How I sold my company to Coca-Cola for $2B | Rohan Oza

Every deal on Shark Tank, that's a Every deal on Shark Tank, that's a beverage. I know they're looking at me. beverage. I know they're looking at me. beverage. I know they're looking at me. But nobody wins the lottery seven times. But nobody wins the lottery seven times. But nobody wins the lottery seven times. You got sharks spitting out the product, You got sharks spitting out the product, You got sharks spitting out the product, you've got a terrible brand name, and you've got a terrible brand name, and you've got a terrible brand name, and you pick up 25% of that company. Sold you pick up 25% of that company. Sold you pick up 25% of that company. Sold for billion and a half. for billion and a half. for billion and a half. >> Is this just art or is there some >> Is this just art or is there some >> Is this just art or is there some science behind it? science behind it? science behind it? >> One of the biggest lines of Robert >> One of the biggest lines of Robert >> One of the biggest lines of Robert Woodruff was like he wanted Coke to be Woodruff was like he wanted Coke to be Woodruff was like he wanted Coke to be within arms reach of desire. Brand is within arms reach of desire. Brand is within arms reach of desire. Brand is creating that desire. One in 10 creating that desire. One in 10 creating that desire. One in 10 Americans influence the other nine. The Americans influence the other nine. The Americans influence the other nine. The goal is to spot that one. goal is to spot that one. goal is to spot that one. >> Can you teach us more about how it's >> Can you teach us more about how it's >> Can you teach us more about how it's done? done? done? >> It's actually three things. One is >> It's actually three things. One is >> It's actually three things. One is spotting stuff early, one is building spotting stuff early, one is building spotting stuff early, one is building the brands, and the other is actually You are You are You're the brand father. You have been You're the brand father. You have been You're the brand father. You have been brand You You have been crushing it in brand You You have been crushing it in brand You You have been crushing it in the beverage space. I was reading the the beverage space. I was reading the the beverage space. I was reading the like research on you the last couple like research on you the last couple like research on you the last couple days. I knew about Poppi, I knew about days. I knew about Poppi, I knew about days. I knew about Poppi, I knew about Vitaminwater, but I didn't know the Vitaminwater, but I didn't know the Vitaminwater, but I didn't know the extent of it. Can you Can you brag for a extent of it. Can you Can you brag for a extent of it. Can you Can you brag for a second? Give me Shout out some of the second? Give me Shout out some of the second? Give me Shout out some of the brands that you've been involved with. I brands that you've been involved with. I brands that you've been involved with. I actually I've started none of I only actually I've started none of I only actually I've started none of I only co-founded one, which is Poppi, and I'll co-founded one, which is Poppi, and I'll co-founded one, which is Poppi, and I'll tell you that story. But the rest I just tell you that story. But the rest I just tell you that story. But the rest I just bought them early or I bought them with bought them early or I bought them with bought them early or I bought them with founders. I think it was like founders. I think it was like founders. I think it was like Vitaminwater, Smartwater, they were Vitaminwater, Smartwater, they were Vitaminwater, Smartwater, they were tiny. Vita Coco, even things I lost tiny. Vita Coco, even things I lost tiny. Vita Coco, even things I lost money on well-known like Popchips, money on well-known like Popchips, money on well-known like Popchips, uh Vital Proteins, One Bar, Bulletproof uh Vital Proteins, One Bar, Bulletproof uh Vital Proteins, One Bar, Bulletproof lost money but still known well-known. lost money but still known well-known. lost money but still known well-known. What else we have? Farmers Own, What else we have? Farmers Own, What else we have? Farmers Own, Once Upon a Farm, and then probably Once Upon a Farm, and then probably Once Upon a Farm, and then probably Poppi is my sort of most famous alone. Poppi is my sort of most famous alone. Poppi is my sort of most famous alone. >> That's an insane >> That's an insane >> That's an insane insane roster. It was It was funny insane roster. It was It was funny insane roster. It was It was funny actually. One of our founders who you actually. One of our founders who you actually. One of our founders who you know, um know, um know, um a guy called Golares, who's the a guy called Golares, who's the a guy called Golares, who's the co-founder of Gymkhana Fine Foods, was co-founder of Gymkhana Fine Foods, was co-founder of Gymkhana Fine Foods, was at a We had an LP conference. And you at a We had an LP conference. And you at a We had an LP conference. And you know, we're so focused on like know, we're so focused on like know, we're so focused on like the brands and the teams and growing the brands and the teams and growing the brands and the teams and growing stuff. And like you sometimes bury stuff. And like you sometimes bury stuff. And like you sometimes bury yourself in the weeds and you don't yourself in the weeds and you don't yourself in the weeds and you don't sometimes ladder up. But he's like, "Yo, sometimes ladder up. But he's like, "Yo, sometimes ladder up. But he's like, "Yo, when you look at the sheet of brands on when you look at the sheet of brands on when you look at the sheet of brands on Cavu, which is Cavu, which is Cavu, which is the fund that I have sort of masthead, the fund that I have sort of masthead, the fund that I have sort of masthead, it's insane this ecosystem you've it's insane this ecosystem you've it's insane this ecosystem you've created. I think you do you need to do a created. I think you do you need to do a created. I think you do you need to do a better job of almost leveraging that better job of almost leveraging that better job of almost leveraging that ecosystem. And it kind of the light bulb ecosystem. And it kind of the light bulb ecosystem. And it kind of the light bulb went off cuz he's a founder, right? He's went off cuz he's a founder, right? He's went off cuz he's a founder, right? He's growing an incredible brand and I part growing an incredible brand and I part growing an incredible brand and I part of it I focus on individuals and of it I focus on individuals and of it I focus on individuals and sometimes we got to bring the whole gang sometimes we got to bring the whole gang sometimes we got to bring the whole gang in to realize the strength of what we in to realize the strength of what we in to realize the strength of what we have. It's sort of amazing because when have. It's sort of amazing because when have. It's sort of amazing because when a lot of people say the word it's sort a lot of people say the word it's sort a lot of people say the word it's sort of related to taste and both of those of related to taste and both of those of related to taste and both of those are can be pretty nebulous. are can be pretty nebulous. are can be pretty nebulous. But you sort of are like Paul McCartney But you sort of are like Paul McCartney But you sort of are like Paul McCartney or John Lennon where like you've made or John Lennon where like you've made or John Lennon where like you've made enough hits where you're like, okay, is enough hits where you're like, okay, is enough hits where you're like, okay, is this just art or is there some science this just art or is there some science this just art or is there some science behind it? behind it? behind it? >> nobody wins the lottery seven times. >> nobody wins the lottery seven times. >> nobody wins the lottery seven times. >> Yeah, I I >> Yeah, I I >> Yeah, I I I mean that's quite high accolades to be I mean that's quite high accolades to be I mean that's quite high accolades to be in any conversation that used the in any conversation that used the in any conversation that used the Beatles name, but there's always luck, Beatles name, but there's always luck, Beatles name, but there's always luck, guys. It's not like this you can't you guys. It's not like this you can't you guys. It's not like this you can't you got to the dice has got to roll your way got to the dice has got to roll your way got to the dice has got to roll your way a little bit, but if you have a game a little bit, but if you have a game a little bit, but if you have a game plan, which I've sort of honed over plan, which I've sort of honed over plan, which I've sort of honed over time, the odds flow in your favor. And time, the odds flow in your favor. And time, the odds flow in your favor. And so I've, you know, I've created some so I've, you know, I've created some so I've, you know, I've created some mantras and some principles and so on mantras and some principles and so on mantras and some principles and so on and so forth that I actually created and so forth that I actually created and so forth that I actually created after the fact cuz you don't go in after the fact cuz you don't go in after the fact cuz you don't go in saying, all right, guys, I've got five saying, all right, guys, I've got five saying, all right, guys, I've got five mantras. You're almost like you have a mantras. You're almost like you have a mantras. You're almost like you have a few hits and you're like, how did this few hits and you're like, how did this few hits and you're like, how did this happen? And then I rewind and go, okay, happen? And then I rewind and go, okay, happen? And then I rewind and go, okay, this is kind of how it happened. this is kind of how it happened. this is kind of how it happened. >> Give us one. What what's one of the >> Give us one. What what's one of the >> Give us one. What what's one of the first ones you realize like, okay, all first ones you realize like, okay, all first ones you realize like, okay, all right, that this is one that matters. We right, that this is one that matters. We right, that this is one that matters. We got to put that concrete. Couple of big got to put that concrete. Couple of big got to put that concrete. Couple of big ones. One is influence the influencer. ones. One is influence the influencer. ones. One is influence the influencer. So you got a pot of money, right? So you got a pot of money, right? So you got a pot of money, right? Whatever. Whatever. Whatever. A hundred grand, a million, a hundred A hundred grand, a million, a hundred A hundred grand, a million, a hundred million, whatever you want to spend on million, whatever you want to spend on million, whatever you want to spend on your marketing budget. Who do I get to? your marketing budget. Who do I get to? your marketing budget. Who do I get to? Right, I can't get to everyone. It's not Right, I can't get to everyone. It's not Right, I can't get to everyone. It's not it's not possible. No, you know, unless it's not possible. No, you know, unless it's not possible. No, you know, unless you're Amazon has the budget to get to you're Amazon has the budget to get to you're Amazon has the budget to get to everyone, but most people when they everyone, but most people when they everyone, but most people when they start a company they don't. So from my start a company they don't. So from my start a company they don't. So from my perspective it's one in 10 Americans and perspective it's one in 10 Americans and perspective it's one in 10 Americans and I say America cuz I say America cuz I say America cuz 90 100% of my career actually is America 90 100% of my career actually is America 90 100% of my career actually is America in terms of success. So, this is the in terms of success. So, this is the in terms of success. So, this is the greatest country in the world to be an greatest country in the world to be an greatest country in the world to be an entrepreneur. I say that everywhere I entrepreneur. I say that everywhere I entrepreneur. I say that everywhere I go. I truly believe it. So, in America, go. I truly believe it. So, in America, go. I truly believe it. So, in America, one in 10 Americans influence the other one in 10 Americans influence the other one in 10 Americans influence the other nine. nine. nine. The goal is to spot that one. The goal is to spot that one. The goal is to spot that one. And that has evolved over time. So, when And that has evolved over time. So, when And that has evolved over time. So, when I first started doing this, I first started doing this, I first started doing this, honestly, and I'm aging myself here, but honestly, and I'm aging myself here, but honestly, and I'm aging myself here, but some of the biggest influences, and I'm some of the biggest influences, and I'm some of the biggest influences, and I'm talking about back in the day with like talking about back in the day with like talking about back in the day with like Sprite even and even Vitamin Water, was Sprite even and even Vitamin Water, was Sprite even and even Vitamin Water, was radio DJs. radio DJs. radio DJs. Now, radio is dead and you guys are the Now, radio is dead and you guys are the Now, radio is dead and you guys are the heroes online, right? But before you heroes online, right? But before you heroes online, right? But before you before you podcast kings came along, uh before you podcast kings came along, uh before you podcast kings came along, uh it was radio DJs. And so, at one time in it was radio DJs. And so, at one time in it was radio DJs. And so, at one time in Vegas, I picked an award show annually, Vegas, I picked an award show annually, Vegas, I picked an award show annually, and I would fly in the top 25 cities and and I would fly in the top 25 cities and and I would fly in the top 25 cities and the top two DJs from every city. the top two DJs from every city. the top two DJs from every city. So, you have 50 people coming in, So, you have 50 people coming in, So, you have 50 people coming in, and every single artist that came to and every single artist that came to and every single artist that came to that award show that award show that award show would want to go to this place cuz you would want to go to this place cuz you would want to go to this place cuz you could hit 20 cities in 2 hours. could hit 20 cities in 2 hours. could hit 20 cities in 2 hours. It was almost like the cities came to It was almost like the cities came to It was almost like the cities came to you versus you traveling. And back then, you versus you traveling. And back then, you versus you traveling. And back then, you're releasing an album, a new you're releasing an album, a new you're releasing an album, a new product, whatever it is, you write that. product, whatever it is, you write that. product, whatever it is, you write that. And I did it back in the day on a brand And I did it back in the day on a brand And I did it back in the day on a brand called Sprite. It's a corporate brand, called Sprite. It's a corporate brand, called Sprite. It's a corporate brand, but we did something cool. And then I but we did something cool. And then I but we did something cool. And then I did that with Vitamin Water where I took did that with Vitamin Water where I took did that with Vitamin Water where I took on all the DJs in the local markets, and on all the DJs in the local markets, and on all the DJs in the local markets, and I hired people on my team that felt that I hired people on my team that felt that I hired people on my team that felt that vibe. Because in order to bond with a vibe. Because in order to bond with a vibe. Because in order to bond with a DJ, if your dog is not going to work. DJ, if your dog is not going to work. DJ, if your dog is not going to work. So, I hired people who kind of So, I hired people who kind of So, I hired people who kind of in my which is my next mantra, who lived in my which is my next mantra, who lived in my which is my next mantra, who lived the brand. They didn't market the brand. the brand. They didn't market the brand. the brand. They didn't market the brand. They lived Vitamin Water. That was their They lived Vitamin Water. That was their They lived Vitamin Water. That was their vibe. And so, that's now evolved today vibe. And so, that's now evolved today vibe. And so, that's now evolved today to like the Alex Earls of the world or to like the Alex Earls of the world or to like the Alex Earls of the world or the, you know, if it's a music, it's the the, you know, if it's a music, it's the the, you know, if it's a music, it's the 50 Cent who's having a amazing 50 Cent who's having a amazing 50 Cent who's having a amazing resurgence. But now it's digital social resurgence. But now it's digital social resurgence. But now it's digital social media influencers that were the early media influencers that were the early media influencers that were the early DJs. And the key is to spot that one in DJs. And the key is to spot that one in DJs. And the key is to spot that one in 10. So, that's been a big sort of 10. So, that's been a big sort of 10. So, that's been a big sort of philosophy of mine with every company we philosophy of mine with every company we philosophy of mine with every company we go into is who is that one in 10. go into is who is that one in 10. go into is who is that one in 10. Hey, Hey, to tell you about something Hey, Hey, to tell you about something Hey, Hey, to tell you about something pretty cool. We have a database of all pretty cool. We have a database of all pretty cool. We have a database of all of the unsexy business ideas that have of the unsexy business ideas that have of the unsexy business ideas that have been discussed on this podcast. So, been discussed on this podcast. So, been discussed on this podcast. So, hundreds of episodes, the team at hundreds of episodes, the team at hundreds of episodes, the team at HubSpot went through, they pulled out HubSpot went through, they pulled out HubSpot went through, they pulled out all the unsexy ideas. So, not the super all the unsexy ideas. So, not the super all the unsexy ideas. So, not the super high-tech ones, but the simple, high-tech ones, but the simple, high-tech ones, but the simple, relatable, interesting, profitable ideas relatable, interesting, profitable ideas relatable, interesting, profitable ideas that we have brainstormed, and they're that we have brainstormed, and they're that we have brainstormed, and they're all available for download for free. all available for download for free. all available for download for free. Just click the link in the description Just click the link in the description Just click the link in the description below. Thank you to our friends at below. Thank you to our friends at below. Thank you to our friends at HubSpot for sponsoring this podcast and HubSpot for sponsoring this podcast and HubSpot for sponsoring this podcast and putting together this free resource for putting together this free resource for putting together this free resource for you guys. Back to the show. you guys. Back to the show. you guys. Back to the show. Can you define what a brand even is? Can you define what a brand even is? Can you define what a brand even is? I think a brand is something that allows I think a brand is something that allows I think a brand is something that allows a consumer a consumer a consumer to have an emotional connection with a to have an emotional connection with a to have an emotional connection with a product. So, this is just a can. product. So, this is just a can. product. So, this is just a can. Gratuitous, uh, Gratuitous, uh, Gratuitous, uh, you know, product of certain. you know, product of certain. you know, product of certain. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I drink it. I like the product. Liquid's >> I drink it. I like the product. Liquid's >> I drink it. I like the product. Liquid's great. great. great. But, I got to create an emotional bond But, I got to create an emotional bond But, I got to create an emotional bond with people, so they request a Poppi. with people, so they request a Poppi. with people, so they request a Poppi. They reach for a Poppi. They reach for a Poppi. They reach for a Poppi. And I worked for Coke back in the day, And I worked for Coke back in the day, And I worked for Coke back in the day, and and and one of the biggest lines of Robert one of the biggest lines of Robert one of the biggest lines of Robert Woodruff was like one of the godfathers Woodruff was like one of the godfathers Woodruff was like one of the godfathers of making Coke what it is today. He said of making Coke what it is today. He said of making Coke what it is today. He said he wanted Coke to be within arm's reach he wanted Coke to be within arm's reach he wanted Coke to be within arm's reach of desire. of desire. of desire. Brand Brand Brand is creating that desire. Right. And is creating that desire. Right. And is creating that desire. Right. And then, the distribution is putting it in then, the distribution is putting it in then, the distribution is putting it in arm's reach. You nailed it. Exactly. Sam arm's reach. You nailed it. Exactly. Sam arm's reach. You nailed it. Exactly. Sam sent texted me a clip this morning of sent texted me a clip this morning of sent texted me a clip this morning of when Poppi walked into Shark Tank. And when Poppi walked into Shark Tank. And when Poppi walked into Shark Tank. And at the time, they're not called Poppi, at the time, they're not called Poppi, at the time, they're not called Poppi, they're called like Mother or Mothers or they're called like Mother or Mothers or they're called like Mother or Mothers or something like that. something like that. something like that. >> Yeah. They're not a soda that tastes >> Yeah. They're not a soda that tastes >> Yeah. They're not a soda that tastes good. That's a prebiotic. They're apple good. That's a prebiotic. They're apple good. That's a prebiotic. They're apple cider vinegar. So, it's amazing cuz it's cider vinegar. So, it's amazing cuz it's cider vinegar. So, it's amazing cuz it's like you know, when there's these like you know, when there's these like you know, when there's these documentaries and there's like the dude documentaries and there's like the dude documentaries and there's like the dude who followed Kanye around 10 years who followed Kanye around 10 years who followed Kanye around 10 years before he became famous at all. And before he became famous at all. And before he became famous at all. And you're like, I can't believe we're so you're like, I can't believe we're so you're like, I can't believe we're so lucky that this guy happened to just lucky that this guy happened to just lucky that this guy happened to just follow this young artist in Chicago who follow this young artist in Chicago who follow this young artist in Chicago who happened to become Kanye West. And so, happened to become Kanye West. And so, happened to become Kanye West. And so, there's this thing where it's like you there's this thing where it's like you there's this thing where it's like you see them come into the Shark Tank. I see them come into the Shark Tank. I see them come into the Shark Tank. I think they have something like $250,000 think they have something like $250,000 think they have something like $250,000 in revenue. Some some 200 to 400k of of in revenue. Some some 200 to 400k of of in revenue. Some some 200 to 400k of of annual revenue at the time. annual revenue at the time. annual revenue at the time. >> Yeah. Different brand, different drink, >> Yeah. Different brand, different drink, >> Yeah. Different brand, different drink, no revenue. All the other sharks go out. no revenue. All the other sharks go out. no revenue. All the other sharks go out. So, it's you're you're in a bidding war So, it's you're you're in a bidding war So, it's you're you're in a bidding war with no one. with no one. with no one. >> Yeah, nobody. Nobody. They uh they go, >> Yeah, nobody. Nobody. They uh they go, >> Yeah, nobody. Nobody. They uh they go, "All right, sharks. Taste this healthy "All right, sharks. Taste this healthy "All right, sharks. Taste this healthy drink." And they make people take a shot drink." And they make people take a shot drink." And they make people take a shot of apple cider vinegar. And they're of apple cider vinegar. And they're of apple cider vinegar. And they're like, "This is horrible." And they're like, "This is horrible." And they're like, "This is horrible." And they're like, "Yeah, it is horrible, but it's like, "Yeah, it is horrible, but it's like, "Yeah, it is horrible, but it's great for you. Now, what if it could be great for you. Now, what if it could be great for you. Now, what if it could be great for you and also taste good? great for you and also taste good? great for you and