Breakthrough Muscle Building Peptides with Jay Campbell | Mind Pump 2840

Key Takeaway

Train properly with progressive overload and eat adequate protein (1g per pound of lean body mass), and new compounds like albumin-bound follistatin can dramatically enhance muscle building—but the fundamentals still matter most. Without proper training stimulus and nutrition, even cutting-edge science won't deliver results. Master the basics first, then consider optimization.

Episode Overview

Jay Campbell, dubbed the 'modern Dan Duchaine,' discusses his mentorship with legendary supplement guru Dan Duchaine in the late '90s, the evolution of bodybuilding nutrition from cyclical ketogenic diets to today's approaches, and groundbreaking new muscle-building compounds like albumin-bound follistatin that could revolutionize body composition without traditional side effects.

Full Transcript

Transcript of Breakthrough Muscle Building Peptides with Jay Campbell | Mind Pump 2840 from Mind Pump Show. Auto-generated from episode audio; may contain minor errors.

Jay, welcome back. Always a good time. Always fun talking to you. I like to refer to you as the modern Dan Duchaine. That's a huge compliment. Huge compliment. It is a huge compliment. For people who know who that is. to say you need to explain that for people that don't that aren't old enough to know who that The supplement guru. Well, he was the everything guru. A lot of the stuff that like high-level competitors will do now he pioneered. Back in the day and so anybody who knows bodybuilding in the '80s, '90s, you know, they they know Dan Duchaine.

And as you guys know, he mentored me for 6 months. That's right. That's right. So you knew him personally. him personally. him personally. know him personally. Yeah, so rad. Still have that book, The Underground Steroid Handbook, that little paper pamphlet. pamphlet. pamphlet. You know what's crazy about that? He wrote about stuff that I hear competitors using now and I'm like dude he was talking about that in the early '90s. And it was all speculative back then. How did you meet him? How did you come across him?

Uh literally very true story just on underground like forum bodybuilding forum. So he posted about his book Body Opus. Who was the Who was the athlete the shredded guy on the cover of Body Opus? And I wrote in and true story the guy literally was a guy by the name Hans Hobstatter and he trained at my gym Wait, so that's where you met him? That's where you met him? So that's the That was the guy on the cover? Yes. Okay. Yes. Okay. Yes. Okay. And so I wrote in I was like oh that's Hans.

He's like my buddy, you know, I train at the same gym as him and he wrote me back he's like holy [ __ ] He's like we need to talk and then we started talking via email and then he was actually in the same group that I was in which was the low-carb list. It was called the the else else serve low-carb list or exercise list. And then him and I became friends. He's like hey man, if you ever want to come down to TJ I'll talk to you cuz he lived in TJ.

Yeah. At the end of his life. This is a '90s? Yes, this was this was like '90 like '90 like '90 8 and '99. Wait, how old How old are you Jay? I'm I'll be 55 in February. Okay, okay. So you were still you were a kid though in the '90s. in my '20s. I was in my '20s. But he died literally the next year. I I to say he died in It was either 2000 or 2001. He died before 9/11. Mhm. But yeah, I worked with him or met worked with him, literally sat in uh the Hard Rock Cafe on Revolution in Tijuana.

Okay, so how's that happen? So you guys start emailing back and forth. He's like we got to meet. Do you go down to TJ? I went to TJ and On a whim. You meet this guy on a forum in the But was he already uh uh uh Yeah, you knew who he was. You knew who he was. Yeah, of course. Okay, so it wasn't like he was just some rando. You like everyone respected who he was. super cool guy, um very weird. Just like he was, you know, in real life, like very to himself, you know, was never married, didn't have kids, just very, very, you know, reclusive, but just super intelligent.

And so he would just like tell me, you know, he would ask me questions and I would ask him questions and we just became really good friends and then he basically died, you know, and it was kind of like he died in the in a one-bedroom apartment type thing. Do you do you attribute that that time to kind of what set you off down your path or were you already kind of that path and that just was part of your journey? Like I was on that path, but he massively was responsible for me going deeper.

Really? What did you learn So what did you end up learning from him in that that that Dude, just so much about fat loss, you know, so much about like how to use androgens, androgens, androgens, um you know, low carb. He was huge, like he was super, super into like the Atkins diet and low carb and, you know, how to build muscle by like basically doing like a cyclical ketogenic diet. Yeah. Um he was one of the first people that understood that like where you went zero carb all week and then on Saturday and Sunday you glycogen loaded.

Yeah. And he is he had so many tricks on how to like um dispose of glucose faster and like what kind of things you could take, like you could take mannitol. Like he just knew all these things that no one really understood. understood. understood. he responsible for carb cycling? Not responsible for but in the bodybuilding world, he was the guy that introduced it. Carb cycling before that was endurance athletes. There was one Exactly. There was one other doctor, if you guys remember, his name was Mauro Di Pasquale.

He wrote the book The Anabolic Diet. Diet. Diet. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. So, I met him at around the same time, too. But, he was very instrumental with the bodybuilding side of things. But, Dan personally used to say Mauro doesn't know [ __ ] Mauro, if you're out there and you hear this podcast, man, much love to you, man. But, he used to joke about that. But, Mauro did know his stuff, but Dan was They had like their little beef, you know. Like Yeah, I think all these all these intellects and the Exactly.

Exactly. He was Dan was De Cain was he was the guy that started the ephedra caffeine aspirin stack. That was him. Ultimate Orange. If you guys remember Ultimate Orange. Ultimate Orange. Ultimate Orange. That was the first pre-workout. I want to talk a little bit more about this this this this I don't you don't call carb cycling what you would call it this like low carb on the week weekdays and then a high carb on the weekend. I don't think I I of all the carb cycling I've done I've done a lot of carb cycling, back loading, front loading, you name it.

High, super high, low, all the but I don't think I've ever attempted a Monday through Friday low to no carb and then a heavy load on the weekends. Yeah, so it was an interesting strategy. So, it was known as the cyclical ketogenic diet. That's right. And Lyle McDonald, who by the way is also a friend of mine, who is crazy crazy crazy Dude, I've been trying to get these guys to get him on the show. I say I can get Lyle to come on the show if you guys want to.

For sure. I've been I've been I followed some of his stuff. his stuff. his stuff. But, Lyle is crazy. He is He is He is He's a [ __ ] talker and he's He's a [ __ ] talker and he's brilliant. He's absolutely brilliant, off the charts. So, Lyle Lyle and another woman by the name of Elzi Volk, who I think him and her were girlfriend and boyfriend for a while, and me were like the crash test dummies for his book, which was called uh Cyclical Ketogenic Diet or I'm sorry, it was changed to A Ketogenic Diet in Theory and Practice, which was written in '96, which was really the first diet book for ketogenic dieting that was written for like bodybuilding and performance.

performance. performance. Uh but, anyway, I was doing that for 3 years and giving him the research of me being in that like deep cyclical ketogenic window. Um and it was awesome. I mean, this is before I ever touched testosterone or any anabolic or anything. And I was just using rip fuel or ultimate orange and stuff like that. But I learned a lot and and I always tell people like I learned enough to know that like if you're in a ketogenic diet long-term for a long time, you will really F yourself up because it retards insulin metabolism.

And so that's why all the keto bros and the carnivore people really don't know how crazy they're screwing up their metabolism because they're actually changing insulin metabolism from a standpoint that they're increasing their A1C. I mean, you know, I was just at I just spoke at the Hack Your Health conference. And so there was all the low carb cuz that's former Keto Con people, right? And so they're all there and you know, some of them are so militant about this. But like they don't understand when they get their labs done or their biomarkers done why their A1Cs are so high.

And it's because dude, like I'm not eating carbs. How's this possible? Exactly. So they don't understand that. But they're starting to learn people. Some carbs for if for insulin sensitivity. Actually and by the way, the old the hardcore anti-carb guys all changed Mercola. I mean, he does he understands this. And it also hammers your thyroid. Oh, it's terrible. It's bad for your thyroid to be no carb all the time. It's terrible. And even Paul Saladino Saladino Saladino completely changed his tune because he learned, right? So he completely changed his tune because he learned.

And and I think you guys know, we've talked about this on the show many times. You got to be remain metabolically flexible, right? It's the end of the day, if you're building muscle, you have to have carbs, you know, the brain requires carbs. Sure, the brain can get carbs from a very inefficient process of gluconeogenesis, right? But the body wants carbs. You know, remember Poliquin he said, you get your carbs when you deserve them, right? So it's like if you're a bodybuilder and you're not eating carbs, you're kind of like missing the deal.

But it's it's it's it's interesting because you know, going back to what Lyle was doing, you would go Monday through Friday and you would eat like four to five times a day and it it just be literally be like ground turkey or a hamburger. If you wanted to get some roughage for, you know, bowel movements, you'd have like broccoli or something. But it would just be trace green carbs. And then on Saturday morning, you would do a depletion workout. And your workout was like you would want to go like 60 to 90 minutes of just completely pushing all the glycogen that was left in your body, which wasn't much anyway.

You're on fumes. fumes. fumes. And then you would just go crazy and eat as much as you could eat until literally you went to bed on Sunday night. Now, you we when after 6 or 8 months of doing this, we learned you didn't want to like go crazy at 7:00 or 8:00 at night and go to bed 2 hours later because your body would be laying there and you couldn't sleep digesting all that sugar and glycogen. But you would eat whatever you want. I mean, I swear to God, I was literally eating bowls of cereal that were this big.

