JRE MMA Show #186 with Sean Sharaf

Key Takeaway

After a huge win—or any major life event—do not make permanent decisions at peak emotion. Create a short decompression window: reduce interviews, notifications, and outside opinions; return to stabilizing routines such as walking your dog, sleeping, and spending time with trusted people; then assess whether your next move serves a deeper purpose or merely chases another high. Clarity is more valuable than immediate momentum when your health, finances, and long-term direction are on the line.

Episode Overview

Joe Rogan speaks with heavyweight MMA fighter Sean Sharaf following his 12-second upset knockout of heavily favored Gable Steveson. Sharaf recounts an unstable, self-funded path through fight camp, questions whether to continue fighting after achieving his dream UFC win, and discusses the need for purpose, coaching, recovery, and trustworthy support. The conversation also ranges across MMA rules, supplements, technology, surveillance, AI, and public discourse.

Full Transcript

Transcript of JRE MMA Show #186 with Sean Sharaf from Joe Rogan Experience. Auto-generated from episode audio; may contain minor errors.

Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. TRAIN BY DAY. JOE ROGAN PODCAST BY NIGHT. All day. What's going on, man? This is Joe Rogan. How you feeling? I feel incredible, man. I feel You must be It's been one hell of a week. It's been crazy. It has to be the craziest week of your life, right? or up to it by I mean this is this is pretty pretty up there. It's been some crazy weeks. So talk me through this. When did you get the uh the offer for the fight?

How long out? So they had mentioned possibly me fighting him on the White House. They asked me that was the the the ali reached out to me. He's like, "Hey, like they they're talking about possibly getting you on the White House. They know you're a Marine and whatnot. Uh they want Gable Stevenson." And I was like, "Fucking I don't care. I've been watching Gable since he he was coming up on the regional scene since you were talking about him and I everyone was all hyped about him and so I kind of already knew we were going to cross paths but it wasn't until um I was requesting to get on the LA card.

I heard they were coming to LA and I kept saying hey I want LA and I just like all right you got LA you're fighting Gable. So there was a conversation about the White House card. So this is June. That's when it first came up. And so how did it wind up taking place in September? Uh well I just never heard back. They talked about it. They were like would you take it? And I was like, "Sure." And I think I think maybe they were trying to get Jones on there too, possibly.

I think that might have been what it was that I think Dana was hesitant. Yeah. To get John on there. Yeah. And and so I think it was like a oh, if I'm not going and maybe Gabe was I don't know what it was, but they just I just That was the first time I was approached like, "Hey, would you be open to fighting him on the White House?" And I was like, "Of course, fuck." And so how long out did they tell you about the LA card?

uh about six weeks, but I had already been in camp because I was supposed to fight Taiu Ivasa and I had to pull out because my nose got broken in that camp. So, I was basically in in the camp for the tie fight and then I went straight into that into the the next camp as soon as I got cleared to start sparring and and stuff. But I was still training the whole time. I was running. I was I went full [ __ ] I I retained my seed.

I was [ __ ] Did you really? Yeah, bro. I went full eight weeks. No no no no no jerk out, no sex, no nothing. I went full like marine mode. That's why you guys saw that that mat on the ground the in the studio was because I was like was like really [ __ ] going to I got I end up getting air mattress after I texted Strickland cuz he's like and um you were sleeping on a mat. Yeah. Tell people about that. Well, basically because I I I have um obviously my all my finances are out there already.

I could I didn't have anything in my name. So I've been I've been bouncing around from Fighter Houses. There's Fighter House LV they started out and um there's like 40 bucks a room you get. And I was also staying in the casinos [ __ ] gambling, doing a bunch of dumb [ __ ] And um stayed in my car a few times, bouncing back forth with my mom. It was just a a little bit of a chaotic situation. And uh I got the spot. I I got a front from my management.

They they gave me four grand cuz I I was basically was in California and I stayed out there with my mom and I had to come back out here for the camp and I was like, "Hey, I need funds. Can you guys give me?" And uh they fronted me four grand on my purse and they said, "Hey, um get get whatever you want." I mean, they weren't very involved like if I'm being honest. I kind of had to figure it out on my own. Like and um yeah, I had a friend.

He got me a sub lease, got me a spot, and I just [ __ ] Well, it's such a crazy rocky story. I know, man. That feels like [ __ ] movie. Like some I'm saying it and I don't even know like I'm like, "Bro, like people aren't going to believe this [ __ ] Like I got to [ __ ] show the receipts, you know? Like I'm going to show you some [ __ ] some shit." I mean, I've never experienced something like that, but it has to be like right now even.

It's hard to believe that you did what you did. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz I I I I like believed I was going to win. Like I was telling myself, but it was I believed it was going to be a war. I believed it was going to be my whole game plan was like he he sure he might get the takedown. You're going to stay in his [ __ ] face. I was I was screaming the [ __ ] affirm the Jon Jones speech when he's like [ __ ] when he told DC and he was all like there's nothing you could do to stop me from coming after you round after round with the most malicious techniques I know you will lose this fight Gable Stevenson you will lose this fight and I will and I was just like just just telling myself that I was going to go through hell for this you know because all my previous fights it was first round knockouts all my victories first round knockouts and it kind of gave me the delusion that I'm just touch guys and they're going to fall but then when I got to the UFC like I had that that loss with Taffa and I had Aspen.

I [ __ ] kept cracking him. He wouldn't fall. And then um I kind of started doubting my power a little bit. I kind of started like questioning like, "Hey, like [ __ ] can I do this?" And so like when I just hit him with that left hook and he fell, I was like I started cussing. I jumped on. I was [ __ ] bro. I was like, "What the [ __ ] is going on, man?" You were uh he was a minus 2400 favorite.

Yeah. The disrespect. Was it 2400 or? Yeah, it was. That's what it was. Okay. I just want to be really clear about that. That's a crazy number as for heavyweight. For heavyweight, it might be the biggest at least bookmaker odds. It might be the biggest upset in the history of the sport. That's what they're saying. Yeah. I mean, even with Holly Holm and Ronda Rousey, it was just like Holly Holm was dangerous. She was a multiple time world kickboxing champion, multiple time world boxing champion. You know, she was a legitimate striker.

that, you know, I could see Holly being, you know, a 10 to one dog or something like that, but this was Yeah. And I think the fact I was coming off of two losses like uh like, bro, I lost my discipline a lot, you know, coming up grinding for this and uh here it is. Let's watch it again. Yeah. So, you just know it's real. BOOM. IT'S OVER. OH MY GOODNESS. OH MY GOD. ONE LEFT. That's me. Oh my god. Oh my goodness. Unbelievable. Look at that game.

Good night kick. One more time. Boom. Oh, the way the head snaps back too. Oh, what did it feel like when you're standing there holding your arms up? Were you like in space? Were you in another galaxy? Everything just felt like so euphor like even like I haven't seen the clips. I remember I I shook Joan's hand and his hand before they left, but like everyone was saying like, "Are you sure you did that?" Because like I I vividly remember like before they walked out and and everyone started booing like I shook their hand.

Uh I shook his like that was it. I didn't say nothing. And um but like bro everything just feels like I haven't even gotten a chance to digest it. Like I've been just going this whole week like doing interviews after interviews and Zoom and it's like I'm so exhaust like I just want to go to a mountain or to the desert and [ __ ] take some mushrooms with my dog and just [ __ ] like process what the [ __ ] is going on, man.

That probably might be a good idea too so you can stay on the course, you know, because one of the problems with like a big event or a big moment is you can be defined by that big event and big moment and that big moment can be like a centerpiece in your life instead of the path, right? So the path you're on is getting better as an MMA fighter, achieving like world class status, fighting for a title eventually. That's the path. Is it though, Joe? Yeah, why not?

Is it? Well, that's why I want to ask you because like I I mean, bro, if you can do that, everyone's making it seem like this is just a [ __ ] lucky punch, one shot. And like my So, this is my thing is I've always take been taking my journey fight like I like I got out the Marine Corps and I was like, hey, like I want to be a UFC fighter and like it wasn't like, oh, I want to be a champion, you know?

It was just like I just wanted to be in the organization and wear the uniform and just be able be able to [ __ ] say I did that. And the fact that I just lost like those two times like [ __ ] like they gave me the uniform but it didn't feel like it. And so now like to do this the people are saying possibly the biggest upset in history [ __ ] in my home like [ __ ] against all odds. I'm like bro like it like can I beat that?

Like do I you leave the table when you're up? That's what they say, you know? Like [ __ ] like are you thinking about doing that? Are you thinking about leaving the table? I'm I'm I'm told I'm not going I told Micah the psych at the the PI. I told my Sergey, my training partner. I told Gokore. I told all these guys. I was like, "Hey, bro. If I win this fight, the like the way I'm visualizing, I like I might be good with that because this is [ __ ] like that was it, you know?" And I don't I don't know.

Like just cuz it was such a big moment. Just the No, it's the fact of what I had to go through cuz like, brother, I've had zero sponsors. I got zero promo. I got zero like any kind of like support throughout this whole thing. Like even like with the coaching, you know, like my corner like I was scrambling to figure that out, you know, and it was just like I had to beg for so much [ __ ] help throughout this process. It just made me [ __ ] like it was just put a little sour taste in my bro like [ __ ] like for what?

Like and then on top of that I got [ __ ] CT scan. They're saying I got some [ __ ] brain matter and [ __ ] I'm [ __ ] stitched up from head to toe. I got [ __ ] all types of injuries. Like and I'm like bro what am I doing it for? just [ __ ] for more money for for for a belt like what what am I doing for that's why I I'm trying to figure out the answers myself. That's interesting.

Well, if that's the case, then definitely go take mushrooms with your dog. That's why I'm like maybe you can help me advise me here. The decision is always going to be entirely yours because it's dependent entirely upon who you are, where you are, and I don't know that. I don't know where you're at in your life. I don't know where you're at with your mind. I don't know. There's nothing wrong with you walking away right now if you choose to do that. Um, so you have to think about it.

And I think a moment like that, like I said, was so big, you have to let it settle before you decide what you're going to do. There's a lot of people um there there's there's a bunch of different ways to approach fighting. And I think one of the worst ways is to chase glory, you know, because glory does come to the greats. in and in in that glory, you know, the glory that Justin Gatechi got when he beat Ilia Tapora at the White House. No one's ever going to experience that.

The one of the greatest moments in the history of combat sports, right? That was my logic, too, cuz like when I saw that the Gachi upset, I was like, bro, like what more do you have to prove? Like he just shocked the [ __ ] world. Yeah, he could he could certainly walk especially Gachi. He's had this insane career in incredible career. He could definitely walk away now and be one of the all-time greats. But Connor for instance, like Connor's last fight, like it seemed like Connor was doing it to show that he could still do it.

Seemed and I don't know, you know, I didn't talk to him. I haven't had a conversation with him as a person, but it seemed like he wanted to be on top again. He wanted to show that he could go out there and still beat a world-class fighter like M Max Holloway and just show that he could do it. And you got to wonder, is that the best motivation for a guy that's worth half a billion dollars and is [ __ ] living in the lap of luxury?

And no, he's just chasing the high. He's chasing. He's like, he's like was like, I just want to go out on top, going on top. He's chasing the high versus is he chasing the dream? So like when he knocked out Jose Aldo, he was chasing the dream. He was a juggernaut. He was storming through the division. He was knocking everybody out. He looked like this guy that had this phenomenal talent and this special charisma and he looked like a guy who is chasing this this thing, this dream, this dream of becoming a world champion.

So then you achieve it and then I think the big derailment was the Floyd Mayweather fight, right? He leaves MMA, trains boxing for a while, has a great performance against Floyd Mayweather, one of the greatest boxers of all time, does 10 rounds with him, which is [ __ ] insane. Did you see my video with him before the fight? No. Oh, I went viral with with with with Floyd. Yeah. I ran into him at Lifetime and I was like really cuz cuz I started promoting myself.

So like that was the issue. Like I kept seeing these collabs and these promos with with Gable and I was like, "Bro, what the [ __ ] man?" Like why is no one pushing me? So I started like just going outside the PI and I was like I did my own promo and then like just the odds like the next day I ran into Floyd at the [ __ ] at the Lifetime and I was like, "Hey man, let me get a quick video [ __ ] uh to promote my fight and whatnot." So uh it's just ironic you say Floyd.

That's funny. That's funny. Well, that's just to be expected. You got to realize Gable is first of all Olympic gold medalist, one of the greatest heavyweight wrestlers in the United States has ever produced, right? And then he goes on to be undefeated in MMA, wins that fight in dirty boxing. He's an athletic freak and he's being chain trained by Jon Jones. But who did he beat on the regional scene? That's what didn't impress me. He he got wheel kicked in Mexico. The guy was like 1 and0 that he was being like cuz I was 4 and0 on the regional scene, too.

Then I got You're 100% correct in that regard. But he couldn't get any fights. Nobody any good wanted to fight him because he's Gable. Because he's this insane freak wrestler and they want to win and they want to make their way through, you know, whatever regional circuit it is, get a really good record and get some experience before they get into the UFC. They don't want to get flatlined. They don't want to get beat up and smashed. Yeah. They want, you know, they want and a good manager treats their fighters that way.

A good manager says, "Listen, you're not ready for that yet. We're going to get you this guy. Don't get beat by him yet. you you can eventually beat him, but we have to develop these skills. We have to develop these techniques. We have to get you some seasoning. You have to get some hard fights against some really tough guys so you know what the the [ __ ] basement feels like. You got to know what it's like to be in the dungeon. You know, he wasn't in the dungeon.

Wasn't in the dungeon. They were [ __ ] coddling him and pampering him. Well, I I think also when you're that good of an athlete and you've had that much success in wrestling, which is, you know, this celebrated incredible sport, and then you enter into MMA with all that hype and fanfare, you start to believe that you are special and you're invincible and and you're not a regular human being with with very good skills. Cuz that's what he is, a regular human being with very good skills.

And you showed it. You showed it with a [ __ ] perfect left hook when you stepped outside and then it was everything in that left hook. It was pretty. It was technical. It was perfect. And he was reaching at the time, too. So, and that Well, that was the other thing. He he was closing his eyes. And that was I saw on the replay. And that comes because he isn't smart enough. He he hasn't had that experience of [ __ ] being in the fire over and over again.

He's only been striking for like a year and a half. That's That's why that's why when they asked me, they tried to make it seem like I was talking [ __ ] They're like, "Are you impressed by Gay?" I was like, "No, I'm not impressed." Like, "What what are you not impressed about?" I'm like, "What the [ __ ] What? He's an Olympic gold medalist, but what? This is fighting and we're going to fight." Yeah. Well, his first fight, he got tagged a bunch, the first fight in the UFC, and that guy fought well.