also taste good? That's our product." Which is it was a That's our product." Which is it was a That's our product." Which is it was a really good actually pitch. Yeah, the really good actually pitch. Yeah, the really good actually pitch. Yeah, the title of the video is um title of the video is um title of the video is um sharks disgusted Yeah, they were. by the sharks disgusted Yeah, they were. by the sharks disgusted Yeah, they were. by the Poppy like They were. Poppy like They were. Poppy like They were. I think Kevin may have spit it out. I I think Kevin may have spit it out. I I think Kevin may have spit it out. I can't remember, but can't remember, but can't remember, but >> So, you got you got sharks spitting out >> So, you got you got sharks spitting out >> So, you got you got sharks spitting out the product. You've got a terrible brand the product. You've got a terrible brand the product. You've got a terrible brand name. Mothers in cursive, and it looks name. Mothers in cursive, and it looks name. Mothers in cursive, and it looks like a old like um sparkling wine or like a old like um sparkling wine or like a old like um sparkling wine or something like that. something like that. something like that. >> Yeah. Uh totally different formulation, >> Yeah. Uh totally different formulation, >> Yeah. Uh totally different formulation, and you pick up 25% of that company. I and you pick up 25% of that company. I and you pick up 25% of that company. I think Poppy sold for a billion and a think Poppy sold for a billion and a think Poppy sold for a billion and a half or something like that. half or something like that. half or something like that. >> No, no. Come on. North of two, buddy. To >> No, no. Come on. North of two, buddy. To >> No, no. Come on. North of two, buddy. To Oh, north of two. Okay. Unbelievable Oh, north of two. Okay. Unbelievable Oh, north of two. Okay. Unbelievable exit. What happens? And it's amazing exit. What happens? And it's amazing exit. What happens? And it's amazing that the whole thing was captured. What that the whole thing was captured. What that the whole thing was captured. What happens between the time you see it? happens between the time you see it? happens between the time you see it? What are you thinking then? And then, What are you thinking then? And then, What are you thinking then? And then, what were the things that actually what were the things that actually what were the things that actually transformed that business? Cuz I think transformed that business? Cuz I think transformed that business? Cuz I think that's a perfect like case study. Yeah. that's a perfect like case study. Yeah. that's a perfect like case study. Yeah. Let's go to phase one. So, these guys Let's go to phase one. So, these guys Let's go to phase one. So, these guys come out. Like every deal on Shark Tank come out. Like every deal on Shark Tank come out. Like every deal on Shark Tank that's a beverage or food, but really that's a beverage or food, but really that's a beverage or food, but really beverage. Like I can do the range, but beverage. Like I can do the range, but beverage. Like I can do the range, but beverage is kind of my real house. I beverage is kind of my real house. I beverage is kind of my real house. I don't know if I was DNA gifted with don't know if I was DNA gifted with don't know if I was DNA gifted with that. So, beverage comes out, and that. So, beverage comes out, and that. So, beverage comes out, and they're like I I know they're looking at they're like I I know they're looking at they're like I I know they're looking at me. Like Cubans are a bigger name than me. Like Cubans are a bigger name than me. Like Cubans are a bigger name than me. Kevin's a bigger name than me. You me. Kevin's a bigger name than me. You me. Kevin's a bigger name than me. You know, Lori's the queen of, you know, uh know, Lori's the queen of, you know, uh know, Lori's the queen of, you know, uh digital on QVC, but beverage they're digital on QVC, but beverage they're digital on QVC, but beverage they're looking at me. And then, these guys come looking at me. And then, these guys come looking at me. And then, these guys come out. I'm like, "Here we go again." Cuz out. I'm like, "Here we go again." Cuz out. I'm like, "Here we go again." Cuz we I'm now three seasons in. I'm like, we I'm now three seasons in. I'm like, we I'm now three seasons in. I'm like, you know, someone's going to hit me up you know, someone's going to hit me up you know, someone's going to hit me up with some nonsense beverage, you know. with some nonsense beverage, you know. with some nonsense beverage, you know. And we had some real dumb ones along the And we had some real dumb ones along the And we had some real dumb ones along the way. way. way. But this really good-looking couple But this really good-looking couple But this really good-looking couple comes out, you know, husband and wife comes out, you know, husband and wife comes out, you know, husband and wife like straight out of Central Casting. like straight out of Central Casting. like straight out of Central Casting. Like they look like that, you know, like Like they look like that, you know, like Like they look like that, you know, like this chiseled, good-looking, you know, this chiseled, good-looking, you know, this chiseled, good-looking, you know, white boy. white boy. white boy. I'm I'm I'm friends with Steven and we I'm I'm I'm friends with Steven and we I'm I'm I'm friends with Steven and we became friends because I DM'd him and I became friends because I DM'd him and I became friends because I DM'd him and I just said, "We look alike. Want to be just said, "We look alike. Want to be just said, "We look alike. Want to be friends?" I swear to god. But he does friends?" I swear to god. But he does friends?" I swear to god. But he does look a little bit like Steven Hart. look a little bit like Steven Hart. look a little bit like Steven Hart. You're kidding. So, these bloody two You're kidding. So, these bloody two You're kidding. So, these bloody two good-looking guys come out and guy and a good-looking guys come out and guy and a good-looking guys come out and guy and a lady. She's like, I don't know, 8 months lady. She's like, I don't know, 8 months lady. She's like, I don't know, 8 months pregnant. She could deliver any second. pregnant. She could deliver any second. pregnant. She could deliver any second. So, immediately I'm like, they've got So, immediately I'm like, they've got So, immediately I'm like, they've got hustle. hustle. hustle. So, So, So, one. Then they pitch the product and I'm one. Then they pitch the product and I'm one. Then they pitch the product and I'm like, horrible packaging. like, horrible packaging. like, horrible packaging. I don't like the brand name. You know, I I don't like the brand name. You know, I I don't like the brand name. You know, I like the word mother, but everyone has a like the word mother, but everyone has a like the word mother, but everyone has a mother. You can't trademark it. It's not mother. You can't trademark it. It's not mother. You can't trademark it. It's not really a trademarkable thing. really a trademarkable thing. really a trademarkable thing. But like let's try it. So, that's that's But like let's try it. So, that's that's But like let's try it. So, that's that's the train's running on that track, okay? the train's running on that track, okay? the train's running on that track, okay? In the separate track in my head, I'm a In the separate track in my head, I'm a In the separate track in my head, I'm a soda kid. I've been looking for soda. I soda kid. I've been looking for soda. I soda kid. I've been looking for soda. I grew up in Zambia, in Africa, right? So, grew up in Zambia, in Africa, right? So, grew up in Zambia, in Africa, right? So, in Zambia, when you had three beverages, in Zambia, when you had three beverages, in Zambia, when you had three beverages, Coke, Sprite, and Fanta. That's it. But Coke, Sprite, and Fanta. That's it. But Coke, Sprite, and Fanta. That's it. But I came off sodas cuz soda had [ __ ] ton I came off sodas cuz soda had [ __ ] ton I came off sodas cuz soda had [ __ ] ton of sugar. They're not good for you. of sugar. They're not good for you. of sugar. They're not good for you. They're no value. But in the back of my They're no value. But in the back of my They're no value. But in the back of my head, I've always been looking for soda head, I've always been looking for soda head, I've always been looking for soda I can feel good about. But I didn't go I can feel good about. But I didn't go I can feel good about. But I didn't go into the show thinking that. But in the into the show thinking that. But in the into the show thinking that. But in the back of my head, that's the running back of my head, that's the running back of my head, that's the running track. track. track. I try this. Actually, it was this one. I try this. Actually, it was this one. I try this. Actually, it was this one. Ironically, it was the orange one. Ironically, it was the orange one. Ironically, it was the orange one. And so, for me, that is still this is my And so, for me, that is still this is my And so, for me, that is still this is my top two. Orange is my favorite and cream top two. Orange is my favorite and cream top two. Orange is my favorite and cream soda is my second. So funny, the two soda is my second. So funny, the two soda is my second. So funny, the two flavors I drank when I was a kid. It's flavors I drank when I was a kid. It's flavors I drank when I was a kid. It's amazing what 40 years later, it's amazing what 40 years later, it's amazing what 40 years later, it's throwing back to the 9-10 year old throwing back to the 9-10 year old throwing back to the 9-10 year old Roland. Crazy. Anyway, so I try the Roland. Crazy. Anyway, so I try the Roland. Crazy. Anyway, so I try the orange one and I'm like, oh my god. This orange one and I'm like, oh my god. This orange one and I'm like, oh my god. This is Fanta meets Orangina. If you guys is Fanta meets Orangina. If you guys is Fanta meets Orangina. If you guys don't know. And I'm like, this liquid is don't know. And I'm like, this liquid is don't know. And I'm like, this liquid is in my head takes me back. This is my in my head takes me back. This is my in my head takes me back. This is my modern soda. modern soda. modern soda. But I don't get excited cuz I know the But I don't get excited cuz I know the But I don't get excited cuz I know the minute I get excited, these guys get minute I get excited, these guys get minute I get excited, these guys get excited. excited. excited. And so, I think you were the last one to And so, I think you were the last one to And so, I think you were the last one to talk, at least in the edit. I don't know talk, at least in the edit. I don't know talk, at least in the edit. I don't know if that's actually how it was, but I if that's actually how it was, but I if that's actually how it was, but I thought that was incredible patience to thought that was incredible patience to thought that was incredible patience to let the other sharks play out before you let the other sharks play out before you let the other sharks play out before you chimed in cuz obviously you would chimed in cuz obviously you would chimed in cuz obviously you would influence them. influence them. influence them. Exactly right. I did not. I specifically Exactly right. I did not. I specifically Exactly right. I did not. I specifically remained mute because the minute I remained mute because the minute I remained mute because the minute I seemed vaguely excited and by the way, seemed vaguely excited and by the way, seemed vaguely excited and by the way, even then, even then, even then, Cuban and Bethany both turned to me and Cuban and Bethany both turned to me and Cuban and Bethany both turned to me and said, "Rosh, should we split this?" said, "Rosh, should we split this?" said, "Rosh, should we split this?" >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> And I'm like, kind of in a nice way, no, >> And I'm like, kind of in a nice way, no, >> And I'm like, kind of in a nice way, no, because because because if this works, if this works, if this works, which it did, why would I want to split which it did, why would I want to split which it did, why would I want to split it? And if it doesn't work, I'm fine to it? And if it doesn't work, I'm fine to it? And if it doesn't work, I'm fine to lose it, but in the end the I'm betting lose it, but in the end the I'm betting lose it, but in the end the I'm betting on myself, right? on myself, right? on myself, right? >> Right. I didn't like them. >> Right. I didn't like them. >> Right. I didn't like them. Like I like Steven Allison, Like I like Steven Allison, Like I like Steven Allison, but that's a very short like like like but that's a very short like like like but that's a very short like like like you know, we go out for dinner the next you know, we go out for dinner the next you know, we go out for dinner the next day and I'm like, oh god, they're day and I'm like, oh god, they're day and I'm like, oh god, they're horrible. The first thing I did when we horrible. The first thing I did when we horrible. The first thing I did when we got when we became partners, I shut it got when we became partners, I shut it got when we became partners, I shut it down. down. down. I shut down Mother. I shut down Mother. I shut down Mother. And it was a tough conversation and then And it was a tough conversation and then And it was a tough conversation and then basically Steven Allison, me, and a lady basically Steven Allison, me, and a lady basically Steven Allison, me, and a lady on my team called Stevie, we basically on my team called Stevie, we basically on my team called Stevie, we basically co-founded Poppi. co-founded Poppi. co-founded Poppi. There was no Poppi. There was no Poppi. There was no Poppi. And in my mind, I wasn't focused on an And in my mind, I wasn't focused on an And in my mind, I wasn't focused on an apple cider vinegar beverage. I was apple cider vinegar beverage. I was apple cider vinegar beverage. I was focused on making this modern soda for focused on making this modern soda for focused on making this modern soda for today's youth. And so I'm like, okay, if today's youth. And so I'm like, okay, if today's youth. And so I'm like, okay, if I love soda and everyone else loves I love soda and everyone else loves I love soda and everyone else loves soda, this is modern soda. And so we soda, this is modern soda. And so we soda, this is modern soda. And so we kind of created the whole modern soda kind of created the whole modern soda kind of created the whole modern soda category, category, category, but I wasn't thinking apple cider but I wasn't thinking apple cider but I wasn't thinking apple cider vinegar. And so we shut Mother down. vinegar. And so we shut Mother down. vinegar. And so we shut Mother down. Stevie, myself, Allison, Steven, and Stevie, myself, Allison, Steven, and Stevie, myself, Allison, Steven, and Stevie took charge of the packaging Stevie took charge of the packaging Stevie took charge of the packaging design actually. design actually. design actually. We then all debated which is the best We then all debated which is the best We then all debated which is the best one to go with. We voted on it and one to go with. We voted on it and one to go with. We voted on it and that's where Poppi came into play. that's where Poppi came into play. that's where Poppi came into play. >> What about the name? We had a David >> What about the name? We had a David >> What about the name? We had a David Placik come on who who named Blackberry Placik come on who who named Blackberry Placik come on who who named Blackberry and Swiffer and he he gave us like a and Swiffer and he he gave us like a and Swiffer and he he gave us like a master class on naming product. Poppi is master class on naming product. Poppi is master class on naming product. Poppi is a is an incredible name, right, for a a is an incredible name, right, for a a is an incredible name, right, for a soda pop brand uh to to find that super soda pop brand uh to to find that super soda pop brand uh to to find that super easy to say, recognizable, fun. It easy to say, recognizable, fun. It easy to say, recognizable, fun. It almost feels bubbly in the name like almost feels bubbly in the name like almost feels bubbly in the name like Yeah. Here's a So I'm strategically Yeah. Here's a So I'm strategically Yeah. Here's a So I'm strategically creative, creative, creative, right? Stevie on my team is what I call right? Stevie on my team is what I call right? Stevie on my team is what I call tactically creative. That sounds like tactically creative. That sounds like tactically creative. That sounds like something I would say when I don't want something I would say when I don't want something I would say when I don't want to do work. to do work. to do work. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> That's exactly right. Yeah, she works >> That's exactly right. Yeah, she works >> That's exactly right. Yeah, she works with me. Yeah, good one. So with me. Yeah, good one. So with me. Yeah, good one. So So it's a triangle offense, right? So it's a triangle offense, right? So it's a triangle offense, right? Allison and Stephen had created the Allison and Stephen had created the Allison and Stephen had created the product. product. product. It's a great product, but their their It's a great product, but their their It's a great product, but their their insight was apple cider vinegar healthy insight was apple cider vinegar healthy insight was apple cider vinegar healthy healthy beverage. healthy beverage. healthy beverage. My insight is I want soda. My insight is I want soda. My insight is I want soda. So, So, So, what's America for sodas? Pop, right? what's America for sodas? Pop, right? what's America for sodas? Pop, right? So, that's the It's what everyone In So, that's the It's what everyone In So, that's the It's what everyone In England it translates That's all the England it translates That's all the England it translates That's all the poppys exploding in in the UK now, but poppys exploding in in the UK now, but poppys exploding in in the UK now, but And And Stevie's goal was how does she And And Stevie's goal was how does she And And Stevie's goal was how does she take what they created, what my take what they created, what my take what they created, what my strategic game plan was, and create a strategic game plan was, and create a strategic game plan was, and create a name that rolls off the tongue. name that rolls off the tongue. name that rolls off the tongue. And we had a bunch of them. At one point And we had a bunch of them. At one point And we had a bunch of them. At one point I even liked Mom and Pop cuz I'm like it I even liked Mom and Pop cuz I'm like it I even liked Mom and Pop cuz I'm like it was a throwback to like Mom and Pop was a throwback to like Mom and Pop was a throwback to like Mom and Pop stores and all that. And people told me stores and all that. And people told me stores and all that. And people told me it was stupid and they were right. But it was stupid and they were right. But it was stupid and they were right. But But then when they came out with Poppi But then when they came out with Poppi But then when they came out with Poppi and Stevie presented I'm like, "Okay." and Stevie presented I'm like, "Okay." and Stevie presented I'm like, "Okay." Right. Can we All right, let's go back Right. Can we All right, let's go back Right. Can we All right, let's go back because you only invested I think 250 or because you only invested I think 250 or because you only invested I think 250 or or $400,000 into Poppi. And so it was a or $400,000 into Poppi. And so it was a or $400,000 into Poppi. And so it was a really small business. You shut it down really small business. You shut it down really small business. You shut it down at half a million in revenue and you at half a million in revenue and you at half a million in revenue and you rebranded it and restarted it as Poppi. rebranded it and restarted it as Poppi. rebranded it and restarted it as Poppi. Do you remember what was the revenue Do you remember what was the revenue Do you remember what was the revenue growth up until you exited for $2 growth up until you exited for $2 growth up until you exited for $2 billion? Yeah, so And at this point I billion? Yeah, so And at this point I billion? Yeah, so And at this point I give Allison and Stephen full credit give Allison and Stephen full credit give Allison and Stephen full credit because Mother was their baby. because Mother was their baby. because Mother was their baby. And to go to a founder and say, "Hey, And to go to a founder and say, "Hey, And to go to a founder and say, "Hey, good news, bad news. Good news, you good news, bad news. Good news, you good news, bad news. Good news, you know, I'm your partner. Bad news, we're know, I'm your partner. Bad news, we're know, I'm your partner. Bad news, we're shutting down Mother. Um you know, we're shutting down Mother. Um you know, we're shutting down Mother. Um you know, we're not co-founding Poppi together." That not co-founding Poppi together." That not co-founding Poppi together." That takes a lot of faith on their part. And takes a lot of faith on their part. And takes a lot of faith on their part. And we launched in March of 2020, right? We we launched in March of 2020, right? We we launched in March of 2020, right? We sat I said, "Guys, I don't want plastic sat I said, "Guys, I don't want plastic sat I said, "Guys, I don't want plastic cuz plastic's bad. We can't do glass cuz cuz plastic's bad. We can't do glass cuz cuz plastic's bad. We can't do glass cuz it's inconvenient. We're going to go it's inconvenient. We're going to go it's inconvenient. We're going to go back to cans." OG back to cans." OG back to cans." OG it's Telegraph soda. That's That's what it's Telegraph soda. That's That's what it's Telegraph soda. That's That's what I drank. You know, I'm sitting sitting I drank. You know, I'm sitting sitting I drank. You know, I'm sitting sitting here drinking out of a can. We launched here drinking out of a can. We launched here drinking out of a can. We launched March of 2020. March of 2020. March of 2020. What happens in April? What happens in April? What happens in April? COVID. The world shuts down. COVID. The world shuts down. COVID. The world shuts down. Yeah. So, Yeah. So, Yeah. So, we We had started to be a more digital we We had started to be a more digital we We had started to be a more digital company because that's just the nature company because that's just the nature company because that's just the nature where life was, but we turboed that. where life was, but we turboed that. where life was, but we turboed that. Because then suddenly Because then suddenly Because then suddenly all retail was dead and everything all retail was dead and everything all retail was dead and everything became digital and so on and so forth. became digital and so on and so forth. became digital and so on and so forth. So, you know, our first year we did like So, you know, our first year we did like So, you know, our first year we did like a couple million bucks only because the a couple million bucks only because the a couple million bucks only because the world shut down, which is still world shut down, which is still world shut down, which is still incredible for that. But then we went incredible for that. But then we went incredible for that. But then we went from like a couple of million to over from like a couple of million to over from like a couple of million to over half a billion half a billion half a billion in the next 4 years. So, from '21 to '20 in the next 4 years. So, from '21 to '20 in the next 4 years. So, from '21 to '20 five we we exploded. And did you put five we we exploded. And did you put five we we exploded. And did you put more money in in the beginning to more money in in the beginning to more money in in the beginning to push marketing or did you guys raise? push marketing or did you guys raise? push marketing or did you guys raise? What did you guys do? Yeah, we kept What did you guys do? Yeah, we kept What did you guys do? Yeah, we kept raising. I mean, there's I mean, raising. I mean, there's I mean, raising. I mean, there's I mean, beverage is expensive, by the way. Like beverage is expensive, by the way. Like beverage is expensive, by the way. Like I put more money in. My fund Cabo came I put more money in. My fund Cabo came I put more money in. My fund Cabo came in. So, my business partner Brad was in. So, my business partner Brad was in. So, my business partner Brad was like, "Look, like, "Look, like, "Look, I believe in you. I don't get beverages I believe in you. I don't get beverages I believe in you. I don't get beverages early. If you get it, early. If you get it, early. If you get it, Cabo is going to back it." Cabo is going to back it." Cabo is going to back it." So, we everyone went in, right? And so, So, we everyone went in, right? And so, So, we everyone went in, right? And so, we kept backing. We raised a chunk of we kept backing. We raised a chunk of we kept backing. We raised a chunk of money, but everyone got a great return money, but everyone got a great return money, but everyone got a great return because of the exit number. It's not because of the exit number. It's not because of the exit number. It's not really what you get it at, it's what you really what you get it at, it's what you really what you get it at, it's what you get out at. get out at. get out at. How much did you raise in sum? What did How much did you raise in sum? What did How much did you raise in sum? What did we I mean, all in? we I mean, all in? we I mean, all in? 40, maybe? 