jobs, relationships with parents, family jobs, relationships with parents, family for so much longer. for so much longer. for so much longer. >> Do you think you stayed too long? And >> Do you think you stayed too long? And >> Do you think you stayed too long? And what made you shift finally? What was it what made you shift finally? What was it what made you shift finally? What was it that really made you go, I'm willing to that really made you go, I'm willing to that really made you go, I'm willing to accept the uncertainty? accept the uncertainty? accept the uncertainty? >> I honestly I don't think I stayed for >> I honestly I don't think I stayed for >> I honestly I don't think I stayed for too long. I feel like I truly wanted to too long. I feel like I truly wanted to too long. I feel like I truly wanted to step away from the marriage knowing that step away from the marriage knowing that step away from the marriage knowing that I gave it my all and attempted as much I gave it my all and attempted as much I gave it my all and attempted as much as I could to, you know, put in place as I could to, you know, put in place as I could to, you know, put in place more healthy coping mechanisms when more healthy coping mechanisms when more healthy coping mechanisms when they're going through fights and like they're going through fights and like they're going through fights and like all these things. I feel like I just all these things. I feel like I just all these things. I feel like I just wanted to make sure that like I really wanted to make sure that like I really wanted to make sure that like I really gave it my all. And I think my final gave it my all. And I think my final gave it my all. And I think my final straw was just the word divorce would be straw was just the word divorce would be straw was just the word divorce would be held over my head a lot. And I think he held over my head a lot. And I think he held over my head a lot. And I think he just knew that that was my biggest fear just knew that that was my biggest fear just knew that that was my biggest fear coming from a broken household and coming from a broken household and coming from a broken household and seeing that happen in front of me as a seeing that happen in front of me as a seeing that happen in front of me as a little girl. I think that that was just little girl. I think that that was just little girl. I think that that was just terrifying for me, that concept. And it terrifying for me, that concept. And it terrifying for me, that concept. And it was kind of a way to get me to fall into was kind of a way to get me to fall into was kind of a way to get me to fall into line of like where I think he wanted me line of like where I think he wanted me line of like where I think he wanted me to behave. And I think he just said it to behave. And I think he just said it to behave. And I think he just said it for the final time that I was like, I for the final time that I was like, I for the final time that I was like, I can't keep begging you to stay with me. can't keep begging you to stay with me. can't keep begging you to stay with me. I know my worth and I know that like I I know my worth and I know that like I I know my worth and I know that like I am a good partner and if you can't see am a good partner and if you can't see am a good partner and if you can't see that, then like it's okay. Um, and I'll that, then like it's okay. Um, and I'll that, then like it's okay. Um, and I'll always have a place for him in my heart. always have a place for him in my heart. always have a place for him in my heart. I think that he is a phenomenal dad. I think that he is a phenomenal dad. I think that he is a phenomenal dad. Truly one of the best dads I've ever Truly one of the best dads I've ever Truly one of the best dads I've ever like seen and witnessing him love my like seen and witnessing him love my like seen and witnessing him love my boys is amazing. But I think in terms of boys is amazing. But I think in terms of boys is amazing. But I think in terms of just us working out as a partner. Um it just us working out as a partner. Um it just us working out as a partner. Um it just wasn't for us. But yeah. just wasn't for us. But yeah. just wasn't for us. But yeah. >> What was his reaction when you told him >> What was his reaction when you told him >> What was his reaction when you told him that? that? that? >> Like the he was actually the one that >> Like the he was actually the one that >> Like the he was actually the one that brought it up and normally I would kind brought it up and normally I would kind brought it up and normally I would kind of fight back and I was like no don't do of fight back and I was like no don't do of fight back and I was like no don't do this. Like let's talk this out. Like this. Like let's talk this out. Like this. Like let's talk this out. Like let's go to therapy. Let's do this. let's go to therapy. Let's do this. let's go to therapy. Let's do this. Let's do that. But he just said it for Let's do that. But he just said it for Let's do that. But he just said it for the final time that I was like okay yeah the final time that I was like okay yeah the final time that I was like okay yeah like you're right. um probably go pack like you're right. um probably go pack like you're right. um probably go pack your stuff and we'll start to figure out your stuff and we'll start to figure out your stuff and we'll start to figure out like the next steps. So, I think his like the next steps. So, I think his like the next steps. So, I think his reaction wasn't what he expected me to reaction wasn't what he expected me to reaction wasn't what he expected me to do. I think he normally he was just used do. I think he normally he was just used do. I think he normally he was just used to me just begging and graveling and to me just begging and graveling and to me just begging and graveling and wanting this to work and all the things. wanting this to work and all the things. wanting this to work and all the things. So, I think when I finally was like, So, I think when I finally was like, So, I think when I finally was like, "You're right. Like, let's let's make "You're right. Like, let's let's make "You're right. Like, let's let's make this happen." I think it probably caught this happen." I think it probably caught this happen." I think it probably caught him off guard. But, I mean, I think he him off guard. But, I mean, I think he him off guard. But, I mean, I think he had to have known deep down like enough had to have known deep down like enough had to have known deep down like enough would have been enough at some point. would have been enough at some point. would have been enough at some point. >> Gosh. When you finally left and were a >> Gosh. When you finally left and were a >> Gosh. When you finally left and were a single mom, how did it feel compared to single mom, how did it feel compared to single mom, how did it feel compared to how you thought it would feel to be how you thought it would feel to be how you thought it would feel to be free? free? free? >> I think there was so much good around >> I think there was so much good around >> I think there was so much good around it. Like I wasn't in a toxic it. Like I wasn't in a toxic it. Like I wasn't in a toxic relationship. And you know, like me and relationship. And you know, like me and relationship. And you know, like me and my babies got like this fun little night my babies got like this fun little night my babies got like this fun little night routine that we would do every night, routine that we would do every night, routine that we would do every night, but there was also so much hard things but there was also so much hard things but there was also so much hard things that came at the beginning of my single that came at the beginning of my single that came at the beginning of my single motherhood journey. motherhood journey. motherhood journey. >> Tell me about this. >> Tell me about this. >> Tell me about this. >> Yeah, I didn't for a little bit there. I >> Yeah, I didn't for a little bit there. I >> Yeah, I didn't for a little bit there. I didn't have an income. This was before didn't have an income. This was before didn't have an income. This was before the show came to be and before I started the show came to be and before I started the show came to be and before I started making money on brand deals. And there making money on brand deals. And there making money on brand deals. And there was time periods that I was borrowing was time periods that I was borrowing was time periods that I was borrowing money from family and I would be grocery money from family and I would be grocery money from family and I would be grocery shopping and I would buy $30 worth of shopping and I would buy $30 worth of shopping and I would buy $30 worth of groceries for the whole week. And my groceries for the whole week. And my groceries for the whole week. And my kids would get food, but I would eat kids would get food, but I would eat kids would get food, but I would eat like their scraps after they ate cuz I like their scraps after they ate cuz I like their scraps after they ate cuz I couldn't afford to buy that. And I was couldn't afford to buy that. And I was couldn't afford to buy that. And I was getting eviction notices flopped on my getting eviction notices flopped on my getting eviction notices flopped on my door. And this was right around the time door. And this was right around the time door. And this was right around the time that we started filming for the show. that we started filming for the show. that we started filming for the show. So, while all this was happening behind So, while all this was happening behind So, while all this was happening behind the scenes and I was terrified to let the scenes and I was terrified to let the scenes and I was terrified to let anyone know cuz I was so embarrassed anyone know cuz I was so embarrassed anyone know cuz I was so embarrassed that I was like mad at myself. I was that I was like mad at myself. I was that I was like mad at myself. I was like, "You should have just stayed like, "You should have just stayed like, "You should have just stayed married. At least at least married, you married. At least at least married, you married. At least at least married, you had food on the table. At least married had food on the table. At least married had food on the table. At least married your lights weren't getting shut off. At your lights weren't getting shut off. At your lights weren't getting shut off. At least married you could pay your rent." least married you could pay your rent." least married you could pay your rent." So, it was almost like a shame thing So, it was almost like a shame thing So, it was almost like a shame thing that I was Why did you do this? You that I was Why did you do this? You that I was Why did you do this? You should have just stayed with him because should have just stayed with him because should have just stayed with him because now look at you now. And I was trying to now look at you now. And I was trying to now look at you now. And I was trying to almost keep up a facade cuz I was just almost keep up a facade cuz I was just almost keep up a facade cuz I was just embarrassed to tell the girls. I don't embarrassed to tell the girls. I don't embarrassed to tell the girls. I don't honestly even think that some of them honestly even think that some of them honestly even think that some of them know this to this day of like how badly know this to this day of like how badly know this to this day of like how badly I was struggling at the beginning and I was struggling at the beginning and I was struggling at the beginning and then I was showing up to filming every then I was showing up to filming every then I was showing up to filming every day trying to slap a smile on my face day trying to slap a smile on my face day trying to slap a smile on my face not letting anyone know what was not letting anyone know what was not letting anyone know what was happening behind the scenes. So I think happening behind the scenes. So I think happening behind the scenes. So I think yeah my start of single motherhood was yeah my start of single motherhood was yeah my start of single motherhood was not good and I'm very very grateful to not good and I'm very very grateful to not good and I'm very very grateful to be in the position that I am now. I be in the position that I am now. I be in the position that I am now. I can't even put into words how grateful I can't even put into words how grateful I can't even put into words how grateful I am for the show and for the people am for the show and for the people am for the show and for the people around me like my team that you know around me like my team that you know around me like my team that you know they believed in me from the start and they believed in me from the start and they believed in me from the start and have been by my side throughout all of have been by my side throughout all of have been by my side throughout all of this. Um, it Yeah, it was definitely a this. Um, it Yeah, it was definitely a this. Um, it Yeah, it was definitely a rocky start, but grateful for it though. rocky start, but grateful for it though. rocky start, but grateful for it though. It taught me a lot. It taught me a lot. It taught me a lot. >> God, I had no idea. >> God, I had no idea. >> God, I had no idea. >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> that I mean, you're saying it with a >> that I mean, you're saying it with a >> that I mean, you're saying it with a smile on your face right now, but smile on your face right now, but smile on your face right now, but >> yeah, I think it just taught me a lot >> yeah, I think it just taught me a lot >> yeah, I think it just taught me a lot and it taught me to be very, very and it taught me to be very, very and it taught me to be very, very grateful for what I have. I will never grateful for what I have. I will never grateful for what I have. I will never ever take for granted the position that ever take for granted the position that ever take for granted the position that I'm in. I think it will never feel real. I'm in. I think it will never feel real. I'm in. I think it will never feel real. even just doing small things that coming even just doing small things that coming even just doing small things that coming today to do this podcast and being able today to do this podcast and being able today to do this podcast and being able to like buy a flight for myself. That's to like buy a flight for myself. That's to like buy a flight for myself. That's something that, you know, when I was at something that, you know, when I was at something that, you