Andrew Huberman: Peptides, Sleep Tech, and the End of Obesity

You don't want to stimulate the You don't want to stimulate the sympathetic nervous system so much for sympathetic nervous system so much for sympathetic nervous system so much for so often. It can probably shorten your so often. It can probably shorten your so often. It can probably shorten your life. There's a whole category of what life. There's a whole category of what life. There's a whole category of what are called growth hormone secrets which are called growth hormone secrets which are called growth hormone secrets which are very popular. People hear erection, are very popular. People hear erection, are very popular. People hear erection, fat loss, energy, tan, like, oh great. fat loss, energy, tan, like, oh great. fat loss, energy, tan, like, oh great. This isn't the kind of thing you do to This isn't the kind of thing you do to This isn't the kind of thing you do to like go on vacation. You got to be real like go on vacation. You got to be real like go on vacation. You got to be real careful with these things. careful with these things. careful with these things. >> Nearly one in seven Americans is taking >> Nearly one in seven Americans is taking >> Nearly one in seven Americans is taking a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried them. What a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried them. What a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried them. What do you think the future looks like? do you think the future looks like? do you think the future looks like? >> In theory, you could eradicate obesity. >> In theory, you could eradicate obesity. >> In theory, you could eradicate obesity. People can lose up to a third of their People can lose up to a third of their People can lose up to a third of their body weight. Melanotan, which makes body weight. Melanotan, which makes body weight. Melanotan, which makes people tan from the inside, raises people tan from the inside, raises people tan from the inside, raises energy and libido dramatically, fat loss energy and libido dramatically, fat loss energy and libido dramatically, fat loss dramatically. BPC-157, body protection dramatically. BPC-157, body protection dramatically. BPC-157, body protection compound. It's not legal, but it's not compound. It's not legal, but it's not compound. It's not legal, but it's not necessarily enforced. They list them as necessarily enforced. They list them as necessarily enforced. They list them as for research purposes only, not for for research purposes only, not for for research purposes only, not for human use. I mean, who's doing research human use. I mean, who's doing research human use. I mean, who's doing research on these peptides at home? Anytime on these peptides at home? Anytime on these peptides at home? Anytime you're stimulating cell growth, it could you're stimulating cell growth, it could you're stimulating cell growth, it could start going ary and then get a tumor or start going ary and then get a tumor or start going ary and then get a tumor or something like that. If that's within something like that. If that's within something like that. If that's within your margins of risk, and that's up to your margins of risk, and that's up to your margins of risk, and that's up to you. you. you. >> I want to talk about what's happened >> I want to talk about what's happened >> I want to talk about what's happened over the last 5 years. Slowly through over the last 5 years. Slowly through over the last 5 years. Slowly through the 80s, through the 90s, and then the 80s, through the 90s, and then the 80s, through the 90s, and then [music] the early 2000s, everyone wanted [music] the early 2000s, everyone wanted [music] the early 2000s, everyone wanted to know what they could take to improve to know what they could take to improve to know what they could take to improve their immune system and their health. their immune system and their health. their immune system and their health. There's a very interesting drug I think There's a very interesting drug I think There's a very interesting drug I think is going to become far more popular is going to become far more popular is going to become far more popular soon, which is >> Dr. Heberman, welcome to the A16Z show. >> Dr. Heberman, welcome to the A16Z show. >> Thank you. Delighted to be here. >> Thank you. Delighted to be here. >> Thank you. Delighted to be here. >> I want to talk about what's happened >> I want to talk about what's happened >> I want to talk about what's happened over the last 5 years. like since you over the last 5 years. like since you over the last 5 years. like since you launched your podcast, there's been an launched your podcast, there's been an launched your podcast, there's been an extreme increase in consumer interest extreme increase in consumer interest extreme increase in consumer interest and focus on their own health. Like as and focus on their own health. Like as and focus on their own health. Like as an investor, we used to kind of think an investor, we used to kind of think an investor, we used to kind of think people were only willing to spend on people were only willing to spend on people were only willing to spend on what we'd like call sex or vanity drugs what we'd like call sex or vanity drugs what we'd like call sex or vanity drugs like Propecia, Viagra, and that has like Propecia, Viagra, and that has like Propecia, Viagra, and that has totally changed in the last 5 years, and totally changed in the last 5 years, and totally changed in the last 5 years, and people are really interested in their people are really interested in their people are really interested in their health. I'm curious what you think the health. I'm curious what you think the health. I'm curious what you think the major drivers of that have been and what major drivers of that have been and what major drivers of that have been and what your role has been in it. your role has been in it. your role has been in it. >> So I think the major driver was there >> So I think the major driver was there >> So I think the major driver was there were a few breakthrough supplements were a few breakthrough supplements were a few breakthrough supplements that changed the way that people think that changed the way that people think that changed the way that people think about healthcare and decided they needed about healthcare and decided they needed about healthcare and decided they needed to be more self-directed in their to be more self-directed in their to be more self-directed in their healthcare. Return to that in a second. healthcare. Return to that in a second. healthcare. Return to that in a second. I think the other thing is that the the I think the other thing is that the the I think the other thing is that the the health and fitness and industry collided health and fitness and industry collided health and fitness and industry collided with mainstream medicine and just with mainstream medicine and just with mainstream medicine and just self-care in the following way. Um when self-care in the following way. Um when self-care in the following way. Um when I was growing up, the only people that I was growing up, the only people that I was growing up, the only people that lifted weights were bodybuilders, lifted weights were bodybuilders, lifted weights were bodybuilders, football players, and um people going football players, and um people going football players, and um people going off to the military. I was told if you off to the military. I was told if you off to the military. I was told if you lift weights, the muscle will turn to lift weights, the muscle will turn to lift weights, the muscle will turn to fat if you stop. That everyone in gyms fat if you stop. That everyone in gyms fat if you stop. That everyone in gyms is on steroids. I think what happened is is on steroids. I think what happened is is on steroids. I think what happened is slowly through the 80s, through the 90s, slowly through the 80s, through the 90s, slowly through the 80s, through the 90s, and then the early 2000s, the world and then the early 2000s, the world and then the early 2000s, the world started accepting, oh, there there are started accepting, oh, there there are started accepting, oh, there there are modes of fitness that allow me to eat modes of fitness that allow me to eat modes of fitness that allow me to eat healthily and and take care of myself. healthily and and take care of myself. healthily and and take care of myself. And yes, there's some extremes there, And yes, there's some extremes there, And yes, there's some extremes there, but there was that it was actually quite but there was that it was actually quite but there was that it was actually quite compatible with a with a normal healthy compatible with a with a normal healthy compatible with a with a normal healthy life. So, what happened during the life. So, what happened during the life. So, what happened during the pandemic was everyone wanted to know, pandemic was everyone wanted to know, pandemic was everyone wanted to know, this was before and after the vaccines, this was before and after the vaccines, this was before and after the vaccines, wanted to know what they could take to wanted to know what they could take to wanted to know what they could take to improve their immune system and their improve their immune system and their improve their immune system and their health. And the first thing that sort of health. And the first thing that sort of health. And the first thing that sort of broke through was vitamin D. broke through was vitamin D. broke through was vitamin D. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Maybe because it can be increased by >> Maybe because it can be increased by >> Maybe because it can be increased by sunlight and everyone gets some exposure sunlight and everyone gets some exposure sunlight and everyone gets some exposure to sunlight. Doctors weren't saying to sunlight. Doctors weren't saying to sunlight. Doctors weren't saying don't take it. The studies on it were don't take it. The studies on it were don't take it. The studies on it were kind of mixed, but they were like, okay, kind of mixed, but they were like, okay, kind of mixed, but they were like, okay, you know, take everyone start having you know, take everyone start having you know, take everyone start having some vitamin D around. some vitamin D around. some vitamin D around. Then, you know, the melatonin craze had Then, you know, the melatonin craze had Then, you know, the melatonin craze had already kind of come and gone. Um, but already kind of come and gone. Um, but already kind of come and gone. Um, but that that's a hormone. And then as time that that's a hormone. And then as time that that's a hormone. And then as time went on and people started getting more went on and people started getting more went on and people started getting more interested in physical fitness, not just interested in physical fitness, not just interested in physical fitness, not just jogging or doing cardio, but as jogging or doing cardio, but as jogging or doing cardio, but as resistance training came in, resistance training came in, resistance training came in, >> it inevitably brought with it an >> it inevitably brought with it an >> it inevitably brought with it an interest in protein needs. So, are you interest in protein needs. So, are you interest in protein needs. So, are you going to take supplements that increase going to take supplements that increase going to take supplements that increase your daily protein? You know, we could your daily protein? You know, we could your daily protein? You know, we could argue about whether or not you need more argue about whether or not you need more argue about whether or not you need more or less protein. I don't necessarily or less protein. I don't necessarily or less protein. I don't necessarily think everyone needs one gram per pound think everyone needs one gram per pound think everyone needs one gram per pound of body weight. Some people feel kind of of body weight. Some people feel kind of of body weight. Some people feel kind of poisoned, like overwhelmed when they eat poisoned, like overwhelmed when they eat poisoned, like overwhelmed when they eat that much. I think you have to sense for that much. I think you have to sense for that much. I think you have to sense for yourself what you want and what you yourself what you want and what you yourself what you want and what you need. >> If I'm going to work out then, you know, >> If I'm going to work out then, you know, uh caffeine before that seems to help. uh caffeine before that seems to help. uh caffeine before that seems to help. And then gradually now the creatine And then gradually now the creatine And then gradually now the creatine craze, it's funny. Creatine was craze, it's funny. Creatine was craze, it's funny. Creatine was something that was popular in gyms and something that was popular in gyms and something that was popular in gyms and it when I was like 16 years old, 17 it when I was like 16 years old, 17 it when I was like 16 years old, 17 years old and then oh there all these years old and then oh there all these years old and then oh there all these cognitive benefits, etc. So it came in cognitive benefits, etc. So it came in cognitive benefits, etc. So it came in with the fitness. with the fitness. with the fitness. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Vitamin D came in with COVID. Um and >> Vitamin D came in with COVID. Um and >> Vitamin D came in with COVID. Um and then then then with COVID pe people were very with COVID pe people were very with COVID pe people were very actively debating whether or not you actively debating whether or not you actively debating whether or not you could trust the government to give you could trust the government to give you could trust the government to give you what you needed to make you healthy. And what you needed to make you healthy. And what you needed to make you healthy. And I think whether you were provaccine, I think whether you were provaccine, I think whether you were provaccine, vaccine skeptical, or antivax, what vaccine skeptical, or antivax, what vaccine skeptical, or antivax, what became very clear is everyone realized became very clear is everyone realized became very clear is everyone realized some bell went off. some bell went off. some bell went off. We are all responsible for our own We are all responsible for our own We are all responsible for our own health. health. health. >> Totally. I think co reminded people of >> Totally. I think co reminded people of >> Totally. I think co reminded people of their own mortality their own mortality their own mortality >> and they realized just because like they >> and they realized just because like they >> and they realized just because like they go to a doctor for an annual physical go to a doctor for an annual physical go to a doctor for an annual physical does not mean they're healthy or does not mean they're healthy or does not mean they're healthy or protected or safe. protected or safe. protected or safe. >> A lot of the mental health issues that >> A lot of the mental health issues that >> A lot of the mental health issues that we saw during the lockdowns were we saw during the lockdowns were we saw during the lockdowns were disruption in circadian biology. I know disruption in circadian biology. I know disruption in circadian biology. I know people were indoors more. There was more people were indoors more. There was more people were indoors more. There was more drinking. There was a bunch of other drinking. There was a bunch of other drinking. There was a bunch of other issues. But I'll just say there's a issues. But I'll just say there's a issues. But I'll just say there's a really beautiful study with more more really beautiful study with more more really beautiful study with more more than 80,000 subjects out of the UK that than 80,000 subjects out of the UK that than 80,000 subjects out of the UK that shows and this is a recent study that shows and this is a recent study that shows and this is a recent study that shows that the brighter people's days shows that the brighter people's days shows that the brighter people's days are and the darker their nights, the are and the darker their nights, the are and the darker their nights, the healthier they are mentally. And this is healthier they are mentally. And this is healthier they are mentally. And this is especially true for people with OCD, especially true for people with OCD, especially true for people with OCD, anxiety, u mania, schizophrenia, major anxiety, u mania, schizophrenia, major anxiety, u mania, schizophrenia, major depression. I mean basically every depression. I mean basically every depression. I mean basically every psychiatric challenge is made worse by psychiatric challenge is made worse by psychiatric challenge is made worse by dim days and bright nights. And so what dim days and bright nights. And so what dim days and bright nights. And so what we saw during co we saw during co we saw during co was people were just drifting in a was people were just drifting in a was people were just drifting in a circadian circadian circadian sense. It it was as if we had put people sense. It it was as if we had put people sense. It it was as if we had put people into a cave and done the cave experiment into a cave and done the cave experiment into a cave and done the cave experiment and then there was co right and then and then there was co right and then and then there was co right and then there's all the vaccine stuff which you there's all the vaccine stuff which you there's all the vaccine stuff which you know frankly isn't my domain but it it know frankly isn't my domain but it it know frankly isn't my domain but it it was so important to me to give people was so important to me to give people was so important to me to give people tools to be able to control their tools to be able to control their tools to be able to control their circadian biology circadian biology circadian biology um momentary anxiety with things like um momentary anxiety with things like um momentary anxiety with things like long exhale breathing which just simply long exhale breathing which just simply long exhale breathing which just simply uh reduces heart rate. We know through uh reduces heart rate. We know through uh reduces heart rate. We know through something called respiratory sinus something called respiratory sinus something called respiratory sinus arrhythmia involves the vagus nerve. You arrhythmia involves the vagus nerve. You arrhythmia involves the vagus nerve. You know the vagus is is sending a bunch of know the vagus is is sending a bunch of know the vagus is is sending a bunch of sensory information about the body to sensory information about the body to sensory information about the body to the brain. But then a percentage of the the brain. But then a percentage of the the brain. But then a percentage of the vagus is descending its motor. It vagus is descending its motor. It vagus is descending its motor. It controls the heart rate. So when you controls the heart rate. So when you controls the heart rate. So when you exhale exhale exhale deliberately you slow your heart rate deliberately you slow your heart rate deliberately you slow your heart rate down. So this is the you don't need to down. So this is the you don't need to down. So this is the you don't need to do breath work. You just if you want to do breath work. You just if you want to do breath work. You just if you want to calm down you you do a long exhale. And calm down you you do a long exhale. And calm down you you do a long exhale. And so these little simple things for which so these little simple things for which so these little simple things for which there's mechanistic science to support there's mechanistic science to support there's mechanistic science to support them. that was really what we started them. that was really what we started them. that was really what we started putting out into the world. So I think putting out into the world. So I think putting out into the world. So I think that's what happened and then you know that's what happened and then you know that's what happened and then you know there we were you know in my I was there we were you know in my I was there we were you know in my I was literally in a closet with my bulldog literally in a closet with my bulldog literally in a closet with my bulldog and my producer and a microphone and and my producer and a microphone and and my producer and a microphone and just like talking out to the world and just like talking out to the world and just like talking out to the world and things just so people became really things just so people became really things just so people became really strong advocates for themselves. They're strong advocates for themselves. They're strong advocates for themselves. They're like oh I need to go figure out how like oh I need to go figure out how like oh I need to go figure out how how to take care of myself. how to take care of myself. how to take care of myself. >> What do you make of kind of Maha's role >> What do you make of kind of Maha's role >> What do you make of kind of Maha's role in this broader health awakening? What in this broader health awakening? What in this broader health awakening? What do you think the effects will be do you think the effects will be do you think the effects will be >> on our health? >> on our health? >> on our health? >> Well, I very deliberately >> Well, I very deliberately >> Well, I very deliberately not joined a maja panel to maintain the not joined a maja panel to maintain the not joined a maja panel to maintain the flexibility that I want to say what I flexibility that I want to say what