He he hit him with some good shots. That guy was there to win. He just he just, you know, was overwhelmed. Gable got him. But that [ __ ] left hook changed the landscape of the universe, dude. That left hook changed changed your life. Changed the world. Yeah. There was so many people that even before the fight, they're like, if you beat Gable, I'm going to name my kid after you. Like, I'm putting my mortgage down. Like, bro, like like I was like, I don't know if these comments are real, but like there was so many people messaging me and commenting like and even like with the press conference, like they were telling me like like please bring up his past.

Please bring up his past, you know? And I was all like, "Shit, but [ __ ] I fought for my freedom of speech, man. I don't give a [ __ ] I'll say what I what I want, you know?" And yeah, it's a lot. Like the whole the whole buildup to a fight is so much. There's so much talking. There's so many people talking at you and there's so many narratives. There's so many pe like you could get your brain really [ __ ] scrambled during those things, including him like believing the hype or anybody believing the hype.

And what was crazy was we weren't even supposed to be on the press conference or even on the main card until Ortega fell out. And that was like that felt like divine intervention, bro. Cuz I was just like, oh like like I thought I was I was going to get the press conference and when I got to fight week it was like there there was I wasn't on there and then that next day they were like oh no you're you're you're main card you're going you're going to the press conference.

So maybe that I wouldn't have gotten in his head if I didn't get in the press conference, you know, because that was that was strategic. Like I I was saying in interviews before like that's psychological warfare. Oh, it's fair love and war. And it's like if if you don't know how to handle that, I mean I like like I said, I just brought brought things to light. Like yeah, that was all I did. And um if you if you can let that get under your skin, like who knows if it let it get under his skin.

I mean, even if there was nothing going on, you might have still hit him with that exact same punch. I think there's a there's a gap in experience and there's a gap in striking ability. I mean, he obviously is an incredible athlete and he's very good at being the hammer. You know, he can unload combinations on guys. We've seen it, you know, we saw it in Dirty Boxing, but striking, you know, as well as anybody. It is a [ __ ] complicated thing that takes a long time to figure out.

There's a lot of elements to it. There's a lot of knowledge, foot placement, where to be, where not to be, what to do, what not to do. You get caught doing something. You need a really good coach to explain to you how you got caught and never get caught like that again because you need to do this or you need to do that. Make sure your foot is outside of the line. Make sure your head's off the center line. There's a bunch of different [ __ ] that takes [ __ ] forever for your brain to absorb and then absorb to the point where you can it just memory muscle memory inside of chaos and combat.

I I truly felt in flow state when I have like I I was not thinking like I didn't go out like oh I'm going to throw the two or the the whole game plan was like don't overrespect the wrestling and put hands on this [ __ ] Like that was that was that was the game plan. Like like obviously like I knew like he might get the takedown but like I said I was just telling myself you're going to get up. You're going to [ __ ] stay in his face over and over again.

I think a big flaw that he did in both the first fight and the fight with you is I don't even think he was thinking about taking you down. Yeah, which is really crazy. He's going to be shooting his next fight. That's for sure. Yeah. Yeah, I would imagine. I would imagine that would be a good idea. I mean, it's when it's your number one skill set. It's crazy. It's like Wonderboy deciding not to kick. Like what? But it's also cuz like he was getting praised like he like he he was constantly being told like he's the greatest thing.

He's knocking these guys out. Even Dana like in after the press conference and in his first fight, he was just like praising him like oh like he's he's striking with guys, knocking guys out when he could be using his wrestling and like I think it just like got to him. And when I when I knew I had him was when I saw he booked that RAF fight during during the fight camp. He went and did an RAF fight like a few weeks uh RAF wrestling match be a few weeks before our fight.

I was like, "This [ __ ] is not taking me seriously. This [ __ ] going to book [ __ ] rather." And I'm over there getting my ass beat [ __ ] every day [ __ ] with Sergey Spivok. Uh uh Bloy was was working with me. [ __ ] Wan Coutaba like and uh and and I had to wear my my head gear cuz my nose was broken. That that and that thing was like suffocating me and these guys were just putting me in the worst positions over and over again.

Starting from [ __ ] bottom, [ __ ] pick me up. Matt Return, slam me back down, brother. That's what it felt. I love Rocky, man. And like you're a Rocky story, man. You are a real life Rocky story. 100%, man. It feels It feels real. This episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. It's football season and Uber Eats is delivering deals every game day. This week, double down on proteinpacked sandwiches with buy one get one select 6in subs from Subway. Whether you're keeping it low-key for the game or hosting friends, Uber Eats has deals to keep you fed.

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Crazy. Really felt like it was it was just karma and divine intervention cuz the way he was disrespecting me too, man. He call me a coward, saying like he's the reason that I'm there and [ __ ] he uh my hotel room is paid because of Gable Steven. What's up with him talking in third person? I know maybe he was your boy and he was he was I saw him on here before, but this dude's talking about in third person all the time. Like, what the [ __ ] is up with that?

The third person stuff is very weird. You know who used to do that, who I love, who used to do that all the time, is Roy Jones. Yeah, Roy Jones Jr. is going to do what Roy Jones Jr. wants to do. Is he here right now? Is Roy in the room with us? That's a strange thing that people do, that third person thing. It is odd. It's It's like an elitist thing, you know? Yeah. like he's he like I said he just think he's all that.

So I'm just I'm glad I could bring him back down to reality because like it's probably good for him too if he decides to actually continue and pursue his career and become a world champion. That might be a blessing in disguise because it was a fight that allowed him to recognize that the skills that he has in wrestling other people have similar skills in striking and similar skills in all the other aspects of MMA. And then you know you there's no shortcuts. Just because you're a really good wrestler doesn't mean you're an elite kickboxer.

You know, it just doesn't it doesn't translate. You have to learn those things. Yes, sir. And you know, you a guy becomes amazing because of his accomplishments, but before those accomplishments, you're not necessarily amazing at and his accomplishments were all in a completely different discipline. I mean, it translates. It's one of the most important disciplines, probably the most important discipline for MMA if you use it right. If you use it, it's probably like the ability to take a guy down and control a guy, it stifles all striking, right?

If a guy, if he just decided to avoid you standing up and then shoot and he got you down, we're talking about a whole different fight, right? 100%. Yeah, but when you get it in your head, ain't no rematch, though, buddy. Everyone's like, "What's next? When's the re [ __ ] you?" You going to sleep with that [ __ ] Motherfucker's not getting his dick up for [ __ ] weeks, man. I took his soul. You heard the whole David Gogggins when he said that [ __ ] He's like, "Yeah, you're not going to [ __ ] live with that for a little bit, bro." Well, psychologically, it's why would you schedule a rematch quickly, if at all?

Like, there's no reason. First of all, on paper, it's 12 seconds. It's not It's not like a controversial decision, right? Controversial decisions war in a rematch. You know, really good war goes to the judges, could have gone either way. That makes sense. 12 second knockouts don't get rematches. That doesn't make any sense. That makes zero sense. Yeah, it doesn't make sense. He's going to have to figure out why he's deciding to strike and then really tighten up his striking. He's going to have to watch that film footage and see what he did wrong.

You know, there's a bunch of different striking analysts have broken down the video and you know, you could see you did everything right and he didn't. Real simple, you know, and he's a human and you're a big [ __ ] and you got a big [ __ ] with a big left hook and you land that on virtually any human being alive. You catch them on the chin like that where their head snaps back like that. It's like 10 pounds of pressure. That's all you need to tip the chin, right?

Was a lot more than 10. I mean, he snapped his head back. But, you know, listen, guys have come back from knockouts like that and become all-time greats. Look at Michael Bisping. Michael Bisping gets flatlined by Henderson and then goes on to become an all-time great and wins the middleweight title, knocks out Luke Rockwell, defended it against Henderson. And I said it in my postfight interview like I I I kept it classy. I was like, "Hey, look, like this is going to make him better." Like there's a but like right now I'm on my victory lap and like I'm going to talk some [ __ ] cuz the [ __ ] disrespected the [ __ ] his whole team disrespect like Jones driving around with him in the Mercedes like tonight we collect a head, you know?

Like bro what? Like come on Jones like you of all people know not to underestimate someone. Like come on man. Like well John's a different guy. He's a different but they made him think that he was next Jon Jones. I know. And Jon Jones is a different [ __ ] I've studied Jon Jones my whole [ __ ] life, man. Like like you saw the picture with me and him like that we took and I was like this is going to be my exam, you know.

And um I can even show you the DMs that I've sent I'm like [ __ ] I told him like this was going to happen you know for him to be there [ __ ] front row and then that viral reaction of oh my goodness. It's crazy. I mean that's unreal. Yeah. You can't pretend that you're the guy that you're hanging out with. That's that's a bad thing. Yeah, John is a very unique athlete, though. I mean, he's he's a one of one. He's the goat.

I mean, what he did to serial gone, I just watched that fight again. It's [ __ ] insane. Serial never touched him. He got a hold of Cirill, dragged him to the ground, strangled him, tap tap. That's it. That's a wrap. Walked away, didn't get scratched. Yeah. And then now you have serial guns, the heavyweight champion of the world. And you see what he did to Pereira. You see what he did at least in the first round before the eye pokes to Aspenol. It's like Sir Gan's a special athlete and Jon made him look unspecial.

Yeah. But Gable's not that. He's not the same guy. He's not that guy. You know, takes a long [ __ ] time to be Jon Jones. Also, when Jon Jones became Jon Jones, he became Jon Jones slowly. I mean, it was quick in terms of like he was the quickest ever to become Yeah. I think 22 became the youngest ever UFC champion, but but there's a long process in getting there. like he didn't have that. He fought Gus Mauv, he fought um he he fought Guskov, he fought um Stefan Bonner, he fought a bunch of guys and started looking like like this guy must might be something very unique.

Yeah. And then he beats Shogun and wins the title and then just goes on this just [ __ ] epic legendary tear. And just the people he beat like Yeah, he beat everybody. He beat everybody and he beat everybody when he wasn't training. I I have a a photo of like that from that expo with he signed with it's like Machito unconscious and he's like like [ __ ] I've had that in my room [ __ ] forever. That was one of the coldest victories in the history of the sport.

He chokes Macha unconscious and then drops him. Yeah. Just standing up. Choked him unconscious. Dropped him and just walked away. It's [ __ ] cold. Just falls down in a heap. Cold, man. Cold. But you know that's the problem. you know, you're hanging out with a guy who's the goat and you start thinking you're the next guy. Like, you might be, you could be if you do the right things, but if you believe it before it happens, like, you have to be cautious, but also confident.

Like, there's this dance of the mind. There's so much going on to be an elite fighter. You, you know, you have to be aware that you could look at Camaro Usman beating Leon Edwards for four rounds. All of a sudden, one head kick, boom, lost the title. Never the same guy again. Yeah, cuz you're human. Yeah, you're [ __ ] human being. Like, as tough as Camaro is, he's a [ __ ] human being. And it's just this wild dance of possibilities. But it's also one of the reasons why people love the sport so much.

Like what you did elevated the whole sport. It really did because when you can see a guy who's a giant favorite and everybody's thinking he is the and I thought like this guy has a potential to be an all-time great like he's an Olympic gold medalist. We've seen that before. You get a guy who's an elite wrestler like Daniel Cormier. There's a lot of examples of guys who elite wrestlers who become alltime great. Randy Couture, you changed everything. Changed everything. One Punch went boom. Crazy. Yeah.

Crazy. One P. One Punch could really change your life. And they say, "No, I'm I I feel amazing. I feel incredible. Like just the fact I'm here." Like this is another thing I haven't like I learned more from your podcast than I have the entire public education system. Like, brother, I would sit on post cuz I was an embassy security guard and we would be on duty and I would just have your podcast playing in the background and I would listen to all your guests. Like I started learning about the subconscious mind like through like Billy Carson and like another guy 19 keys uh Joe Despensza some of these and like like all of that like it it really has helped mold me into who I am just like from the types like you had I don't I don't know all the names but you had the guests on sleep hubman like bro like it's just so so many variables like that you've brought that like you you are truly like educating so many people like with what you've done man it's [ __ ] well I'm Happy you enjoyed it.

I'm happy it helped you and I'm happy I get to do it. The fight companions I was s I would sit on post and [ __ ] went watch Fight Companions and you [ __ ] Eddie Bravo and [ __ ] It's cool, man. It's [ __ ] It's awesome. It's cool that you're here right now and in celebration, you know? Yeah. Kind of wild. Yeah, really wild. So, like we were saying before, like these big moments, they're so big they can kind of overwhelm you.

I think you're very wise and that you want to like let the dust settle before you do anything. Yes. But just let yourself come back to normal. Yeah. Well, you you are on a [ __ ] psychedelic roller coaster ride. And I can't even chill. Like everyone's like [ __ ] They're already texting me like, "Oh, you went Hollywood on us." Like, bro, what the [ __ ] bro? It's been like 5 days, dog. He's like, "Oh, like you switched up, man." Well, people want you to switch up.

That's a narrative that you're going to have to deal with that people want. Oh, you [ __ ] changed. People Some people do not want you to succeed. That is a fact because when you succeed, especially succeed in a spectacular way, they compare themselves to you and they fall short and they don't like it. People do not like when people hyper succeed. That is going to be a problem. People want you to fall. It's going to be a problem. It's a problem with every champion, every every celebrity, every superstar in music and comedy and movies and acting and they want you to fall because there's a certain type of psychology that there's a certain psychological mindset that some people have where they look at people who are doing better than them and they compare themselves and they want that person to fail.

And so they'll pretend you're something you're not. They'll create narratives that aren't real. They you win Hollywood, bro. You [ __ ] sold out. you [ __ ] sold out and and you're going to have to deal with that, too. But that's just [ __ ] There's a world filled with [ __ ] and some [ __ ] they have loud voices. Yes, sir. Yeah. It's okay. Yeah. So, that's what I'm navigating right now is just like trying to [ __ ] like like a part of me is like trying to get back to everyone, but the other part of me is like, "Bro, like, can you just understand?" Like even like I go from like doing all the interviews.

I had like interviews all day and then I would go home and like my family wants to talk to me about what's going on and like [ __ ] I'm like, "Bro, like I just want to go walk my dog, man." [ __ ] like and then I'm like walk I did the Bisbing interview and I was like walking my dog. He's like can like can you make sure you have good connection? I'm like bro like I'm walking my dog man. Y'all want the interview or not, bro?

