Bryan Johnson: I Just Took the Most Powerful Dose of DMT in the World... Here's What It Was Like

Brian Johnson, thanks for being here. Brian Johnson, thanks for being here. >> Yeah, it's good to see you. >> Yeah, it's good to see you. >> Yeah, it's good to see you. >> How are you feeling? Maybe just share >> How are you feeling? Maybe just share >> How are you feeling? Maybe just share with us what you did a few days ago. And with us what you did a few days ago. And with us what you did a few days ago. And >> yeah, I did um a I did five MOD DMT, >> yeah, I did um a I did five MOD DMT, >> yeah, I did um a I did five MOD DMT, which is the most powerful psychedelic which is the most powerful psychedelic which is the most powerful psychedelic on the planet. Uh it's somewhere between on the planet. Uh it's somewhere between on the planet. Uh it's somewhere between five and 10 times more powerful than five and 10 times more powerful than five and 10 times more powerful than DMT. And so, yeah, I it's so it's been DMT. And so, yeah, I it's so it's been DMT. And so, yeah, I it's so it's been 48 hours. I'm still learning how to talk 48 hours. I'm still learning how to talk 48 hours. I'm still learning how to talk about it. >> You know what? Many of the biggest tech >> You know what? Many of the biggest tech CEOs and VCs have in common. They sleep CEOs and VCs have in common. They sleep CEOs and VCs have in common. They sleep on the Pod by eight sleep. It's become on the Pod by eight sleep. It's become on the Pod by eight sleep. It's become tech's favorite way to sleep, and for tech's favorite way to sleep, and for tech's favorite way to sleep, and for good reason. A cover that goes on any good reason. A cover that goes on any good reason. A cover that goes on any mattress, cools it down to 55°, and uses mattress, cools it down to 55°, and uses mattress, cools it down to 55°, and uses AI to adjust your temperature all night. AI to adjust your temperature all night. AI to adjust your temperature all night. Up to 34% more deep sleep. 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So when when we when I started this project 5 years ago, the started this project 5 years ago, the started this project 5 years ago, the the approach we had was go through all the approach we had was go through all the approach we had was go through all the scientific evidence ever published the scientific evidence ever published the scientific evidence ever published on health and longevity. Try to find the on health and longevity. Try to find the on health and longevity. Try to find the interventions that have the best interventions that have the best interventions that have the best evidence for effect size and we just evidence for effect size and we just evidence for effect size and we just went down the list from top performing went down the list from top performing went down the list from top performing on down. So, of course, you start with on down. So, of course, you start with on down. So, of course, you start with uh exercise, nutrition, uh you know, um uh exercise, nutrition, uh you know, um uh exercise, nutrition, uh you know, um sleep, and you work your way down to sleep, and you work your way down to sleep, and you work your way down to things like hyperbaric oxygen therapy things like hyperbaric oxygen therapy things like hyperbaric oxygen therapy and sauna, and then rapamy, metformin. and sauna, and then rapamy, metformin. and sauna, and then rapamy, metformin. And so, we never actually had on our And so, we never actually had on our And so, we never actually had on our radar psychedelics. They were always radar psychedelics. They were always radar psychedelics. They were always either an ancient medicine, you know, either an ancient medicine, you know, either an ancient medicine, you know, being used in in ritualistic practices being used in in ritualistic practices being used in in ritualistic practices or being pointed at things like or being pointed at things like or being pointed at things like depression and anxiety in in certain depression and anxiety in in certain depression and anxiety in in certain trials, but it was never understood as a trials, but it was never understood as a trials, but it was never understood as a rejuvenation protocol, something that rejuvenation protocol, something that rejuvenation protocol, something that was for anti-aging. And so we found a was for anti-aging. And so we found a was for anti-aging. And so we found a pre-clinical evidence in mice on pre-clinical evidence in mice on pre-clinical evidence in mice on psilocybin. We thought that's psilocybin. We thought that's psilocybin. We thought that's interesting. Uh and so we did the interesting. Uh and so we did the interesting. Uh and so we did the world's most studied the most uh world's most studied the most uh world's most studied the most uh quantified experiment doing psilocybin quantified experiment doing psilocybin quantified experiment doing psilocybin three doses at 25 milligrams uh of three doses at 25 milligrams uh of three doses at 25 milligrams uh of psilocybin psilocybin psilocybin >> which are pretty high doses. >> which are pretty high doses. >> which are pretty high doses. >> It's yeah it's a clinical uh dose at >> It's yeah it's a clinical uh dose at >> It's yeah it's a clinical uh dose at very very close to a hero dose and we very very close to a hero dose and we very very close to a hero dose and we found that we think it's a a longevity found that we think it's a a longevity found that we think it's a a longevity therapy. therapy. therapy. >> Let's get to that data in a minute. But >> Let's get to that data in a minute. But >> Let's get to that data in a minute. But then you decided to try 5me this then you decided to try 5me this then you decided to try 5me this weekend. weekend. weekend. >> Yes. Walk me through the experience >> Yes. Walk me through the experience >> Yes. Walk me through the experience because you televised the whole thing. because you televised the whole thing. because you televised the whole thing. It was live streamed. You looked It was live streamed. You looked It was live streamed. You looked amazingly calm going into it and going amazingly calm going into it and going amazingly calm going into it and going through the process. Walk us through through the process. Walk us through through the process. Walk us through your experience. your experience. your experience. >> Yeah, I think uh those who have done 5me >> Yeah, I think uh those who have done 5me >> Yeah, I think uh those who have done 5me would probably relate with me that it would probably relate with me that it would probably relate with me that it feels like an impossible task to explain feels like an impossible task to explain feels like an impossible task to explain what it's like. So that caveat said, what it's like. So that caveat said, what it's like. So that caveat said, I'll I'll give it a go. I'm stunned. I'll I'll give it a go. I'm stunned. I'll I'll give it a go. I'm stunned. absolutely floored, speechless. You you absolutely floored, speechless. You you absolutely floored, speechless. You you basically basically basically experience raw consciousness and raw experience raw consciousness and raw experience raw consciousness and raw intelligence. It's this. So whatever intelligence. It's this. So whatever intelligence. It's this. So whatever when I say these words, take these words when I say these words, take these words when I say these words, take these words that I committed to you, take that idea, that I committed to you, take that idea, that I committed to you, take that idea, multiply it by a thousand, and then move multiply it by a thousand, and then move multiply it by a thousand, and then move out infinite depth, infinite width, out infinite depth, infinite width, out infinite depth, infinite width, width and then dimensions. And like that width and then dimensions. And like that width and then dimensions. And like that gives you kind of like a rough map of gives you kind of like a rough map of gives you kind of like a rough map of like the size and like the size and like the size and space that you deal with. And uh it was space that you deal with. And uh it was space that you deal with. And uh it was incredibly hard because you you get incredibly hard because you you get incredibly hard because you you get blasted into this space that is so blasted into this space that is so blasted into this space that is so foreign you don't even know what's foreign you don't even know what's foreign you don't even know what's happening. happening. happening. >> It happens very quickly >> It happens very quickly >> It happens very quickly >> like you you inhale it. I did uh 9 >> like you you inhale it. I did uh 9 >> like you you inhale it. I did uh 9 milligrams of intramuscular and then milligrams of intramuscular and then milligrams of intramuscular and then seven uh 18 of of vaporized and it hits seven uh 18 of of vaporized and it hits seven uh 18 of of vaporized and it hits you within 10 seconds. You're just ab you within 10 seconds. You're just ab you within 10 seconds. You're just ab you're out. And so um but what happens you're out. And so um but what happens you're out. And so um but what happens is you you get in that space and then is you you get in that space and then is you you get in that space and then >> visual changes every >> visual changes every >> visual changes every >> very very little visual uh like you see >> very very little visual uh like you see >> very very little visual uh like you see on DMT it's a very visual you'll meet on DMT it's a very visual you'll meet on DMT it's a very visual you'll meet the you know like the elves or whatever the you know like the elves or whatever the you know like the elves or whatever else this is not a visual experience but else this is not a visual experience but else this is not a visual experience but you you get in this world and you you get in this world and you you get in this world and you lock in to basically you either you lock in to basically you either you lock in to basically you either panic because you feel like the gates of panic because you feel like the gates of panic because you feel like the gates of hell are going to open that the the hell are going to open that the the hell are going to open that the the stream of Yeah. stream of Yeah. stream of Yeah. >> Existence is just going to just tear you >> Existence is just going to just tear you >> Existence is just going to just tear you to shreds. It's going to shard you. And to shreds. It's going to shard you. And to shreds. It's going to shard you. And if you give up, if you give up, if you give up, >> like break your brain. >> like break your brain. >> like break your brain. >> Yeah. You feel like it's going to like >> Yeah. You feel like it's going to like >> Yeah. You feel like it's going to like threaten your sanity. Like is it going threaten your sanity. Like is it going threaten your sanity. Like is it going to chop you up into little pieces? And to chop you up into little pieces? And to chop you up into little pieces? And so in that moment, you have to say, do I so in that moment, you have to say, do I so in that moment, you have to say, do I try to wrestle this and I I need to just try to wrestle this and I I need to just try to wrestle this and I I need to just like wait it out until it's over or you like wait it out until it's over or you like wait it out until it's over or you just relent and you say yes. And you just relent and you say yes. And you just relent and you say yes. And you have to in that moment, you have to say have to in that moment, you have to say have to in that moment, you have to say yes so thoroughly. You have to release yes so thoroughly. You have to release yes so thoroughly. You have to release all attachment, all preconditions, all all attachment, all preconditions, all all attachment, all preconditions, all want, all desire. You have to release want, all desire. You have to release want, all desire. You have to release self, ego, control. You just have to self, ego, control. You just have to self, ego, control. You just have to just relent entirely. And then when you just relent entirely. And then when you just relent entirely. And then when you do that, it opened up this unimaginable do that, it opened up this unimaginable do that, it opened up this unimaginable bliss and euphoria. And I I again this bliss and euphoria. And I I again this bliss and euphoria. And I I again this like a V1 of trying to explain this, but like a V1 of trying to explain this, but like a V1 of trying to explain this, but if I list out the the most if I list out the the most if I list out the the most dynamic experiences I've had of a human, dynamic experiences I've had of a human, dynamic experiences I've had of a human, you know, uh like certain you know, uh like certain you know, uh like certain accomplishments or getting married or accomplishments or getting married or accomplishments or getting married or having a child or overcoming a having a child or overcoming a having a child or overcoming a difficulty or you know, state your list difficulty or you know, state your list difficulty or you know, state your list of things. This is without question the of things. This is without question the of things. This is without question the most dynamic experience I've ever most dynamic experience I've ever most dynamic experience I've ever experienced as a human. Does the experienced as a human. Does the experienced as a human. Does the internal chatter, the internal monologue internal chatter, the internal monologue internal chatter, the internal monologue of the ego turn off? of the ego turn off? of the ego turn off? >> Does. >> Does. >> Does. >> So you can't hear yourself speaking, how >> So you can't hear yourself speaking, how >> So you can't hear yourself speaking, how do you rationalize what's going on if do you rationalize what's going on if do you rationalize what's going on if you don't have a dialogue going on? you don't have a dialogue going on? you don't have a dialogue going on? >> It's this visceral feeling like you're >> It's this visceral feeling like you're >> It's this visceral feeling like you're you're hyper aware of what's happening. you're hyper aware of what's happening. you're hyper aware of what's happening. It's not like you you block out in the It's not like you you block out in the It's not like you you block out in the first like when you take a very high first like when you take a very high first like when you take a very high dose, you