know, when I was at the start of single motherhood, I the start of single motherhood, I the start of single motherhood, I wouldn't have ne never been able to do. wouldn't have ne never been able to do. wouldn't have ne never been able to do. And yeah, I just I'm just so so grateful And yeah, I just I'm just so so grateful And yeah, I just I'm just so so grateful and I feel like that's why I'm able to and I feel like that's why I'm able to and I feel like that's why I'm able to look at it, you know, positively now is look at it, you know, positively now is look at it, you know, positively now is that I've seen how hard it can be and that I've seen how hard it can be and that I've seen how hard it can be and I'm just really grateful that I got to I'm just really grateful that I got to I'm just really grateful that I got to the other side. the other side. the other side. >> Talk to me about a night during that >> Talk to me about a night during that >> Talk to me about a night during that time which was the worst night. like the time which was the worst night. like the time which was the worst night. like the memory that when you think about it, you memory that when you think about it, you memory that when you think about it, you were at rock bottom. were at rock bottom. were at rock bottom. >> I don't even know. There's just so many >> I don't even know. There's just so many >> I don't even know. There's just so many nights that I would just sit there just nights that I would just sit there just nights that I would just sit there just thinking and questioning how I was going thinking and questioning how I was going thinking and questioning how I was going to keep going for The Boys. And there's to keep going for The Boys. And there's to keep going for The Boys. And there's times that like I was debating just times that like I was debating just times that like I was debating just texting my ex and being like, "Hey, like texting my ex and being like, "Hey, like texting my ex and being like, "Hey, like I need you to like take the kids and I I need you to like take the kids and I I need you to like take the kids and I might need to go move in with my might need to go move in with my might need to go move in with my sister." Like I just at that point I sister." Like I just at that point I sister." Like I just at that point I didn't know how to continue on the road didn't know how to continue on the road didn't know how to continue on the road that I was on. And it was scary cuz all that I was on. And it was scary cuz all that I was on. And it was scary cuz all I wanted to do is just be a mom for them I wanted to do is just be a mom for them I wanted to do is just be a mom for them and to show up for them because that's and to show up for them because that's and to show up for them because that's what they deserve. of their innocent what they deserve. of their innocent what they deserve. of their innocent little babies. They deserve to like not little babies. They deserve to like not little babies. They deserve to like not have to worry about where their next have to worry about where their next have to worry about where their next meal was coming from. And it was hard meal was coming from. And it was hard meal was coming from. And it was hard and it was scary cuz I just also just and it was scary cuz I just also just and it was scary cuz I just also just didn't want to tell anyone around me cuz didn't want to tell anyone around me cuz didn't want to tell anyone around me cuz it was just a lot of embarrassment. And it was just a lot of embarrassment. And it was just a lot of embarrassment. And I shouldn't have been embarrassed. I I shouldn't have been embarrassed. I I shouldn't have been embarrassed. I wish I would have asked for help from wish I would have asked for help from wish I would have asked for help from more people. But I think I'm such a not more people. But I think I'm such a not more people. But I think I'm such a not prideful person, but it's just so hard prideful person, but it's just so hard prideful person, but it's just so hard for me to ask for help. I think growing for me to ask for help. I think growing for me to ask for help. I think growing up I never asked for help from like my up I never asked for help from like my up I never asked for help from like my parents for small things. When I was parents for small things. When I was parents for small things. When I was dealing with my mental health issues, I dealing with my mental health issues, I dealing with my mental health issues, I really had no idea when I was dealing really had no idea when I was dealing really had no idea when I was dealing with my eating disorder issues. I had no with my eating disorder issues. I had no with my eating disorder issues. I had no idea. So, I think I've just been like idea. So, I think I've just been like idea. So, I think I've just been like ingrained since a little girl to just ingrained since a little girl to just ingrained since a little girl to just kind of like shut your mouth and suck it kind of like shut your mouth and suck it kind of like shut your mouth and suck it up and it'll maybe work out. And yeah, I up and it'll maybe work out. And yeah, I up and it'll maybe work out. And yeah, I think just yeah, there's just a lot of think just yeah, there's just a lot of think just yeah, there's just a lot of nights of just I didn't know how I was nights of just I didn't know how I was nights of just I didn't know how I was going to move forward. going to move forward. going to move forward. >> Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I >> Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I >> Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I mean, I I feel like we don't realize how mean, I I feel like we don't realize how mean, I I feel like we don't realize how easy it is to end up in a position like easy it is to end up in a position like easy it is to end up in a position like that and how difficult it is. And that's that and how difficult it is. And that's that and how difficult it is. And that's why so many of us will stay longer in why so many of us will stay longer in why so many of us will stay longer in relationships or wherever we are because relationships or wherever we are because relationships or wherever we are because the alternative is a path that you're the alternative is a path that you're the alternative is a path that you're like, like, like, >> why did I do this to myself? Like, why >> why did I do this to myself? Like, why >> why did I do this to myself? Like, why am I putting myself through this pain? am I putting myself through this pain? am I putting myself through this pain? >> When did you start to be open to the >> When did you start to be open to the >> When did you start to be open to the idea of dating again and meeting someone idea of dating again and meeting someone idea of dating again and meeting someone new? And how were you starting to new? And how were you starting to new? And how were you starting to navigate that? Honestly, I dated pretty navigate that? Honestly, I dated pretty navigate that? Honestly, I dated pretty quickly after me and my ex separated. I quickly after me and my ex separated. I quickly after me and my ex separated. I think for a long period of my life, I think for a long period of my life, I think for a long period of my life, I used to seek validation and other people used to seek validation and other people used to seek validation and other people really bad. And I think it was almost really bad. And I think it was almost really bad. And I think it was almost like because I had those, you know, like because I had those, you know, like because I had those, you know, those abandonment wounds that I, you those abandonment wounds that I, you those abandonment wounds that I, you know, suffered from from when I was a know, suffered from from when I was a know, suffered from from when I was a little girl. I just always put my self little girl. I just always put my self little girl. I just always put my self worth into how other people viewed me worth into how other people viewed me worth into how other people viewed me and how other people perceived me. And I and how other people perceived me. And I and how other people perceived me. And I think I would put that a lot into my think I would put that a lot into my think I would put that a lot into my partners. So, I just feel like I never partners. So, I just feel like I never partners. So, I just feel like I never really knew how to be alone. And that really knew how to be alone. And that really knew how to be alone. And that honestly it would like scare me like I honestly it would like scare me like I honestly it would like scare me like I don't have someone that I can like rely don't have someone that I can like rely don't have someone that I can like rely on all the time. Not even just like you on all the time. Not even just like you on all the time. Not even just like you know physically or like you know know physically or like you know know physically or like you know financially. It's more just like financially. It's more just like financially. It's more just like emotional like I didn't want to be alone emotional like I didn't want to be alone emotional like I didn't want to be alone with my thoughts. I didn't want to be with my thoughts. I didn't want to be with my thoughts. I didn't want to be alone in general. And I think I would alone in general. And I think I would alone in general. And I think I would just always jump into relationships and just always jump into relationships and just always jump into relationships and I feel like I would see comments on life I feel like I would see comments on life I feel like I would see comments on life people like oh just she's in another people like oh just she's in another people like oh just she's in another relationship other every other season. relationship other every other season. relationship other every other season. Like I actually like you guys are right Like I actually like you guys are right Like I actually like you guys are right for that. Honestly, there was a long for that. Honestly, there was a long for that. Honestly, there was a long period of my life that I just felt like period of my life that I just felt like period of my life that I just felt like I couldn't be alone with myself. And I couldn't be alone with myself. And I couldn't be alone with myself. And that's, you know, that led me to not be that's, you know, that led me to not be that's, you know, that led me to not be able to be authentic to me because I able to be authentic to me because I able to be authentic to me because I didn't know who I was for such a long didn't know who I was for such a long didn't know who I was for such a long time. time. time. >> Do you think you feel more comfortable >> Do you think you feel more comfortable >> Do you think you feel more comfortable being alone now? being alone now? being alone now? >> Oh, yeah. I feel like I honestly value >> Oh, yeah. I feel like I honestly value >> Oh, yeah. I feel like I honestly value my alone time. I feel like that's how my alone time. I feel like that's how my alone time. I feel like that's how how I've been able to come, you know, to how I've been able to come, you know, to how I've been able to come, you know, to the conclusion and, you know, finally the conclusion and, you know, finally the conclusion and, you know, finally accept that I am by. And I wouldn't have accept that I am by. And I wouldn't have accept that I am by. And I wouldn't have been able to do that if I was with been able to do that if I was with been able to do that if I was with somebody. So, I really do value my alone somebody. So, I really do value my alone somebody. So, I really do value my alone time. I feel like it's given me a lot of time. I feel like it's given me a lot of time. I feel like it's given me a lot of perspective and just yeah, being able to perspective and just yeah, being able to perspective and just yeah, being able to find out who I am. find out who I am. find out who I am. >> What was it about being alone that gave >> What was it about being alone that gave >> What was it about being alone that gave you that confidence to look within and you that confidence to look within and you that confidence to look within and actually be comfortable with saying that actually be comfortable with saying that actually be comfortable with saying that out loud? out loud? out loud? >> Yeah, I think again just not living for >> Yeah, I think again just not living for >> Yeah, I think again just not living for other people and just being able to other people and just being able to other people and just being able to fully fully fully focus on me and I don't know, I feel focus on me and I don't know, I feel focus on me and I don't know, I feel like Yeah, just not having to do things like Yeah, just not having to do things like Yeah, just not having to do things for other people's approval I feel like for other people's approval I feel like for other people's approval I feel like really helped me. Yeah. It's only when really helped me. Yeah. It's only when really helped me. Yeah. It's only when you switch off all the noise from you switch off all the noise from you switch off all the noise from outside that you can actually hear your outside that you can actually hear your outside that you can actually hear your inner voice. inner voice. inner voice. >> And then when it gets louder, you >> And then when it gets louder, you >> And then when it gets louder, you realize, oh, that's what I should have realize, oh, that's what I should have realize, oh, that's what I should have been listening to all along. been listening to all along. been listening to all along. >> Not listen to all of these other >> Not listen to all of these other >> Not listen to all of these other opinions and ideas and expectations and opinions and ideas and expectations and opinions and ideas and expectations and everything else everyone wants me to do. everything else everyone wants me to do. everything else everyone wants me to do. But you're so right. You have to find But you're so right. You have to find But you're so right. You have to find that alone time. And that alone time. And that alone time. And >> I often ask people how many months in >> I often ask people how many months in >> I often ask people how many months in their life they've actually spent alone. their life they've actually spent alone. their life they've actually spent alone. And when I say alone, I don't mean And when I say alone, I don't mean And when I say alone, I don't mean >> dating, pursuing with someone. I mean, >> dating, pursuing with someone. I mean, >> dating, pursuing