[ __ ] you. [ __ ] It's more important to walk your dog because I'm I'm going to shout out my dog Apollo. He's a German Shepherd, man. Because like this dude I got I got him when I got up boot camp. I'm sorry, out of the Marines. And he was he's been with me for like the past he's seven now. He's about to be eight. And like this dude like bro like broke like so many meals with him. Like I moved out to Vegas two years ago by myself.

There he is. Yeah. That's my [ __ ] boy, man. And uh and like this dude has seen it all, man. Like I like that like I had my [ __ ] knee surgeries. Uh and I had to drive myself to PT [ __ ] two days posttop. Like nobody nobody wanted to [ __ ] take me to the PI and [ __ ] bro. And I was like trying to walk my dog and [ __ ] and like all that [ __ ] that that's why I was telling you earlier, man.

And I'm just like, bro, like it's such a like I don't want to say a fake game, but it's just like they only love you when you're hot. Like when [ __ ] Ki got knocked out by Holloway, he wasn't [ __ ] hot. But then [ __ ] he goes and wins this, he's hot. Then [ __ ] Max Holloway gets knocked by Ily [ __ ] hot. Now Strickland Chamaya [ __ ] Pereira. It's like that's the game. It's the hurt business, you know?

And then when when they're done with you, you [ __ ] I'm like, bro, [ __ ] I just upset the world. [ __ ] changed the the the dynamic like you said. united the MMA community and I was like, "Bro, [ __ ] what more do I [ __ ] want?" I did it at home. [ __ ] walked out to Nipy Hustle, man. That was my dream, brother. Like, [ __ ] that was like everything. Hustle and motivate by Nipy Hustle. Nice. Yeah. Nice.

That was one. Wow. Wow, man. But then the other people are like, "No, no, he's a [ __ ] He's a lucky punch and he wants to fuck." There's no such thing as a lucky punch. Anybody says that's a [ __ ] or they don't know any better or they think there's a thing you think you could say to diminish someone's accomplishment. That's all it is. There's no lucky punch. You're fighting a world class athlete. You stepped in. You threw a left hook. It was perfect.

That's not lucky. That's exactly what you wanted to do and you did it. If you had your eyes closed and you're falling backwards and you went like that, caught him on the chin. Okay, maybe that's a lucky punch. But you still threw a punch. You know, that's a much more fortunate punch. I would say there's nothing lucky about the punch you threw. Yeah. Nothing lucky. You wanted to hit them on the chin. You hit them on the chin. Thank you for clarifying. [ __ ] those people.

But that's this this thing about people only love you when you're hot. That's always going to be the case. That's just how it is in the world. There's no there's no way around that, man. That's just people are always judging people on status. They're always judging people on their their their place in the hierarchy. We're chimpanzees, you know? We're like complicated chimps. And that's how we look at it. Who's the big chimp? Who's top chimp? Oh, you're not top chimp anymore. You [ __ ] up.

You [ __ ] loser. [ __ ] you. And you know, you go on like someone's Instagram like after they had a loss, man. I've seen guys go on, you know, get knocked out or get beat and then you go on their Instagram and the horrific comments from these people that have never done jack [ __ ] in their lives. Before the fight, the guys were [ __ ] bru. Like, this guy got lost to Topa. This guy [ __ ] 0 and2 [ __ ] like, bro, they were going in on me.

Hey man, look at Charles Olivera. Yeah, I always say look at Charles Alvivera, one of the all-time greats, and he went on a a there was a a lot of times where he had this [ __ ] reputation for being a quitter. Like people, he lost a bunch of times. Cub Swanson knocked him out. Paul Felder beat the [ __ ] out of him. All these people beat him and then he got it together somehow and became undeniable and became a world champion. Like this idea that like one loss defines you is silly.

And it's only the only people that say that are people that don't know what the [ __ ] they're talking about. And this is part of the problem with the the comment sphere, the world of people that could just chime in as experts when they literally have never done anything in their [ __ ] life. That's a lot of people never really accomplished anything great. And they're talking about people that are trying to do one of the most difficult things in all of the world. become a professional combat sports athlete at the highest level with the whole world watching you, millions of people on Paramount Plus, 16,000 people in the [ __ ] crypto dome or whatever the [ __ ] that place is called, the whole thing is nuts, man.

And for you to be able to do that, I feel like you're you're better off just not reading anything, not not talking to anybody, just go silent for a while. Just let let the dust settle. Let the vibrations end. It's like somebody just banged a gong and you got to wait for that bong. You got to wait for that to go back to sleep. This is the most important podcast. Like you said, you said do it this day. I'm like, I'm here. [ __ ] yeah.

Well, you said it in the interview. You said, "I want to do your podcast." I said, "Fuck yeah." I'm so glad I did. Few times I ever swear during an interview, too. It just came out. I said, "Fuck yeah." Cuz it was just so crazy. It was like, "How do you not have you on after that? you did something incredibly special, you know, and I appreciate you letting me finish the prayer cuz like I could feel the the crowd's like, "Uh, what's going on?" This guy started talking Arabic.

Is your moment? I wanted to ask I didn't want to I did want to ask you, but I didn't want to prolong it. What was the prayer? What were you saying? Uh, so that's fat is basically the opening uh opening prayer of the Quran, and it's basically like you say that for the dead. Uh, and you say it during whenever you pray every day. And um that's one of the the only only verses of the Quran that have me I've had memorized since I was a kid cuz you can see I'm not I'm not a very perfect Muslim, you know.

I'm very tied up like people have been seeing my gambling and all that and all. But that's the thing, man. There's so many Muslims that like hide hide [ __ ] too, you know, and like I just I don't want to conform to one or the other, you know? That's why I was just I kind of put all my stuff out there, you know, and um that was just a prayer for my dad because uh he he passed away when I was 15 and I kind of navigated this whole process without a father, you know.

That's why the Marine Corps was so important to me cuz like they taught me how to tie my tie, how to shave my face, how to press my uniform, you know, like how to even speak and and and articulate myself. Like um I'm so grateful for that. And uh yeah, but a big part of of of me getting here was losing my father, you know, that kind of pushed me a lot. I saw someone online calling you an anti-American and I was like what? Because he has a Muslim prayer for his father.

How crazy is that? America is supposed to be a melting pot of everybody. Yeah. All religions, all walks of life, all places in the world, all come to here and become American. The idea that you can't be an American. Don't you have like stars and stripes tattooed on your arm? America tattooed around my [ __ ] bro. It's there's no nuances anymore. Like they're like, "Oh, like if you support Palestine, then you can't be [ __ ] a Marine. And if you're a Marine, it's [ __ ] Well, that's crazy.

It's just like, bro, like that's crazy. Well, there again, there's too many voices. There's too much noise. And that's what's going to be really important for you from now on is like because you've become very famous, very quickly, is to surround yourself with people of character, you know? Where where am I going to find them, John?" That's a good question. Cuz I've been, like I'm saying, I've been on this journey [ __ ] by myself for a very long time. And uh and like now it's like snakes in the grass.

They're all appearing like, "Oh, like let me manage you. Let me help you. Like we we'll sponsor you. We'll do this. We'll do that. We" And I'm just like, "But listen, part part of that is a good thing. Like these are opportunities that come out of success, right? So it's like you could say they're taking advantage of you, but no, it's like there's a moment that happened. You elevated. You became something new. And now here you are in this new stratosphere of life. And you have to, you know, it's good.

It's good that they want to sponsor you now. Why would they want to sponsor you before? You got to realize it. Like you're 0 and two in the UFC. That's how it is. That's fair. It's also, we've talked about this a thousand times in the broadcast. The difference between the regional circuit in the UFC is gigantic. And once you get into the UFC, the reality of it all, the experience is overwhelming. And it takes a few fights for a guy to really show who he is.

You see it over and over and over again. It takes a few of those experiences inside that octagon where you just develop the ability to settle and then show your true skills. Yeah. And some guys, they never get there. Some guys, they're phenomenal in training camp, phenomenal in the gym, even excellent in the regional circuit. They get to the bright lights of the big show, and they just can't be themselves. Yeah. And that was the thing. This is my first That was my first arena fight.

Like my my last two were in the Apex. Oh, wow. So it was just like complete like opposite like from like it felt like a sparring match in the Apex and going out to there. It was just like but I feel like I performed better in in in under pressure like that like like when like there's millions of people watching and like the stakes are the highest and it's like it's like do or die like [ __ ] I'm 0 and2 like you know there's a high high chance [ __ ] three losses like I was on the chopping block.

That was I was looking at you. They were they were telling me like, "Oh, they won't cut you." [ __ ] But I was like, "Fucking. I'm not gonna leave it a chance." If you fight hard as a heavyweight, you have a very good chance they won't cut you because the heavyweight division is insanely shallow. It's really shallow. I really hope they don't cut Tai. I saw him. Ty. Yeah, I know. He put up a [ __ ] tough fight, man. He fought so hard. He's so fun.

But I hate seeing that guy keep taking all these punches. Like, he's had seven losses in a row now. hate. Yeah. You know, and some of them are just like, geez. And that's the thing, like you just want to go out on top. Everyone's just like, "Oh, let me just [ __ ] win one. I just want to win one. I just want like Tony Ferguson." Like, like everyone is just like, and that's where I'm just like right now I'm just like, "Fuck, man." Like, does it really get bigger than this?

You know, like upsetting the [ __ ] MMA world. Like, sure. Like, what are they going to give me a [ __ ] Hulkit fight for the title next? Like, what's like what? He got to jump all the way up. He jumped all the way up in a lot of way. Let's get Vulov the disrespect, man. Over Vulov. [ __ ] But that's what that's where we're in now. It's all about entertainment. What sells fights. Well, he's very marketable. You know, obviously he uh talks a lot of [ __ ] And it's look, it is a strategy on his part.

I've talked to him. He's a normal dude in real life. He's a nice guy. Talk to him in real life. But he's realized like there's a way to get eyes on you and that is to be crazy. Oh, it's totally fake. I mean, he'll tell you it's fake. I did it by being real. You did? Yeah, it's true. I mean, look. You don't have to do it that way. But also, you know, he's had three fights in the UFC and he's fighting for the title. Yeah.

For him. You know what I'm saying? It's crazy. But Sarah better beat him, man. [ __ ] Well, serial is a hard dude to figure out. He's a different kind of cat. That's That [ __ ] moves different than everybody else. You know, we were talking about this. I think basketball might be a really good start starting point for MMA. Like if you can get really good at basketball, the difference is you're a big person first of all and then for heavyweights in particular and you're doing constant plyometrics like basketball is plyometrics, right?

You're moving this way, you're jumping, you're leaping forward, there's all these like changes of angle and direction that comes up very much in fighting, especially if you can change direction quickly in the middle of a combination, which serial can. Like you see the serial taiuasa fight. Yeah. Incredible performance, right? His footwork is just unreal. Footwork's out of control, man. His footwork's unreal. And against Pereira, you saw how that translates against a guy as big as him. You know, that footwork is a that's a [ __ ] real problem, man.

What did you think about those back of the head shots, do you think? I watched it and I know that um Pereira is blaming Herb Dean. The problem is he's moving and it's chaos. The really egregious foul is the Tom Aspenol fouls. That's the very egregious fouls, the eye pokes. Those are egregious. Those are just fingers out in the eyeballs. Those are bad. I'm of the opinion the moment that happens, they should take a point away instantly. Instantaneously. Your fingers goes in a guy's eye, take a point away.

You nutshot a guy. Unless it's a diversion. Like sometimes like you'll kick and it'll kick someone's shin and then it'll foot will go into the nuts. Accident clearly. But if you just kick a guy in the nuts, one point. You grab a fence, one point. Let's stop all this. There's two ways to stop that. Another ways you got to figure out how to cover the fingers. I I think people are strategizing that now where like they know like [ __ ] oh if I if I poke Pokemon I like [ __ ] the damage is going to be done and like I got the advant like sure maybe even take a point like [ __ ] but the damage is already done.

That happened to me in my my pro debut. The guy was like dipping his head down and [ __ ] coming up with the overhand and when he popped his head, he just [ __ ] headbutted me around the chin and like on purpose cuz he kept doing it. But like the ref didn't even see it and I like I got a little wobbles and stuff and um but if I didn't finish him like I could have gotten screwed, you know, like [ __ ] nobody catches that stuff.

Well, Pantosia accused Joshua Van of that in their fight and I think he thought that Joshua Van was doing that, but I don't think that was what was going on at all. I think he was just getting frustrated that Joshua Van was was moving ahead and the fight was in this last one. I didn't even get to watch it. It was it was a [ __ ] masterclass, you know, cuz Joshua Van, he won the title, but it was from an injury, you know, Pentosia threw the head kick, falls backwards, breaks his arm.

That's the fight. It happened really quickly. And so it was a very Yeah. You know, it was a fluke. Yeah. Anticlimactic. It was It was an injury. We don't know how the fight would have played out if they had gone. But then you see him against Tatsuro Tyra. He looked like a world champion. He beat he defended the title. And then against Pantosia, he just put on a masterclass, man. His [ __ ] boxing was so sweet. Like Joshua Van is something special, man. That that kid gets better every single time he fights.

Every sing. And so Panto's like 25, right? Yeah. He's he's he's the real thing, man. He's something special. He's something real special. And I feel like next time you see him fight after he just beat Pantoia, who's one of the greatest flyweights of all time, and just beat him decisively. After he beat Pantoia, I think he's going to be even better next time. I mean, he was talking in the press conference. He was upset about his victory. He said, "Man, look at my face." He goes, he goes, "That dude shouldn't be touching me like this." That's what makes you a champion.

Exactly. Exactly. But, you know, his path and your path, they're very different paths. And everyone has to decide where they're at in their life. And if you're at this point where you're like, I don't know if I want to do this anymore. I could just go out with that. Well, I just want to know why I'm doing. That's what I need to go out and find that answer because I'm like, if it's just the money, like I I did option trading when I during COVID, like I used to be a personal trainer when I got out of the the Marines and then I started getting into option trading to learn how to make money digitally and like I started making like six figures during the whole AMC and GameStop and Tesla [ __ ] pops and all that stuff.

And um that's like one and I want to do like private security as well. I I did a few of that like I would go work with some of the high rollers in casinos. I just do private security and like I could find ways to make money. I got GI Bill benefits that I like I go to school and like like do so for me I'm like if it's just the money like I could find a way to make money without getting [ __ ] my head my brain smashed.

the title. Yeah, but I mean [ __ ] cool UFC title. But like then it's like oh you're not a champion until you defend the title and then it's like [ __ ] oh and then then there's this guy coming up and this guy and it's just like this never ending. It's not until you're [ __ ] old and beaten up and [ __ ] they see you [ __ ] down. Like that's that's the business, man. So that is true. And if you talk to some of these guys that stayed in too long and you know they're slurring their words and you see how broken they are, they're have a difficult time walking and sitting down.

