China Outbuilds America 230-to-1. Saronic Has a Plan

All right, everybody, welcome back to All right, everybody, welcome back to the All In interview series. I am the All In interview series. I am the All In interview series. I am thrilled, really thrilled because thrilled, really thrilled because thrilled, really thrilled because Saronic is a defense company that has Saronic is a defense company that has Saronic is a defense company that has been doing amazing work and we are so been doing amazing work and we are so been doing amazing work and we are so lucky to have the co-founders here on lucky to have the co-founders here on lucky to have the co-founders here on the program. Welcome to the program, the program. Welcome to the program, the program. Welcome to the program, Dino Mavrukas. How are you, sir? Dino Mavrukas. How are you, sir? Dino Mavrukas. How are you, sir? >> Doing well. Thanks for having us. >> Doing well. Thanks for having us. >> Doing well. Thanks for having us. >> And your co-founder here, Vib Alka car. >> And your co-founder here, Vib Alka car. >> And your co-founder here, Vib Alka car. Let's talk a little bit about Saronic. Let's talk a little bit about Saronic. Let's talk a little bit about Saronic. And we're going to get into everything, And we're going to get into everything, And we're going to get into everything, but you were in the news. You were in but you were in the news. You were in but you were in the news. You were in the news because you're making the news because you're making the news because you're making autonomous ships and one of these was autonomous ships and one of these was autonomous ships and one of these was used recently in the Strait of Hormuz, I used recently in the Strait of Hormuz, I used recently in the Strait of Hormuz, I understand. understand. understand. >> I'm going all [singing] in. >> I'm going all [singing] in. >> I'm going all [singing] in. >> [music] >> [music] >> [music] >> As your wealth grows, have you noticed >> As your wealth grows, have you noticed >> As your wealth grows, have you noticed how much more complex things get between how much more complex things get between how much more complex things get between investments, tax strategy, and estate investments, tax strategy, and estate investments, tax strategy, and estate planning? Managing it all is a full-time planning? Managing it all is a full-time planning? Managing it all is a full-time job that you didn't ask for. Creative job that you didn't ask for. Creative job that you didn't ask for. Creative Planning can help. Their coordinated Planning can help. Their coordinated Planning can help. Their coordinated team of investment managers, CPAs, and team of investment managers, CPAs, and team of investment managers, CPAs, and affiliated estate attorneys can do much affiliated estate attorneys can do much affiliated estate attorneys can do much of the heavy lifting so you don't have of the heavy lifting so you don't have of the heavy lifting so you don't have to. Creative Planning, where wealth to. Creative Planning, where wealth to. Creative Planning, where wealth works together. Go to works together. Go to works together. Go to creativeplanning.com/allin. creativeplanning.com/allin. creativeplanning.com/allin. >> I'm going all in. >> I got to start there, Dino. >> I got to start there, Dino. Tell us about the mission. Tell us what Tell us about the mission. Tell us what Tell us about the mission. Tell us what happened. This is the first time an happened. This is the first time an happened. This is the first time an autonomous autonomous autonomous ship has ever rescued ship has ever rescued ship has ever rescued folks in the field and then we'll get folks in the field and then we'll get folks in the field and then we'll get back into your history and everything, back into your history and everything, back into your history and everything, but I think that we got to start off but I think that we got to start off but I think that we got to start off with this story cuz it's incredible. with this story cuz it's incredible. with this story cuz it's incredible. >> It It's just a huge story and I look I >> It It's just a huge story and I look I >> It It's just a huge story and I look I can't get into too many specifics of the can't get into too many specifics of the can't get into too many specifics of the operation and the mission for for operation and the mission for for operation and the mission for for obvious reasons, but obvious reasons, but obvious reasons, but before we get into what it means for the before we get into what it means for the before we get into what it means for the country, what it means for our company, country, what it means for our company, country, what it means for our company, I mean, without saying the most I mean, without saying the most I mean, without saying the most important thing is that those two pilots important thing is that those two pilots important thing is that those two pilots came home safely regardless of how they came home safely regardless of how they came home safely regardless of how they got there, right? Now, what we were able got there, right? Now, what we were able got there, right? Now, what we were able to demonstrate through this partnership to demonstrate through this partnership to demonstrate through this partnership with the Navy like for us it the Navy with the Navy like for us it the Navy with the Navy like for us it the Navy actually trusted us in this moment. actually trusted us in this moment. actually trusted us in this moment. Lives are on the line. We're going to Lives are on the line. We're going to Lives are on the line. We're going to send this autonomous platform to go and send this autonomous platform to go and send this autonomous platform to go and rescue these folks. This is not a rescue these folks. This is not a rescue these folks. This is not a patrol, this is not maritime domain patrol, this is not maritime domain patrol, this is not maritime domain awareness, this is the highest stakes of awareness, this is the highest stakes of awareness, this is the highest stakes of the highest stakes. There's downed the highest stakes. There's downed the highest stakes. There's downed American pilots in the Straits of Hormuz American pilots in the Straits of Hormuz American pilots in the Straits of Hormuz and they're like and they're like and they're like Corsair, which you actually see right Corsair, which you actually see right Corsair, which you actually see right over my right shoulder, which is our over my right shoulder, which is our over my right shoulder, which is our 24-ft fully autonomous speedboat for 24-ft fully autonomous speedboat for 24-ft fully autonomous speedboat for tho- for those that that don't know. Um tho- for those that that don't know. Um tho- for those that that don't know. Um he said we're going to use that to he said we're going to use that to he said we're going to use that to rescue the pilots. And that's that's rescue the pilots. And that's that's rescue the pilots. And that's that's actually like a milestone moment for the actually like a milestone moment for the actually like a milestone moment for the country. And I can tell you I'll tell country. And I can tell you I'll tell country. And I can tell you I'll tell you a personal story firsthand of kind you a personal story firsthand of kind you a personal story firsthand of kind of what this means. But you know this, of what this means. But you know this, of what this means. But you know this, like leaving people behind in the US like leaving people behind in the US like leaving people behind in the US military just it's not a thing. Like the military just it's not a thing. Like the military just it's not a thing. Like the US military does not do it. Right? Like US military does not do it. Right? Like US military does not do it. Right? Like I was in the Navy SEAL teams for 11 I was in the Navy SEAL teams for 11 I was in the Navy SEAL teams for 11 years from 2004 to 2015. years from 2004 to 2015. years from 2004 to 2015. Uh my last 5 years were on SEAL Team 6. Uh my last 5 years were on SEAL Team 6. Uh my last 5 years were on SEAL Team 6. I personally experienced 2005, I personally experienced 2005, I personally experienced 2005, there were four SEALs trapped on a there were four SEALs trapped on a there were four SEALs trapped on a mountainside in Afghanistan, and the mountainside in Afghanistan, and the mountainside in Afghanistan, and the helicopter got shou- got shot down while helicopter got shou- got shot down while helicopter got shou- got shot down while going to rescue them. So what we were going to rescue them. So what we were going to rescue them. So what we were able to prove in this moment was that able to prove in this moment was that able to prove in this moment was that you can go and rescue you can go and rescue you can go and rescue people without putting additional people without putting additional people without putting additional soldiers in harm's way. That's that's soldiers in harm's way. That's that's soldiers in harm's way. That's that's the impact of what this had. That's what the impact of what this had. That's what the impact of what this had. That's what it means for the country. And for our it means for the country. And for our it means for the country. And for our company, it was just an extremely proud company, it was just an extremely proud company, it was just an extremely proud moment where the Navy trusted us in this moment where the Navy trusted us in this moment where the Navy trusted us in this high-stakes environment. high-stakes environment. high-stakes environment. >> Absolutely incredible. And obviously >> Absolutely incredible. And obviously >> Absolutely incredible. And obviously thank you for your service. thank you for your service. thank you for your service. I and I know you can't get into too many I and I know you can't get into too many I and I know you can't get into too many details, but I've been reading all about details, but I've been reading all about details, but I've been reading all about it. it. it. And I got to wonder when when these two And I got to wonder when when these two And I got to wonder when when these two pilots pilots pilots did they know that this was an did they know that this was an did they know that this was an autonomous ship? When the ship comes autonomous ship? When the ship comes autonomous ship? When the ship comes rolling up and they're like somebody rolling up and they're like somebody rolling up and they're like somebody sent them a message, "Hey, you're going sent them a message, "Hey, you're going sent them a message, "Hey, you're going to get picked up by the autonomous ship. to get picked up by the autonomous ship. to get picked up by the autonomous ship. Grab the side of it. Climb on board." Grab the side of it. Climb on board." Grab the side of it. Climb on board." Like what's the protocol for the Like what's the protocol for the Like what's the protocol for the autonomous ship picking up two folks? autonomous ship picking up two folks? autonomous ship picking up two folks? Are they swimming out to it? Like I just Are they swimming out to it? Like I just Are they swimming out to it? Like I just got to get a little color on this before got to get a little color on this before got to get a little color on this before it becomes a movie. it becomes a movie. it becomes a movie. >> I mean it's the first time that it that >> I mean it's the first time that it that >> I mean it's the first time that it that it happened, right? And when a ship when it happened, right? And when a ship when it happened, right? And when a ship when a boat pulls up to you and there's a boat pulls up to you and there's a boat pulls up to you and there's nobody on it, you know, you can very nobody on it, you know, you can very nobody on it, you know, you can very quickly deduce that it's fully that it's quickly deduce that it's fully that it's quickly deduce that it's fully that it's an autonomous boat. And you know, these an autonomous boat. And you know, these an autonomous boat. And you know, these pilots were in the water for I don't pilots were in the water for I don't pilots were in the water for I don't even know how long. They're in a even know how long. They're in a even know how long. They're in a completely contested environment. We're completely contested environment. We're completely contested environment. We're in a conflict with Iran. They're in the in a conflict with Iran. They're in the in a conflict with Iran. They're in the Straits of Hormuz, and we can go through Straits of Hormuz, and we can go through Straits of Hormuz, and we can go through the dynamic there. the dynamic there. the dynamic there. But, they looked at this platform and But, they looked at this platform and But, they looked at this platform and said that that's my way home, right? said that that's my way home, right? said that that's my way home, right? That that's how I get out of here. That that's how I get out of here. That that's how I get out of here. >> I love it. All right, let's step back a >> I love it. All right, let's step back a >> I love it. All right, let's step back a bit here. You're a Navy SEAL. bit here. You're a Navy SEAL. bit here. You're a Navy SEAL. Vib, you've worked in this space for a Vib, you've worked in this space for a Vib, you've worked in this space for a while, while, while, and you previously worked at Anduril, I and you previously worked at Anduril, I and you previously worked at Anduril, I understand. understand. understand. The mission, as I understand it, for the The mission, as I understand it, for the The mission, as I understand it, for the company company company is to greatly increase is to greatly increase is to greatly increase our ability in America to produce ships. our ability in America to produce ships. our ability in America to produce ships. And for people who don't know, the And for people who don't know, the And for people who don't know, the amount of amount of amount of tonnage, the number of ships that we're tonnage, the number of ships that we're tonnage, the number of ships that we're able to make in America and most Western able to make in America and most Western able to make in America and most Western countries is very low. countries is very low. countries is very low. But, there's an adversary But, there's an adversary But, there's an adversary in the Pacific in the Pacific in the Pacific who is able to produce a lot of ships. who is able to produce a lot of ships. who is able to produce a lot of ships. It's known as the Chinese Communist It's known as the Chinese Communist It's known as the Chinese Communist Party. So, maybe from first principles, Party. So, maybe from first principles, Party. So, maybe from first principles, you could just explain what you're you could just explain what you're you could just explain what you're building and why it's important, and building and why it's important, and building and why it's important, and just how insane just how insane just how insane the incompetence of the West in terms of the incompetence of the West in terms of the incompetence of the West in terms of building ships has become. I mean, we building ships has become. I mean, we building ships has become. I mean, we are really bad at making ships right are really bad at making ships right are really bad at making ships right now. Am I correct? now. Am I correct? now. Am I correct? >> We're beyond bad. Let me I'll take a >> We're beyond bad. Let me I'll take a >> We're beyond bad. Let me I'll take a step back and just kind of highlight step back and just kind of highlight step back and just kind of highlight where we're at, and then I'll let Vib go where we're at, and then I'll let Vib go where we're at, and then I'll let Vib go through what we're doing about it, how through what we're doing about it, how through what we're doing about it, how how we're changing that dynamic. But, how we're changing that dynamic. But, how we're changing that dynamic. But, Jason, what you were saying, right? Just Jason, what you were saying, right? Just Jason, what you were saying, right? Just to put it in context, the United States to put it in context, the United States to put it in context, the United States can build 100,000 gross tons of ships can build 100,000 gross tons of ships can build 100,000 gross tons of ships every year. Gross ton is this volumetric every year. Gross ton is this volumetric every year. Gross ton is this volumetric measure of ship. So, if you build, you measure of ship. So, if you build, you measure of ship. So, if you build, you know, a 200-ft ship, that's different know, a 200-ft ship, that's different know, a 200-ft ship, that's different than an 800-ft ship, but let's compare than an 800-ft ship, but let's compare than an 800-ft ship, but let's compare apples to apples. 100,000 gross tons. apples to apples. 100,000 gross tons. apples to apples. 100,000 gross tons. The Chinese, which you referencing, can The Chinese, which you referencing, can The Chinese, which you referencing, can build 23 million build 23 million build 23 million gross tons. So, they can outbuild the US gross tons. So, they can outbuild the US gross tons. So, they can outbuild the US 230 to 1. And it wasn't always the case, 230 to 1. And it wasn't always the case, 230 to 1. And it wasn't always the case, right? right? right? 