40, maybe? 40, maybe? Wow. Well, that being That's amazing to Wow. Well, that being That's amazing to Wow. Well, that being That's amazing to go from go from go from >> much. I didn't realize you guys were >> much. I didn't realize you guys were >> much. I didn't realize you guys were that new. So, 20 roughly 2021 to 2025 26 that new. So, 20 roughly 2021 to 2025 26 that new. So, 20 roughly 2021 to 2025 26 zero to $2 billion exit. Yeah. What was zero to $2 billion exit. Yeah. What was zero to $2 billion exit. Yeah. What was the most satisfying win you had? Was it the most satisfying win you had? Was it the most satisfying win you had? Was it Poppi or was it something earlier? Was Poppi or was it something earlier? Was Poppi or was it something earlier? Was there something where maybe even it there something where maybe even it there something where maybe even it wasn't as big financially, but just you wasn't as big financially, but just you wasn't as big financially, but just you just were proud of kind of the way you just were proud of kind of the way you just were proud of kind of the way you made it work? No, Poppi, hands down. made it work? No, Poppi, hands down. made it work? No, Poppi, hands down. Poppi because Poppi because Poppi because Poppi Everything else I went and someone Poppi Everything else I went and someone Poppi Everything else I went and someone else had a product that I helped build. else had a product that I helped build. else had a product that I helped build. Here, Steven and Allison created Poppi Here, Steven and Allison created Poppi Here, Steven and Allison created Poppi and that it was brilliant. Without the and that it was brilliant. Without the and that it was brilliant. Without the liquid that they had created, we liquid that they had created, we liquid that they had created, we wouldn't be anywhere, right? But I got wouldn't be anywhere, right? But I got wouldn't be anywhere, right? But I got in early enough to basically co-found in early enough to basically co-found in early enough to basically co-found Poppi with me and Steven added to Poppi with me and Steven added to Poppi with me and Steven added to Allison and Steven and it was amazing. Allison and Steven and it was amazing. Allison and Steven and it was amazing. And so, I think that was satisfying And so, I think that was satisfying And so, I think that was satisfying because I I had the vision from the because I I had the vision from the because I I had the vision from the beginning. I had a great beginning. I had a great beginning. I had a great team team team with Steven, Allison, Steven and then we with Steven, Allison, Steven and then we with Steven, Allison, Steven and then we brought in a CEO because at some point brought in a CEO because at some point brought in a CEO because at some point I'm not an operator. I'm not an operator. I'm not an operator. Allison and Stephen super smart but also Allison and Stephen super smart but also Allison and Stephen super smart but also realized they weren't operators. And so realized they weren't operators. And so realized they weren't operators. And so once we got to like 30 40 million we once we got to like 30 40 million we once we got to like 30 40 million we brought a guy called Chris Hollins and brought a guy called Chris Hollins and brought a guy called Chris Hollins and that guy is a legend. I think one of the that guy is a legend. I think one of the that guy is a legend. I think one of the other lessons you have to learn as an other lessons you have to learn as an other lessons you have to learn as an entrepreneur is entrepreneur is entrepreneur is having a having a having a a a founder a a founder a a founder and creator mind and creator mind and creator mind doesn't always align with having an doesn't always align with having an doesn't always align with having an operator mind. Sometimes operator mind. Sometimes operator mind. Sometimes >> More more more often it probably >> More more more often it probably >> More more more often it probably doesn't. doesn't. doesn't. >> More often it doesn't. The one guy I >> More often it doesn't. The one guy I >> More often it doesn't. The one guy I think was really good at it was a guy think was really good at it was a guy think was really good at it was a guy called called called Kurt from Vital Proteins. I don't know Kurt from Vital Proteins. I don't know Kurt from Vital Proteins. I don't know him. Kurt founded Vital Proteins. We him. Kurt founded Vital Proteins. We him. Kurt founded Vital Proteins. We partnered with him as well and that guy partnered with him as well and that guy partnered with him as well and that guy was he was actually a rocket scientist was he was actually a rocket scientist was he was actually a rocket scientist like legit. So he was a founder and a like legit. So he was a founder and a like legit. So he was a founder and a brilliant operator. So that's you know brilliant operator. So that's you know brilliant operator. So that's you know it's a unique rarity. But in this case it's a unique rarity. But in this case it's a unique rarity. But in this case we brought in Chris Hollins and Chris we brought in Chris Hollins and Chris we brought in Chris Hollins and Chris ran the Barkley's Ice. So I had to spend ran the Barkley's Ice. So I had to spend ran the Barkley's Ice. So I had to spend a lot of time like a lot of time like a lot of time like coaching and coaching and coaching and begging and then convincing and a begging and then convincing and a begging and then convincing and a combination of all of the above to get combination of all of the above to get combination of all of the above to get him over but he was a game changer him over but he was a game changer him over but he was a game changer because you need to operate and he because you need to operate and he because you need to operate and he helped take it from like 50 to 500. Man helped take it from like 50 to 500. Man helped take it from like 50 to 500. Man it's still amazing how good you are at it's still amazing how good you are at it's still amazing how good you are at this and and I think we should talk this and and I think we should talk this and and I think we should talk about that because there's a handful of about that because there's a handful of about that because there's a handful of skill sets that are you just I call them skill sets that are you just I call them skill sets that are you just I call them ATM skills where you just become like a ATM skills where you just become like a ATM skills where you just become like a money maker. You know like if you can money maker. You know like if you can money maker. You know like if you can create an audience you're probably a create an audience you're probably a create an audience you're probably a money maker. If you can sell you're money maker. If you can sell you're money maker. If you can sell you're probably a money maker. If you can do probably a money maker. If you can do probably a money maker. If you can do good branding you're probably a money good branding you're probably a money good branding you're probably a money maker. And you've done it many times in maker. And you've done it many times in maker. And you've done it many times in a row. Where did you learn how to do a row. Where did you learn how to do a row. Where did you learn how to do this cuz I know you worked for Mars. You this cuz I know you worked for Mars. You this cuz I know you worked for Mars. You worked for Coke. Is that where you worked for Coke. Is that where you worked for Coke. Is that where you learned how to do this and and can you learned how to do this and and can you learned how to do this and and can you teach us more about how it's done? teach us more about how it's done? teach us more about how it's done? Actually it's interesting you bring up Actually it's interesting you bring up Actually it's interesting you bring up that point. It's actually three things. that point. It's actually three things. that point. It's actually three things. One is spotting stuff early. One is spotting stuff early. One is spotting stuff early. Right? One is building the brands and Right? One is building the brands and Right? One is building the brands and the other is actually how to sell them. the other is actually how to sell them. the other is actually how to sell them. And it's people forget the last part And it's people forget the last part And it's people forget the last part because because because there's a there's a big graveyard of there's a there's a big graveyard of there's a there's a big graveyard of brands that have got built got to scale brands that have got built got to scale brands that have got built got to scale but never fully exited. but never fully exited. but never fully exited. And there's a bigger graveyard of those And there's a bigger graveyard of those And there's a bigger graveyard of those who just didn't go anywhere. And I think who just didn't go anywhere. And I think who just didn't go anywhere. And I think part of it, so take my learnings. My part of it, so take my learnings. My part of it, so take my learnings. My learnings on Mars were less so cuz I was learnings on Mars were less so cuz I was learnings on Mars were less so cuz I was in manufacturing operations. So my in manufacturing operations. So my in manufacturing operations. So my learning there was almost like the learning there was almost like the learning there was almost like the importance of supply chain operations, importance of supply chain operations, importance of supply chain operations, gross margin, like the boring stuff that gross margin, like the boring stuff that gross margin, like the boring stuff that people forget that if you don't have people forget that if you don't have people forget that if you don't have good gross margins, you cannot make good gross margins, you cannot make good gross margins, you cannot make money and if you can't make money, you money and if you can't make money, you money and if you can't make money, you go bankrupt. And by the way, I've still go bankrupt. And by the way, I've still go bankrupt. And by the way, I've still made that mistake. I had an incredible made that mistake. I had an incredible made that mistake. I had an incredible product called Chef's Cut. It was a product called Chef's Cut. It was a product called Chef's Cut. It was a jerky before Chomps. Like my buddy jerky before Chomps. Like my buddy jerky before Chomps. Like my buddy invested in Chomps and he and I would invested in Chomps and he and I would invested in Chomps and he and I would joke cuz we were like neck and neck and joke cuz we were like neck and neck and joke cuz we were like neck and neck and Chef's came out first. And I just didn't Chef's came out first. And I just didn't Chef's came out first. And I just didn't have great gross margins and I should have great gross margins and I should have great gross margins and I should have focused more on that. Chef's Cut have focused more on that. Chef's Cut have focused more on that. Chef's Cut shut down or got sold for nothing and shut down or got sold for nothing and shut down or got sold for nothing and Chomps became a juggernaut and so he Chomps became a juggernaut and so he Chomps became a juggernaut and so he keeps laughing at me. But I think from keeps laughing at me. But I think from keeps laughing at me. But I think from from from that perspective, I learned from from that perspective, I learned from from that perspective, I learned from Mars a little bit. You know, and from Mars a little bit. You know, and from Mars a little bit. You know, and you still make mistakes. With Coke, I you still make mistakes. With Coke, I you still make mistakes. With Coke, I really I learned how to do disruptive really I learned how to do disruptive really I learned how to do disruptive marketing and branding cuz I was lucky. marketing and branding cuz I was lucky. marketing and branding cuz I was lucky. I was in Sprite back in the heyday when I was in Sprite back in the heyday when I was in Sprite back in the heyday when we, you know, signed Missy Elliott and we, you know, signed Missy Elliott and we, you know, signed Missy Elliott and Kobe Bryant and I did like a bunch of Kobe Bryant and I did like a bunch of Kobe Bryant and I did like a bunch of hip-hop stuff and it was it was really hip-hop stuff and it was it was really hip-hop stuff and it was it was really cool. And then I was in Powerade where cool. And then I was in Powerade where cool. And then I was in Powerade where Coke didn't care about it. So they said, Coke didn't care about it. So they said, Coke didn't care about it. So they said, "Do whatever you want." So I learned "Do whatever you want." So I learned "Do whatever you want." So I learned creative disruption early even though I creative disruption early even though I creative disruption early even though I was in a corporate environment. was in a corporate environment. was in a corporate environment. And then they fired me cuz I was a And then they fired me cuz I was a And then they fired me cuz I was a little too disruptive. And so I went to little too disruptive. And so I went to little too disruptive. And so I went to Vitaminwater and that's where I really Vitaminwater and that's where I really Vitaminwater and that's where I really started to learn how to and that's my started to learn how to and that's my started to learn how to and that's my second mantra second mantra second mantra is how to make brands part of pop is how to make brands part of pop is how to make brands part of pop culture. culture. culture. There's a lot of guys who report news. There's a lot of guys who report news. There's a lot of guys who report news. Very few people make the news. And so Very few people make the news. And so Very few people make the news. And so for me, for me, for me, with Vitaminwater and Smartwater, I with Vitaminwater and Smartwater, I with Vitaminwater and Smartwater, I started by making the news. And that started by making the news. And that started by making the news. And that those brands became part of pop culture. those brands became part of pop culture. those brands became part of pop culture. That that sounds cool, but what what That that sounds cool, but what what That that sounds cool, but what what does that mean? Make the news. I don't does that mean? Make the news. I don't does that mean? Make the news. I don't know I'm I'm too dumb to understand know I'm I'm too dumb to understand know I'm I'm too dumb to understand that. So make the news. So that. So make the news. So that. So make the news. So the first influencer mega influencer the first influencer mega influencer the first influencer mega influencer ownership deal I did Cuz remember, ownership deal I did Cuz remember, ownership deal I did Cuz remember, everything before 50 was very much a everything before 50 was very much a everything before 50 was very much a sponsorship deal, right? You sign a sponsorship deal, right? You sign a sponsorship deal, right? You sign a celebrity, they get in, that's the deal, celebrity, they get in, that's the deal, celebrity, they get in, that's the deal, right? The equity ownership Arguably, right? The equity ownership Arguably, right? The equity ownership Arguably, Michael did it in a different way with Michael did it in a different way with Michael did it in a different way with Nike, so but that has come out later and Nike, so but that has come out later and Nike, so but that has come out later and it wasn't really well known then. But it wasn't really well known then. But it wasn't really well known then. But with 50, I didn't have the money to pay with 50, I didn't have the money to pay with 50, I didn't have the money to pay 50. He was huge at the time, right? And 50. He was huge at the time, right? And 50. He was huge at the time, right? And so, I met with F and his manager Chris so, I met with F and his manager Chris so, I met with F and his manager Chris Lighty and actually there's two guys I Lighty and actually there's two guys I Lighty and actually there's two guys I was looking at for Vitamin Water cuz was looking at for Vitamin Water cuz was looking at for Vitamin Water cuz Vitamin Water was a great brand, but it Vitamin Water was a great brand, but it Vitamin Water was a great brand, but it was a kind of little bit was a kind of little bit was a kind of little bit uppery side, you know, New York preppy uppery side, you know, New York preppy uppery side, you know, New York preppy brand who wasn't like nationwide cool. brand who wasn't like nationwide cool. brand who wasn't like nationwide cool. It It wasn't getting shot in the face It It wasn't getting shot in the face It It wasn't getting shot in the face nine times cool. nine times cool. nine times cool. >> shot in the face cool and rap about it, >> shot in the face cool and rap about it, >> shot in the face cool and rap about it, yeah. Exactly. yeah. Exactly. yeah. Exactly. Although it was only eight times cuz one Although it was only eight times cuz one Although it was only eight times cuz one bullet went through twice, but anyway. bullet went through twice, but anyway. bullet went through twice, but anyway. >> Of course, sorry. Uh so, >> Of course, sorry. Uh so, >> Of course, sorry. Uh so, I wanted hip-hop and the two biggest I wanted hip-hop and the two biggest I wanted hip-hop and the two biggest names in the world at the time were names in the world at the time were names in the world at the time were Curtis Jackson and uh the other. It was Curtis Jackson and uh the other. It was Curtis Jackson and uh the other. It was Jay-Z, right? So, those are the two guys Jay-Z, right? So, those are the two guys Jay-Z, right? So, those are the two guys who were like the biggest names. And so, who were like the biggest names. And so, who were like the biggest names. And so, I called my buddy Seth Rodsky and I I called my buddy Seth Rodsky and I I called my buddy Seth Rodsky and I said, "Seth, said, "Seth, said, "Seth, you're more connected in this world than you're more connected in this world than you're more connected in this world than I am. I am. I am. Who can I get to?" Seth could have got Who can I get to?" Seth could have got Who can I get to?" Seth could have got to both, but he had a much better to both, but he had a much better to both, but he had a much better relationship with Chris Lighty, 50's relationship with Chris Lighty, 50's relationship with Chris Lighty, 50's manager. So, he put me on text with 50's manager. So, he put me on text with 50's manager. So, he put me on text with 50's manager. A lot of this also for artists, manager. A lot of this also for artists, manager. A lot of this also for artists, it's their managers getting you. So, it's their managers getting you. So, it's their managers getting you. So, Chris got it straight away. He got the Chris got it straight away. He got the Chris got it straight away. He got the product, he got F. He said, "We've not product, he got F. He said, "We've not product, he got F. He said, "We've not done a deal. We're about to do a deal done a deal. We're about to do a deal done a deal. We're about to do a deal with Reebok, with Reebok, with Reebok, but I'll kill that deal. I'll do this but I'll kill that deal. I'll do this but I'll kill that deal. I'll do this with you." That's how I got connected. with you." That's how I got connected. with you." That's how I got connected. And 50, as we see today, is clearly an And 50, as we see today, is clearly an And 50, as we see today, is clearly an entrepreneur. entrepreneur. entrepreneur. Uh also don't invest with him cuz he Uh also don't invest with him cuz he Uh also don't invest with him cuz he will come after you with a vengeance. will come after you with a vengeance. will come after you with a vengeance. So, I think that he got it. And I said, So, I think that he got it. And I said, So, I think that he got it. And I said, I go, "I don't have money, but I can I go, "I don't have money, but I can I go, "I don't have money, but I can give you skin in the game." And he give you skin in the game." And he give you skin in the game." And he immediately said, "Okay, immediately said, "Okay, immediately said, "Okay, I'm in." I'm in." I'm in." And I thought I was going to make him X. And I thought I was going to make him X. And I thought I was going to make him X. I kind of think he made 10 X cuz I I did I kind of think he made 10 X cuz I I did I kind of think he made 10 X cuz I I did the math wrong, basically. the math wrong, basically. the math wrong, basically. He He got what? Like 1 2%? Something He He got what? Like 1 2%? Something He He got what? Like 1 2%? Something like that in the company? like that in the company? like that in the company? >> I can't tell you exactly what he got, >> I can't tell you exactly what he got, >> I can't tell you exactly what he got, but he cuz we have a deal. I don't give but he cuz we have a deal. I don't give but he cuz we have a deal. I don't give the exact number and he doesn't kick the the exact number and he doesn't kick the the exact number and he doesn't kick the [ __ ] out of me, but um [ __ ] out of me, but um [ __ ] out of me, but um but he made a lot because honestly, I but he made a lot because honestly, I but he made a lot because honestly, I gave him enough gave him enough gave him enough equity for him to make good money if we equity for him to make good money if we equity for him to make good money if we sold the company for 400 to 500 million. sold the company for 400 to 500 million. sold the company for 400 to 500 million. That was our goal at Vitamin Water. Like That was our goal at Vitamin Water. Like That was our goal at Vitamin Water. Like I remember Michael Ball, who was the I remember Michael Ball, who was the I remember Michael Ball, who was the co-founder of Vitamin Water, was like, co-founder of Vitamin Water, was like, co-founder of Vitamin Water, was like, "Bro, put it up on this board. If we get "Bro, put it up on this board. If we get "Bro, put it up on this board. If we get to this, this, this, we're going to get to this, this, this, we're going to get to this, this, this, we're going to get to 150 million revenue, we're going to to 150 million revenue, we're going to to 150 million revenue, we're going to sell for 450." sell for 450." sell for 450." Without you can't reveal it cuz Curtis Without you can't reveal it cuz Curtis Without you can't reveal it cuz Curtis Jackson will Curtis Jackson you, but Jackson will Curtis Jackson you, but Jackson will Curtis Jackson you, but will he is it like would it be crazy to will he is it like would it be crazy to will he is it like would it be crazy to give someone 10% of a company like that? give someone 10% of a company like that? give someone 10% of a company like that? Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, 10% would be too high. Got it. Okay. 10% would be too high. Got it. Okay. 10% would be too high. Got it. Okay. >> But but what we sold for 4 billion. So, >> But but what we sold for 4 billion. So, >> But but what we sold for 4 billion. So, you can do the math on, you know, what you can do the math on, you know, what you can do the math on, you know, what he would have made. It seems like that he would have made. It seems like that he would have made. It seems like that you know, the kind of the influencing you know, the kind of the influencing you know, the kind of the influencing influencers or things obviously works, influencers or things obviously works, influencers or things obviously works, obviously makes sense. obviously makes sense. obviously makes sense. But also obviously goes wrong sometimes, But also obviously goes wrong sometimes, But also obviously goes wrong sometimes, right? right? right? You know, for example, this podcast, we You know, for example, this podcast, we You know, for example, this podcast, we got bought by HubSpot. HubSpot was like, got bought by HubSpot. HubSpot was like, got bought by HubSpot. HubSpot was like, "Yo, we we want to reach entrepreneurs, "Yo, we we want to reach entrepreneurs, "Yo, we we want to reach entrepreneurs, we want them to use our software." So, we want them to use our software." So, we want them to use our software." So, they went to us cuz we influence a lot they went to us cuz we influence a lot they went to us cuz we influence a lot of entrepreneurs. If we influence a of entrepreneurs. If we influence a of entrepreneurs. If we influence a million entrepreneurs, we're valuable to million entrepreneurs, we're valuable to million entrepreneurs, we're valuable to them and many other brands. And so, but them and many other brands. And so, but them and many other brands. And so, but there's many people who get that there's many people who get that there's many people who get that partnership wrong, you know, celebrities partnership wrong, you know, celebrities partnership wrong, you know, celebrities are busy, they're they're divas, they are busy, they're they're divas, they are busy, they're they're divas, they don't really care, maybe you didn't make don't really care, maybe you didn't make don't really care, maybe you didn't make it incentive enough, and it's hard to it incentive enough, and it's hard to it incentive enough, and it's hard to claw back. So, like claw back. So, like claw back. So, like I guess how confident were you and what I guess how confident were you and what I guess how confident were you and what made it go right versus go wrong? I made it go right versus go wrong? I made it go right versus go wrong? I think what makes it go right and think what makes it go right and think what makes it go right and happened with 50, happened with 50, happened with 50, uh it happened with Jennifer Aniston on uh it happened with Jennifer Aniston on uh it happened with Jennifer Aniston on Smartwater, Smartwater, Smartwater, and I think it happened most recently and I think it happened most recently and I think it happened most recently for me with Alex Ohl for me with Alex Ohl for me with Alex Ohl on Poppi. on Poppi. on Poppi. Uh and the connective tissue that 50, Uh and the connective tissue that 50, Uh and the connective tissue that 50, Jennifer, and Alex Ohl share Jennifer, and Alex Ohl share Jennifer, and Alex Ohl share is belief in the brand, is belief in the brand, is belief in the brand, creative connectivity. Like they creative connectivity. Like they creative connectivity. Like they creatively got the brand and connected creatively got the brand and connected creatively got the brand and connected with. They believed in it, they they with. They believed in it, they they with. They believed in it, they they creatively connected with it, and they creatively connected with it, and they creatively connected with it, and they went above and beyond. went above and beyond. went above and beyond. Those are the three things when Those are the three things when Those are the three things when consumers, cuz consumers are smart, consumers, cuz consumers are smart, consumers, cuz consumers are smart, know, "Okay, that's the real deal." know, "Okay, that's the real deal." know, "Okay, that's the real deal." Right? Like Alex loves Poppi, I see the Right? Like Alex loves Poppi, I see the Right? Like Alex loves Poppi, I see the cool [ __ ] she's doing with it. And also cool [ __ ] she's doing with it. And also cool [ __ ] she's doing with it. And also she's probably the smartest 24-year-old she's probably the smartest 24-year-old she's probably the smartest 24-year-old I've ever met. Like she knows her brand, I've ever met. Like she knows her brand, I've ever met. Like she knows her brand, knows her DNA, makes me feel old. Like knows her DNA, makes me feel old. Like knows her DNA, makes me feel old. Like she is on it, you know? Love of the she is on it, you know? Love of the she is on it, you know? Love of the brand, cultural brand, cultural brand, cultural creative connectivity, and then going creative connectivity, and then going creative connectivity, and then going above and beyond. above and beyond. above and beyond. When you're looking at these deals, what When you're looking at these deals, what When you're looking at these deals, what would you say are the traits that the would you say are the traits that the would you say are the traits that the winners have in common? And what would winners have in common? And what would winners have in common? And what would you say the traits are of the losers? you say the traits are of the losers? you say the traits are of the losers? So, for example, we had this guy named So, for example, we had this guy named So, for example, we had this guy named Chad who started Gruen on, and he sold Chad who started Gruen on, and he sold Chad who started Gruen on, and he sold it for $2 it for $2 it for $2 >> Yeah, so he sold it for $2 billion I >> Yeah, so he sold it for $2 billion I >> Yeah, so he sold it for $2 billion I think 1.2 1.2 billion dollars in 35 think 1.2 1.2 billion dollars in 35 think 1.2 1.2 billion dollars in 35 months or something insane. And we were months or something insane. And we were months or something insane. And we were like like like and he was like basically he was like I and he was like basically he was like I and he was like basically he was like I called my shot. I worked at a PE firm called my shot. I worked at a PE firm called my shot. I worked at a PE firm and I realized that the TAM needs to be and I realized that the TAM needs to be and I realized that the TAM needs to be big, my CAC to LTV needs to be 1 to 3. big, my CAC to LTV needs to be 1 to 3. big, my CAC to LTV needs to be 1 to 3. Like he he's like I kind of had it down Like he he's like I kind of had it down Like he he's like I kind of had it down to a little bit of a science. He didn't to a little bit of a science. He didn't to a little bit of a science. He didn't say it that way, but that's how I say it that way, but that's how I say it that way, but that's how I interpreted it. What's the science in interpreted it. What's the science in interpreted it. What's the science in your head of not for investing, but for your head of not for investing, but for your head of not for investing, but for building a winning product? building a winning product? building a winning product? It's similar. I mean, one, let's start It's similar. I mean, one, let's start It's similar. I mean, one, let's start with big categories, right? All right, with big categories, right? All right, with big categories, right? All right, at Carvoo our game plan is we're at Carvoo our game plan is we're at Carvoo our game plan is we're basically trying to in a nutshell upgrade upgrade the products that every everyday the products that every everyday the products that every everyday Americans are using with better quality, Americans are using with better quality, Americans are using with better quality, right? So, I'm not recreating the wheel, right? So, I'm not recreating the wheel, right? So, I'm not recreating the wheel, I'm just giving you a better wheel, that I'm just giving you a better wheel, that I'm just giving you a better wheel, that makes sense. And so, take the biggest makes sense. And so, take the biggest makes sense. And so, take the biggest TAMs in food, in beverage, in beauty, TAMs in food, in beverage, in beauty, TAMs in food, in beverage, in beauty, and pet. And at Carvoo we're like, and pet. And at Carvoo we're like, and pet. And at Carvoo we're like, "Okay, well, you like soda? "Okay, well, you like soda? "Okay, well, you like soda? Maybe a Coke or a founders not good for Maybe a Coke or a founders not good for Maybe a Coke or a founders not good for you, we're going to upgrade you to a you, we're going to upgrade you to a you, we're going to upgrade you to a Poppi. Do you like pet food? Burnt, Poppi. Do you like pet food? Burnt, Poppi. Do you like pet food? Burnt, extruded kibble that has very low extruded kibble that has very low extruded kibble that has very low nutrient value, ain't good. We're going nutrient value, ain't good. We're going nutrient value, ain't good. We're going to give you Farmer's Dog, right? The to give you Farmer's Dog, right? The to give you Farmer's Dog, right? The goal is how do you give Americans what goal is how do you give Americans what goal is how do you give Americans what they used to, but elevate it so they can they used to, but elevate it so they can they used to, but elevate it so they can feel better about themselves? feel better about themselves? feel better about themselves? What are the big TAMs that are left What are the big TAMs that are left What are the big TAMs that are left where you're like, "We still haven't where you're like, "We still haven't where you're like, "We still haven't found the winning kind of brand or found the winning kind of brand or found the winning kind of brand or product in a certain category." Like if product in a certain category." Like if product in a certain category." Like if I go to that grocery shop or I go to the I go to that grocery shop or I go to the I go to that grocery shop or I go to the supermarket, where do you see the supermarket, where do you see the supermarket, where do you see the opportunities right now? Which aisle? opportunities right now? Which aisle? opportunities right now? Which aisle? Everywhere. Everywhere. Everywhere. Let me explain why. Let me explain why. Let me explain why. Go down every aisle next time you go to Go down every aisle next time you go to Go down every aisle next time you go to the grocery store. By the way, my wife the grocery store. By the way, my wife the grocery store. By the way, my wife gets super pissed at me cuz when she gets super pissed at me cuz when she gets super pissed at me cuz when she sends me out to get stuff in the grocery sends me out to get stuff in the grocery sends me out to get stuff in the grocery store, I'm like 2 hours later, she's store, I'm like 2 hours later, she's store, I'm like 2 hours later, she's like, "Where the hell have you been?" like, "Where the hell have you been?" like, "Where the hell have you been?" Like, "Honey, this is my business. Like, Like, "Honey, this is my business. Like, Like, "Honey, this is my business. Like, my dumb ass wandering around the grocery my dumb ass wandering around the grocery my dumb ass wandering around the grocery store figuring out what's broken." But store figuring out what's broken." But store figuring out what's broken." But that's the scenario. Go down and say, that's the scenario. Go down and say, that's the scenario. Go down and say, "Okay, would I buy all of these "Okay, would I buy all of these "Okay, would I buy all of these products?" And my guess is if you go to products?" And my guess is if you go to products?" And my guess is if you go to a traditional grocery store where most a traditional grocery store where most a traditional grocery store where most Americans shop today, you would probably Americans shop today, you would probably Americans shop today, you would probably say, "No, no, no, no, yes." So, you have say, "No, no, no, no, yes." So, you have say, "No, no, no, no, yes." So, you have seven nos before you get to a yes. seven nos before you get to a yes. seven nos before you get to a yes. Go down the candy aisle. Okay, I have an Go down the candy aisle. Okay, I have an Go down the candy aisle. Okay, I have an investment in a brand called investment in a brand called investment in a brand called SkinnyDipped. Have you heard about Have SkinnyDipped. Have you heard about Have SkinnyDipped. Have you heard about Have you heard of it? Yeah, I love those. you heard of it? Yeah, I love those. you heard of it? Yeah, I love those. Yeah, they're so addictive. Right. But Yeah, they're so addictive. Right. But Yeah, they're so addictive. Right. But almond tab is is okay. But it's it's almond tab is is okay. But it's it's almond tab is is okay. But it's it's it's chocolate is this almond almond it's chocolate is this almond almond it's chocolate is this almond almond tabs is big. Creating sweet treats tabs is big. Creating sweet treats tabs is big. Creating sweet treats that don't have guilt, right? that don't have guilt, right? that don't have guilt, right? Is this big. So, SkinnyDipped Is this big. So, SkinnyDipped Is this big. So, SkinnyDipped chocolate-covered almonds. The chocolate-covered almonds. The chocolate-covered almonds. The brilliance of the founder was after X brilliance of the founder was after X brilliance of the founder was after X number of years, she's like, "This [ __ ] number of years, she's like, "This [ __ ] number of years, she's like, "This [ __ ] ain't working. It's doing fine, but my ain't working. It's doing fine, but my ain't working. It's doing fine, but my tabs aren't big enough." Right to the tabs aren't big enough." Right to the tabs aren't big enough." Right to the point you made with Chad. point you made with Chad. point you made with Chad. She pivoted. She pivoted. She pivoted. She created peanut butter cups. She created peanut butter cups. She created peanut butter cups. She created coconut bites and she She created coconut bites and she She created coconut bites and she created wafers. created wafers. created wafers. You want to name me the three products You want to name me the three products You want to name me the three products that do that? Reese's, that do that? Reese's, that do that? Reese's, Almond Joy, and Kit Kat. By the way, all Almond Joy, and Kit Kat. By the way, all Almond Joy, and Kit Kat. By the way, all three of these products sub two grams of three of these products sub two grams of three of these products sub two grams of sugar. sugar. sugar. So, now I can have, and I do, a coconut So, now I can have, and I do, a coconut So, now I can have, and I do, a coconut bite every day with my coffee or after bite every day with my coffee or after bite every day with my coffee or after dinner cuz I need a have a sweet fix, dinner cuz I need a have a sweet fix, dinner cuz I need a have a sweet fix, but zero shits given because it's two but zero shits given because it's two but zero shits given because it's two grams of sugar. You don't care two grams grams of sugar. You don't care two grams grams of sugar. You don't care two grams of sugar. You give it a kid, you'll have of sugar. You give it a kid, you'll have of sugar. You give it a kid, you'll have it. 10 grams, 20 grams, your mind starts it. 10 grams, 20 grams, your mind starts it. 10 grams, 20 grams, your mind starts clicking a little bit. Is it possible to clicking a little bit. Is it possible to clicking a little bit. Is it possible to even be more specific when you're even be more specific when you're even be more specific when you're walking around the aisle? Is there a walking around the aisle? Is there a walking around the aisle? Is there a spot where you're like, "This product spot where you're like, "This product spot where you're like, "This product should be right here on this shelf and should be right here on this shelf and should be right here on this shelf and it's not? Or it's not? Or it's not? Or >> go go to the confection shelf >> go go to the confection shelf >> go go to the confection shelf and say what will I eat? And I look down and say what will I eat? And I look down and say what will I eat? And I look down I'm like, almost nothing. Cuz everything I'm like, almost nothing. Cuz everything I'm like, almost nothing. Cuz everything is fully loaded with sugar and it's is fully loaded with sugar and it's is fully loaded with sugar and it's really highly processed. So now take the really highly processed. So now take the really highly processed. So now take the process down. There's a lot of good process down. There's a lot of good process down. There's a lot of good stuff that's less processed, better stuff that's less processed, better stuff that's less processed, better ingredients. Can we agree on that? There ingredients. Can we agree on that? There ingredients. Can we agree on that? There is. However, the sugar content is still is. However, the sugar content is still is. However, the sugar content is still high. So now I evolve from horrible high. So now I evolve from horrible high. So now I evolve from horrible stuff to maybe like an Alter Ego stuff to maybe like an Alter Ego stuff to maybe like an Alter Ego chocolate or a huge chocolate. They're chocolate or a huge chocolate. They're chocolate or a huge chocolate. They're great, but they've still got a high great, but they've still got a high great, but they've still got a high sugar content. So you asked me what I'd sugar content. So you asked me what I'd sugar content. So you asked me what I'd do. I go sit at the entire confection do. I go sit at the entire confection do. I go sit at the entire confection shelf and put my arms up and just look shelf and put my arms up and just look shelf and put my arms up and just look around. What would I eat? And the only around. What would I eat? And the only around. What would I eat? And the only thing that I can eat is Skinny and maybe thing that I can eat is Skinny and maybe thing that I can eat is Skinny and maybe one one other product because I feel one one other product because I feel one one other product because I feel good about it. So let me ask you a good about it. So let me ask you a good about it. So let me ask you a question. You had this great line where question. You had this great line where question. You had this great line where you go, the shelf space is the original you go, the shelf space is the original you go, the shelf space is the original algorithm. algorithm. algorithm. The same way that content creators are The same way that content creators are The same way that content creators are constantly trying to figure out how to constantly trying to figure out how to constantly trying to figure out how to get on the YouTube shelf or the get on the YouTube shelf or the get on the YouTube shelf or the Instagram shelf. How do I get Instagram shelf. How do I get Instagram shelf. How do I get discovered? There discovered? There discovered? There it's even harder, arguably, because it's even harder, arguably, because it's even harder, arguably, because there's a very like mafia-like business there's a very like mafia-like business there's a very like mafia-like business practices that occurs in behind the practices that occurs in behind the practices that occurs in behind the scenes of these shelf spaces. Like I've scenes of these shelf spaces. Like I've scenes of these shelf spaces. Like I've walked through one of our events that we walked through one of our events that we walked through one of our events that we do, guys have like brands at Target or do, guys have like brands at Target or do, guys have like brands at Target or or or Safeway or whatever. We walk or or Safeway or whatever. We walk or or Safeway or whatever. We walk through and we do store walks and then through and we do store walks and then through and we do store walks and then they explain, you know, Mr. Beast will they explain, you know, Mr. Beast will they explain, you know, Mr. Beast will explain how the candy aisle works. He'll explain how the candy aisle works. He'll explain how the candy aisle works. He'll explain Mars and Hershey's and the explain Mars and Hershey's and the explain Mars and Hershey's and the tactics they use and what how the color tactics they use and what how the color tactics they use and what how the color your color blocking your section, etc. your color blocking your section, etc. your color blocking your section, etc. etc. So you get this sort of PhD in each etc. So you get this sort of PhD in each etc. So you get this sort of PhD in each aisle. aisle. aisle. I think his market's a little bit I think his market's a little bit I think his market's a little bit different. So you know, different. So you know, different. So you know, you sell like let's say Skinny Dip just you sell like let's say Skinny Dip just you sell like let's say Skinny Dip just a little higher price point, better for a little higher price point, better for a little higher price point, better for you is like the bigger angle, whereas you is like the bigger angle, whereas you is like the bigger angle, whereas you know, he's I think the number like you know, he's I think the number like you know, he's I think the number like the one of the fastest growing brands in the one of the fastest growing brands in the one of the fastest growing brands in Walmart, right? And so his price point Walmart, right? And so his price point Walmart, right? And so his price point has to be a big constraint. So he has to has to be a big constraint. So he has to has to be a big constraint. So he has to play a slightly different game, but he's play a slightly different game, but he's play a slightly different game, but he's doing a lot of stuff with like his doing a lot of stuff with like his doing a lot of stuff with like his better for you isn't in the ingredients, better for you isn't in the ingredients, better for you isn't in the ingredients, it's in the business practices. So like it's in the business practices. So like it's in the business practices. So like we don't use child labor in the cocoa we don't use child labor in the cocoa we don't use child labor in the cocoa farms and you know, things like that, farms and you know, things like that, farms and you know, things like that, which is a you know, which is a you know, which is a you know, he cares and he's trying to get everyone he cares and he's trying to get everyone he cares and he's trying to get everyone to care. Will it will it change people's to care. Will it will it change people's to care. Will it will it change people's purchasing purchasing decisions I think purchasing purchasing decisions I think purchasing purchasing decisions I think is a question. is a question. is a question. But the I guess the the thought process But the I guess the the thought process But the I guess the the thought process is like how do you get the shelf space? is like how do you get the shelf space? is like how do you get the shelf space? Well, I think what so reverse engineer. Well, I think what so reverse engineer. Well, I think what so reverse engineer. One of the advantage I bring to the mix, One of the advantage I bring to the mix, One of the advantage I bring to the mix, right? We talked a lot about influencer right? We talked a lot about influencer right? We talked a lot about influencer and so on and so forth. and so on and so forth. and so on and so forth. The second influencer, and probably as The second influencer, and probably as The second influencer, and probably as important, is retail buyers. important, is retail buyers. important, is retail buyers. And I have now established because I And I have now established because I And I have now established because I brought up run of great products and brought up run of great products and brought up run of great products and exits and scale. exits and scale. exits and scale. I have great connections with the top I have great connections with the top I have great connections with the top people at Walmart, Target and people at Walmart, Target and people at Walmart, Target and Albertsons and Kroger etc. And just Albertsons and Kroger etc. And just Albertsons and Kroger etc. And just maintaining those relationships are key maintaining those relationships are key maintaining those relationships are key because when I bring a product that I've because when I bring a product that I've because when I bring a product that I've invested in or Kavoo's invested in invested in or Kavoo's invested in invested in or Kavoo's invested in they will give us the shelf space. And I they will give us the shelf space. And I they will give us the shelf space. And I think that's a lot of entrepreneurs come think that's a lot of entrepreneurs come think that's a lot of entrepreneurs come to us because they're like, "Okay, to us because they're like, "Okay, to us because they're like, "Okay, great. I can do X, Y, and Z, but if I great. I can do X, Y, and Z, but if I great. I can do X, Y, and Z, but if I just get one meeting with the top guy at just get one meeting with the top guy at just get one meeting with the top guy at Walmart, that can inflect, you know, Walmart, that can inflect, you know, Walmart, that can inflect, you know, inflect my business in a way that's inflect my business in a way that's inflect my business in a way that's unique. So, unique. So, unique. So, I have the relationships now. I have the relationships now. I have the relationships now. However, However, However, retailers are smart and they are retailers are smart and they are retailers are smart and they are actually closer to the consumer actually closer to the consumer actually closer to the consumer than big corporations. than big corporations. than big corporations. So, they are seeking the products of So, they are seeking the products of So, they are seeking the products of tomorrow tomorrow tomorrow while maintaining what I call the brands while maintaining what I call the brands while maintaining what I call the brands of yesterday. of yesterday. of yesterday. Because you can't eliminate the brands Because you can't eliminate the brands Because you can't eliminate the brands of yesterday. Too much money, too much of yesterday. Too much money, too much of yesterday. Too much money, too much revenue. At the same time, you then also revenue. At the same time, you then also revenue. At the same time, you then also have to bridge to the brands of have to bridge to the brands of have to bridge to the brands of tomorrow. And Sam, to your point, tomorrow. And Sam, to your point, tomorrow. And Sam, to your point, let me take Poppy. I mean, a regular let me take Poppy. I mean, a regular let me take Poppy. I mean, a regular soda is probably a buck for a can, soda is probably a buck for a can, soda is probably a buck for a can, right? A Poppy is probably a buck right? A Poppy is probably a buck right? A Poppy is probably a buck 60, 70, 80, depending where you buy it, 60, 70, 80, depending where you buy it, 60, 70, 80, depending where you buy it, 90. 