And it'd be like 1,500 calories of like sugar and just, you know, simple carbohydrates. It's just We just literally before you got on here, we were talking about They're like, "Have you ever ate 10,000 calories?" I'm like, "Oh, absolutely. I ate 10,000 calories post show." They're like, "How terrible you feel?" I said, "I feel amazing. I was so depleted. I was like was like was like You look And that And that's the craziest part is your body does super glycogenate. And so you see this insane effect of how pumped your muscles are and how lean you actually You actually get leaner, right?

Because it's like I said I I looked better. I was like it was awesome. It was awesome. The theory behind this is the theory behind this was to leverage going into ketosis. Yes. Uh using glycogen, it's to leverage the the anabolic response. anabolic response. anabolic response. Exactly. And to leverage the fat loss potential response. And so that's what it was. And of course typical Right. So the idea is that you're basically losing losing losing body fat during the week and then you're building on the weekend.

And now typical bodybuilding style, they overdo everything. So it's like, you know, bowls of cereal and stuff. Duchaine, why he was so genius, is like he knew the levers to pull during that window of say 36 hours where you're super glycogenating of like what you can do to really make it less stressful on your body, you know, adding in like racemic ALA as glucose disposal, taking in mannitol, glucomannan. people insulin? Yeah, I mean I mean well I see then well no, that's a good point and I'll get to that.

I wasn't using insulin then and I didn't know how to do that, but Dan talked to me about that. That this So again, this is before I started using testosterone. It was honestly like literally 1 year later I was on testosterone, right? So but yeah, I didn't take advantage of that, but he talked to me about a lot of that stuff. But what you would find is that and what I found which was a very unfortunate is that once you came off that diet, your insulin metabolism was so [ __ ] You could not even eat carbs without becoming a narcoleptic.

You'd become narcoleptic. I mean I literally could not go out in public and at that that time in my life I was actually working for LA Times. I was like a classified advertising sales person, but I couldn't It was so bad I would want to go to sleep in my car. I would be like, "Oh my god, you know, I just reintroduced I ate, you know, a couple of like brown rice or white rice or whatever I was eating and I would be Because your insulin metabolism so much to that schedule.

For 3 years I did a strict ketogenic diet, right? And that was for the research and to have the book and understand all the stuff. It took 6 months before I was normal again. And so that's why I always tell people who are so hardcore keto or carnivore or whatever who avoid carbs that might give no idea what you're doing to your Did you find uh like did like things like honey or fruit were better and then you slowly introduce How did you get there in 6 months?

Well, I wasn't smart enough to do that. I mean I at first I would eat a lot of greens and I was fine, but then as soon as I started eating complex carbs it was like like like it was coma. I mean I would be comatose. I mean it was and everyone experiences you know, you talk to people and I was just talking to people at the Hack Your Health event. I mean you guys will laugh. There was a guy at the my booth and I had those new chips, the Maza chips, you know, they taste so amazing whatever with no seed oils or whatever and the guy was like I was like, "You want one?" He's like, "Oh no." And then you could see him.

Oh no. Oh no. Oh no. He's like and and and then He's like and and and then he goes, he pulls up his shirt and he's like, and he was soft. He didn't even have abs. And he's like, he was seriously he's like, "No, man. I I like my abs." I'm like, "Bro, don't make me pull up my shirt." Because you don't have abs. YOU SHOULD HAVE CARBS, YOU SHOULD HAVE CARBS, DOG. DOG. DOG. I MEAN, ANYWAY, but but the bottom line is is that too many of these people, seriously, too many of these people are like obviously carbophobic.

You guys know this. Yeah. And they're like, "Oh my god, carbs are the devil." And "I'm going to get fat if I eat carbs." And I, you know, and so many of them, like you said, have horrible biomarkers because you're right, it's depleted thyroid. when it comes to building muscle, I would love your opinion your your input on this, but for my understanding, the the the mass monster era in bodybuilding, right, in the '90s, which took everything to where it is now. There is huge difference in bodybuilding.

I mean, there was a difference from the '70s and '80s, but that was mainly anabolics. They were just taking more anabolics. Then you went '80s and '90s and something different happened. And a lot of people like, "It's growth hormone." No, I think it was insulin. I think it was them figuring out how to how to use carbohydrates carbohydrates carbohydrates in an anabolic way. by the way, those were the best physiques ever. Yeah. Today, no one looks that conditioned. No one is that carbed, and that is exactly the answer.

And then you know the other thing, and I don't want to get in trouble. Maps push pull legs. It's a three-day split. 40% off right now. Go to mapsppl.com. mapsppl.com. mapsppl.com. Use the code PPL for the 40% off discount. Now, this episode is brought to you by a sponsor, Huel. So, they make meal replacement shakes that are non-dairy, that taste delicious. These are vegan shakes, high in protein, that are good meal replacements. If you want a quick meal in the morning or in the mid-afternoon, if you have protein targets you're trying to hit cuz you want to build muscle, of course, or help yourself get leaner, leaner, leaner, try Huel.

Again, it's delicious, it's easy, and you can get 15% off. Go to huel.com, that's h u e l.com/mindpump. The code mindpump gets you 15% off. What's really tanked bodybuilding from a physique aesthetic standpoint is AIs. All these guys are using high doses of Aromasin, Aromasin, Aromasin, Arimidex, and that is preventing them from getting shredded because it's very evidence in the literature that when you take an aromatase inhibitor again and you inhibit the production of estrogen from the aromatase enzyme from your androgens, you cannot burn fat.

So those guys are getting down to like 7 or 8% body fat and they stop. And they can't get down to the 4% body fat. in the '90s, were No, there was none of that. And so that is the difference. And look, I say this all the time. I've said this on podcasts, I'll say it on yours. A lot of these guys who have died, I won't name names, but we could, have died from the fissures in the capillary network from taking AIs because that's what it does.

It's causing these little micro fissures in the capillary and vascular networks that literally cause them to stroke out. Because of the lack of estrogen? Yes. Okay. Cuz you need estrogen for your health. List all the common ones. Anastrozole, what are all the common ones? Anas- So Arimidex, Anastrozole, Aromasin, you've got What's the Letrozole, which is a suicide inhibitor. That is a That's a strong one. That takes everything out. That is so bad. And there is other ones. Your dick won't work for like a But yeah, but I mean it's like I tell people all the time like these are women's cancer drugs and they were created for stage three and stage four cancer, which these women are like at the end, you know, or the end of the rope for that metastasis.

And so now you're giving them to bodybuilders to suppress estrogen. They're so bad. I mean I again, I don't want to rabbit hole on them. They're so bad for people. You know, Ben Pakulski used to say, we all know Ben, and Ben used to say to me, he's like, bro, those are the worst gnarliest drugs I've ever taken in my life, but at the end, you know, when I was in my competitive days, the only way I could get water out of my hamstrings is I had to take a small dose for like the last 10 days.

And he would always tell me that he felt like his head was in a vice from being on those things, right? So, it's like at the end of the day there there's no purpose for them in bodybuilding. There's really no purpose for them for them for them in TRT. in TRT. in TRT. Like you said, we need estrogen. Estrogen is more important at this at the tissue level than even testosterone is. is. is. Well, there's it's not just that. So, there's two things. One, we've all been conditioned as men that estrogen's bad.

Exactly. You need exactly. High test, low estrogen. You need to have some estrogen, but it's also the ratio of estrogen to testosterone. So, if you're on testosterone replacement therapy and let's say you're pushing the limits of what your testosterone replacement therapy is. So, it's high like I do. Like I take as much as the doctors let me take. So, it's high. I want my estrogen to be at a certain ratio. I don't want normal estrogen for a man who has normal testosterone. It needs to be higher.

higher. higher. right, but that's the problem. I'm glad you said that. That's the problem is that they're using the range, which is for normal men and not men on testosterone and they're attempting the physicians to keep them in that suppressed range. suppressed range. suppressed range. a ratio. a ratio. a ratio. totally unhealthy. Exactly, but no, very few doctors understand that. Yeah. And that's the problem and that's why you can see men who are on therapeutic testosterone who have again lean men who have, you know, sensitive estradiols in the 90 to 120 and they have no side effects or symptoms.

But a fatter guy or an insulin resistant guy who has that has all the side effects because their body cannot handle that aromatase, right? So, they're over expressing aromatase and so they have quote unquote what people think are high estrogen symptoms, but there's no such thing as high estrogen symptoms. There's only insulin resistance and inflammation, which people think are high estrogen symptoms. I mean, I've had some amazing doctors that have really schooled me on this from the evidence standpoint, but that's also the reason why when you suppress estrogen, you can't get that low level of body fat because it's literally allowing the I always thought it was the growth hormone growing the internal organs and pushing the water out.

There's water retention. There's There's edema. There's, you know, uh, obviously swelling of the internal organs from high levels of insulin. probably a combo of all of it. But I mean, what what I what I'm talking about is like to actually see that super low shredded physique that again a Frank Zane had, a Franco Columbu had. Exactly, all those guys in the glory days of like the late '80s and the early '90s before the AIs came in. And you're also right, it was high dose carbs or actually excuse me high amounts carbs and then insulin and growth hormone combined.