30 years ago, the Chinese didn't have 30 years ago, the Chinese didn't have 30 years ago, the Chinese didn't have this capability. They had 5% of the this capability. They had 5% of the this capability. They had 5% of the world's shipbuilding capacity. world's shipbuilding capacity. world's shipbuilding capacity. Today, they have 57% Today, they have 57% Today, they have 57% of the world's shipbuilding capacity. of the world's shipbuilding capacity. of the world's shipbuilding capacity. And actually, that problem's getting And actually, that problem's getting And actually, that problem's getting worse because worse because worse because the the the the Communist Party is just the Communist Party is just the Communist Party is just constantly subsidizing the entire constantly subsidizing the entire constantly subsidizing the entire industry. So, they're undercutting the industry. So, they're undercutting the industry. So, they're undercutting the commercial market on price. They're not commercial market on price. They're not commercial market on price. They're not just subsidizing the direct cost to just subsidizing the direct cost to just subsidizing the direct cost to build. They're subsidizing raw material build. They're subsidizing raw material build. They're subsidizing raw material and labor costs. So, the ship built in and labor costs. So, the ship built in and labor costs. So, the ship built in the United States is actually five to the United States is actually five to the United States is actually five to six times the cost of that same ship six times the cost of that same ship six times the cost of that same ship built in China. And so, they keep built in China. And so, they keep built in China. And so, they keep getting more and more orders. So, that getting more and more orders. So, that getting more and more orders. So, that number of 57% is just going up. number of 57% is just going up. number of 57% is just going up. >> How did they get that capability? Is >> How did they get that capability? Is >> How did they get that capability? Is that because as a manufacturer to the that because as a manufacturer to the that because as a manufacturer to the world, they needed to ship out products? world, they needed to ship out products? world, they needed to ship out products? So, they did this in a commercial way So, they did this in a commercial way So, they did this in a commercial way first, or is this always very first, or is this always very first, or is this always very intentionally, we need to own the South intentionally, we need to own the South intentionally, we need to own the South Pacific? Pacific? Pacific? >> around the commercial market, and then >> around the commercial market, and then >> around the commercial market, and then I'll talk about I want to talk about the I'll talk about I want to talk about the I'll talk about I want to talk about the status of our Navy. Like, where the status of our Navy. Like, where the status of our Navy. Like, where the naval fleet is today, what that means, naval fleet is today, what that means, naval fleet is today, what that means, and then where the Chinese Navy is and and then where the Chinese Navy is and and then where the Chinese Navy is and where that's going. Because again, 30 where that's going. Because again, 30 where that's going. Because again, 30 years ago, the Chinese Navy was a years ago, the Chinese Navy was a years ago, the Chinese Navy was a littoral backwater Navy. Today, they littoral backwater Navy. Today, they littoral backwater Navy. Today, they have nuclear submarines, aircraft have nuclear submarines, aircraft have nuclear submarines, aircraft carriers, and hypersonic missiles. So, carriers, and hypersonic missiles. So, carriers, and hypersonic missiles. So, there's a massive massive change over there's a massive massive change over there's a massive massive change over the last 30 years. And what's happened the last 30 years. And what's happened the last 30 years. And what's happened in the US shipbuilding industry is in the US shipbuilding industry is in the US shipbuilding industry is completely declined. completely declined. completely declined. So, the US naval fleet has 296 ships So, the US naval fleet has 296 ships So, the US naval fleet has 296 ships today. There's a congressional mandate, today. There's a congressional mandate, today. There's a congressional mandate, statutory minimum statutory minimum statutory minimum of 355 ships that was set by Congress in of 355 ships that was set by Congress in of 355 ships that was set by Congress in 2018. That was 8 years ago. Last year, 2018. That was 8 years ago. Last year, 2018. That was 8 years ago. Last year, we built nine ships, but we retired 19 we built nine ships, but we retired 19 we built nine ships, but we retired 19 naval vessels. So, we're We're in the naval vessels. So, we're We're in the naval vessels. So, we're We're in the wrong the completely wrong direction. wrong the completely wrong direction. wrong the completely wrong direction. The Chinese delivered somewhere in the The Chinese delivered somewhere in the The Chinese delivered somewhere in the ballpark of 30 ships. Their fleet size ballpark of 30 ships. Their fleet size ballpark of 30 ships. Their fleet size is around 370. They'll be at 450 before is around 370. They'll be at 450 before is around 370. They'll be at 450 before you know it. But the commercial market you know it. But the commercial market you know it. But the commercial market is where that discrepancy lies even is where that discrepancy lies even is where that discrepancy lies even larger, right? They delivered over 1,000 larger, right? They delivered over 1,000 larger, right? They delivered over 1,000 commercial ships last year. commercial ships last year. commercial ships last year. The United States built five. The United States built five. The United States built five. >> Five. 1 2 3 4 5. >> Five. 1 2 3 4 5. >> Five. 1 2 3 4 5. >> 1 2 3 4 5. One hand. >> 1 2 3 4 5. One hand. >> 1 2 3 4 5. One hand. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> So, if a conflict actually kicks off, >> So, if a conflict actually kicks off, >> So, if a conflict actually kicks off, and we saw this in the US in World War and we saw this in the US in World War and we saw this in the US in World War II, where we had the production II, where we had the production II, where we had the production capacity, where we're building thousands capacity, where we're building thousands capacity, where we're building thousands of vessels every year. If a conflict of vessels every year. If a conflict of vessels every year. If a conflict kicks off, that commercial capacity kicks off, that commercial capacity kicks off, that commercial capacity isn't going to go to building cargo isn't going to go to building cargo isn't going to go to building cargo containers anymore. It's all going to containers anymore. It's all going to containers anymore. It's all going to flip to defense capacity, and it's going flip to defense capacity, and it's going flip to defense capacity, and it's going to be building for what the Chinese to be building for what the Chinese to be building for what the Chinese Communist Party needs to to win a Communist Party needs to to win a Communist Party needs to to win a conflict. And that's what we have to be conflict. And that's what we have to be conflict. And that's what we have to be building towards. That's what we're building towards. That's what we're building towards. That's what we're doing at Saronic. That's why we're doing at Saronic. That's why we're doing at Saronic. That's why we're thinking, "Okay, how do we build mass? thinking, "Okay, how do we build mass? thinking, "Okay, how do we build mass? How do we build scale in whatever it is How do we build scale in whatever it is How do we build scale in whatever it is that we do?" that we do?" that we do?" >> And so, how do you do it, Vib? I would >> And so, how do you do it, Vib? I would >> And so, how do you do it, Vib? I would think, and listen, I'm a neophyte here, think, and listen, I'm a neophyte here, think, and listen, I'm a neophyte here, but if these are autonomous ships, well, but if these are autonomous ships, well, but if these are autonomous ships, well, you can remove things. Like, you don't you can remove things. Like, you don't you can remove things. Like, you don't need beds. You don't need a commissary, need beds. You don't need a commissary, need beds. You don't need a commissary, and you don't need latrines. And I don't and you don't need latrines. And I don't and you don't need latrines. And I don't know what percentage of a Corsair or know what percentage of a Corsair or know what percentage of a Corsair or battleship are battleship are battleship are there to there to there to support humans on the ship. But I got to support humans on the ship. But I got to support humans on the ship. But I got to think it's half the mass of it is to is think it's half the mass of it is to is think it's half the mass of it is to is to keep humans on it. Am I directionally to keep humans on it. Am I directionally to keep humans on it. Am I directionally correct? correct? correct? >> I think half is a little half is a >> I think half is a little half is a >> I think half is a little half is a little excessive, but little excessive, but little excessive, but >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> there's a significant percentage of the >> there's a significant percentage of the >> there's a significant percentage of the components, the cost, the labor that components, the cost, the labor that components, the cost, the labor that actually goes into catering to human actually goes into catering to human actually goes into catering to human beings on board. Um I would say at a beings on board. Um I would say at a beings on board. Um I would say at a high level, you know, you're really high level, you know, you're really high level, you know, you're really reducing the complexity of the entire reducing the complexity of the entire reducing the complexity of the entire product, right? Um you don't need to product, right? Um you don't need to product, right? Um you don't need to worry about a separate electrical system worry about a separate electrical system worry about a separate electrical system for humans. You don't need to worry for humans. You don't need to worry for humans. You don't need to worry about, as we mentioned, doors, about, as we mentioned, doors, about, as we mentioned, doors, bathrooms, stairs, etc. Um and then at bathrooms, stairs, etc. Um and then at bathrooms, stairs, etc. Um and then at the end of the day, you can actually the end of the day, you can actually the end of the day, you can actually start to end-to-end optimize a lot of start to end-to-end optimize a lot of start to end-to-end optimize a lot of different things. So, even if you look different things. So, even if you look different things. So, even if you look at Corsair, for example, you know, if at Corsair, for example, you know, if at Corsair, for example, you know, if you were to buy a commercial 24-foot you were to buy a commercial 24-foot you were to buy a commercial 24-foot boat, it's unlikely to go 1,000 nautical boat, it's unlikely to go 1,000 nautical boat, it's unlikely to go 1,000 nautical miles. miles. miles. Um it's also unlikely to drive and have Um it's also unlikely to drive and have Um it's also unlikely to drive and have the control authority the control authority the control authority of the boat that we built here of the boat that we built here of the boat that we built here because you don't have to again you because you don't have to again you because you don't have to again you don't have to worry about, you know, a don't have to worry about, you know, a don't have to worry about, you know, a person feeling, person feeling, person feeling, you know, you know, taking shots in the you know, you know, taking shots in the you know, you know, taking shots in the middle of the ocean. Yeah. middle of the ocean. Yeah. middle of the ocean. Yeah. Um and so you can actually optimize Um and so you can actually optimize Um and so you can actually optimize across a bunch of different areas. Naval across a bunch of different areas. Naval across a bunch of different areas. Naval architecture, the speed, range, and architecture, the speed, range, and architecture, the speed, range, and payload of the craft itself, and then payload of the craft itself, and then payload of the craft itself, and then again reduce a lot of the complexity again reduce a lot of the complexity again reduce a lot of the complexity where you're removing subsystems that where you're removing subsystems that where you're removing subsystems that are meant for humans. are meant for humans. are meant for humans. >> Yeah, and the Corsair, which is my >> Yeah, and the Corsair, which is my >> Yeah, and the Corsair, which is my favorite ship just based on the name, favorite ship just based on the name, favorite ship just based on the name, I believe from my research this may it I believe from my research this may it I believe from my research this may it was originally meant like a pirate ship was originally meant like a pirate ship was originally meant like a pirate ship or a privateering ship, but it's or a privateering ship, but it's or a privateering ship, but it's is it now standard lingo that that's a is it now standard lingo that that's a is it now standard lingo that that's a 24-foot boat and and has a certain 24-foot boat and and has a certain 24-foot boat and and has a certain profile, do you know? Is that Is that profile, do you know? Is that Is that profile, do you know? Is that Is that how these designations come about, the how these designations come about, the how these designations come about, the names of these ships? names of these ships? names of these ships? >> I mean, I wouldn't say that Corsair is >> I mean, I wouldn't say that Corsair is >> I mean, I wouldn't say that Corsair is now universal 24-foot autonomous surface now universal 24-foot autonomous surface now universal 24-foot autonomous surface vessel. It's a name of our product lines vessel. It's a name of our product lines vessel. It's a name of our product lines and we chose it very purposefully and we and we chose it very purposefully and we and we chose it very purposefully and we chose all our names purposefully. Even chose all our names purposefully. Even chose all our names purposefully. Even the name of the company, I mean, we were the name of the company, I mean, we were the name of the company, I mean, we were talking about, you know, our Greek talking about, you know, our Greek talking about, you know, our Greek heritage before the show and where that heritage before the show and where that heritage before the show and where that came from. You know, the Saronic Gulf is came from. You know, the Saronic Gulf is came from. You know, the Saronic Gulf is a Gulf off the coast of Athens where the a Gulf off the coast of Athens where the a Gulf off the coast of Athens where the Battle of Salamis happened. It's one of Battle of Salamis happened. It's one of Battle of Salamis happened. It's one of the most famous naval battles in the most famous naval battles in the most famous naval battles in history. It came after the Battle of history. It came after the Battle of history. It came after the Battle of Thermopylae or the famous stand of the Thermopylae or the famous stand of the Thermopylae or the famous stand of the spar 300 Spartans and it was the naval spar 300 Spartans and it was the naval spar 300 Spartans and it was the naval battle between battle between battle between the Greeks and the Persians where the the Greeks and the Persians where the the Greeks and the Persians where the Greeks were wildly unmatched. The Greeks were wildly unmatched. The Greeks were wildly unmatched. The Persians had much, much larger ships. Persians had much, much larger ships. Persians had much, much larger ships. They had a much larger fleet and the They had a much larger fleet and the They had a much larger fleet and the Greeks were able to lure them into this Greeks were able to lure them into this Greeks were able to lure them into this narrow strait and used smaller, more narrow strait and used smaller, more narrow strait and used smaller, more maneuverable products to ultimately maneuverable products to ultimately maneuverable products to ultimately defeat the Persians. defeat the Persians. defeat the Persians. >> Now, cost is part of this in terms of >> Now, cost is part of this in terms of >> Now, cost is part of this in terms of these ships in the field and the number these ships in the field and the number these ships in the field and the number of ships. My understanding of our of ships. My understanding of our of ships. My understanding of our contemporary China is that they don't contemporary China is that they don't contemporary China is that they don't build a lot of big ships. They build a build a lot of big ships. They build a build a lot of big ships. They build a lot of ships. So, they've got a lot of lot of ships. So, they've got a lot of lot of ships. So, they've got a lot of smaller and and very varied number of smaller and and very varied number of smaller and and very varied number of ships, if I'm correct there, then the ships, if I'm correct there, then the ships, if I'm correct there, then the cost becomes the issue because building cost becomes the issue because building cost becomes the issue because building a bunch of aircraft carriers, I keep a bunch of aircraft carriers, I keep a bunch of aircraft carriers, I keep hearing that supersonics are going to hearing that supersonics are going to hearing that supersonics are going to take out all these take out all these take out all these uh aircraft carriers in the first 15 uh aircraft carriers in the first 15 uh aircraft carriers in the first 15 minutes. Viv, is is that true what we minutes. Viv, is is that true what we minutes. Viv, is is that true what we hear that, "Hey, we need smaller ships, hear that, "Hey, we need smaller ships, hear that, "Hey, we need smaller ships, faster ships?" And what is the cost of faster ships?" And what is the cost of faster ships?" And what is the cost of something like, you know, the Corsair something like, you know, the Corsair something like, you know, the Corsair that you used on this incredible that you used on this incredible that you used on this incredible mission? mission? mission? >> Yeah, I would say, you know, at a high >> Yeah, I would say, you know, at a high >> Yeah, I would say, you know, at a high level, the goal is mass, right? Um like level, the goal is mass, right? Um like level, the goal is mass, right? Um like large-scale attritable mass. large-scale attritable mass. large-scale attritable mass. And yeah, if if an aircraft carrier And yeah, if if an aircraft carrier And yeah, if if an aircraft carrier takes 10 years to build and 13 billion takes 10 years to build and 13 billion takes 10 years to build and 13 billion dollars, like you're not really dollars, like you're not really dollars, like you're not really achieving that. Um I think there's achieving that. Um I think there's achieving that. Um I think there's always going to be always going to be always going to be like kind of a role and responsibility like kind of a role and responsibility like kind of a role and responsibility for for a craft like that. Um but for for a craft like that. Um but for for a craft like that. Um but ultimately, you're right. Like if you're ultimately, you're right. Like if you're ultimately, you're right. Like if you're big and and, you know, very obvious to big and and, you know, very obvious to big and and, you know, very obvious to find and you can find you from space, find and you can find you from space, find and you can find you from space, etc., um you know, it's it's a real etc., um you know, it's it's a real etc., um you know, it's it's a real risk. When you reduce, you know, the the risk. When you reduce, you know, the the risk. When you reduce, you know, the the overall