90. 90. Why do you pay the extra 50 cents, 60 Why do you pay the extra 50 cents, 60 Why do you pay the extra 50 cents, 60 cents, 90 cents? cents, 90 cents? cents, 90 cents? Probably. I'm not It's not like I'm Probably. I'm not It's not like I'm Probably. I'm not It's not like I'm buying a, you know, a house a BMW versus buying a, you know, a house a BMW versus buying a, you know, a house a BMW versus I'm buying a a Toyota. There's like a I'm buying a a Toyota. There's like a I'm buying a a Toyota. There's like a 20,000, 30,000 difference there. Here, 20,000, 30,000 difference there. Here, 20,000, 30,000 difference there. Here, it's a it's a it's a 30, 60, 90 cents difference. So, a big 30, 60, 90 cents difference. So, a big 30, 60, 90 cents difference. So, a big part of what I do also is when I go to part of what I do also is when I go to part of what I do also is when I go to retail retail retail is whilst the product might be premium, is whilst the product might be premium, is whilst the product might be premium, I still want to try and appeal to a I still want to try and appeal to a I still want to try and appeal to a large amount of Americans in their large amount of Americans in their large amount of Americans in their ability to reach those products where ability to reach those products where ability to reach those products where they're attainable. they're attainable. they're attainable. And so, I think that And so, I think that And so, I think that the the retailers are looking the the retailers are looking the the retailers are looking for brands that are attainable even for brands that are attainable even for brands that are attainable even though it's a slightly premium that are though it's a slightly premium that are though it's a slightly premium that are the future brands. You said something the future brands. You said something the future brands. You said something earlier that was that was kind of earlier that was that was kind of earlier that was that was kind of important you go, "The third thing I do important you go, "The third thing I do important you go, "The third thing I do is how to sell it." And there's a huge is how to sell it." And there's a huge is how to sell it." And there's a huge value swing at the end. I've done When value swing at the end. I've done When value swing at the end. I've done When me and Sam sold our companies, it's kind me and Sam sold our companies, it's kind me and Sam sold our companies, it's kind of amazing. You work 6 years, 7 years, 8 of amazing. You work 6 years, 7 years, 8 of amazing. You work 6 years, 7 years, 8 years, years, years, and then 50% of the value is going to be and then 50% of the value is going to be and then 50% of the value is going to be how good you are at this M&A thing at how good you are at this M&A thing at how good you are at this M&A thing at the end that you've the end that you've the end that you've never done before, but it's the biggest never done before, but it's the biggest never done before, but it's the biggest deal of your life. And so, I've seen deal of your life. And so, I've seen deal of your life. And so, I've seen that firsthand how important that is and that firsthand how important that is and that firsthand how important that is and how it is a separate skill set for an how it is a separate skill set for an how it is a separate skill set for an entrepreneur that you're very low entrepreneur that you're very low entrepreneur that you're very low repetitions in. So, it's hard to even repetitions in. So, it's hard to even repetitions in. So, it's hard to even get good at it. Yeah, it's a it's a get good at it. Yeah, it's a it's a get good at it. Yeah, it's a it's a really unfair advantage because a really unfair advantage because a really unfair advantage because a a reputable buyer has done this many a reputable buyer has done this many a reputable buyer has done this many times and it doesn't matter it doesn't times and it doesn't matter it doesn't times and it doesn't matter it doesn't matter to them necessarily if it fails. matter to them necessarily if it fails. matter to them necessarily if it fails. They'll just get fired worst-case They'll just get fired worst-case They'll just get fired worst-case scenario. Uh but for you, it like scenario. Uh but for you, it like scenario. Uh but for you, it like changes your life. Completely. Yeah, so changes your life. Completely. Yeah, so changes your life. Completely. Yeah, so so how How do you go get Coke to buy a so how How do you go get Coke to buy a so how How do you go get Coke to buy a company for $2 billion? What do you What company for $2 billion? What do you What company for $2 billion? What do you What do you go What do you do? How do those do you go What do you do? How do those do you go What do you do? How do those conversations happen? conversations happen? conversations happen? Uh how do you negotiate those deals? And Uh how do you negotiate those deals? And Uh how do you negotiate those deals? And why do they buy them for so much? why do they buy them for so much? why do they buy them for so much? So, so that's again why I mean, I have So, so that's again why I mean, I have So, so that's again why I mean, I have established and I have relationships established and I have relationships established and I have relationships everywhere, but you know, I have everywhere, but you know, I have everywhere, but you know, I have relationships with a lot of big CPGs, relationships with a lot of big CPGs, relationships with a lot of big CPGs, right? Coke, Pepsi, Hershey, Mondelez, right? Coke, Pepsi, Hershey, Mondelez, right? Coke, Pepsi, Hershey, Mondelez, you know, um KDP. So, I've done that you know, um KDP. So, I've done that you know, um KDP. So, I've done that over time. A lot of these guys I've over time. A lot of these guys I've over time. A lot of these guys I've either either either worked for, worked with over time cuz worked for, worked with over time cuz worked for, worked with over time cuz I've been I've been I've been doing this now over 25 years in the doing this now over 25 years in the doing this now over 25 years in the industry, right? Maybe longer. And so, industry, right? Maybe longer. And so, industry, right? Maybe longer. And so, relationships with the top guys is relationships with the top guys is relationships with the top guys is critical. And so, you know, uh with One critical. And so, you know, uh with One critical. And so, you know, uh with One Bar, Bar, Bar, I walked them in back in the day to I walked them in back in the day to I walked them in back in the day to Hershey to the CEO of Hershey at the Hershey to the CEO of Hershey at the Hershey to the CEO of Hershey at the time, right? I didn't negotiate the time, right? I didn't negotiate the time, right? I didn't negotiate the Vitamin Water deal. Uh the founder of Vitamin Water deal. Uh the founder of Vitamin Water deal. Uh the founder of Vitamin Water, Darius did brilliantly Vitamin Water, Darius did brilliantly Vitamin Water, Darius did brilliantly and I learned from him, by the way. So, and I learned from him, by the way. So, and I learned from him, by the way. So, I'm on the sidelines watching this guy I'm on the sidelines watching this guy I'm on the sidelines watching this guy go to town. I brought Coke to the table. go to town. I brought Coke to the table. go to town. I brought Coke to the table. So, I called Coke because I used to work So, I called Coke because I used to work So, I called Coke because I used to work for them. Sandy Douglas, mentor of mine, for them. Sandy Douglas, mentor of mine, for them. Sandy Douglas, mentor of mine, he brought the CEO, he was the he brought the CEO, he was the he brought the CEO, he was the president, and they negotiated with president, and they negotiated with president, and they negotiated with Darius, and I saw what he did, and I Darius, and I saw what he did, and I Darius, and I saw what he did, and I learned from that. Out of that learned from that. Out of that learned from that. Out of that negotiation, what was one thing you negotiation, what was one thing you negotiation, what was one thing you picked up? picked up? picked up? If you have a great brand, you it's okay If you have a great brand, you it's okay If you have a great brand, you it's okay to be slightly unhinged on your to be slightly unhinged on your to be slightly unhinged on your expectation. Like when he said the expectation. Like when he said the expectation. Like when he said the number starts with a four, I almost fell number starts with a four, I almost fell number starts with a four, I almost fell off my chair. I'm like, "Did he just say off my chair. I'm like, "Did he just say off my chair. I'm like, "Did he just say four?" I'm like, "No, four B." And Coke four?" I'm like, "No, four B." And Coke four?" I'm like, "No, four B." And Coke came right back at 4.1. I'm like, "All came right back at 4.1. I'm like, "All came right back at 4.1. I'm like, "All right, guy." He, you know, I I right, guy." He, you know, I I right, guy." He, you know, I I sometimes you get nervous cuz there's a sometimes you get nervous cuz there's a sometimes you get nervous cuz there's a fine line, guys. This is fine line, guys. This is fine line, guys. This is Sean, you made such a great point. You Sean, you made such a great point. You Sean, you made such a great point. You spend spend spend anywhere from 4 to 10, 15 years building anywhere from 4 to 10, 15 years building anywhere from 4 to 10, 15 years building your baby, and then your baby, and then your baby, and then the finish line is where the where the the finish line is where the where the the finish line is where the where the money is made, and so sometimes you get money is made, and so sometimes you get money is made, and so sometimes you get scared because if you overreach, which scared because if you overreach, which scared because if you overreach, which I've also done, and you fail, you might I've also done, and you fail, you might I've also done, and you fail, you might be catching a falling knife. But if you be catching a falling knife. But if you be catching a falling knife. But if you under the reach, then you keep kicking under the reach, then you keep kicking under the reach, then you keep kicking yourself with how much you left on the yourself with how much you left on the yourself with how much you left on the table. Dial in on that. That's table. Dial in on that. That's table. Dial in on that. That's interesting because, hey, knowing if you interesting because, hey, knowing if you interesting because, hey, knowing if you have a great brand is actually kind of have a great brand is actually kind of have a great brand is actually kind of challenging, but overreaching and challenging, but overreaching and challenging, but overreaching and underreaching, that is also very underreaching, that is also very underreaching, that is also very nuanced. Is there like Is there like nuanced. Is there like Is there like nuanced. Is there like Is there like some more specific details that you can some more specific details that you can some more specific details that you can give on how you know Like for example, give on how you know Like for example, give on how you know Like for example, do you look at comps and you say, "We're do you look at comps and you say, "We're do you look at comps and you say, "We're just going to be the top quartile." What just going to be the top quartile." What just going to be the top quartile." What do you do? Yeah, it's a very good do you do? Yeah, it's a very good do you do? Yeah, it's a very good question. Timing is everything, by the question. Timing is everything, by the question. Timing is everything, by the way, right? Like Pop Bee sold for half way, right? Like Pop Bee sold for half way, right? Like Pop Bee sold for half of what Vitamin Water did, except of what Vitamin Water did, except of what Vitamin Water did, except Vitamin Pop Bee grew faster than Vitamin Vitamin Pop Bee grew faster than Vitamin Vitamin Pop Bee grew faster than Vitamin Water. It's a bigger scale brand than Water. It's a bigger scale brand than Water. It's a bigger scale brand than Vitamin Water ever was, but timing was Vitamin Water ever was, but timing was Vitamin Water ever was, but timing was different, right? different, right? different, right? At that time, there was a willingness, At that time, there was a willingness, At that time, there was a willingness, and the money was more in liquidity was and the money was more in liquidity was and the money was more in liquidity was freedom and greater to pay more, right? freedom and greater to pay more, right? freedom and greater to pay more, right? So, and risks were different. So, I So, and risks were different. So, I So, and risks were different. So, I think the same with tech valuations, think the same with tech valuations, think the same with tech valuations, right? People were investing in 20 2021 right? People were investing in 20 2021 right? People were investing in 20 2021 at bonkers values, then slowed down, and at bonkers values, then slowed down, and at bonkers values, then slowed down, and now AI is also not So, there's a there's now AI is also not So, there's a there's now AI is also not So, there's a there's a timing mechanism. So, a timing mechanism. So, a timing mechanism. So, you should have belief and faith in who you should have belief and faith in who you should have belief and faith in who you are, but do not always benchmark you are, but do not always benchmark you are, but do not always benchmark against the biggest number you've seen. against the biggest number you've seen. against the biggest number you've seen. And that's the danger entrepreneurs And that's the danger entrepreneurs And that's the danger entrepreneurs have. They're like, "Oh, this company have. They're like, "Oh, this company have. They're like, "Oh, this company sold for seven times revenue. I'm going sold for seven times revenue. I'm going sold for seven times revenue. I'm going for seven, and if I don't get it, I'm for seven, and if I don't get it, I'm for seven, and if I don't get it, I'm out." I'm like, "Bro, take it easy. out." I'm like, "Bro, take it easy. out." I'm like, "Bro, take it easy. Beauty's in the eye of the beholder." Beauty's in the eye of the beholder." Beauty's in the eye of the beholder." And at some point, when you're ready, And at some point, when you're ready, And at some point, when you're ready, you're going to have X number of you're going to have X number of you're going to have X number of beholders. And if they say your beauty beholders. And if they say your beauty beholders. And if they say your beauty is 600 million, that's your beauty. Now, is 600 million, that's your beauty. Now, is 600 million, that's your beauty. Now, you can take a risk and pass and wait you can take a risk and pass and wait you can take a risk and pass and wait for a bigger number, and that's okay. for a bigger number, and that's okay. for a bigger number, and that's okay. But, the groups that pass and wait for a But, the groups that pass and wait for a But, the groups that pass and wait for a bigger number are few and far between, bigger number are few and far between, bigger number are few and far between, and they don't always work out. Some do. and they don't always work out. Some do. and they don't always work out. Some do. I also think that there's a there's I also think that there's a there's I also think that there's a there's definitely like a a je ne sais quoi, definitely like a a je ne sais quoi, definitely like a a je ne sais quoi, there's a there's a showmanship that is there's a there's a showmanship that is there's a there's a showmanship that is involved here. It's very I've only I've involved here. It's very I've only I've involved here. It's very I've only I've known you now for known you now for known you now for 57 minutes. 57 minutes. 57 minutes. You have it. You have a likeability, a You have it. You have a likeability, a You have it. You have a likeability, a charisma, whatever it is you want to charisma, whatever it is you want to charisma, whatever it is you want to call it. Are you in the room negotiating call it. Are you in the room negotiating call it. Are you in the room negotiating these deals? Uh in some I am. So, with these deals? Uh in some I am. So, with these deals? Uh in some I am. So, with Pop Beauty, uh we bought a It's It's Pop Beauty, uh we bought a It's It's Pop Beauty, uh we bought a It's It's always a good to You have to have a always a good to You have to have a always a good to You have to have a banker. And bankers have done this, banker. And bankers have done this, banker. And bankers have done this, right? So, get a good banker, right? So, get a good banker, right? So, get a good banker, you know, get good reps. So, we had you know, get good reps. So, we had you know, get good reps. So, we had Goldman Sachs with with Pop Beauty, I Goldman Sachs with with Pop Beauty, I Goldman Sachs with with Pop Beauty, I built a great relationship with them. built a great relationship with them. built a great relationship with them. They actually brought Pepsi to the table They actually brought Pepsi to the table They actually brought Pepsi to the table initially, and initially, and initially, and without getting into it, the number in without getting into it, the number in without getting into it, the number in the offer was inadequate. So, I did what the offer was inadequate. So, I did what the offer was inadequate. So, I did what I said is a risky move, which is I I said is a risky move, which is I I said is a risky move, which is I walked cuz I didn't like the construct walked cuz I didn't like the construct walked cuz I didn't like the construct of the deal. of the deal. of the deal. Uh and then someone else came to the Uh and then someone else came to the Uh and then someone else came to the table. table. table. I also walked cuz I didn't like the I also walked cuz I didn't like the I also walked cuz I didn't like the construct of the deal. And if you construct of the deal. And if you construct of the deal. And if you probably speak to Steven Allison, they probably speak to Steven Allison, they probably speak to Steven Allison, they were probably getting nervous at this were probably getting nervous at this were probably getting nervous at this point because, you know, I was blessed point because, you know, I was blessed point because, you know, I was blessed to have had exits before. They hadn't to have had exits before. They hadn't to have had exits before. They hadn't had any, and even Stevie was losing it had any, and even Stevie was losing it had any, and even Stevie was losing it at one point because they're like, "This at one point because they're like, "This at one point because they're like, "This is life-changing money that Rose saying is life-changing money that Rose saying is life-changing money that Rose saying no to." no to." no to." But, I just didn't like the construct But, I just didn't like the construct But, I just didn't like the construct cuz it wasn't a full buyout. The the cuz it wasn't a full buyout. The the cuz it wasn't a full buyout. The the earn outs were And so, earn outs were And so, earn outs were And so, third time's a charm. So, when third time's a charm. So, when third time's a charm. So, when Pepsi came back I ended up negotiating Pepsi came back I ended up negotiating Pepsi came back I ended up negotiating that directly with them. that directly with them. that directly with them. Did it change your life, too? Did it change your life, too? Did it change your life, too? Yeah, it's you know you when you have a Yeah, it's you know you when you have a Yeah, it's you know you when you have a massive win like this you always have to massive win like this you always have to massive win like this you always have to step back and realize how blessed you step back and realize how blessed you step back and realize how blessed you are, not take it for granted, see what are, not take it for granted, see what are, not take it for granted, see what you could do for others and those around you could do for others and those around you could do for others and those around you. And a good thing for me was I let a you. And a good thing for me was I let a you. And a good thing for me was I let a lot of people into the deal. lot of people into the deal. lot of people into the deal. So it wasn't just me. I had So it wasn't just me. I had So it wasn't just me. I had >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> family, friends, one of my closest >> family, friends, one of my closest >> family, friends, one of my closest childhood friends was in the deal. And childhood friends was in the deal. And childhood friends was in the deal. And so when you affect other people beyond so when you affect other people beyond so when you affect other people beyond yourself, that's that's huge, you know. yourself, that's that's huge, you know. yourself, that's that's huge, you know. You said a bunch of things earlier that You said a bunch of things earlier that You said a bunch of things earlier that I want to I want to I want to ask you like the same question but with ask you like the same question but with ask you like the same question but with a different caveat. So sometimes I'll be a different caveat. So sometimes I'll be a different caveat. So sometimes I'll be like, "Hey, how do you sell this like, "Hey, how do you sell this like, "Hey, how do you sell this company?" Like, "Well, I called the guy. company?" Like, "Well, I called the guy. company?" Like, "Well, I called the guy. I know him." "How do you get on the I know him." "How do you get on the I know him." "How do you get on the shelf?" "Well, they know me and I know shelf?" "Well, they know me and I know shelf?" "Well, they know me and I know them." And like that's true and great them." And like that's true and great them." And like that's true and great and an extreme advantage today, but it and an extreme advantage today, but it and an extreme advantage today, but it two two problems. One, you didn't wake two two problems. One, you didn't wake two two problems. One, you didn't wake up you weren't born with that. You up you weren't born with that. You up you weren't born with that. You earned that somehow. earned that somehow. earned that somehow. And the second is it's not you know most And the second is it's not you know most And the second is it's not you know most entrepreneurs don't have that advantage. entrepreneurs don't have that advantage. entrepreneurs don't have that advantage. If they don't partner with you, you If they don't partner with you, you If they don't partner with you, you know, just in general people have to know, just in general people have to know, just in general people have to figure out how do you survive? No one's figure out how do you survive? No one's figure out how do you survive? No one's going to come save you. Do you have an going to come save you. Do you have an going to come save you. Do you have an insane hustle story from the beginning? insane hustle story from the beginning? insane hustle story from the beginning? Cuz that's what gets me excited. After Cuz that's what gets me excited. After Cuz that's what gets me excited. After this I'm going to go work and nothing this I'm going to go work and nothing this I'm going to go work and nothing fires me up more than a good hustle fires me up more than a good hustle fires me up more than a good hustle story. You have to have hustle at every story. You have to have hustle at every story. You have to have hustle at every stage, by the way. stage, by the way. stage, by the way. So I'll give you a puppy story which is So I'll give you a puppy story which is So I'll give you a puppy story which is later. I've had a bunch of exits, but later. I've had a bunch of exits, but later. I've had a bunch of exits, but I'm still hustling. Because guess