And that pushed so much super glycogen in. But they didn't have the AI preventing the fat loss. And so that's why you see so many of these guys who are jacked and shoot and massive but don't have that incredible carved peaked condition at the end because they're still on an AI. Yeah, and a lot of it's just just just they might even just be better off of lower doses of anabolics. Oh, dude, 100%. I mean again and that's where we're going with follistatin, right? Because like we have all these amazing things that are coming into the world that will allow them to gain lean skeletal mass without the side effects.

Tell us Okay, what is follistatin? So this is a peptide from my understanding that inhibits myostatin. And myostatin is the is the is the the brakes on muscle growth. And I think at this point everybody has seen the pictures of Yes. the myostatin inhibited animals. animals. animals. Yeah, the blue mouse or I'm not the mouse, the blue bull. bull and it just looks crazy. And so So what follistatin is a naturally occurring peptide. Correct. So that your body uses to counteract So so the it's a great question.

So most bodybuilders or people like us in this space, we all heard of follistatin 314, 344, 347. They've been around in the bro world for a long time, right? The issue with those drugs is as you said, they have a very they're they're obviously a protein, it's a peptide, but it's a very short half-life. So if you use that, you would have to inject yourself three or four times and you would also have to inject yourself in the actual area that you were attempting to increase in size systemic.

systemic. systemic. and train them. Exactly. Um, and that's always been the problem and even the underground community, if you got follistatin, it was sometimes like because of the way the protein is actually made or actually synthesized, it wouldn't stay stable or it would become inert really fast. So, a lot of guys that would get follistatin would say I never got anything from it because it would just go bad. Now, our chemist, being the genius that he is, and I won't mention his name, I'll tell you guys off air.

Eventually, you'll know who he is, but he's got hundreds of drug delivery system patents. He's one of the smartest guys in the world. He created a 19-day albumin bound follistatin. It's called FLGR242. FLGR242. FLGR242. That's its actual trade name. The CAS number is actually coming out this week. And because he extended the half-life, you can inject it twice a month and dramatically increase plasma levels. And know why? In every person that's using it, and granted it's a small sample size, size, size, uh and I'm one of them, there's six of us, there's a one woman and five guys, every single one of us has gained somewhere between 7 and 10 lb in 8 weeks.

Of muscle? Of pure skeletal mass. All of us have done uh the de novo exams. Two of us have done the uh what do you call it? The DEXAs. DEXAs. DEXAs. Uh and everyone else has done in bodies. And all of us have gained 7 lb. If I took my shirt off, you guys see like my chest definition, like my androgen receptors have receptors have receptors have look like you're 7 to 10 lb heavier from the last time we saw you. Yes. Yeah. Yes. And but I mean my arms and my shoulders, if you look at the picture that I just put on Instagram, uh my Instagram came back for the first time in 3 months, so I can't talk about peptides, uh you can see the size that I put on.

But all these people are attacking us in the bodybuilding world because they're like there's no way. But they don't understand that this is a totally separate, patented delivery system of follistatin that actually allows muscle to build. this what's sim- Is this similar to what's in the newest GLP-1, the the the It's not, but it's the same it they're they're targeting a similar pathway. What they're doing with those drugs is they're using monoclonal antibodies. And unfortunately, without getting into the science, that that's a that's a dead end path.

So, where we're really going with this is they're going to eventually have like a stage four and a stage five agonist that will use follistatin in a format the way ours is. And also, and I don't want to again rabbit hole on this, but where we're going with say GLP technology or science is it's more small molecules moving forward because Lilly and Novo Nordisk are going crazy to enforce their patents. So, all the compounders, the research companies, everybody else who's out there who's attempting to sell or manufacture or even create GLPs, they're going to shut it down.

Because they own all the patents. Now, they haven't been doing that. They've just been sending cease and desist letters to compounders, to research companies, but nobody really did anything with it because FDA wasn't enforcing them. But now, Lilly and Novo are going to enforce the patents because they're going to be approving retatrutide very soon. And once they approve retatrutide, everybody knows how amazing retatrutide is as a drug, and they're like, "We don't want anybody using retatrutide other than if you buy it from Lilly." Oh, wow.

So, okay, this begs another question then then because we had this discussion with Dr. Seeds. And And And Who? Dr. Seeds. He's just tough. Oh, shut up. shut up. shut up. I fell for that. So, we we What's up, doc? So, one of the things that we talked about was about was about was you know, being able to build all this muscle, but it potentially being almost useless muscle. Similar to like those bulls. bulls. bulls. Non-functional muscle. Non-functional muscle. Non-functional muscle. Non-functional. It's like So, the body you block this muscular person.

muscular person. muscular person. Yeah, so you block this, you put on 20, 30 lb of muscle. Great, you look cool, but it's you're not stronger, you're not you So, is that a concern with the follistatin? follistatin? follistatin? Yeah, so it's a great question. So, previous follistatins, yes, because of the way it bound and it could the the the risk or the concern would be that it could increase uh, organ size or it could increase like the heart valve or the aortic valve. Again, ours, the way it's um, it just call it um, recombinant engineered, it only binds to activin.

So, and and and and if I'm saying this wrong, we can edit this, but it the way it works is that it only will bind to androgen receptors that are not organ sensitive. So, it's you know, shoulder, delt, quad, it's not going to build muscles or increase the size of organs. It's only going to target the actual muscles. So, I just want to make sure that I said that correctly, but again, it's a 19-day uh, albumin binder. So, the the linker on the actual binder extends, as you said earlier, the FC, so it becomes systemic and it's not local.

So, albumin meaning so, albumin. So, somebody can't use this if they're allergic to eggs. Um, I don't know about that. I mean, I mean, no one's said it. I I don't think that's the case. I think that anybody can use this. I mean, again, so just so you know, so we've tested this product for close to 18 months. It's been tested in monkeys. It's been tested in humans. Uh, 6 months in humans. Uh, dogs, cats, and of course, rats it started with. And he's already applied for the patent and will have the CAS number at the end of this week.

Literally, by Friday, we're going to have a CAS number for it. So, there's so many people in the scientific community interested in this product right now that we're like fielding inquiries from some of the biggest companies literally in Europe who want to sell this. Because again, you know, and and we haven't talked about Clotho, we'll get there in a second, but like Clotho and follistatin is like where all the research in the longevity space is going to. Like, how can we re-engineer? How can we molecularly recombinantly change these molecules so that we can make them make them make them uh, for everybody in the scientific community who's interested in longevity to have.

to have. to have. Besides building muscle on follistatin because of its effect on It also burns fat. I know you were going to Well, well, well, well, I was asking, what what else do you get What else do you you you through Is that just through the metabolic pathway though? Because you add 5 lb of muscle, you're going to burn more calories. more calories. more calories. Yes, I mean, in theory, yes, but we're actually going to be coming out with a product for cuz our chemist was like, after he used it for 6 months he's like dude it also has this insane ability to burn fat.

So yes from a metabolic pathway but then here's the other thing and this is why it makes it so interesting because you guys already talked about all the people especially women who lose muscle on GOPs this is the answer. the answer. the answer. Give them a micro dose of this recombinant form of follistatin and they can't lose muscle. Because of the way it binds and again it binds so powerfully again has a 19 day half life so I mean imagine how many people will be okay to inject it just once or twice a month.

You know and that's where it's going with small molecules molecules molecules we should have another product that I won't let the name out of out of the bag cuz it's he's working on the patent it's patent pending patent pending patent pending that will be a super retro tide. Super retro tide. It binds It binds It binds I'm literally not exaggerating yet with a cape. I should put my cape on real quick. It binds somewhere between 50 and 75 times harder than retro tide does and it's not a GOP so it's a small molecule so again according to our chemist you might have to only will be both oral and injectable but you will only have to inject it like once every two months.

That's how powerful it is. So that's where we're going with these again you guys have obviously heard of the guys at the Meddy Center where they do recombinant engineering and they inject all these different you know gene therapies. These aren't gene therapies but you're getting to where the drug manufacturing and the delivery system is so powerful that you don't have to inject it like we've always come to know. I'm way stronger that's so so the back to what you're saying the functionality of this. of this.

of this. Because of the way it binds again to the androgen receptor. Well yeah yeah yeah I mean again we don't yeah we we obviously this is a very intelligent audience right like if I was on a different crew I would be like guys you have to do all the things I mean everybody that listens to you guys and to me. to me. to me. And by the way your audience is now my audience so thank you guys for that. But but it but it is true.

Like it's not a magic pill. None of these things are magic pills. I mean I we always disclaim that, right? But if you train and you take this follistatin and you eat, you know, 1 g say per pound of lean body mass and you understand how to train in the way you guys recommend training, positive positive failure, you know, progressive overload, etc. Uh you will build muscle way easier on this. And when I say way easier, like I notice more from this now. And again, this is today 9 weeks that I've been on it.

And I have been on Again, let me just pull this up for the audience real quick. So, this is the actual vial. It says F says F says F Oh, I can't read it. FLGR242, which is again is the actual novel uh patented uh albumin-bound follistatin and it's 5 mg. So, you can inject this once every 2 weeks or you can inject it, as I was telling you, once a week. Exactly. So, I like and again, you know, obviously the Gorilla Chemist, you guys know Brian.