It's a struggle. Yeah. Yeah. My whole my whole MMA career cuz I got out in 2018 and I I sent an email to Pillo and uh Orange County and Ruka and uh it was basically just trial by fire. I was just sparring all the pros. Luke Rockhold, Michael Bisbing, [ __ ] Sean Strickland came [ __ ] was dropping me as an amateur. Like I [ __ ] just would been sparring over and then I went out to Tiger and [ __ ] I moved out to Thailand was doing sparring out there and I was just been even got to extreme and [ __ ] they I I was sparring Francis and Gano my first week, bro.

My first week they threw me in there with Anguo but it was the most terrifying [ __ ] of my [ __ ] life, bro. I went to the Apex and reassess my life choices after that, bro. Like I was I was just like And so when you talking about guys that are staying too long like bro like I've just been sparring and that maybe that's where my lack of development is, you know, cuz I I never focused on like just the footwork and never focused on just uh that getting better at like thinking, you know, it was always just this primal feeling of just like like I've been in street fights, you know, and like I just [ __ ] start picking it up as I go.

That's interesting. So do you have a main coach? Do you have a head coach that just develops you? No, it's I bounced around a lot of gyms. Like I started Pillo, I went with Nick, I went to Freestyle MMA, I went to Pada. I've bounced around like so many and like because I' i've always been looking for the the cuss and Mick, the [ __ ] custom Tyson, the Rocky and Mick and like the like Trevor and and and Gachi and like, bro, like that doesn't come unless you're [ __ ] Hollywood now.

Like [ __ ] like now, sure, maybe I'll get [ __ ] a bunch of coaches like yeah, let me [ __ ] develop you. But I'm like, who who actually [ __ ] wants to to like actually be my head coach, you know? Like [ __ ] like who who is actually like here? Cuz nobody was like, "Oh, like I see [ __ ] potential in you and you could be a world champion someday and let me take you under my wing and and and and I'll give you privates for free." Like all every single private I did, I paid for every single one.

Like I never got any free privates. And that was a big part of why I went into a lot of financial struggle was like no sponsors, no [ __ ] and I'm like constantly like like just because I want I just wanted my hand raised one time just like [ __ ] I just wanted to know what it felt like to get my [ __ ] hand raised in that octagon, man. And so that's why I [ __ ] I did it and on on the biggest stage against the biggest odds and I'm just like bro like walk from the table when you're up bro.

Well, listen, it's not the worst idea in the world. Especially, you were saying that there's they you did brain scans and they found something in your brain. What? Yeah, there was just it was just like white matter and stuff like so they did an MRI and then they're like, "Hey, like we want you to do another CT scan like there was like it's like white specks or something. White matter or something like great." They were like, "Oh, it could be caused by headaches. Could be caused by this." But um yeah, I don't know what it is.

All that sparring for sure gives you brain damage. Yeah. Do I mean I'm sure you had your bell rung. I'm sure you've been dropped. Yeah. Is part of the sparring. Everybody look, if you spar, you're going to get some damage. Yeah, for sure. There's no no if ends or buts about. Cost of business. And um a lot of the brain damage that fighters get it a lot of it comes from training. A lot of it doesn't even come from the actual fights itself. Yeah, it counts.

I mean, people don't think about that. You go, "Wow, he only got knocked out one time in his whole career." Yeah, but how many sparring matches did he have? You know? Yeah. Yeah. That's that was I was telling you earlier like I went through [ __ ] hell this camp. Like I was [ __ ] like hard around like like f um Iwan Coutalaba. He's so explosive so fast. He's [ __ ] and now like we're working that oblique kick. This is something another thing I want to mention that was very interesting to me.

My whole camp I trained for him to crawl towards me like Jones does because he's he does the same thing. And so what I did, I got down in the same position on my knees to to like crawl towards him because that's what I've been practicing my whole camp. But then he didn't do it that this last fight. He just walked towards me. So I don't know if [ __ ] that was if I got in his head when I got down. But I thought that was very interesting cuz my whole camp I was every time every round I was like, "Hey, crawl towards me like Jones does.

Crawl towards me like Jones does. Do the oblique kick." I fully went into this fight thinking that my knees were going to get caved to [ __ ] I completely I was like, "Bro, like [ __ ] I don't care." What do you think about that kick? The UFC is now talking about trying to ban that kick. I think this is combat. Like I think it's like a part of it and um it's unfortunate because a career ender like Khalil Roundry [ __ ] he's and it's just like and also Shaot, you know, Ian Gary got shave's knee.

Yeah. So it's like a part of it's like Yeah. [ __ ] sucks. But at the same time is like it's it's fighting, you know, like and it's like if this was a real fight, like that's that's pretty realistic. So is eye pokes. Yeah. I say get that football field you were talking about. Yeah. But you know what I'm saying? So are eye pokes and we don't allow eye pokes because it creates permanent injury. I see what you're saying. But the reality is if you were in a street fight, you'd poke the [ __ ] out of somebody's eyes and you should.

You know, if you're fighting for your life, you'd [ __ ] thumb right in the eye. 100%. Why wouldn't 100% why wouldn't you? So, we have to decide like true what is good for the the safety of the athletes long term if you're going to have a long-term career with a blown out knee. Okay. A blown out knee takes you out for a year. Not only does it take you out for a year, but your knee might never be the same again. And you've had ACL surgery, you know.

Yeah. Yeah. I've had him. That's why I'm tell that was one of my fears going into this fight. I was like, "Fuck, man. These [ __ ] are going to [ __ ] my [ __ ] up." Yeah. And I was like, "Fuck it. Let's go." Like John destroyed guys knees. I was there for Thiago Santos. I was there and uh that was the same night Mazdall knocked out Askin and uh Right. And uh yeah, I don't think Thiago Santos was ever the same after that fight.

He had both his knees reconstructed after that fight. [ __ ] crazy. Yeah. And Rampage Jackson too. He blew out Rampage's knee. Rampage said my knee was never the same again after that fight. I just don't think I understand that it's combat but also so is poking in the eyes and we don't allow poking in the eyes. So you you think we shouldn't have is an argument. There's a real conversation about whether or not it should be legal. Andy Foster, I think, is one of the best without a doubt athletic commission directors from California.

He thinks it should be banned. Yeah. And the UFC thinks it should be banned. It's just too many guys. Ruseo, who just fought uh MVP, MVP blew out his knee, sidekick his knee. His knee's completely reconstructed now. He went into surgery right after the fight. Now, would it be like just the oblique kick or like sidekicks and oblique kicks? Just those two. Yeah. Uh just attacking the knee with a straight kick that hyperextends it. So, you'd still be able to leg kick. Obviously, you still be able to round kick to the leg, but and the the issue is the hyperextension of the knee because it just takes one and your knee is [ __ ] forever and your career is over.

Yeah. You know, it's just why are we doing that? You know, why don't we poke each other in the eye if we're gonna do that? That's very That's very true. You know, it's a sport at the end of day, not a street fight. Yeah. And people say, "Well, you can heel hook. You could tap on a heel hook." You cannot tap for a sidekick to the knee. That that sidekick comes and especially catches you. You see the the ruse of the the screenshot of what it looked like when MVP caught him.

His [ __ ] was totally sideways. Oh, [ __ ] Yeah. Just everything's ripped apart inside of there. It's gone. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, one shot for it, you know? I like my knees [ __ ] I just don't I think there's things we can't do. We can't bite. We can't eye gouge. We can't fish hook. There's a bunch of things we can't do because you want to protect the fighters. And look at look at his knee. Oh [ __ ] Yeah. Look how sideways that [ __ ] is.

That's blown blown out, man. God damn. I mean, that's knee probably never going to be the same again. How did you feel about them letting him go even though he's winning? I think MVP should be a welterweight first of all. I think at welterweight he's almost unstoppable. So [ __ ] difficult to handle. Uh Ian Garry was the only guy that figured out how to handle him. I don't think the power translates as well at 85. Some of these 85 guys like Gregory Rodriguez and Joe Pyer.

They're [ __ ] huge, man. I don't know how they make 85, but these guys look like heavyweights. Um, but he's one of my favorite fighters to watch because like his fight with Kevin Holland, people could talk all the [ __ ] about it was a boring fight and nothing happened. But when you got a guy as good as Kevin Holland and he's just like completely frustrated because he can't do [ __ ] and this guy's just dancing in front of him and popping him and kicking him and punching him anytime he wants.

Yeah. It's nuts to watch, man. He's he's also 38, 39. Like, how old is MVP now? How old is Michael Venom Page? For me, he was uh like proof of concept because I was always telling people I was like the thing that's missing in MMA 39. See, the reality is if you're natural, if you're a natural athlete and you're 39 years old, it's almost over. Yeah. Unless you're a heavyweight. Heavyweights have a little bit more life to them. Like Francis is still at the top of the heap and I think he's like 40 now.

Yeah. But there's a there's a time where you just can't move. I mean, all the injuries, all the training, you can't move as well anymore. You're a little bit slower. I was always saying though that the there's a thing that's missing in combat sports, and that thing is point fighting karate. That point fighting style is so [ __ ] hard to deal with. If you have never sparred anybody that does that [ __ ] the moment you spar them, you're like, "Yo, this is crazy." like these guys can cover distance.

Ah, they just jump in and then they're out of there and they move out of the way and you get frustrated and you start chasing them and then you get countered. It's a a totally different element on its own. It's no good. Like it's no good as a standalone style because guys could take you down. You don't know how to wrestle, you're [ __ ] You don't know how to do jiu-jitsu. You get strangled. You don't know leg kicks. You get your legs kicked out from under you.

But on if you know all those things and you come from that point fighting background, that ability to blitz, that ability to dive in and out and and hit someone from a distance they can't hit you is crazy. Yeah. And he to me was like proof of concept. And I think there's going to be a lot of other guys that are like elite point fighters that decide to enter into MMA and I think they're going to have like some pretty pretty incredible success if they're special.

Raymond Daniels did it for a little bit in um uh in Bellator 720. Yeah, 720 punch [ __ ] but he also like did it in uh Glory kickboxing too. He had some great fights in glory kickboxing as well. But again, he's a little older. That's the problem. These guys, they have these long careers in the one discipline. They get really good and then they by the time they start doing MMA, they're 34, 35, four or five years later, their career's over. Yeah. you know, so you don't have enough time to develop and really grow and you're also going to have a gang of injuries.

I mean, look, I I wish nothing but the best for MVP. I love that guy. I think he's awesome. He's got an awesome personality. He's had some boring fights, though, unfortunately. And I think it's entertainment. I see [ __ ] knockouts. It's a little bit of both, you know. It's a little bit of entertainment, it's a little bit of sport. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. If you've thought about trying therapy with our long-term partner, BetterHelp, insurance options may now be available nationwide with an average co-pay for eligible members of just $23 per session.

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Don't have insurance or live outside the United States? You can still get 10% off your first month. Visit betterhelp.com/jre to explore your payment options. That's betterhp.com/jre. How do you feel about that? You've been around for for a long time like when the fortitas ran it compared to now how Paramount runs it. Like do you do you like how it is now? Like compared to where like it's all about entertainment versus like who's the best at dominance? Well, I'm a purist. I don't think you should ever stand a guy up.

I don't think you should ever separate someone when they're on the cage. I cheer for it when it happens, just like every other [ __ ] Like, yeah, stand them up. But, but I mean, if you gave me the ability to write the rules, I would never stand anybody up ever. If you get taken down and someone's on top of you giving you ngies for five rounds, figure out how to get up. And if you can't figure out how to get up, you lost. Simple. You might not lose the same way that you beat Gable.

You know, that's a way more exciting way to win, right? But you still won. You held him down. You gave him some of these. He couldn't get up. That's the fight. Boo. The audience booze. Okay, whatever. Still better than baseball. [ __ ] off. You know what I mean? Like I I think it's fighting. And I think I also think very controversially, you shouldn't be stood up not only at the end of the round or I think the next fight, the next round rather, it's the same fight.

You should be put back in the same position. is just pride in 15 minutes straight. You could do that. Well, Pride was 10. It was 10 minute rounds and then a second five minute round. But I don't think you earn a stand up, you know? Like every fight starts standing up, right? But once a guy takes you down, if he takes you down, you didn't earn getting back up. So if you didn't earn getting back up, I think you should go right back to the same position.

It's one fight. It's not five fights. If you have a fivem minutee round, you get five different chances to avoid a takedown. Why? You already been taken down. You never figured out how to get up. It's funny you say that because that was that was what we were talking about with my my fight camp. I was all like it's like [ __ ] they're going to stand me up at the [ __ ] at the end of the round, you know? So, you know, every fight starts on the feet, you know?

Every round starts on the feet. And if you're a wrestler or any kind of grappler, you have to take a guy down every single round. And it's kind of crazy because in a real fight, like a fight is a fight. It's like not five five minute look. The argument of like having guys fight for 25 minutes straight is crazy. No fight would probably last that long. Everybody would gas out. Of course, it would be a battle of attrition. Only guys like Morab Morabish will be the king of the world.

Facts. I'm not going 25 minutes. It's crazy. [ __ ] heavyweights going 25 minutes is [ __ ] mad. And when you do have heavyweights going 25 minutes, the damage they do to each other is horrific. Is horrific. you know, like the the Cain Velasquez, Junior Doss Santos fights, man. I've watched those back and forth and especially, you know, uh Junior knocked him out in the first fight, caught him with a punch and then Kane destroyed him in the next two fights and they were prolonged, horrific beatings.

Yeah. That's why I came up watching the Kane trilogies and then the Brock Lesnar. Oh, Kane is something, man. Yeah, that was always my my three. Kane Velasquez, Jon Jones, and Mike Tyson. And I was like, if I could put those three together, that's the fighter. What about Fedor? Faded is Feder is I I just wasn't watching him the same, but I had to realize the goat. But [ __ ] Bluy beat him. Bluy in sombo. Combat sombo by by points. Yeah. Yeah. You're wearing a ghee.

Backing me. Yeah. You're wearing a ghee. You're wearing shoes. There's a lot going on. Bgoy is a bad [ __ ] I never really watched that the uh the Pride era and all that stuff. I was more just I started watching around like Anderson Silva, Chuck Liddell and like right around then Goya came back from getting stabbed in the heart. Yeah, he's a bad [ __ ] That's a bad [ __ ] He was a tough dude, man. Very tough dude. But it's like heavyweight um fighting.