what? I'm still hustling. Because guess what? I'm still hustling. Because guess what? People change out of roles in People change out of roles in People change out of roles in corporation. So when I say I know corporation. So when I say I know corporation. So when I say I know people, historically I've used bankers, people, historically I've used bankers, people, historically I've used bankers, I've used brokers, I've used people who I've used brokers, I've used people who I've used brokers, I've used people who are in the industry which you have to are in the industry which you have to are in the industry which you have to use as an entrepreneur. You've got to use as an entrepreneur. You've got to use as an entrepreneur. You've got to build a relationship with with everybody build a relationship with with everybody build a relationship with with everybody so that they get you in the room. And so that they get you in the room. And so that they get you in the room. And then when you get your shot you make it then when you get your shot you make it then when you get your shot you make it work. So I'll give a shout out to my work. So I'll give a shout out to my work. So I'll give a shout out to my buddy Danny Stepper. I don't know Danny. buddy Danny Stepper. I don't know Danny. buddy Danny Stepper. I don't know Danny. Danny's kind of a legend of the beverage Danny's kind of a legend of the beverage Danny's kind of a legend of the beverage industry. industry. industry. I went to the beverage forum just I went to the beverage forum just I went to the beverage forum just finished yesterday. It's probably the finished yesterday. It's probably the finished yesterday. It's probably the best in conference best in conference best in conference in and any beverage entrepreneur should in and any beverage entrepreneur should in and any beverage entrepreneur should be there. It's the best beverage be there. It's the best beverage be there. It's the best beverage conference in America. And I I went conference in America. And I I went conference in America. And I I went there 2 years ago. there 2 years ago. there 2 years ago. And Danny said, "Ro, would you speak?" I And Danny said, "Ro, would you speak?" I And Danny said, "Ro, would you speak?" I said, "Yes, I'll speak. said, "Yes, I'll speak. said, "Yes, I'll speak. But, But, But, there's a butt in this thing. I need a there's a butt in this thing. I need a there's a butt in this thing. I need a Walmart and a Target meeting while I'm Walmart and a Target meeting while I'm Walmart and a Target meeting while I'm at your conference." And he had at your conference." And he had at your conference." And he had some of the lead guys from Walmart and some of the lead guys from Walmart and some of the lead guys from Walmart and Target. Target. Target. They don't know me like at me. They know They don't know me like at me. They know They don't know me like at me. They know of me, but it's not like just cuz I walk of me, but it's not like just cuz I walk of me, but it's not like just cuz I walk in there. They're still Walmart. They're in there. They're still Walmart. They're in there. They're still Walmart. They're like, "Ro, screw you. We're Walmart." like, "Ro, screw you. We're Walmart." like, "Ro, screw you. We're Walmart." And so, I went in and I danced. Me, And so, I went in and I danced. Me, And so, I went in and I danced. Me, Allison, Chris Hall, the the CEO, and I Allison, Chris Hall, the the CEO, and I Allison, Chris Hall, the the CEO, and I danced. And I danced the Modern Soda danced. And I danced the Modern Soda danced. And I danced the Modern Soda dance because we were sucking wind at dance because we were sucking wind at dance because we were sucking wind at Walmart. We were doing everything else. Walmart. We were doing everything else. Walmart. We were doing everything else. And I'm like, "This is my one shot." And And I'm like, "This is my one shot." And And I'm like, "This is my one shot." And I came in and I painted the vision. I I came in and I painted the vision. I I came in and I painted the vision. I said, "Guys, this is not prebiotic soda. said, "Guys, this is not prebiotic soda. said, "Guys, this is not prebiotic soda. This is Modern Soda for tomorrow's This is Modern Soda for tomorrow's This is Modern Soda for tomorrow's generation." And I made a full story. generation." And I made a full story. generation." And I made a full story. And the light bulb went off at Walmart's And the light bulb went off at Walmart's And the light bulb went off at Walmart's head. And the head buyer, well, amazing head. And the head buyer, well, amazing head. And the head buyer, well, amazing guy, right away guy, right away guy, right away believed in the vision, got behind it. believed in the vision, got behind it. believed in the vision, got behind it. His boss, Melanie, was a rock star at His boss, Melanie, was a rock star at His boss, Melanie, was a rock star at Walmart, accelerated it from 2025 into Walmart, accelerated it from 2025 into Walmart, accelerated it from 2025 into end of '24. And Poppi did this. That was end of '24. And Poppi did this. That was end of '24. And Poppi did this. That was the moment Poppi went into explosive the moment Poppi went into explosive the moment Poppi went into explosive growth mode. And I'm doing the hustle. growth mode. And I'm doing the hustle. growth mode. And I'm doing the hustle. I'm doing the dance. And by the way, I'm doing the dance. And by the way, I'm doing the dance. And by the way, I've been pretty successful. But if you I've been pretty successful. But if you I've been pretty successful. But if you come in with an ego and you don't want come in with an ego and you don't want come in with an ego and you don't want to do the dance for retailers, to do the dance for retailers, to do the dance for retailers, regardless who you are, they don't give regardless who you are, they don't give regardless who you are, they don't give two shits. two shits. two shits. I know that Cavu is incredibly I know that Cavu is incredibly I know that Cavu is incredibly successful now. I know that I I believe successful now. I know that I I believe successful now. I know that I I believe it's many billion-dollar funds. You've it's many billion-dollar funds. You've it's many billion-dollar funds. You've had multi-billion-dollar exits. And I had multi-billion-dollar exits. And I had multi-billion-dollar exits. And I know that you started like in the Mars know that you started like in the Mars know that you started like in the Mars factory, like I think you said counting factory, like I think you said counting factory, like I think you said counting M&M's. M&M's. M&M's. The show is called my Sorry, Twix. Uh The show is called my Sorry, Twix. Uh The show is called my Sorry, Twix. Uh the show is called uh My First Million. the show is called uh My First Million. the show is called uh My First Million. I don't know like the middle ground. I don't know like the middle ground. I don't know like the middle ground. What did you do to make your first What did you do to make your first What did you do to make your first million? Because was it investing your million? Because was it investing your million? Because was it investing your own money in brands? Was it because you own money in brands? Was it because you own money in brands? Was it because you got equity in Vitamin Water? My first got equity in Vitamin Water? My first got equity in Vitamin Water? My first million million million So, I got fired from Coke. So, I got fired from Coke. So, I got fired from Coke. Um too creative disruptive. Um too creative disruptive. Um too creative disruptive. And I went to this no-name company And I went to this no-name company And I went to this no-name company called Vitamin Water. In fact, I sent a called Vitamin Water. In fact, I sent a called Vitamin Water. In fact, I sent a bunch of product to my friends, they bunch of product to my friends, they bunch of product to my friends, they didn't even drink it. That's the power didn't even drink it. That's the power didn't even drink it. That's the power of brand, by the way. They didn't drink of brand, by the way. They didn't drink of brand, by the way. They didn't drink it and 2 years later the same jackasses it and 2 years later the same jackasses it and 2 years later the same jackasses called me, "Ro, Vitamin Water is huge. called me, "Ro, Vitamin Water is huge. called me, "Ro, Vitamin Water is huge. My kids love it." I'm like, "Dude, I My kids love it." I'm like, "Dude, I My kids love it." I'm like, "Dude, I sent that to you 2 years ago. You never sent that to you 2 years ago. You never sent that to you 2 years ago. You never said [ __ ] to me." Anyway, so I put my said [ __ ] to me." Anyway, so I put my said [ __ ] to me." Anyway, so I put my own money in. I borrowed from my dad. own money in. I borrowed from my dad. own money in. I borrowed from my dad. So, I'm broke as a joke and I borrowed So, I'm broke as a joke and I borrowed So, I'm broke as a joke and I borrowed from my dad and I get equity. from my dad and I get equity. from my dad and I get equity. And so I went from And so I went from And so I went from you know, fumes in my bank account cuz I you know, fumes in my bank account cuz I you know, fumes in my bank account cuz I was basically spending everything I was was basically spending everything I was was basically spending everything I was making to the Vitamin Water exit and making to the Vitamin Water exit and making to the Vitamin Water exit and that was my first million or more than that was my first million or more than that was my first million or more than that, but it was putting everything that that, but it was putting everything that that, but it was putting everything that I had and I think that's honestly where I had and I think that's honestly where I had and I think that's honestly where you make a big bet, you put everything you make a big bet, you put everything you make a big bet, you put everything into it and if it works out, that's kind into it and if it works out, that's kind into it and if it works out, that's kind of where you get your biggest paydays. of where you get your biggest paydays. of where you get your biggest paydays. Did you raise money for a fund right Did you raise money for a fund right Did you raise money for a fund right after that? Were you like, "No, I'm after that? Were you like, "No, I'm after that? Were you like, "No, I'm going going going >> No, I did my own thing. So, I did >> No, I did my own thing. So, I did >> No, I did my own thing. So, I did Vitamin Water, Smartwater. I exited. Vitamin Water, Smartwater. I exited. Vitamin Water, Smartwater. I exited. I had my own money, so what's the phrase I had my own money, so what's the phrase I had my own money, so what's the phrase they say? You invest off your balance they say? You invest off your balance they say? You invest off your balance sheet? Some [ __ ] finance phrase. So, sheet? Some [ __ ] finance phrase. So, sheet? Some [ __ ] finance phrase. So, anyway, yes, I invested off my balance anyway, yes, I invested off my balance anyway, yes, I invested off my balance sheet, meaning I went in solo, Rohan, sheet, meaning I went in solo, Rohan, sheet, meaning I went in solo, Rohan, into Vita Coco, into Bai, into Popchips into Vita Coco, into Bai, into Popchips into Vita Coco, into Bai, into Popchips and Stevie was my right hand wing woman and Stevie was my right hand wing woman and Stevie was my right hand wing woman in this case. And so she was my She in this case. And so she was my She in this case. And so she was my She learned marketing from me. We did it learned marketing from me. We did it learned marketing from me. We did it together and now she's the head of together and now she's the head of together and now she's the head of marketing for Kavoo. That's really marketing for Kavoo. That's really marketing for Kavoo. That's really interesting and what I'm asking you is interesting and what I'm asking you is interesting and what I'm asking you is really personal, so you can avoid it or really personal, so you can avoid it or really personal, so you can avoid it or you can give as much information as you you can give as much information as you you can give as much information as you want, but I find that to be cool and want, but I find that to be cool and want, but I find that to be cool and there's a lot of people listening who there's a lot of people listening who there's a lot of people listening who are like, "I would like to make a little are like, "I would like to make a little are like, "I would like to make a little bit of money and spend a little bit of bit of money and spend a little bit of bit of money and spend a little bit of money doing what this guy is doing. money doing what this guy is doing. money doing what this guy is doing. That's badass. I don't want to start a That's badass. I don't want to start a That's badass. I don't want to start a fund yet." Are you able to give any type fund yet." Are you able to give any type fund yet." Are you able to give any type of numbers as to what you had when you of numbers as to what you had when you of numbers as to what you had when you started investing in Popchips and all started investing in Popchips and all started investing in Popchips and all these companies? these companies? these companies? >> Yeah, I got I can give you a range. I >> Yeah, I got I can give you a range. I >> Yeah, I got I can give you a range. I was investing anywhere from was investing anywhere from was investing anywhere from probably half a million to 2 million. probably half a million to 2 million. probably half a million to 2 million. That's a shitload for an angel That's a shitload for an angel That's a shitload for an angel investment. investment. investment. >> Yeah, I wasn't that smart, dude. I was a >> Yeah, I wasn't that smart, dude. I was a >> Yeah, I wasn't that smart, dude. I was a little bit unhinged. I had Long term, I little bit unhinged. I had Long term, I little bit unhinged. I had Long term, I worked out great. I don't advocate you worked out great. I don't advocate you worked out great. I don't advocate you go that heavy. Were you really rich? No, go that heavy. Were you really rich? No, go that heavy. Were you really rich? No, I was just I was a I think I bet on I was just I was a I think I bet on I was just I was a I think I bet on myself a little too much. So, yeah, I myself a little too much. So, yeah, I myself a little too much. So, yeah, I had a lot more money than that, but I had a lot more money than that, but I had a lot more money than that, but I think you have to be willing to lose think you have to be willing to lose think you have to be willing to lose if you're going to win. Did you tell if you're going to win. Did you tell if you're going to win. Did you tell yourself like, okay, I'm I'm willing to yourself like, okay, I'm I'm willing to yourself like, okay, I'm I'm willing to lose 10 million bucks, but I'm going to lose 10 million bucks, but I'm going to lose 10 million bucks, but I'm going to bet I'm going to bet on myself to go bet I'm going to bet on myself to go bet I'm going to bet on myself to go make a few concentrated bets? Did you make a few concentrated bets? Did you make a few concentrated bets? Did you Did you sort of mentally partition like Did you sort of mentally partition like Did you sort of mentally partition like this is loseable money or you just You this is loseable money or you just You this is loseable money or you just You were just going and you didn't even were just going and you didn't even were just going and you didn't even think about it? think about it? think about it? >> of stress. So, basically, I was kind of >> of stress. So, basically, I was kind of >> of stress. So, basically, I was kind of doing the math. I'm like, okay, I'm in doing the math. I'm like, okay, I'm in doing the math. I'm like, okay, I'm in for this, I'm in for this, I'm in for for this, I'm in for this, I'm in for for this, I'm in for this, I'm in for this. And then like this. And then like this. And then like you know, X years later, I'm like, well, you know, X years later, I'm like, well, you know, X years later, I'm like, well, you know, I mean, you know, I'm in for you know, I mean, you know, I'm in for you know, I mean, you know, I'm in for 10, but I've made, you know, 10 times 10, but I've made, you know, 10 times 10, but I've made, you know, 10 times that, so I think I'm good. You know what that, so I think I'm good. You know what that, so I think I'm good. You know what I'm saying? So, it's like it's a what It I'm saying? So, it's like it's a what It I'm saying? So, it's like it's a what It was organic. Like you know, what what was organic. Like you know, what what was organic. Like you know, what what percent man math? I like it. What percent man math? I like it. What percent man math? I like it. What percent What prin- For the principal, percent What prin- For the principal, percent What prin- For the principal, not the markups, what percent of your not the markups, what percent of your not the markups, what percent of your liquid net worth was in private deals? liquid net worth was in private deals? liquid net worth was in private deals? Yeah, a lot. I also I should really Yeah, a lot. I also I should really Yeah, a lot. I also I should really should have done a better job with my should have done a better job with my should have done a better job with my publics. I was very like into my private publics. I was very like into my private publics. I was very like into my private cuz I'd made my money on private, so it cuz I'd made my money on private, so it cuz I'd made my money on private, so it far too high a percentage. far too high a percentage. far too high a percentage. >> like Was it like all? No, no, it's >> like Was it like all? No, no, it's >> like Was it like all? No, no, it's probably probably about a third though. probably probably about a third though. probably probably about a third though. I mean, I guess Okay, okay. I don't I mean, I guess Okay, okay. I don't I mean, I guess Okay, okay. I don't know. Like I don't know. It was a decent know. Like I don't know. It was a decent know. Like I don't know. It was a decent amount. I can't remember exactly. I was amount. I can't remember exactly. I was amount. I can't remember exactly. I was rolling heavy. I was like in my 30s. And rolling heavy. I was like in my 30s. And rolling heavy. I was like in my 30s. And like PopChips was a great brand and I like PopChips was a great brand and I like PopChips was a great brand and I bet on that, but I didn't understand the bet on that, but I didn't understand the bet on that, but I didn't understand the importance of a pref stack. They were importance of a pref stack. They were importance of a pref stack. They were just going just going just going >> bets and then like going out and >> bets and then like going out and >> bets and then like going out and hustling on your behalf. You're like, hustling on your behalf. You're like, hustling on your behalf. You're like, hey, I'm going to beverage forum and I'm hey, I'm going to beverage forum and I'm hey, I'm going to beverage forum and I'm just going to figure out how to wheel just going to figure out how to wheel just going to figure out how to wheel and deal a little bit. and deal a little bit. and deal a little bit. >> Yeah, I was working with these >> Yeah, I was working with these >> Yeah, I was working with these companies. Like I would help the companies. Like I would help the companies. Like I would help the PopChips guys with influencers. We You PopChips guys with influencers. We You PopChips guys with influencers. We You know, all with marketing or team. Like know, all with marketing or team. Like know, all with marketing or team. Like I'd bring in the head of sales or the I'd bring in the head of sales or the I'd bring in the head of sales or the head of marketing or You were free You head of marketing or You were free You head of marketing or You were free You were like a free hire a little bit. were like a free hire a little bit. were like a free hire a little bit. >> Yeah, I was like I'm like, let me in. >> Yeah, I was like I'm like, let me in. >> Yeah, I was like I'm like, let me in. I'll help you out. Sometimes I got an I'll help you out. Sometimes I got an I'll help you out. Sometimes I got an equity for helping. And so, the good equity for helping. And so, the good equity for helping. And so, the good news is my hits in in VitaCoco, the news is my hits in in VitaCoco, the news is my hits in in VitaCoco, the coconut water, Bai, coconut water, Bai, coconut water, Bai, Vital Proteins, Vital Proteins, Vital Proteins, and Poppy far outstripped whatever loss and Poppy far outstripped whatever loss and Poppy far outstripped whatever loss >> the the order of winners was Vitamin >> the the order of winners was Vitamin >> the the order of winners was Vitamin Water, you did that with you did it with Water, you did that with you did it with Water, you did that with you did it with Smartwater, and then what was the order Smartwater, and then what was the order Smartwater, and then what was the order the next five deals? Uh I did Vitamin the next five deals? Uh I did Vitamin the next five deals? Uh I did Vitamin Smart, Smart, Smart, then I did Vita Coco, then I did Vita Coco, then I did Vita Coco, the coconut water, which is great. Cavan the coconut water, which is great. Cavan the coconut water, which is great. Cavan is an incredible operator. Did that is an incredible operator. Did that is an incredible operator. Did that exit? [ __ ] the guy's got with the exit? [ __ ] the guy's got with the exit? [ __ ] the guy's got with the company worth two and a half billion on company worth two and a half billion on company worth two and a half billion on the public stock exchange. Stock market. the public stock exchange. Stock market. the public stock exchange. Stock market. >> Oh, wow, I didn't know that. Okay, wow. >> Oh, wow, I didn't know that. Okay, wow. >> Oh, wow, I didn't know that. Okay, wow. With a thing like coconut water, right? With a thing like coconut water, right? With a thing like coconut water, right? Like my my business partner Ben, he's Like my my business partner Ben, he's Like my my business partner Ben, he's been trying to get me to drink freaking been trying to get me to drink freaking been trying to get me to drink freaking banana water. He's like, "Oh, banana banana water. He's like, "Oh, banana banana water. He's like, "Oh, banana water." And I do it's nasty. Can't water." And I do it's nasty. Can't water." And I do it's nasty. Can't believe he likes it, but he's like, believe he likes it, but he's like, believe he likes it, but he's like, "Banana water, that's the next coconut "Banana water, that's the next coconut "Banana water, that's the next coconut water." I'm like, "I don't think it is." water." I'm like, "I don't think it is." water." I'm like, "I don't think it is." How do you spot the real trends versus How do you spot the real trends versus How do you spot the real trends versus the false trends? Are you just trusting the false trends? Are you just trusting the false trends? Are you just trusting your own taste buds? Or is it some your own taste buds? Or is it some your own taste buds? Or is it some research you're doing? Are you watching research you're doing? Are you watching research you're doing? Are you watching what high schoolers are doing? Like what what high schoolers are doing? Like what what high schoolers are doing? Like what what are you doing to see figure out what are you doing to see figure out what are you doing to see figure out real trend versus fizzle out trend? real trend versus fizzle out trend? real trend versus fizzle out trend? >> Yeah, taste buds and time. Coconut water >> Yeah, taste buds and time. Coconut water >> Yeah, taste buds and time. Coconut water wasn't a coconut water time. It was a wasn't a coconut water time. It was a wasn't a coconut water time. It was a hydration time. Mhm. Right? Taste buds, hydration time. Mhm. Right? Taste buds, hydration time. Mhm. Right? Taste buds, and maybe it's bad cuz I'm of Indian and maybe it's bad cuz I'm of Indian and maybe it's bad cuz I'm of Indian origin, I like coconut water, but but origin, I like coconut water, but but origin, I like coconut water, but but let's be honest, I got in early. I got let's be honest, I got in early. I got let's be honest, I got in early. I got out at a $700 million valuation. Right? out at a $700 million valuation. Right? out at a $700 million valuation. Right? So, I got in at I don't know 30, so I So, I got in at I don't know 30, so I So, I got in at I don't know 30, so I made 20 times my money. The thing's now made 20 times my money. The thing's now made 20 times my money. The thing's now worth north of two billion. So, I didn't worth north of two billion. So, I didn't worth north of two billion. So, I didn't have the