don't really know what's dose, you don't really know what's dose, you don't really know what's happening the first few minutes, but happening the first few minutes, but happening the first few minutes, but then you kind of come to and you're then you kind of come to and you're then you kind of come to and you're hyper aware of everything. It's not hyper aware of everything. It's not hyper aware of everything. It's not visual, but it's this um you're in the depths of [snorts] you're in the depths of [snorts] existence like this. >> It's just the most majestic >> It's just the most majestic >> experience >> experience >> experience achievable by a by by intelligent life. achievable by a by by intelligent life. achievable by a by by intelligent life. I just can't imagine anything more I just can't imagine anything more I just can't imagine anything more miraculous. miraculous. miraculous. You've studied the biology, the You've studied the biology, the You've studied the biology, the biochemistry. What goes on in the brain biochemistry. What goes on in the brain biochemistry. What goes on in the brain as this molecule hits your neurons? as this molecule hits your neurons? as this molecule hits your neurons? >> Yeah. I mean like it um I mean one it >> Yeah. I mean like it um I mean one it >> Yeah. I mean like it um I mean one it completely dissolves your default mode completely dissolves your default mode completely dissolves your default mode network. network. network. >> Describe what that is. >> Describe what that is. >> Describe what that is. >> So like um it's this is the engine that >> So like um it's this is the engine that >> So like um it's this is the engine that constructs self and ego. And so as you constructs self and ego. And so as you constructs self and ego. And so as you ruminate, you know, like you're going ruminate, you know, like you're going ruminate, you know, like you're going through through through >> thinking through your day, what's next? >> thinking through your day, what's next? >> thinking through your day, what's next? How am I feeling? Yeah. How am I feeling? Yeah. How am I feeling? Yeah. >> What should I be doing right now? >> What should I be doing right now? >> What should I be doing right now? Constant conversation. Constant conversation. Constant conversation. >> Do I feel bad about myself? Do I feel, >> Do I feel bad about myself? Do I feel, >> Do I feel bad about myself? Do I feel, you know, like I am I shy? Am I like do you know, like I am I shy? Am I like do you know, like I am I shy? Am I like do I feel bad about whatever? Like you're I feel bad about whatever? Like you're I feel bad about whatever? Like you're doing this rumination stuff. Uh kids doing this rumination stuff. Uh kids doing this rumination stuff. Uh kids don't have this rumination loop. Their don't have this rumination loop. Their don't have this rumination loop. Their default mode network is is quiet. And as default mode network is is quiet. And as default mode network is is quiet. And as you age, you basically build up this you age, you basically build up this you age, you basically build up this default mode network into more stiffer default mode network into more stiffer default mode network into more stiffer patterns. And so as you age, your patterns. And so as you age, your patterns. And so as you age, your experience of reality becomes experience of reality becomes experience of reality becomes increasingly narrow. You have these big increasingly narrow. You have these big increasingly narrow. You have these big ruts that form. And so you can just see ruts that form. And so you can just see ruts that form. And so you can just see people in their patterns like how open a people in their patterns like how open a people in their patterns like how open a child is to say like very random things. child is to say like very random things. child is to say like very random things. And as adults, you're just very, you And as adults, you're just very, you And as adults, you're just very, you shut in. Like when I did psilocybin, shut in. Like when I did psilocybin, shut in. Like when I did psilocybin, one of the reasons why we did it is one of the reasons why we did it is one of the reasons why we did it is because it does have this effect where because it does have this effect where because it does have this effect where it dampens the default mode network. And it dampens the default mode network. And it dampens the default mode network. And we could pick this up with kernel the we could pick this up with kernel the we could pick this up with kernel the brain interface. You can see how the brain interface. You can see how the brain interface. You can see how the default mode network weakens. Like so default mode network weakens. Like so default mode network weakens. Like so basically like think of the brain like a basically like think of the brain like a basically like think of the brain like a globe with airports scattered about globe with airports scattered about globe with airports scattered about >> and you have certain traffic patterns >> and you have certain traffic patterns >> and you have certain traffic patterns like New York to London. You have a like New York to London. You have a like New York to London. You have a certain number of flights every day. certain number of flights every day. certain number of flights every day. That's like a very strong connection. That's like a very strong connection. That's like a very strong connection. But New York to um you know some small But New York to um you know some small But New York to um you know some small town in Arkansas has a very uh low town in Arkansas has a very uh low town in Arkansas has a very uh low traffic map. And so when you do traffic map. And so when you do traffic map. And so when you do something like psilocybin it basically something like psilocybin it basically something like psilocybin it basically takes the airports picks them up and takes the airports picks them up and takes the airports picks them up and then repositions around the world. So then repositions around the world. So then repositions around the world. So it's just all scrambled so that the it's just all scrambled so that the it's just all scrambled so that the traffic patterns aren't the same and traffic patterns aren't the same and traffic patterns aren't the same and then over time then over time then over time >> the neurons don't physically move but >> the neurons don't physically move but >> the neurons don't physically move but the activity shifts around. the activity shifts around. the activity shifts around. >> Exactly. >> Exactly. >> Exactly. >> Right. the neurons are a little bit more >> Right. the neurons are a little bit more >> Right. the neurons are a little bit more random random random >> than they normally would be which >> than they normally would be which >> than they normally would be which arguably drives neuroplasticity causes arguably drives neuroplasticity causes arguably drives neuroplasticity causes those neurons to reach out for new those neurons to reach out for new those neurons to reach out for new connections and when new connections are connections and when new connections are connections and when new connections are made new behaviors new ways of thinking made new behaviors new ways of thinking made new behaviors new ways of thinking emerge coming out of these therapeutics. emerge coming out of these therapeutics. emerge coming out of these therapeutics. Is that a fair way to describe it? Is that a fair way to describe it? Is that a fair way to describe it? >> Exactly right. So you look at my brain >> Exactly right. So you look at my brain >> Exactly right. So you look at my brain on psilocybin from kernel you see my on psilocybin from kernel you see my on psilocybin from kernel you see my patterns before like the New York London patterns before like the New York London patterns before like the New York London connection you see my brain afterwards connection you see my brain afterwards connection you see my brain afterwards and it's exactly what you said new and it's exactly what you said new and it's exactly what you said new patterns are emergent the old ones have patterns are emergent the old ones have patterns are emergent the old ones have have quieted down. It's like a new map have quieted down. It's like a new map have quieted down. It's like a new map of connectivity. And so we saw that of connectivity. And so we saw that of connectivity. And so we saw that happen and that does generate a lot of happen and that does generate a lot of happen and that does generate a lot of neuroplasticity. neuroplasticity. neuroplasticity. >> And obviously this neuroplasticity >> And obviously this neuroplasticity >> And obviously this neuroplasticity rewiring these connections in the brain rewiring these connections in the brain rewiring these connections in the brain is what allows trauma victims or folks is what allows trauma victims or folks is what allows trauma victims or folks that have a certain wiring that they that have a certain wiring that they that have a certain wiring that they keep repeating in their brain which keep repeating in their brain which keep repeating in their brain which causes the trauma and the anxiety in causes the trauma and the anxiety in causes the trauma and the anxiety in their lives to get rewired and then that their lives to get rewired and then that their lives to get rewired and then that trauma and that anxiety feels like it trauma and that anxiety feels like it trauma and that anxiety feels like it dissolves or melts away. Is that a fair? dissolves or melts away. Is that a fair? dissolves or melts away. Is that a fair? >> Exactly right. >> Exactly right. >> Exactly right. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And so this is this has been >> Yeah. And so this is this has been >> Yeah. And so this is this has been documented in psilocybin. It's kind of documented in psilocybin. It's kind of documented in psilocybin. It's kind of well understood. How did you connect well understood. How did you connect well understood. How did you connect that psilocybin data to an effort in that psilocybin data to an effort in that psilocybin data to an effort in longevity or was this just like a random longevity or was this just like a random longevity or was this just like a random idea? Let's try it out. idea? Let's try it out. idea? Let's try it out. >> Yeah, it was. So we we we saw some mouse >> Yeah, it was. So we we we saw some mouse >> Yeah, it was. So we we we saw some mouse data that it had these effects. It also data that it had these effects. It also data that it had these effects. It also showed reduced inflammation. Uh so we showed reduced inflammation. Uh so we showed reduced inflammation. Uh so we said like this is interesting because said like this is interesting because said like this is interesting because most longevity therapies do something most longevity therapies do something most longevity therapies do something with inflammation, right? Like with inflammation, right? Like with inflammation, right? Like inflammation is the killer. So if you inflammation is the killer. So if you inflammation is the killer. So if you can lower inflammation, a very good can lower inflammation, a very good can lower inflammation, a very good sign. uh if you can do something that sign. uh if you can do something that sign. uh if you can do something that makes the brain more youthful and takes makes the brain more youthful and takes makes the brain more youthful and takes down those those big ruts that's use down those those big ruts that's use down those those big ruts that's use also useful. What we found at psilocybin also useful. What we found at psilocybin also useful. What we found at psilocybin though is it had we found a first in though is it had we found a first in though is it had we found a first in human observation it had this this uh human observation it had this this uh human observation it had this this uh metabolic reset in the brain where my metabolic reset in the brain where my metabolic reset in the brain where my blood glucose before this was in the top blood glucose before this was in the top blood glucose before this was in the top 99.5 percentile of all the population. 99.5 percentile of all the population. 99.5 percentile of all the population. >> Okay. after it went to the top 99.9 >> Okay. after it went to the top 99.9 >> Okay. after it went to the top 99.9 percentile like to move my blood glucose percentile like to move my blood glucose percentile like to move my blood glucose from that level is very very hard and from that level is very very hard and from that level is very very hard and but it basically like uh not like but it basically like uh not like but it basically like uh not like metformin where you're doing something metformin where you're doing something metformin where you're doing something on blood glucose this just had a reset on blood glucose this just had a reset on blood glucose this just had a reset across the body also changed my across the body also changed my across the body also changed my microbiome uh so we saw a full-on effect microbiome uh so we saw a full-on effect microbiome uh so we saw a full-on effect so then we said okay if that had that so then we said okay if that had that so then we said okay if that had that consequence 5 MO may have some similar consequence 5 MO may have some similar consequence 5 MO may have some similar characteristics and so characteristics and so characteristics and so >> no one had done this in 5 MO before >> no one had done this in 5 MO before >> no one had done this in 5 MO before >> exactly so there's like there's potent >> exactly so there's like there's potent >> exactly so there's like there's potent there's there's some animal evidence um there's there's some animal evidence um there's there's some animal evidence um but it's the the similar dynamics of but it's the the similar dynamics of but it's the the similar dynamics of like can you take the brain and can you like can you take the brain and can you like can you take the brain and can you basically like smooth out the barnacles basically like smooth out the barnacles basically like smooth out the barnacles that accumulate and 5 MODMT compared to that accumulate and 5 MODMT compared to that accumulate and 5 MODMT compared to psilocybin like just absolutely like psilocybin like just absolutely like psilocybin like just absolutely like blasted clean my default mode network. blasted clean my default mode network. blasted clean my default mode network. It felt like psilocybin dampens it like It felt like psilocybin dampens it like It felt like psilocybin dampens it like it softens it but this thing just it softens it but this thing just it softens it but this thing just annihilated my default annihilated my default annihilated my default >> turned it off completely. Yeah, it just >> turned it off completely. Yeah, it just >> turned it off completely. Yeah, it just it just doesn't run the same way. And it just doesn't run the same way. And it just doesn't run the same way. And like for an example like uh this morning like for an example like uh this morning like for an example like uh this morning I woke up uh catching myself laughing in I woke up uh catching myself laughing in I woke up uh catching myself laughing in a dream. I have not laughed in a dream. a dream. I have not laughed in a dream. a dream. I have not laughed in a dream. I I don't even know when I've ever I I don't even know when I've ever I I don't even know when I've ever laughed in a dream but that is after I laughed in a dream but that is after I laughed in a dream but that is after I woke up I was like that's really weird. woke up I was like that's really weird. woke up I was like that's really weird. Like I don't remember laughing. I looked Like I don't remember laughing. I looked Like I don't remember laughing. I looked it up and like that is a characteristic it up and like that is a characteristic it up and like that is a characteristic of a child. of a child. of a child. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> And so you are restored to this >> And so you are restored to this >> And so you are restored to this childlike state. And I mean the past childlike state. And I mean the past childlike state. And I mean the past couple days uh I have felt childlike. couple days uh I have felt childlike. couple days uh I have felt childlike. You know, yesterday morning I felt that, You know, yesterday morning I felt that, You know, yesterday morning I felt that, you know, that emergent excitement, the you know, that emergent excitement, the you know, that emergent excitement, the bubbling of like today is so exciting. bubbling of like today is so exciting. bubbling of like today is so exciting. I'm going to do new things. I'm going to I'm going to do new things. I'm going to I'm going to do new things. I'm going to have new experiences. Um that you're have new experiences. Um that you're have new experiences. Um that you're just excited about all things. I haven't just excited about all things. I haven't just excited about all things. I haven't felt that. I don't even know when, you felt that. I don't even know when, you felt that. I don't even know when, you know, for so many years. So like it know, for so many years. So like it know, for so many years. So like it really was um profound on every layer. really was um profound on every layer. really was um profound on every layer. And I see I'm stumbling through this cuz And I see I'm stumbling through this cuz And I see I'm stumbling through this cuz I don't even know how to talk about it I don't even know how to talk about it I don't even know how to talk about it yet. yet. yet. >> During the day, you're hanging out, >> During the day, you're hanging out, >> During the day, you're hanging out, you're walking around. Is your brain you're walking around. Is your brain you're walking around. Is your brain having the same normal chatter that it having the same normal chatter that it having the same normal chatter that it did before or do you think that there's did before or do you think that there's did before or do you think that there's a persistent change in that default mode a persistent change in that default mode a persistent change in that default mode network? network? network? >> Yeah, definitely a change. Like with I I >> Yeah, definitely a change. Like with I I >> Yeah, definitely a change. Like with I I was with my partner Kate yesterday and was with my partner Kate yesterday and was with my partner Kate yesterday and we um I did something that we um I did something that we um I did something that made her upset. And so like in that made her upset. And so like in that made her upset. And so like in that situation, you know, like when when situation, you know, like when when situation, you know, like when when couples are in that moment, you you have couples are in that moment, you you have couples are in that moment, you you have like this negotiation. How do I sort like this negotiation. How do I sort like this negotiation. How do I sort this? And it all just became so clear to this? And it all just became so clear to this? And it all just became so clear to me like when children have a fight, you me like when children have a fight, you me like when children have a fight, you have it out and it's just like done. have it out and it's just like done. have it out and it's just like done. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And you move on. But then adults take >> And you move on. But then adults take >> And you move on. But then adults take that and they like package it up and that and they like package it up and that and they like package it up and like they want to weaponize it. Be like like they want to weaponize it. Be like like they want to weaponize it. Be like I got something on you, I got something on you, I got something on you, >> right? I'm like move it. I'm going to >> right? I'm like move it. I'm going to >> right? I'm like move it. I'm going to move the chest pieces and like try to move the chest pieces and like try to move the chest pieces and like try to leverage this and and um leverage this and and um leverage this and and um >> or they store it up like a snake in one >> or they store it up like a snake in one >> or they store it up like a snake in one of those things that pops out all the of those things that pops out all the of those things that pops out all the snakes later, you [laughter] know? It's snakes later, you [laughter] know? It's snakes later, you [laughter] know? It's like package it all up. like package it all up. like package it all up. >> Exactly. And so like we had this and I I >> Exactly. And so like we had this and I I >> Exactly. And so like we had this and I I just felt um absolutely like no need to just felt um absolutely like no need to just felt um absolutely like no need to escalate or to defend or to like it was escalate or to defend or to like it was escalate or to defend or to like it was just easy just easy just easy >> and um it was a breakthrough in our >> and um it was a breakthrough in our >> and um it was a breakthrough in our relationship where I was able to relationship where I was able to relationship where I was able to communicate with her in a way. And so communicate with her in a way. And so communicate with her in a way. And so it's like h laughing in my sleep. It's it's like h laughing in my sleep. It's it's like h laughing in my sleep. It's how I deal with my partner when I walk how I deal with my partner when I walk how I deal with my partner when I walk around. I just feel so much I uh I feel around. I just feel so much I uh I feel around. I just feel so much I uh I feel so much more funny, you know, like my so much more funny, you know, like my so much more funny, you know, like my ability to make quips ability to make quips ability to make quips >> that are just immediate. Uh you know, >> that are just immediate. Uh you know, >> that are just immediate. Uh you know, like so yeah, I just feel renewed as a like so yeah, I just feel renewed as a like so yeah, I just feel renewed as a person in a way that I just really person in a way that I just really person in a way that I just really didn't imagine. didn't imagine. didn't imagine. >> Have you tried hallucinogenics before >> Have you tried hallucinogenics before >> Have you tried hallucinogenics before you started your longevity path a couple you started your longevity path a couple you started your longevity path a couple of years ago? of years ago? of years ago? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And did you do that recreationally or >> And did you do that recreationally or >> And did you do that recreationally or therapeutically? It was mostly therapeutically? It was mostly therapeutically? It was mostly therapeutic in that I I had sold my therapeutic in that I I had sold my therapeutic in that I I had sold my company branch of mo. I got a divorce. I company branch of mo. I got a divorce. I company branch of mo. I got a divorce. I left the Mormon church and I was trying left the Mormon church and I was trying left the Mormon church and I was trying to remap like what is life? Who am I? to remap like what is life? Who am I? to remap like what is life? Who am I? What do I do? So I was in that What do I do? So I was in that What do I do? So I was in that rebuilding stage where I just dabbled of rebuilding stage where I just dabbled of rebuilding stage where I just dabbled of like you know I did I did ketamine at like you know I did I did ketamine at like you know I did I did ketamine at Colonel. So one of our first studies at Colonel. So one of our first studies at Colonel. So one of our first studies at Colonel is we said ketamine was a up and Colonel is we said ketamine was a up and Colonel is we said ketamine was a up and cominging therapy for depression and we cominging therapy for depression and we cominging therapy for depression and we posed the question what happens when you posed the question what happens when you posed the question what happens when you do ketamine. And so we did the world's do ketamine. And so we did the world's do ketamine. And so we did the world's most extensive measurement of ketamine most extensive measurement of ketamine most extensive measurement of ketamine with kernel before, during, and after. with kernel before, during, and after. with kernel before, during, and after. And so that was interesting like and it And so that was interesting like and it And so that was interesting like and it has some kind of, you know, transient has some kind of, you know, transient has some kind of, you know, transient effect, but that's like a a a like a effect, but that's like a a a like a effect, but that's like a a a like a little league relative to 5 MO. little league relative to 5 MO. little league relative to 5 MO. >> And so as you've gone through this, >> And so as you've gone through this, >> And so as you've gone through this, maybe share a little bit of the MRI data maybe share a little bit of the MRI data maybe share a little bit of the MRI data that you're gathering and the other data that you're gathering and the other data that you're gathering and the other data mapping neurological effects. mapping neurological effects. mapping neurological effects. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And tell us a little bit about what >> And tell us a little bit about what >> And tell us a little bit about what you've learned you've learned you've learned >> so far. Nothing. uh I have my subjective >> so far. Nothing. uh I have my subjective >> so far. Nothing. uh I have my subjective experience to share but we we have a experience to share but we we have a experience to share but we we have a structural brain MRI we have a structural brain MRI we have a structural brain MRI we have a functional brain MRI we did kernel which functional brain MRI we did kernel which functional brain MRI we did kernel which is like an optical interface and then I is like an optical interface and then I is like an optical interface and then I did realtime EEG capture did realtime EEG capture did realtime EEG capture >> and we should just talk about I think >> and we should just talk about I think >> and we should just talk about I think it's important structural you can see it's important structural you can see it's important structural you can see the the physical brain the the physical brain the the physical brain functional you can see the activity in functional you can see the activity in functional you can see the activity in the brain the brain the brain >> so neurons firing and neurons that are >> so neurons firing and neurons that are >> so neurons firing and neurons that are not firing right not firing right not firing right >> and then electrical actions that are >> and then electrical actions that are >> and then electrical actions that are measured by an electrical device measured by an electrical device measured by an electrical device >> so we basically I wanted cuz the brain >> so we basically I wanted cuz the brain >> so we basically I wanted cuz the brain is very so we've had a lot of success is very so we've had a lot of success is very so we've had a lot of success rejuvenating my heart and my lungs and rejuvenating my heart and my lungs and rejuvenating my heart and my lungs and muscle and body fat but rejuvenating the muscle and body fat but rejuvenating the muscle and body fat but rejuvenating the brain is very hard brain is very hard brain is very hard >> right >> right >> right >> and so we this is why this is so such a >> and so we this is why this is so such a >> and so we this is why this is so such a promising therapy so we wanted to look promising therapy so we wanted to look promising therapy so we wanted to look at the brain uh through every modality at the brain uh through every modality at the brain uh through every modality possible we wanted to look at blood flow possible we wanted to look at blood flow possible we wanted to look at blood flow structural molecular you know the wave structural molecular you know the wave structural molecular you know the wave pattern form so we it's a it's a very pattern form so we it's a it's a very pattern form so we it's a it's a very high fidelity quantification and so high fidelity quantification and so high fidelity quantification and so we'll see what the data comes out um I'm we'll see what the data comes out um I'm we'll see what the data comes out um I'm very excited yeah very excited yeah very excited yeah >> you did this on psilocybin as well, >> you did this on psilocybin as well, >> you did this on psilocybin as well, right? You map the brain over time. What right? You map the brain over time. What right? You map the brain over time. What did you learn there? did you learn there? did you learn there? >> Dramatic >> Dramatic >> Dramatic uh restoration of youthful brain uh restoration of youthful brain uh restoration of youthful brain patterns. patterns. patterns. >> Yeah. Right. >> Yeah. Right. >> Yeah. Right. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And >> And >> And what comes after 5me [laughter] what comes after 5me [laughter] what comes after 5me [laughter] I mean how far do you take this? I mean how far do you take this? I mean how far do you take this? >> Yeah. Honestly, um >> Yeah. Honestly, um >> Yeah. Honestly, um I am so encouraged by psychedelics. I I am so encouraged by psychedelics. I I am so encouraged by psychedelics. I you know like in in the community where you know like in in the community where you know like in in the community where I hang out, psychedelics have always I hang out, psychedelics have always I hang out, psychedelics have always been understood as you know it's like a been understood as you know it's like a been understood as you know it's like a retreat or it's like a a ritual or you retreat or it's like a a ritual or you retreat or it's like a a ritual or you go to like do various explorations but go to like do various explorations but go to like do various explorations but never in the world of longevity. It's never in the world of longevity. It's never in the world of longevity. It's never been understood as that thing. And never been understood as that thing. And never been understood as that thing. And now after seeing the data now I um now after seeing the data now I um now after seeing the data now I um and of course you have to be very and of course you have to be very and of course you have to be very careful when talking about psychedelics careful when talking about psychedelics careful when talking about psychedelics because they're extremely powerful. It's because they're extremely powerful. It's because they're extremely powerful. It's not like go out and do them everybody not like go out and do them everybody not like go out and do them everybody right. It's like it needs to be done right. It's like it needs to be done right. It's like it needs to be done properly with a licensed professional. properly with a licensed professional. properly with a licensed professional. It needs to be done carefully. The It needs to be done carefully. The It needs to be done carefully. The person needs to be in the right state. person needs to be in the right state. person needs to be in the right state. Like it is not to be taken lightly. But Like it is not to be taken lightly. But Like it is not to be taken lightly. But I am uh more interested than ever in I am uh more interested than ever in I am uh more interested than ever in psychedelic compounds. They're just psychedelic compounds. They're just psychedelic compounds. They're just uniquely powerful. uniquely powerful. uniquely powerful. >> There's some arguments to be made that >> There's some arguments to be made that >> There's some arguments to be made that psychedelics can induce permanent psychedelics can induce permanent psychedelics can induce permanent psychosis. psychosis. psychosis. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Cause functional changes and drive some >> Cause functional changes and drive some >> Cause functional changes and drive some people that might be predisposed into people that might be predisposed into people that might be predisposed into schizophrenic states. schizophrenic states. schizophrenic states. >> That's right. How did you get over those >> That's right. How did you get over those >> That's right. How did you get over those risks? Because for a lot of people that risks? Because for a lot of people that risks? Because for a lot of people that would turn them off to trying would turn them off to trying would turn them off to trying psychedelics and it's not a nonzero psychedelics and it's not a nonzero psychedelics and it's not a nonzero percentage of people that suffer these percentage of people that suffer these percentage of people that suffer these consequences. consequences. consequences. >> Yep. I agree. And and also people who >> Yep. I agree. And and also people who >> Yep. I agree. And and also people who have really bad trips that leave them have really bad trips that leave them have really bad trips that leave them star scarred. So it's it really is. And star scarred. So it's it really is. And star scarred. So it's it really is. And I think in in part of it is um what I think in in part of it is um what I think in in part of it is um what could be contributing to this is uh could be contributing to this is uh could be contributing to this is uh people who for example who have tried uh people who for example who have tried uh people who for example who have tried uh magic mushrooms. magic mushrooms. magic mushrooms. You know it's in a social situation. You know it's in a social situation. You know it's in a social situation. Someone's got a bag. you pull out some Someone's got a bag. you pull out some Someone's got a bag. you pull out some mushrooms, it's like yeah, like weighs mushrooms, it's like yeah, like weighs mushrooms, it's like yeah, like weighs blank and they pop it in, but they have blank and they pop it in, but they have blank and they pop it in, but they have no idea what kind of mushroom strain no idea what kind of mushroom strain no idea what kind of mushroom strain they're eating. They don't know what the they're eating. They don't know what the they're eating. They don't know what the dose of psilocybin is. Uh, so it's like dose of psilocybin is. Uh, so it's like dose of psilocybin is. Uh, so it's like unquantified, unsupervised, wrong unquantified, unsupervised, wrong unquantified, unsupervised, wrong sentence setting. And so much of it I sentence setting. And so much of it I sentence setting. And so much of it I think you can the risk persists, but I think you can the risk persists, but I think you can the risk persists, but I don't think we we've approached don't think we we've approached don't think we we've approached psychedelics with the appropriate rigor psychedelics with the appropriate rigor psychedelics with the appropriate rigor that we should to make it safe. And so that we should to make it safe. And so that we should to make it safe. And so it's not to say that we can solve for it's not to say that we can solve for it's not to say that we can solve for the safety issues for all people. some the safety issues for all people. some the safety issues for all people. some people just may not be the appropriate people just may not be the appropriate people just may not be the appropriate candidate for it. But I think if we do candidate for it. But I think if we do candidate for it. But I think if we do create a safety structure around it, create a safety structure around it, create a safety structure around it, they could deliver the benefits people they could deliver the benefits people they could deliver the benefits people want uh without, you know, with less of want uh without, you know, with less of want uh without, you know, with less of the risk. But definitely I agree with the risk. But definitely I agree with the risk. But definitely I agree with you like it's again it it deserves all you like it's again it it deserves all you like it's again it it deserves all the caution in the world. Do you think the caution in the world. Do you think the caution in the world. Do you think it's like neurogenic, neuroplasticity, it's like neurogenic, neuroplasticity, it's like neurogenic, neuroplasticity, trauma resolution? And I mean what is trauma resolution? And I mean what is trauma resolution? And I mean what is the way that this is going to be allowed the way that this is going to be allowed the way that this is going to be allowed to become call it a medical therapeutic to become call it a medical therapeutic to become call it a medical therapeutic that can be more broadly triled and then that can be more broadly triled and then that can be more broadly triled and then eventually figure out how to bring it to eventually figure out how to bring it to eventually figure out how to bring it to people without it being carrying all the people without it being carrying all the people without it being carrying all the risks and burdens that it does today. risks and burdens that it does today. risks and burdens that it does today. >> I mean if I just subjectively compare my >> I mean if I just subjectively compare my >> I mean if I just subjectively compare my experience with 5 MO to you having a experience with 5 MO to you having a experience with 5 MO to you having a better diet and exercising every day and better diet and exercising every day and better diet and exercising every day and uh sleeping well and doing the sauna and uh sleeping well and doing the sauna and uh sleeping well and doing the sauna and doing hyper oxygen therapy. doing hyper oxygen therapy. doing hyper oxygen therapy. this was more efficacious than all of this was more efficacious than all of this was more efficacious than all of them in terms of the reset of me as a them in terms of the reset of me as a them in terms of the reset of me as a human. It it just is incomparable. And I human. It it just is incomparable. And I human. It it just is incomparable. And I guess I'm I'm really left pondering like guess I'm I'm really left pondering like guess I'm I'm really left pondering like for this molecule to have such a for this molecule to have such a for this molecule to have such a gigantic impact now like how long will gigantic impact now like how long will gigantic impact now like how long will it last? What's the decay curve like? it last? What's the decay curve like? it last? What's the decay curve like? You know, will I find I I become the You know, will I find I I become the You know, will I find I I become the former Brian within 30 days, 60 days? Do former Brian within 30 days, 60 days? Do former Brian within 30 days, 60 days? Do I have to repeat this again? I don't I have to repeat this again? I don't I have to repeat this again? I don't know. But it really is, you know, you know. But it really is, you know, you know. But it really is, you know, you when you sleep well, you feel great. when you sleep well, you feel great. when you sleep well, you feel great. When you exercise, great. But like When you exercise, great. But like When you exercise, great. But like nothing like what 5 MO did in terms of nothing like what 5 MO did in terms of nothing like what 5 MO did in terms of of like the reset of me as a human. of like the reset of me as a human. of like the reset of me as a human. >> So let's just talk about the >> So let's just talk about the >> So let's just talk about the consequences outside of the consequences outside of the consequences outside of the physiological physiological physiological which is life. which is life. which is life. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> There are lots of stories and friends >> There are lots of stories and friends >> There are lots of stories and friends that I have that and people that I know that I have that and people that I know that I have that and people that I know >> that have tried a heavy psychedelic like >> that have tried a heavy psychedelic like >> that have tried a heavy psychedelic like an Iawaska or something. an Iawaska or something. an Iawaska or something. >> They were the CEO of a company and then >> They were the CEO of a company and then >> They were the CEO of a company and then they quit their company and they go off they quit their company and they go off they quit their company and they go off to the jungle, leave their family, to the jungle, leave their family, to the jungle, leave their family, divorce their their partner. divorce their their partner. divorce their their partner. um make such dramatic life changes um make such dramatic life changes um make such dramatic life changes because their perspective has been because their perspective has been because their perspective has been shifted so much shifted so much shifted so much >> that they re-evaluate what matters in >> that they re-evaluate what matters in >> that they re-evaluate what matters in life to such a degree that they give up life to such a degree that they give up life to such a degree that they give up a lot of the things that mattered a lot of the things that mattered a lot of the things that mattered before. before. before. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> In the wake of that, there are people >> In the wake of that, there are people >> In the wake of that, there are people that feel they're a victim of that that feel they're a victim of that that feel they're a victim of that behavioral shift, the investors in the behavioral shift, the investors in the behavioral shift, the investors in the company, the employees, the family company, the employees, the family company, the employees, the family members, etc. Yeah. members, etc. Yeah. members, etc. Yeah. >> Can you just talk a little bit about >> Can you just talk a little bit about >> Can you just talk a little bit about those broad risks because we've seen it those broad risks because we've seen it those broad risks because we've seen it and I don't know if you've seen the same and I don't know if you've seen the same and I don't know if you've seen the same but friends that have kind of like said but friends that have kind of like said but friends that have kind of like said I have this new perspective I'm giving I have this new perspective I'm giving I have this new perspective I'm giving up my life. up my life. up my life. >> I've seen the same thing and I um one >> I've seen the same thing and I um one >> I've seen the same thing and I um one investor told me that he even put it in investor told me that he even put it in investor told me that he even put it in the deal docks that you know if we the deal docks that you know if we the deal docks that you know if we invest you're not going to do these invest you're not going to do these invest you're not going to do these psychedelics because they wanted to psychedelics because they wanted to psychedelics because they wanted to minimize the the risk profile. It's a minimize the the risk profile. It's a minimize the the risk profile. It's a thing thing thing >> in your deal in an investment in you. >> in your deal in an investment in you. >> in your deal in an investment in you. No, I just spoke because I've been doing No, I just spoke because I've been doing No, I just spoke because I've been doing this uh people bring this up as a topic this uh people bring this up as a topic this uh people bring this up as a topic of conversation, right? of conversation, right? of conversation, right? >> And so they say like, I see you're doing >> And so they say like, I see you're doing >> And so they say like, I see you're