I flexibility that I want to say what I believe. Um, a good example would be believe. Um, a good example would be believe. Um, a good example would be I think that some of the things they're I think that some of the things they're I think that some of the things they're doing are directionally right trying to doing are directionally right trying to doing are directionally right trying to food supply um get people embracing food supply um get people embracing food supply um get people embracing healthy behaviors or the these are very healthy behaviors or the these are very healthy behaviors or the these are very much like hub huberman lab things right much like hub huberman lab things right much like hub huberman lab things right >> at the same time I for instance think >> at the same time I for instance think >> at the same time I for instance think that the mRNA vaccines for cancer are a that the mRNA vaccines for cancer are a that the mRNA vaccines for cancer are a transformative transformative transformative incredible able life-saving technology incredible able life-saving technology incredible able life-saving technology >> and a lot of funding has been cut. >> and a lot of funding has been cut. >> and a lot of funding has been cut. >> Yeah, I think that well it's >> Yeah, I think that well it's >> Yeah, I think that well it's interesting. So um the the funding for interesting. So um the the funding for interesting. So um the the funding for um mRNA vaccines for respiratory um mRNA vaccines for respiratory um mRNA vaccines for respiratory illnesses has been cut. I was told and I illnesses has been cut. I was told and I illnesses has been cut. I was told and I don't know if this is true that the don't know if this is true that the don't know if this is true that the funding for mRNA vaccines for cancers funding for mRNA vaccines for cancers funding for mRNA vaccines for cancers was not cut but there was some very was not cut but there was some very was not cut but there was some very tricky messaging around that at that tricky messaging around that at that tricky messaging around that at that time. So much so that you know because time. So much so that you know because time. So much so that you know because I'd gone on Bill Maher and I said it's I'd gone on Bill Maher and I said it's I'd gone on Bill Maher and I said it's foolish to cut this funding for the the foolish to cut this funding for the the foolish to cut this funding for the the cancer research but um I got a call from cancer research but um I got a call from cancer research but um I got a call from Washington and said we didn't cut the Washington and said we didn't cut the Washington and said we didn't cut the the money for that we cut the money for the money for that we cut the money for the money for that we cut the money for the other thing and I said okay so it's the other thing and I said okay so it's the other thing and I said okay so it's like it's but the messaging has been like it's but the messaging has been like it's but the messaging has been deliberately broad on both sides. deliberately broad on both sides. deliberately broad on both sides. >> So um >> So um >> So um >> the challenge has been that because we >> the challenge has been that because we >> the challenge has been that because we now let's just call it duck a duck. now let's just call it duck a duck. now let's just call it duck a duck. We've got right-wing media and we've got We've got right-wing media and we've got We've got right-wing media and we've got leftwing media and then we've got a few leftwing media and then we've got a few leftwing media and then we've got a few people in the middle like Bill Maher who people in the middle like Bill Maher who people in the middle like Bill Maher who are kind of like you know just calling are kind of like you know just calling are kind of like you know just calling shots. shots. shots. >> I you went on Bill Maher. It was a >> I you went on Bill Maher. It was a >> I you went on Bill Maher. It was a really good episode. really good episode. really good episode. >> Yeah. So thank you. Um but for the most >> Yeah. So thank you. Um but for the most >> Yeah. So thank you. Um but for the most part that the way that clicks and ad part that the way that clicks and ad part that the way that clicks and ad revenue etc is is working for these news revenue etc is is working for these news revenue etc is is working for these news outlets is is outlets is is outlets is is don't say anything positive about the don't say anything positive about the don't say anything positive about the other side other side other side >> even if there's something that they're >> even if there's something that they're >> even if there's something that they're do that's favorable and really paint do that's favorable and really paint do that's favorable and really paint with a broad brush. And both sides are with a broad brush. And both sides are with a broad brush. And both sides are really guilty of that. The left has been really guilty of that. The left has been really guilty of that. The left has been um not supportive of the the moves that um not supportive of the the moves that um not supportive of the the moves that I think are directionally correct which I think are directionally correct which I think are directionally correct which are improving the food supply, getting are improving the food supply, getting are improving the food supply, getting people more active, etc. because their people more active, etc. because their people more active, etc. because their criticism is um that's rearranging deck criticism is um that's rearranging deck criticism is um that's rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. That's their chairs on the Titanic. That's their chairs on the Titanic. That's their their criticism. My stance is their criticism. My stance is their criticism. My stance is anything that gets people moving in the anything that gets people moving in the anything that gets people moving in the direction of their own health. direction of their own health. direction of their own health. uh doing things that are proactive for uh doing things that are proactive for uh doing things that are proactive for their own health, circadian health, their own health, circadian health, their own health, circadian health, reducing anxiety, improving sleep, reducing anxiety, improving sleep, reducing anxiety, improving sleep, eating cleaner food, more movement is eating cleaner food, more movement is eating cleaner food, more movement is fantastic. Is it the only thing I'd like fantastic. Is it the only thing I'd like fantastic. Is it the only thing I'd like to see done? No. Um but it certainly is to see done? No. Um but it certainly is to see done? No. Um but it certainly is important. And so I'll be supportive of important. And so I'll be supportive of important. And so I'll be supportive of the things I think are are good and I'm the things I think are are good and I'm the things I think are are good and I'm going to criticize the the things that I going to criticize the the things that I going to criticize the the things that I I think are are not good. And I'm just I think are are not good. And I'm just I think are are not good. And I'm just going to continue to do that. It means I going to continue to do that. It means I going to continue to do that. It means I have fewer friends and more enemies. I'm have fewer friends and more enemies. I'm have fewer friends and more enemies. I'm kind of used to that by now. um kind of used to that by now. um kind of used to that by now. um >> your personality on the internet. >> your personality on the internet. >> your personality on the internet. >> I often get get referred to as a as a >> I often get get referred to as a as a >> I often get get referred to as a as a influencer or a health podcaster. They influencer or a health podcaster. They influencer or a health podcaster. They seem to have forgotten the the my seem to have forgotten the the my seem to have forgotten the the my science training. But I but I get it. I science training. But I but I get it. I science training. But I but I get it. I understand why I now after 5 years I understand why I now after 5 years I understand why I now after 5 years I really understand really understand really understand how media works. how media works. how media works. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> In part because podcast channels have >> In part because podcast channels have >> In part because podcast channels have become bigger than a lot of the at least become bigger than a lot of the at least become bigger than a lot of the at least in the health domain than the more in the health domain than the more in the health domain than the more traditional uh houses. So, I think um traditional uh houses. So, I think um traditional uh houses. So, I think um I've been called a Maha podcaster. I I've been called a Maha podcaster. I I've been called a Maha podcaster. I don't know how they got to that because don't know how they got to that because don't know how they got to that because I I don't ever recall. Uh I I don't ever recall. Uh I I don't ever recall. Uh >> you also predate Maha. >> you also predate Maha. >> you also predate Maha. >> Yeah. Yeah, they took it from me. No, >> Yeah. Yeah, they took it from me. No, >> Yeah. Yeah, they took it from me. No, I'm kidding. The uh the [laughter] um I'm kidding. The uh the [laughter] um I'm kidding. The uh the [laughter] um Yeah, thank you. Um the Yeah, thank you. Um the Yeah, thank you. Um the I did make a comment about the food I did make a comment about the food I did make a comment about the food guidelines. I said that I thought it was guidelines. I said that I thought it was guidelines. I said that I thought it was directionally right, but that I would directionally right, but that I would directionally right, but that I would have liked to see more uh vegetables and have liked to see more uh vegetables and have liked to see more uh vegetables and fiber, some, you know, low sugar fiber, some, you know, low sugar fiber, some, you know, low sugar fermented foods. And it's so interesting fermented foods. And it's so interesting fermented foods. And it's so interesting to see how that would get attacked. If I to see how that would get attacked. If I to see how that would get attacked. If I see something like that that I said see something like that that I said see something like that that I said getting attacked, then I think, wow, getting attacked, then I think, wow, getting attacked, then I think, wow, like they must be so poorly paid or just like they must be so poorly paid or just like they must be so poorly paid or just so desperate to write something for so desperate to write something for so desperate to write something for whatever 500 bucks or a,000 bucks to whatever 500 bucks or a,000 bucks to whatever 500 bucks or a,000 