cost of like just doing things overall cost of like just doing things overall cost of like just doing things in the ocean, right? Like that's in the ocean, right? Like that's in the ocean, right? Like that's ultimately where the autonomous piece ultimately where the autonomous piece ultimately where the autonomous piece comes in. Um you can deploy at scale. comes in. Um you can deploy at scale. comes in. Um you can deploy at scale. You can monitor a large a larger body of You can monitor a large a larger body of You can monitor a large a larger body of water with less people. Um and water with less people. Um and water with less people. Um and ultimately, what you're what you're ultimately, what you're what you're ultimately, what you're what you're really getting to is removing people really getting to is removing people really getting to is removing people from harm's way, right? Um so, what when from harm's way, right? Um so, what when from harm's way, right? Um so, what when we think about designing and kind of we think about designing and kind of we think about designing and kind of thinking through the price points of thinking through the price points of thinking through the price points of these things, these things, these things, the comparison to mancraft isn't really the comparison to mancraft isn't really the comparison to mancraft isn't really um um um necessarily even comparable as you get necessarily even comparable as you get necessarily even comparable as you get into larger ships, right? Um into larger ships, right? Um into larger ships, right? Um for for us, it's really a question of for for us, it's really a question of for for us, it's really a question of like what is the cost that you would like what is the cost that you would like what is the cost that you would typically have to use humans for and how typically have to use humans for and how typically have to use humans for and how much is that actually being reduced by much is that actually being reduced by much is that actually being reduced by having a large autonomous fleet? having a large autonomous fleet? having a large autonomous fleet? >> Corsair's a million bucks or something, >> Corsair's a million bucks or something, >> Corsair's a million bucks or something, do you know? The the Corsair costs about do you know? The the Corsair costs about do you know? The the Corsair costs about a million? a million? a million? >> Yeah, I want to go back to we'll get >> Yeah, I want to go back to we'll get >> Yeah, I want to go back to we'll get that. I want to go back to one thing you that. I want to go back to one thing you that. I want to go back to one thing you said earlier and it's like China's said earlier and it's like China's said earlier and it's like China's building both very large ships and a lot building both very large ships and a lot building both very large ships and a lot of ships. They're They're doing it all, of ships. They're They're doing it all, of ships. They're They're doing it all, right? And when we think about, okay, right? And when we think about, okay, right? And when we think about, okay, how do you actually change the paradigm how do you actually change the paradigm how do you actually change the paradigm for the US Navy? It's for the US Navy? It's for the US Navy? It's let's actually boil it down to unit let's actually boil it down to unit let's actually boil it down to unit economics. Let's think about this like a economics. Let's think about this like a economics. Let's think about this like a commercial company. How do you that commercial company. How do you that commercial company. How do you that mentioned like payloads? What are you mentioned like payloads? What are you mentioned like payloads? What are you actually moving on the ocean? One of the actually moving on the ocean? One of the actually moving on the ocean? One of the most important metrics is VLS tubes. So most important metrics is VLS tubes. So most important metrics is VLS tubes. So vertical launch systems. It's basically vertical launch systems. It's basically vertical launch systems. It's basically how many big Tomahawk missiles can you how many big Tomahawk missiles can you how many big Tomahawk missiles can you carry on a ship? It's how much firepower carry on a ship? It's how much firepower carry on a ship? It's how much firepower are you fielding? So let's use an are you fielding? So let's use an are you fielding? So let's use an example of that, right? A destroyer, example of that, right? A destroyer, example of that, right? A destroyer, naval destroyer costs about $3 billion. naval destroyer costs about $3 billion. naval destroyer costs about $3 billion. >> 3 billion? >> 3 billion? >> 3 billion? >> 3 billion. And I'm not even getting into >> 3 billion. And I'm not even getting into >> 3 billion. And I'm not even getting into the sustainment and maintenance costs the sustainment and maintenance costs the sustainment and maintenance costs over the life cycle of the destroyer. over the life cycle of the destroyer. over the life cycle of the destroyer. I'm just talking about what it costs to I'm just talking about what it costs to I'm just talking about what it costs to buy. If we do that, it's 10 10 billion buy. If we do that, it's 10 10 billion buy. If we do that, it's 10 10 billion over 30 40 years. over 30 40 years. over 30 40 years. $3 billion, 6 to 8 years to make. You $3 billion, 6 to 8 years to make. You $3 billion, 6 to 8 years to make. You carry you can field about 96 VLS tubes. carry you can field about 96 VLS tubes. carry you can field about 96 VLS tubes. So I'm going to round up. I'm going to So I'm going to round up. I'm going to So I'm going to round up. I'm going to make that 100 for easy math. make that 100 for easy math. make that 100 for easy math. So on average, you're fielding somewhere So on average, you're fielding somewhere So on average, you're fielding somewhere between 10 to 15 VLS tubes per year at a between 10 to 15 VLS tubes per year at a between 10 to 15 VLS tubes per year at a cost of 30 million per tube. cost of 30 million per tube. cost of 30 million per tube. Marauder, Marauder, Marauder, I won't give you the exact price or I won't give you the exact price or I won't give you the exact price or cost, but can reduce that cost by a cost, but can reduce that cost by a cost, but can reduce that cost by a significant amount, but we're building significant amount, but we're building significant amount, but we're building 20 Marauders for we're going to be 20 Marauders for we're going to be 20 Marauders for we're going to be building 20 Marauders per year at our building 20 Marauders per year at our building 20 Marauders per year at our shipyard in Louisiana. shipyard in Louisiana. shipyard in Louisiana. Right? So now you can field we can carry Right? So now you can field we can carry Right? So now you can field we can carry the equivalent of 16 VLS tubes on the the equivalent of 16 VLS tubes on the the equivalent of 16 VLS tubes on the back of that 180 ft fully autonomous back of that 180 ft fully autonomous back of that 180 ft fully autonomous ship. So now you can field 320 ship. So now you can field 320 ship. So now you can field 320 VLS tubes per year as opposed to 15, and VLS tubes per year as opposed to 15, and VLS tubes per year as opposed to 15, and you could do it at a fraction of the you could do it at a fraction of the you could do it at a fraction of the cost. This is how you actually save the cost. This is how you actually save the cost. This is how you actually save the taxpayers hundreds of billions of taxpayers hundreds of billions of taxpayers hundreds of billions of dollars, and you get more capability dollars, and you get more capability dollars, and you get more capability into the field faster. into the field faster. into the field faster. >> I mean, that's just extraordinary >> I mean, that's just extraordinary >> I mean, that's just extraordinary thinking about it. What do you lose by thinking about it. What do you lose by thinking about it. What do you lose by not having humans on it? You know, are not having humans on it? You know, are not having humans on it? You know, are we going to be faced with a moment in we going to be faced with a moment in we going to be faced with a moment in time where these are kind of like time where these are kind of like time where these are kind of like drones, you know, where there's no drones, you know, where there's no drones, you know, where there's no pilots. They're just pilots in a pilots. They're just pilots in a pilots. They're just pilots in a shipping container dropped somewhere shipping container dropped somewhere shipping container dropped somewhere either, you know, in the middle of either, you know, in the middle of either, you know, in the middle of America and doing it remote like we've America and doing it remote like we've America and doing it remote like we've done. And is that the future of warfare done. And is that the future of warfare done. And is that the future of warfare with these ships or with these ships or with these ships or and what do you lose when you don't have and what do you lose when you don't have and what do you lose when you don't have a team there on the boat? And what is a team there on the boat? And what is a team there on the boat? And what is the criticism valid or invalid that the criticism valid or invalid that the criticism valid or invalid that people have of unmanned ships? people have of unmanned ships? people have of unmanned ships? >> Well, >> Well, >> Well, I'm going to let him talk about the way I'm going to let him talk about the way I'm going to let him talk about the way that we're using software because I that we're using software because I that we're using software because I think the the criticism to your question think the the criticism to your question think the the criticism to your question is, well, what happens if we're in the is, well, what happens if we're in the is, well, what happens if we're in the middle of the ocean and the ship breaks middle of the ocean and the ship breaks middle of the ocean and the ship breaks down, who's going to fix it? It's not down, who's going to fix it? It's not down, who's going to fix it? It's not It's not that we don't need this It's not that we don't need this It's not that we don't need this technology. It's folks that aren't used technology. It's folks that aren't used technology. It's folks that aren't used to technology saying, oh, how's the to technology saying, oh, how's the to technology saying, oh, how's the technology actually going to work? And technology actually going to work? And technology actually going to work? And that's what we're proving out every that's what we're proving out every that's what we're proving out every single day. To your point of like, what single day. To your point of like, what single day. To your point of like, what do you lose by not having people on do you lose by not having people on do you lose by not having people on them? Look, it all it all boils down to them? Look, it all it all boils down to them? Look, it all it all boils down to the mission. the mission. the mission. Right? And this is why we partner so Right? And this is why we partner so Right? And this is why we partner so closely with the Navy. This is why we closely with the Navy. This is why we closely with the Navy. This is why we work with actual operators is like, what work with actual operators is like, what work with actual operators is like, what are you using? What are you delivering? are you using? What are you delivering? are you using? What are you delivering? If the mission is long-range fires, If the mission is long-range fires, If the mission is long-range fires, we're packing a bunch of VLS tubes on we're packing a bunch of VLS tubes on we're packing a bunch of VLS tubes on the back of Marauder. You actually don't the back of Marauder. You actually don't the back of Marauder. You actually don't lose anything. Right? You're just lose anything. Right? You're just lose anything. Right? You're just delivering those capabilities into the delivering those capabilities into the delivering those capabilities into the field while keeping people out of harm's field while keeping people out of harm's field while keeping people out of harm's way. And that's a very, very important way. And that's a very, very important way. And that's a very, very important part of the equation. part of the equation. part of the equation. But if our ships, let's be clear, like But if our ships, let's be clear, like But if our ships, let's be clear, like if our boats and ships aren't if our boats and ships aren't if our boats and ships aren't accomplishing the mission, then they're accomplishing the mission, then they're accomplishing the mission, then they're not relevant. They're not going to be not relevant. They're not going to be not relevant. They're not going to be used in the first place. And there is used in the first place. And there is used in the first place. And there is going to be some mix. I don't know what going to be some mix. I don't know what going to be some mix. I don't know what that mix is. I don't think anybody that mix is. I don't think anybody that mix is. I don't think anybody really knows what that mix is of manned really knows what that mix is of manned really knows what that mix is of manned and unmanned ships. So, what you're and unmanned ships. So, what you're and unmanned ships. So, what you're going to see in the Navy is like a going to see in the Navy is like a going to see in the Navy is like a hybrid Navy. So, the things that you're hybrid Navy. So, the things that you're hybrid Navy. So, the things that you're missing from having people on the ships missing from having people on the ships missing from having people on the ships forward deployed decision makers in the forward deployed decision makers in the forward deployed decision makers in the environment, you can actually have out environment, you can actually have out environment, you can actually have out there on manned ships, but you're using there on manned ships, but you're using there on manned ships, but you're using unmanned ships to put into combat areas unmanned ships to put into combat areas unmanned ships to put into combat areas and conflict areas to keep those people and conflict areas to keep those people and conflict areas to keep those people very safe. very safe. very safe. >> Fab, take us through the production of >> Fab, take us through the production of >> Fab, take us through the production of these. How do you achieve speed at it? these. How do you achieve speed at it? these. How do you achieve speed at it? You know, uh friend of the pod Elon Musk You know, uh friend of the pod Elon Musk You know, uh friend of the pod Elon Musk with the Teslas, over time, he with the Teslas, over time, he with the Teslas, over time, he eventually eventually eventually built the full stack. In the beginning, built the full stack. In the beginning, built the full stack. In the beginning, if you had a Tesla, you would look at if you had a Tesla, you would look at if you had a Tesla, you would look at the the shifter and you'd be like, "Hey, the the shifter and you'd be like, "Hey, the the shifter and you'd be like, "Hey, that looks like my Mercedes." And that's that looks like my Mercedes." And that's that looks like my Mercedes." And that's because they had their steering column because they had their steering column because they had their steering column from Mercedes, one of the early from Mercedes, one of the early from Mercedes, one of the early investors. The HVAC was from somebody investors. The HVAC was from somebody investors. The HVAC was from somebody else. But eventually, else. But eventually, else. But eventually, he had materials coming in one side of he had materials coming in one side of he had materials coming in one side of the factory, cars coming out the other, the factory, cars coming out the other, the factory, cars coming out the other, and he made every single thing in that and he made every single thing in that and he made every single thing in that car. He was now no longer dependent on car. He was now no longer dependent on car. He was now no longer dependent on any third-party manufacturers or a any third-party manufacturers or a any third-party manufacturers or a supply chain, you know, and famously the supply chain, you know, and famously the supply chain, you know, and famously the HVAC, I think, in the Model 3 and Y when HVAC, I think, in the Model 3 and Y when HVAC, I think, in the Model 3 and Y when it came out, reduced massively the drain it came out, reduced massively the drain it came out, reduced massively the drain on the battery, right? So, it's on the battery, right? So, it's on the battery, right? So, it's purpose-built for that mission. So, I'm purpose-built for that mission. So, I'm purpose-built for that mission. So, I'm assuming you're doing that from first assuming you're doing that from first assuming you're doing that from first principles, principles, principles, but what what's the secret to this rapid but what what's the secret to this rapid but what what's the secret to this rapid production and lower-cost production? production and lower-cost production? production and lower-cost production? >> Yeah, listen, I think there's, you know, >> Yeah, listen, I think there's, you know, >> Yeah, listen, I think there's, you know, within the shipbuilding industry at within the shipbuilding industry at within the shipbuilding industry at large, there's a bunch of different large, there's a bunch of different large, there's a bunch of different challenges of of why the production challenges of of why the production challenges of of why the production isn't as high as it should be. And one isn't as high as it should be. And one isn't as high as it should be. And one of those core reasons, and the Navy's of those core reasons, and the Navy's of those core reasons, and the Navy's talked about this extensively, is is talked about this extensively, is is talked about this extensively, is is investing in the supply chain. Right? Um investing in the supply chain. Right? Um investing in the supply chain. Right? Um when you don't when you only build five when you don't when you only build five when you don't when you only build five commercial ships a year, your genset commercial ships a year, your genset commercial ships a year, your genset manufacturers, the marine engine manufacturers, the marine engine manufacturers, the marine engine manufacturers, also don't have to manufacturers, also don't have to manufacturers, also don't have to produce at a very high rate. So, one of produce at a very high rate. So, one of produce at a very high rate. So, one