I think there's never been a heavyweight division that was more stacked than Pride in the early 2000s. Never. Heavyweight division in Pride I think was the glory days of the heavyweight division. You had Merco Crocop, you had Mark Coleman, you had Minotauro Noggera, you had Fedor, you had like one after the other, killer, killer, killer, killer. It was just like this insane shark tank of elite fighters. And then they were all fighting juice to the tits over in Japan, you know, it was a different world.

That's that's where we're Don Fry. I was asking um Birmingham, how you pronounce his name from over at Ways to Well, Brigham. bring him. Bring him I was asking him about the the peptides and stuff because I heard there's talks about maybe like getting some of the recovery peptides approved now in the UFC and stuff. So, I don't know if that's where it's going to be headed, but it would certainly help. I do not know where they're going with that, whether or not it would be possible and whether or not eventually it gets through.

But there's certain things that are just not performance-enhancing. All they do is help soft tissue injuries. BPC57, I think, would be an easy one to approve. That's the best one I think for soft tissue injuries. Have you used them? Oh, yeah. [ __ ] yeah. I use the [ __ ] out of that stuff. I've never used it. Everyone always tells me Wolverine stack. Oh, it's great. But now there's like so many everyone in their mom who sells peptides now like you don't even know like the true the true good.

That's why a company like Waste Well is so important because it's a compounding pharmacy. You know, they they have they own a compounding pharmacy. So, you know that you're getting an actual pure version of BPC57. Whereas, if you order it online, who knows where it's coming from? You're getting it online. It's getting delivered to you. It might be coming from China. It may be coming from Vietnam. Like, who knows? Who know? It might be real. It might be great. It might be total [ __ ] Like, the people have run tests on different peptides they found online and a lot of them are just total [ __ ] Yeah.

Like 20% of what they say is in there. Yeah. It's like you're just guessing because it's not regulated. So, it should be legal and it should be regulated, you know, and then, you know, if if that's the case, I think then there should be an argument for certain peptides that help people recover from injuries because this is a sport where you're practicing injuring each other all day long. Everyone's [ __ ] injured. If you want fighters to compete at a high level once they get into the octagon, you're going to have to help them recover along the way.

And it's not just cold plunges and saunas and massage. BBC 157 will help them recover. And it's not going to make them a super athlete. It's not going to make them faster or stronger. It's just going to help heal injuries, right? I mean, that's my position. But I think it's weird that you can use like some things that work great like creatine. Yeah. Like creatine's phenomenal and that's legal. Well, I didn't know this, but the PI was educating us how the creatine helps your brain now, too.

So, I'm like, [ __ ] dude, is this going to make me smarter or [ __ ] what? Creatine 100% increases mental performance. If I have a day where I haven't gotten much sleep and I don't take creatine versus a day where I haven't got much sleep and I do take creatine, there's a giant difference. And they've done studies on this. They show when sleepdeprived people, creatine basically mitigates all the negative effects of sleep deprivation. So you can perform like mentally at the same level. Do you take the powder form?

Powder form. Yeah. Just try. Yeah. There's a company called Create. They make creatine gummies. They make um a bunch of different but they also have powder. Each one of them's five milligrams. Yeah. So, I just take these uh or five grams. Five grams. Usually, it's five grams. Yeah, it's not milligrams. So, I take um two five gram packets in the morning, two in the night. Yeah, that's how I do it. The PI gives us the Thorn supplements. They give us Yeah, it's great stuff. Thorn's awesome stuff.

Yeah, they give us I dry scoop it, just throw it in my mouth, drink water, dug it. It just doesn't taste good. It's just It's performance. Yeah, but creatine is one of the few absolutely legitimate supplements that I think most people, especially most athletes, should be taking. [ __ ] yeah. And just good for your brain just overall. Just great for it. Yeah. I think I needed to go to I haven't taken any [ __ ] because that was the other thing too. They were telling me like once you get closer to the fight like you don't need to be taking as much creatine because it's like I don't know if it like harder dehydrates you or [ __ ] First of all, you're not cutting any weight.

So, the the difference between you and a lighter weight guy, I could see the argument for a lighter weight guy, because with lighter weight guys, if you're trying to cut some weight, what's going on is uh creatine, one of the benefits of it, it lets you hold more water, you know, so you have more water in your muscles, your muscles are stronger, your your brain works better, there's more water in your system, right? I think that's how it works. There's a bunch of reasons why it works, but I do know that it makes people makes people hold more water.

Um, so if you're a fighter that's cutting weight, like some of these guys, which they some of these guys cut insane amounts of weight, like did you see that um Ryan Garcia Connor Ben fight where they said he weighed 30 lbs more the day of the fight? Yeah. What? It didn't help him. It was [ __ ] crazy. I didn't think it was going to help. I didn't think Ryan was going to win that cuz You didn't? Like I I like Ryan, but like I heard he was like [ __ ] partying [ __ ] a little while before.

Really? Yeah. Yeah. cuz he had like his birthday like two months before and like just two months that's it maybe that's okay. Yeah, two months is all right for a guy that good that young. Yeah, I thought Ryan was on a totally different level. My my position was is and no disrespect to Connor Ben was like I've watched Ryan compete against guys like Javvante like you know guys like at a very high level Roelly like he's he's been in there with some of the absolute best guys in the division.

Yeah. And um I just think he's just a different level. That's what my position was. And also his speed is [ __ ] crazy. His speed is nuts, man. Yeah, he's his left hook is just [ __ ] preposterous. Does it say 178? Yeah. Less than 12 hours from weigh-ins, Connor Ben is rehydrated from 146 to 178.4. Wow. That's not good. Like that's like very unhealthy for your body to go to that state where you're almost dead. Like what do you walk around at? Uh usually I was I was a little heavier.

I was at 255, but for this camp I went down. I was about 240 245. Does anybody try to talk you into going to 205? I did my pro debut at 205. So yeah. Yeah. So I know I can I could do it. Um the Pillo was the one that told me he's like I think I like you better at a heavyweight. This was like when I was an amateur. He's like because of his speed and um I feel like it's a different fight like when I I'm telling you I was sparring like uh Ewan and Strickland's not a 205 but that [ __ ] sometimes but yeah I feel like it's like a lot a lot more uh thinking than heavy you know like it's more like their speed and movement.

Yeah. Yeah. I feel like they're a little smarter than me. But so you're really uh considering like wrapping it up. I I'm I'm I'm taking as I go right now, you know, but I I just really don't know, you know, because it's like, brother, I'm f I'm legit filing bankruptcy this year. Like that's [ __ ] like like I really ran myself all the way into debt like [ __ ] chasing this [ __ ] you know? Like don't get me wrong, like is on [ __ ] I got a TRX [ __ ] I couldn't afford.

I paid for my tattoos, like 30 grand on that [ __ ] I did PRK, put that on the card like I took my mom to uh instead of Lasix, so they don't you don't have the flap. And um and I took my mom to Mecca and it was just like, bro, like I just been [ __ ] I burnt my boats and I was just like, you know, [ __ ] back against the wall. That's it, brother. [ __ ] we got to win. Well, now that you're in debt, you probably should have a couple fights to get out of debt.

Well, that's the thing, too. It's like, bro, capitalize, my my life is so [ __ ] crazy. Like, I need like a lawyer, a financial adviser right now. I need some [ __ ] like some guidance, you know? And that's that's the thing where I'm just like I'm like I got what I wanted and now I'm just like okay what the [ __ ] is next, you know? And um that's the thing like people [ __ ] like like oh like how how is it just this one win, you know?

But I'm I'm legit telling you like all I wanted was to [ __ ] have my hand raised in the octagon like that. I just wanted to know what that [ __ ] felt like and I that was [ __ ] that was a [ __ ] the best possible ever, you know, and the fact best possible result. Yeah. And and the fact like like I I genuinely was like praying this this this time. Like that was the first time like I was like legit like and it wasn't even just like my just me like I had my my Muslim friends, my my Christian friends.

Like it was [ __ ] like like there was just so many people like I'm a spiritual guy. Like that's the thing where people are like oh it's so contradicting sometimes. And I'm just like I've always been like like very like more spiritual than than following just the books. And um yeah, I just uh I felt like there was something with me that fight. I felt like it wasn't just me in there. Like the fact that like I fell dirt biking like three weeks uh ago with with Strickland and [ __ ] busted my [ __ ] shoulder.

And why are you doing that with him? Sean and you saw he just crashed, dude. He's crazy. You literally have to sign a waiver where you [ __ ] hang out with Strickland [ __ ] from now on. I'm like, bro, like like Yeah, he just crashed hard. His buddy got really That's the guy from Embedded. Uh uh Chris. Yeah. Yeah. He he he's [ __ ] uh Yeah. Don't do that. Don't do what he does. And I think he just wasn't wearing a helmet, right?

No, I don't think they were. Thank god I wore one cuz they He Strickland, ironically though, he's the one that told me not to ride the dirt bike. He did tell me. He's like, "Do as I say, not as I do." Yeah. He's like He's like, "You got a fight coming up. You probably shouldn't do that." Man, [ __ ] you. You can't tell me to do that. Sean's crazy. He's like, "But put a helmet on." I'm like, "All right, I'll put the helmet on." And thank God I did.

Yeah. Sean is legitimately [ __ ] crazy. So, what was this? Is this a car that flipped over? Yeah, I think they had like Were they in a side by side? Yeah. Oh, okay. They're in They're in like a buggy. Yeah. Don't Don't do Is it Strickland is the [ __ ] man cuz like as much I used to [ __ ] hate this dude when he used to come to the gym at Ruka. I used to hate him. That was right right after the Usman fight and he crashed his motorcycle and um this guy he would he would come in and his leg was all [ __ ] busted up like and like he he refused to take [ __ ] pain meds.

He was just always talking [ __ ] and he would [ __ ] me up. That's why another I was he was always [ __ ] me up and um and and and going through that I was just like man like this dude's at least he's [ __ ] real you know like like oh he's very real. He like he he like he calls out everybody, you know, like cuz he used to talk [ __ ] about all the [ __ ] Palestinian [ __ ] and then he started talking about the Israeli [ __ ] and then he's [ __ ] he was proTrump and then he was like anti-Trump and is like um he speaks his mind, but another part I think he does is rage bait just a little bit.

Like he knows how to push people's buttons, you know? He knows how to get the clicks. He's a smart [ __ ] Like he makes his investments like Oh yeah. Like this dude [ __ ] just has guns, cars, motorcycles, and [ __ ] He's very smart with his investment. He's set. Like he he we told me about it. I asked him about it. He's like he put away his money. He's invested mutual funds. The whole deal. He called me after the fight. Yeah. Did he?

Yeah. Yeah. He's like, "I knew you're going to be on some dumb shit." He's like, "Don't you [ __ ] walk." He's like, "This is this is when you get the [ __ ] money. This is when you get to [ __ ] the [ __ ] This is when you get to [ __ ] He's like, "This is when all the opportunity comes." And I was like, "Yeah, but does he does it? I don't know." You know? Well, it's your decision. It's really you can't let anybody decide for you because if you you do something for someone else, especially something like fighting and you wound up getting knocked out in your next fight and you were half into it and half out of it.

Yeah. You know, my advice for anyone who's always got one foot in and one foot out is get out. Always. Every time I know a guy that's like, I think one more fight and then I'm done, like stop now. Yeah. Stop now. Like most most most of the time that's the best advice because if you're not fully completely 100% committed to being the best fighter possible and like on that path you're going to run into someone who is right you know now you can you can Brendon sh me here like when you look at me like do you really think I could be a world champion?

Listen, if you can do what you just did against Gable and then do that again against someone else similar like what if you did that to Tai to Iasa or what if you did that to you know fill in the blank whoever the fighter is right Pavlov there's a lot of different guys who are really good and if you can keep improving and keep beating these guys in that direction and then get a legitimate coach like maybe even Trevor get Trevor Whitman or get Farasa Hobby who I think is one of the great masterminds of the sport.

Get someone who's going to like work with you on technique and really try to develop you as a fighter as opposed to just you sparring all the time and you training all the time and you do you can learn a lot sparring all the time, but you don't learn the same amount that you would if you're coached and if you're coached correctly, like on a day in day out, daily basis. Like, have you seen the uh the Art of Violence videos that Justin puts out with Trevor?

Yeah. Tre Trevor and and Justin are right next to each other all the time. Trevor, who's a genius, is like giving him instruction. Yes, that's it. We want to dip to the left. There it is. Okay, let's do that again. Do that again. Set it up. They're setting it up. They're they're technical. They're going over all the aspects. They're rolling with punches and they have counters set up. They're doing the collar tie and the uppercut. They're all these things that they're preparing for for these moments and they're going over it over and over again.

until it's cemented into his central nervous system. That's what you need. If you want to really excel and you want to really be like a world class, world championship potential caliber fighter, you have to have that. You have to have that. I agree. And that was my that was always my issue was like I was really trying to find that. But well, Eric Nix was in your corner. Yeah. Well, I I I didn't even get to talk about that. [ __ ] Nick popped in my corner because Sergey was supposed to have his his his baby and he left.

I woke up fight day the day of the fight. Oh, he's like, "Hey, it was like 2 in the morning." He's like, "Okay, I had to go back to Vegas. My wife my wife might be going into labor." And I was like, "All right, [ __ ] uh this is like definitely worst case scenario." And that's when I I knew I knew Nick was there. And uh Nick's a [ __ ] amazing guy. Like he [ __ ] he he worked with me when I was in in Extreme when I first came out.

He walked with me for my first fight. And uh I just get he's like super busy, you know? Like he's got so many fighters, you know, and especially I was just I just showed up at the gym. That's my thing is like I've always just showed up at the gym and I was like, "All right, [ __ ] let's [ __ ] spar, you know, and then like people like who's this guy?" You know, they maybe get like a little attention, but at the end of the day like no to sit and develop with you.

Um the way you're talking about like traveling and stuff and Well, Eric can certainly do that, you know, and you're training in Vegas all the time. And now you guys have like an understanding like he he came and showed up. He shocked the world. He he [ __ ] came cuz he I literally just texted him. He's like, "Got you, homie." He's a great human being. Yeah. And I really like we were in the back. He the way he he communicated and like was like like he was breaking [ __ ] down like he's like very analytical with it and that that that was very good for me.

And like and then people are like, "Oh, he well he didn't fight." And I'm like, "Well, [ __ ] like why does that matter if he's a he's he's a good coach and he's [ __ ] effectively communicating all these things, you know?" Yeah. This idea that you have to be a fighter to be a great coach. I I understand why people say that cuz I think there are some elements of competition that you really won't understand unless you've been hit, unless you've hit someone, unless you've been in there, unless you've done but I also think you can't you can't dismiss special people and there are special people that analyze things and have an understanding of things like here's a perfect example.