Um he is like our chief science officer. We hired him back in uh August and he's been doing a lot of research on this, but he kind of thinks and I agree with him based on what I've been doing that if you inject it once a week, you increase peak plasma concentration slightly more, even though it's the same dosage. You're giving that little PK curve bump by injecting it once a week. So, you might as a bodybuilder or as a somebody who's looking to build more muscle, you might notice a little bit more, but the net dose at 19-day half-life is the same.

What do you notice with joints, tendons, ligaments? Any difference? Yes. Yes. Like Like Like way better. Yes. Yeah. So, I mean again, Does myostatin also inhibit uh the car like cartilage? Does it also work on that? that? that? Not not technically. And again, I'm not the the the guru when it comes to the science on that. Brian would be a guy that you guys could want to talk to possibly to go deeper on that, but I definitely know that one of the things our chemist recommended and and we can talk about this.

It's like, what's the ultimate muscle building stack right now in 2026 and you would add TB 500 while you're taking this which I've been taking. Right. And that's obviously to increase plasma increase plasma increase plasma and increase and of course to help with the binding right with all the stuff TB 500 does. 500 does. 500 does. you this man and I know you started saying this after I told you so I'd like to take the credit although you You did. You did. I know what you're going to go for you I just wanted to say that first.

No dude listen BPC plus TB 500 together consistently at the at the higher doses. Yes it does work. It's a muscle building fat burning combo. 100%. It totally changes it. That's like that's an expensive stack though these days right? No it's so much cheaper now. Oh it is? Did it come back down cuz Well so so it's funny you just said that. So we just launched another product which I highly recommend everybody who's got injuries use which has Cartalax added to it. Oh okay. And Cartalax is that bioregulator right?

Exactly but it's injectable. If if there's something that actually helps to regenerate cartilage or regenerate the nerve bundle nerve fiber bundles in cartilage I would think it's that cuz I've gotten so many feedbacks so much feedback from people with low back problems that said they started taking Cartalax. Wolverine stack? It's way better than way better Wolverine stack. Yeah But I just noticed that I get leaner and I have a different quality or different look to my muscles. It's like they look harder and more told me that 2 years ago I went and I remember I told you guys this I went and looked at the research and there is research out there that does say that it improves and up regulates androgen receptors.

So it makes sense that that's what it's doing. So absolutely you would take less testosterone less anabolic agent. Or same amount and then a Yeah and and get a better result right? What so so so what's what's the what you cuz you say it's a larger dose. What what would you consider a larger dose of TB 500 and BPC? BPC? BPC? Well whatever so they'll tell you a range. I don't know what the number is but they'll give you a range and I'll stick to the higher range.

So here so here We have to talk off air to you to get the number. I'll give it to you. No I'll give it to you right now. It's we we just talked about this so I just don't remember. Chris Cavallini the owner of Nutrition Solutions has a issue in his back right now and he's like one of the most conditioned guys in the world and so we just designed a new healing stack for him with this we call it the regeno blend and it's TB, BBC and cardalax.

And so it's like 1 to 2 mg and by the way it's 10 10 10 in the blend. So you get 10 mg of each but it's 1 to 2 mg mg mg injected locally at the origin of the injury once to twice a day depending on how acute the injury is. So if it just happened you probably want to do it twice a day morning and night and then you would throw in if you want you can throw in two things you can throw in obviously copper peptide GHK-Cu right?

And some people when they inject that locally they get a burning yeah burns. So what you can do with that is you can just dilute it more right? Put more back to back water in it or and a lot of people are now doing this you can also take the other bioregulator which is oral which is called sigamir. Now we are now the first company in the United States that are selling the actual bioregulator the Russian cavinsons ones the ones that seed says don't work. I had you knew I was going to get that in there.

We're the only company in the only yeah only company in the United States that's manufacturing our own and they are cavinsons. So what we did is we said you know what we're going to prove that these work. We doubled the net ingredient so all of our capsules have double all the Russian blister pack bioregulators now. So we have one called bio cartilage which is just sigamir which nobody knows what sigamir means right? It's a Russian name but if you use that in addition you will definitely get better bonding or better binding because there's just something about that again I've had all these different influencers who have used that who have had shoulder issues that are like dude it literally made my shoulder feel good.

is there such a divide in the bioregulator thing? Why do why do half my doctor friends say one side and the other half say the other side? Because it's very easy. You don't notice physical change or feel physical change like you do with peptides. In today's episode you hear us talking about peptides. Look you can get them through medical practitioners from FDA regulated compound pharmacies, not the gray market, gray market, gray market, but stuff that's actually legit. And you can also get your blood tests and maybe get on hormone replacement therapy.

We have a place for you. mphormones.com. Work with real medical professionals. Get your hormones tested, see if hormone therapy's for you, and see if peptide therapy's for you. And again, these are the peptides that are coming from real compound pharmacies that are FDA-regulated. FDA-regulated. FDA-regulated. One more time, mphormones.com. Back to the show. And so, the bioregulators are more of a maintenance thing, right? But I mean, I use them. I take the Bio Male, my wife takes the Bio Female. Um I also use the prostate one.

It definitely works. I mean, I'm absolute living proof. I also inject Prosta Max. Look, I brought these with me today, you know, cuz I wanted to talk about like the latest stuff. But no, I mean, like look, like this is a real pen of Prosta Max, which is straight This is straight from Lithuania. This guy is a really cool guy. He sends these to me. But this is literally If I do not inject this once a day, I have to go piss twice a night when I go to bathroom.

Twice a night. What? What with one With I inject it every day, I only have to go to bathroom once a night. Bro, you need to be on this my whole life. Bro, you need to be on this for might be different, bro. Well, I mean, my my prostate I I had to piss twice a night starting at 27, and the doctor that taught me or not taught me, but kind of educated me on what was happening was when I was using Rip Fuel. Um you know, those things do They do stimulate the smooth muscle lining of the prostate walls, right?

So, like they could have could have could have increased slight slight hypertrophy. And so, that would, you know, cause that compression, making you have to piss multiple times. But I'm telling you, since I started injecting this, I only go to bathroom once a night. And as you know, dude, if you don't have to wake up more than once, you sleep so much better. better. better. But again, what is this What is this doing? So, I mean it literally is suppressing the inflammatory cascades that are happening around the prostate as you get older, which all men have.

Yeah. Right? I mean the older you get Matter of time. Yeah. Matter of time. How do you guys So cuz you How do you guys So cuz you guys operate in this like interesting space, right? space, right? space, right? How do you Like what is that like? Yeah. What is that like because that's a that's a I mean you got your Instagram taken down. You said it came back but you can't talk about peptides. Because you cuz you're working kind of this chill. It's so insane.

We use code words. words. words. here's the other thing too. That space is so crazy. It's insane. It's wild wild west. It's complete wild wild west because you don't know what you're getting. You know, the only I mean I know you. I trust you. I know where your address is. So if you send me something messed up, I'm coming after you. Yeah, we'll get you. But what's So So tell us about that whole space and what the Like what's that like navigating it? No, it's an awesome question.

an awesome No, it's an awesome question. So So in in truth, research use only, which is RUO. Well, first off we have the best attorney. I'll give him a shout out. If you guys ever need an attorney, we have Jeff Cohen, the honorable Jeff Cohen, who is literally the guy who's created the American Peptide Association. I mean he's just amazing. He works for um pharma. He works for compounders. He represents everybody. He's also got obviously research clients like us. But he knows the space from a legal, you know, regulatory standpoint better than anyone else.

So obviously we take our advice from him. But the truth is is that I told you guys this before, the research community is not under the purview of FDA. Right? Mhm. So it's not in the legal deal where where the weird part, the gray area is now with so many people like you said in the peptide space. Like, you know, there's people literally I I don't know if this is a real peptide company, but I'll just use the name Lonestar Peptides, right? They just pop up and you see them on your Instagram or your Facebook and you're like, "Oh my god, who's this?

These guys are brewing this up in their kitchen or their basement or whatever, their bathroom." But at the end of the day, the reality is is that all these different companies are not in the research space, again called RUO. They're not under the purview of the FDA. They're not technically allowed, which is what we have to deal with every single day, to give advice because they're not a medically authorized or licensed company. So, for example, if we sell you bioregulators or these small molecules, which we have all over here, there's nothing wrong with this because the FDA does not care about these oral products.

In fact, bioregulators are considered supplements. These are supplements. Small molecules are supplements. So, there's nothing illegal about doing that. The FDA though also says with like our peptides, with our injectable peptides, which are considered non-sterile, we cannot promote them for human use. So, that's why it says on the vial for research purposes only. But legally, anyone can research on themselves. You can research on yourself, you can research on your dog. So, no, but it's true, right? So, so, but here's where But here's where the divide is.

And to your question cuz it's the best question anybody can ask me is like we now, and there's not just me, there's tons of other influencers and and and people talking about it. Like, if we promote human use from our platform as this is my experience using this, whether I use Peptide Sciences, BioLongevity Labs, you know, Seeds brand, whomever, brand, whomever, brand, whomever, I'm allowed to do that because I'm promoting my personal experience, right? So, the line is gray and being straddled when it's an in And again, this comes from our attorney.