of the things that we get the luxury of the things that we get the luxury of the things that we get the luxury of doing, um by being vertically doing, um by being vertically doing, um by being vertically integrated, is that we get to work with integrated, is that we get to work with integrated, is that we get to work with these manufacturers directly, do these manufacturers directly, do these manufacturers directly, do non-recurring engineering work, invest non-recurring engineering work, invest non-recurring engineering work, invest in really digitizing a lot of the in really digitizing a lot of the in really digitizing a lot of the components that historically have been components that historically have been components that historically have been very analog, right? Um you know, you very analog, right? Um you know, you very analog, right? Um you know, you asked earlier like, "What do people What asked earlier like, "What do people What asked earlier like, "What do people What do the people do on the ships? Like, do the people do on the ships? Like, do the people do on the ships? Like, what are they going to do if if the what are they going to do if if the what are they going to do if if the ships are autonomous?" Well, when you ships are autonomous?" Well, when you ships are autonomous?" Well, when you think about, you know, Dino mentioned think about, you know, Dino mentioned think about, you know, Dino mentioned the life cycle of these ships are 30 the life cycle of these ships are 30 the life cycle of these ships are 30 years, you think about a ship that was years, you think about a ship that was years, you think about a ship that was built 30 years ago, you know, you have built 30 years ago, you know, you have built 30 years ago, you know, you have people that are doing extremely manual people that are doing extremely manual people that are doing extremely manual things in the engine room that today things in the engine room that today things in the engine room that today should be extremely trivial to automate should be extremely trivial to automate should be extremely trivial to automate through software. through software. through software. Um and so, a lot of that work actually Um and so, a lot of that work actually Um and so, a lot of that work actually gets completely absorbed by the software gets completely absorbed by the software gets completely absorbed by the software stack, and so you don't have to worry stack, and so you don't have to worry stack, and so you don't have to worry about it. Um and as we choose about it. Um and as we choose about it. Um and as we choose components, we invest in the supply components, we invest in the supply components, we invest in the supply chain, we invest invest in the chain, we invest invest in the chain, we invest invest in the industrial base, we actually help bring industrial base, we actually help bring industrial base, we actually help bring all of these analog components that for all of these analog components that for all of these analog components that for a long time were, you know, meant to be a long time were, you know, meant to be a long time were, you know, meant to be operated by humans, we give them operated by humans, we give them operated by humans, we give them software APIs, we make sure that they software APIs, we make sure that they software APIs, we make sure that they can be controlled by, you know, MCPs or can be controlled by, you know, MCPs or can be controlled by, you know, MCPs or software stack somewhere else and can software stack somewhere else and can software stack somewhere else and can be, you know, remotely accessed and be, you know, remotely accessed and be, you know, remotely accessed and whatnot. Um whatnot. Um whatnot. Um >> So, the complexity is going to go down >> So, the complexity is going to go down >> So, the complexity is going to go down massively when you're building one of massively when you're building one of massively when you're building one of these, yeah? these, yeah? these, yeah? >> Absolutely, yeah. And and you know, >> Absolutely, yeah. And and you know, >> Absolutely, yeah. And and you know, frankly, I don't think that the person frankly, I don't think that the person frankly, I don't think that the person who's sitting in the engine room is who's sitting in the engine room is who's sitting in the engine room is super thrilled about it anyway. super thrilled about it anyway. super thrilled about it anyway. >> No, not a great day. >> No, not a great day. >> No, not a great day. >> You're actually changing the um you're >> You're actually changing the um you're >> You're actually changing the um you're democratizing the decision-making, democratizing the decision-making, democratizing the decision-making, right? Like now there's going to be you right? Like now there's going to be you right? Like now there's going to be you have more mass out in the ocean, more have more mass out in the ocean, more have more mass out in the ocean, more sailors are going to be making decisions sailors are going to be making decisions sailors are going to be making decisions about what those what that mass is going about what those what that mass is going about what those what that mass is going to be doing and where assets are going to be doing and where assets are going to be doing and where assets are going to be instead of worrying about, you to be instead of worrying about, you to be instead of worrying about, you know, coolant pressure in an engine, know, coolant pressure in an engine, know, coolant pressure in an engine, right? Um and so, right? Um and so, right? Um and so, you know, when we think about the the you know, when we think about the the you know, when we think about the the actual design, there's there's a lot of actual design, there's there's a lot of actual design, there's there's a lot of different variables there. There's some different variables there. There's some different variables there. There's some components that are commercial components that are commercial components that are commercial off-the-shelf, right? Elon in the early off-the-shelf, right? Elon in the early off-the-shelf, right? Elon in the early days um from a compute perspective, they days um from a compute perspective, they days um from a compute perspective, they had to invest in ASICs, right? The had to invest in ASICs, right? The had to invest in ASICs, right? The compute stack wasn't there to run, you compute stack wasn't there to run, you compute stack wasn't there to run, you know, large models and and run inference know, large models and and run inference know, large models and and run inference and power budgets that they wanted to. and power budgets that they wanted to. and power budgets that they wanted to. In 2026, it's a totally different game, In 2026, it's a totally different game, In 2026, it's a totally different game, right? Um and so, there's there's a lot right? Um and so, there's there's a lot right? Um and so, there's there's a lot of different parts of the supply chain of different parts of the supply chain of different parts of the supply chain that, you know, sometimes we're looking that, you know, sometimes we're looking that, you know, sometimes we're looking at, you know, investing in the at, you know, investing in the at, you know, investing in the industrial base and making sure that, industrial base and making sure that, industrial base and making sure that, you know, our engine manufacturers and you know, our engine manufacturers and you know, our engine manufacturers and genset manufacturers are keeping up. Um genset manufacturers are keeping up. Um genset manufacturers are keeping up. Um on the other side, there's there's on the other side, there's there's on the other side, there's there's particular components that we're like, particular components that we're like, particular components that we're like, "Hey, the marine industry actually "Hey, the marine industry actually "Hey, the marine industry actually hasn't had this level of investment in hasn't had this level of investment in hasn't had this level of investment in in a long time, so we're going to have in a long time, so we're going to have in a long time, so we're going to have to build this in-house." Um you know, a to build this in-house." Um you know, a to build this in-house." Um you know, a couple of examples around that are couple of examples around that are couple of examples around that are related to a lot of electronics related related to a lot of electronics related related to a lot of electronics related to the sensors and compute. Um but, you to the sensors and compute. Um but, you to the sensors and compute. Um but, you know, bunch of different things there know, bunch of different things there know, bunch of different things there that that help us build and assemble that that help us build and assemble that that help us build and assemble quickly. quickly. quickly. >> I'm going all in. >> Starting business usually means juggling >> Starting business usually means juggling a bunch of different services just to a bunch of different services just to a bunch of different services just to look legit. Not anymore. With Northwest look legit. Not anymore. With Northwest look legit. Not anymore. With Northwest Registered Agent, you get a complete Registered Agent, you get a complete Registered Agent, you get a complete business identity all in one place. A business identity all in one place. A business identity all in one place. 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Visit northwestregisteredagent.com/allinfree and start using free resources to build and start using free resources to build your business today. >> Let's talk a little bit about Andino on >> Let's talk a little bit about Andino on the business side, how you work with the the business side, how you work with the the business side, how you work with the Department of War, formerly known as the Department of War, formerly known as the Department of War, formerly known as the Department of Defense. Emil Michaels and Department of Defense. Emil Michaels and Department of Defense. Emil Michaels and a bunch of the folks over there are a bunch of the folks over there are a bunch of the folks over there are really focused on getting startups, really focused on getting startups, really focused on getting startups, essentially, like you are, more essentially, like you are, more essentially, like you are, more contracts. But, you also are moving out, contracts. But, you also are moving out, contracts. But, you also are moving out, I assume, of this cost-plus world and I assume, of this cost-plus world and I assume, of this cost-plus world and you're just figuring out, "Hey, what you're just figuring out, "Hey, what you're just figuring out, "Hey, what what's the right price for this?" And what's the right price for this?" And what's the right price for this?" And take us inside that paradigm shift. You take us inside that paradigm shift. You take us inside that paradigm shift. You have these primes have these primes have these primes and then you have these upstarts. And it and then you have these upstarts. And it and then you have these upstarts. And it seems like seems like seems like based on history, the incumbents based on history, the incumbents based on history, the incumbents sometimes don't take this lying down. sometimes don't take this lying down. sometimes don't take this lying down. So, take us inside the paradigm shift So, take us inside the paradigm shift So, take us inside the paradigm shift from cost-plus from cost-plus from cost-plus to what these, I guess they call the new to what these, I guess they call the new to what these, I guess they call the new primes, like yourself and Anduril, are primes, like yourself and Anduril, are primes, like yourself and Anduril, are doing. doing. doing. >> Yep. And I'll just define cost-plus >> Yep. And I'll just define cost-plus >> Yep. And I'll just define cost-plus everybody's listening. Basically, means everybody's listening. Basically, means everybody's listening. Basically, means "Hey, we're we're going to go build you "Hey, we're we're going to go build you "Hey, we're we're going to go build you something, Mr. Government, and however something, Mr. Government, and however something, Mr. Government, and however long that takes, however much it costs, long that takes, however much it costs, long that takes, however much it costs, you're just going to pay us 10 to 15% on you're just going to pay us 10 to 15% on you're just going to pay us 10 to 15% on top of that." So, I'm actually top of that." So, I'm actually top of that." So, I'm actually incentivized, and I'm not saying there's incentivized, and I'm not saying there's incentivized, and I'm not saying there's malicious intent, but I'm incentivized malicious intent, but I'm incentivized malicious intent, but I'm incentivized to make it take longer and cost more to make it take longer and cost more to make it take longer and cost more because if it costs a hundred million because if it costs a hundred million because if it costs a hundred million dollars, well, then I only make 15 dollars, well, then I only make 15 dollars, well, then I only make 15 million dollars. But, if it costs a million dollars. But, if it costs a million dollars. But, if it costs a billion dollars, then as a company, I billion dollars, then as a company, I billion dollars, then as a company, I make a hundred and fifty million make a hundred and fifty million make a hundred and fifty million dollars. So, there's this perverse dollars. So, there's this perverse dollars. So, there's this perverse incentive to drive up costs. Now, that's incentive to drive up costs. Now, that's incentive to drive up costs. Now, that's not the only reason the industry is not the only reason the industry is not the only reason the industry is where it is today, but we're we're very where it is today, but we're we're very where it is today, but we're we're very encouraged encouraged encouraged by the push from the administration by the push from the administration by the push from the administration to adopt things at at speed and scale to adopt things at at speed and scale to adopt things at at speed and scale and to do that quickly and to do that and to do that quickly and to do that and to do that quickly and to do that differently, and to move away from cost differently, and to move away from cost differently, and to move away from cost plus. You had it like we invest our own plus. You had it like we invest our own plus. You had it like we invest our own capital. Today we're we're just about 4 capital. Today we're we're just about 4 capital. Today we're we're just about 4 years old. We've raised 2 and 1/2 years old. We've raised 2 and 1/2 years old. We've raised 2 and 1/2 billion dollars in private capital. billion dollars in private capital. billion dollars in private capital. We're pouring that into R&D. I remember We're pouring that into R&D. I remember We're pouring that into R&D. I remember when we decided to build Marada, again when we decided to build Marada, again when we decided to build Marada, again 180 foot ship. 180 foot ship. 180 foot ship. Viv and I were talking and he was like Viv and I were talking and he was like Viv and I were talking and he was like who who who who's crazy enough to go and build a who's crazy enough to go and build a who's crazy enough to go and build a ship on IRAD? ship on IRAD? ship on IRAD? And he was like well well we are. Cuz And he was like well well we are. Cuz And he was like well well we are. Cuz that's what the country needs. That's that's what the country needs. That's that's what the country needs. That's what it demands. That's what's we're what it demands. That's what's we're what it demands. That's what's we're going to go do. And our investors are going to go do. And our investors are going to go do. And our investors are giving us the capital to go do it. giving us the capital to go do it. giving us the capital to go do it. They're actually entrusting us with that They're actually entrusting us with that They're actually entrusting us with that capital. That's the reverse of what's capital. That's the reverse of what's capital. That's the reverse of what's happening in the large primes where happening in the large primes where happening in the large primes where their investors are kind of demanding their investors are kind of demanding their investors are kind of demanding share buybacks. They're saying give us share buybacks. They're saying give us share buybacks. They're saying give us our capital back. So the country very our capital back. So the country very our capital back. So the country very much needs us to build for needs much needs us to build for needs much needs us to build for needs companies like us to build for the companies like us to build for the companies like us to build for the future. Um and when you look at what the future. Um and when you look at what the future. Um and when you look at what the administration is doing even just in administration is doing even just in administration is doing even just in shipbuilding, just recognizing that shipbuilding, just recognizing that shipbuilding, just recognizing that shipbuilding is a critical strategic shipbuilding is a critical strategic shipbuilding is a critical strategic industry, right? The president one of industry, right? The president one of industry, right? The president one of the first things he did was put out the the first things he did was put out the the first things he did was put out the maritime executive order. That was maritime executive order. That was maritime executive order. That was followed with the maritime action plan, followed with the maritime action plan, followed with the maritime action plan, right? There's ships act sitting in right? There's ships act sitting in right? There's ships act sitting in Congress. You had the secretary of war Congress. You had the secretary of war Congress. You had the secretary of war give a whole speech on defense give a whole speech on defense give a whole speech on defense acquisition reform talking about how acquisition reform talking about how acquisition reform talking about how we're going to push the department to be we're going to push the department to be we're going to push the department to be better, to move faster, to work with better, to move faster, to work with better, to move faster, to work with companies like us that are building on companies like us that are building on companies like us that are building on firm fixed price contracts that are firm fixed price contracts that are firm fixed price contracts that are focused on delivering at speed and scale focused on delivering at speed and scale focused