with someone. I mean, where you weren't thinking about that. where you weren't thinking about that. where you weren't thinking about that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it's quite shocking to me that if >> And it's quite shocking to me that if >> And it's quite shocking to me that if you speak to an adult, they'll be you speak to an adult, they'll be you speak to an adult, they'll be they'll be like weeks like people are they'll be like weeks like people are they'll be like weeks like people are constantly looking for relationships or constantly looking for relationships or constantly looking for relationships or in one and you don't actually get the in one and you don't actually get the in one and you don't actually get the space to do what you just said. space to do what you just said. space to do what you just said. >> 100%. Yeah. It's it's hard to be alone >> 100%. Yeah. It's it's hard to be alone >> 100%. Yeah. It's it's hard to be alone and it's hard to be like alone with your and it's hard to be like alone with your and it's hard to be like alone with your thoughts and to be able to just feel thoughts and to be able to just feel thoughts and to be able to just feel emotions, especially like post breakup. emotions, especially like post breakup. emotions, especially like post breakup. there's people that, you know, rebound there's people that, you know, rebound there's people that, you know, rebound and do those things to kind of like, you and do those things to kind of like, you and do those things to kind of like, you know, mute those thoughts that you have know, mute those thoughts that you have know, mute those thoughts that you have and all those things. And yeah, I just and all those things. And yeah, I just and all those things. And yeah, I just think it's very, it's really good to be think it's very, it's really good to be think it's very, it's really good to be alone sometimes. alone sometimes. alone sometimes. >> One of the story lines on the show is >> One of the story lines on the show is >> One of the story lines on the show is this idea that you're not satisfied by this idea that you're not satisfied by this idea that you're not satisfied by your male sexual partners. your male sexual partners. your male sexual partners. >> Was that difficult to say out loud? Like >> Was that difficult to say out loud? Like >> Was that difficult to say out loud? Like were you scared to were you scared to were you scared to >> I honestly when I said it in the moment >> I honestly when I said it in the moment >> I honestly when I said it in the moment I was just I forget that the cameras are I was just I forget that the cameras are I was just I forget that the cameras are there half of the time and I'll just be there half of the time and I'll just be there half of the time and I'll just be like oh I'm just like with my girls and like oh I'm just like with my girls and like oh I'm just like with my girls and I just shared something I didn't think I just shared something I didn't think I just shared something I didn't think it would have the impact that it did it would have the impact that it did it would have the impact that it did until the season came out and I had so until the season came out and I had so until the season came out and I had so many DMs of women being like I haven't many DMs of women being like I haven't many DMs of women being like I haven't and thank you for sharing this and and thank you for sharing this and and thank you for sharing this and making me feel less, you know, alone in making me feel less, you know, alone in making me feel less, you know, alone in that situation. And yeah, I just didn't that situation. And yeah, I just didn't that situation. And yeah, I just didn't think it was going to be such a big think it was going to be such a big think it was going to be such a big thing for me to share. And probably a thing for me to share. And probably a thing for me to share. And probably a good thing that I didn't realize that in good thing that I didn't realize that in good thing that I didn't realize that in the moment cuz then I probably like, "Oh the moment cuz then I probably like, "Oh the moment cuz then I probably like, "Oh my god, no wait, cut that." But I'm I'm my god, no wait, cut that." But I'm I'm my god, no wait, cut that." But I'm I'm glad that I did cuz I feel like it glad that I did cuz I feel like it glad that I did cuz I feel like it opened up a really big conversation for opened up a really big conversation for opened up a really big conversation for people that have dealt with that. people that have dealt with that. people that have dealt with that. >> Talk to me about that wider conversation >> Talk to me about that wider conversation >> Talk to me about that wider conversation because I think it's almost like all because I think it's almost like all because I think it's almost like all those men are going to feel terrible those men are going to feel terrible those men are going to feel terrible about themselves obviously. about themselves obviously. about themselves obviously. >> Yeah. I mean, it wasn't I did get some >> Yeah. I mean, it wasn't I did get some >> Yeah. I mean, it wasn't I did get some comments like that of people being like comments like that of people being like comments like that of people being like like I feel so bad for her exes and like like I feel so bad for her exes and like like I feel so bad for her exes and like that wasn't my intentions to like throw that wasn't my intentions to like throw that wasn't my intentions to like throw them under the bus. Yeah. And be like, them under the bus. Yeah. And be like, them under the bus. Yeah. And be like, "Yeah, you like never made me." It was "Yeah, you like never made me." It was "Yeah, you like never made me." It was more of just like kind of breaking that more of just like kind of breaking that more of just like kind of breaking that taboo that I think especially I don't taboo that I think especially I don't taboo that I think especially I don't know if everyone feels this way but I know if everyone feels this way but I know if everyone feels this way but I think for me dating men for so long I think for me dating men for so long I think for me dating men for so long I would view sex as I needed to make sure would view sex as I needed to make sure would view sex as I needed to make sure the man always was pleasured every the man always was pleasured every the man always was pleasured every single time and like I don't really single time and like I don't really single time and like I don't really matter as long as like they're good and matter as long as like they're good and matter as long as like they're good and taken care of and like it's good and taken care of and like it's good and taken care of and like it's good and like that's all in my head I thought sex like that's all in my head I thought sex like that's all in my head I thought sex was for such a long time and it opened was for such a long time and it opened was for such a long time and it opened up that conversation that I feel like a up that conversation that I feel like a up that conversation that I feel like a lot of people felt the same way and lot of people felt the same way and lot of people felt the same way and Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, >> it's such a fascinating conversation >> it's such a fascinating conversation >> it's such a fascinating conversation because of how patriarchal society has because of how patriarchal society has because of how patriarchal society has wired us, how porn is wired us. wired us, how porn is wired us. wired us, how porn is wired us. >> A lot of that is so wired that way and >> A lot of that is so wired that way and >> A lot of that is so wired that way and geared that way that sadly it naturally geared that way that sadly it naturally geared that way that sadly it naturally ends up resulting in how we feel sexes ends up resulting in how we feel sexes ends up resulting in how we feel sexes in real life. And I think men are kind in real life. And I think men are kind in real life. And I think men are kind of trained in that way and conditioned of trained in that way and conditioned of trained in that way and conditioned to think that. And then like you said, to think that. And then like you said, to think that. And then like you said, women end up getting trained that way. women end up getting trained that way. women end up getting trained that way. >> And then you end up in this position >> And then you end up in this position >> And then you end up in this position where until someone calls it out. where until someone calls it out. where until someone calls it out. >> Yeah. And I didn't realize that it was >> Yeah. And I didn't realize that it was >> Yeah. And I didn't realize that it was like a thing. I just I was like I I like a thing. I just I was like I I like a thing. I just I was like I I didn't even know what it felt like cuz I didn't even know what it felt like cuz I didn't even know what it felt like cuz I have never experienced that. And knowing have never experienced that. And knowing have never experienced that. And knowing that like people are like, "Oh no, like that like people are like, "Oh no, like that like people are like, "Oh no, like my boyfriend makes sure that every my boyfriend makes sure that every my boyfriend makes sure that every single time I do, I'm like, what are you single time I do, I'm like, what are you single time I do, I'm like, what are you talking about?" Like I I just never talking about?" Like I I just never talking about?" Like I I just never experienced that because I just didn't experienced that because I just didn't experienced that because I just didn't think that that's how it worked. And I think that that's how it worked. And I think that that's how it worked. And I think it also relates back to what I think it also relates back to what I think it also relates back to what I said earlier like I didn't have like the said earlier like I didn't have like the said earlier like I didn't have like the birds in the bee conversation with my birds in the bee conversation with my birds in the bee conversation with my parents. Like I didn't know how any of parents. Like I didn't know how any of parents. Like I didn't know how any of that worked. And I think that probably that worked. And I think that probably that worked. And I think that probably led to that as well of me just having led to that as well of me just having led to that as well of me just having like this like this like this >> preconceived idea of what sex was in my >> preconceived idea of what sex was in my >> preconceived idea of what sex was in my head for such a long time. head for such a long time. head for such a long time. >> It's almost like when you were pregnant >> It's almost like when you were pregnant >> It's almost like when you were pregnant from having sex was the first time you from having sex was the first time you from having sex was the first time you actually actually actually >> honestly. Yeah. Cuz like I knew what it >> honestly. Yeah. Cuz like I knew what it >> honestly. Yeah. Cuz like I knew what it was. Like I know like how sex should was. Like I know like how sex should was. Like I know like how sex should like end, but like I just didn't know like end, but like I just didn't know like end, but like I just didn't know like the details I guess. like the details I guess. like the details I guess. >> Yeah. Yeah. Sex education in America >> Yeah. Yeah. Sex education in America >> Yeah. Yeah. Sex education in America obviously isn't doing any good. obviously isn't doing any good. obviously isn't doing any good. >> Yeah. at school. Like it's I think about >> Yeah. at school. Like it's I think about >> Yeah. at school. Like it's I think about that all the time. I'm just like how is that all the time. I'm just like how is that all the time. I'm just like how is it that it's taught so poorly in schools it that it's taught so poorly in schools it that it's taught so poorly in schools and no one really has a clue? and no one really has a clue? and no one really has a clue? >> Yeah. I didn't get any sex classes >> Yeah. I didn't get any sex classes >> Yeah. I didn't get any sex classes growing up. growing up. growing up. >> Oh, you didn't? Not at all. >> Oh, you didn't? Not at all. >> Oh, you didn't? Not at all. >> Not one. Yeah. >> Not one. Yeah. >> Not one. Yeah. >> So I I think it just >> So I I think it just >> So I I think it just >> is that because of where No. >> is that because of where No. >> is that because of where No. >> I think maybe where I grew up was again >> I think maybe where I grew up was again >> I think maybe where I grew up was again like very predominantly Mormon. And I like very predominantly Mormon. And I like very predominantly Mormon. And I just think that again people a lot of just think that again people a lot of just think that again people a lot of people think that if you don't address people think that if you don't address people think that if you don't address it then like people won't be curious it then like people won't be curious it then like people won't be curious about it. But I think if anything it at about it. But I think if anything it at about it. But I think if anything it at least from me and my perspective being least from me and my perspective being least from me and my perspective being you know very young and having sex for you know very young and having sex for you know very young and having sex for the first time I think it made me more the first time I think it made me more the first time I think it made me more curious if anything. So I think me going curious if anything. So I think me going curious if anything. So I think me going now being a parent like I want to now being a parent like I want to now being a parent like I want to address these things with my kids and address these things with my kids and address these things with my kids and address and be like we're all going to address and be like we're all going to address and be like we're all going to have those urges and like this is what have those urges and like this is what have those urges and like this is what you do if you're in this situation and you do if you're in this situation and you do if you're in this situation and like teach them how to have safe sex and like teach them how to have safe sex and like teach them how to have safe sex and all the things. So again, I think all my all the things. So again, I think all my all the things. So again, I think all my experiences in life have just really led experiences in life have just really led experiences in life have just really led me to rewire my brain on how I want to me to rewire my brain on how I want to me to rewire my brain on how I want to be a parent and hopefully, you know, be a parent and hopefully, you know, be a parent and hopefully, you know, other people same thing cuz I think other people same thing cuz I think other people same thing cuz I think yeah, my faults, not that they're yeah, my faults, not that they're yeah, my faults, not that they're faults, but I think those experiences faults, but I think those experiences faults, but I think those experiences have led me to want to kind of do things have led me to want to kind of do things have led me to want to kind of do things differently. differently. differently. >> What's the Mormon approach to sex? >> What's the Mormon approach to sex? >> What's the Mormon approach to sex? >> Don't have it until you're married. >> Don't have it until you're married. >> Don't have it until you're married. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. But then still kind of the >> Yeah. Yeah. But then still kind of the >> Yeah. Yeah. But then still kind of the point of sex a little bit when you're point of sex a little bit when you're point of sex a little bit when you're Mormon is just to procreate, Mormon is just to procreate, Mormon is just to procreate, >> right? not really for the enjoyment. I >> right? not really for the enjoyment. I >> right? not really for the enjoyment. I don't know, maybe some people would like don't know, maybe some people would like don't know, maybe some people would like argue differently with that. But I know argue differently with that. But I know argue differently with that. But I know like a lot of members of the church that like a lot of members of the church that like a lot of members of the church that don't even have like toys or like they don't even have like toys or like they don't even have like toys or like they things like that like they it's just things like that like they it's just things like that like they it's just literally just to make babies for some literally just to make babies for some literally just to make babies for some people which is unfortunate cuz I think people which is unfortunate cuz I think people which is unfortunate cuz I think it's you know a great thing and it's you know a great thing and it's you know a great thing and >> and do people actually follow through >> and do people actually follow through >> and do people actually follow through with that with that with that >> with >> with >> with >> like are there are people in the church >> like are there are people in the church >> like are there are people in the church actually stay strict to that? actually stay strict to that? actually stay strict to that? >> I think so. Yeah. Like a lot of people I >> I think so. Yeah. Like a lot of people I >> I think so. Yeah. Like a lot of people I know, know, know, >> you know, the first time they have sex >> you know, the first time they have sex >> you know, the first time they have sex is when they get married and is when they get married and is when they get married and >> they get pregnant really fast and all >> they get pregnant really fast and all >> they get pregnant really fast and all the things, which I also think is, you the things, which I also think is, you the things, which I also think is, you know, that's what we're taught is to know, that's what we're taught is to know, that's what we're taught is to just make babies. So just make babies. So just make babies. So >> I saw in a lot of religious institutions >> I saw in a lot of religious institutions >> I saw in a lot of religious institutions the opposite where it was there was the the opposite where it was there was the the opposite where it was there was the rule of no sex before marriage. And then rule of no sex before marriage. And then rule of no sex before marriage. And then there was the same as what you're there was the same as what you're there was the same as what you're saying, only for procreation, but the saying, only for procreation, but the saying, only for procreation, but the majority of people were still having majority of people were still having majority of people were still having sex. They just wouldn't tell anyone. sex. They just wouldn't tell anyone. sex. They just wouldn't tell anyone. >> So then there was like this shame and >> So then there was like this shame and >> So then there was like this shame and guilt attached to it. and everyone's guilt attached to it. and everyone's guilt attached to it. and everyone's pretending. pretending. pretending. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But saying that they're not because >> But saying that they're not because >> But saying that they're not because that's what the standard is. And it's that's what the standard is. And it's that's what the standard is. And it's fascinating to me how you kind of get fascinating to me how you kind of get fascinating to me how you kind of get stuck in these stuck in these stuck in these anti-authenticity loops anti-authenticity loops anti-authenticity loops >> where you think you're being authentic >> where you think you're being authentic >> where you think you're being authentic because you're trying to live up to this because you're trying to live up to this because you're trying to live up to this ideal, ideal, ideal, >> but then no one's actually living up to >> but then no one's actually living up to >> but then no one's actually living up to it and we're all pretending we are. So, it and we're all pretending we are. So, it and we're all pretending we are. So, >> I've always found it so interesting how >> I've always found it so interesting how >> I've always found it so interesting how humans because this isn't about it humans because this isn't about it humans because this isn't about it actually isn't about religion or God. actually isn't about religion or God. actually isn't about religion or God. It's how humans can gather to kind of It's how humans can gather to kind of It's how humans can gather to kind of set a standard and people either pretend set a standard and people either pretend set a standard and people either pretend to live up to the standard or they don't to live up to the standard or they don't to live up to the standard or they don't know what to do with it. know what to do with it. know what to do with it. >> Yeah. And they fake it. Kind of keeping >> Yeah. And they fake it. Kind of keeping >> Yeah. And they fake it. Kind of keeping up with the Joneses, I feel like, is up with the Joneses, I feel like, is up with the Joneses, I feel like, is like a phrase that we have in Utah that like a phrase that we have in Utah that like a phrase that we have in Utah that everyone, you know, we all have our everyone, you know, we all have our everyone, you know, we all have our secrets and like our things that we secrets and like our things that we secrets and like our things that we don't share. And it's just kind of to don't share. And it's just kind of to don't share. And it's just kind of to keep it that facade that you, you know, keep it that facade that you, you know, keep it that facade that you, you know, are this perfect member. are this perfect member. are this perfect member. >> Yeah. When did you let go of that >> Yeah. When did you let go of that >> Yeah. When did you let go of that wanting to be the perfect member? wanting to be the perfect member? wanting to be the perfect member? >> I haven't been active probably for >> I haven't been active probably for >> I haven't been active probably for four or five years now, but when I was four or five years now, but when I was four or five years now, but when I was married, u me and my ex would go married, u me and my ex would go married, u me and my ex would go sometimes like here and there, but we sometimes like here and there, but we sometimes like here and there, but we weren't really active members either. It weren't really active members either. It weren't really active members either. It was again kind of the same thing to kind was again kind of the same thing to kind was again kind of the same thing to kind of keep the facade up and you know keep of keep the facade up and you know keep of keep the facade up and you know keep with what we thought we had to do. But with what we thought we had to do. But with what we thought we had to do. But when we separated, I was like, "Okay, when we separated, I was like, "Okay, when we separated, I was like, "Okay, like I finally am like I'm able to not like I finally am like I'm able to not like I finally am like I'm able to not have to keep up this facade that I know have to keep up this facade that I know have to keep up this facade that I know that I tr truly don't believe in," which that I tr truly don't believe in," which that I tr truly don't believe in," which was Yeah, that was nice. was Yeah, that was nice. was Yeah, that was nice. >> How did you decide that you were finally >> How did you decide that you were finally >> How did you decide that you were finally ready to start dating women? ready to start dating women? ready to start dating women? >> I don't know like there was like an >> I don't know like there was like an >> I don't know like there was like an exact moment that I remember like it exact moment that I remember like it exact moment that I remember like it just like dawned on me. I think just like dawned on me. I think just like dawned on me. I think just it felt right. Mhm. But did you just it felt right. Mhm. But did you just it felt right. Mhm. But did you feel like there was you said earlier feel like there was you said earlier feel like there was you said earlier like there was this sense of like there was this sense of like there was this sense of >> like you you should have done this the >> like you you should have done this the >> like you you should have done this the whole time whole time whole time >> like is there a sense of like lost time >> like is there a sense of like lost time >> like is there a sense of like lost time or that I held myself back? or that I held myself back? or that I held myself back? >> I think everything played out how like >> I think everything played out how like >> I think everything played out how like it was supposed to. I think obviously I it was supposed to. I think obviously I it was supposed to. I think obviously I wish I would have, you know, came out a wish I would have, you know, came out a wish I would have, you know, came out a lot sooner, but I also think I was going lot sooner, but I also think I was going lot sooner, but I also think I was going through so much that it would have been through so much that it would have been through so much that it would have been still swept under the rug like it did still swept under the rug like it did still swept under the rug like it did for so long. I just think a lot of for so long. I just think a lot of for so long. I just think a lot of things just were not more important in things just were not more important in things just were not more important in that moment, but just took precedence a that moment, but just took precedence a that moment, but just took precedence a little bit, like becoming a single mom little bit, like becoming a single mom little bit, like becoming a single mom and like things that I dealt with in and like things that I dealt with in and like things that I dealt with in childhood and all those things. I just childhood and all those things. I just childhood and all those things. I just think it just never felt like the right think it just never felt like the right think it just never felt like the right time to like just dive into it. And I time to like just dive into it. And I time to like just dive into it. And I think honestly just like the concept of think honestly just like the concept of think honestly just like the concept of coming out in general is just kind of coming out in general is just kind of coming out in general is just kind of something that I've never really something that I've never really something that I've never really understood. And obviously like I can understood. And obviously like I can understood. And obviously like I can hold space for people that like are hold space for people that like are hold space for people that like are taught either in their homes or like in taught either in their homes or like in taught either in their homes or like in their religions that you know love is their religions that you know love is their religions that you know love is between a man and a woman, but I think between a man and a woman, but I think between a man and a woman, but I think the concept that we're all just born the concept that we're all just born the concept that we're all just born straight is something that like I've straight is something that like I've straight is something that like I've never been able to fully like never been able to fully like never been able to fully like conceptualize. And coming out and just conceptualize. And coming out and just conceptualize. And coming out and just having to say like I like girls and boys having to say like I like girls and boys having to say like I like girls and boys is just I never could see myself like is just I never could see myself like is just I never could see myself like sitting down at a podcast and saying sitting down at a podcast and saying sitting down at a podcast and saying this, but I also understand like the this, but I also understand like the this, but I also understand like the position that I'm in that there's so position that I'm in that there's so position that I'm in that there's so many people that look up to me and many people that look up to me and many people that look up to me and maybe, you know, resonate with my story. maybe, you know, resonate with my story. maybe, you know, resonate with my story. And if I can help someone feel just more And if I can help someone feel just more And if I can help someone feel just more comfortable to be able to be true to comfortable to be able to be true to comfortable to be able to be true to themselves, then I want to do that. But themselves, then I want to do that. But themselves, then I want to do that. But yeah, I feel like I just never could yeah, I feel like I just never could yeah, I feel like I just never could picture myself like coming out in this picture myself like coming out in this picture myself like coming out in this way, I just thought that maybe I would way, I just thought that maybe I would way, I just thought that maybe I would just show up with a girl one day and just show up with a girl one day and just show up with a girl one day and people would be like, "Oh." And I'd be people would be like, "Oh." And I'd be people would be like, "Oh." And I'd be