bucks to make rent that like that to spend that make rent that like that to spend that make rent that like that to spend that to spend time on that. I I do think that to spend time on that. I I do think that to spend time on that. I I do think that there's been a real um just like a a there's been a real um just like a a there's been a real um just like a a real drop in standards of what we real drop in standards of what we real drop in standards of what we consider news. consider news. consider news. and and that makes me sad, frankly. It's and and that makes me sad, frankly. It's and and that makes me sad, frankly. It's kind of it saddens me because it kind of it saddens me because it kind of it saddens me because it cheapens the entire health space. And cheapens the entire health space. And cheapens the entire health space. And so, it's very easy to point at how, you so, it's very easy to point at how, you so, it's very easy to point at how, you know, health influencers and biohackers know, health influencers and biohackers know, health influencers and biohackers have have contaminated the space. But I have have contaminated the space. But I have have contaminated the space. But I think I actually think that traditional think I actually think that traditional think I actually think that traditional media is is more to blame because are we media is is more to blame because are we media is is more to blame because are we really arguing about whether or not the really arguing about whether or not the really arguing about whether or not the food guidelines are are perfect? They food guidelines are are perfect? They food guidelines are are perfect? They they were cast as, oh, you know, now they were cast as, oh, you know, now they were cast as, oh, you know, now they're promoting a lot of meat. they're promoting a lot of meat. they're promoting a lot of meat. >> No, that's not what it was. If you >> No, that's not what it was. If you >> No, that's not what it was. If you looked, you act if you actually read it, looked, you act if you actually read it, looked, you act if you actually read it, the servings of grains and fruits and the servings of grains and fruits and the servings of grains and fruits and vegetables were at least as high as what vegetables were at least as high as what vegetables were at least as high as what they were recommending for meat. So, they were recommending for meat. So, they were recommending for meat. So, it's it's just silly. It's just silly. it's it's just silly. It's just silly. it's it's just silly. It's just silly. It's it's like red shirts. It's like red It's it's like red shirts. It's like red It's it's like red shirts. It's like red shirts, blue shirts kind of um like shirts, blue shirts kind of um like shirts, blue shirts kind of um like playground. playground. playground. >> Totally. Partisanship plays and it gets >> Totally. Partisanship plays and it gets >> Totally. Partisanship plays and it gets clicked. clicked. clicked. >> Yeah. So, I'm I'm enjoying now. I'm in >> Yeah. So, I'm I'm enjoying now. I'm in >> Yeah. So, I'm I'm enjoying now. I'm in this place where I love that I don't this place where I love that I don't this place where I love that I don't belong to any camp. belong to any camp. belong to any camp. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um I feel very free. Um, I've been asked >> Um I feel very free. Um, I've been asked >> Um I feel very free. Um, I've been asked to write op-eds for the New York Times, to write op-eds for the New York Times, to write op-eds for the New York Times, um, about the mRNA vaccine thing, and I um, about the mRNA vaccine thing, and I um, about the mRNA vaccine thing, and I said, "Listen, I'd be happy to do it, said, "Listen, I'd be happy to do it, said, "Listen, I'd be happy to do it, except they didn't. I was told, I don't except they didn't. I was told, I don't except they didn't. I was told, I don't know if it's true, but I was told that know if it's true, but I was told that know if it's true, but I was told that they didn't cut the funding for cancer." they didn't cut the funding for cancer." they didn't cut the funding for cancer." So, that makes it a tough oped to write. So, that makes it a tough oped to write. So, that makes it a tough oped to write. At the same time, I I've been asked to At the same time, I I've been asked to At the same time, I I've been asked to give my input to folks at Maha and give my input to folks at Maha and give my input to folks at Maha and certainly NIH. I've worked very hard certainly NIH. I've worked very hard certainly NIH. I've worked very hard behind the scenes to try and ensure that behind the scenes to try and ensure that behind the scenes to try and ensure that funding for SC for basic research is not funding for SC for basic research is not funding for SC for basic research is not cut. And it looks like, I'm not going to cut. And it looks like, I'm not going to cut. And it looks like, I'm not going to take credit for this at all, but looks take credit for this at all, but looks take credit for this at all, but looks like there might be a 2% increase. like there might be a 2% increase. like there might be a 2% increase. There's bipartisan support to maintain There's bipartisan support to maintain There's bipartisan support to maintain funding for NIH um research, basic funding for NIH um research, basic funding for NIH um research, basic research. So, you know, I you can't put research. So, you know, I you can't put research. So, you know, I you can't put me in a camp. Y me in a camp. Y me in a camp. Y >> and I'm happy about that. >> and I'm happy about that. >> and I'm happy about that. >> Let's talk about peptides. Yeah. >> Let's talk about peptides. Yeah. >> Let's talk about peptides. Yeah. >> Um nearly one in seven Americans is >> Um nearly one in seven Americans is >> Um nearly one in seven Americans is taking a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried taking a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried taking a GLP-1 drug. 20% have tried them. These numbers continue to rise. them. These numbers continue to rise. them. These numbers continue to rise. You've talked about um retride um a GLP You've talked about um retride um a GLP You've talked about um retride um a GLP and Lily's pipeline. What do you think and Lily's pipeline. What do you think and Lily's pipeline. What do you think the future looks like as it regards to the future looks like as it regards to the future looks like as it regards to kind of GLPs? And then let's talk about kind of GLPs? And then let's talk about kind of GLPs? And then let's talk about other peptides after that. other peptides after that. other peptides after that. >> Yeah. Um I'm hoping this analogy works. >> Yeah. Um I'm hoping this analogy works. >> Yeah. Um I'm hoping this analogy works. You know, when I was growing up, if you You know, when I was growing up, if you You know, when I was growing up, if you could afford a nice car, you had a nice could afford a nice car, you had a nice could afford a nice car, you had a nice car. Otherwise, there were a lot of kind car. Otherwise, there were a lot of kind car. Otherwise, there were a lot of kind of junky cars on the road. of junky cars on the road. of junky cars on the road. >> Um and then this thing called credit >> Um and then this thing called credit >> Um and then this thing called credit came along where everyone could have a came along where everyone could have a came along where everyone could have a nice car or lease a nice car. So, you nice car or lease a nice car. So, you nice car or lease a nice car. So, you don't really see that like rundown cars don't really see that like rundown cars don't really see that like rundown cars in a, you know, you do some places, but in a, you know, you do some places, but in a, you know, you do some places, but you really don't. Um, you really don't. Um, you really don't. Um, I I see the GLPs the same way. It used I I see the GLPs the same way. It used I I see the GLPs the same way. It used to be that being really fit at a certain to be that being really fit at a certain to be that being really fit at a certain age um reflected the fact you do a lot age um reflected the fact you do a lot age um reflected the fact you do a lot of exercise and I think that the GLPs of exercise and I think that the GLPs of exercise and I think that the GLPs make it such that people can um be a make it such that people can um be a make it such that people can um be a healthy weight without having to healthy weight without having to healthy weight without having to exercise. We know however that people exercise. We know however that people exercise. We know however that people should resistance train in particular to should resistance train in particular to should resistance train in particular to offset the muscle loss. But Red at True offset the muscle loss. But Red at True offset the muscle loss. But Red at True Tide went through phase three at Lily Tide went through phase three at Lily Tide went through phase three at Lily people can lose up to a third of their people can lose up to a third of their people can lose up to a third of their body weight in a pretty short amount of body weight in a pretty short amount of body weight in a pretty short amount of time with some degree of muscle sparing. time with some degree of muscle sparing. time with some degree of muscle sparing. So this is also called GLP3. It also So this is also called GLP3. It also So this is also called GLP3. It also seems to bypass some of the side effects seems to bypass some of the side effects seems to bypass some of the side effects that some of the previous GLPs um that some of the previous GLPs um that some of the previous GLPs um created. Although no drug is perfect, of created. Although no drug is perfect, of created. Although no drug is perfect, of course. But the real reason is course. But the real reason is course. But the real reason is interesting to me is that already people interesting to me is that already people interesting to me is that already people have realized that they can get much have realized that they can get much have realized that they can get much lower cost lower cost lower cost um and or take lower doses of GLP drugs um and or take lower doses of GLP drugs um and or take lower doses of GLP drugs by going through compoundingies. by going through compoundingies. by going through compoundingies. Lily is working very hard to make sure Lily is working very hard to make sure Lily is working very hard to make sure that compoundingies do not sell reddit that compoundingies do not sell reddit that compoundingies do not sell reddit tide. tide. tide. Compoundingarmacies and gray market Compoundingarmacies and gray market Compoundingarmacies and gray market sources already sell redu tide. Many sources already sell redu tide. Many sources already sell redu tide. Many people