doing this for longevity, but you know, like this for longevity, but you know, like this for longevity, but you know, like I've seen so many examples where people I've seen so many examples where people I've seen so many examples where people put money in, then you lose the founder. put money in, then you lose the founder. put money in, then you lose the founder. Like they're off, everyone's high and Like they're off, everyone's high and Like they're off, everyone's high and dry. And so they were telling me that dry. And so they were telling me that dry. And so they were telling me that they put into Dill Docs that they can't they put into Dill Docs that they can't they put into Dill Docs that they can't do this for the duration of the company. do this for the duration of the company. do this for the duration of the company. And so it is a thing. And you know, I I And so it is a thing. And you know, I I And so it is a thing. And you know, I I have nothing to say about it other than have nothing to say about it other than have nothing to say about it other than I know it happens. Um, also I would say I know it happens. Um, also I would say I know it happens. Um, also I would say that most people in the tech world that that most people in the tech world that that most people in the tech world that I'm familiar with, again, they've done I'm familiar with, again, they've done I'm familiar with, again, they've done this in retreat centers or in social this in retreat centers or in social this in retreat centers or in social environments. It's not quantified. It's environments. It's not quantified. It's environments. It's not quantified. It's not set and setting. It's so it's a not set and setting. It's so it's a not set and setting. It's so it's a different thing. But I will say like, different thing. But I will say like, different thing. But I will say like, you know, I I guess me as a person, what you know, I I guess me as a person, what you know, I I guess me as a person, what I'm trying to focus on, I came back even I'm trying to focus on, I came back even I'm trying to focus on, I came back even more motivated to do what I'm doing now. more motivated to do what I'm doing now. more motivated to do what I'm doing now. Uh I don't have a desire to go off in Uh I don't have a desire to go off in Uh I don't have a desire to go off in the woods, you know, and like and live the woods, you know, and like and live the woods, you know, and like and live that kind of life. It it it emboldened that kind of life. It it it emboldened that kind of life. It it it emboldened me to work on these things, but no me to work on these things, but no me to work on these things, but no question about it. You you do have a question about it. You you do have a question about it. You you do have a dramatic shift in perspective, and it's dramatic shift in perspective, and it's dramatic shift in perspective, and it's it's very hard to get. it's very hard to get. it's very hard to get. >> It begs a very important philosophical >> It begs a very important philosophical >> It begs a very important philosophical question. question. question. >> Who am I? >> Who am I? >> Who am I? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> If I'm defined by my experiences, >> If I'm defined by my experiences, >> If I'm defined by my experiences, it roughly equates to my neurons are it roughly equates to my neurons are it roughly equates to my neurons are wired in a way. wired in a way. wired in a way. >> Yes. That's a consequence of my >> Yes. That's a consequence of my >> Yes. That's a consequence of my experiences. And if I go in and take a experiences. And if I go in and take a experiences. And if I go in and take a drug and in a few hours rewire all my drug and in a few hours rewire all my drug and in a few hours rewire all my neurons, am I the same person? neurons, am I the same person? neurons, am I the same person? >> What makes Brian Brian? You can maybe >> What makes Brian Brian? You can maybe >> What makes Brian Brian? You can maybe recall some memories of Brian recall some memories of Brian recall some memories of Brian >> prior to taking the psychedelic, >> prior to taking the psychedelic, >> prior to taking the psychedelic, >> but Brian as a person has been rewired. >> but Brian as a person has been rewired. >> but Brian as a person has been rewired. >> Are you a different person now? And what >> Are you a different person now? And what >> Are you a different person now? And what does that say about are we ever a does that say about are we ever a does that say about are we ever a persistent person? persistent person? persistent person? >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> Yeah, your question is spot on. probably >> Yeah, your question is spot on. probably >> Yeah, your question is spot on. probably the most dramatic reconstruction of your the most dramatic reconstruction of your the most dramatic reconstruction of your 60 plus trillion cells than anything you 60 plus trillion cells than anything you 60 plus trillion cells than anything you can do in life. Yeah. Like maybe like a can do in life. Yeah. Like maybe like a can do in life. Yeah. Like maybe like a near-death experience, you know, would near-death experience, you know, would near-death experience, you know, would would maybe uh be close, but it's a would maybe uh be close, but it's a would maybe uh be close, but it's a dramatic rewiring of you as a as a dramatic rewiring of you as a as a dramatic rewiring of you as a as a human. human. human. >> Your values can change, too. >> Your values can change, too. >> Your values can change, too. >> That's right. >> That's right. >> That's right. >> And you could judge the values pre and >> And you could judge the values pre and >> And you could judge the values pre and post, right? You could judge values post, right? You could judge values post, right? You could judge values ascribed to you by a religion ascribed to you by a religion ascribed to you by a religion >> or perhaps values ascribed to you by >> or perhaps values ascribed to you by >> or perhaps values ascribed to you by responsibility to family members, responsibility to family members, responsibility to family members, children, spouses, partners, what have children, spouses, partners, what have children, spouses, partners, what have you. you. you. >> You abandon them after you go through >> You abandon them after you go through >> You abandon them after you go through this change. So your values have this change. So your values have this change. So your values have changed. Is it right or wrong? changed. Is it right or wrong? changed. Is it right or wrong? >> That's right. >> That's right. >> That's right. >> I think is another important question >> I think is another important question >> I think is another important question that comes out of all this. that comes out of all this. that comes out of all this. >> I agree. And like you you now like you >> I agree. And like you you now like you >> I agree. And like you you now like you now think about that that's been through now think about that that's been through now think about that that's been through the frame where the world changes at a the frame where the world changes at a the frame where the world changes at a certain speed. Now you take the world certain speed. Now you take the world certain speed. Now you take the world where it's changing faster. So we now where it's changing faster. So we now where it's changing faster. So we now know that it's hard to predict what's know that it's hard to predict what's know that it's hard to predict what's going to happen two weeks from now or a going to happen two weeks from now or a going to happen two weeks from now or a month, right? Like things are changing month, right? Like things are changing month, right? Like things are changing very quickly. And so now you come up very quickly. And so now you come up very quickly. And so now you come up with this practical question. Can humans with this practical question. Can humans with this practical question. Can humans change fast enough in the world where AI change fast enough in the world where AI change fast enough in the world where AI is the dominant engine of innovation? is the dominant engine of innovation? is the dominant engine of innovation? And so in that case, like you may want And so in that case, like you may want And so in that case, like you may want psychedelics as your ally to say, as a psychedelics as your ally to say, as a psychedelics as your ally to say, as a human, I'm struggling to like move with human, I'm struggling to like move with human, I'm struggling to like move with the change. the change. the change. >> Yeah. And so there there's potentially >> Yeah. And so there there's potentially >> Yeah. And so there there's potentially where it it flips from a liability to an where it it flips from a liability to an where it it flips from a liability to an asset where like now I do want that asset where like now I do want that asset where like now I do want that restructure changing even though you restructure changing even though you restructure changing even though you have some tail risk of like maybe my have some tail risk of like maybe my have some tail risk of like maybe my priorities will shift. priorities will shift. priorities will shift. >> I think you have profound what I would >> I think you have profound what I would >> I think you have profound what I would call psychoflexibility call psychoflexibility call psychoflexibility and I think most people don't. They have and I think most people don't. They have and I think most people don't. They have either a disinterest in changing who either a disinterest in changing who either a disinterest in changing who they are overnight they are overnight they are overnight >> or they're fearful of the the >> or they're fearful of the the >> or they're fearful of the the ramifications or the experience ramifications or the experience ramifications or the experience >> and that they wouldn't go through it. >> and that they wouldn't go through it. >> and that they wouldn't go through it. How far would you take it? Would you How far would you take it? Would you How far would you take it? Would you wire yourself up to a neural link or wire yourself up to a neural link or wire yourself up to a neural link or neural enhancement device that would neural enhancement device that would neural enhancement device that would give you the ability to have information give you the ability to have information give you the ability to have information on demand and maybe change your on demand and maybe change your on demand and maybe change your personality and capacity as a human personality and capacity as a human personality and capacity as a human through an implant? Would you consider through an implant? Would you consider through an implant? Would you consider doing something like that? You would doing something like that? You would doing something like that? You would would you consider a transgenic system would you consider a transgenic system would you consider a transgenic system where you basically take a plasmid which where you basically take a plasmid which where you basically take a plasmid which would then express a set of proteins in would then express a set of proteins in would then express a set of proteins in your body and change uh gene expression your body and change uh gene expression your body and change uh gene expression profiles and cells in your body and profiles and cells in your body and profiles and cells in your body and basically can rewire you as a different basically can rewire you as a different basically can rewire you as a different person? person? person? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Is there a limit to what you would >> Yes. Is there a limit to what you would >> Yes. Is there a limit to what you would try? Oh, try? Oh, try? Oh, >> interesting. Where do you think that >> interesting. Where do you think that >> interesting. Where do you think that comes from? comes from? comes from? >> I think I I find it to be the most >> I think I I find it to be the most >> I think I I find it to be the most exciting configuration of life. Uh the exciting configuration of life. Uh the exciting configuration of life. Uh the ability to play on the frontier, uh ability to play on the frontier, uh ability to play on the frontier, uh novelty and expedition and challenge. novelty and expedition and challenge. novelty and expedition and challenge. That's really my That's really my That's really my >> Did you always have it or are you >> Did you always have it or are you >> Did you always have it or are you responding to childhood suppression of responding to childhood suppression of responding to childhood suppression of those? those? those? >> It's probably it's probably an >> It's probably it's probably an >> It's probably it's probably an overcompensation of of trauma response overcompensation of of trauma response overcompensation of of trauma response like most things are. And so, you know, like most things are. And so, you know, like most things are. And so, you know, as a child, I lived in a very structured as a child, I lived in a very structured as a child, I lived in a very structured religious environment where things were religious environment where things were religious environment where things were cemented like here's the story, here's cemented like here's the story, here's cemented like here's the story, here's the plan, here's what you do and what the plan, here's what you do and what the plan, here's what you do and what you don't do. you don't do. you don't do. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And so, yeah, maybe it's probably just >> And so, yeah, maybe it's probably just >> And so, yeah, maybe it's probably just I'm now a flip in the opposite. I'm now a flip in the opposite. I'm now a flip in the opposite. >> And so, I mean, that's like probably >> And so, I mean, that's like probably >> And so, I mean, that's like probably true that I really uh I don't trust my true that I really uh I don't trust my true that I really uh I don't trust my internal generation of reality. You internal generation of reality. You internal generation of reality. You know, I know I'm always making things know, I know I'm always making things know, I know I'm always making things up. I've got 188 chronicle biases like up. I've got 188 chronicle biases like up. I've got 188 chronicle biases like all humans do. So I'm just I'm generally all humans do. So I'm just I'm generally all humans do. So I'm just I'm generally suspicious of all things all time and I suspicious of all things all time and I suspicious of all things all time and I don't take myself very seriously. So I don't take myself very seriously. So I don't take myself very seriously. So I just find the the frontier play space to just find the the frontier play space to just find the the frontier play space to be like right now I mean you know what be like right now I mean you know what be like right now I mean you know what you're doing in building a company is you're doing in building a company is you're doing in building a company is like you just open up a a toolkit and like you just open up a a toolkit and like you just open up a a toolkit and say like what can I build and how do I say like what can I build and how do I say like what can I build and how do I modify and uh so I agree with you I do modify and uh so I agree with you I do modify and uh so I agree with you I do have a a strong proclivity towards have a a strong proclivity towards have a a strong proclivity towards openness of play. openness of play. openness of play. >> Do you find that you've been challenged >> Do you find that you've been challenged >> Do you find that you've been challenged in maintaining I would call it external in maintaining I would call it external in maintaining I would call it external responsibility as you explore and responsibility as you explore and responsibility as you explore and enhance yourself so much. Do you give up enhance yourself so much. Do you give up enhance yourself so much. Do you give up the responsibility to others around you the responsibility to others around you the responsibility to others around you who maybe are dependent on you or or in who maybe are dependent on you or or in who maybe are dependent on you or or in need of you? need of you? need of you? >> Yeah, I have three kids and so um I do >> Yeah, I have three kids and so um I do >> Yeah, I have three kids and so um I do think about them a lot and I you being a think about them a lot and I you being a think about them a lot and I you being a father is a really important thing to me father is a really important thing to me father is a really important thing to me and it's an important part of my and it's an important part of my and it's an important part of my identity and so that has not changed. So identity and so that has not changed. So identity and so that has not changed. So I've never uh vacasillated on that or I've never uh vacasillated on that or I've never uh vacasillated on that or changed my disposition towards that. For changed my disposition towards that. For changed my disposition towards that. For those around me, I guess fortunately I those around me, I guess fortunately I those around me, I guess fortunately I have a a social group that just says go have a a social group that just says go have a a social group that just says go and play. There's there's really no one and play. There's there's really no one and play. There's there's really no one in my life in my life in my life >> that tries to claw me back. There's no >> that tries to claw me back. There's no >> that tries to claw me back. There's no Velcro. Velcro. Velcro. >> It's just all encouraging. And so that I >> It's just all encouraging. And so that I >> It's just all encouraging. And so that I guess I feel very fortunate that guess I feel very fortunate that guess I feel very fortunate that everyone around me and they're willing everyone around me and they're willing everyone around me and they're willing to take the risks. I mean, this is when to take the risks. I mean, this is when to take the risks. I mean, this is when I sat down for 5 MO. I mean, my my I sat down for 5 MO. I mean, my my I sat down for 5 MO. I mean, my my partner Kate like she's got a ton of partner Kate like she's got a ton of partner Kate like she's got a ton of risk. Like what if it goes poorly? What risk. Like what if it goes poorly? What risk. Like what if it goes poorly? What if I change my perspectives? What if if I change my perspectives? What if if I change my perspectives? What if something bad happens? something bad happens? something bad happens? Well, one could make an argument that Well, one could make an argument that Well, one could make an argument that taking that degree of risk where taking that degree of risk where taking that degree of risk where something could have gone wrong, something could have gone wrong, something could have gone wrong, >> the people around you are enabling >> the people around you are enabling >> the people around you are enabling versus being supportive, right? versus being supportive, right? versus being supportive, right? >> That's right. That's right. >> That's right. That's right. >> That's right. That's right. >> I mean, >> I mean, >> I mean, >> yeah, that's right. >> yeah, that's right. >> yeah, that's right. >> That's a consequence. But let's shift >> That's a consequence. But let's shift >> That's a consequence. But let's shift topics to other uh topics to other uh topics to other uh modalities for longevity. modalities for longevity. modalities for longevity. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> What else is on the horizon? So, you've >> What else is on the horizon? So, you've >> What else is on the horizon? So, you've had this profound set of experiences had this profound set of experiences had this profound set of experiences with psychedelics. You've documented in with psychedelics. You've documented in with psychedelics. You've documented in a very extraordinary and exquisite a very extraordinary and exquisite a very extraordinary and exquisite fashion all of the other things that fashion all of the other things that fashion all of the other things that you've been doing with interventions. you've been doing with interventions. you've been doing with interventions. Are there other things that are on the Are there other things that are on the Are there other things that are on the horizon that you're either excited about horizon that you're either excited about horizon that you're either excited about or that you're considering yourself? or that you're considering yourself? or that you're considering yourself? >> Yeah. I mean, two of the ones that we've >> Yeah. I mean, two of the ones that we've >> Yeah. I mean, two of the ones that we've spoken about, cell therapy and gene spoken about, cell therapy and gene spoken about, cell therapy and gene therapy. therapy. therapy. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. They um they're all in the >> Yeah. They um they're all in the >> Yeah. They um they're all in the pipeline. So, they're not ready yet. pipeline. So, they're not ready yet. pipeline. So, they're not ready yet. We've we've knocked out all the stuff We've we've knocked out all the stuff We've we've knocked out all the stuff you can do today. Like, we've gone you can do today. Like, we've gone you can do today. Like, we've gone through it all, done it all. Um the through it all, done it all. Um the through it all, done it all. Um the nextG therapies are just not there yet. nextG therapies are just not there yet. nextG therapies are just not there yet. So, we're looking at mitochondrial So, we're looking at mitochondrial So, we're looking at mitochondrial rejuvenation. I think that's incredible. rejuvenation. I think that's incredible. rejuvenation. I think that's incredible. I think mitochondrial augmentation I think mitochondrial augmentation I think mitochondrial augmentation therapy and there was a paper I saw therapy and there was a paper I saw therapy and there was a paper I saw where in order to get the mitochondria where in order to get the mitochondria where in order to get the mitochondria in the cell, they coded the mitochondria in the cell, they coded the mitochondria in the cell, they coded the mitochondria in effectively a red blood cell envelope in effectively a red blood cell envelope in effectively a red blood cell envelope >> which made it more transportable into >> which made it more transportable into >> which made it more transportable into cells and less uh attack by the immune cells and less uh attack by the immune cells and less uh attack by the immune system which is incredible. And I I'm a system which is incredible. And I I'm a system which is incredible. And I I'm a big big big believer in this this this big big big believer in this this this big big big believer in this this this course of therapeut therapeutic modality course of therapeut therapeutic modality course of therapeut therapeutic modality that no one has even recognized. that no one has even recognized. that no one has even recognized. >> I agree. We have our first uh >> I agree. We have our first uh >> I agree. We have our first uh mitochondrial therapy lined up. So mitochondrial therapy lined up. So mitochondrial therapy lined up. So >> how are you going to do it? you're >> how are you going to do it? you're >> how are you going to do it? you're you're like 99.9%. You need someone you're like 99.9%. You need someone you're like 99.9%. You need someone who's like 48.7% who's like 48.7% who's like 48.7% [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> to try the mitochondrial >> to try the mitochondrial >> to try the mitochondrial particularly like you know I think they particularly like you know I think they particularly like you know I think they tried it in Parkinson's patients tried it in Parkinson's patients tried it in Parkinson's patients Alzheimer's patients that's where you Alzheimer's patients that's where you Alzheimer's patients that's where you could really see profound shifts in could really see profound shifts in could really see profound shifts in >> in certain metrics for you it's like >> in certain metrics for you it's like >> in certain metrics for you it's like 99.9 to what like 99.9 to what like 99.9 to what like >> yeah I have the mitochondria you know of >> yeah I have the mitochondria you know of >> yeah I have the mitochondria you know of a 48-year-old right so like what if I a 48-year-old right so like what if I a 48-year-old right so like what if I >> what if I yes >> what if I yes >> what if I yes >> you could go to your siblings child >> you could go to your siblings child >> you could go to your siblings child because the mitochondria is passed because the mitochondria is passed because the mitochondria is passed maternally because it's in the it's in maternally because it's in the it's in maternally because it's in the it's in the egg Yeah. the egg Yeah. the egg Yeah. >> So, it's the mother's mitochondria. So, >> So, it's the mother's mitochondria. So, >> So, it's the mother's mitochondria. So, if you go down in the mother's line, if you go down in the mother's line, if you go down in the mother's line, >> if you have a sister who has a kid, >> if you have a sister who has a kid, >> if you have a sister who has a kid, they're going to have very young they're going to have very young they're going to have very young mitochondria. You can take a little mitochondria. You can take a little mitochondria. You can take a little blood sample and then blood sample and then blood sample and then >> grow their mitochondria extensively and >> grow their mitochondria extensively and >> grow their mitochondria extensively and use that as a biological match to use that as a biological match to use that as a biological match to >> This is a a perfect extension. I've had >> This is a a perfect extension. I've had >> This is a a perfect extension. I've had a blood boy as a son. a blood boy as a son. a blood boy as a son. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, now I'm just going to go to the >> So, now I'm just going to go to the >> So, now I'm just going to go to the extended family and be like, "Guys, it's extended family and be like, "Guys, it's extended family and be like, "Guys, it's a it's a family project." a it's a family project." a it's a family project." >> Yeah. Family project. Exactly. Yeah. >> Yeah. Family project. Exactly. Yeah. >> Yeah. Family project. Exactly. Yeah. >> Well, that one's super interesting. We >> Well, that one's super interesting. We >> Well, that one's super interesting. We also have one we're doing. Um I I'm now also have one we're doing. Um I I'm now also have one we're doing. Um I I'm now building building building >> Sorry. Are you going to do your own >> Sorry. Are you going to do your own >> Sorry. Are you going to do your own mitochondrial transplantation? You're mitochondrial transplantation? You're mitochondrial transplantation? You're going to build a bioreactor or you using going to build a bioreactor or you using going to build a bioreactor or you using working with one of the third parties working with one of the third parties working with one of the third parties that are that are that are >> Yeah. third company. Yeah. So I'll get >> Yeah. third company. Yeah. So I'll get >> Yeah. third company. Yeah. So I'll get I'll do a blood draw in the next week or I'll do a blood draw in the next week or I'll do a blood draw in the next week or two. They'll spin up and then we'll do two. They'll spin up and then we'll do two. They'll spin up and then we'll do it. Yeah. I'll do it. it. Yeah. I'll do it. it. Yeah. I'll do it. >> Okay. Y >> Okay. Y >> Okay. Y >> So you're going to get your mitochondria >> So you're going to get your mitochondria >> So you're going to get your mitochondria which have some which have some which have some you know the problem with mitochondria you know the problem with mitochondria you know the problem with mitochondria as you know is mitochondrial DNA as you know is mitochondrial DNA as you know is mitochondrial DNA degradation over time right? It degradation over time right? It degradation over time right? It accelerates for certain people, but that accelerates for certain people, but that accelerates for certain people, but that way if you go back to a young person, way if you go back to a young person, way if you go back to a young person, you have young you have young you have young >> mitochondria, but then you're going to >> mitochondria, but then you're going to >> mitochondria, but then you're going to multiply yours out. multiply yours out. multiply yours out. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And probably select a little bit or for >> And probably select a little bit or for >> And probably select a little bit or for healthier ones. Yeah. Right. Okay. And healthier ones. Yeah. Right. Okay. And healthier ones. Yeah. Right. Okay. And then put it back in. then put it back in. then put it back in. >> It's very I mean exploratively like we >> It's very I mean exploratively like we >> It's very I mean exploratively like we don't know. Uh we're one of the first. don't know. Uh we're one of the first. don't know. Uh we're one of the first. They're they're in phase two now. They're they're in phase two now. They're they're in phase two now. >> Do you sprint? >> Do you sprint? >> Do you sprint? >> Yeah, I do. >> Yeah, I do. >> Yeah, I do. >> So you could probably score if you did >> So you could probably score if you did >> So you could probably score if you did it intramuscular like mitochondrial it intramuscular like mitochondrial it intramuscular like mitochondrial therapy. You could sprint see your therapy. You could sprint see your therapy. You could sprint see your score. score. score. >> That's a great idea. >> That's a great idea. >> That's a great idea. >> Yeah, thank you. Yeah. Yeah, >> Yeah, thank you. Yeah. Yeah, >> Yeah, thank you. Yeah. Yeah, >> that would be a great way to measure it >> that would be a great way to measure it >> that would be a great way to measure it from a rather than just a basic from a rather than just a basic from a rather than just a basic biomarker perspective. Be really biomarker perspective. Be really biomarker perspective. Be really interesting to see. interesting to see. interesting to see. >> Yeah, sprinting is one of the most >> Yeah, sprinting is one of the most >> Yeah, sprinting is one of the most underappreciated longevity therapies. underappreciated longevity therapies. underappreciated longevity therapies. >> Yeah, I I don't do it. >> Yeah, I I don't do it. >> Yeah, I I don't do it. >> Oh man, >> Oh man, >> Oh man, >> I've got the um the age of a 74y old uh >> I've got the um the age of a 74y old uh >> I've got the um the age of a 74y old uh roughly [laughter] >> I am uh I'm definitely not keeping track >> I am uh I'm definitely not keeping track with you. Would you consider or have you with you. Would you consider or have you with you. Would you consider or have you looked at any plasmids where you take a looked at any plasmids where you take a looked at any plasmids where you take a gene as DNA put in your body and then gene as DNA put in your body and then gene as DNA put in your body and then that gene makes a protein in your body that gene makes a protein in your body that gene makes a protein in your body that that does something that that does something that that does something >> like the one we were looking at in the >> like the one we were looking at in the >> like the one we were looking at in the foxil 3 expression. Yeah, exactly. So foxil 3 expression. Yeah, exactly. So foxil 3 expression. Yeah, exactly. So the messenal stem cells you packaged up the messenal stem cells you packaged up the messenal stem cells you packaged up with the fox3 delivery um you know that with the fox3 delivery um you know that with the fox3 delivery um you know that showed that over 50% of tissues getting showed that over 50% of tissues getting showed that over 50% of tissues getting that rejuvenation. that rejuvenation. that rejuvenation. >> It's unbelievable. >> It's unbelievable. >> It's unbelievable. >> Un it's like the best demonstration in >> Un it's like the best demonstration in >> Un it's like the best demonstration in the entire world. the entire world. the entire world. >> It's perfect for tissue regeneration >> It's perfect for tissue regeneration >> It's perfect for tissue regeneration like as a particular application set like as a particular application set like as a particular application set tissue regeneration using that sort of tissue regeneration using that sort of tissue regeneration using that sort of system system system >> seems like a no-brainer. It's like, >> seems like a no-brainer. It's like, >> seems like a no-brainer. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, >> it's safe, right? It's like, so yes, I I >> it's safe, right? It's like, so yes, I I >> it's safe, right? It's like, so yes, I I uh reached out to that Chinese uh reached out to that Chinese uh reached out to that Chinese professor. I'm really interested in professor. I'm really interested in professor. I'm really interested in seeing it replicating. I would love seeing it replicating. I would love seeing it replicating. I would love >> You reached out to the Chinese >> You reached out to the Chinese >> You reached out to the Chinese professor? professor? professor? >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> that's awesome. [laughter] >> that's awesome. [laughter] >> that's awesome. [laughter] We sent that paper back. Yeah. Yeah, We sent that paper back. Yeah. Yeah, We sent that paper back. Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. So, that's awesome. So, that's awesome. So, >> can you respond? >> can you respond? >> can you respond? >> Uh, yeah. >> Uh, yeah. >> Uh, yeah. >> Awesome. >> Awesome. >> Awesome. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Good. >> Good. >> Good. >> Uh, so we I'd love to do that. Um, I'd >> Uh, so we I'd love to do that. Um, I'd >> Uh, so we I'd love to do that. Um, I'd love to actually build it ourselves, but love to actually build it ourselves, but love to actually build it ourselves, but that's like a two-year project. So, um, that's like a two-year project. So, um, that's like a two-year project. So, um, >> AI can help make it faster. >> AI can help make it faster. >> AI can help make it faster. >> That's true. Actually, that's true. AI >> That's true. Actually, that's true. AI >> That's true. Actually, that's true. AI as a project manager for these sorts of as a project manager for these sorts of as a project manager for these sorts of programs is programs is programs is >> you know that's true. We we spoke about >> you know that's true. We we spoke about >> you know that's true. We we spoke about this six months ago. Yeah. And this six months ago. Yeah. And this six months ago. Yeah. And >> things are so different. >> things are so different. >> things are so different. >> So different now six months later in >> So different now six months later in >> So different now six months later in terms of stand that up. Um that one's terms of stand that up. Um that one's terms of stand that up. Um that one's cool. So I think that's a good good cool. So I think that's a good good cool. So I think that's a good good option. Then also I'm doing uh Brian option. Then also I'm doing uh Brian option. Then also I'm doing uh Brian Johnson organoids. So uh we took my IPS Johnson organoids. So uh we took my IPS Johnson organoids. So uh we took my IPS IPSC's IPSC's IPSC's >> we now have >> we now have >> we now have >> induced pluropotent stem cells. So you >> induced pluropotent stem cells. So you >> induced pluropotent stem cells. So you took your cells turn them into stem took your cells turn them into stem took your cells turn them into stem cells. Yep. Yeah. cells. Yep. Yeah. cells. Yep. Yeah. >> So now we're doing indish. So now we >> So now we're doing indish. So now we >> So now we're doing indish. So now we have like a Brian Johnson heart, liver, have like a Brian Johnson heart, liver, have like a Brian Johnson heart, liver, lungs, and now we're gonna try molecules lungs, and now we're gonna try molecules lungs, and now we're gonna try molecules on me in on me in on me in >> So you've appi So let me just walk the >> So you've appi So let me just walk the >> So you've appi So let me just walk the audience through this. So you take cells audience through this. So you take cells audience through this. So you take cells off of your skin or something blood and off of your skin or something blood and off of your skin or something blood and then you put these Yamanaka factor then you put these Yamanaka factor then you put these Yamanaka factor proteins on those cells causes those proteins on those cells causes those proteins on those cells causes those cells to become stem cells which means cells to become stem cells which means cells to become stem cells which means they can then turn into any other cell they can then turn into any other cell they can then turn into any other cell and then you put other proteins on them and then you put other proteins on them and then you put other proteins on them to turn them into a heart cell to turn them into a heart cell to turn them into a heart cell >> or a eye cell or or what have you. And >> or a eye cell or or what have you. And >> or a eye cell or or what have you. And now you've got a store of these tissue now you've got a store of these tissue now you've got a store of these tissue specific Brian Johnson cells. Yes. That specific Brian Johnson cells. Yes. That specific Brian Johnson cells. Yes. That you then use for you then use for you then use for >> like you can say okay uh what if you >> like you can say okay uh what if you >> like you can say okay uh what if you give Brian Johnson blank you know drug. give Brian Johnson blank you know drug. give Brian Johnson blank you know drug. What is what happens? Is it good? Is it What is what happens? Is it good? Is it What is what happens? Is it good? Is it bad? What are the side effects? What bad? What are the side effects? What bad? What are the side effects? What >> in the P3 dish? You put the drug in >> in the P3 dish? You put the drug in >> in the P3 dish? You put the drug in there see what happens. there see what happens. there see what happens. >> Yeah. So like you can simulate all these >> Yeah. So like you can simulate all these >> Yeah. So like you can simulate all these experiments. So now you you get the experiments. So now you you get the experiments. So now you you get the advantage of time of acceleration of advantage of time of acceleration of advantage of time of acceleration of like what to take, why, what dose. like what to take, why, what dose. like what to take, why, what dose. That's awesome. That's awesome. That's awesome. >> What comaterial things to consider. And >> What comaterial things to consider. And >> What comaterial things to consider. And so we we have the organoids stood up. We so we we have the organoids stood up. We so we we have the organoids stood up. We haven't done our first takes yet. So haven't done our first takes yet. So haven't done our first takes yet. So that's interesting because now I have to that's interesting because now I have to that's interesting because now I have to do this old school methodology like put do this old school methodology like put do this old school methodology like put it in my body, it in my body, it in my body, >> wait to see what happens. Is it good? Is >> wait to see what happens. Is it good? Is >> wait to see what happens. Is it good? Is it bad? What, you know, how does it it bad? What, you know, how does it it bad? What, you know, how does it affect everything else? affect everything else? affect everything else? >> Yeah, totally. >> Yeah, totally. >> Yeah, totally. >> That's a good one. But I mean, I don't >> That's a good one. But I mean, I don't >> That's a good one. But I mean, I don't know. We'll see. It's cool in concept. I know. We'll see. It's cool in concept. I know. We'll see. It's cool in concept. I mean, TBD if it actually works. So, mean, TBD if it actually works. So, mean, TBD if it actually works. So, we'll see. we'll see. we'll see. >> Have you tracked any of the alternatives >> Have you tracked any of the alternatives >> Have you tracked any of the alternatives to Yamanaka factors, the factor to Yamanaka factors, the factor to Yamanaka factors, the factor discovery work that's going on, and do discovery work that's going on, and do discovery work that's going on, and do you think there's anything worth testing you think there's anything worth testing you think there's anything worth testing at this stage? at this stage? at this stage? >> Yeah, I'm an investor in New Limit. So, >> Yeah, I'm an investor in New Limit. So, >> Yeah, I'm an investor in New Limit. So, I've talked to them about where they're I've talked to them about where they're I've talked to them about where they're at and I mean at and I mean at and I mean >> Blake and Brian's company, >> Blake and Brian's company, >> Blake and Brian's company, >> they've done uh I mean they've made >> they've done uh I mean they've made >> they've done uh I mean they've made remarkable progress. They they figured remarkable progress. They they figured remarkable progress. They they figured out how to computationally solve the out how to computationally solve the out how to computationally solve the discovery process. discovery process. discovery process. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And so they um they're much faster than >> And so they um they're much faster than >> And so they um they're much faster than they initially thought. And so that's they initially thought. And so that's they initially thought. And so that's very encouraging. very encouraging. very encouraging. >> You know, the big challenge with >> You know, the big challenge with >> You know, the big challenge with Yamanaka factors is always dosing. If Yamanaka factors is always dosing. If Yamanaka factors is always dosing. If you overdose a cell, a one cell, that you overdose a cell, a one cell, that you overdose a cell, a one cell, that cell can become a cancer cell and take cell can become a cancer cell and take cell can become a cancer cell and take off as a tumor. Yeah. So the sensitivity off as a tumor. Yeah. So the sensitivity off as a tumor. Yeah. So the sensitivity that you need to have to get the right that you need to have to get the right that you need to have to get the right number of the factors which is a protein number of the factors which is a protein number of the factors which is a protein into the cell needs to be into the cell needs to be into the cell needs to be >> perfectly tuned. >> perfectly tuned. >> perfectly tuned. >> So I have a theory that this will end up >> So I have a theory that this will end up >> So I have a theory that this will end up being solved by cellular switches being solved by cellular switches being solved by cellular switches >> that will end up putting machinery into >> that will end up putting machinery into >> that will end up putting machinery into the cells that can turn on or off the the cells that can turn on or off the the cells that can turn on or off the protein synthesis at the right dosing protein synthesis at the right dosing protein synthesis at the right dosing >> based on the measurement of gene >> based on the measurement of gene >> based on the measurement of gene expression in the cell. That's my theory expression in the cell. That's my theory expression in the cell. That's my theory on where this will end. on where this will end. on where this will end. >> That makes a lot of sense. Any other >> That makes a lot of sense. Any other >> That makes a lot of sense. Any other control mechanism will be inadequate. control mechanism will be inadequate. control mechanism will be inadequate. >> That's right. the feedback loop just >> That's right. the feedback loop just >> That's right. the feedback loop just >> all you need is one error and you're >> all you need is one error and you're >> all you need is one error and you're you're you're in trouble. But it is it you're you're in trouble. But it is it you're you're in trouble. But it is it is the most profound I think technology is the most profound I think technology is the most profound I think technology that humanity is dealing with today that humanity is dealing with today that humanity is dealing with today besides AI. We're not quite there with besides AI. We're not quite there with besides AI. We're not quite there with fusion which I would argue is probably a fusion which I would argue is probably a fusion which I would argue is probably a distant third but it is very powerful distant third but it is very powerful distant third but it is very powerful what's possible what's possible what's possible >> and in the future like I think we'll >> and in the future like I think we'll >> and in the future like I think we'll look back and we'll see GLP1s as the look back and we'll see GLP1s as the look back and we'll see GLP1s as the first big drop. first big drop. first big drop. >> Yeah. like what I can just inject myself >> Yeah. like what I can just inject myself >> Yeah. like what I can just inject myself and like it solves hunger and you know and like it solves hunger and you know and like it solves hunger and you know and then the second will probably be and then the second will probably be and then the second will probably be something like new limit or one of these something like new limit or one of these something like new limit or one of these fox one of these plasma based fox 3 fox one of these plasma based fox 3 fox one of these plasma based fox 3 therapies where therapies where therapies where >> it will show real life like dramatic >> it will show real life like dramatic >> it will show real life like dramatic changes totally changes totally changes totally >> and then humanity will shift as like uh >> and then humanity will shift as like uh >> and then humanity will shift as like uh longevity being a vision of sci-fi you longevity being a vision of sci-fi you longevity being a vision of sci-fi you know rich people pursuit to like know rich people pursuit to like know rich people pursuit to like something that is truly I mean go back something that is truly I mean go back something that is truly I mean go back to like the conversation on on the to like the conversation on on the to like the conversation on on the temptation towards socialism right like temptation towards socialism right like temptation towards socialism right like if if you can feel robust in your if if you can feel robust in your if if you can feel robust in your ability to pursue life and be healthy ability to pursue life and be healthy ability to pursue life and be healthy and vibrant and uh in control. I think and vibrant and uh in control. I think and vibrant and uh in control. I think these things could have dramatic changes these things could have dramatic changes these things could have dramatic changes in society, not just in health, but like in society, not just in health, but like in society, not just in health, but like >> well any form of abundance, whether it's >> well any form of abundance, whether it's >> well any form of abundance, whether it's abundance in food, in energy, in abundance in food, in energy, in abundance in food, in energy, in housing, in mobility, in lifespan, the housing, in mobility, in lifespan, the housing, in mobility, in lifespan, the more abundance people get, the happier more abundance people get, the happier more abundance people get, the happier they are. And the more you're improving they are. And the more you're improving they are. And the more you're improving abundance in the world, the the better abundance in the world, the the better abundance in the world, the the better we are going to live as a group of we are going to live as a group of we are going to live as a group of people together on planet Earth, the people together on planet Earth, the people together on planet Earth, the happier we will all be with each other. happier we will all be with each other. happier we will all be with each other. >> I think like honestly like a lot of the >> I think like honestly like a lot of the >> I think like honestly like a lot of the the the the >> external conflict only comes from >> external conflict only comes from >> external conflict only comes from internal unhappiness internal unhappiness internal unhappiness >> 100%. Yeah. So, if you look at the >> 100%. Yeah. So, if you look at the >> 100%. Yeah. So, if you look at the general malaise of like American general malaise of like American general malaise of like American society, like no wonder society, like no wonder society, like no wonder uh things are, right? Like you've got uh things are, right? Like you've got uh things are, right? Like you've got metab 84% of people have metabolic metab 84% of people have metabolic metab 84% of people have metabolic disorder. Over 40% of people are obese. disorder. Over 40% of people are obese. disorder. Over 40% of people are obese. Like we're just in really poor health. Like we're just in really poor health. Like we're just in really poor health. Nobody's sleeping. Everyone's on their Nobody's sleeping. Everyone's on their Nobody's sleeping. Everyone's on their phone. Like we have mental health phone. Like we have mental health phone. Like we have mental health issues. Like no wonder you have the issues. Like no wonder you have the issues. Like no wonder you have the proclivity towards these kinds of proclivity towards these kinds of proclivity towards these kinds of outcomes. Like so if you could get the outcomes. Like so if you could get the outcomes. Like so if you could get the health in check, it changes the health in check, it changes the health in check, it changes the psychological decision of you, your psychological decision of you, your psychological decision of you, your community, your country. Like you have community, your country. Like you have community, your country. Like you have much more of a can do attitude. like I much more of a can do attitude. like I much more of a can do attitude. like I can take on the world and I can do hard can take on the world and I can do hard can take on the world and I can do hard things, but when you're not feeling things, but when you're not feeling things, but when you're not feeling well, like it's just everything is just well, like it's just everything is just well, like it's just everything is just so much harder. so much harder. so much harder. >> Yeah. 100%. And so in light of all of >> Yeah. 100%. And so in light of all of >> Yeah. 100%. And so in light of all of these new therapeutic modalities and these new therapeutic modalities and these new therapeutic modalities and these new opportunities that seem to be these new opportunities that seem to be these new opportunities that seem to be biologically proven and have these biologically proven and have these biologically proven and have these profound effects, why continue to tinker profound effects, why continue to tinker profound effects, why continue to tinker with psychedelics? Like are they as with psychedelics? Like are they as with psychedelics? Like are they as profound or are they a compliment or profound or are they a compliment or profound or are they a compliment or like how do you think about fitting all like how do you think about fitting all like how do you think about fitting all of this portfolio of things that you're of this portfolio of things that you're of this portfolio of things that you're looking at together? looking at together? looking at together? >> Yeah, I mean I guess the question is um >> Yeah, I mean I guess the question is um >> Yeah, I mean I guess the question is um I forget on the Fox 3 study. I don't I forget on the Fox 3 study. I don't I forget on the Fox 3 study. I don't know if they saw brain rejuvenation. know if they saw brain rejuvenation. know if they saw brain rejuvenation. Didn't see that. Yeah. Didn't see that. Yeah. Didn't see that. Yeah. >> I did not see that. And I don't >> I did not see that. And I don't >> I did not see that. And I don't >> I don't remember. I mean, it is a very >> I don't remember. I mean, it is a very >> I don't remember. I mean, it is a very complicated organ. complicated organ. complicated organ. >> Yeah. Exactly. And >> Yeah. Exactly. And >> Yeah. Exactly. And >> it's insane. >> it's insane. >> it's insane. You know, you can grow muscle tissue You know, you can grow muscle tissue You know, you can grow muscle tissue back and you can grow skin tissue back back and you can grow skin tissue back back and you can grow skin tissue back and it's kind of like, okay, I grew a and it's kind of like, okay, I grew a and it's kind of like, okay, I grew a little ex like if you grow the the little ex like if you grow the the little ex like if you grow the the neurons back maybe in the wrong way. neurons back maybe in the wrong way. neurons back maybe in the wrong way. Like we don't know. Like we don't know. Like we don't know. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Because it's never been done before. So >> Because it's never been done before. So >> Because it's never been done before. So understanding the consequence of neuro understanding the consequence of neuro understanding the consequence of neuro regeneration is like regeneration is like regeneration is like >> so I wonder like if the role it might >> so I wonder like if the role it might >> so I wonder like if the role it might play like you know maybe psilocybin and play like you know maybe psilocybin and play like you know maybe psilocybin and 5 MO won't be um 5 MO won't be um 5 MO won't be um you know meaningful for like basic you know meaningful for like basic you know meaningful for like basic functions of the body but maybe it's the functions of the body but maybe it's the functions of the body but maybe it's the uh the outperformer in youthfulness of uh the outperformer in youthfulness of uh the outperformer in youthfulness of your of your disposition towards your of your disposition towards your of your disposition towards reality. Like one thing I'm apprehensive reality. Like one thing I'm apprehensive reality. Like one thing I'm apprehensive about is you I'm 48 and so about is you I'm 48 and so about is you I'm 48 and so >> as you start climbing to your 50s 60s >> as you start climbing to your 50s 60s >> as you start climbing to your 50s 60s you do you do you do >> really narrow like your ambition goes >> really narrow like your ambition goes >> really narrow like your ambition goes from I can do anything to start you know from I can do anything to start you know from I can do anything to start you know narrowing down further and further and I narrowing down further and further and I narrowing down further and further and I worry about using losing a youthful worry about using losing a youthful worry about using losing a youthful disposition of a can do attitude of disposition of a can do attitude of disposition of a can do attitude of anything is possible totally anything is possible totally anything is possible totally >> and maybe that's the role of >> and maybe that's the role of >> and maybe that's the role of psychedelics is you just get a wash of psychedelics is you just get a wash of psychedelics is you just get a wash of like the snapback of like I can and I like the snapback of like I can and I like the snapback of like I can and I can bounce can bounce can bounce Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, >> that definitely been the case for me. >> that definitely been the case for me. >> that definitely been the case for me. So, I think they do probably play a So, I think they do probably play a So, I think they do probably play a really important role of like they're really important role of like they're really important role of like they're probably a set of things that for probably a set of things that for probably a set of things that for certain people that will um certain people that will um certain people that will um basically like I mean I felt like it was basically like I mean I felt like it was basically like I mean I felt like it was like 30 like 30 like 30 40 years of 40 years of 40 years of psychological rejuvenation, you know, psychological rejuvenation, you know, psychological rejuvenation, you know, it's like to transport me back to a it's like to transport me back to a it's like to transport me back to a childlike state. Yeah. childlike state. Yeah. childlike state. Yeah. >> That is insane. I don't get that from >> That is insane. I don't get that from >> That is insane. I don't get that from the sauna or from eating well or from the sauna or from eating well or from the sauna or from eating well or from sleeping well. Like I'm still sleeping well. Like I'm still sleeping well. Like I'm still >> right. So, just unique. >> right. So, just unique. >> right. So, just unique. >> Yeah. Amazing. Well, listen. I'm going >> Yeah. Amazing. Well, listen. I'm going >> Yeah. Amazing. Well, listen. I'm going to go drink alcohol and eat carbs and to go drink alcohol and eat carbs and to go drink alcohol and eat carbs and stay out late. I don't know. What are stay out late. I don't know. What are stay out late. I don't know. What are you going to do? you going to do? you going to do? >> I'm gonna go to bed on time. Yeah. Do my >> I'm gonna go to bed on time. Yeah. Do my >> I'm gonna go to bed on time. Yeah. Do my wind down routine. wind down routine. wind down routine. >> Yeah. You do you. But you as well. Enjoy >> Yeah. You do you. But you as well. Enjoy >> Yeah. You do you. But you as well. Enjoy [laughter] it. [laughter] it. [laughter] it. >> I appreciate it. This has been great. >> I appreciate it. This has been great. >> I appreciate it. This has been great. Brian Johnson, thank you. Thanks. Yeah, Brian Johnson, thank you. Thanks. Yeah, Brian Johnson, thank you. Thanks. Yeah, that was awesome. that was awesome. that was awesome. >> That was great.