vision that Mike has, who's a have the vision that Mike has, who's a have the vision that Mike has, who's a CEO founder, that this could be north of CEO founder, that this could be north of CEO founder, that this could be north of a two billion dollar public company. No a two billion dollar public company. No a two billion dollar public company. No chance I had that vision. I was cuz to chance I had that vision. I was cuz to chance I had that vision. I was cuz to me the TAM was limited by the taste of me the TAM was limited by the taste of me the TAM was limited by the taste of coconut water in America. So, I coconut water in America. So, I coconut water in America. So, I sometimes you sometimes you sometimes you knowing when to hold them, you knowing knowing when to hold them, you knowing knowing when to hold them, you knowing when to fold them. So, I got out. I made when to fold them. So, I got out. I made when to fold them. So, I got out. I made good money. I can I will never begrudge good money. I can I will never begrudge good money. I can I will never begrudge the money that I could have made, I but the money that I could have made, I but the money that I could have made, I but I got it. So, the I got it. So, the I got it. So, the I was out on that one. But then, you I was out on that one. But then, you I was out on that one. But then, you know, but then I got into Bai, and I know, but then I got into Bai, and I know, but then I got into Bai, and I rode Bai all the way. And the founder rode Bai all the way. And the founder rode Bai all the way. And the founder Ben is super smart, and he I got him Ben is super smart, and he I got him Ben is super smart, and he I got him introduced to KDP, and he built a introduced to KDP, and he built a introduced to KDP, and he built a brilliant relationship with the CEO of brilliant relationship with the CEO of brilliant relationship with the CEO of KDP, and then sold that for 1.7 billion. KDP, and then sold that for 1.7 billion. KDP, and then sold that for 1.7 billion. I think one of the great tests of I think one of the great tests of I think one of the great tests of marketing is can you sell water? marketing is can you sell water? marketing is can you sell water? >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> How do you sell water? Right? What's the >> How do you sell water? Right? What's the >> How do you sell water? Right? What's the There's a marketing genius about There's a marketing genius about There's a marketing genius about figuring out how to sell water, and not figuring out how to sell water, and not figuring out how to sell water, and not just once, how to sell it many times in just once, how to sell it many times in just once, how to sell it many times in many different ways. And so many different ways. And so many different ways. And so >> I've only done one water, by the way. >> I've only done one water, by the way. >> I've only done one water, by the way. I've done many beverages, but only one I've done many beverages, but only one I've done many beverages, but only one water. Okay. Well, so Vitaminwater not a water. Okay. Well, so Vitaminwater not a water. Okay. Well, so Vitaminwater not a water. water. water. >> Yeah, Vitaminwater is flavored, right? >> Yeah, Vitaminwater is flavored, right? >> Yeah, Vitaminwater is flavored, right? Poppy's flavored. Vita Coco buy, they're Poppy's flavored. Vita Coco buy, they're Poppy's flavored. Vita Coco buy, they're all flavored. Like when you just all flavored. Like when you just all flavored. Like when you just straight water, I still don't know how straight water, I still don't know how straight water, I still don't know how the hell I did that, but um the hell I did that, but um the hell I did that, but um I'll take a crack. The founder Darius I'll take a crack. The founder Darius I'll take a crack. The founder Darius created Smartwater with a really good created Smartwater with a really good created Smartwater with a really good story, which is vapor distilled water. story, which is vapor distilled water. story, which is vapor distilled water. It's how water is made in in the world, It's how water is made in in the world, It's how water is made in in the world, right? Water evaporates from the ocean, right? Water evaporates from the ocean, right? Water evaporates from the ocean, goes up, hydrogen and oxygen separate, goes up, hydrogen and oxygen separate, goes up, hydrogen and oxygen separate, all the impurities fall out, it comes all the impurities fall out, it comes all the impurities fall out, it comes back to earth, that first drop of back to earth, that first drop of back to earth, that first drop of rainwater before it enters the rainwater before it enters the rainwater before it enters the atmosphere and before it hits the atmosphere and before it hits the atmosphere and before it hits the ground, that's pure water. So that was ground, that's pure water. So that was ground, that's pure water. So that was the initial vision behind Smartwater. the initial vision behind Smartwater. the initial vision behind Smartwater. The packaging was all great, it was The packaging was all great, it was The packaging was all great, it was invisible, so I redo the package. The invisible, so I redo the package. The invisible, so I redo the package. The current package was me and my team that current package was me and my team that current package was me and my team that sits on shelf today. Then we did the sits on shelf today. Then we did the sits on shelf today. Then we did the influencer strategy, and I felt that influencer strategy, and I felt that influencer strategy, and I felt that Evian was the only player in America Evian was the only player in America Evian was the only player in America that was in premium water. But it's a that was in premium water. But it's a that was in premium water. But it's a French company and was in plastic being French company and was in plastic being French company and was in plastic being shipped across the ocean, it didn't make shipped across the ocean, it didn't make shipped across the ocean, it didn't make sense, and neither did Fiji being sense, and neither did Fiji being sense, and neither did Fiji being shipped from basically Fiji. Like why shipped from basically Fiji. Like why shipped from basically Fiji. Like why can't we have a premium American water can't we have a premium American water can't we have a premium American water that has And the thing is your water is that has And the thing is your water is that has And the thing is your water is a badge. When you walk around with the a badge. When you walk around with the a badge. When you walk around with the water more than anything else, it's a water more than anything else, it's a water more than anything else, it's a little bit of a reflection of you, little bit of a reflection of you, little bit of a reflection of you, right? That's why at home, who cares? right? That's why at home, who cares? right? That's why at home, who cares? You buy the case packs at Costco and 24 You buy the case packs at Costco and 24 You buy the case packs at Costco and 24 packs for like $2. But when you're packs for like $2. But when you're packs for like $2. But when you're walking around, you want a little bit of walking around, you want a little bit of walking around, you want a little bit of a a different badge. And I think with a a different badge. And I think with a a different badge. And I think with the team I had the team I had the team I had uh Jennifer Aniston became the face of uh Jennifer Aniston became the face of uh Jennifer Aniston became the face of the brand, the the new packaging we did. the brand, the the new packaging we did. the brand, the the new packaging we did. Smart became this like go-to accessory Smart became this like go-to accessory Smart became this like go-to accessory particularly for women and the brand particularly for women and the brand particularly for women and the brand took off. And I think when Coke bought took off. And I think when Coke bought took off. And I think when Coke bought Vitamin Water of you awesome today, the Vitamin Water of you awesome today, the Vitamin Water of you awesome today, the brand that that has worked out for them brand that that has worked out for them brand that that has worked out for them is Smartwater not Vitamin Water. And is is Smartwater not Vitamin Water. And is is Smartwater not Vitamin Water. And is what is there something to this idea of what is there something to this idea of what is there something to this idea of placement? So like I remember when Beats placement? So like I remember when Beats placement? So like I remember when Beats by Dre came out and it was this by Dre came out and it was this by Dre came out and it was this headphone brand just like many other headphone brand just like many other headphone brand just like many other Bose and others. But instead of going Bose and others. But instead of going Bose and others. But instead of going for audio files, everywhere you saw it for audio files, everywhere you saw it for audio files, everywhere you saw it was basically hip-hop artists and was basically hip-hop artists and was basically hip-hop artists and athletes walking into the stadium. And athletes walking into the stadium. And athletes walking into the stadium. And it became like synonymous with like the it became like synonymous with like the it became like synonymous with like the pre-game lock-in pre-game lock-in pre-game lock-in associated with the coolest athletes and associated with the coolest athletes and associated with the coolest athletes and and and artists. And and and artists. And and and artists. And like that was a they created billions of like that was a they created billions of like that was a they created billions of dollars of value by a by that dollars of value by a by that dollars of value by a by that association that placement of the association that placement of the association that placement of the pre-game or the walk-in at least for me. pre-game or the walk-in at least for me. pre-game or the walk-in at least for me. Um and I think that Um and I think that Um and I think that I've read stories about Grey Goose and I've read stories about Grey Goose and I've read stories about Grey Goose and and some of the liquor brands where they and some of the liquor brands where they and some of the liquor brands where they would put it in the limousines of the would put it in the limousines of the would put it in the limousines of the after-parties of the Oscars and just after-parties of the Oscars and just after-parties of the Oscars and just where it was seen was almost just as where it was seen was almost just as where it was seen was almost just as important as the story of how it was important as the story of how it was important as the story of how it was triple filtered and distilled cuz nobody triple filtered and distilled cuz nobody triple filtered and distilled cuz nobody actually ends up knowing that [ __ ] They actually ends up knowing that [ __ ] They actually ends up knowing that [ __ ] They just see where it's seen. Um did you just see where it's seen. Um did you just see where it's seen. Um did you ever use that tactic or what is that? ever use that tactic or what is that? ever use that tactic or what is that? That was huge for me back in the day. So That was huge for me back in the day. So That was huge for me back in the day. So now this strategy is done really through now this strategy is done really through now this strategy is done really through social digital, right? So digital social digital, right? So digital social digital, right? So digital influences when when influences when when influences when when the all top sororities are running the all top sororities are running the all top sororities are running around posting Poppi and having it at around posting Poppi and having it at around posting Poppi and having it at the sorority kickoff parties. I have an the sorority kickoff parties. I have an the sorority kickoff parties. I have an army of amazing college ambassadors and army of amazing college ambassadors and army of amazing college ambassadors and Poppi is the number one drink on college Poppi is the number one drink on college Poppi is the number one drink on college campuses. campuses. campuses. >> day like Red Bull playbook basically. >> day like Red Bull playbook basically. >> day like Red Bull playbook basically. >> Yeah, but it's kind of a better for you >> Yeah, but it's kind of a better for you >> Yeah, but it's kind of a better for you feel-good vibe and definitely works feel-good vibe and definitely works feel-good vibe and definitely works better for women than you know, like better for women than you know, like better for women than you know, like from a from a connection standpoint. So from a from a connection standpoint. So from a from a connection standpoint. So but back in the day but back in the day but back in the day I did this with the Oscars, with the I did this with the Oscars, with the I did this with the Oscars, with the Golden Globes. Smartwater was the first Golden Globes. Smartwater was the first Golden Globes. Smartwater was the first water on the table at the Golden Globes water on the table at the Golden Globes water on the table at the Golden Globes before they were pouring it out of just before they were pouring it out of just before they were pouring it out of just a and so I did a deal with them. So a and so I did a deal with them. So a and so I did a deal with them. So suddenly every table you go to you're suddenly every table you go to you're suddenly every table you go to you're seeing a Smartwater there. And then seeing a Smartwater there. And then seeing a Smartwater there. And then Vitamin I used to sponsor mainly because Vitamin I used to sponsor mainly because Vitamin I used to sponsor mainly because I wanted to go to the parties. So, I wanted to go to the parties. So, I wanted to go to the parties. So, Patrick Whitesell, I'm a friend of Patrick Whitesell, I'm a friend of Patrick Whitesell, I'm a friend of Patrick's, he's too big time now, but Patrick's, he's too big time now, but Patrick's, he's too big time now, but Patrick Endeavor, right? used to throw Patrick Endeavor, right? used to throw Patrick Endeavor, right? used to throw the coolest post Oscar parties, the coolest post Oscar parties, the coolest post Oscar parties, um, um, um, it Oscar and VMA, Golden Globe parties it Oscar and VMA, Golden Globe parties it Oscar and VMA, Golden Globe parties in LA. So, just for me to get to access in LA. So, just for me to get to access in LA. So, just for me to get to access to those things, I would sponsor them. to those things, I would sponsor them. to those things, I would sponsor them. But, the good news is But, the good news is But, the good news is all the I like I remember going to one all the I like I remember going to one all the I like I remember going to one and it was back in [clears throat] what and it was back in [clears throat] what and it was back in [clears throat] what I call round one of J.Lo and Affleck I call round one of J.Lo and Affleck I call round one of J.Lo and Affleck dating. And I was at the party and like dating. And I was at the party and like dating. And I was at the party and like J.Lo and Affleck are there. And everyone J.Lo and Affleck are there. And everyone J.Lo and Affleck are there. And everyone was really vibing with her back then. was really vibing with her back then. was really vibing with her back then. This is like 2003, This is like 2003, This is like 2003, you know? 2004. So, I think you're dead you know? 2004. So, I think you're dead you know? 2004. So, I think you're dead right. In the early days, right. In the early days, right. In the early days, especially with products, they've got to especially with products, they've got to especially with products, they've got to appear in people's lifestyle areas as appear in people's lifestyle areas as appear in people's lifestyle areas as both physically and digitally. You're a both physically and digitally. You're a both physically and digitally. You're a hustler. I didn't I didn't realize how hustler. I didn't I didn't realize how hustler. I didn't I didn't realize how big of a hustler you are. If you lose big of a hustler you are. If you lose big of a hustler you are. If you lose your hustle, you lose your edge. Like, your hustle, you lose your edge. Like, your hustle, you lose your edge. Like, the guy who Shawn and I know, Gulrez, the guy who Shawn and I know, Gulrez, the guy who Shawn and I know, Gulrez, who's the CEO of, who's the CEO of, who's the CEO of, Jim Khanna Fine Foods, like he's like, Jim Khanna Fine Foods, like he's like, Jim Khanna Fine Foods, like he's like, "Bro, you are bloody intense." Like, "Bro, you are bloody intense." Like, "Bro, you are bloody intense." Like, when I get in a sessions with him, he's when I get in a sessions with him, he's when I get in a sessions with him, he's like, "I thought you just chilled out. like, "I thought you just chilled out. like, "I thought you just chilled out. You're a father. You're successful." I'm You're a father. You're successful." I'm You're a father. You're successful." I'm like, "Bro, it's go time. Like, we're like, "Bro, it's go time. Like, we're like, "Bro, it's go time. Like, we're building your empire. Let's, you know, building your empire. Let's, you know, building your empire. Let's, you know, there's no there's no there's no you got to have a hustle mode." And I you got to have a hustle mode." And I you got to have a hustle mode." And I think also founders respect that. So, I think also founders respect that. So, I think also founders respect that. So, I want to ask you a little bit of a want to ask you a little bit of a want to ask you a little bit of a different question. I'm obsessed with different question. I'm obsessed with different question. I'm obsessed with brands that last a long time. I'm also a brands that last a long time. I'm also a brands that last a long time. I'm also a massive American history buff. And some massive American history buff. And some massive American history buff. And some of the best brands in America, you know, of the best brands in America, you know, of the best brands in America, you know, they've been around for over a century, they've been around for over a century, they've been around for over a century, Coke, Snickers, M&M's, like brands that Coke, Snickers, M&M's, like brands that Coke, Snickers, M&M's, like brands that you've worked with. I think Mars is like you've worked with. I think Mars is like you've worked with. I think Mars is like a $50 billion a year business that's a $50 billion a year business that's a $50 billion a year business that's family owned. Hershey's is run by I family owned. Hershey's is run by I family owned. Hershey's is run by I think run by a family trust. I think think run by a family trust. I think think run by a family trust. I think they do something like 10 or 20 billion they do something like 10 or 20 billion they do something like 10 or 20 billion a year in revenue. And these brands, you a year in revenue. And these brands, you a year in revenue. And these brands, you know, everyone talks about getting know, everyone talks about getting know, everyone talks about getting healthy, but like Reese's probably isn't healthy, but like Reese's probably isn't healthy, but like Reese's probably isn't going to go away for the next 50 years. going to go away for the next 50 years. going to go away for the next 50 years. >> Coke is probably not going to go away >> Coke is probably not going to go away >> Coke is probably not going to go away for 100 years. And also, you've worked for 100 years. And also, you've worked for 100 years. And also, you've worked with startups. Is there anything that I with startups. Is there anything that I with startups. Is there anything that I or Shawn or the listener can learn from or Shawn or the listener can learn from or Shawn or the listener can learn from these old big companies that have been these old big companies that have been these old big companies that have been around for 100 plus years? around for 100 plus years? around for 100 plus years? Yeah, look, they do a very good job of Yeah, look, they do a very good job of Yeah, look, they do a very good job of two things. Uh two things. Uh two things. Uh They're managing their installed base. They're managing their installed base. They're managing their installed base. So, they have fantastic retail presence. So, they have fantastic retail presence. So, they have fantastic retail presence. And they do, in my opinion, when I great And they do, in my opinion, when I great And they do, in my opinion, when I great marketing to maintain relevance for marketing to maintain relevance for marketing to maintain relevance for their brands. It's almost I'm always their brands. It's almost I'm always their brands. It's almost I'm always shocked how well they do it in a world shocked how well they do it in a world shocked how well they do it in a world where technically you shouldn't be where technically you shouldn't be where technically you shouldn't be eating or drinking any of those eating or drinking any of those eating or drinking any of those products. products. products. However, where they are smart, and I However, where they are smart, and I However, where they are smart, and I give Pepsi credit for this, give Pepsi credit for this, give Pepsi credit for this, they do go out and buy the future as they do go out and buy the future as they do go out and buy the future as well. Like Pepsi bought Poppi not cuz well. Like Pepsi bought Poppi not cuz well. Like Pepsi bought Poppi not cuz it's a apple cider vinegar beverage, it's a apple cider vinegar beverage, it's a apple cider vinegar beverage, because they're seeing the vision. Look, because they're seeing the vision. Look, because they're seeing the vision. Look, this could [clears throat] be right up this could [clears throat] be right up this could [clears throat] be right up there, and they've said it to me, this there, and they've said it to me, this there, and they've said it to me, this between like Pepsi, Mountain Dew, Poppi, between like Pepsi, Mountain Dew, Poppi, between like Pepsi, Mountain Dew, Poppi, that should be this their their soda that should be this their their soda that should be this their their soda lineup. And choose what you want. If you lineup. And choose what you want. If you lineup. And choose what you want. If you feel like having a Pepsi, great. And by feel like having a Pepsi, great. And by feel like having a Pepsi, great. And by the way, the growth is all coming, Sam, the way, the growth is all coming, Sam, the way, the growth is all coming, Sam, from their zero sugar products. So, it's from their zero sugar products. So, it's from their zero sugar products. So, it's not coming from core Coca-Cola, Pepsi. not coming from core Coca-Cola, Pepsi. not coming from core Coca-Cola, Pepsi. It's Pepsi Zero. Yeah, correct. Pepsi It's Pepsi Zero. Yeah, correct. Pepsi It's Pepsi Zero. Yeah, correct. Pepsi Zero's crushing it, Coke Zero's crushing Zero's crushing it, Coke Zero's crushing Zero's crushing it, Coke Zero's crushing it. And so, Poppi fits into that realm. it. And so, Poppi fits into that realm. it. And so, Poppi fits into that realm. So, So, So, they see that. You still maintain your they see that. You still maintain your they see that. You still maintain your legacy, but you have to make sure you legacy, but you have to make sure you legacy, but you have to make sure you pick up the future, otherwise you will pick up the future, otherwise you will pick up the future, otherwise you will get left behind. And so, I think you're get left behind. And so, I think you're get left behind. And so, I think you're seeing it. Like Unilever bought Unilever seeing it. Like Unilever bought Unilever seeing it. Like Unilever bought Unilever Boy, Grooming's, right? Like that Boy, Grooming's, right? Like that Boy, Grooming's, right? Like that they're buying the future. There's a lot they're buying the future. There's a lot they're buying the future. There's a lot of M&A. Hershey just bought LesserEvil. of M&A. Hershey just bought LesserEvil. of M&A. Hershey just bought LesserEvil. Like that they are buying the future, Like that they are buying the future, Like that they are buying the future, and I think they but they're getting a and I think they but they're getting a and I think they but they're getting a little savvier and a little wiser in how little savvier and a little wiser in how little savvier and a little wiser in how they do it. Before they would build get they do it. Before they would build get they do it. Before they would build get brands that I don't think were built to brands that I don't think were built to brands that I don't think were built to last. And now, to your point, Sam, I last. And now, to your point, Sam, I last. And now, to your point, Sam, I think they're trying to find brands that think they're trying to find brands that think they're trying to find brands that are built to last. And for me, if we are built to last. And for me, if we are built to last. And for me, if we look at all the exits we've been a part look at all the exits we've been a part look at all the exits we've been a part of, whether those brands continue of, whether those brands continue of, whether those brands continue growing 40% or just maintain a good growing 40% or just maintain a good growing 40% or just maintain a good scale, Vitamin Smart, Poppi, Vital scale, Vitamin Smart, Poppi, Vital scale, Vitamin Smart, Poppi, Vital Proteins, By Farmer's Dog, like all Proteins, By Farmer's Dog, like all Proteins, By Farmer's Dog, like all these are still Once Upon a Farm, you these are still Once Upon a Farm, you these are still Once Upon a Farm, you know, we IPO'd that brand. We They're know, we IPO'd that brand. We They're know, we IPO'd that brand. We They're all still there. And that they will be all still there. And that they will be all still there. And that they will be here if managed right for the next 10, here if managed right for the next 10, here if managed right for the next 10, 20, 30, 40 years. 