are already taking it. It's not people are already taking it. It's not people are already taking it. It's not legal, but it's not necessarily legal, but it's not necessarily legal, but it's not necessarily enforced. And I'm not necessarily uh enforced. And I'm not necessarily uh enforced. And I'm not necessarily uh suggesting people do, but I think it's suggesting people do, but I think it's suggesting people do, but I think it's going to change society where in theory going to change society where in theory going to change society where in theory you could eradicate obesity. in theory. you could eradicate obesity. in theory. you could eradicate obesity. in theory. Um, Um, Um, >> five years from now, what what percent >> five years from now, what what percent >> five years from now, what what percent of Americans do you think are on JLPs? of Americans do you think are on JLPs? of Americans do you think are on JLPs? >> Well, I like to think that there's still >> Well, I like to think that there's still >> Well, I like to think that there's still some people who because they've some people who because they've some people who because they've exercised good habits up until now don't exercised good habits up until now don't exercised good habits up until now don't need them. I I don't know why I like need them. I I don't know why I like need them. I I don't know why I like that, but I I suppose if you can get that, but I I suppose if you can get that, but I I suppose if you can get away without having to take a drug and away without having to take a drug and away without having to take a drug and get the same result, that's better. Um, get the same result, that's better. Um, get the same result, that's better. Um, I'm guessing that more than half, I'm guessing that more than half, I'm guessing that more than half, especially especially especially um, people who come from families or um, people who come from families or um, people who come from families or communities where there's a lot of communities where there's a lot of communities where there's a lot of obesity are are going to be taking them obesity are are going to be taking them obesity are are going to be taking them probably taking them at lower dosages probably taking them at lower dosages probably taking them at lower dosages than are prescribed. Um, and I I don't than are prescribed. Um, and I I don't than are prescribed. Um, and I I don't think that you can control the think that you can control the think that you can control the compoundingies in gray market mostly compoundingies in gray market mostly compoundingies in gray market mostly because, and I could be wrong here, so I because, and I could be wrong here, so I because, and I could be wrong here, so I want to be careful, but I'm not aware of want to be careful, but I'm not aware of want to be careful, but I'm not aware of of a major adverse event. You know, it's of a major adverse event. You know, it's of a major adverse event. You know, it's a little bit the same way that steroids a little bit the same way that steroids a little bit the same way that steroids were discussed in the 80s and 90s, but were discussed in the 80s and 90s, but were discussed in the 80s and 90s, but people were dying, going into rages. people were dying, going into rages. people were dying, going into rages. They were coming up with ALS, you know, They were coming up with ALS, you know, They were coming up with ALS, you know, they're having a lot of problems. I'm they're having a lot of problems. I'm they're having a lot of problems. I'm not aware of anyone dying from taking not aware of anyone dying from taking not aware of anyone dying from taking BPC57. BPC57. BPC57. So, there's a lot more room for So, there's a lot more room for So, there's a lot more room for experimentation. I'm not suggesting experimentation. I'm not suggesting experimentation. I'm not suggesting people do that, but the margins for people do that, but the margins for people do that, but the margins for error seem to be greater. error seem to be greater. error seem to be greater. >> Yeah. I mean, my understanding is it's >> Yeah. I mean, my understanding is it's >> Yeah. I mean, my understanding is it's not the like not the like not the like the compounded drugs are probably the compounded drugs are probably the compounded drugs are probably generally safe, but it's the fear of generally safe, but it's the fear of generally safe, but it's the fear of contamination or a menitis outbreak or contamination or a menitis outbreak or contamination or a menitis outbreak or whatever it's happened in the past um whatever it's happened in the past um whatever it's happened in the past um with compoundingies being just less with compoundingies being just less with compoundingies being just less regulated. Yeah. regulated. Yeah. regulated. Yeah. >> Than traditional drug manufacturing. >> Than traditional drug manufacturing. >> Than traditional drug manufacturing. >> Yeah. I think it's really interesting >> Yeah. I think it's really interesting >> Yeah. I think it's really interesting too because as I watch this space, this too because as I watch this space, this too because as I watch this space, this peptide space emerge, which has mainly peptide space emerge, which has mainly peptide space emerge, which has mainly been been around the GLPS, right? and been been around the GLPS, right? and been been around the GLPS, right? and BPC-157 body protection compound which BPC-157 body protection compound which BPC-157 body protection compound which may or may not accelerate healing in may or may not accelerate healing in may or may not accelerate healing in animal models. It's very clear that it animal models. It's very clear that it animal models. It's very clear that it can improve cartilage growth, nerve can improve cartilage growth, nerve can improve cartilage growth, nerve regrowth as well as uh vascular growth regrowth as well as uh vascular growth regrowth as well as uh vascular growth which is a little bit worrisome if you which is a little bit worrisome if you which is a little bit worrisome if you have a tumor. You don't want to have a tumor. You don't want to have a tumor. You don't want to vascularize the tumor. No one has the vascularize the tumor. No one has the vascularize the tumor. No one has the right control experiment in themselves right control experiment in themselves right control experiment in themselves because they'll say, "Oh, I injected my because they'll say, "Oh, I injected my because they'll say, "Oh, I injected my shoulder and it I healed so much more shoulder and it I healed so much more shoulder and it I healed so much more quickly, but it goes systemically." So, quickly, but it goes systemically." So, quickly, but it goes systemically." So, you can't like compare the two you can't like compare the two you can't like compare the two shoulders. And so, but no one wants to shoulders. And so, but no one wants to shoulders. And so, but no one wants to be in the control group and the people be in the control group and the people be in the control group and the people are just assuming it's BPC. They're are just assuming it's BPC. They're are just assuming it's BPC. They're taking it. I mean, I think we probably taking it. I mean, I think we probably taking it. I mean, I think we probably would have heard of an adverse event by would have heard of an adverse event by would have heard of an adverse event by now, but who knows, maybe some something now, but who knows, maybe some something now, but who knows, maybe some something will pop up. I think that um when it will pop up. I think that um when it will pop up. I think that um when it comes to the GLPS in particular, there comes to the GLPS in particular, there comes to the GLPS in particular, there was a lot of debate for a while. The was a lot of debate for a while. The was a lot of debate for a while. The exercise fitness community were saying, exercise fitness community were saying, exercise fitness community were saying, "Oh, you know, you don't want to take a "Oh, you know, you don't want to take a "Oh, you know, you don't want to take a drug. You just need to eat right and drug. You just need to eat right and drug. You just need to eat right and exercise." I disagree. I think that some exercise." I disagree. I think that some exercise." I disagree. I think that some people have accumulated so much atapost people have accumulated so much atapost people have accumulated so much atapost tissue that it's modified their tissue that it's modified their tissue that it's modified their metabolism and even perhaps even brain metabolism and even perhaps even brain metabolism and even perhaps even brain circuitry and appetite that it's really circuitry and appetite that it's really circuitry and appetite that it's really really helps them. Um and obviously really helps them. Um and obviously really helps them. Um and obviously behaviors and these drugs are going to behaviors and these drugs are going to behaviors and these drugs are going to be the best combination. Um or just the be the best combination. Um or just the be the best combination. Um or just the behaviors if you can get away with them. behaviors if you can get away with them. behaviors if you can get away with them. I've never taken a GLP so I can't talk I've never taken a GLP so I can't talk I've never taken a GLP so I can't talk about the experience of it. I have tried about the experience of it. I have tried about the experience of it. I have tried various peptides. I've tried BPC. I various peptides. I've tried BPC. I various peptides. I've tried BPC. I don't know if it helped me or not. I don't know if it helped me or not. I don't know if it helped me or not. I didn't have an injury. I didn't notice didn't have an injury. I didn't notice didn't have an injury. I didn't notice that I recovered anymore quickly uh from that I recovered anymore quickly uh from that I recovered anymore quickly uh from exercise. I've tried pinealin as a sleep exercise. I've tried pinealin as a sleep exercise. I've tried pinealin as a sleep uh peptide. It gave me 3 hours a night uh peptide. It gave me 3 hours a night uh peptide. It gave me 3 hours a night of REM sleep, which was pretty awesome. of REM sleep, which was pretty awesome. of REM sleep, which was pretty awesome. Um very little human data. So now I just Um very little human data. So now I just Um very little human data. So now I just >> Are you continuing that? >> Are you continuing that? >> Are you continuing that? >> No, I just take AGZ. And that's the >> No, I just take AGZ. And that's the >> No, I just take AGZ. And that's the truth. I truth. I truth. I >> So you want more data? I'm a little >> So you want more data? I'm a little >> So you want more data? I'm a little scared about taking something that in scared about taking something that in scared about taking something that in animal models has been shown to both animal models has been shown to both animal models has been shown to both improve the function of but maybe also improve the function of but maybe also improve the function of but maybe also the proliferation of pinealytes which the proliferation of pinealytes which the proliferation of pinealytes which produce melatonin or that they and other produce melatonin or that they and other produce melatonin or that they and other cells in the in the pineal. Um cells in the in the pineal. Um cells in the in the pineal. Um because anytime you're stimulating cell because anytime you're stimulating cell because anytime you're stimulating cell growth you could it could start going growth you could it could start going growth you could it could start going ary and then get a tumor or something ary and then get a tumor or something ary and then get a tumor or something like that. like that. like that. >> Maybe you can just kind of speak more >> Maybe you can just kind of speak more >> Maybe you can just kind of speak more broadly about the nongp peptide craze. broadly about the nongp peptide craze. broadly about the nongp peptide craze. There's been a lot of kind of black There's been a lot of kind of black There's been a lot of kind of black market activity around Chinese peptides. market activity around Chinese peptides. market activity around Chinese peptides. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> I love how that term has come about. >> I love how that term has come about. >> I love how that term has come about. >> There's look smacking like people are >> There's look smacking like people are >> There's look smacking like people are What is a peptide? What do you What is a peptide? What do you What is a peptide? What do you recommend? What should people avoid? recommend? What should people avoid? recommend? What should people avoid? >> Sure. Um short course, a peptide is is >> Sure. Um short course, a peptide is is >> Sure. Um short course, a peptide is is just a short chain of amino acids make just a short chain of amino acids make just a short chain of amino acids make up a protein. Insulin is a peptide. Um up a protein. Insulin is a peptide. Um up a protein. Insulin is a peptide. Um all the things we're talking about up all the things we're talking about up all the things we're talking about up until now are peptides. So the phrase until now are peptides. So the phrase until now are peptides. So the phrase peptides has been kind of co-opted. um peptides has been kind of co-opted. um peptides has been kind of co-opted. um to mean a certain sort of a click of to mean a certain sort of a click of to mean a certain sort of a click of peptides just like the word steroids in peptides just like the word steroids in peptides just like the word steroids in people's minds they think bodybuilders people's minds they think bodybuilders people's minds they think bodybuilders but you know a stero estrogen is a but you know a stero estrogen is a but you know a stero estrogen is a steroid hormone people are always steroid hormone people are always steroid hormone people are always shocked to hear that you know so if you shocked to hear that you know so if you shocked to hear that you know so if you take estrogen you're on steroids okay take estrogen you're on steroids okay take estrogen you're on steroids okay but we know what people are saying when but we know what people are saying when but we know what people are saying when they say on steroids so they're they say on steroids so they're they say on steroids so they're androgenic steroids they're estrogenic androgenic steroids they're estrogenic androgenic steroids they're estrogenic steroids there's corticosterone okay steroids there's corticosterone okay steroids there's corticosterone okay just in the same way there are peptides just in the same way there are peptides just in the same way there are peptides that are to reduce hunger and appetite that are to reduce hunger and appetite that are to reduce hunger and appetite the GL LPS. Uh, Reddit True Tide being the GL LPS. Uh, Reddit True Tide being the GL LPS. Uh, Reddit True Tide being the newest generation, one soon to be the newest generation, one soon to be the newest generation, one soon to be released through Lily, um, but already released through Lily, um, but already released through Lily, um, but already out on the market from gray market out on the market from gray market out on the market from gray market sources are these sources that are sold sources are these sources that are sold sources are these sources that are sold all over the internet that are American all over the internet that are American all over the internet that are American or Canadian or whatever. And they list or Canadian or whatever. And they list or Canadian or whatever. And they list them as uh for research purposes only, them as uh for research purposes only, them as uh for research purposes only, not for human use. But they're selling not for human use. But they're selling not for human use. But they're selling them knowing that people are taking them knowing that people are taking them knowing that people are taking them. I mean, who's doing research on them. I mean, who's doing research on them. I mean, who's doing research on these peptides at home, right? this is these peptides at home, right? this is these peptides at home, right? this is not your unless you're my lab down the not your unless you're my lab down the not your unless you're my lab down the road or someone else's lab like of road or someone else's lab like of road or someone else's lab like of course people are taking these um they course people are taking these um they course people are taking these um they tend to be the gray market sources for tend to be the gray market sources for tend to be the gray market sources for research purposes only not for human use research purposes only not for human use research purposes only not for human use tend to be 99% purity which means tend to be 99% purity which means tend to be 99% purity which means they've been cleaned of most things they've been cleaned of most things they've been cleaned of most things except I do worry a bit about repeated except I do worry a bit about repeated except I do worry a bit about repeated injection of a substance that contains injection of a substance that contains injection of a substance that contains 1% say lip polysaccharide which can 1% say lip polysaccharide which can 1% say lip polysaccharide which can cause inflammation so maybe not in one cause inflammation so maybe not in one cause inflammation so maybe not in one injection but maybe repeatedly over time injection but maybe repeatedly over time injection but maybe repeatedly over time as well as other contaminants as well as other contaminants as well as other contaminants black market sources and when you hear black market sources and when you hear black market sources and when you hear Chinese peptides are companies online we Chinese peptides are companies online we Chinese peptides are companies online we don't know that it's all coming from don't know that it's all coming from don't know that it's all coming from China by the way they sort of get get China by the way they sort of get get China by the way they sort of get get hit the hardest in this but people refer hit the hardest in this but people refer hit the hardest in this but people refer to Chinese and black market peptides as to Chinese and black market peptides as to Chinese and black market peptides as people are going online buying reatride people are going online buying reatride people are going online buying reatride and you have no idea if it's reatride in and you have no idea if it's reatride in and you have no idea if it's reatride in contrast to the gray market sources contrast to the gray market sources contrast to the gray market sources where they might not be the cleanest but where they might not be the cleanest but where they might not be the cleanest but you know we they give you a data sheet you know we they give you a data sheet you know we they give you a data sheet that says this was tested And if it says that says this was tested And if it says that says this was tested And if it says reatrite, if it says BPC57, that's reatrite, if it says BPC57, that's reatrite, if it says BPC57, that's what's actually in the vial and only what's actually in the vial and only what's actually in the vial and only that. Okay, so that's an important that. Okay, so that's an important that. Okay, so that's an important distinction. Compounding pharmacies have distinction. Compounding pharmacies have distinction. Compounding pharmacies have been compounding all sorts of things, been compounding all sorts of things, been compounding all sorts of things, selling drugs more cheaply than um drug selling drugs more cheaply than um drug selling drugs more cheaply than um drug companies. Um they are controversial for companies. Um they are controversial for companies. Um they are controversial for that reason. We could talk about that. that reason. We could talk about that. that reason. We could talk about that. But other peptides that are interesting, But other peptides that are interesting, But other peptides that are interesting, excuse me, [clears throat] BBC57 for tissue repair, reducing BBC57 for tissue repair, reducing inflammation seems to have very very inflammation seems to have very very inflammation seems to have very very high LD50. No one's really discovered high LD50. No one's really discovered high LD50. No one's really discovered it. And people have been injecting it. And people have been injecting it. And people have been injecting enormously high um amounts of this. I've enormously high um amounts of this. I've enormously high um amounts of this. I've not heard of an adverse event. I don't not heard of an adverse event. I don't not heard of an adverse event. I don't recommend doing that, however, because recommend doing that, however, because recommend doing that, however, because you don't want to vascularize a little you don't want to vascularize a little you don't want to vascularize a little tumor you might have on your liver or in tumor you might have on your liver or in tumor you might have on your liver or in your brain. Mhm. your brain. Mhm. your brain. Mhm. >> Um but maybe for short-term use to treat >> Um but maybe for short-term use to treat >> Um but maybe for short-term use to treat an injury if that's within your margins an injury if that's within your margins an injury if that's within your margins of risk, of risk, of risk, you know, I mean that's up to you. Um you know, I mean that's up to you. Um you know, I mean that's up to you. Um ideally you'd get it from a compounding ideally you'd get it from a compounding ideally you'd get it from a compounding pharmacy if you can or from one of these pharmacy if you can or from one of these pharmacy if