like, "Yeah, what what about it?" But like, "Yeah, what what about it?" But like, "Yeah, what what about it?" But yeah, so I just think I just never had yeah, so I just think I just never had yeah, so I just think I just never had like an idea in my head of like when it like an idea in my head of like when it like an idea in my head of like when it was going to happen. I just think I just was going to happen. I just think I just was going to happen. I just think I just always thought it was going to happen at always thought it was going to happen at always thought it was going to happen at some point. some point. some point. >> What was your like biggest fear in your >> What was your like biggest fear in your >> What was your like biggest fear in your mind with what it would feel like to mind with what it would feel like to mind with what it would feel like to come out? Like what was the thing that come out? Like what was the thing that come out? Like what was the thing that you were like, I keep getting close. you were like, I keep getting close. you were like, I keep getting close. >> Yeah. I'm about to say it. I'm about to >> Yeah. I'm about to say it. I'm about to >> Yeah. I'm about to say it. I'm about to act on it, but I this keeps blocking me. act on it, but I this keeps blocking me. act on it, but I this keeps blocking me. >> I think it was just so foreign for me >> I think it was just so foreign for me >> I think it was just so foreign for me because I, you know, dated for men for because I, you know, dated for men for because I, you know, dated for men for so long, my whole entire life. And so long, my whole entire life. And so long, my whole entire life. And that's all I knew. Like I obviously had that's all I knew. Like I obviously had that's all I knew. Like I obviously had like, you know, experiences with women, like, you know, experiences with women, like, you know, experiences with women, but like I never in depth, you know, got but like I never in depth, you know, got but like I never in depth, you know, got to know women on like a intimate level to know women on like a intimate level to know women on like a intimate level and all those things. So I think for me and all those things. So I think for me and all those things. So I think for me for so long it was just very foreign and for so long it was just very foreign and for so long it was just very foreign and scary. Um, but I think, you know, you scary. Um, but I think, you know, you scary. Um, but I think, you know, you can't get over that without getting can't get over that without getting can't get over that without getting through it. And I think I just was like, through it. And I think I just was like, through it. And I think I just was like, "Hey, like you know that you are. Stop "Hey, like you know that you are. Stop "Hey, like you know that you are. Stop being like scared of like the whatifs being like scared of like the whatifs being like scared of like the whatifs and like the unknown and just you could and like the unknown and just you could and like the unknown and just you could just got to dive in." So, just got to dive in." So, just got to dive in." So, >> yeah. What What surprised you about >> yeah. What What surprised you about >> yeah. What What surprised you about dating women compared to men? dating women compared to men? dating women compared to men? >> Oh my gosh. Everything. Not like >> Oh my gosh. Everything. Not like >> Oh my gosh. Everything. Not like surprised me, but like already just like surprised me, but like already just like surprised me, but like already just like more like emotionally aware about more like emotionally aware about more like emotionally aware about certain things and very patient. I feel certain things and very patient. I feel certain things and very patient. I feel like at least who I'm talking to right like at least who I'm talking to right like at least who I'm talking to right now, she's just been very understanding now, she's just been very understanding now, she's just been very understanding and kind of letting me take this at my and kind of letting me take this at my and kind of letting me take this at my own pace because it is just so foreign own pace because it is just so foreign own pace because it is just so foreign to me and it is so so new. Um, and yeah, to me and it is so so new. Um, and yeah, to me and it is so so new. Um, and yeah, I just think the level of like I just think the level of like I just think the level of like understanding and just like being there understanding and just like being there understanding and just like being there for me. Yeah. for me. Yeah. for me. Yeah. >> How do you feel about certain people who >> How do you feel about certain people who >> How do you feel about certain people who may disagree, may not be happy about it, may disagree, may not be happy about it, may disagree, may not be happy about it, may have different views? Like I'm sure may have different views? Like I'm sure may have different views? Like I'm sure you've thought about that and had to you've thought about that and had to you've thought about that and had to think about it being so public and think about it being so public and think about it being so public and >> yeah I think I have tried to like play >> yeah I think I have tried to like play >> yeah I think I have tried to like play by the books you know in certain ways. I by the books you know in certain ways. I by the books you know in certain ways. I feel like looking back on like my feel like looking back on like my feel like looking back on like my experience even on the show, I feel like experience even on the show, I feel like experience even on the show, I feel like season one and season two, I tried so season one and season two, I tried so season one and season two, I tried so hard to do everything right and I still hard to do everything right and I still hard to do everything right and I still had people that hated me. And now, you had people that hated me. And now, you had people that hated me. And now, you know, being more vocal and being more know, being more vocal and being more know, being more vocal and being more outspoken, I still have people that hate outspoken, I still have people that hate outspoken, I still have people that hate me. And I just think we're only on this me. And I just think we're only on this me. And I just think we're only on this earth for, you know, however long we are earth for, you know, however long we are earth for, you know, however long we are here. And I'll be damned if like I'm not here. And I'll be damned if like I'm not here. And I'll be damned if like I'm not able to be fully who I am. And if you able to be fully who I am. And if you able to be fully who I am. And if you don't like that, then that's okay. And I don't like that, then that's okay. And I don't like that, then that's okay. And I can understand if like you were raised a can understand if like you were raised a can understand if like you were raised a certain way and you have certain values certain way and you have certain values certain way and you have certain values and standards maybe. But I think for me, and standards maybe. But I think for me, and standards maybe. But I think for me, I just Yeah, I just it shouldn't bug you I just Yeah, I just it shouldn't bug you I just Yeah, I just it shouldn't bug you if people choose to love whoever they if people choose to love whoever they if people choose to love whoever they want to love. I think it's just it's want to love. I think it's just it's want to love. I think it's just it's nobody's nobody's business at the end of nobody's nobody's business at the end of nobody's nobody's business at the end of the day. the day. the day. >> Yeah. Is there is there any of it that >> Yeah. Is there is there any of it that >> Yeah. Is there is there any of it that does affect you or get through to you? I does affect you or get through to you? I does affect you or get through to you? I know. I know. For me, know. I know. For me, know. I know. For me, there's always there's always something there's always there's always something there's always there's always something that kind of just like creeps through that kind of just like creeps through that kind of just like creeps through and you're like, "Oh, man." Like, I just and you're like, "Oh, man." Like, I just and you're like, "Oh, man." Like, I just I wish like I always say, I wish I could I wish like I always say, I wish I could I wish like I always say, I wish I could sit everyone down and tell them what my sit everyone down and tell them what my sit everyone down and tell them what my intention was and how I feel and who I intention was and how I feel and who I intention was and how I feel and who I am. And if they got to spend like an am. And if they got to spend like an am. And if they got to spend like an hour with me, then maybe they'd feel hour with me, then maybe they'd feel hour with me, then maybe they'd feel different. But is there anything that different. But is there anything that different. But is there anything that ever just like gets to you sometimes and ever just like gets to you sometimes and ever just like gets to you sometimes and you're like, "Oh, this keeps me up at you're like, "Oh, this keeps me up at you're like, "Oh, this keeps me up at night." I think the only insult that night." I think the only insult that night." I think the only insult that people can ever say to me that like people can ever say to me that like people can ever say to me that like actually like is like that hurt a little actually like is like that hurt a little actually like is like that hurt a little bit is anything to do with parenting. I bit is anything to do with parenting. I bit is anything to do with parenting. I think that's like the one thing that I'm think that's like the one thing that I'm think that's like the one thing that I'm like I'm so protective over my baby. So like I'm so protective over my baby. So like I'm so protective over my baby. So that's something that like I didn't get that's something that like I didn't get that's something that like I didn't get growing up and I think that's the one growing up and I think that's the one growing up and I think that's the one thing that will always just kind of hit thing that will always just kind of hit thing that will always just kind of hit home is if someone says something about home is if someone says something about home is if someone says something about like my parenting. I think everything like my parenting. I think everything like my parenting. I think everything else like looks say what you want to else like looks say what you want to else like looks say what you want to say. Now if I'm being gay and that say. Now if I'm being gay and that say. Now if I'm being gay and that offends you say what you want to say but offends you say what you want to say but offends you say what you want to say but I'm like my babies don't say anything I'm like my babies don't say anything I'm like my babies don't say anything about them ever. about them ever. about them ever. >> Yeah. I feel and I feel like the >> Yeah. I feel and I feel like the >> Yeah. I feel and I feel like the internet is good at talking about internet is good at talking about internet is good at talking about everyone's babies and mothering everyone's babies and mothering everyone's babies and mothering motherhood. motherhood. motherhood. I feel like I feel like I feel like >> I get it's so I can't imagine how hard >> I get it's so I can't imagine how hard >> I get it's so I can't imagine how hard that is as a mom or a dad or a parent. that is as a mom or a dad or a parent. that is as a mom or a dad or a parent. Like I can't imagine how difficult that Like I can't imagine how difficult that Like I can't imagine how difficult that is because everyone's kind of telling is because everyone's kind of telling is because everyone's kind of telling you like this is the right way and you like this is the right way and you like this is the right way and that's wrong and that's wrong and that's wrong and >> yeah, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> I mean that seems exhausting. >> I mean that seems exhausting. >> I mean that seems exhausting. >> Yeah. I think parenting is just it's >> Yeah. I think parenting is just it's >> Yeah. I think parenting is just it's such a one-off experience for every such a one-off experience for every such a one-off experience for every single person. Like every child is single person. Like every child is single person. Like every child is different, every parent's different. And different, every parent's different. And different, every parent's different. And there's no textbook for how to parent there's no textbook for how to parent there's no textbook for how to parent properly. There's no textbook of how to properly. There's no textbook of how to properly. There's no textbook of how to handle situations of, you know, how to handle situations of, you know, how to handle situations of, you know, how to just be a parent. It's hard. It's it's just be a parent. It's hard. It's it's just be a parent. It's hard. It's it's challenging every single day. It teaches challenging every single day. It teaches challenging every single day. It teaches me new things about myself that I didn't me new things about myself that I didn't me new things about myself that I didn't even know before. And yeah, I think even know before. And yeah, I think even know before. And yeah, I think that's the one thing that I'm like just that's the one thing that I'm like just that's the one thing that I'm like just parents, we're doing our best. And parents, we're doing our best. And parents, we're doing our best. And ultimately just as long as your kids ultimately just as long as your kids ultimately just as long as your kids health and you know mental health is health and you know mental health is health and you know mental health is being protected in the day and they're being protected in the day and they're being protected in the day and they're happy and healthy that's all that happy and healthy that's all that happy and healthy that's all that matters. So matters. So matters. So >> you've you've mentioned that for your >> you've you've mentioned that for your >> you've you've mentioned that for your kids right now. You've talked about kids right now. You've talked about kids right now. You've talked about health and mental health a couple of health and mental health a couple of health and mental health a couple of times. Like what do you do for yours and times. Like what do you do for yours and times. Like what do you do for yours and your kids health and mental health? Like your kids health and