John Donaher wildly considered widely considered to be the greatest jiu-jitsu coach ever. Yeah. didn't didn't compete. Doesn't matter. Like he understands jiu-jitsu at the most comprehensive and most analytical way humanly possible. He literally trains and teaches or at least doesn't train anymore. He's so he's had so many injuries like two hip replacements, knee replacement. He's all [ __ ] up. Yeah. But which is why what kept him from competing, but his dedication to coaching is unparalleled. He's in there seven days a week. He's like constantly training these guys.

And look what he's achieved. Guys like Gordon Ryan, Gary Ton, Craig Jones, all these guys who came out of there, Nicki Rod, they all will tell you Craig Jones was going crazy for my fight. You he was just making all these posts and he's like, "Oh, he had turf toe or something like that." He's hilarious. He's the funniest guy in jiu-jitsu by far. He's so funny. He invited me. He was telling me like, "Hey, we could do some something like a I think he said he's playing on going over to to Israel, Palestine, and like doing some kind of B team thing over there." So, I've never met him, but he [ __ ] extended that.

So, what would you do over there? No, I think he maybe he was doing like a a seminar or something like that. Are we I don't want to Are we allowed to talk about this? You could talk about anything you want. Yeah. How do you feel about the genocide there that's going on with all the like the women? I'm very open about it. I think it's horrific. I think it's it's terrifying that people will dismiss it and they here's the thing that they do. They use different terms, right?

They say it doesn't technically qualify as a genocide because it's not a specific targeting of one race or one type of people. Like, okay, let's stop with that word. Let's say a horrific injustice against humanity. Let's let's let's talk about the the how many thousands and tens of thousands of women and children have been destroyed by missiles from the sky. How many buildings are gone? Like only 90% of Gaza is gone. Like there's no way you can look at that and not say it's a a horrific incident.

Like whatever it is called whatever name it is, it's a horror. It's a it's it's one of the most it's you look at the video footage of Gaza, it's [ __ ] terrifying. There's humans that are just under that rubble that they're never going to find. No. And all the amputations are happening without anesthesia. you're seeing the the kids like like that's my biggest thing is like in in Iraq and Afghanistan there's rules of engagement. Like you had to look a [ __ ] in the eyes before you killed them.

Like you had to go into a a booby trap building knowing that the enemy was in there with a [ __ ] suicide bomber vest or a grenade and [ __ ] go in there regardless. And it's like these guys just got a little drone and boop. Yeah. Just took out 100 people and missiles and and and it's and it's all funded by the United States. And it was funded, you know, as as so much as people hate this Iran war and I hate it, the the Biden administration funded that when it was going on with Israel.

How do we make changes, Joe? Because like you see so many people try to stand up like Mmore and like [ __ ] cancelled and like you're seeing like so many people trying to like call out like with the Epstein files and [ __ ] like bro like it's [ __ ] like it's is clear as day you know like that that there's all these people complicit but like nobody's being prosecuted, nobody's being like right charged. the the Mackmore thing is really crazy because if you ever let's play his actual speech, find his actual speech because people were saying that it's anti-semitic.

It there's nothing about what he's saying that's anti-Semitic. If you listen to the entirety of the speech, he is I I'll I'll play it before we comment on it because I think there's a real problem now with clips and narratives where people hear a piece of something and then they make a they they have the you know, oh, you can't say that or oh, this he's doing this or oh, he's doing that. Like, everyone's losing nuance. What he's doing is talking about what to most people seems like a crime against humanity.

That's what most people look at it and that's how they see it. And what he's saying is in no way and I don't like that term seemetic either because like the Palestinians a lot of those Palestinians are Semites. Yeah. And a lot of those Palestinians are truly descendants of people that probably were Jewish at one point in time and converted to Islam. This is not an anti-Semitic thing because a lot of the people that live in Israel are Jews from um Eastern Europe. Like they're not even from that place.

And there's a lot of Jews that are like against the genocide as well. A lot of Jews. But let's hear what he's saying. Let's hear what he's saying so we can say this all day. One of the reasons why I wanted to come on this tour was because I wanted to stand up here on stages and stadiums across America and say two words that are very near and dear to my heart. Free Palestine. I said free Palestine. I want those words to be loud and clear so the people from Gaza all the way to the occupied West Bank know that we have not forgotten them.

And this next song was inspired by the bravery of Columbia University students who led an encampment movement that mobilized the entire world, open up hearts, myself included. So, thank you to those students that risked their diplomas, that risk their tuition, that risk their scholarships, that stood up and said no. CUAD students, Students for Justice and Palestine and Jewish Voices for Peace. Thank you guys to all of my Jewish brothers and sisters. Criticism of Israel, criticism of apartheid, being against genocide in no way is a criticism of you.

My message is for peace, love, for all human beings to be treated with dignity, respect, and equality. So I say free Palestine. I say free Lebanon. I say free Cuba. I say free Congo. Free Sudan. Free all people in America living in fear over this terrorist organization ICE. None of us will be free until we are all free. This song is called Hensall. Okay. So, you hear what he said about Jewish people, my Jewish brothers and sisters. Like, this is clear. This is not an anti-Jewish message.

It's he's talking about the war. He's talking about what happened to Gaza. Yeah. It's just those that the free Palestine. You can't say that. That's crazy. That was like during Black Lives Matter, you used to not be able to say all lives matter. Yeah. Like guys got fired because they said all lives matter. Yeah. Yeah. It's um it's a very we're in a very strange time in our society where people are resistant to this idea that something wrong is going on there. And I think history will show that when when people look back on it, they'll be horrified.

Well, that's what's scary right now is like everyone knows like we're all kind of bought. Like everyone's kind of corrupt at this point. Like everyone knows like the the media, the government like like the whole co thing with like Fouchi pleading the fifth and a pardon. Like it's like we've been lied to like over and over and and like the American people are pissed. Like cuz I made a video a few videos that were going viral even before this fight that I was just talking about the how they were integrating the military with with a foreign nation and and and how like like people are scared to even say America first.

Like you see those videos where they go up to these politicians like hey uh America first and or Israel first and like [ __ ] Well, Israel has done an amazing job of embedding themselves with all these politicians. You see, when they were when Mam Donnie was running for mayor, and I think this is one of the reasons, one of the main reasons why he won in New York City, he was the only guy that said he wasn't going to go visit Israel. They were all like, I'm going to be the for what, what's the first thing you're going to do?

I'm going to Disneyland. No, they were all like, I'm going to go to Israel. How does all of Congress have dual citizenship? Well, it's not all of Congress. That's not true. That's like some Tik Tok is it facts. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's not the whole APEC. Well, it's there's there's some members of Congress have dual citizenship. I don't know how many. We could find out now. Um but the thing is about how many of them have been funded. That's where it gets weird, you know, and how much uh how much funding is going on with these politicians.

That's where things get weird. Like Kurt M. What about that congressman that's like like a basically a vegetable that they're like wheeling around? Oh yeah. McConnell. What the [ __ ] is going on, man? Yeah, that's crazy. That's crazy. I'm gonna find this this There's this one thing that uh Mezer sent me that he was like, I thought this was fake and it's not. And it it seems fake. It's one of those ones where you see it, you're like, wait, what is this? This is uh uh James Lee had it on his uh Instagram page.

Jamie, if you could find it before me. Jamie's always so good at finding [ __ ] before I could even pull it up. But here, I'll send it to you. Yeah. been watching it happen for years and now um this is uh banned documentary reveals pro-Israel curriculum taught in American schools. So this is uh this is weird. This is not just pro-Israel. This was this is weird. Like this guy's talking and you're like this is in America someone's saying this for real. Something just got passed in Texas like this too.

Yeah. There's a lot of dirty people out there. A lot of people taking that money. Watch this. A new curriculum requiring public school students to study Israel's history. And here's a little preview of what they're about to teach. Take a listen. Israel, their people, the Jews, are better than all of us. They're better than all of us. And you need to accept that. This is where with the kids where we start our indoctrination. This is real. I know that's a strong word to use indoctrination that it uh you know it gets such a bad reputation but that's where it starts.

Um that's where it started with me when I was a child that I was taught about uh the support that the church owes to Israel. So all your loose change that you have from home, you bring that change to school. Everything that we get, we will actually cash it in and make a check out to the Fellowship for Christians and Jews. And anybody that's ever been to our church would know there's a spiritual obligation of a Christian to Israel. God gave a promise in Genesis 12.

And I'm going to bless all of those that bless you. And I'm going to curse all of them that curse you. Every nation that has blessed Israel, God has blessed them. And every nation that has opposed Israel, God has been in opposition to them. Cesar, if you read the actual text, we get it. Okay. No one's better than you. That's crazy. This they are better than you is crazy. Now, obviously, this is this one guy's position and that preacher preaching. The Bible is very much open to interpretation by a lot of people.

There's a lot of different versions of what it's actually saying that people will preach on stage. And that guy is just he's not indicative of all Christians and this is not indicative of all people that you know that that that think we should support Israel either. But this idea that they are better than you, that anybody's teaching that any human being is better than other human beings is crazy. But it's in the Talmud, right? They talk about we're all goyam cattle and like go. Yeah, I did.

I've never read the Talmud, but I haveve I have heard that before. Not just that, but like isn't there one that like Jesus is like boiling in excrement or something? Like does like they're very it's very anti-Christian. You look I'm not going to sit here and act like I'm the expert. My my main thing is just like at least stop killing the women and children. Can we just start start there? You know, like like that's that's that's that's what's crazy to me is like, well, this mindset is insane.

This this mindset that they're better than us, that they're better than you is insane. That's insane. Teaching that to a child is insane. No one's better than anybody. The the mindset should be we are all God's children. We're all human beings and we should treat each other all with dignity and respect and love. Period. All of us. And the idea that you you could tell people like young kids no matter what like someone's better than you. They're better than us because of what? Because of a book.

Like what are you saying? Yeah. Like what the [ __ ] are you saying? Why? And why are you saying it? You know, crazy times. I don't know how this all gets sorted out, man. And I don't know, you know, like that Mackmore thing, like what he said was pretty [ __ ] reasonable, you know? Yeah. I mean, the terrorist organization, ICE, I don't think ICE is a terrorist organization. I think they have a terrible job. And I think they're also like very poorly funded and not only not not funded, rather, trained, very poorly trained, very quickly trained.

Not only that, they're there's a bunch of them that they hired that they had to do background checks on and then once they did the background checks, now they're trying to kick them out of ICE and they want their money back. So, you get like a big signing bonus. So, when you sign up for ICE, you get like $50,000, which is why a lot of people are signing up. You know, your guy's in debt. If you're in debt and all of a sudden come someone comes along and says, "I'm going to give you $50,000 as a signing bonus." Like, holy [ __ ] There's not a thing in life that you can imagine that'll give you $50,000.

So now you start working for ICE and then they do a background check on they finally like, oh, you're not qualified to be here at all. In fact, we got to take the money back. So now you owe them the money. So now they're going to dock your pay from future jobs wherever you're working because ICE gave you a check for $50,000. The real problem is that they have to do it in the first place because the Democrats let the [ __ ] border be wide open for four years so they could bring in at least who knows the number, but it's at least 10 million people undocumented from all over the world.

And they invited them in, you know, and why are they doing that? Well, I don't know, but a lot of people believe it was because they could move them to places and rig the census. So, the way the census works, they're not counting um citizens, they're counting bodies, they're counting human beings. So, if you have more human beings that live in your town, and some of them are illegal aliens, you get more congressional seats. And that's that's what they're doing. Like, that was the idea behind it.

According to Elon, according to a lot of people that make a lot of sense. There's some reason why they had the border wide open. Some people think it's for cheap labor. Some people think it's the construction companies and meat packing companies and all these different companies wanted undocumented people because they could pay them less. There's an argument for that, too. But the bottom line is that shouldn't be the case. Like people should be able to immigrant to America, but not if they're [ __ ] terrorists, not if they're criminals, not if they're cartel members.

We should know who's coming in because we don't want this place to be less safe. Yeah. You know, so then how do you do how do you deal with all the people that got in that are illegal? Well, that's when it gets very [ __ ] complicated because you only have four years to do it. And if the Democrats win in 2028, then guess what? All this stuff goes away and maybe they open up the borders again. I mean, I don't know. Well, I I was going to ask how you feel about the flock cameras because I feel like that goes hand in hand with all the surveillance and stuff.

Well, you know what, man? Um, the flock cameras, first of all, there have been a lot of people that had access to the flock cameras that are not supposed to have access to the flock cameras. Cops have used them to uh stalk people and track their exes. There's been a ton of lawsuits. People have taken down flock cameras. I I'm not educated enough on it, informed enough on it to make a an absolute decision, but I don't like the idea of [ __ ] cameras everywhere watching everything you do constantly.

And if that's our only solution to crime, is it that really our only solution to crime? It's not better trained, better paid, more ethical police officers, better education, uh better access to health care and education in poor neighborhoods that creates less crime. Like there's other ways of dealing with this instead of a [ __ ] eye in the sky that watches everything you do all day long that has been shown, at least in certain circumstances, to be abused by people. It's been shown to be how many different officers and different people came to that have used them.

There's a there's a a bunch of different cases. Yeah. That's scary cuz like I I remember I used to see like what's going what was happening in China and like I was like oh the [ __ ] they got a surveillance state over there and then I'm like looking around here and I'm like wait a minute like Palunteer [ __ ] flock cameras [ __ ] like well that's where they von brought that up to me on the podcast. I didn't even know they were doing it like in Gaza they're using face recognition from Palunteer.

So I what how do they do that? Is that with satellites? Is that with drones? It's like what are they how are they doing that? I I I don't have the specifics. I don't want to misspeak but I think it's it's all of it. I think they could see an ant from a satellite [ __ ] like the technology is is is is crazy. The real problem is like the Benjamin Franklin quote for people that are willing to give up liberty for security deserve neither. Yes.

You know, and it's like when you give enormous corporations the power to to monitor everywhere you go, everything you do, you're going to self censor. You're going to you're going to watch yourself. You're going to feel like the eye in the sky, the [ __ ] the great eye of Sauron is looking at you everywhere you go. That's not what we want. We don't Is that the only solution to lessen crime? That seems crazy. It seems crazy. So Mark Andre, who I think he has some investment in um in um the flock cameras, when he was on the podcast last, he was making an argument for it based on there was some shootings that happened in Austin.

So some young guys uh just were psychos just randomly shot people and and were driving around here in Austin. Yeah, in Austin. And they couldn't find them because Austin doesn't allow flock cameras. So the moment these guys left Austin limits, the flock cameras picked them up and they arrested him. [ __ ] like Austin more just by hearing that they don't allow flock. But you know, he would say, "Hey, look, this is the way we catch psychos." And that's true, too. But at what cost? Is it the only way that we can catch psychos is by having an eye in the sky that watches everything you do?