you can or from one of these gray market uh sources before you would gray market uh sources before you would gray market uh sources before you would go to a black market source. Injectable go to a black market source. Injectable go to a black market source. Injectable injecting locally seems to be better injecting locally seems to be better injecting locally seems to be better than taking it systemically. than taking it systemically. than taking it systemically. taking the oral forms. It's unclear how taking the oral forms. It's unclear how taking the oral forms. It's unclear how much of that BPC57 much of that BPC57 much of that BPC57 gets into your bodily tissues. Pinealin gets into your bodily tissues. Pinealin gets into your bodily tissues. Pinealin as I mentioned for for sleep is become as I mentioned for for sleep is become as I mentioned for for sleep is become very popular. There's a whole category very popular. There's a whole category very popular. There's a whole category of what are called growth hormone of what are called growth hormone of what are called growth hormone secrets which are very popular. Uh secrets which are very popular. Uh secrets which are very popular. Uh tesamellin, epimellin, curelin, mk677. tesamellin, epimellin, curelin, mk677. tesamellin, epimellin, curelin, mk677. These all stimulate the pituitary to These all stimulate the pituitary to These all stimulate the pituitary to release growth hormone but they release growth hormone but they release growth hormone but they themselves are not growth hormone. themselves are not growth hormone. themselves are not growth hormone. They will increase the amount of deep They will increase the amount of deep They will increase the amount of deep sleep that you get at night. Typically, sleep that you get at night. Typically, sleep that you get at night. Typically, you'll take these 30 minutes before you'll take these 30 minutes before you'll take these 30 minutes before sleep, ideally not having eaten anything sleep, ideally not having eaten anything sleep, ideally not having eaten anything in the previous few hours, in the previous few hours, in the previous few hours, will increase growth hormone and IGF-1. will increase growth hormone and IGF-1. will increase growth hormone and IGF-1. Some of those things I just mentioned Some of those things I just mentioned Some of those things I just mentioned are FDA approved. So, serellin for are FDA approved. So, serellin for are FDA approved. So, serellin for instance, I I forget the exact instance, I I forget the exact instance, I I forget the exact indication, but um to increase height indication, but um to increase height indication, but um to increase height for instance, or uh tissue repair after for instance, or uh tissue repair after for instance, or uh tissue repair after um after surgery, some you know, um after surgery, some you know, um after surgery, some you know, increasing growth hormone can be increasing growth hormone can be increasing growth hormone can be beneficial. Some people will just take beneficial. Some people will just take beneficial. Some people will just take growth hormone but growth hormone is growth hormone but growth hormone is growth hormone but growth hormone is very expensive. So sematotrope omnitrope very expensive. So sematotrope omnitrope very expensive. So sematotrope omnitrope um so that's what these peptides are um so that's what these peptides are um so that's what these peptides are very commonly used those have been very commonly used those have been very commonly used those have been researched so assuming the sourcing is researched so assuming the sourcing is researched so assuming the sourcing is clean we have a lot of human data on the clean we have a lot of human data on the clean we have a lot of human data on the ones I just described as opposed to ones I just described as opposed to ones I just described as opposed to pinealin and bpc7 where you have pinealin and bpc7 where you have pinealin and bpc7 where you have basically no human data. So there are basically no human data. So there are basically no human data. So there are human data on things like melanotan human data on things like melanotan human data on things like melanotan which makes people tan from the inside which makes people tan from the inside which makes people tan from the inside raises energy and libido dramatically raises energy and libido dramatically raises energy and libido dramatically fat loss dramatically. fat loss dramatically. fat loss dramatically. >> Did we put that in the looks maxing >> Did we put that in the looks maxing >> Did we put that in the looks maxing category? category? category? >> I don't know I or energy maxing or >> I don't know I or energy maxing or >> I don't know I or energy maxing or something. Yeah it's kind of something. Yeah it's kind of something. Yeah it's kind of interesting. I mean I mean um there interesting. I mean I mean um there interesting. I mean I mean um there there's a lot about so melanitan there's a lot about so melanitan there's a lot about so melanitan um and some similar peptides have been um and some similar peptides have been um and some similar peptides have been have been FDA approved for um have been FDA approved for um have been FDA approved for um hyposexuality in women. I think the vile hyposexuality in women. I think the vile hyposexuality in women. I think the vile is the drug for women. Men take it too. is the drug for women. Men take it too. is the drug for women. Men take it too. I have to say those drugs melanitan is I have to say those drugs melanitan is I have to say those drugs melanitan is very risky. Some of the the skin color very risky. Some of the the skin color very risky. Some of the the skin color changes um the kind of oranging of the changes um the kind of oranging of the changes um the kind of oranging of the skin can be permanent. So you have to skin can be permanent. So you have to skin can be permanent. So you have to this isn't the kind of thing you do to this isn't the kind of thing you do to this isn't the kind of thing you do to like go on vacation, right? [laughter] like go on vacation, right? [laughter] like go on vacation, right? [laughter] This is it might have more permanent This is it might have more permanent This is it might have more permanent effect, effect, effect, >> right? And and there's the risk for men >> right? And and there's the risk for men >> right? And and there's the risk for men of preipism which you know the the last of preipism which you know the the last of preipism which you know the the last erection you may ever have. It might erection you may ever have. It might erection you may ever have. It might last eight hours, but that might be the last eight hours, but that might be the last eight hours, but that might be the last one you ever It can cause damage to last one you ever It can cause damage to last one you ever It can cause damage to the nerves and penile tissues. So the nerves and penile tissues. So the nerves and penile tissues. So people, you know, people hear like people, you know, people hear like people, you know, people hear like erection, fat loss, energy, tan, like, erection, fat loss, energy, tan, like, erection, fat loss, energy, tan, like, oh great, you know, and you think, uh, oh great, you know, and you think, uh, oh great, you know, and you think, uh, you got to be real careful with these you got to be real careful with these you got to be real careful with these things if they they do get abused. Um, things if they they do get abused. Um, things if they they do get abused. Um, but I just mentioned the these things but I just mentioned the these things but I just mentioned the these things and and and the melanoten whole pathway and and and the melanoten whole pathway and and and the melanoten whole pathway is super interesting because it raises is super interesting because it raises is super interesting because it raises dopamine. Dopamine and pigmentation are dopamine. Dopamine and pigmentation are dopamine. Dopamine and pigmentation are linked through an enzyme called linked through an enzyme called linked through an enzyme called tyrroscenase. Not to get technical here, tyrroscenase. Not to get technical here, tyrroscenase. Not to get technical here, but some animals are um are uh look like but some animals are um are uh look like but some animals are um are uh look like they're albino in the winter, except they're albino in the winter, except they're albino in the winter, except they have dark eyes, like an arctic fox. they have dark eyes, like an arctic fox. they have dark eyes, like an arctic fox. And then the summer sunlight comes, hits And then the summer sunlight comes, hits And then the summer sunlight comes, hits this pathway, increases dopamine, this pathway, increases dopamine, this pathway, increases dopamine, pigments the fur, pigments the fur, pigments the fur, >> and they breed. >> and they breed. >> and they breed. >> So that there's a relationship between >> So that there's a relationship between >> So that there's a relationship between sunlight, dopamine, ficundity, and these sunlight, dopamine, ficundity, and these sunlight, dopamine, ficundity, and these kinds of things. It's pretty kinds of things. It's pretty kinds of things. It's pretty interesting, right? the um so um interesting, right? the um so um interesting, right? the um so um people are taking these things and people are taking these things and people are taking these things and they're getting them either through they're getting them either through they're getting them either through black market which I don't recommend black market which I don't recommend black market which I don't recommend gray market which is risky or gray market which is risky or gray market which is risky or compounding pharmacy so now we're sort compounding pharmacy so now we're sort compounding pharmacy so now we're sort of ascending levels of stringency and of ascending levels of stringency and of ascending levels of stringency and then you get to pharma sells it you can then you get to pharma sells it you can then you get to pharma sells it you can buy smearllin from one of the drug buy smearllin from one of the drug buy smearllin from one of the drug companies you can buy reatride soon from companies you can buy reatride soon from companies you can buy reatride soon from lily the cost tends to be you know three lily the cost tends to be you know three lily the cost tends to be you know three to 10 times higher the dosage recommend to 10 times higher the dosage recommend to 10 times higher the dosage recommend commendations tend to be higher. People commendations tend to be higher. People commendations tend to be higher. People have figured out doing their own kind of have figured out doing their own kind of have figured out doing their own kind of rogue experiments that you can get by rogue experiments