on delivering at speed and scale and driving down cost for the taxpayer. and driving down cost for the taxpayer. and driving down cost for the taxpayer. So all of that is extremely encouraging, So all of that is extremely encouraging, So all of that is extremely encouraging, but I want to be I also want to be clear but I want to be I also want to be clear but I want to be I also want to be clear here on the flip side. here on the flip side. here on the flip side. We're in the early days, Jason. Like We're in the early days, Jason. Like We're in the early days, Jason. Like >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> very early days. When you look at the >> very early days. When you look at the >> very early days. When you look at the overall defense Department of War's overall defense Department of War's overall defense Department of War's budget budget budget 1% 1% 1% 1% 1% 1% goes to autonomous systems. goes to autonomous systems. goes to autonomous systems. That's not nearly enough. Make that 5%, That's not nearly enough. Make that 5%, That's not nearly enough. Make that 5%, make that to I don't know the right mix, make that to I don't know the right mix, make that to I don't know the right mix, but it needs to go up and it needs to go but it needs to go up and it needs to go but it needs to go up and it needs to go up quickly. up quickly. up quickly. >> I'll I'll just add one more thing that >> I'll I'll just add one more thing that >> I'll I'll just add one more thing that um that you know, historically um that you know, historically um that you know, historically shipbuilding, you know, the design is shipbuilding, you know, the design is shipbuilding, you know, the design is bifurcated from the builder, right? So, bifurcated from the builder, right? So, bifurcated from the builder, right? So, the design someone gets paid to do the the design someone gets paid to do the the design someone gets paid to do the design um and the ground up general design um and the ground up general design um and the ground up general assembly and all that. Like it's handed assembly and all that. Like it's handed assembly and all that. Like it's handed off to a totally different person to go off to a totally different person to go off to a totally different person to go and build a ship. Um and I think there's and build a ship. Um and I think there's and build a ship. Um and I think there's a statistic out there that's like 70% of a statistic out there that's like 70% of a statistic out there that's like 70% of sequence critical components on on some sequence critical components on on some sequence critical components on on some Navy ships are sole source suppliers, Navy ships are sole source suppliers, Navy ships are sole source suppliers, like single source suppliers. like single source suppliers. like single source suppliers. Um and so, to Dino's point, it's not Um and so, to Dino's point, it's not Um and so, to Dino's point, it's not just that you're incentivized to to take just that you're incentivized to to take just that you're incentivized to to take longer, it's that you're not longer, it's that you're not longer, it's that you're not incentivized to change that necessarily incentivized to change that necessarily incentivized to change that necessarily um because you know that you're still um because you know that you're still um because you know that you're still going to get paid. Um whereas like from going to get paid. Um whereas like from going to get paid. Um whereas like from our perspective, when you own the our perspective, when you own the our perspective, when you own the design, you own the shipyard, you know, design, you own the shipyard, you know, design, you own the shipyard, you know, software engineers, shipbuilders, naval software engineers, shipbuilders, naval software engineers, shipbuilders, naval architects, and welders can all all sit architects, and welders can all all sit architects, and welders can all all sit down and eat lunch together in the yard. down and eat lunch together in the yard. down and eat lunch together in the yard. Um there's end-to-end optimizations that Um there's end-to-end optimizations that Um there's end-to-end optimizations that you get that, you know, the the system you get that, you know, the the system you get that, you know, the the system from a from a historical perspective from a from a historical perspective from a from a historical perspective just wasn't set up to gain. just wasn't set up to gain. just wasn't set up to gain. >> Yeah, let's do a little uh look at what >> Yeah, let's do a little uh look at what >> Yeah, let's do a little uh look at what happened in the Strait of Hormuz. Uh we happened in the Strait of Hormuz. Uh we happened in the Strait of Hormuz. Uh we weren't able to control it completely. weren't able to control it completely. weren't able to control it completely. Doesn't seem like anybody in history has Doesn't seem like anybody in history has Doesn't seem like anybody in history has been able to been able to been able to uh control it. If we were to fast uh control it. If we were to fast uh control it. If we were to fast forward and you had your entire fleet, forward and you had your entire fleet, forward and you had your entire fleet, you had let's assume uh not unlimited, you had let's assume uh not unlimited, you had let's assume uh not unlimited, but massive capacity, how but massive capacity, how but massive capacity, how would you would you be able to secure would you would you be able to secure would you would you be able to secure something like the Strait of Hormuz with something like the Strait of Hormuz with something like the Strait of Hormuz with these autonomous vehicles? And what these autonomous vehicles? And what these autonomous vehicles? And what might that look like? Take us into a, might that look like? Take us into a, might that look like? Take us into a, you know, scenario 5 years from now. you know, scenario 5 years from now. you know, scenario 5 years from now. What would it take? What would it take? What would it take? >> That's the type of scenario that that >> That's the type of scenario that that >> That's the type of scenario that that we're building for. I think before we're building for. I think before we're building for. I think before talking about the scenario, let's talk talking about the scenario, let's talk talking about the scenario, let's talk about the Strait of Hormuz itself, about the Strait of Hormuz itself, about the Strait of Hormuz itself, right? The environment, the part of the right? The environment, the part of the right? The environment, the part of the world, like what neighborhood is it in, world, like what neighborhood is it in, world, like what neighborhood is it in, right? It it connects, so you have the right? It it connects, so you have the right? It it connects, so you have the Persian Gulf, which is 200 miles wide, Persian Gulf, which is 200 miles wide, Persian Gulf, which is 200 miles wide, which narrows down to a 20-mile wide which narrows down to a 20-mile wide which narrows down to a 20-mile wide strip, which is the Strait of Hormuz, strip, which is the Strait of Hormuz, strip, which is the Strait of Hormuz, and then it connects to the Indian Ocean and then it connects to the Indian Ocean and then it connects to the Indian Ocean and connects these large oil-producing and connects these large oil-producing and connects these large oil-producing countries to global markets. On the one countries to global markets. On the one countries to global markets. On the one side of the Persian Gulf, you have side of the Persian Gulf, you have side of the Persian Gulf, you have you know, Iraq, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, you know, Iraq, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, you know, Iraq, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, and Oman. And on the other UAE, Qatar, and Oman. And on the other UAE, Qatar, and Oman. And on the other side of the Persian Gulf, the north side side of the Persian Gulf, the north side side of the Persian Gulf, the north side is all controlled by Iran. is all controlled by Iran. is all controlled by Iran. So now, Iran is saying, "Well, how how So now, Iran is saying, "Well, how how So now, Iran is saying, "Well, how how are we going to disrupt traffic in the are we going to disrupt traffic in the are we going to disrupt traffic in the Strait of Hormuz?" Well, it's only a Strait of Hormuz?" Well, it's only a Strait of Hormuz?" Well, it's only a 20-mi wide stretch. I can use missiles, 20-mi wide stretch. I can use missiles, 20-mi wide stretch. I can use missiles, I can use fast attack vessels, I can use I can use fast attack vessels, I can use I can use fast attack vessels, I can use naval mines, I can use cheap drones, cuz naval mines, I can use cheap drones, cuz naval mines, I can use cheap drones, cuz I don't have a large distance to cover. I don't have a large distance to cover. I don't have a large distance to cover. I can launch these things anywhere from I can launch these things anywhere from I can launch these things anywhere from shore. So, it becomes this completely shore. So, it becomes this completely shore. So, it becomes this completely chaotic environment that sending in chaotic environment that sending in chaotic environment that sending in naval destroyers into or trying to get naval destroyers into or trying to get naval destroyers into or trying to get commercial ships past becomes extremely commercial ships past becomes extremely commercial ships past becomes extremely dangerous. So, using large numbers of dangerous. So, using large numbers of dangerous. So, using large numbers of autonomous vessels, you can combat these autonomous vessels, you can combat these autonomous vessels, you can combat these threats in completely different ways. threats in completely different ways. threats in completely different ways. You can offer scale, persistence, and You can offer scale, persistence, and You can offer scale, persistence, and risk reduction in ways that, you know, risk reduction in ways that, you know, risk reduction in ways that, you know, manned vessels just can't. And again, manned vessels just can't. And again, manned vessels just can't. And again, won't get into too many of the specifics won't get into too many of the specifics won't get into too many of the specifics on the types of operations that we're on the types of operations that we're on the types of operations that we're building towards, but autonomy is a way building towards, but autonomy is a way building towards, but autonomy is a way to counter these effects these these um to counter these effects these these um to counter these effects these these um these effects that are over well or like these effects that are over well or like these effects that are over well or like really aren't meant to be countered by really aren't meant to be countered by really aren't meant to be countered by traditional manned ships alone. We can traditional manned ships alone. We can traditional manned ships alone. We can counter that with scale and technology counter that with scale and technology counter that with scale and technology and keep people out of harm's way. and keep people out of harm's way. and keep people out of harm's way. >> Well, you have some small ships. Yeah, >> Well, you have some small ships. Yeah, >> Well, you have some small ships. Yeah, you got the Cutlass and you got the you got the Cutlass and you got the you got the Cutlass and you got the Spyglass in this uh Spyglass in this uh Spyglass in this uh you know, build out. Those are 6-ft, you know, build out. Those are 6-ft, you know, build out. Those are 6-ft, 15-ft, or whatever. 15-ft, or whatever. 15-ft, or whatever. >> We actually started with those and I and >> We actually started with those and I and >> We actually started with those and I and I'll give you an interesting story. We I'll give you an interesting story. We I'll give you an interesting story. We actually don't build those aren't we actually don't build those aren't we actually don't build those aren't we haven't productized those. Those were haven't productized those. Those were haven't productized those. Those were great subscale demonstrators, but our great subscale demonstrators, but our great subscale demonstrators, but our real flagship product is Corsair. And real flagship product is Corsair. And real flagship product is Corsair. And when you talk about again the the when you talk about again the the when you talk about again the the scenario in the Strait of Hormuz and scenario in the Strait of Hormuz and scenario in the Strait of Hormuz and what type of volume can we bring there? what type of volume can we bring there? what type of volume can we bring there? Like it's not only 5 years in the Like it's not only 5 years in the Like it's not only 5 years in the future, we could build 2,000 Corsair per future, we could build 2,000 Corsair per future, we could build 2,000 Corsair per year right now at our manufacturing year right now at our manufacturing year right now at our manufacturing facility in Austin. facility in Austin. facility in Austin. So, I I know you live in Austin. We'd So, I I know you live in Austin. We'd So, I I know you live in Austin. We'd love to show you around. When you see love to show you around. When you see love to show you around. When you see it, it, it, when you see it, it actually comes to when you see it, it actually comes to when you see it, it actually comes to life. You're like, "Oh, wait. You can life. You're like, "Oh, wait. You can life. You're like, "Oh, wait. You can actually build thousands of these actually build thousands of these actually build thousands of these vessels every single year." vessels every single year." vessels every single year." >> How many would you need? A thousand? >> How many would you need? A thousand? >> How many would you need? A thousand? 5,000 in the Strait of Hormuz? 5,000 in the Strait of Hormuz? 5,000 in the Strait of Hormuz? >> I don't think you need It's a 20-mi wide >> I don't think you need It's a 20-mi wide >> I don't think you need It's a 20-mi wide strait. strait. strait. >> So, you're just going to And and they >> So, you're just going to And and they >> So, you're just going to And and they This is their offensive strategy. They This is their offensive strategy. They This is their offensive strategy. They have these speedboats that they use. I have these speedboats that they use. I have these speedboats that they use. I don't know what they're called, but don't know what they're called, but don't know what they're called, but >> They call them fast attack vessels. >> They call them fast attack vessels. >> They call them fast attack vessels. >> Fast attack vessels. These guys >> Fast attack vessels. These guys >> Fast attack vessels. These guys essentially are kamikaze, right? They essentially are kamikaze, right? They essentially are kamikaze, right? They just zip in, just zip in, just zip in, you know, no regard for safety and their you know, no regard for safety and their you know, no regard for safety and their life, etc. And and they will attack. life, etc. And and they will attack. life, etc. And and they will attack. >> They're using fast attack vessels. >> They're using fast attack vessels. >> They're using fast attack vessels. They're using cheap drones. So, you have They're using cheap drones. So, you have They're using cheap drones. So, you have to be able to have counter UAS to be able to have counter UAS to be able to have counter UAS capabilities. They're They're using capabilities. They're They're using capabilities. They're They're using mines. They're just floating mines into mines. They're just floating mines into mines. They're just floating mines into the strait without regard for what those the strait without regard for what those the strait without regard for what those mines may set off. So, it's mines may set off. So, it's mines may set off. So, it's a really complicated environment that a really complicated environment that a really complicated environment that you need to bring a lot of capabilities you need to bring a lot of capabilities you need to bring a lot of capabilities towards. towards. towards. >> Yeah, but it sounds like they've with >> Yeah, but it sounds like they've with >> Yeah, but it sounds like they've with artificial intelligence, which is the artificial intelligence, which is the artificial intelligence, which is the next card that I think is going to turn next card that I think is going to turn next card that I think is going to turn over, you put these corsairs out there, over, you put these corsairs out there, over, you put these corsairs out there, could they with AI be able to, you know, could they with AI be able to, you know, could they with AI be able to, you know, be using satellite data from Planet or be using satellite data from Planet or be using satellite data from Planet or whoever's providing it to just or a whoever's providing it to just or a whoever's providing it to just or a military satellites and just zip out military satellites and just zip out military satellites and just zip out there and know say somebody's putting there and know say somebody's putting there and know say somebody's putting out some mines. Hey, somebody's putting out some mines. Hey, somebody's putting out some mines. Hey, somebody's putting out some of these fast attack vehicles. out some of these fast attack vehicles. out some of these fast attack vehicles. Just intercept them. And now they have Just intercept them. And now they have Just intercept them. And now they have an actual cost, human life, and a an actual cost, human life, and a an actual cost, human life, and a limited amount of resources. And hey, limited amount of resources. And hey, limited amount of resources. And hey, we're America and we have you guys we're America and we have you guys we're America and we have you guys building ships at scale. They don't have building ships at scale. They don't have building ships at scale. They don't have this ability to build AI-based ships. this ability to build AI-based ships. this ability to build AI-based ships. So, talk about what AI on these ships So, talk about what AI on these ships So, talk about what AI on these ships could do eventually. could do eventually. could do eventually. >> Yeah, so I would say I would say today, >> Yeah, so I would say I would say today, >> Yeah, so I would say I would say today, you know, there's a bunch of different, you know, there's a bunch of different, you know, there's a bunch of different, you know, machine learning applications you know, machine learning applications you know, machine learning applications that run on our boat