mental health? Like your kids health and mental health? Like what are the priorities? what are the priorities? what are the priorities? >> Definitely a lot of affirmations. I >> Definitely a lot of affirmations. I >> Definitely a lot of affirmations. I didn't really hear a lot of that growing didn't really hear a lot of that growing didn't really hear a lot of that growing up. I feel like I honestly had very up. I feel like I honestly had very up. I feel like I honestly had very negative selfworth. I don't think I negative selfworth. I don't think I negative selfworth. I don't think I know. I had very negative self-worth for know. I had very negative self-worth for know. I had very negative self-worth for a long time cuz I felt like I heard the a long time cuz I felt like I heard the a long time cuz I felt like I heard the opposite a lot growing up. Even just opposite a lot growing up. Even just opposite a lot growing up. Even just small things like my mom would be small things like my mom would be small things like my mom would be looking in the mirror and she's like, looking in the mirror and she's like, looking in the mirror and she's like, "Oh, I'm so fat or this or my dad would "Oh, I'm so fat or this or my dad would "Oh, I'm so fat or this or my dad would say, you know, mean comments to my mom." say, you know, mean comments to my mom." say, you know, mean comments to my mom." So, I just felt like I never heard So, I just felt like I never heard So, I just felt like I never heard positive selft talk about themselves or positive selft talk about themselves or positive selft talk about themselves or others around them. And I think my others around them. And I think my others around them. And I think my biggest thing for my boys that we do biggest thing for my boys that we do biggest thing for my boys that we do like affirmations that like I have them like affirmations that like I have them like affirmations that like I have them sit in front of the mirror and say like, sit in front of the mirror and say like, sit in front of the mirror and say like, "I'm handsome and I'm smart and I'm "I'm handsome and I'm smart and I'm "I'm handsome and I'm smart and I'm loved and I'm cared for and like all loved and I'm cared for and like all loved and I'm cared for and like all these things that kind of just like set these things that kind of just like set these things that kind of just like set their mind already of just being their mind already of just being their mind already of just being grateful and loving themselves." I think grateful and loving themselves." I think grateful and loving themselves." I think that that's just so important and that that that's just so important and that that that's just so important and that honestly can set you up for success in honestly can set you up for success in honestly can set you up for success in your life in so many ways. Whether your life in so many ways. Whether your life in so many ways. Whether that's, you know, your career path, that's, you know, your career path, that's, you know, your career path, school, um, confidence in sports, you school, um, confidence in sports, you school, um, confidence in sports, you know, confidence in relationships, just know, confidence in relationships, just know, confidence in relationships, just so many things. I just think that so many things. I just think that so many things. I just think that uplifting yourself is so so important uplifting yourself is so so important uplifting yourself is so so important and so undervalued. and so undervalued. and so undervalued. And I just think that that's like my And I just think that that's like my And I just think that that's like my biggest thing with my boys. I just want biggest thing with my boys. I just want biggest thing with my boys. I just want them to love themselves and love them to love themselves and love them to love themselves and love everyone around them and just be good everyone around them and just be good everyone around them and just be good people. people. people. >> That makes sense. And when you said >> That makes sense. And when you said >> That makes sense. And when you said selfworth, I was wondering, talk to me selfworth, I was wondering, talk to me selfworth, I was wondering, talk to me about the moments in your life where you about the moments in your life where you about the moments in your life where you experienced low selfworth. experienced low selfworth. experienced low selfworth. >> A lot of it stemmed from, like I >> A lot of it stemmed from, like I >> A lot of it stemmed from, like I mentioned, just growing up just being mentioned, just growing up just being mentioned, just growing up just being the only black kid in a room full of 30 the only black kid in a room full of 30 the only black kid in a room full of 30 students and I'm the only only kid there students and I'm the only only kid there students and I'm the only only kid there that's black. I think that triggered a that's black. I think that triggered a that's black. I think that triggered a lot in me just not valuing myself and my lot in me just not valuing myself and my lot in me just not valuing myself and my individuality. But I think also I individuality. But I think also I individuality. But I think also I struggled with an eating disorder um struggled with an eating disorder um struggled with an eating disorder um throughout high school and then it throughout high school and then it throughout high school and then it resurfaced here about probably resurfaced here about probably resurfaced here about probably a year ago and I feel like I'm kind of a year ago and I feel like I'm kind of a year ago and I feel like I'm kind of in remission from it right now. Um, and in remission from it right now. Um, and in remission from it right now. Um, and I'm really really proud of myself for I'm really really proud of myself for I'm really really proud of myself for getting that to that point again. But I getting that to that point again. But I getting that to that point again. But I think I've always had a very jaded think I've always had a very jaded think I've always had a very jaded perspective of, you know, my worth and perspective of, you know, my worth and perspective of, you know, my worth and my image and all those things. And I my image and all those things. And I my image and all those things. And I think I'm finally in a position that I think I'm finally in a position that I think I'm finally in a position that I am realizing that like again those those am realizing that like again those those am realizing that like again those those negative selft talks can affect my negative selft talks can affect my negative selft talks can affect my children and they view their mommy as children and they view their mommy as children and they view their mommy as beautiful and kind and you know all beautiful and kind and you know all beautiful and kind and you know all these good things and I want to be able these good things and I want to be able these good things and I want to be able to say those things about myself back to say those things about myself back to say those things about myself back and I try to look at myself as like a and I try to look at myself as like a and I try to look at myself as like a little girl that I would never like see little girl that I would never like see little girl that I would never like see a little girl saying there be like a little girl saying there be like a little girl saying there be like you're ugly or you're fat or no one you're ugly or you're fat or no one you're ugly or you're fat or no one likes you at school. Like I would never likes you at school. Like I would never likes you at school. Like I would never do that. So, I try to talk to myself as do that. So, I try to talk to myself as do that. So, I try to talk to myself as if I was like that little girl. if I was like that little girl. if I was like that little girl. >> I have such a concern for young women >> I have such a concern for young women >> I have such a concern for young women right now, especially in terms of what right now, especially in terms of what right now, especially in terms of what they're exposed to online, the name they're exposed to online, the name they're exposed to online, the name calling, the criticism of women's calling, the criticism of women's calling, the criticism of women's bodies. It just it just feels like we bodies. It just it just feels like we bodies. It just it just feels like we we're going backwards. we're going backwards. we're going backwards. >> Like, we haven't gone in the right >> Like, we haven't gone in the right >> Like, we haven't gone in the right direction. direction. direction. >> And I can't imagine what it feels like >> And I can't imagine what it feels like >> And I can't imagine what it feels like to be a mom and have kids. And whether to be a mom and have kids. And whether to be a mom and have kids. And whether they're young boys or young girls or they're young boys or young girls or they're young boys or young girls or >> young children that are having to grow >> young children that are having to grow >> young children that are having to grow up right now and be exposed to all of up right now and be exposed to all of up right now and be exposed to all of that, I'm like, I'm sure you feel so that, I'm like, I'm sure you feel so that, I'm like, I'm sure you feel so protective. But also, what do you do? protective. But also, what do you do? protective. But also, what do you do? >> Yeah, I think it's inevitable, but >> Yeah, I think it's inevitable, but >> Yeah, I think it's inevitable, but hopefully setting them up with the right hopefully setting them up with the right hopefully setting them up with the right tools to handle those things properly, I tools to handle those things properly, I tools to handle those things properly, I think, is what I'm trying to do for my think, is what I'm trying to do for my think, is what I'm trying to do for my kids. I think I don't think I would have kids. I think I don't think I would have kids. I think I don't think I would have maybe not experienced the things that I maybe not experienced the things that I maybe not experienced the things that I would have or I did. I mean either which would have or I did. I mean either which would have or I did. I mean either which way I couldn't change the circumstances way I couldn't change the circumstances way I couldn't change the circumstances of where I grew up. But if I had those, of where I grew up. But if I had those, of where I grew up. But if I had those, you know, coping mechanisms that were you know, coping mechanisms that were you know, coping mechanisms that were healthy, I think I would have been able healthy, I think I would have been able healthy, I think I would have been able to overcome those a lot better than I to overcome those a lot better than I to overcome those a lot better than I did. Um, so I think just being able to did. Um, so I think just being able to did. Um, so I think just being able to instill those in my boys and, you know, instill those in my boys and, you know, instill those in my boys and, you know, in everyone, I think that that's how you in everyone, I think that that's how you in everyone, I think that that's how you get through those things is just being get through those things is just being get through those things is just being able to have the proper tools to handle able to have the proper tools to handle able to have the proper tools to handle them. them. them. >> Yeah, it sounds like you're investing in >> Yeah, it sounds like you're investing in >> Yeah, it sounds like you're investing in all the right stuff. I mean, all the right stuff. I mean, all the right stuff. I mean, >> you can hope, right? What I find >> you can hope, right? What I find >> you can hope, right? What I find phenomenal is just it just shows us that phenomenal is just it just shows us that phenomenal is just it just shows us that as soon as you feel responsible for as soon as you feel responsible for as soon as you feel responsible for someone else, you realize how valuable someone else, you realize how valuable someone else, you realize how valuable it is what you put in your mind, your it is what you put in your mind, your it is what you put in your mind, your body, and everything else, body, and everything else, body, and everything else, >> right? Like that's what it comes from. >> right? Like that's what it comes from. >> right? Like that's what it comes from. As soon as you realize that your actions As soon as you realize that your actions As soon as you realize that your actions affect someone else, you start to take affect someone else, you start to take affect someone else, you start to take so much more accountability and so much more accountability and so much more accountability and responsibility for everything you eat, responsibility for everything you eat, responsibility for everything you eat, consume, read, listen to. consume, read, listen to. consume, read, listen to. >> Yeah. Honestly, even though even on that >> Yeah. Honestly, even though even on that >> Yeah. Honestly, even though even on that too, like having a platform as well. I too, like having a platform as well. I too, like having a platform as well. I think that there's so many, you know, think that there's so many, you know, think that there's so many, you know, young women, men that watch our pages young women, men that watch our pages young women, men that watch our pages and watch the show and I wouldn't want and watch the show and I wouldn't want and watch the show and I wouldn't want to affect them and have my poor choices to affect them and have my poor choices to affect them and have my poor choices affect them as well and they, you know, affect them as well and they, you know, affect them as well and they, you know, mirror those. So, I think being in the mirror those. So, I think being in the mirror those. So, I think being in the position that we are, um, all of us position that we are, um, all of us position that we are, um, all of us women on the show, I think that again women on the show, I think that again women on the show, I think that again using our platforms for good is it's using our platforms for good is it's using our platforms for good is it's beneficial for like a lot of people. beneficial for like a lot of people. beneficial for like a lot of people. >> Yeah. What's your if you could say this >> Yeah. What's your if you could say this >> Yeah. What's your if you could say this is what I want to use my platform for is what I want to use my platform for is what I want to use my platform for right now, what would you say it is? right now, what would you say it is? right