20, 30, 40 years. 20, 30, 40 years. Sean had a good question that he was Sean had a good question that he was Sean had a good question that he was telling me that he had for you, but I'm telling me that he had for you, but I'm telling me that he had for you, but I'm going to ask it and uh going to ask it and uh going to ask it and uh He hasn't gotten He hasn't gotten to it He hasn't gotten He hasn't gotten to it He hasn't gotten He hasn't gotten to it yet. yet. yet. >> of guy I am. He hasn't gotten to it yet. >> of guy I am. He hasn't gotten to it yet. >> of guy I am. He hasn't gotten to it yet. >> a gifted He's a gifted. Yeah, I'm going >> a gifted He's a gifted. Yeah, I'm going >> a gifted He's a gifted. Yeah, I'm going to steal it from him and uh it was to steal it from him and uh it was to steal it from him and uh it was basically um if a young guy were to go basically um if a young guy were to go basically um if a young guy were to go and shadow you, what would they be uh and shadow you, what would they be uh and shadow you, what would they be uh surprised about how you spend your time? surprised about how you spend your time? surprised about how you spend your time? Shadow you for like a day or a week, Shadow you for like a day or a week, Shadow you for like a day or a week, yeah. yeah. yeah. It's a quick question, Sean. So, a few It's a quick question, Sean. So, a few It's a quick question, Sean. So, a few things. I think what allows me that I things. I think what allows me that I things. I think what allows me that I think they will be a little surprised of think they will be a little surprised of think they will be a little surprised of how I can change lanes so rapidly. how I can change lanes so rapidly. how I can change lanes so rapidly. So, part of my success and part of my So, part of my success and part of my So, part of my success and part of my failures failures failures uh are around my ADD. So, I can go from uh are around my ADD. So, I can go from uh are around my ADD. So, I can go from five different company conversations five different company conversations five different company conversations with different founders to then figuring with different founders to then figuring with different founders to then figuring out out out the plumbing problem in my house to the the plumbing problem in my house to the the plumbing problem in my house to the new house that I'm trying to buy, but new house that I'm trying to buy, but new house that I'm trying to buy, but getting screwed on with the price. Like, getting screwed on with the price. Like, getting screwed on with the price. Like, I can change lanes and gears very I can change lanes and gears very I can change lanes and gears very rapidly rapidly rapidly and be fully engaged. And but by the end and be fully engaged. And but by the end and be fully engaged. And but by the end of it, I'm I'm exhausted, right? My of it, I'm I'm exhausted, right? My of it, I'm I'm exhausted, right? My brain shut off and then I have to watch brain shut off and then I have to watch brain shut off and then I have to watch TV to unlock to to sort of calm it down. TV to unlock to to sort of calm it down. TV to unlock to to sort of calm it down. So, one of the things they'll find is So, one of the things they'll find is So, one of the things they'll find is how I'm rapidly able to change change how I'm rapidly able to change change how I'm rapidly able to change change lanes. The second thing is lanes. The second thing is lanes. The second thing is even though I personally don't operate even though I personally don't operate even though I personally don't operate at a detailed level personally, at a detailed level personally, at a detailed level personally, they'll be surprised at how detailed I they'll be surprised at how detailed I they'll be surprised at how detailed I get with the brands and the founders I get with the brands and the founders I get with the brands and the founders I partner with because I have great recall partner with because I have great recall partner with because I have great recall of information. And so, they're of information. And so, they're of information. And so, they're surprised. Sometimes the founders think surprised. Sometimes the founders think surprised. Sometimes the founders think I've forgotten something from like a I've forgotten something from like a I've forgotten something from like a month ago when I asked him about it. You month ago when I asked him about it. You month ago when I asked him about it. You can ask Al Rez, he's a classic. We're can ask Al Rez, he's a classic. We're can ask Al Rez, he's a classic. We're like, "Three weeks ago we spoke about like, "Three weeks ago we spoke about like, "Three weeks ago we spoke about this. Where are you on this?" He's like, this. Where are you on this?" He's like, this. Where are you on this?" He's like, "Shit, how did you remember that?" He "Shit, how did you remember that?" He "Shit, how did you remember that?" He thought because I forgot to come back, thought because I forgot to come back, thought because I forgot to come back, he could ignore me. And so, my ability he could ignore me. And so, my ability he could ignore me. And so, my ability to recall to recall to recall and retain info because you have to go and retain info because you have to go and retain info because you have to go deep with founders cuz if you go deep with founders cuz if you go deep with founders cuz if you go shallow, you're not helping them out. shallow, you're not helping them out. shallow, you're not helping them out. It's got to be meaningful stuff that It's got to be meaningful stuff that It's got to be meaningful stuff that helps impact the business. And the third helps impact the business. And the third helps impact the business. And the third thing um thing um thing um is I'm blessed to be living a great is I'm blessed to be living a great is I'm blessed to be living a great lifestyle. I you know, I'm living the lifestyle. I you know, I'm living the lifestyle. I you know, I'm living the American dream, right? I'm an immigrant American dream, right? I'm an immigrant American dream, right? I'm an immigrant that came here and and did well, but I that came here and and did well, but I that came here and and did well, but I also am able to do high low, right? So, also am able to do high low, right? So, also am able to do high low, right? So, from where I eat, I mean, I'm you know, from where I eat, I mean, I'm you know, from where I eat, I mean, I'm you know, the taco stand or what I where I go, I the taco stand or what I where I go, I the taco stand or what I where I go, I go and do the grocery shopping. I'm not go and do the grocery shopping. I'm not go and do the grocery shopping. I'm not sending someone. I'm like I'm there, I'm sending someone. I'm like I'm there, I'm sending someone. I'm like I'm there, I'm picking stuff up cuz I think if you picking stuff up cuz I think if you picking stuff up cuz I think if you don't live in reality, you you you then don't live in reality, you you you then don't live in reality, you you you then can't operate in reality. You kind of can't operate in reality. You kind of can't operate in reality. You kind of end up in this 1% world, which doesn't end up in this 1% world, which doesn't end up in this 1% world, which doesn't help uh help uh help uh when you're dealing with products that when you're dealing with products that when you're dealing with products that deal with deal with deal with all Americans. I was talking to a a all Americans. I was talking to a a all Americans. I was talking to a a buddy of ours who's a a brilliant buddy of ours who's a a brilliant buddy of ours who's a a brilliant marketer. They probably sold a billion marketer. They probably sold a billion marketer. They probably sold a billion dollars of products online, and he I dollars of products online, and he I dollars of products online, and he I opened up my laptop, and he saw that I opened up my laptop, and he saw that I opened up my laptop, and he saw that I had ad blocker on, and he's like, "How had ad blocker on, and he's like, "How had ad blocker on, and he's like, "How could you?" He's like, "You're a could you?" He's like, "You're a could you?" He's like, "You're a marketer. He's like, you have study your marketer. He's like, you have study your marketer. He's like, you have study your craft. Sit through every ad." He He craft. Sit through every ad." He He craft. Sit through every ad." He He logged in and another guy logged into logged in and another guy logged into logged in and another guy logged into his Facebook, and he's on Facebook, he's his Facebook, and he's on Facebook, he's his Facebook, and he's on Facebook, he's a woman. Uh like his profile is his, but a woman. Uh like his profile is his, but a woman. Uh like his profile is his, but he told Facebook, "I'm a woman." cuz he told Facebook, "I'm a woman." cuz he told Facebook, "I'm a woman." cuz he's like, "I want to see what they're he's like, "I want to see what they're he's like, "I want to see what they're marketing to a 40-year-old marketing to a 40-year-old marketing to a 40-year-old [clears throat] woman in America. That's [clears throat] woman in America. That's [clears throat] woman in America. That's That's the prime target. I need to see That's the prime target. I need to see That's the prime target. I need to see who's What's the messaging?" And I was who's What's the messaging?" And I was who's What's the messaging?" And I was like, "There's levels to this game of like, "There's levels to this game of like, "There's levels to this game of intensity and detail." What do you stink intensity and detail." What do you stink intensity and detail." What do you stink at? Where's your weakness in business? I at? Where's your weakness in business? I at? Where's your weakness in business? I think sometimes I may have too much think sometimes I may have too much think sometimes I may have too much belief. You know, when you love a belief. You know, when you love a belief. You know, when you love a product and you like you kind of have product and you like you kind of have product and you like you kind of have faith that blinds you a little bit to faith that blinds you a little bit to faith that blinds you a little bit to the to the whether it's the whether it's the to the whether it's the whether it's the to the whether it's the whether it's the founder you you think is amazing or the founder you you think is amazing or the founder you you think is amazing or whether you love you're not overly whether you love you're not overly whether you love you're not overly focused on the gross margins because focused on the gross margins because focused on the gross margins because you know, I'm a big Field of Dreams you know, I'm a big Field of Dreams you know, I'm a big Field of Dreams guys, build it and they will come. guys, build it and they will come. guys, build it and they will come. But if you don't build it correctly, But if you don't build it correctly, But if you don't build it correctly, I feel the dream won't come. And I feel the dream won't come. And I feel the dream won't come. And sometimes when I love something a lot, I sometimes when I love something a lot, I sometimes when I love something a lot, I end up um ignoring some of the red end up um ignoring some of the red end up um ignoring some of the red flags. flags. flags. So, I think uh passion is a super So, I think uh passion is a super So, I think uh passion is a super important element, important element, important element, but you passion at all costs can be but you passion at all costs can be but you passion at all costs can be dangerous. dangerous. dangerous. Let's leave it with this. Let's leave it with this. Let's leave it with this. Well, we're in the business of stealing Well, we're in the business of stealing Well, we're in the business of stealing questions. Patrick O'Shaughnessy has questions. Patrick O'Shaughnessy has questions. Patrick O'Shaughnessy has this great question he asked the guest this great question he asked the guest this great question he asked the guest at the end of every one of his at the end of every one of his at the end of every one of his Invest Like the Best episodes. He He Invest Like the Best episodes. He He Invest Like the Best episodes. He He asked the guest, he said, "What's the asked the guest, he said, "What's the asked the guest, he said, "What's the kindest thing anyone's ever done for you kindest thing anyone's ever done for you kindest thing anyone's ever done for you in your career?" And I'm just curious, in your career?" And I'm just curious, in your career?" And I'm just curious, what what what comes to mind when I say what what what comes to mind when I say what what what comes to mind when I say that? Like, what's the kindest thing that? Like, what's the kindest thing that? Like, what's the kindest thing anyone's ever done for you? anyone's ever done for you? anyone's ever done for you? Kindest thing anyone's done for me. Kindest thing anyone's done for me. Kindest thing anyone's done for me. I should shout Shout out to a guy. I was I should shout Shout out to a guy. I was I should shout Shout out to a guy. I was probably two of them. I've been adopted probably two of them. I've been adopted probably two of them. I've been adopted a couple of times. One time a couple of times. One time a couple of times. One time was at Coca-Cola when I was about to was at Coca-Cola when I was about to was at Coca-Cola when I was about to leave cuz they gave me a brand called leave cuz they gave me a brand called leave cuz they gave me a brand called Box Wood Beer. You know that? Box Wood Beer. You know that? Box Wood Beer. You know that? Like, remember I told you I have a few Like, remember I told you I have a few Like, remember I told you I have a few mantras? One of my mantras is influence mantras? One of my mantras is influence mantras? One of my mantras is influence the influencer. The other is become a the influencer. The other is become a the influencer. The other is become a part of pop culture. The third one is part of pop culture. The third one is part of pop culture. The third one is live the brand. live the brand. live the brand. Well, I can't live Box Wood Beer. I Well, I can't live Box Wood Beer. I Well, I can't live Box Wood Beer. I don't understand it. I grew up in don't understand it. I grew up in don't understand it. I grew up in Zambia. I bloody hate root beer. So, I Zambia. I bloody hate root beer. So, I Zambia. I bloody hate root beer. So, I was on Sprite. Someone demoted demoted was on Sprite. Someone demoted demoted was on Sprite. Someone demoted demoted me. me. me. Uh and I ran Box. And two guys, and I Uh and I ran Box. And two guys, and I Uh and I ran Box. And two guys, and I was about to leave, and my career would was about to leave, and my career would was about to leave, and my career would have been toast cuz I was going to some have been toast cuz I was going to some have been toast cuz I was going to some travel.com [ __ ] site that ended up travel.com [ __ ] site that ended up travel.com [ __ ] site that ended up folding. And two guys, a guy called Todd folding. And two guys, a guy called Todd folding. And two guys, a guy called Todd Botman and a guy called Daryl Cobbins, Botman and a guy called Daryl Cobbins, Botman and a guy called Daryl Cobbins, kind of kind of kind of heard that I was leaving, saved me. heard that I was leaving, saved me. heard that I was leaving, saved me. Said, "We'll give you something Said, "We'll give you something Said, "We'll give you something different. Don't leave." They put me on different. Don't leave." They put me on different. Don't leave." They put me on Powerade. And that changed the Powerade. And that changed the Powerade. And that changed the trajectory of of my career once. trajectory of of my career once. trajectory of of my career once. And then when I got to Vitamin Water, I And then when I got to Vitamin Water, I And then when I got to Vitamin Water, I was doing great. I took over all the was doing great. I took over all the was doing great. I took over all the marketing, but you know, the founder and marketing, but you know, the founder and marketing, but you know, the founder and I kind of had different visions on how I kind of had different visions on how I kind of had different visions on how to market. Um and [clears throat] I to market. Um and [clears throat] I to market. Um and [clears throat] I don't think he liked my approach, but I don't think he liked my approach, but I don't think he liked my approach, but I was the one who was bringing the heat to was the one who was bringing the heat to was the one who was bringing the heat to the brand. And I think he wanted to fire the brand. And I think he wanted to fire the brand. And I think he wanted to fire me at one point. And so, Mike Repole, he me at one point. And so, Mike Repole, he me at one point. And so, Mike Repole, he was the president of the company, was the president of the company, was the president of the company, changed reporting structure and put me changed reporting structure and put me changed reporting structure and put me under him. So, that cuz he and I got under him. So, that cuz he and I got under him. So, that cuz he and I got along great. He said, "Look, take ego along great. He said, "Look, take ego along great. He said, "Look, take ego aside. Either you want to report to the aside. Either you want to report to the aside. Either you want to report to the CEO and get fired, or you report to me CEO and get fired, or you report to me CEO and get fired, or you report to me and I got you cuz now you're my guy. And and I got you cuz now you're my guy. And and I got you cuz now you're my guy. And so I said I want money, I don't want so I said I want money, I don't want so I said I want money, I don't want ego. So I reported to Mike and I still ego. So I reported to Mike and I still ego. So I reported to Mike and I still run marketing, but had the founder run marketing, but had the founder run marketing, but had the founder clarified me, right? I was an employee clarified me, right? I was an employee clarified me, right? I was an employee at will, at will, at will, that would have also changed the that would have also changed the that would have also changed the trajectory of my career. So trajectory of my career. So trajectory of my career. So >> So this is only the second podcast that >> So this is only the second podcast that >> So this is only the second podcast that you've done, is that right? Yeah, you've done, is that right? Yeah, you've done, is that right? Yeah, correct. Dude, thanks for coming on. correct. Dude, thanks for coming on. correct. Dude, thanks for coming on. Where should people go find you if they Where should people go find you if they Where should people go find you if they want to follow more, you know, want to follow more, you know, want to follow more, you know, get get more of what you're doing? You get get more of what you're doing? You get get more of what you're doing? You know what? It's It's a really good know what? It's It's a really good know what? It's It's a really good question and it's a horrible answer. You question and it's a horrible answer. You question and it's a horrible answer. You actually can't go anywhere yet other actually can't go anywhere yet other actually can't go anywhere yet other than you guys and one of the podcasts. than you guys and one of the podcasts. than you guys and one of the podcasts. >> have social media? Subscribe to this >> have social media? Subscribe to this >> have social media? Subscribe to this podcast if you podcast if you podcast if you >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> if you want to see him again. The last >> if you want to see him again. The last >> if you want to see him again. The last one that was like that was Bryan one that was like that was Bryan one that was like that was Bryan Johnson. He came on and he was just He Johnson. He came on and he was just He Johnson. He came on and he was just He was just hacking on his own body and his was just hacking on his own body and his was just hacking on his own body and his own privacy of his own home and then he own privacy of his own home and then he own privacy of his own home and then he came on this podcast and uh so you know, came on this podcast and uh so you know, came on this podcast and uh so you know, maybe you'll have a Netflix documentary maybe you'll have a Netflix documentary maybe you'll have a Netflix documentary soon. I don't know. soon. I don't know. soon. I don't know. >> I can I can reverse the age by 20 years. >> I can I can reverse the age by 20 years. >> I can I can reverse the age by 20 years. My wife would love that. We My wife would love that. We My wife would love that. We were his first podcast and you know, were his first podcast and you know, were his first podcast and you know, Sean, I don't know if I ever told you Sean, I don't know if I ever told you Sean, I don't know if I ever told you this. He called me last year and he was, this. He called me last year and he was, this. He called me last year and he was, "Hey, I just wanted to thank you because "Hey, I just wanted to thank you because "Hey, I just wanted to thank you because you were the first podcast that I ever you were the first podcast that I ever you were the first podcast that I ever did and you guys asked me a lot of did and you guys asked me a lot of did and you guys asked me a lot of really hard questions that I never even really hard questions that I never even really hard questions that I never even I never even thought about. Uh and so A, I never even thought about. Uh and so A, I never even thought about. Uh and so A, I'm thankful for you for doing that and I'm thankful for you for doing that and I'm thankful for you for doing that and B, when I saw the response, I was like, B, when I saw the response, I was like, B, when I saw the response, I was like, 'Oh, I should do media.' Right. 'Oh, I should do media.' Right. 'Oh, I should do media.' Right. >> And I should go hard. This works. It's >> And I should go hard. This works. It's >> And I should go hard. This works. It's crazy and look what he's done. So you crazy and look what he's done. So you crazy and look what he's done. So you guys are the influence Remember the one guys are the influence Remember the one guys are the influence Remember the one in 10? You are the one in 10 guys. My my in 10? You are the one in 10 guys. My my in 10? You are the one in 10 guys. My my contrarian belief about Bryan Johnson is contrarian belief about Bryan Johnson is contrarian belief about Bryan Johnson is is that Bryan Johnson is the greatest is that Bryan Johnson is the greatest is that Bryan Johnson is the greatest marketer alive right now. marketer alive right now. marketer alive right now. >> Possibly. I think he understands social >> Possibly. I think he understands social >> Possibly. I think he understands social media at a level that media at a level that media at a level that I don't know anybody else does. It's I don't know anybody else does. It's I don't know anybody else does. It's kind of really cool. kind of really cool. kind of really cool. >> but yeah. >> but yeah. >> but yeah. >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Yeah, exactly. All right, thanks for >> Yeah, exactly. All right, thanks for >> Yeah, exactly. All right, thanks for coming on. coming on. coming on. >> You're awesome. >> You're awesome. >> You're awesome. >> Pleasure. Thanks for taking the time. >> Pleasure. Thanks for taking the time. >> Pleasure. Thanks for taking the time. >> All right, that's it. That's the pod.