today. Um there's that run on our boat today. Um there's that run on our boat today. Um there's heavy amounts of compute on all of our heavy amounts of compute on all of our heavy amounts of compute on all of our crafts um that allows people to have crafts um that allows people to have crafts um that allows people to have tons of capability, whether it's, you tons of capability, whether it's, you tons of capability, whether it's, you know, the navigation and kind of the know, the navigation and kind of the know, the navigation and kind of the autopilot or self-driving of the craft autopilot or self-driving of the craft autopilot or self-driving of the craft itself, or compute for payloads, whether itself, or compute for payloads, whether itself, or compute for payloads, whether that's counter UAS, as Dino mentioned, that's counter UAS, as Dino mentioned, that's counter UAS, as Dino mentioned, or or a bunch of other things, really. or or a bunch of other things, really. or or a bunch of other things, really. Um there's a variety of different Um there's a variety of different Um there's a variety of different mission sets. The end state here is mission sets. The end state here is mission sets. The end state here is that, you know, you have a distributed that, you know, you have a distributed that, you know, you have a distributed fleet, you know, across the ocean that, fleet, you know, across the ocean that, fleet, you know, across the ocean that, you know, invariably like cuz the ocean you know, invariably like cuz the ocean you know, invariably like cuz the ocean is a treacherous place like by default. is a treacherous place like by default. is a treacherous place like by default. Without war zone, like the ocean's still Without war zone, like the ocean's still Without war zone, like the ocean's still bad. Um you know, salt water hits your bad. Um you know, salt water hits your bad. Um you know, salt water hits your antennas, you lose you lose comms. Uh antennas, you lose you lose comms. Uh antennas, you lose you lose comms. Uh so, there's a bunch of different radio so, there's a bunch of different radio so, there's a bunch of different radio communications on this. There's a bunch communications on this. There's a bunch communications on this. There's a bunch of different sensors. Um all of those of different sensors. Um all of those of different sensors. Um all of those things kind of are networked together things kind of are networked together things kind of are networked together with ML, with a bunch of different with ML, with a bunch of different with ML, with a bunch of different software uh components of the software software uh components of the software software uh components of the software stack, to make sure that you can stack, to make sure that you can stack, to make sure that you can basically translate intent from a basically translate intent from a basically translate intent from a commander or sailor, and then result in commander or sailor, and then result in commander or sailor, and then result in a mission outcome. a mission outcome. a mission outcome. >> Let's talk, Dino, a little bit about the >> Let's talk, Dino, a little bit about the >> Let's talk, Dino, a little bit about the adversary, China, and they have started adversary, China, and they have started adversary, China, and they have started to put weapons on robots. to put weapons on robots. to put weapons on robots. I'm assuming that they're doing the same I'm assuming that they're doing the same I'm assuming that they're doing the same if they're willing to put it on a, you if they're willing to put it on a, you if they're willing to put it on a, you know, one of those dog robots, like the know, one of those dog robots, like the know, one of those dog robots, like the Spot robots. They're putting weapons on Spot robots. They're putting weapons on Spot robots. They're putting weapons on them. They're demonstrating it. And them. They're demonstrating it. And them. They're demonstrating it. And whatever they're demonstrating, they've whatever they're demonstrating, they've whatever they're demonstrating, they've already got in production. Let's just already got in production. Let's just already got in production. Let's just call it what it is. And call it what it is. And call it what it is. And they're not signing some UN treaty to they're not signing some UN treaty to they're not signing some UN treaty to not put autonomous and AI weapons. This not put autonomous and AI weapons. This not put autonomous and AI weapons. This is a different type of adversary. And is a different type of adversary. And is a different type of adversary. And I'm sure North Korea and and other bad I'm sure North Korea and and other bad I'm sure North Korea and and other bad guys are doing similar things. guys are doing similar things. guys are doing similar things. We have um We have um We have um I believe treaties where we're not I believe treaties where we're not I believe treaties where we're not allowed to put weapons and use AI-based allowed to put weapons and use AI-based allowed to put weapons and use AI-based weapons. Am I correct about that in the weapons. Am I correct about that in the weapons. Am I correct about that in the West here? West here? West here? >> There's a autonomous weapon system >> There's a autonomous weapon system >> There's a autonomous weapon system standard called 3009 that basically standard called 3009 that basically standard called 3009 that basically outlines exactly how AI can be used on outlines exactly how AI can be used on outlines exactly how AI can be used on an on an autonomous system, yeah. an on an autonomous system, yeah. an on an autonomous system, yeah. >> Tell us all about that. Like cuz this is >> Tell us all about that. Like cuz this is >> Tell us all about that. Like cuz this is the RoboCop scenario. This is the the RoboCop scenario. This is the the RoboCop scenario. This is the robotic soldier or the robotic boat robotic soldier or the robotic boat robotic soldier or the robotic boat that's able to engage the enemy without that's able to engage the enemy without that's able to engage the enemy without a human, you know, if it loses comms, or a human, you know, if it loses comms, or a human, you know, if it loses comms, or to do a kamikaze mission, which seems to do a kamikaze mission, which seems to do a kamikaze mission, which seems like something we might have to do. like something we might have to do. like something we might have to do. These are things we might have to do, These are things we might have to do, These are things we might have to do, Dino, versus the Chinese, cuz they're Dino, versus the Chinese, cuz they're Dino, versus the Chinese, cuz they're not signing these treaties. They're not not signing these treaties. They're not not signing these treaties. They're not thinking ethically. They are thinking ethically. They are thinking ethically. They are not respecting the Declaration of Human not respecting the Declaration of Human not respecting the Declaration of Human Rights. They've got their own playbook, Rights. They've got their own playbook, Rights. They've got their own playbook, yeah? yeah? yeah? >> And I think that the important thing to >> And I think that the important thing to >> And I think that the important thing to to articulate here is especially when to articulate here is especially when to articulate here is especially when you use the kind of Robocop example and you use the kind of Robocop example and you use the kind of Robocop example and just to kind of just to kind of just to kind of quell people's fears a little bit is quell people's fears a little bit is quell people's fears a little bit is even in that example where we're sending even in that example where we're sending even in that example where we're sending boats off the off of Taiwan and we're in boats off the off of Taiwan and we're in boats off the off of Taiwan and we're in the Taiwan Strait and they're engaging, the Taiwan Strait and they're engaging, the Taiwan Strait and they're engaging, we're still using artificial we're still using artificial we're still using artificial intelligence to bifurcate between an intelligence to bifurcate between an intelligence to bifurcate between an enemy vessel and a friendly vessel, enemy vessel and a friendly vessel, enemy vessel and a friendly vessel, between a non-combatant and a combatant. between a non-combatant and a combatant. between a non-combatant and a combatant. And people are still making the And people are still making the And people are still making the decisions and setting the mission decisions and setting the mission decisions and setting the mission intent. It's just government policy intent. It's just government policy intent. It's just government policy that's setting, "Okay, when are you that's setting, "Okay, when are you that's setting, "Okay, when are you authorized to engage versus not?" authorized to engage versus not?" authorized to engage versus not?" Artificial intelligence actually just Artificial intelligence actually just Artificial intelligence actually just gives the military the opportunity to gives the military the opportunity to gives the military the opportunity to one operate at a greater scale and then one operate at a greater scale and then one operate at a greater scale and then operate more efficiently. These aren't operate more efficiently. These aren't operate more efficiently. These aren't robots actually just making decisions on robots actually just making decisions on robots actually just making decisions on when to go to war or not. when to go to war or not. when to go to war or not. >> Got it. So, it says, "Hey, this is a bad >> Got it. So, it says, "Hey, this is a bad >> Got it. So, it says, "Hey, this is a bad guy. Hey, our recommendation is to, you guy. Hey, our recommendation is to, you guy. Hey, our recommendation is to, you know, neutralize it." And then a human know, neutralize it." And then a human know, neutralize it." And then a human has to say, "Okay, neutralize it." But has to say, "Okay, neutralize it." But has to say, "Okay, neutralize it." But if you're up against if you're up against if you're up against an adversary who says, "Hey, no, no, we an adversary who says, "Hey, no, no, we an adversary who says, "Hey, no, no, we built this thing. Anybody comes in to built this thing. Anybody comes in to built this thing. Anybody comes in to the blockade in Taiwan, which, you know, the blockade in Taiwan, which, you know, the blockade in Taiwan, which, you know, we think is, uh, you know, a pretty we think is, uh, you know, a pretty we think is, uh, you know, a pretty significant non-zero probability in our significant non-zero probability in our significant non-zero probability in our lifetime. lifetime. lifetime. If you're up against somebody who says, If you're up against somebody who says, If you're up against somebody who says, "I'm just going to have these ships kill "I'm just going to have these ships kill "I'm just going to have these ships kill anything that's not our ship." Period. anything that's not our ship." Period. anything that's not our ship." Period. Full stop. Then we lose, don't we? Full stop. Then we lose, don't we? Full stop. Then we lose, don't we? >> No, because the the technologies that >> No, because the the technologies that >> No, because the the technologies that all you're doing is putting all you're doing is putting all you're doing is putting policy thresholds and approval policy thresholds and approval policy thresholds and approval thresholds into the technology. There's thresholds into the technology. There's thresholds into the technology. There's a real-world scenario where doomsday a real-world scenario where doomsday a real-world scenario where doomsday scenario, we go to World War III, the scenario, we go to World War III, the scenario, we go to World War III, the Taiwan Strait is a complete conflict. Taiwan Strait is a complete conflict. Taiwan Strait is a complete conflict. Exactly what you said, our commanders Exactly what you said, our commanders Exactly what you said, our commanders are going to make that same judgment. are going to make that same judgment. are going to make that same judgment. Right? They're going to be like, "Hey, Right? They're going to be like, "Hey, Right? They're going to be like, "Hey, if anything, there's no fishing boats if anything, there's no fishing boats if anything, there's no fishing boats out here right now. out here right now. out here right now. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> There's no cruise ships coming through >> There's no cruise ships coming through >> There's no cruise ships coming through the Panama Canal. the Panama Canal. the Panama Canal. >> damage. >> damage. >> damage. >> If you're not a If you're not a friendly >> If you're not a If you're not a friendly >> If you're not a If you're not a friendly vessel, you're an enemy vessel, and vessel, you're an enemy vessel, and vessel, you're an enemy vessel, and that's that. And our technology is that's that. And our technology is that's that. And our technology is actually enables that what we were actually enables that what we were actually enables that what we were talking about earlier is like the talking about earlier is like the talking about earlier is like the autonomy, the artificial intelligence, autonomy, the artificial intelligence, autonomy, the artificial intelligence, and everything else is there, and you're and everything else is there, and you're and everything else is there, and you're building the policies into the software building the policies into the software building the policies into the software based on government procedures and when based on government procedures and when based on government procedures and when those authorizations need to be in those authorizations need to be in those authorizations need to be in place, place, place, those authorizations will change based those authorizations will change based those authorizations will change based on on on the threat environment that we're in. the threat environment that we're in. the threat environment that we're in. >> Is the plan for you to sell to our >> Is the plan for you to sell to our >> Is the plan for you to sell to our allies? And what are the rules there? allies? And what are the rules there? allies? And what are the rules there? Because it sounds like we need as many Because it sounds like we need as many Because it sounds like we need as many ships for our navy as we can get. But if ships for our navy as we can get. But if ships for our navy as we can get. But if you can get up to capacity, then hey, you can get up to capacity, then hey, you can get up to capacity, then hey, the French, the Germans, and the English the French, the Germans, and the English the French, the Germans, and the English have essentially been just stopped have essentially been just stopped have essentially been just stopped making ships, right? And they they they making ships, right? And they they they making ships, right? And they they they have very deprecated military. It's my have very deprecated military. It's my have very deprecated military. It's my understanding is the only people who are understanding is the only people who are understanding is the only people who are really doing a great job at this are the really doing a great job at this are the really doing a great job at this are the folks in South Korea, which I believe folks in South Korea, which I believe folks in South Korea, which I believe are building but one ship for us. So are building but one ship for us. So are building but one ship for us. So maybe you could talk about maybe you could talk about maybe you could talk about the other top countries in the world, the other top countries in the world, the other top countries in the world, democracies, and our allies, and what democracies, and our allies, and what democracies, and our allies, and what their capability is, and then your their capability is, and then your their capability is, and then your ability to help arm them and sell to ability to help arm them and sell to ability to help arm them and sell to them. them. them. >> I mean, very very focused on our allies >> I mean, very very focused on our allies >> I mean, very very focused on our allies and partners. If you talk to the and partners. If you talk to the and partners. If you talk to the Department of War, if you talk to the Department of War, if you talk to the Department of War, if you talk to the United States Navy, they actually want United States Navy, they actually want United States Navy, they actually want our allies and partners to have these our allies and partners to have these our allies and partners to have these capabilities as well. This is capabilities as well. This is capabilities as well. This is This is going to be a combined effort, This is going to be a combined effort, This is going to be a combined effort, right? We mentioned earlier that China right? We mentioned earlier that China right? We mentioned earlier that China has 57% of the world's shipbuilding has 57% of the world's shipbuilding has 57% of the world's shipbuilding capacity. That's not capacity. That's not capacity. That's not limited to just that one industry. We limited to just that one industry. We limited to just that one industry. We could go industry by industry and talk could go industry by industry and talk could go industry by industry and talk about their manufacturing might and about their manufacturing might and about their manufacturing might and their manufacturing dominance. their manufacturing dominance. their manufacturing dominance. Um so you really do need a combined Um so you really do need a combined Um so you really do need a combined effort. You need our allies and partners effort. You need our allies and partners effort. You need our allies and partners to have this technology. We're talking to have this technology. We're talking to have this technology. We're talking to to to um our allies in Asia, obviously, and um our allies in Asia, obviously, and um our allies in Asia, obviously, and Europe, and in the Middle East right now Europe, and in the Middle East right now Europe, and in the Middle East right now about getting not only our our products about getting not only our our products about getting not only our our products there, but also how do we stand up, you there, but also how do we stand up, you there, but also how do we stand up, you know, domestic production in those know, domestic production in those know, domestic production in those countries. How do we give them the countries. How do we give them the countries. How do we give them the sovereign capability? How do we have sovereign capability? How