now, what would you say it is? >> I think owning single motherhood and >> I think owning single motherhood and >> I think owning single motherhood and being proud to be a single mom. Um, being proud to be a single mom. Um, being proud to be a single mom. Um, owning being a black woman, owning being owning being a black woman, owning being owning being a black woman, owning being a woman, um, and now owning being a by a woman, um, and now owning being a by a woman, um, and now owning being a by woman. So, yeah, I think just being woman. So, yeah, I think just being woman. So, yeah, I think just being truly authentic to like who yourself. I truly authentic to like who yourself. I truly authentic to like who yourself. I hope that that's what people take away hope that that's what people take away hope that that's what people take away from my page. from my page. from my page. >> Yeah. Have you spoken to your partner >> Yeah. Have you spoken to your partner >> Yeah. Have you spoken to your partner and potentially even your children about and potentially even your children about and potentially even your children about your new relationship? your new relationship? your new relationship? >> They aren't really involved with it >> They aren't really involved with it >> They aren't really involved with it right now. I think obviously I'm still right now. I think obviously I'm still right now. I think obviously I'm still kind of exploring and kind of trying to kind of exploring and kind of trying to kind of exploring and kind of trying to navigate this. So until I feel more navigate this. So until I feel more navigate this. So until I feel more steady cuz it's not like I'm going to steady cuz it's not like I'm going to steady cuz it's not like I'm going to change my mind like I know that I am. Um change my mind like I know that I am. Um change my mind like I know that I am. Um I think I'm just going to kind of just I think I'm just going to kind of just I think I'm just going to kind of just handle it on my own until Yeah. until handle it on my own until Yeah. until handle it on my own until Yeah. until the time feels more right. the time feels more right. the time feels more right. >> Yeah. And and what's co-parenting like >> Yeah. And and what's co-parenting like >> Yeah. And and what's co-parenting like in the situation you were talking about in the situation you were talking about in the situation you were talking about how your ex is a great dad and so good how your ex is a great dad and so good how your ex is a great dad and so good to the boys. Like what does that setup to the boys. Like what does that setup to the boys. Like what does that setup look like for you right now? look like for you right now? look like for you right now? >> We're just finally in a place that the >> We're just finally in a place that the >> We're just finally in a place that the emotions have died down. You know, the emotions have died down. You know, the emotions have died down. You know, the initial adjustment period of like initial adjustment period of like initial adjustment period of like getting into a good swing of things with getting into a good swing of things with getting into a good swing of things with co-arenting has finally like set in. And co-arenting has finally like set in. And co-arenting has finally like set in. And I think that at least I can say from my I think that at least I can say from my I think that at least I can say from my behalf, I just I want the best for him. behalf, I just I want the best for him. behalf, I just I want the best for him. Um, and I think we're in a really good Um, and I think we're in a really good Um, and I think we're in a really good place with co-arenting that we just we place with co-arenting that we just we place with co-arenting that we just we want the boys to be happy and we're want the boys to be happy and we're want the boys to be happy and we're doing that, you know, coincide next to doing that, you know, coincide next to doing that, you know, coincide next to each other. And I think that, yeah, each other. And I think that, yeah, each other. And I think that, yeah, we're in like a good rhythm, which is we're in like a good rhythm, which is we're in like a good rhythm, which is nice. nice. nice. >> Yeah. If there's someone who's listening >> Yeah. If there's someone who's listening >> Yeah. If there's someone who's listening right now and they're struggling to come right now and they're struggling to come right now and they're struggling to come out, they're struggling to leave a toxic out, they're struggling to leave a toxic out, they're struggling to leave a toxic relationship, what would you say to relationship, what would you say to relationship, what would you say to them? them? them? I think for me personally, I think I've I think for me personally, I think I've I think for me personally, I think I've just been in survival mode like my whole just been in survival mode like my whole just been in survival mode like my whole entire life. Whether if it was surviving entire life. Whether if it was surviving entire life. Whether if it was surviving my childhood, surviving becoming a my childhood, surviving becoming a my childhood, surviving becoming a single mom, surviving now single single mom, surviving now single single mom, surviving now single motherhood, surviving my eating motherhood, surviving my eating motherhood, surviving my eating disorder, surviving just all these disorder, surviving just all these disorder, surviving just all these things. I just feel like I've just things. I just feel like I've just things. I just feel like I've just constantly been in fight or flight. And constantly been in fight or flight. And constantly been in fight or flight. And life is not meant to just be survived. life is not meant to just be survived. life is not meant to just be survived. You're supposed to enjoy life and you're You're supposed to enjoy life and you're You're supposed to enjoy life and you're supposed to live it to its fullest. And supposed to live it to its fullest. And supposed to live it to its fullest. And I think to do that, you have to be I think to do that, you have to be I think to do that, you have to be authentic and fully yourself. And it's authentic and fully yourself. And it's authentic and fully yourself. And it's scary and it's hard to do that. But who scary and it's hard to do that. But who scary and it's hard to do that. But who are you living your life for if it's not are you living your life for if it's not are you living your life for if it's not for yourself? And I, you know, it took for yourself? And I, you know, it took for yourself? And I, you know, it took me 25 years to fully be completely proud me 25 years to fully be completely proud me 25 years to fully be completely proud of every single part of myself. And I of every single part of myself. And I of every single part of myself. And I wish it happened sooner, but I think wish it happened sooner, but I think wish it happened sooner, but I think everything happens for a reason. So I everything happens for a reason. So I everything happens for a reason. So I just think if you're out there and just think if you're out there and just think if you're out there and you're you're afraid or you're scared, you're you're afraid or you're scared, you're you're afraid or you're scared, be more scared of not being who you are, be more scared of not being who you are, be more scared of not being who you are, >> I think, is like my piece of advice. >> I think, is like my piece of advice. >> I think, is like my piece of advice. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> How old are you now? >> How old are you now? >> How old are you now? >> 25. You're very wise and strong. >> 25. You're very wise and strong. >> 25. You're very wise and strong. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> You're so coherent. I'm like, what? >> You're so coherent. I'm like, what? >> You're so coherent. I'm like, what? Like, how? Like, how did you just say Like, how? Like, how did you just say Like, how? Like, how did you just say that? Like, that? Like, that? Like, >> thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> It's unbelievable how much life you've >> It's unbelievable how much life you've >> It's unbelievable how much life you've squeezed into 25 years. squeezed into 25 years. squeezed into 25 years. >> I know. I'm like, I need a little bit of >> I know. I'm like, I need a little bit of >> I know. I'm like, I need a little bit of a break. I don't know. I'm like, a a break. I don't know. I'm like, a a break. I don't know. I'm like, a little bit less challenges, please. I'm little bit less challenges, please. I'm little bit less challenges, please. I'm just kidding. No, I'm I'm grateful for just kidding. No, I'm I'm grateful for just kidding. No, I'm I'm grateful for everything that I've gone through. I everything that I've gone through. I everything that I've gone through. I think it made me who I am. think it made me who I am. think it made me who I am. >> Yeah. But also, it's like you're saying, >> Yeah. But also, it's like you're saying, >> Yeah. But also, it's like you're saying, I wish I learned it sooner, but I'm like I wish I learned it sooner, but I'm like I wish I learned it sooner, but I'm like 25 is 25 is 25 is >> pretty early to have some of this. >> pretty early to have some of this. >> pretty early to have some of this. There's so many people out there that There's so many people out there that There's so many people out there that are 65 and they still haven't come out. are 65 and they still haven't come out. are 65 and they still haven't come out. So, I think I'm very grateful that I So, I think I'm very grateful that I So, I think I'm very grateful that I felt safe enough at this point to do felt safe enough at this point to do felt safe enough at this point to do that and I hope that for everyone. that and I hope that for everyone. that and I hope that for everyone. >> Yeah. Did you talk to other people who >> Yeah. Did you talk to other people who >> Yeah. Did you talk to other people who had come out and asked them about their had come out and asked them about their had come out and asked them about their experience? Like have you experience? Like have you experience? Like have you >> No, not really. Honestly, like no one >> No, not really. Honestly, like no one >> No, not really. Honestly, like no one really like knows. I just think again really like knows. I just think again really like knows. I just think again like I mentioned earlier, I think my like I mentioned earlier, I think my like I mentioned earlier, I think my thing was for a long time I just I thing was for a long time I just I thing was for a long time I just I didn't know how didn't know how didn't know how to do it and I just thought that one day to do it and I just thought that one day to do it and I just thought that one day I would just date a girl and just be I would just date a girl and just be I would just date a girl and just be like, "Hey, this is this is my like, "Hey, this is this is my like, "Hey, this is this is my girlfriend." And just, you know, see how girlfriend." And just, you know, see how girlfriend." And just, you know, see how people would react there. But people would react there. But people would react there. But >> I the platform that I have just I want >> I the platform that I have just I want >> I the platform that I have just I want to be able to help people that are in to be able to help people that are in to be able to help people that are in similar situations. And I think that's similar situations. And I think that's similar situations. And I think that's why I wanted this to happen the way that why I wanted this to happen the way that why I wanted this to happen the way that it is right now to just be able to help it is right now to just be able to help it is right now to just be able to help people. Are there any other friends that people. Are there any other friends that people. Are there any other friends that you know that have come out or people you know that have come out or people you know that have come out or people that you that you that you >> Yeah, I have so many friends that are in >> Yeah, I have so many friends that are in >> Yeah, I have so many friends that are in the community as well and the people the community as well and the people the community as well and the people that like do know have been like nothing that like do know have been like nothing that like do know have been like nothing but supportive and just like so excited but supportive and just like so excited but supportive and just like so excited and they're just like you're connecting and they're just like you're connecting and they're just like you're connecting with another soul. It doesn't matter if with another soul. It doesn't matter if with another soul. It doesn't matter if they're a guy, if they're a girl, it they're a guy, if they're a girl, it they're a guy, if they're a girl, it doesn't matter. We just want you to be doesn't matter. We just want you to be doesn't matter. We just want you to be happy. happy. happy. >> Yeah. What What are you most excited to >> Yeah. What What are you most excited to >> Yeah. What What are you most excited to do now that you're out and do now that you're out and do now that you're out and >> Oh my gosh. >> Oh my gosh. >> Oh my gosh. >> able to say out loud >> able to say out loud >> able to say out loud >> make out with her in public and not have >> make out with her in public and not have >> make out with her in public and not have someone be like, "What is going on?" Is someone be like, "What is going on?" Is someone be like, "What is going on?" Is that Leila from Secret Life with a girl? that Leila from Secret Life with a girl? that Leila from Secret Life with a girl? Just Yeah. Just be able to be like fully Just Yeah. Just be able to be like fully Just Yeah. Just be able to be like fully me and own it. me and own it. me and own it. >> I'm sure after this hopefully you feel >> I'm sure after this hopefully you feel >> I'm sure after this hopefully you feel safe and you know I think I think that's safe and you know I think I think that's safe and you know I think I think that's what I always wish for people when what I always wish for people when what I always wish for people when they're making big changes in their life they're making big changes in their life they're making big changes in their life and and and >> making these moves is that people feel >> making these moves is that people feel >> making these moves is that people feel safe. I think that's something everyone safe. I think that's something everyone safe. I think that's something everyone deserves for their choices. When people deserves for their choices. When people deserves for their choices. When people are not breaking the law or doing are not breaking the law or doing are not breaking the law or doing something wrong or something wrong or something wrong or >> it's almost like can people just feel >> it's almost like can people just feel >> it's almost like can people just feel safe for their choices that are true to safe for their choices that are true to safe for their choices that are true to their soul and their heart. And I I their soul and their heart. And I I their soul and their heart. And I I really hope Ila that you feel safe really hope Ila that you feel safe really hope Ila that you feel safe >> and that you know you get to explore the >> and that you know you get to explore the >> and that you know you get to explore the life and experience the life that you life and experience the life that you life and experience the life that you really really want. really really want. really really want. >> Thank you. I appreciate that so much. >> Thank you. I appreciate that so much. >> Thank you. I appreciate that so much. >> Ila, we end every episode of On Purpose >> Ila, we end every episode of On Purpose >> Ila, we end every episode of On Purpose with a final five. These questions have with a final five. These questions have with a final five. These questions have to be answered in one sentence. to be answered in one sentence. to be answered in one sentence. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And so Ila, this is your final five. Uh >> And so Ila, this is your final five. Uh >> And so Ila, this is your final five. Uh question number one, what is the best question number one, what is the best question number one, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received? advice you've ever heard or received? advice you've ever heard or received? >> Your love for yourself has to be >> Your love for yourself has to be >> Your love for yourself has to be stronger than your desire to be loved. stronger than your desire to be loved. stronger than your desire to be loved. >> That's great advice. Who told you that? >> That's great advice. Who told you that? >> That's great advice. Who told you that? >> I think I just saw it on like Pinterest. >> I think I just saw it on like Pinterest. >> I think I just saw it on like Pinterest. actually, but I feel like it's like it's actually, but I feel like it's like it's actually, but I feel like it's like it's a really good one and I think it applies a really good one and I think it applies a really good one and I think it applies to a lot of things. So, to a lot of things. So, to a lot of things. So, >> say it again. >> say it again. >> say it again. >> Your love for yourself has to be higher >> Your love for yourself has to be higher >> Your love for yourself has to be higher than your desire to be loved. than your desire to be loved. than your desire to be loved. >> That's great. I love that. Great piece >> That's great. I love that. Great piece >> That's great. I love that. Great piece of advice. That's an awesome one. Never of advice. That's an awesome one. Never of advice. That's an awesome one. Never had it. Uh, second question. What is the had it. Uh, second question. What is the had it. Uh, second question. What is the worst advice you've ever heard or worst advice you've ever heard or worst advice you've ever heard or received? received? received? >> I think it relates probably back to >> I think it relates probably back to >> I think it relates probably back to what we were talking about earlier that what we were talking about earlier that what we were talking about earlier that I used to be in a toxic cycle of I used to be in a toxic cycle of I used to be in a toxic cycle of constantly, you know, putting my work constantly, you know, putting my work constantly, you know, putting my work into other people and being in a lot of into other people and being in a lot of into other people and being in a lot of relationships. I think one cheesy saying relationships. I think one cheesy saying relationships. I think one cheesy saying that when you're going through a that when you're going through a that when you're going through a breakup, I feel like people throw this breakup, I feel like people throw this breakup, I feel like people throw this around like casually. They're always around like casually. They're always around like casually. They're always like, "The best way to get over someone like, "The best way to get over someone like, "The best way to get over someone is to get under somebody else." So, that is to get under somebody else." So, that is to get under somebody else." So, that one, I'm like, "Oh my gosh." No. Take one, I'm like, "Oh my gosh." No. Take one, I'm like, "Oh my gosh." No. Take time to yourself, girlfriend. time to yourself, girlfriend. time to yourself, girlfriend. >> Pick up a book or something. A hobby. I >> Pick up a book or something. A hobby. I >> Pick up a book or something. A hobby. I don't know. don't know. don't know. >> That's great. That's awesome. What a >> That's great. That's awesome. What a >> That's great. That's awesome. What a great answer. great answer. great answer. >> Uh, okay. Question. You You're killing >> Uh, okay. Question. You You're killing >> Uh, okay. Question. You You're killing these. You're You're killing these. these. You're You're killing these. these. You're You're killing these. People usually struggle with that one. People usually struggle with that one. People usually struggle with that one. That's a great answer. Uh, question That's a great answer. Uh, question That's a great answer. Uh, question number three. How do you define a good number three. How do you define a good number three. How do you define a good friend? who I think someone that loves friend? who I think someone that loves friend? who I think someone that loves you through all stages, you through all stages, you through all stages, >> every phase of life. >> every phase of life. >> every phase of life. >> In every phase of life. Yeah. Every >> In every phase of life. Yeah. Every >> In every phase of life. Yeah. Every chapter, every challenge, just chapter, every challenge, just chapter, every challenge, just everything. Yeah. everything. Yeah. everything. Yeah. >> Uh question number four. I'm going to >> Uh question number four. I'm going to >> Uh question number four. I'm going to add two parts to this. Uh repeat after add two parts to this. Uh repeat after add two parts to this. Uh repeat after me and finish. This is about me and finish. This is about me and finish. This is about overthinking. So, repeat after me and overthinking. So, repeat after me and overthinking. So, repeat after me and finish the sentence. I think I think too finish the sentence. I think I think too finish the sentence. I think I think too much about much about much about >> I think I think too much about >> I think I think too much about >> I think I think too much about perception and how people view me. perception and how people view me. perception and how people view me. >> Is that something you're still working >> Is that something you're still working >> Is that something you're still working on right now? on right now? on right now? >> Yeah. I think that's something that like >> Yeah. I think that's something that like >> Yeah. I think that's something that like in the space that we are in, I think in the space that we are in, I think in the space that we are in, I think that's something we see every day, you that's something we see every day, you that's something we see every day, you know, people's opinions of us and it's know, people's opinions of us and it's know, people's opinions of us and it's hard to not take things to heart. But hard to not take things to heart. But hard to not take things to heart. But I'm just yeah, stepping into an era that I'm just yeah, stepping into an era that I'm just yeah, stepping into an era that I just want to be authentically me and I just want to be authentically me and I just want to be authentically me and you either like it or you don't. So you either like it or you don't. So you either like it or you don't. So >> yeah, good for you. I love that. Okay, >> yeah, good for you. I love that. Okay, >> yeah, good for you. I love that. Okay, fifth and final question. We ask this to fifth and final question. We ask this to fifth and final question. We ask this to every guest who's been on the show. If every guest who's been on the show. If every guest who's been on the show. If you could create one law that everyone you could create one law that everyone you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would in the world had to follow, what would in the world had to follow, what would it be? You're not allowed to convert to it be? You're not allowed to convert to it be? You're not allowed to convert to Mormonism until you have a greater Mormonism until you have a greater Mormonism until you have a greater understanding. understanding. understanding. >> Wow. Just kidding. >> Wow. Just kidding. >> Wow. Just kidding. >> No, that's you can't No, I like the idea >> No, that's you can't No, I like the idea >> No, that's you can't No, I like the idea that you can't I I get the point you're that you can't I I get the point you're that you can't I I get the point you're making is you can't make a commitment to making is you can't make a commitment to making is you can't make a commitment to something without actually something without actually something without actually >> knowing enough about it. >> knowing enough about it. >> knowing enough about it. >> Yeah. Because was it was it you I'm >> Yeah. Because was it was it you I'm >> Yeah. Because was it was it you I'm assuming it was easy as it was. assuming it was easy as it was. assuming it was easy as it was. >> It was five lessons you have to do and >> It was five lessons you have to do and >> It was five lessons you have to do and then you disagree at the end if you want then you disagree at the end if you want then you disagree at the end if you want to and I had no understanding of a lot to and I had no understanding of a lot to and I had no understanding of a lot of things. I feel like I get the of things. I feel like I get the of things. I feel like I get the question a lot of like oh do you not did question a lot of like oh do you not did question a lot of like oh do you not did you not know about the history of like you not know about the history of like you not know about the history of like this about that and I was like no they this about that and I was like no they this about that and I was like no they did not teach me that in my lessons did not teach me that in my lessons did not teach me that in my lessons they're teaching me like very minimal. they're teaching me like very minimal. they're teaching me like very minimal. So yeah. So yeah. So yeah. >> Yeah. I mean that's all history >> Yeah. I mean that's all history >> Yeah. I mean that's all history everywhere I feel like everything they everywhere I feel like everything they everywhere I feel like everything they teach. Yeah that's uh that's a good teach. Yeah that's uh that's a good teach. Yeah that's uh that's a good answer. Uh Leila Taylor, thank you so answer. Uh Leila Taylor, thank you so answer. Uh Leila Taylor, thank you so much for your time, your energy. I'm so much for your time, your energy. I'm so much for your time, your energy. I'm so grateful you came all the way here. I'm grateful you came all the way here. I'm grateful you came all the way here. I'm thankful to have this conversation with thankful to have this conversation with thankful to have this conversation with you. I feel so lucky and you. I feel so lucky and you. I feel so lucky and >> uh appreciate so much that you chose us >> uh appreciate so much that you chose us >> uh appreciate so much that you chose us to share this big news. And as I said, I to share this big news. And as I said, I to share this big news. And as I said, I really hope you feel safe. I hope you really hope you feel safe. I hope you really hope you feel safe. I hope you feel uh the love of our community and feel uh the love of our community and feel uh the love of our community and everyone else that sees this podcast and everyone else that sees this podcast and everyone else that sees this podcast and hope you feel the support. I know that hope you feel the support. I know that hope you feel the support. I know that >> the GLAD Awards in LA are my favorite >> the GLAD Awards in LA are my favorite >> the GLAD Awards in LA are my favorite event event event >> of the year. Like the community is just >> of the year. Like the community is just >> of the year. Like the community is just unbelievable. I know every year when I unbelievable. I know every year when I unbelievable. I know every year when I go to that event or every time I have go to that event or every time I have go to that event or every time I have been, sorry, not every year. Every time been, sorry, not every year. Every time been, sorry, not every year. Every time I go to that event, I go to that event, I go to that event, >> honestly, the community is just the most >> honestly, the community is just the most >> honestly, the community is just the most fun. I don't know if you've ever been. fun. I don't know if you've ever been. fun. I don't know if you've ever been. >> No, never. I hope you get to go. Yeah, >> No, never. I hope you get to go. Yeah, >> No, never. I hope you get to go. Yeah, it's awesome. Thank you so much. Thank it's awesome. Thank you so much. Thank it's awesome. Thank you so much. Thank you. you. you. >> If you're feeling inspired by this >> If you're feeling inspired by this >> If you're feeling inspired by this episode, you won't want to miss my episode, you won't want to miss my episode, you won't want to miss my conversation with Wicked's Cynthia conversation with Wicked's Cynthia conversation with Wicked's Cynthia Arivo. Arivo. Arivo. >> We are afraid to let a person go, and we >> We are afraid to let a person go, and we >> We are afraid to let a person go, and we need to be okay with letting people go. need to be okay with letting people go. need to be okay with letting people go. We don't know what path people are We don't know what path people are We don't know what path people are walking on when they walk into our walking on when they walk into our walking on when they walk into our lives. We might just be a stepping stone lives. We might just be a stepping stone lives. We might just be a stepping stone in their path just like stepping stones in their path just like stepping stones in their path just like stepping stones in their