When an influencer is promoting this as my experience, it's perfectly okay. perfectly okay. perfectly okay. It's perfectly okay. So, what we can't do is I can't be on my company, which is BioLongevity Labs, and sending emails to people saying how this is how you do it. But I can from my personal brand, jcampbell.com, my personal email list, my social media, etc. But obviously, where it's getting weird is in the social media companies which are completely under the power and purview of Pharma. They're like oh, delete this guy.

guy. guy. Even though even though I get doing is wrong. I get ads for research chemicals Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. It's perfectly okay to do that. That's what I'm saying. But if you're somebody like me now and you have a lot of a big audience which thank thanks to you guys. Very truthfully. Very truthfully. Very truthfully. Uh seriously like it is [ __ ] because like you're right. There're thousands of people promoting it and they don't even know what they're talking about, right? Cuz they're like imitating and regurgitating stuff they hear.

How do you guys operate your company? Where do you guys based out of and how do you guys do all that? Yeah, so I mean very very well, I I can say. So we're based out of Akron, Ohio. That's where our 3PL is. So all of our shipping and our warehousing and all the manufacturing and then we are we are in the process of completely owning all of our own API. So we're going to eventually be manufacturing our actual raw's in the United States which is really good.

I'm going to I want to get back to your question cuz there's a lot of stuff to answer into that question of where this is all going. But right now we buy our actual non-sterile injectable peptides from a couple of places in the US. A company in Philadelphia who actually by the way supplies the majority of compound pharmacies and then we get another we have another company in California called Beta. In fact, Beta is awesome. They're down in Orange County and Newport. They're going to be responsible for our hair and face products.

So we actually have a hair and face product coming next year. You guys it'll be I mean you guys already know Better than already what you have? Oh yeah, I mean well you guys know Nick's stuff and and you know Nick is amazing and a a brilliant chemist. But like we decided to just build a kitchen sink product. So like a product that like So put it this way. I used it for 3 weeks. We only had a tiny sample bottle of this and it was a spray bottle and I have pictures.

This was back in September 3rd week of September to the 3rd week or 2nd week of October and my hair grew like a weed. I mean it's not going to be a cheap product cuz it has every single bioactive in under the sun. And they actually spent 6 months formulating the hair product so that they could know what they could put together which wouldn't render the other products inert. So, it's going to be an insane product. It's probably coming out in February. It's going to be called Bio Grow.

And then the face and and the the serum and the cream cuz it'll obviously be like a sister product that'll be called Bio Juvenate. And both of them will be the strongest products in the industry. industry. industry. guys ever get letters from from regulatory you know regular letters that are like, "Hey, stop talking about this" or something? or something? or something? No, so we do Well, so so back to your original question. So, what is coming and this is all obviously tentative and could change. But, we were told, and this is just going back 2 weeks, that in 2026, Lilly and Novo would just completely enforce all their patents.

And so, compounders, who, as you guys know, 80% of the compound business is GLPs. 80%. 80%. Wow. Yes. So, what we've been told and what their attorneys, and when I say their attorneys, I'm literally talking about FDA level and Lilly, which by the way, I don't know how you tell the difference anymore because Lilly just became a trillion-dollar company. Did you guys see that? No. Trillion-dollar No. Trillion-dollar No. Trillion-dollar market cap. market cap. market cap. Wow. So, imagine the power they have. We've also been told they have a billion-dollar legal defense lobby.

So, that that that So, I mean, they they they Nobody can compete with them. But, so what we've been told is that in 2026, you cannot, as a compounder or as a research company, make any GLP product. They're going to own the rights. They paid, you know, the billion dollars that they paid to go through stage three trials of all their products and the cease and desist letters, which by the way, we've never gotten a cease and desist letter cuz we've never sold any of their products, all right?

We sold GLP-3, but it's not approved, right? So, legally we have the right to to do that. But, we're not playing the game. We're At the end of this month, we're never going to sell another GLP again cuz we don't want them coming after us. But, the problem is the compounders, and I won't name names, but you guys know some of these guys, they're in I mean, I mean, problems because they've got massive overheads, massive employees, and 80% of the revenue is coming from GLPs, and they're being told, again, from what I've been told, that they can't make it anymore.

They will have to have express right from Lilly or from Novo or any of the giant, you know, manufacturers, pharmaceutical manufacturers, pharmaceutical manufacturers, pharmaceutical manufacturers to to make it. So, the other side of the coin, and again, this is all what we've been told, I don't know if it actually comes true, is they are going to roll back, which is good for the clinical space, the class two restriction. So, all the peptides two right now, which is most of them, they're going to make them class one, which will mean that anybody can go get a peptide from their doctor.

So, they'll be legally, you know, able to be compounded at most pharmacies. The problem will be for the compounder if you're 80% of your revenue comes from GLP, you know, now you're going to have to scramble and you're going to have to try to, you know, market to your clients all these other peptides that you don't know anything about. Now, do you think that a the cuz you guys are smart, do you guys think that someone's going to come out with a kind of a little bit of a different GLP I told you.

I already told you about it, super rata. Yeah, okay, so which which will be totally different. Exactly. And it's a small molecule, so we don't compete with their compounds. And and and like I said, where I think this goes in the in the space is the smarter chemists and people in it are all in the small molecule route. Because again, pharma's like, we just want to own GLP. own GLP. own GLP. What do you mean by that by small molecule route? Like, what is that versus big molecule route?

What's explain the difference? yeah, no, so I mean, it's just like a technical term to saying like, you don't go down the GLP patent pathway, and you just start working with all these novel agents that are out there now that are like in the biochemical space that are considered small molecules. Like, for example, like, shred max, like, the sloop is a small molecule. Yeah. Yeah. Right? Um bio mind, like, you know, this non J147, small molecule, right? The other one's a peptide, new pept is obviously a racetam.

But you've got all these different small molecules that do all these amazing things, and right now pharma, I mean these are technically small molecules. I mean they're peptide proteins, but Pharma doesn't care about the patent pathways right now of a lot of these. They just care about the breadwinner, which is GLP-3. That's where all the money is. And and and and I didn't tell you guys this and I wanted to bring this up, but I'm writing a book, which is going to be my best book ever.

It's called Metabolic Awakening with GLP peptides and it's amazing. I mean I my writer's been in there for 8 months and I've been in there now for about 2 and 1/2 months and every time I get out of there my brain is like spinning because I went through all the research. I can conclusively tell you guys this and this is going to be good for all the listeners. listeners. listeners. No one is getting side effects from GLP drugs. They're getting them from their lifestyle. Yeah. I've looked at all the research.

I've looked at the eye, you know, know, know, I you know, I sight eye sight issues, gallbladder issues. I mean everything. Every possible conceivable side effect and these are all lifestyle related. Yeah, it's all because they're not strength training, eating enough protein, they're starving their body. And it's from Pharma telling them exactly, giving them too much. big one. Too much, yeah. Yeah. Way too much. Shutting out the gut. Everybody Everybody that we we've gone through in training, we've had to tell them to go back and talk to their doctor about lower on their dose.

Guys, I'm going to send you cuz nobody's seen this yet cuz my copywriter subscribes to the diabetic whatever and they have this new thing. It's coming out in probably February or March, but it's a list of all the things that GLPs do good. It's the most mind-blowing thing you've ever seen in your life. It corrects It corrects It corrects like gambling. Yes. I mean like all these bad like you know, obsessive compulsive things that we do. It rewires It rewires It rewires Do you think there's a fear, Jay, because it is working with the reward pathways that it could there could be a negative side to that?

I mean I'm sure that there is, but I think again everything is dose related. If we do this like you guys know how to do it, to use them as micro doses tools, they're amazing. And imagine the small molecule stuff when we get to like once a month or once every 2 months, like how much better they'll be. But it's it's it's conclusive that it's the dose the dose response curve is what causes the side effects. If you start high and go higher, which is what Pharma wants and which most doctors and again you can't blame the doctors.

Yeah, they're not. It's going to be up to us to correct the doctors so the doctors learn. But you guys know Dr. Tyna, there's a lot of doctors that already know. And they're doing a great job. job. job. You know. Um but it's up to us and people like us to actually continue to be in the field and experimenting with the micro doses. But I'm telling you in the crazy Here's the craziest part too. The research shows that the micro doses work. Because you know what the research shows?

If you start them on a micro dose, 95% of them maintain the weight loss. loss. loss. 95% 95% 95% and all of the other studies when you start high and go higher, it's less than 40%. So they all rebound, they all have thyroid issues, they all have muscle loss issues. Because it's about money, dude. Yeah, but wouldn't wouldn't it be just as advantageous to keep them on it low dose over a long period of time and No, cuz they don't make as much money. Yeah, it will.

But right now it's just money. I mean it literally is I mean you guys know this Trump I mean I don't want to say this cuz we're all fans, but like he at this point right now looks like he sold out to Lilly and and Novo to give everybody the lower price through their insurance. But we all know That's a whole new podcast. But but no, but but seriously like when you think about Yeah, once a fan, right? But but think about this like why would you do that if you know cuz we all know this from history if you give complete price control to one or two companies, what happens?

happens? happens? No competition is insane. So I the final to give you just spin around one more time to your big question, which is a very important question. I see lawsuits in 2026. I see the compounders saying this is [ __ ] You can't do this to us. This is literally anti-trust. You're basically saying that Lilly and Novo and whatever other giant you know pharmaceutical manufacturer owns everything. everything. everything. Exactly. So like if you're Empower, you know, Shawn Dorian shout out to Shawn the owner of Empower the biggest compounder in the country who does very well and has thousands of employees.