do we have sovereign capability? How do we have production lines overseas so that production lines overseas so that production lines overseas so that they're already forward deployed if we they're already forward deployed if we they're already forward deployed if we get into a conflict in the first place? get into a conflict in the first place? get into a conflict in the first place? >> Pretty amazing stuff and you have an >> Pretty amazing stuff and you have an >> Pretty amazing stuff and you have an announcement today I understand that announcement today I understand that announcement today I understand that we're going to share with the All-In we're going to share with the All-In we're going to share with the All-In audience for the first time. audience for the first time. audience for the first time. >> That's right. So, we've been working on >> That's right. So, we've been working on >> That's right. So, we've been working on Port Arthur for a long time now. So, Port Arthur for a long time now. So, Port Arthur for a long time now. So, Port Arthur just for the listeners is Port Arthur just for the listeners is Port Arthur just for the listeners is our shipyard of the future. This is our shipyard of the future. This is our shipyard of the future. This is going to bring American ship building going to bring American ship building going to bring American ship building back to a place that we haven't seen back to a place that we haven't seen back to a place that we haven't seen since World War II. Um since World War II. Um since World War II. Um to be clear we're already operating a to be clear we're already operating a to be clear we're already operating a shipyard. We have a shipyard in shipyard. We have a shipyard in shipyard. We have a shipyard in Franklin, Louisiana. That's where we're Franklin, Louisiana. That's where we're Franklin, Louisiana. That's where we're building Marada. We're ramping that up building Marada. We're ramping that up building Marada. We're ramping that up to 20 Marada. We can bring that up to 50 to 20 Marada. We can bring that up to 50 to 20 Marada. We can bring that up to 50 Maradas per year every single year. And Maradas per year every single year. And Maradas per year every single year. And that is a 100-acre shipyard. that is a 100-acre shipyard. that is a 100-acre shipyard. What we're doing at Port Arthur is What we're doing at Port Arthur is What we're doing at Port Arthur is 10Xing that. We're looking at a shipyard 10Xing that. We're looking at a shipyard 10Xing that. We're looking at a shipyard that is well over 1,000 acres. We've that is well over 1,000 acres. We've that is well over 1,000 acres. We've been doing this search for over a year been doing this search for over a year been doing this search for over a year now on what is the ideal location for now on what is the ideal location for now on what is the ideal location for this shipyard. Where are we going to this shipyard. Where are we going to this shipyard. Where are we going to find the right partner, the right land, find the right partner, the right land, find the right partner, the right land, the right workforce, the right community the right workforce, the right community the right workforce, the right community to be a part of? to be a part of? to be a part of? Um and we're proud to announce that we Um and we're proud to announce that we Um and we're proud to announce that we found that in Brownsville, Texas. So, found that in Brownsville, Texas. So, found that in Brownsville, Texas. So, we're We're headquartered in Austin. we're We're headquartered in Austin. we're We're headquartered in Austin. We're going to be basing Port Arthur in We're going to be basing Port Arthur in We're going to be basing Port Arthur in Brownsville. We're going to start on a Brownsville. We're going to start on a Brownsville. We're going to start on a 800-acre plot of land, which in and of 800-acre plot of land, which in and of 800-acre plot of land, which in and of itself 800 acres is now the largest itself 800 acres is now the largest itself 800 acres is now the largest shipyard in the United States. shipyard in the United States. shipyard in the United States. >> Amazing. >> Amazing. >> Amazing. >> Just to give you a sense of scale. We >> Just to give you a sense of scale. We >> Just to give you a sense of scale. We have the opportunity over time to scale have the opportunity over time to scale have the opportunity over time to scale that to 4,000 acres. that to 4,000 acres. that to 4,000 acres. We're going to invest billions of We're going to invest billions of We're going to invest billions of dollars into this project. We're going dollars into this project. We're going dollars into this project. We're going to create 10,000 jobs over the next 10 to create 10,000 jobs over the next 10 to create 10,000 jobs over the next 10 years. years. years. And we're going to bring ship building And we're going to bring ship building And we're going to bring ship building in this country back again to a place in this country back again to a place in this country back again to a place that we haven't seen since World War II. that we haven't seen since World War II. that we haven't seen since World War II. And we're just grateful for the And we're just grateful for the And we're just grateful for the partnership from the state, from partnership from the state, from partnership from the state, from Governor Abbott, from Cameron County, Governor Abbott, from Cameron County, Governor Abbott, from Cameron County, and then the city and the port of and then the city and the port of and then the city and the port of Brownsville for making this happen. Brownsville for making this happen. Brownsville for making this happen. >> I mean this is one of the great things >> I mean this is one of the great things >> I mean this is one of the great things Viv about being based in Texas. They let Viv about being based in Texas. They let Viv about being based in Texas. They let us build things in Texas. Yeah, as a us build things in Texas. Yeah, as a us build things in Texas. Yeah, as a recent resident here, it's pretty recent resident here, it's pretty recent resident here, it's pretty amazing to live in a state amazing to live in a state amazing to live in a state where the state's like, "What do you where the state's like, "What do you where the state's like, "What do you want to build? How can we help?" as want to build? How can we help?" as want to build? How can we help?" as opposed to opposed to opposed to hey, uh you know, "F off." like they hey, uh you know, "F off." like they hey, uh you know, "F off." like they told uh Elon in California and he got told uh Elon in California and he got told uh Elon in California and he got the message received reply uh to that the message received reply uh to that the message received reply uh to that lunatic. So, maybe we can talk a little lunatic. So, maybe we can talk a little lunatic. So, maybe we can talk a little bit about operating Veben Texas and the bit about operating Veben Texas and the bit about operating Veben Texas and the crazy support you get from Abbott and crazy support you get from Abbott and crazy support you get from Abbott and everybody. everybody. everybody. >> One of the >> One of the >> One of the questions that we used to get like back questions that we used to get like back questions that we used to get like back in the day was, "You guys are a maritime in the day was, "You guys are a maritime in the day was, "You guys are a maritime company, there's no water in Austin. company, there's no water in Austin. company, there's no water in Austin. What are you guys doing there?" Um and I What are you guys doing there?" Um and I What are you guys doing there?" Um and I would say like, you know, Austin has would say like, you know, Austin has would say like, you know, Austin has this like magical um kind of nexus of this like magical um kind of nexus of this like magical um kind of nexus of both digital and physical labor forces. both digital and physical labor forces. both digital and physical labor forces. Like, you can find software talent, you Like, you can find software talent, you Like, you can find software talent, you can find AI talent, you can find can find AI talent, you can find can find AI talent, you can find designers. Um but you can also tap into, designers. Um but you can also tap into, designers. Um but you can also tap into, you know, the industrial base from San you know, the industrial base from San you know, the industrial base from San Antonio, from the oil and gas industry Antonio, from the oil and gas industry Antonio, from the oil and gas industry in Houston. Um and when you marry those in Houston. Um and when you marry those in Houston. Um and when you marry those two together, like you can actually two together, like you can actually two together, like you can actually start to co-design these things across start to co-design these things across start to co-design these things across the entire stack, right? I mentioned the entire stack, right? I mentioned the entire stack, right? I mentioned earlier, like typically ship design and earlier, like typically ship design and earlier, like typically ship design and ship build is is totally independent. Um ship build is is totally independent. Um ship build is is totally independent. Um but I mean, with Port Arthur, we get the but I mean, with Port Arthur, we get the but I mean, with Port Arthur, we get the luxury of like greenfield designing what luxury of like greenfield designing what luxury of like greenfield designing what the the the the manufacturing plant for ships should the manufacturing plant for ships should the manufacturing plant for ships should look like. look like. look like. Um and so, you can design the you can Um and so, you can design the you can Um and so, you can design the you can you can optimize the design of ship for you can optimize the design of ship for you can optimize the design of ship for the yard and the design of the yard for the yard and the design of the yard for the yard and the design of the yard for the ship. And it's very similar to kind the ship. And it's very similar to kind the ship. And it's very similar to kind of like, you know, how how companies of like, you know, how how companies of like, you know, how how companies today like do hardware software today like do hardware software today like do hardware software co-design on chips, right? You design co-design on chips, right? You design co-design on chips, right? You design the compiler and they fit together to the compiler and they fit together to the compiler and they fit together to optimize both for for the other. optimize both for for the other. optimize both for for the other. Um and you we can we have the luxury of Um and you we can we have the luxury of Um and you we can we have the luxury of being able to do that for for ships here being able to do that for for ships here being able to do that for for ships here and um I I can't think of a better place and um I I can't think of a better place and um I I can't think of a better place to do it than Texas. to do it than Texas. to do it than Texas. >> Well, and uh >> Well, and uh >> Well, and uh Starbase is right down the block, SpaceX Starbase is right down the block, SpaceX Starbase is right down the block, SpaceX obviously. Uh and Elon's made that work obviously. Uh and Elon's made that work obviously. Uh and Elon's made that work and I think it's like a four what maybe and I think it's like a four what maybe and I think it's like a four what maybe four, five, six-hour drive down to the four, five, six-hour drive down to the four, five, six-hour drive down to the coast, yeah? So, you guys can either zip coast, yeah? So, you guys can either zip coast, yeah? So, you guys can either zip there on a PJ or you can just drive. So, there on a PJ or you can just drive. So, there on a PJ or you can just drive. So, it's pretty straightforward. it's pretty straightforward. it's pretty straightforward. >> straightforward. It's easy for >> straightforward. It's easy for >> straightforward. It's easy for logistics. What what SpaceX has did has logistics. What what SpaceX has did has logistics. What what SpaceX has did has done in Brownsville is incredible. I done in Brownsville is incredible. I done in Brownsville is incredible. I think what Brownsville has has done for think what Brownsville has has done for think what Brownsville has has done for SpaceX and helping them build out, build SpaceX and helping them build out, build SpaceX and helping them build out, build the community down there. the community down there. the community down there. Um we were very impressed, very very Um we were very impressed, very very Um we were very impressed, very very excited to be basing Port Alpha there. excited to be basing Port Alpha there. excited to be basing Port Alpha there. And look, at the end of the day, it's And look, at the end of the day, it's And look, at the end of the day, it's the people that are going to make this the people that are going to make this the people that are going to make this work. It's it's work. It's it's work. It's it's the labor force, it's the workforce. Viv the labor force, it's the workforce. Viv the labor force, it's the workforce. Viv mentioned it earlier, and we can talk mentioned it earlier, and we can talk mentioned it earlier, and we can talk about, you know, why the American about, you know, why the American about, you know, why the American shipbuilding industry has declined so shipbuilding industry has declined so shipbuilding industry has declined so much, but much, but much, but it's the supply chain and the workforce it's the supply chain and the workforce it's the supply chain and the workforce that has suffered the most. And so, that has suffered the most. And so, that has suffered the most. And so, like, one of the things we focus on is like, one of the things we focus on is like, one of the things we focus on is really, how do we rebuild that really, how do we rebuild that really, how do we rebuild that workforce? How do we upskill existing workforce? How do we upskill existing workforce? How do we upskill existing talent to advanced manufacturing? How do talent to advanced manufacturing? How do talent to advanced manufacturing? How do we take somebody that's building a car we take somebody that's building a car we take somebody that's building a car at Ford and get them building ships at Ford and get them building ships at Ford and get them building ships very, very efficiently, very quickly, very, very efficiently, very quickly, very, very efficiently, very quickly, right? And that all actually all starts right? And that all actually all starts right? And that all actually all starts with the design. If you design a ship with the design. If you design a ship with the design. If you design a ship from the ground up from a first from the ground up from a first from the ground up from a first principles approach to be more principles approach to be more principles approach to be more simplistic, to be designed and simplistic, to be designed and simplistic, to be designed and manufactured at scale, then you can put manufactured at scale, then you can put manufactured at scale, then you can put in the training, the work instructions, in the training, the work instructions, in the training, the work instructions, the processes, and everything else, the processes, and everything else, the processes, and everything else, where where where hey, let's go make this much faster. hey, let's go make this much faster. hey, let's go make this much faster. Let's train, let's build the workforce. Let's train, let's build the workforce. Let's train, let's build the workforce. And then, let's be honest, like, you And then, let's be honest, like, you And then, let's be honest, like, you have to make it cool for young people to have to make it cool for young people to have to make it cool for young people to go work in a shipyard again. You have to go work in a shipyard again. You have to go work in a shipyard again. You have to You have to pay them good wages. Like, You have to pay them good wages. Like, You have to pay them good wages. Like, every one of our employees, every every one of our employees, every every one of our employees, every welder, every pipefitter, welder, every pipefitter, welder, every pipefitter, um they have good wages, the same um they have good wages, the same um they have good wages, the same benefits as our Silicon Valley software benefits as our Silicon Valley software benefits as our Silicon Valley software engineers, they have equity in our engineers, they have equity in our engineers, they have equity in our company. company. company. Um they're they're fired up. Like, I Um they're they're fired up. Like, I Um they're they're fired up. Like, I mentioned our our shipyard in Louisiana, mentioned our our shipyard in Louisiana, mentioned our our shipyard in Louisiana, like, people are fired up down there. like, people are fired up down there. like, people are fired up down there. And it's not just the workforce, it's And it's not just the workforce, it's And it's not just the workforce, it's the community. Like, some of the some of the community. Like, some of the some of the community. Like, some of the some of the stories I hear when I'm down there the stories I hear when I'm down there the stories I hear when I'm down there are like so encouraging. Like, people are like so encouraging. Like, people are like so encouraging. Like, people are like, "I'm wearing my hat in the are like, "I'm wearing my hat in the are like, "I'm wearing my hat in the grocery store, and people are coming up grocery store, and people are coming up grocery store, and people are coming up to me saying, 'You guys are kicking to me saying, 'You guys are kicking to me saying, 'You guys are kicking butt, keep building ships.'" Because butt, keep building ships.'" Because butt, keep building ships.'" Because nobody else in the country is doing what nobody else in the country is doing what nobody else in the country is doing what we're doing. we're doing. we're doing. >> And these are great salaries. People are >> And these are great salaries. People are >> And these are great salaries. People are getting paid significant amounts of getting paid significant amounts of getting paid significant amounts of money, obviously, to work in money, obviously, to work in money, obviously, to work in manufacturing at your company, at down manufacturing at your company, at down manufacturing at your company, at down at Starbase. and now you have these two at Starbase. and now you have these two at Starbase. and now you have these two incredible companies. incredible companies. incredible