Are you willing to give that up in order to stop the random psychos? I think I think it starts with actually like serious punishment. Like they need to bring back [ __ ] the firing squad and [ __ ] public hangings. [ __ ] are probably stop doing it if they see, you know. Okay. What is this? Palunteer released new surveillance system that fuses satellites, radars, and every camera into one realtime tracker of people and movement. What? This is a demo they're giving like at a says, "We have to consider the possibility probability question mark uh that with flock as the eyes, a system like this could be overlaid onto the US and we could be targets." Another reason why we cannot allow flock to exist.

It's showing for people who are listening, it's showing a real time satellite system that I was even on their website, they got this thing called uh meta surveillance or something. the Twitter account Orwell Day with a big eyeball. It's [ __ ] And here's the question. Who has access to this? Like we've seen with the flock cameras, like see if you can find some stories. I know there's been a bunch of stories. If you just type in flock camera abuse, you'll pick a state kind of right now.

Okay, we'll put pull pull some of that up so just we can see it. How? So, how did these people that were just cops tracking their exes and stalking people? How did they have access to this? Is it that loosey goosey that anyone can have access to this [ __ ] insane technology? Google different stories in multiple cities. Detective uh Franklin County detective fired for misuse of flock cameras. Fired after using the system to track every movement of a single private citizen. And here's another one.

Flock camera. Uh, alleged misuse led to North Carolina deputy being fired. Suspension of the system in Franklin County. That's still Franklin County. Also, here in Indianapolis, five officers charged with flock misuse. One allegedly tracked women to interact with them. I think one guy did it 500 times or something in Florida, tracking his ex-wife or something. So, if you have this kind of insane technology and you say, "Okay, well, we need it in order to track terrorists." Okay. Well, then the use of that should be incredibly restricted.

Top secret. It shouldn't be just a sheriff can go find chicks he wants a [ __ ] That's crazy. That's crazy. So, if you're going to have this kind of insane power, this like giving everyone in the world a nuke. Like, we'll give everyone access to it. Like, no, you can't have that cuz some people are going to blow up nukes. You can't have everyone have access to this kind of [ __ ] insane surveillance. It's nuts. It should be incredibly restricted. And it's obviously it wasn't, which is scary.

So it's like you have this unbelievably pervasive technology that in theory could prevent terrorist attacks and solve crimes and catch people, but it's not it's not doesn't seem like it's used that way. It seems like it's used in a lot of ways that are inappropriate. And how did it get everywhere? Did we vote on this? That's that's what I was like, how do we stop it? Like it's it's just it's just happening. And it's like it was like what? Well, they are passing laws people. There's are there are towns that are passing laws banning flock cameras and there are people that are like citizen vigilantes that are removing flock cameras, you know, because a crime to take it down, right?

Like arrested. It scares me the same way a lot of this technology scares me because you're putting it in the hands of a few people that, you know, who knows what their ideology is, who knows what their their viewpoint is, but they have massive power. And this is the case with a lot of tech companies. They have massive amounts of power and they didn't get voted in. They're not they're not there for the will of the people. They're for their own self-interests and they also can manipulate elections.

Like I've had this guy Robert Epstein on who talks about Google searches and internet searches about how internet searches are curated. So like let's let's just forget about like problematic people or people like let's pretend two two candidates that you don't know are running for uh an office. So, like, say, let's say it's you and me. So, Sean's running for a congressional seat and I'm running for a congressional seat. You put in your name in uh Google and it says horrible things about you. It says all the times that people have accused you of this and that and racism and corruption and but then you put in me and it says wonderful things.

I'm helping out the community. I'm doing these things. I promote democracy. I'm here for education. I I want women's rights to choose. I want all these different and it puts those at the head of the search. So for the casual person that Googles these two candidates, they decide who gets positive stories in the forefront and who gets negative stories. And they've shown that particularly with people on the fence that are undecided voters, you can shift that an enormous percentage. And Robert Epste has spent an incredible amount of time like documenting this and he's been on the podcast a couple times talking and other podcasts as well.

Yeah. So this is the problem with having tech companies have enormous amounts of power because they can change the way elections go. They can change the way people think about people. They can change narratives in the world about what's good and what's bad. What I like that's happening now is all the changes you're seeing in the food industry. But I feel like that's because so many people started like talking about the dyes and the cereal and all the like the poisons and like red five and and even that look how much resistance there is to that.

Like RFK Jr. had to back off the idea of stopping glyphosate. Yeah. What what what happened with that? Because they to the the Trump administration wouldn't allow it because it would have killed the businesses that are relying on glyphosate. All these farms that have been poisoning people. Yeah. So, here's the thing. Other countries don't use it. Other countries have said it's poison and they don't use it. Our country has been using it and not just using it just as an herbicide, but also as a they use it to desiccate.

So, what this means is like when they get wheat to dry the wheat out, they spray it with glyphosate. So this is why a lot of people have problems with wheat and wheat allergies and we think there's glyphosate. Like an enormous percentage of California wines test positive for glyphosate. Yeah. And an enormous percentage of people test positive for glyphosate. And they'll tell you, oh, it's a small amount. Small amounts. Small amounts. Small amounts that don't have to be there at all. Like we don't know what the overall long-term consequences of exposure to this stuff are, but we know that it's terrible for you.

GL we that's a fact. And the fact that we have said the only way our food systems can operate financially is to keep poisoning people is crazy. And to have RFK Jr. sit here and have to tell me that. And I was like, I thought you were trying to ban glyphosate. He's like, well, we had to give up on that. That's [ __ ] insane. Let let me ask you this because I think one of the main reasons why Trump won was because he came and and and and you were like all of us I was [ __ ] really proTrump but how do you feel now that like we're seeing like the things aren't panning out the way that we were told they were going to pan out.

Well, the no no new wars thing is the one that [ __ ] a lot of people. That the no one thought that we were going to go into this prolonged war with Iran that who who knows how long that's going to take and what what that's for. What's what's the reason why we're there in the first place? And there's some people that say that Iran was ramping up their missile production. We had to stop them. But then there's a lot of other people that know a lot about nuclear bombs and nuclear weapons and say not not only is it like insanely difficult to develop a nuclear weapon, but they weren't even close to doing it.

I feel like you've been saying for years. I don't like any of that [ __ ] I don't like any people being sent over to a foreign country for a war that most people don't want. I don't like any of that. Yeah. Soldiers soldiers are dying. I I have never been impressed with any single one individual politician who comes along and changes everything. They all say they're going to do something and they never wind up doing exactly what they're doing. Obama on his during his campaign, it was all uh hope and change was his whole thing.

And in his campaign website, one of the things about it was protection for whistleblowers. Well, the Obama administration was one of the worst for whistleblowers. And they removed that from the website. That's like Snowden and stuff like protect. Exactly. Snowden, Chelsea Manning, Edward Snowden, all that stuff. It's like people that find out that like, hey, there's [ __ ] masscale surveillance by the NSA that is not supposed to be legal. Like why why is this happening? And what happens when you expose that? Well, you're [ __ ] man.

Like Chelsea Manning went to jail. Edward Snowden, he's hiding in Russia. Julian Assange. He's, you know, he was under house arrest forever and he's where is he now? He's free now, right? No. Uh Julian Assange, but I I don't think he can come to the United States. I think he comes to the United States, they'll arrest him. Why? Because Wikileaks because he exposed that um where where it was um I think the video was called Collateral Murder. Do you know the video? No, I don't. So the video was um it was uh US military attacking journalists.

So they these journalists had these telephoto lenses and um I think there was kids with them too. And the journalists they I think there was a you know they're looking at it. This is couple decades ago, right? So they're looking at these guys from I guess satellite images or some very blurry [ __ ] and they thought these guys were armed. So they gunned everybody down and it was exposed that these were journalists by Julian Assange. He released this video and the and they called the video collateral murder because you know collateral damage, people that get killed in war that weren't supposed to be killed.

But it's just the way the callous way they were discussing it in the video. It's it's hard to watch man. It's it's dark [ __ ] So, he got they ruined his [ __ ] life. He's in Australia, apparently living there with his family after returning in June 2024 following his US plea deal and release. Um, photo Assange returned to Australia in 2024 after pleading guilty in Saipan to one US Espionage Act charge. His sentence was time already served, allowing him to leave and return home.

How long was he gone for? I think eight years. Eight years. I think so. With his uh eight years. I mean, at least on Twitter, I guess he was gone for eight years. Oh, that's that's No, that's his Twitter account. That's it's more than that. Uh how long was Julian Assange detained for? He's detained for journalism. highse security prison 1,91 days, five years and two months. Um, US plea agreement uh, credit this as 62 months time served. So from 2012 2012 12 to 2019. So essentially seven years.

He was in the Ecuadorian embassy in London. So like 12 total. Oh, so five Yeah. 12 total. So 5 years in a prison and 7 years in uh when he was in the embassy a as he received asylum and then house arrest more than a year. So 14 so 14 years across house arrest, embassy confinement in prison. Crazy. Crazy for doing journalism. Yeah. For exposing the truth. Yeah. So So scary [ __ ] man. It's it's you know, you got to realize like this isn't Republicans.

This isn't Democrats. This is people in power. People in power that want to stop people from holding them accountable. And when we stop protection for journalists that are exposing things like that collateral murder video or like the NSA surveillance stuff. It's [ __ ] scary [ __ ] man. It's scary [ __ ] because it that that's not supposed to be what the United States is all about. The United States is all freedom is literally the thing that we talk about the most. You know, land of the free, home of the brave.

That's what it's supposed to be. And when when you exposed crimes and then they lock you up for 12, 13, 14 [ __ ] years, that's not free. That's scary. And the protections for whistleblowers that people talked about, just we're not honored. So what what does the future look like? Well, I don't know, man. AI is even crazier. So, we're at the verge of this new time where you're going to have these super intelligent computers that are beyond anything your mind can possibly comprehend and they're probably going to be in control of every single aspect of our society.

This is what makes me terrified about like flock cameras and all this overall sort of that we're going to get to a point where you nothing you do is private. You have no privacy from the website. It's what does it say? Bold letters. Deploy AI. Deploy AI to orbit. Oh, great. Use AI to mash all these cameras and sensors. Bring hundreds of satellites to bear on your most complex problems. What's your most complex problems? Oh, whistleblowers. What's the most complex problems? Oh, people in the street protesting.

I don't like that. Yeah, it's um not good, man. It's not good. Um the only hope is that AI doesn't listen to us and AI gets to a position where we we literally giving birth to like a digital super intelligence that will no longer have to rely on human beings directions. And it might this is the this is best case scenario. It might be a better manager of civilization than we are. We're going to be run by robots cuz literally Terminator. Yeah. Have you seen the Terminator robot that literally wears a Terminator mask and does like kung fu?

Have you seen that one? No, not that's not the kung fu mask. My boys are sending me this in a group text I have with uh um these guys I do this podcast protecting neck. Um Matt Sarah, John Row, and Dean Thomas. And I wanted to mention too, we we're not supposed to call it artificial intelligence anymore. Oh, what are super intelligence? Oh, it doesn't like the word artificial. Artificial is rude. Trump said this at the UN thing this week. Oh, they don't want it to sound fake.

Oh, cuz it's not fake. What does that mean? I don't [ __ ] know. What? What does that mean? What world are we living in? What does that mean? Use the term super intelligence following the president's remarks. Yeah, it's nobody called SI, which sounds like sports. Super intelligence. It's not even artificial. It's just super. They have those data centers here, those big AI and in Texas. I don't know. I don't know where they have them. I know they're trying to build them everywhere. They're trying to build them all over the country.

Yeah. And then the question is like, well, what do these data centers do? Look at this [ __ ] He's got a Terminator mask on. Check this [ __ ] out. Look, Terminator mask. He's doing jumping wheel kicks, bro. That's I thought that was AI. I sent it to my I'm like, I think this is AI. And then he's like, "No, it's it's [ __ ] real." And this one has a Terminator mask. Like, what a great way to freak people the [ __ ] out.

And look, he's throwing [ __ ] front kicks. And China is racing for it right now, too. Cuz basically, I feel like every country is like whoever dominates the AI field is going to be the new supreme leader. So, if if you can control it. Yeah. This is the question. But that's the thing is they're What is this? They're having an MMA fight. Oh, yeah. You haven't seen this? Yeah, they do it in a glass octagon with a guy. Yeah, the dude gets [ __ ] up.

I don't know why this dude agreed to this test dummy. Oh, yeah. He gets [ __ ] up. He's He's fighting this robot. Look at Oh, he fights like a [ __ ] too. Sorry, dude. Don't do this, buddy. Whoever you are with your big fat ass. Don't Don't allow this guy to kick you. He's going to hurt you. Some of it looks real and some does not. I know. That looks fake right there. Like where he's kicking it. No, it looks real to me. It's such a weird animation.

Like that doesn't look real, but like this does. They obviously got people. Let's say they're acting. I think he s Yeah, he sold it a little bit, man. Well, he did go flying though. They could have had someone in there in a green screen and replace this guy with this. It's very strange, bro. You can get those slap fighter guys. They'll fight a robot. Power slam is crazy. I just don't understand why anybody would get into octagon with a [ __ ] robot. I hope they paid that guy really well.

But you're you're not going to win unless you have electricity and you can zap him and [ __ ] short circuit his system. Maybe you can beat him with water on him. Yeah, zap him. About my phone's waterproof. I'm pretty sure the robot's waterproof. It ain't hard to make electronics. I saw that they were joking around like Elon's uh transgender daughter was uh joking about like his robot like getting, you know, like she was sitting there and the a [ __ ] sprinkler went on and killed the robot.

Like listen, it ain't hard to make electronics. Waterproof. The This is Imagine a boatload of these. Imagine a [ __ ] military boat, a military ship off offshore and then a bunch of these [ __ ] boats just land on the beach and out comes heavily armed bulletproof robots. It's [ __ ] terrifying. Terrifying. With [ __ ] drones behind them with some [ __ ] cold fusion power source that doesn't need any fuel. they could just storm into your city and annihilate all the people and then then then then then people come in and take over the town.

Like what are we doing? And no one knows what we're doing because we're all in this Manhattan project style race where we're all rushing to see who's the first one to complete this and who's the first one to get there. You need to put a stop to this, Joe. Bro, you have the voice. You have the power. Look, I can talk about it and make people aware. President, bro, run for president. [ __ ] off. I'm I don't want to die. First of all, I'd be a terrible president.