You know, Chris Bell works for Shawn now. You know, he just called me yesterday. Like that's not fair to them to say you can't make GLPs anymore. So they're also going to does does does peptides become like marijuana the 90s? What do you mean? mean? mean? good question. So So I mean just what was marijuana in the 90s? Well, what's going to be a billion dollar underground industry? Everybody was like this [ __ ] ain't that bad. Well, I'll tell you what it's a great question. Rick Collins just did an awesome post on Instagram about that because you've got all these doctors that are writing them and and by the way when they went to class two and restricted the smart doctors didn't care cuz they knew they could still write them as off-label as a script.

Yeah. But it's you know, the younger normie quote-unquote docs that don't understand that think oh, it's illegal. But it's it was never illegal. You just had to write a script and say hey, I had to find a compounder that made it, right? And you guys know there's compounders that never sold out. They're also going to kill innovation because if you limit it and say these are the ones and they're going to be this cheap and there's no competition. Now this rapid innovation into this into the GLP receptor Right.

the money dries up and and the innovation I think is so important because it went from semaglutide to tirzepatide to retatrutide and you're there's there's more that's out there. Oh, there's insane stuff. So that's my last chapter of the book is like what's coming and it's insane. I mean retatrutide again retatrutide again retatrutide again I think personally that it could be that you guys already know this, but I think it could be the drug that could end obesity. Obviously we would have to get it to everyone, right?

But it's one of those drugs that would help doing that and if you could get it to everyone, but there's stuff after retatrutide you guys I'm not joking that I think retatrutide will be a distant memory in 2 years. Wow. Maybe 18 months. I mean, that's what's coming. I mean, like I said, this super Retatrutide, imagine that, and then imagine taking Follistatin or something in that pathway and adding to it. it. it. Yeah. So, you would create superhumans. You know what I mean? No, but I mean, you will.

You'll create metahumans. You take a genetic freak We're going to need to We're going to need to fight the AI, [ __ ] You're already doing that. You're going to have to figure this out. I got to tell you what's crazy is I have friends that compete in in pro bodybuilding, and now they all use uh Retatrutide. Yeah, they all use it. Pre-contest, and they're like, "Dude, this is the easiest greatest thing in my life. This is the easiest pre-contest I've ever done in my But, you guys remember I told you that 2 years ago on our podcast, I said Retatrutide, when it first came out, and you guys thought I was probably even crazier than you think I am now.

I was like, "This will revolutionize bodybuilding." revolutionize bodybuilding." revolutionize bodybuilding." And it already has. And you know, and that's That's the hardest part of bodybuilding, is getting ready for that. And then, if your diet was crushed naturally, and you can keep your muscle. I think it's better What we don't talk about is cuz you guys know how bad it is for women, right? They over diet, they crash their thyroid, and then they rebound, and they get fat, and they never train again or exercise again. It's It's solving the woman problem better than anything, because they don't have the food noise after.

And so, they don't, you know, gorge and Yes. Yes. So, it It's a total game changer for women, and I hear that cuz I have so many women in my private membership group who tell me that Retatrutide changed their life, you know, competitors, cuz they don't they don't rebound anymore. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I could see actually just using it I've never I didn't even think about that. When I think back to all the ways I dieted, like what a smart way to use it to reverse diet.

Exactly. So, I actually wouldn't even 100% 100% 100% Like, I probably wouldn't even use it in the competition. the competition. the competition. Yeah, you would do it for that. do that, but when I get off, like, to control the crazy rebound of aggressive eating. eating. eating. I would actually Dude, you're so smart. I would actually say that you would even be better in that way anyway, because you would put muscle on after. But, what permanently keep. permanently keep. permanently keep. Yes. Yes. Yeah. No, it's a game changer.

Red-red has got some muscle building effects. Because of its insulin sensitivity aspect. sensitivity aspect. sensitivity aspect. It does. It does. Nutrient partitioning, insulin signaling. You know, 100% builds muscle. muscle. muscle. yeah. Or definitely preserving, that's for sure. Tell me about clotho. What is clotho? That's the other one I hear you talking about all the time. Yeah, so so clotho is incredible. So first off, if we look into the research, I sent you guys the articles, um clotho comes from a Greek goddess of a vitality. And so these Japanese chemists discovered it like in 1998 or 1999, same time I met uh Dan Duchaine, by the way, how funny is that?

Um and sub- subsequently since then millions, if not hundreds of millions, probably billions have gone into researching it, like how can we use this protein? It is an endocrine hormone, technically, but how can we use this to forestall aging and extend life? Because it's responsible for almost every single bioenergetic and cellular cascade in the world, right? From heart, sexual function, brain function, uh endothelial function, uh it's incredible. So Monica and I have been using it since the end of August. Um our chemist gave it to us then, so I've technically now been on it for about close to 4 months.

And it's very subtle. The thing that you will notice, especially being in a monogamous relationship, is that like your sex is like, what is going on? Because it's increasing endothelial sensitivity, right? So like 3 days after our first shot, we were just we I can't remember where we were. We were having sex, and I was like, what the [ __ ] is going on? Like it but both of us, like we were like, you know, this is strange, or like she doesn't know me, or like I mean, it was so insane.

And so since then, our sex has become amazing, like in the very beginning of our relationship. We've been together for 14 years, right? So like every time we have sex now, we're like really looking forward to it. So like that's one of the noticeable things. Um Why do you stack it? Why is it with But follistatin? Well, you don't have to. So anybody can use clotho. And in fact, I would just say this, if you're 35 and older, you want clotho. Cuz if you look at the science, we start dropping our clotho levels at 35.

In fact, it literally goes from like you lose like It's like the testosterone dec- dec- decline, but it's greater. So, it's like 1 and 1/2 to 3% per year. per year. per year. or any relation to like if you were on HGH or you were on testosterone, does that clotho level come up? No. No. So, it's just like it's just an endocrine protein that affects aging and all the cellular cascade Okay. Okay. Okay. of aging. So, if you take a tiny bit exogenously as you get older, you will maintain a younger biological age.

And I'm already noticing that. Like no lie, I just did a presentation at Hack Your Health 2 weekends ago, and I only had 30 minutes, and I had an 86-slide deck. And I'm like, "How am I going to do this, right?" And I went through it so fast. I figured in my mind I was like speaking so fast that nobody in this audience even has a clue of what I was saying. And all of a sudden, I look at the clock, and I got 2 minutes and 30 seconds for my 10 minutes of Q&A.

And I'm like, "Oh my god, I just went through an 86-slide deck." So, when I got out, I'm like, "Okay, I must be thinking like I went so fast nobody understood it." And everybody came up to me like, "Woah, bro, that was amazing." And I was like, "Was I too fast?" "No, it was" So, I think your brain, the clock speed, it's working, it's improving your brain, too. I will tell you guys this, the one other thing that I've noticed about how amazing it is in the four four months and a week that I've been on it, I've not had a single morning I woke up depressed.

depressed. depressed. Not one day that I woke up where I was like, "Ah, you know, I'm just" Cuz you know, we all have those ups and downs and those abs and flows, but that's one of the other things it does, it improves well-being. Wow. So, it does so many things. I mean, this really is the fountain of youth molecule. Now, there you got to be careful cuz there's other companies out there that are selling this. There's people in the clinical space selling it, and they're selling it between 5 to 10 times more expensive than us.

Monthly, right? Like right now, and we're out of the follistatin, but you can get a month supply of this for 380 bucks. 380 bucks. 380 bucks. Mhm. So, Mhm. So, Mhm. So, So, we tons of people buy this for an entire year. entire year. entire year. I bought it for the whole year for my wife. wife. wife. other There's one peptide that's supposed to be good for telomere Uh epitalon. Yeah, so how does it compare to epitalon for Way better. Not You can't I mean epitalon's good, don't get me wrong.

It's just not noticeable. Yeah, I've used it. I don't feel anything. anything. anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is noticeable. Like you want to take this because you feel the end Where you really feel is the endothelial sensitivity, right? So you get better erections. Like my wife stays wetter, faster. Um and again, you know, for people in their 50s, this is a serious thing. You know what I mean? And I can't imagine what it's like for people in 60s, 70s, 80s. So this is without a doubt a billion-dollar product.

Um you know, our chemist told me this. He started telling me this in April of this year. You know, at that point it was just like, "Whatever, dude. That sounds cool." But then we started using it and like, "Oh my god, right?" So So So um there'll be other versions, I would assume, and other companies will reverse engineer this and you know, it will come out. And by the way, it's the same 19-day albumin and binder in this product that he has in the fallostatin. Yeah, yeah.

So he's just a genius. Yeah, twice a month. In fact, you don't want to inject too much of clotho. Like more is not better because we only have a tiny bit amount from our cellular cascade standpoint anyway. So it's like I think and I'm going from memory, but I'm pretty sure that the human adult, male or female, is the same. It has anywhere from like 8 to 15 micrograms plasma concentration over a 7-day period. period. period. So this is just 10 micrograms every 2 weeks. So it's technically five a week.