companies. I I don't know if there's any other ones I I don't know if there's any other ones I I don't know if there's any other ones in Brownsville, but this is a small in Brownsville, but this is a small in Brownsville, but this is a small community. There's only like 200,000 community. There's only like 200,000 community. There's only like 200,000 people down there. This is going to be people down there. This is going to be people down there. This is going to be an incredible boom town. an incredible boom town. an incredible boom town. >> Oh, it's going to be incredible. It's >> Oh, it's going to be incredible. It's >> Oh, it's going to be incredible. It's going to be awesome. going to be awesome. going to be awesome. It's going to be awesome. It's going to It's going to be awesome. It's going to It's going to be awesome. It's going to be incredible. And I mentioned earlier be incredible. And I mentioned earlier be incredible. And I mentioned earlier like the cost of building ships in the like the cost of building ships in the like the cost of building ships in the United States, and the United States United States, and the United States United States, and the United States just isn't competitive in the commercial just isn't competitive in the commercial just isn't competitive in the commercial market. And again, we can go through the market. And again, we can go through the market. And again, we can go through the specifics and what happened over time. specifics and what happened over time. specifics and what happened over time. Five to six times the cost of building a Five to six times the cost of building a Five to six times the cost of building a ship in China. ship in China. ship in China. We think just by investing in product We think just by investing in product We think just by investing in product and processes and new shipyards, we can and processes and new shipyards, we can and processes and new shipyards, we can cut the cost of a ship in the United cut the cost of a ship in the United cut the cost of a ship in the United States in half. So, if you have a ship States in half. So, if you have a ship States in half. So, if you have a ship that costs $300 million, we can get that that costs $300 million, we can get that that costs $300 million, we can get that under $150 million. And that's not by under $150 million. And that's not by under $150 million. And that's not by simply just paying people less. simply just paying people less. simply just paying people less. We're paying people more, but we're We're paying people more, but we're We're paying people more, but we're investing in our product. We're investing in our product. We're investing in our product. We're investing in the process. We're investing in the process. We're investing in the process. We're designing the product to be built that designing the product to be built that designing the product to be built that way in the first place. So, we're making way in the first place. So, we're making way in the first place. So, we're making the investments that are needed for the investments that are needed for the investments that are needed for long-term sustainability and to rebuild long-term sustainability and to rebuild long-term sustainability and to rebuild the workforce. the workforce. the workforce. >> All right, if people want to come work >> All right, if people want to come work >> All right, if people want to come work with you, Vib, how can they apply? with you, Vib, how can they apply? with you, Vib, how can they apply? They're a career page, and what are you They're a career page, and what are you They're a career page, and what are you looking for? What what talent do you looking for? What what talent do you looking for? What what talent do you need to come do this incredibly need to come do this incredibly need to come do this incredibly patriotic duty patriotic duty patriotic duty and go work at Saronic? and go work at Saronic? and go work at Saronic? >> Yeah, I mean, saronic.com. We have a >> Yeah, I mean, saronic.com. We have a >> Yeah, I mean, saronic.com. We have a careers page. careers page. careers page. You can you can reach out on Twitter, You can you can reach out on Twitter, You can you can reach out on Twitter, LinkedIn, whatever you want. LinkedIn, whatever you want. LinkedIn, whatever you want. We're we're we're hiring pretty We're we're we're hiring pretty We're we're we're hiring pretty aggressively right now. I would say that aggressively right now. I would say that aggressively right now. I would say that you know, the biggest thing you know, we you know, the biggest thing you know, we you know, the biggest thing you know, we look for generally speaking is you know, look for generally speaking is you know, look for generally speaking is you know, especially 2026 when especially 2026 when especially 2026 when you know, ChatGPT and Claude are getting you know, ChatGPT and Claude are getting you know, ChatGPT and Claude are getting so much better every year. so much better every year. so much better every year. It's pretty important right now to be It's pretty important right now to be It's pretty important right now to be fairly, you know, neuroplastic. fairly, you know, neuroplastic. fairly, you know, neuroplastic. You know, be ready to adapt for what the You know, be ready to adapt for what the You know, be ready to adapt for what the future looks like. Computing is future looks like. Computing is future looks like. Computing is changing. changing. changing. You know, there's there's going to be You know, there's there's going to be You know, there's there's going to be agents that can help you on the agents that can help you on the agents that can help you on the manufacturing floor, too, to assemble manufacturing floor, too, to assemble manufacturing floor, too, to assemble faster if you have an issue. faster if you have an issue. faster if you have an issue. There's all these digital systems that There's all these digital systems that There's all these digital systems that are that are kind of changing the are that are kind of changing the are that are kind of changing the paradigm here. I mean, when we first got paradigm here. I mean, when we first got paradigm here. I mean, when we first got to Gulf Craft in in down in Louisiana, a to Gulf Craft in in down in Louisiana, a to Gulf Craft in in down in Louisiana, a lot of the processes were were pretty lot of the processes were were pretty lot of the processes were were pretty much pen and paper, right? And that's much pen and paper, right? And that's much pen and paper, right? And that's pretty common across most shipyards. pretty common across most shipyards. pretty common across most shipyards. So, like kind of bringing that into the So, like kind of bringing that into the So, like kind of bringing that into the 21st century really quickly, 21st century really quickly, 21st century really quickly, I mean, it's just going to require I mean, it's just going to require I mean, it's just going to require people to be people to be people to be thoughtful, thoughtful, thoughtful, adapt to the future, and adapt to the future, and adapt to the future, and and really be passionate and excited and and really be passionate and excited and and really be passionate and excited and about about kind of building the future. about about kind of building the future. about about kind of building the future. >> Yeah, go to the website saronic.com, >> Yeah, go to the website saronic.com, >> Yeah, go to the website saronic.com, join the mission. There's 300 jobs join the mission. There's 300 jobs join the mission. There's 300 jobs listed on the website. There's something listed on the website. There's something listed on the website. There's something there for everybody. And listen, just there for everybody. And listen, just there for everybody. And listen, just as a fellow Greek, Dino, as a fellow Greek, Dino, as a fellow Greek, Dino, you know, we were obviously the cradle you know, we were obviously the cradle you know, we were obviously the cradle of innovation and where science, math, of innovation and where science, math, of innovation and where science, math, technology, art, and everything technology, art, and everything technology, art, and everything happened, but we were also the great happened, but we were also the great happened, but we were also the great warriors. warriors. warriors. And we patrolled the sea. Obviously, And we patrolled the sea. Obviously, And we patrolled the sea. Obviously, Greece has a lot of coastline. So, Greece has a lot of coastline. So, Greece has a lot of coastline. So, you're you're doing our Greek you're you're doing our Greek you're you're doing our Greek our brothers and sisters and ancestors our brothers and sisters and ancestors our brothers and sisters and ancestors proud. proud. proud. >> of Greece has a lot of coastline, and >> of Greece has a lot of coastline, and >> of Greece has a lot of coastline, and they're actually big in the shipping they're actually big in the shipping they're actually big in the shipping industry. So, now I can industry. So, now I can industry. So, now I can >> yeah. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> So, so now I hear more more often than >> So, so now I hear more more often than >> So, so now I hear more more often than not now, oh, it's good to see a Greek in not now, oh, it's good to see a Greek in not now, oh, it's good to see a Greek in in building ships. in building ships. in building ships. >> I you know what? I can sleep now at >> I you know what? I can sleep now at >> I you know what? I can sleep now at night. I was very worried about the night. I was very worried about the night. I was very worried about the Strait of Hormuz. I was worried about Strait of Hormuz. I was worried about Strait of Hormuz. I was worried about the Pacific theater the Pacific theater the Pacific theater and South China Sea. Dino, now that I and South China Sea. Dino, now that I and South China Sea. Dino, now that I know that my Greek brother is on top of know that my Greek brother is on top of know that my Greek brother is on top of this, this, this, my head's going to hit the pillow. I'm my head's going to hit the pillow. I'm my head's going to hit the pillow. I'm going to go right going to go right going to go right I'm going to sleep like a baby tonight. I'm going to sleep like a baby tonight. I'm going to sleep like a baby tonight. I know you got us covered. Thanks so I know you got us covered. Thanks so I know you got us covered. Thanks so much, guys. And sincerely on behalf of much, guys. And sincerely on behalf of much, guys. And sincerely on behalf of all Americans, like thank you for doing all Americans, like thank you for doing all Americans, like thank you for doing this work. You know, this is something this work. You know, this is something this work. You know, this is something where where where we really need technologists and we really need technologists and we really need technologists and entrepreneurs entrepreneurs entrepreneurs to really help us innovate because we're to really help us innovate because we're to really help us innovate because we're falling behind, and we're the good guys falling behind, and we're the good guys falling behind, and we're the good guys in this. We're the ones who are in this. We're the ones who are in this. We're the ones who are spreading democracy and freedom and spreading democracy and freedom and spreading democracy and freedom and protecting that. The only thing in the protecting that. The only thing in the protecting that. The only thing in the world that isn't trending in the right world that isn't trending in the right world that isn't trending in the right direction, man, if you look at direction, man, if you look at direction, man, if you look at lifespans, if you look at lifespans, if you look at lifespans, if you look at you know, infant mortality, if you look you know, infant mortality, if you look you know, infant mortality, if you look at people's standard of living, at people's standard of living, at people's standard of living, everything is trending in the world in everything is trending in the world in everything is trending in the world in the right direction except the spread of the right direction except the spread of the right direction except the spread of democracy which has been on the decline democracy which has been on the decline democracy which has been on the decline in our lifetime. Let that sink in, in our lifetime. Let that sink in, in our lifetime. Let that sink in, folks. More people living under folks. More people living under folks. More people living under authoritarians than democracies. It's authoritarians than democracies. It's authoritarians than democracies. It's It's a modest amount, but you've seen It's a modest amount, but you've seen It's a modest amount, but you've seen the statistics, I'm sure, Vibin and the statistics, I'm sure, Vibin and the statistics, I'm sure, Vibin and Dino. And we need to have a great Dino. And we need to have a great Dino. And we need to have a great military. We need to have this advanced military. We need to have this advanced military. We need to have this advanced technology if we're going to maintain technology if we're going to maintain technology if we're going to maintain the number of people living under a the number of people living under a the number of people living under a democracy of in in freedom and hopefully democracy of in in freedom and hopefully democracy of in in freedom and hopefully increase it. A lot of bad guys out increase it. A lot of bad guys out increase it. A lot of bad guys out there. And you know, just thank you so there. And you know, just thank you so there. And you know, just thank you so much for doing this work. much for doing this work. much for doing this work. >> That's right. Well, thank you for having >> That's right. Well, thank you for having >> That's right. Well, thank you for having us. And I will end on a positive note us. And I will end on a positive note us. And I will end on a positive note where Look, we're we're seeing that where Look, we're we're seeing that where Look, we're we're seeing that starting to turn around in a really big starting to turn around in a really big starting to turn around in a really big way. It's not just Saronic. You way. It's not just Saronic. You way. It's not just Saronic. You mentioned Anduril, there's SpaceX and mentioned Anduril, there's SpaceX and mentioned Anduril, there's SpaceX and Palantir before that. And now there's Palantir before that. And now there's Palantir before that. And now there's just a big wave, a big push into defense just a big wave, a big push into defense just a big wave, a big push into defense tech because people realize the tech because people realize the tech because people realize the importance and the magnitude of the importance and the magnitude of the importance and the magnitude of the moment that we are living in right now. moment that we are living in right now. moment that we are living in right now. I I tell our team, I'm like, this is our I I tell our team, I'm like, this is our I I tell our team, I'm like, this is our generation's version of the space race. generation's version of the space race. generation's version of the space race. Make Make no mistake about it. And we Make Make no mistake about it. And we Make Make no mistake about it. And we cannot lose. So, that's how hard we're cannot lose. So, that's how hard we're cannot lose. So, that's how hard we're working at Saronic. That's how we're working at Saronic. That's how we're working at Saronic. That's how we're working with a sense of urgency. And working with a sense of urgency. And working with a sense of urgency. And there's a lot of other companies into there's a lot of other companies into there's a lot of other companies into the coming into the space that are the coming into the space that are the coming into the space that are working with that same sense of urgency. working with that same sense of urgency. working with that same sense of urgency. So, I'm I am very optimistic. I know So, I'm I am very optimistic. I know So, I'm I am very optimistic. I know this country can do it. When we put our this country can do it. When we put our this country can do it. When we put our minds and and we get a collective effort minds and and we get a collective effort minds and and we get a collective effort behind something, nobody can beat us. behind something, nobody can beat us. behind something, nobody can beat us. So, So, So, >> Nobody can, yeah. Nobody can beat us. >> Nobody can, yeah. Nobody can beat us. >> Nobody can, yeah. Nobody can beat us. And listen, if you were thinking of And listen, if you were thinking of And listen, if you were thinking of going Listen, it's no no dig to anybody, going Listen, it's no no dig to anybody, going Listen, it's no no dig to anybody, but if you're thinking about going and but if you're thinking about going and but if you're thinking about going and optimizing an ad network at some big optimizing an ad network at some big optimizing an ad network at some big tech company, like incredibly boring. tech company, like incredibly boring. tech company, like incredibly boring. And it's incredibly meaningful. You'll And it's incredibly meaningful. You'll And it's incredibly meaningful. You'll get 20, 30 years into your career and get 20, 30 years into your career and get 20, 30 years into your career and you say, "What did I do?" you say, "What did I do?" you say, "What did I do?" Go work at Saronic. You'll get couple of Go work at Saronic. You'll get couple of Go work at Saronic. You'll get couple of years into your career and you say, "I'm years into your career and you say, "I'm years into your career and you say, "I'm doing important work." doing important work." doing important work." >> That's right. That's right. Every person >> That's right. That's right. Every person >> That's right. That's right. Every person that walks through the door every single that walks through the door every single that walks through the door every single day is quite literally changing the day is quite literally changing the day is quite literally changing the world. And we remind them of that and world. And we remind them of that and world. And we remind them of that and they know it. they know it. they know it. >> Yeah. All right, Vib. Dino, thank Thank >> Yeah. All right, Vib. Dino, thank Thank >> Yeah. All right, Vib. Dino, thank Thank so much for coming on. And we'll see you so much for coming on. And we'll see you so much for coming on. And we'll see you next time on the All-In interview. next time on the All-In interview. next time on the All-In interview. >> I'm going all in.