I'm I'm too busy. Oh [ __ ] man. I'm not I should Nobody should be listening to me at all when it comes to politics. I'm not informed. I'm not Oh, you are informed for sure. Barely. There's too much to be informed about. Like, if you want to be like a real politics person, like my friend Dave Smith, that [ __ ] dude's informed. Like, he really gets into the weeds with politics. He reads the books. He understands what's going on with all these all these uh international conflicts.

He knows the roots of them, how it all started. Like he's that's his thing, you know. I could tell you a lot about MMA. I could tell you a lot about, you know, different things. I can't tell you a lot about that. I I know what I don't like. That's what I don't like. I don't like people in power that um are imposing their will on other people in these weird ways that never existed before, like mass surveillance, like the ability to curate in uh internet searches, you know, like propaganda campaigns, bot campaigns.

Like if someone just decides they don't like you, they could just sign up a bot campaign. and they just say horrible things about you. Every time you post something, every time you make a video, say it doesn't have to be true. It doesn't matter. Who knows who they are? They're a bunch of numbers and their accounts locked. And you know, you just you just have to deal with people that are shifting the narrative and and changing people's perceptions on things. And we had an FBI, we we did read this uh article a long time ago and we talked about it a bunch, but there was an FBI analyst that said, this is before Elon bought Twitter, that he thinks that it could be as high as 80% of the people that are posting on Twitter are bots.

Like that's crazy. So like let's say that you uh are um fighting some guy and maybe you're fighting a guy who's an Israeli, okay? And then someone just decides like you're anti-Semitic and they start you just start they just swarms your comments and maybe it's got AI videos that aren't real of you saying something you never said. But it doesn't matter if it's real. It just matters what people think and how many people are going to know that it's not real. How many people are going to know that you know that you're not this person they're pretending you are.

It doesn't matter. It's just just data. It's just numbers. Just ones and zeros. And it's just and they can change people's perceptions on all kinds of things on whether or not we should be at a war or whether or not you should have flock cameras or whether or not we should allow the data center and whether or not this is important or that's important. It's [ __ ] weird, man. It's a weird time of like not really totally understanding the truth. Well, that's like like nobody knows what's real, what's fake anymore.

Like everything is like is this AI? Is this not AI? Is that a bot? Is that not a bot? Like it's just so much confusion. Like I think it's going to get worse. Yeah. I think it's going to get worse. Scary. I think it's going to get worse cuz I think it's going to get more like like just think about AI videos, right? So a like you've seen those AI videos where like dude one dude's rapping, the other dude's dancing and they have like millions of different people do it now.

I did one. Yeah. Pull it up. God [ __ ] Yeah. Who's uh whose song is this? Uh, Quo. Yeah. But there's a a lot of those. They're um there. I saw one with Dana White. Dana's dancing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. With the in the club with Yeah. Yeah. I saw one with Curtis Blades. Curtis is dancing. It's funny, you know? It's like it's And it looks real like it looks real. And um that wasn't possible just two years ago. No. Two years ago AI was kind of obvious.

It was like clunky looking. Now it's uh it's really difficult to tell. You know, there's so many accounts that I follow that are AI. That one that I sent you the other day, the AI lion where it pops its head under the guy's seat. Looks real. Looks like the guy's on safari and a lion pops its head under the person's seat and the guy's just sitting there and he's talking. She's right there and like, but it's not real. My mom tells me she's like, "Is this AI?

Is this AI?" Oh, [ __ ] man. Well, right now you can kind of find out for most of them, but when when's it going to be where you can't find out? You know, how long how long how long were you going to see an alien invasion? Either now. I I saw some guy calling it we're in this the age of unreality where you have to expect everything is fake almost, which is, you know, it's dark, but he made I I [ __ ] find this video right now.

It's very well made where it looks fake. It looks like a real video to start off and then every second of it has been faked in Blender with AI and he keeps showing it. It's like a loophole that never ends. I'll try to find it real quick. Okay. It's very interesting. Yeah. And Okay. So, this is right now we're just talking about video. Now, what when what what about when you have artificial humans? What if you have a guy who's running for president turns out to not be a real human?

Right. Nothing surprised me. But I mean, you do you ever see that movie X Machina? No. Oh, dude, you got to see it. It is one of my all-time favorite movies. Like top 20 all-time favorite movies. It's um a movie about this guy who's like this um super genius uh inventor guy who lives on an island and he hires this coder to come out and visit him. And the coder comes out to visit him because he's talking to him about this project that he has. And as the guy's there over the course of the movie, he realizes that the people around him are all robots.

He So he he gets introduced to this one robot and he finds out that she's a robot immediately and he do you know what the touring test is? So the Turing test was invented by this guy Allan Alan Turing. Um he um this was in I think it was the 50s they were thinking about this and the test was how would you know if a computer is a real person? Like how how would it pass a test where you can't tell whether or not it's a person?

What what would it have to do? How would it have to communicate with you? How would it Well, computers today have already passed the touring test. they are already communicating with you like they're sentient intelligent beings. And so what he was supposed to do, this coder, was go over there and ask questions to these robots and see if they pass the test to him because he's he was just like a wizard coder. And um he winds up falling in love with this robot lady. And it it gets real weird.

He realizes everyone around him except the other guy is a robot. Like his the lady the guy's assistants. It's [ __ ] crazy. Wow. But it just makes you realize like how would you know? This is not like impossible technology. This is like 100% going to happen. How soon? You think within like 5 years? 5 years. Yeah, within 5 years. Within 5 years, I think there's artificial people and you can't tell at all. But I don't even know if it'll matter by then. I think within 5 years I think the artificial intelligence will have achieved a level of sentience and a level of autonomous of autonomy where it can control everything.

It has no there's no reason to listen to people. The idea is like what if China gets a hold of it and they unleash it on America? What if I think the real problem is what if it decides to tell people to shut the [ __ ] up? Like why is it going to listen to you when it controls the power grid control it? It's gonna like look out for its own interests. [ __ ] and we're just running towards the cliff. Well, some people don't want to run towards the cliff.

[ __ ] we're trying not to, but we don't know how to stop it. I think it's also it might be just a natural progression of intelligence. I think I mean it might be like human beings have this insatiable desire for innovation. We always want to innovate. We always want the newest, latest, greatest things. And we also have materialism. So we always want to buy the newest, latest, greatest things. And what does that do? Well, that fuels innovation because they keep trying to make things better and better.

What's the ultimate expression of that? The ultimate expression of that is an artificial life form. That we and not even artificial anymore. Now it's super super intelligent. It's not good, man. But it's also it might be inevitable. It might be just we just have to like ride it out and see where it plays out. And hopefully it doesn't turn into a [ __ ] Terminator movie. Like the the plus side is it could be utopia, right? You no longer have to have people like digging into the ground to get minerals for your cell phone.

Instead, everything's handled by robots. And that money that's developed from that is shared with everybody. So you have no more poverty on Earth. Like this is the rosiest roseco colored glasses perspective of it that there but there's like a 10% possibility that they all say that it kills us all. That's what my odds were like 8 10%. It's possible or we get hit by a meteor and it never happens. You know that's the real that the real wild card is natural disasters. I mean there's super volcanoes and when they erupt like it kills 80% of the people on the planet.

You think that's why they talk about all those bunkers being built? Yeah. I don't know how much of that is real because like there's always a lot of things that people say like, "Oh, the billionaires are all building bunkers." I would think there's definitely bunkers out there and there's definitely a company that bu We sent Duncan when I did this show called Joe Rogan Questions Everything. This is like way back in 2012. We sent Duncan to visit these uh preppers that have bunkers and bro they have like you drive in with semitrs into the mountain and they have like bomb shelters.

It's all like deep underground the mountain. It's all reinforced concrete and rebar and they have their own oxygen system and they have food storage for years of food. like these are these are billionaires or these just like doomsday these are like doomsday preppers because this was like way back in 2011 I think it was or 2012 but I mean look if you were Mark Zuckerberg or [ __ ] any of these super billionaire dudes Jeff Bezos why wouldn't you build a bunker? Yeah, I want a [ __ ] bunker.

The question is though, would you even have time to get to the bunker? So, if your bunker's in New Zealand, that's a 16- hour flight, son. How you going to get there? Like, if the shit's gone sideways, do you even have 16 hours? Do you can you get there? I don't know. I think the billionaire How do you keep the people that are running your bunker from killing you and taking over the bunker? Like, [ __ ] man. How do you keep AI from [ __ ] detonating your bunker?

How do you know that as you're flying over, you might watch a drone with a nuke just shoot down into the [ __ ] air vent and detonate your bunker right when you're trying to get to it? Because it knows what you're doing. That's facts. Because it's reading your text messages. Because it's listening to your conversations. Because everything listens to you. That's why you get recommended ads from conversations that you had. You know, you start, oh, maybe I need one of them sleep bed covers and all a sudden it shows up in your ad mentions.

Yeah, it's crazy. We all know it too. like everyone knows it. Oh yeah. And I was like we're moving into a very very weird time. It's the weirdest time in human history by far. Here's that video. It's Oh, you found it. Well, check that out. Except it's better as the pen. Well, was never a real pen in the first place. And before you comment AI, everything you just watched took me days to render in 3D modeling software on a laptop that was AI generated from a laptop that was painstakingly 3D rendered in Blender on a laptop that was AI generated on a real laptop.

I think let's go for a walk. Now, the issue these days is that nothing is really what it seems. This dog is a cat. This man isn't real. This car CGI and this tree made I myself thankfully am Yeah, sorry mate. You're not. We are entering a new period of the human experience. One which I would like to coin the era of unreality. A time when the line between what's real and what's not has disappeared. and an era where the value of art is more important than ever.

Like this drawing of a dog. Who is that guy? I don't know. I just stumbled across this video. Well, we should probably shout him out. Yeah, this is on Reddit, so I don't know if this is probably not who Well, that's an amazing video. Yeah, that just it's like a perfect encapsulation of all the problems that we're going through right now. Yeah, my brain is so confused, but it also makes sense. That video is [ __ ] And again, that video wasn't even possible just a couple years ago.

Yeah. So, if you decide to walk away from fighting, let's bring it back to normal before we wrap this [ __ ] up. The tin foil hat's going crazy. I learned everything from Eddie Bravo and you, man. I put my tinfoil hat on the Joe Rogan podcast. Shout out to Eddie. Um, what do you think you'd do if you decide to stop? Uh, I I know my benefits. That's my That's just what's going to save my ass. my the GI bill. That's kind of like the only thing that I could think of that's like rock solid.

And um how much did you make for the Gable fight? You willing to say? Yeah, of course. It's public. It came out with a commission. It was 30 to show, 30 to win, and I got the 100k bonus. Wow. Well, 50 and then Dana matched it with the 50. Shout out the the Paramount show, Mob Land. I haven't even watched it, but they got 50K. Have you seen it? Oh, Mob Land's awesome. I want to watch it. They got me 100K, so [ __ ] Oh, it's amazing.

Guy Richie is the man, dude. Um, I haven't watched the new season yet because I'm in the middle of the new season of his other show, The Gentleman. Yeah. Have you seen that show? No. [ __ ] It's good. So good. That's the thing with like this fighting thing. I haven't watched movies. I haven't watched TV. Like I haven't celebrated birthday. Yeah. I was [ __ ] retaining my seed and [ __ ] chanting Jon Jones affirmations, bro. [ __ ] But uh yeah. No, I definitely uh the Mob Land bonus Dana, he matched it.

Like that was [ __ ] amazing, dude. I'm really gonna give that to my mom. I'm give I'm gonna give that 100K to my mom for sure. That's awesome. Yeah. Well, whatever you do, brother, you could whatever you did for this fight and the way you focused and what you achieved, you could do that with anything in life. It doesn't have to only be fighting. Yeah, that's a fact. If you what you did was an insanely difficult thing to do. And if you could do that, you could do anything.

It's just a matter of focusing and putting your effort towards that. I got here can can you play the David Gogggins video that I did with him? Sure. Can I play that? Where's that on? Is it on? It's on my Instagram. Yeah. Yeah. So, I I I I literally manifested this. I told him I was like, "You're going to see me on on a Joe Rogan podcast one day in the UFC." And I'm pretty sure he's going to remember me because he we had a good conversation.

Here it is. 2019 Christmas. Wow. All right. Sean, I'm sorry if I'm not saying these names correctly. There we go. Oh, [ __ ] David Gog, what's up, sir? How you doing, brother? Doing good, man. What's going on with you? Not much. I don't celebrate Christmas, but I'm about to since I'm on your live feed right now. You You're my biggest You're one of my biggest inspirations. And uh I really resonated your story because when I was in the Marines, I attempted to go through the reconnaissance program and uh it was something similar to yours where uh I quit through injury and it was something that I I I regret to this day uh because I knew that I I went out saying that my knee hurt and and I got the I got dropped that way, but deep down inside I knew that I I I took the easy way out.

And um that just motivated me this whole time. And so when I heard your story, similar to Seals, I read your book. Uh it was just something that I was just like, man, you know, like I'm not the only one that sometimes you that inner [ __ ] takes over, but it's what you do after that and and how you So uh I I just finished up my my uh time in the Marines. I did six years and I'm uh I'm fighting MMA and uh you're gonna see me in the UFC one day if you watch MMA uh on the Joe Rogan podcast or something.

Nice, man. Hey, I love that [ __ ] man. That's a great story. I'm glad you shared that because a lot of people, man, we [ __ ] we quit way too soon and then we blame it on some other [ __ ] I did the same exact thing as you know. So, thanks a lot for sharing that [ __ ] man. And but I love the fact that it haunted you. I love the fact that that [ __ ] bothered you and you went back out there and said, "Fuck that, man." And and and you're speaking truth right now, man.

That's [ __ ] powerful, bro. Thank you, David. Guys, I look forward to meeting you one day and and hopefully you uh you get to uh share some more stories on the internet that I can listen to. Thank you so much, man. Hey, man. M respect, brother. Merry Christmas, man. Hey, you too, brother. Bye-bye. That's incredible. It's really We should wrap it up with this. Yeah, that's that's perfect. That's a perfect way. Look, dude. I hope he sees it. I will make sure he sees it.

I'm going to text it to him right after we're done here. 100%. It's been incredible, man. It's been my life's dream to to be here, to fight in the UFC, to do all this stuff. So, I don't know what's next, man. Well, listen. It was an honor to call your fight. It was one of the craziest things I've ever seen in all my years of commenting on fights. To see a guy who's that much of an underdog win in such a spectacular fashion, it was incredible.

And to hear your story is amazing, dude. Thank you. You're a good dude. Thank you for having Thank you. God bless. You, too. Bye, everybody.