So you're just slightly bumping where you would be and that's all you need because it dramatically improves cellular health signal. When you when you work with people, Jay, uh you must have a lot of fun when you work with like the the bodybuilder cosmonauts because you get to push the limits and have a lot of fun with that. What do you learn from working with with people like that? Just what the upper limits are of I mean, yeah. So I mean, I yeah, so it's a good question.

Um You don't like with these products like 10 mg like follistatin just a switch. 10 mg is the most you'd want to go like to really push the limits. Yeah, because Yeah, cuz like what just happens if you take more? Well, if you take more, you just won't get more of an effect because of the saturation, right? Cuz the way it binds at saturation. Now, that's not to say that if somebody did take 15, you know, a week that they might gain more muscle faster, but like over time the way it saturates and binds, like you're not going to see that much more.

Um Um Um not relative to the size? Like the difference of a 130-lb woman versus a 250-lb bodybuilder? 250-lb bodybuilder? 250-lb bodybuilder? So, it So, for for follistatin, it it would be for like a woman would take less, for sure. But, like let's just say you get to 200 lb as a man, like it's all going to be kind of the same. And now, if you maybe had a 300-lb bodybuilder, maybe they could go up a little bit. But, again, it's just the way it binds actually to androgen receptors and the way it's again has a 19-day plasma half-life, it does There's a certain level where you're you're saturated.

And so, you won't get that much. But, um yeah, to your question, I mean, I definitely have people that push the envelope. Um I think where we're going with small molecules, uh and obviously just newer and newer cuz there's novel peptides coming out now, too. There's like a cancer-killing peptide. It's impossible to get it. Um I've recently, I'm sure you guys have, but I haven't personally until recently, but I've been experimenting with cerebrolysin. Oh my god, cerebrolysin is absolutely absolutely absolutely amazing. I might have injected this morning.

morning. morning. Oh my god, dude. It's I'm not Well, so, here's what's so crazy about cerebrolysin. You cannot sell it as a research company. You cannot sell it as a pharmacy. They will come and shut you down, padlock your door, arrest you, and put you in jail. I'm not joking. joking. joking. And And the the reason they say that is because it's comes from pigs. It's porcine. That's how they make it. But, if you look at the DNA of a pig and you compare it to the DNA of a human, it's almost like anatomical, anatomical blueprint.

Yes, it's insane, which is another podcast probably. Right, we don't want to go down that road. It's a filthy animal that roots in [ __ ] right? Think of Samuel L. Jackson. But no, but it is amazing. I I just started using it a week ago. week ago. week ago. Our friend who I won't mention, you know, gave it to me and he's like, "Bro, you got to start taking this." And so it's a 60-mg vial and both my wife and I have been taking it. We've actually only had three injections.

Today was my third. It's, dude, they they actually give it on they actually have it on EMT trucks in the Balkan countries. When somebody has a heart attack or they have an aneurysm or they have a vent, you know, what do you call it? A sclerotic event, they they give them a giant IV of this stuff because it prevents damage to the brain. That's how amazing it is. So yes, so like all of us should literally be on cerebralysin. Why we're not, again, you know, blame the pharmaceutical companies, blame whoever is in control of the United States.

But I mean, it's absolutely amazing. Yeah, I've only had three shots. shots. shots. You inject it I am. It's water. You know, it's like a normal aqueous-based peptide, but you want to inject it into the into the vasculature to get effect right away. But I'm not kidding you. I my first injection was on Today's Tuesday. Friday did one, Sunday did one this morning. And my first injection within 30 minutes I was like, You sound smarter today. It's not even that. that. that. It's not the smarter.

You think it's smarter and it's well-being. Uh maybe that's what I think. weird things in your head that makes you feel better. Like you actually just have this sense of like everything is awesome. awesome. awesome. I have a left field question for you. How does a guy like you find someone like Monica 14 years ago willing to be a guinea pig like you and try all these things? Dude, things? Dude, things? Dude, dude, it's honestly a miracle. So this is so weird. I mean, with like, you know, Katrina's mom and the whole stuff like we just had a woman that came and spent time with us.

She's from Southern California, too. California, too. California, too. Were you Were you uh spiritual before her? Yeah. Okay, you were. But like she made me much more spiritual. Okay. Cuz I didn't even really know that about her or you until all that. Yeah. Yeah. No. No. No. So I like always have been in that path. I mean obviously we were both of us were raised Catholic so we had like that whole Abrahamic Catholic stuff, but like in the background we were, you know, more into like I would call it the spiritual.

I mean I don't know really what it is. It's just like we have love in us, right? But Um and by the way, the way, the way, props to you guys for taking a stand on that now. I know you guys are doing a lot of that stuff and that's awesome, you know. If we want to talk about that we can, but uh um um um she she she This woman came to the for us for Thanksgiving and she brought her machine and it's like a I forget it is.

It's some sort of machine that measures like uh the bioenergetic wave of the person. And so they can kind of tell if you're in trauma, you know, if you have like a lot of trauma energy or if you're in a like you know, balanced and centered. And she ran our energy and she's like, "I've done 1,600 people in my life and you and your wife have the exact same match." Oh, wow. And so I was like, This was your first date? This was on This she ran us on Thanksgiving day.

And she ran Monica in the morning and I was like, "That's BS. Like you you must have you probably didn't Maybe it just took the same inputs." And she's like, "No, I literally shut the machine down and I unplugged it and I re-ran it and you guys had the same three attributes that it measures." And again, it's it's measuring, you know, you could probably say it's kind of a woo-woo machine, but it does measure like your bioenergetic signal. signal. signal. Dianetics, is it? What is it?

No. No. No. No. This machine No. No. No. No. This machine No, this machine is like a $26,000 machine. It's a serious machine and it measures like your waves and stuff like that, right? So anyway, we we each had the same the same the same that your body emits, right? 100%. 100%. But it But it also gives you like a a qualitative of like this energy is saying that you're here and you're here and you're here. And she said she'd never seen two people that had the exact three top qualities that she measured.

And she also measured everybody at the house, my daughters, Monica's sister was there, we had a couple friends, and so everybody had different things, but she's like, you guys are so in sync that you have the same three things. I was like, that's pretty weird. How far into the relationship was it at that point? Well, this is brand new, so but we're 14 years She just did this on Thursday. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, literally. So, it was so weird because we're like, I mean, I couldn't even believe it.

believe it. believe it. Well, I mean, it's it's crazy when you you share that of all the stuff that she's willing to do, it's just like, uh that's so Well, so I mean, like I I really honestly do feel like we probably shared a past life or past experience or something. Our souls, you know, met up and stuff. and stuff. and stuff. you meet? How did you originally meet? Dude, match.com. Shut up. You did not just say that. Monica has told the story, but it's incredible.

She She basically was with her girlfriend and their kids, they're both divorcees, and they were in Hawaii, and they did the whole bottle thing of like, what I want to meet in a man, and they put it and threw it out into the ocean. And then she came home, she flew back from They were in Waikiki, and then she flew home and she sent a message to like 20 guys on match.com. And she's like and she and she canceled her account. her account. her account. And then she gave her real email address, and I was the only person to respond.

This is in 2012, and and I was like, I mean, dude, I was so in the ego mind and such a bad not where I am now spiritually. Um I was literally like on my match.com profile it was like, if you do not look like a 10 in a bikini, do not respond. That's how wack THAT WAS. YOU DID. IF YOU ARE not a 10 in a bikini, bikini, bikini, do not respond to me. That's how wack I was, right? So, so she actually wrote an email back to me, and her her this was fascinating.

She didn't have a picture of herself other than, you know, mock turtleneck with her daughter. I mean, I could tell she was an attractive woman, but I was like, this is so weird. So, anyway, I responded to her, and her and I met at match.com. I mean at a restaurant in Pasadena, California, Conrad's, which is now gone. And and literally I just met her and I sat down at the table and just threw all my crap at her for 30 minutes thinking that she would be like get up and say, all right, bro, I'm out of here.

And she was like, oh, that's interesting. Here's my story. And then I was like I was like enamored at how spiritually advanced she was. Because I had been meeting and of course I'm attracting the worst people cuz I'm a mess. But like I had just met nothing but women that were a disaster. And I meet her and she's just like this I'm like, holy [ __ ] Like I I really was so broken but I was into like learning from her like how to become like her cuz she was so centered so balanced so calm.

You know, and she was coming out of a divorce too and she had three kids and stuff and so everything attempted to destroy our relationship in the first 6 months cuz I lived in Studio City. You guys I was living in a 220-ft studio apartment. studio apartment. studio apartment. Just coming out of a divorce. I was destroyed. destroyed. destroyed. I mean you know, I was put in jail. My kids were kidnapped from me. Everything that could go wrong was bad and and and and she lived in San Diego.

to I got to know why you went to jail. I don't know you went to jail. Oh, dude, that story is incredible. Yeah, no, no, I I I I NO, NO, NO, NO, MY NO, NO, NO, I'll just tell you the whole story. But so my ex ex ex was dating a ex-sheriff without me knowing while I was working and they cooked up a scheme to put me in jail. W- what? Wait, how did they get Wait, wait, wait, wait, okay, after wait, wait, wait, wait, okay, after okay, so she's she's dating the sheriff post you.

No, no, no, we're together. You're together and she's cheating she's cheating on you with the sheriff. Yes. And he's like, I got an But he wasn't a sh- He was an wasn't a sh- he wasn't a sh- He was an ex-sheriff. He was actually now a like he him and his partner had a fitness photography photography photography thing. I won't tell you who they are but you guys probably know who they are. Okay. And Okay. And Okay. And cuz they're pretty well known. And anyway, they were carrying this on and I came back from a a corporate meeting in Chicago, and I went to bed.

We were living in Las Vegas at the time, and I woke up with Las Vegas Metro. Vegas Metro. Vegas Metro. Mr. Campbell. Mr. Campbell. Mr. Campbell. What were the charges? Uh yeah, I beat her up for domestic violence or something like that. You know, just made up. up. up. But that just sent me that put me back. I mean, I lost my standing in you know, as a corporate wage slave, which was obviously for the good, cuz I ended up meeting Monica like 9 or 10 months later.

But I had my kids kidnapped from me. My daughters were only 18 months. My youngest was 18, and my oldest was about 3 and 1/2. Oh my gosh. No, no, no. So, it was a disaster. I mean, I literally had to rebuild my life completely. I mean, I lost my job over it. You know, I had charges. I had a record, so I couldn't get a job back in my industry. And I was a very accomplished guy in the digital automotive marketing world. You know, this was all the way up until um until um until um I was 42.

So, this happened So, it happened when I was 41, and then the whole like effect was lasting for a year, and then I met Monica when I was 42, when I was forced to come back to Southern California, cuz I couldn't get a job. a job. a job. I couldn't pass a background check. You know, cuz of all the things that were on me. So, it took 4 years for me to suppress my record, uh and to do all the things I had to do, cuz I had community service, and I had to deal with all this stuff.

But it was all fabricated. All the stuff was suppressed. Uh my wife actually admitted it to me, which was crazy, cuz she won't she the ex-wife, excuse me. And And by the way, we're totally amicable, and you know, she's done a good thing. You're amicable with her after all that? Dude, I mean, it was it was it was very tough in the beginning, but you know, as you know, forgiveness is a big thing, you know. It takes a very very spiritually sound and centered and balanced person to forgive.

You're right. And And And as you guys know, forgiveness is not for them. It's for you. you. you. Mhm. And that's what people don't understand, right? It's always for you. grudge is swallowing poison and hoping it will kill the other person. Exactly. So, so, so I I forgave her, even though it was in the first 2 years, it was like I remember attempting to explain to my friends in my inner circle people who didn't believe me. I bet. Because the charges, the you know, you had the the picture, you know, I mean, I got into a fight 1 year after that with one of my brothers at Christmas because they he came in and showed my mug shot.

He's like, "Oh, you must be such a winner." And I was like, "Why are you doing that?" And he's like, "Because you're a tool." Or something like that. I just turned and just I hit him so hard. I like knocked over the Christmas tree. It was awesome. Oh, I mean, I would probably I mean, that would make you I mean, the to be accused of something like that. 3 years of my life was insane. Yeah, yeah, I bet. Um I didn't have my kids. And so, when I met Monica and I gave her that whole story and she found out that I didn't have my kids and I was a disaster and that, you know, I mean, I it devastated me to lose my daughters.

I mean, I Of course. And very truthfully, for 1 year, the only time I heard from them was when she would call me or text me at the end of my She never called me. She text me. She might leave me a message a voice message and she says, "Where's my money?" Right? And And my attorney at the time, because of all the charges that were against me, told me he's like, "You can't respond. You can't call cuz they can just reopen the charges and go after you, you know?" So, I think you guys probably have a ton of men in your audience that have gone through the family court system and had these tape of, you know, it's called um what do you call it?

Um domestic violence DV charges cuz a lot of them are made up. Mhm. And And in Vegas in Nevada when it happened, they had the the rule is the the law is they take they have to arrest the If they come out, they have to arrest the biggest person. biggest person. biggest person. So, my ex was a tiny little, you know, ex fitness model. But, she wasn't there anyway. She They They They planned this, took the two my two daughters in the middle of the night, and then the cops came in.

came in. came in. Were you able to rekindle your relationship with your kids or did it destroy that? No. Um well, man, it would make me cry if I told you guys this, but when I first saw my baby girl a year later, she was crying. She didn't know who I was. And that was Oh my god. That was unbelievable. But yeah, we have an amazing relationship now. Um I ended up raising them. So, this is the cool thing about Monica. So, so once I told Monica the story, and we were dating, she said, "We're going to get your kids back, and they're going to be living with you in a year." And I was like, "Okay.

Okay, well, well, well, maybe Okay, you know, like I totally doubted her. 11 months, we had them back. Shut up. up. up. She met my ex and convinced her like the kids the girls were going to be much better with me and her. And and my ex was a broken person, way way more broken at that point even than I was, um because that guy had of course dumped her. dumped her. dumped her. Right? So, she's now living in Florida with the two girls, and she doesn't have much money, and you know, just out of spite she was keeping them from me.

Um so, once Monica met her, we had them. No way. way. way. then we ended up raising them from they were 4 and 1/2 Well, no, technically almost five. And and and Gabby, the youngest, was like three. And so, we raised them in Southern California until then until we ended up sending them, when I met you guys back, remember I told you that I was sending them back to Florida cuz the whole letter I got from Gavin Newsom about where, you know, you're we know you're homeschooling your daughters, and if we find out if the homeschooler is not vaxed, we're going to you're committing a felony, blah blah blah.

So, to her credit, me my ex, she stepped up when we sent them back to live with them in um in Florida. Bro, that's so rad that you Wow. Yeah. That's rad. I did not know that. Yeah, no, I I mean I mean everything happens for a reason. You guys know that, man. You know, you know, God puts obstacles. I mean, that's why we're here, right? We're here to evolve and grow our souls. And it's like you can choose to grow and evolve through the contrast, or you can just, you know, detach and become a victim.

And so many people do, right? And that's that's why like I had to learn to forgive, and I had so many of my friends were like, "How can you forgive her?" I'm like, "Bro, how can I not?" Right? Like, that's why we're here. We're here to forgive people. Yes, you can be hurt and you can be can be you can be hurt and you can be blinded and you can be, you know, affronted and affronted and affronted and clearly I did things that got me there.

Yeah. You know, I was not the best person. I was living in a pure ego mind. I was a bad person. I mean, I take total full ownership of all the bad things I did. But, that happening to me I didn't think I deserved. But, I learned that, you know, what? It was part of the process. Yeah. process. Yeah. process. Yeah. And so, I evolved through that. I met this amazing woman who, you know, helped raise my daughters. Both of my daughters are very advanced, you know, souls and girls now.

Uh my 18-year-old is she got a 1480 on her SAT. Wow. You know, so she's brilliant, you know, off the charts. Has full scholarships everywhere. And then my sophomore is not as smart, you know, on paper, but she's very advanced, too. And so, both of them really learn from me and Monica and they got really awesome, you know, upbringing. That's badass that she called that and 11 months later you had a a a Dude, it's incredible. I mean, that's like such a rare story. I mean, especially when you figure your record.

Yep. You being a the dad, like and that's why to tell Monica that that hate cuz her brother was a LAPD cop. LAPD cop. LAPD cop. And he was a detective with Rampart, right? Like downtown in the worst division of LA. And I said, you know, cuz I know I knew he would run my record. record. record. Sure. And so, I told her from day one. I was like, cuz she told me she had a cop. I was like, "Ah, well, just so you know, here's the full disclosure." And he did.

And he And he was messaging her, "Are you sure you want to be with this guy?" Yeah. You know, so there was a lot to overcome, but um but it you know what? It was worth it. Um and and she also was coming out of a horrible divorce, too. And her her ex is was a total um how do you want to say it? He was like the the parental alienation syndrome, syndrome, syndrome, you know, dad who pit pitted all their kids cuz she had three kids from him.

Yeah, yeah. And she pitted the with the one middle son didn't talk to her for 7 years. Yeah. So, while we were together, he would not come around because like he kept telling them that like Monica was just going through a midlife crisis and she would eventually come back to him even though we had already living together and married. So, yeah, it was uh it was it was a very interesting time, but um there's no doubt that I think Monica and I came together together together for a very, very spiritual purpose and and obviously now with our community and all the people that were working with and helping, it's all worked out perfect cuz we have that like experience to really sound off on.

Yeah, definitely. Good for you, man. Good for you. It's always fun having you on, bro. Yeah. And so, when can we expect Fall State? Um I mean, you guys honestly are going to have Fall State and Clotho probably within the next 7 to 10 days. I mean, if I have it on Thursday, I'll just have it mailed to you guys. Please. Yeah, I'll talk about it. No, you guys definitely, definitely want to have it. And and and you know, we didn't talk about any of these products, but for sure, definitely try the Shred Max.

I got one of these for you, too. If he won't take it. Uh but you guys You're like the best of both worlds for sure. For sure, the Bio Mine. Oh, no, no, this one, too. This one, What do we got here? That's the the Bio Amp Max. Amp Max. Amp Max. yeah, yeah, yeah. When you guys try I I see the ingredients. Well, just open it. All you guys take it before you guys leave cuz that you'll be like, "Whoa." Yeah, you don't mess Yeah, you don't mess around.

That's for sure. Not at all. Yeah. For sure. Dave, it's always great having Always always good time. Looking forward to the Looking forward to our party this weekend. Yeah, for sure. Thank you so much for having us as always.