that you can get by rogue experiments that you can get by taking much lower doses of things. So, I taking much lower doses of things. So, I taking much lower doses of things. So, I think one of the more interesting uses think one of the more interesting uses think one of the more interesting uses of GLPS that I'm hearing about mainly of GLPS that I'm hearing about mainly of GLPS that I'm hearing about mainly from people getting it from compounding from people getting it from compounding from people getting it from compounding pharmacy and gray market sources is that pharmacy and gray market sources is that pharmacy and gray market sources is that you can get by with taking much lower you can get by with taking much lower you can get by with taking much lower doses. Some people are using it for doses. Some people are using it for doses. Some people are using it for reducing alcohol craving, reducing alcohol craving, reducing alcohol craving, >> for reducing just cognitive noise more >> for reducing just cognitive noise more >> for reducing just cognitive noise more generally, which I think is pretty generally, which I think is pretty generally, which I think is pretty interesting. Um, and this is probably a interesting. Um, and this is probably a interesting. Um, and this is probably a good opportunity to just mention things good opportunity to just mention things good opportunity to just mention things for focus since we were going to talk for focus since we were going to talk for focus since we were going to talk about that. You know, if if you ever about that. You know, if if you ever about that. You know, if if you ever have in your copious amounts of spare have in your copious amounts of spare have in your copious amounts of spare time, which I'm sure you never have, um, time, which I'm sure you never have, um, time, which I'm sure you never have, um, because no one seems to have it anymore, because no one seems to have it anymore, because no one seems to have it anymore, there's [clears throat] some pretty there's [clears throat] some pretty there's [clears throat] some pretty interesting conversations that have interesting conversations that have interesting conversations that have taken place on X about drugs for focus taken place on X about drugs for focus taken place on X about drugs for focus because all the because all the because all the all the the other hackers um, like to all the the other hackers um, like to all the the other hackers um, like to focus and program um, and work. And so focus and program um, and work. And so focus and program um, and work. And so we all have heard of modafanil used to we all have heard of modafanil used to we all have heard of modafanil used to treat excess excessive daytime treat excess excessive daytime treat excess excessive daytime sleepiness. It may have a slight sleepiness. It may have a slight sleepiness. It may have a slight cognitive enhancing effect, but it's cognitive enhancing effect, but it's cognitive enhancing effect, but it's mostly a focusing thing. You can it mostly a focusing thing. You can it mostly a focusing thing. You can it increases energy when you have poor increases energy when you have poor increases energy when you have poor sleep. sleep. sleep. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Um it was designed to treat narcolepsy >> Um it was designed to treat narcolepsy >> Um it was designed to treat narcolepsy and other things. and other things. and other things. >> Better than aderall. >> Better than aderall. >> Better than aderall. >> Different than aderall because aderall >> Different than aderall because aderall >> Different than aderall because aderall is more of an amphetamine type is more of an amphetamine type is more of an amphetamine type stimulant. Um very interesting paper stimulant. Um very interesting paper stimulant. Um very interesting paper came out recently from WashU showing came out recently from WashU showing came out recently from WashU showing that aderall it wasn't really aderall that aderall it wasn't really aderall that aderall it wasn't really aderall specifically but rolin and other specifically but rolin and other specifically but rolin and other stimulants seem to improve focus about stimulants seem to improve focus about stimulants seem to improve focus about as well as a good night's sleep as well as a good night's sleep as well as a good night's sleep >> but a lot of people aren't getting the >> but a lot of people aren't getting the >> but a lot of people aren't getting the good night's sleep they need good night's sleep they need good night's sleep they need >> because of it also >> because of it also >> because of it also >> right exactly and it's not increasing >> right exactly and it's not increasing >> right exactly and it's not increasing focus per se it's increasing alertness focus per se it's increasing alertness focus per se it's increasing alertness which allows you to allocate your focus which allows you to allocate your focus which allows you to allocate your focus this is that as far as I know there are this is that as far as I know there are this is that as far as I know there are no drugs drugs to increase focus per se. no drugs drugs to increase focus per se. no drugs drugs to increase focus per se. Now, the two things are tethered enough. Now, the two things are tethered enough. Now, the two things are tethered enough. You know, you need alertness to You know, you need alertness to You know, you need alertness to alertness gates focus. Um, sleep gates alertness gates focus. Um, sleep gates alertness gates focus. Um, sleep gates alertness unless you take a drug like alertness unless you take a drug like alertness unless you take a drug like aderall or modafanil. There's a very aderall or modafanil. There's a very aderall or modafanil. There's a very interesting drug I think is going to interesting drug I think is going to interesting drug I think is going to become far more popular soon, which is become far more popular soon, which is become far more popular soon, which is already FDA approved calledsi, s u n o already FDA approved calledsi, s u n o already FDA approved calledsi, s u n o si, which is um approved for excessive si, which is um approved for excessive si, which is um approved for excessive daytime sleepiness. Did very well in a daytime sleepiness. Did very well in a daytime sleepiness. Did very well in a trial for ADHD. And it's a little bit of trial for ADHD. And it's a little bit of trial for ADHD. And it's a little bit of a dirtier drug in the sense that it a dirtier drug in the sense that it a dirtier drug in the sense that it doesn't just hit the dopamine and doesn't just hit the dopamine and doesn't just hit the dopamine and norepinephrine pathways that some of the norepinephrine pathways that some of the norepinephrine pathways that some of the other drugs I mentioned do. It also hits other drugs I mentioned do. It also hits other drugs I mentioned do. It also hits serotonin a little bit. Seems to have a serotonin a little bit. Seems to have a serotonin a little bit. Seems to have a much gentler arc of alertness and focus. much gentler arc of alertness and focus. much gentler arc of alertness and focus. I confess I've tried it. Um I'm it was a I confess I've tried it. Um I'm it was a I confess I've tried it. Um I'm it was a bit too much and I was like I don't I bit too much and I was like I don't I bit too much and I was like I don't I think I'm going to stick with caffeine think I'm going to stick with caffeine think I'm going to stick with caffeine for now. People will take Wellutrin the for now. People will take Wellutrin the for now. People will take Wellutrin the anti the atypical anti-depressant anti the atypical anti-depressant anti the atypical anti-depressant >> at low dosages to increase epinephrine >> at low dosages to increase epinephrine >> at low dosages to increase epinephrine dopamine a little bit for focus. I mean dopamine a little bit for focus. I mean dopamine a little bit for focus. I mean people are doing this all the time. people are doing this all the time. people are doing this all the time. nicotine. So there's a lot of stimulant nicotine. So there's a lot of stimulant nicotine. So there's a lot of stimulant use right now for focus. So I do think use right now for focus. So I do think use right now for focus. So I do think that if there is a peptide that can be that if there is a peptide that can be that if there is a peptide that can be taken safely that can reduce the amount taken safely that can reduce the amount taken safely that can reduce the amount of noise in the system and allow people of noise in the system and allow people of noise in the system and allow people to be uh more focused and allocate their to be uh more focused and allocate their to be uh more focused and allocate their attention in a more deliberate way attention in a more deliberate way attention in a more deliberate way without having to take stimulants. I without having to take stimulants. I without having to take stimulants. I think that would be fantastic. I think think that would be fantastic. I think think that would be fantastic. I think there's an excessive amount of stimulant there's an excessive amount of stimulant there's an excessive amount of stimulant use and this is coming from somebody who use and this is coming from somebody who use and this is coming from somebody who drinks a lot of caffeine and and frankly drinks a lot of caffeine and and frankly drinks a lot of caffeine and and frankly would love to have a drug that could would love to have a drug that could would love to have a drug that could increase focus but you always pay the increase focus but you always pay the increase focus but you always pay the piper somehow either in sleep or in piper somehow either in sleep or in piper somehow either in sleep or in cardiac challenges. I mean you don't cardiac challenges. I mean you don't cardiac challenges. I mean you don't want to stimulate the sympathetic want to stimulate the sympathetic want to stimulate the sympathetic nervous system so much for so often. It nervous system so much for so often. It nervous system so much for so often. It can probably shorten your life. can probably shorten your life. can probably shorten your life. >> What does a proactive approach to health >> What does a proactive approach to health >> What does a proactive approach to health look like maybe five years from now? And look like maybe five years from now? And look like maybe five years from now? And what technology do you think needs to be what technology do you think needs to be what technology do you think needs to be built to enable that? Maybe put another built to enable that? Maybe put another built to enable that? Maybe put another way, like you, it feels like you've way, like you, it feels like you've way, like you, it feels like you've covered every single health topic on covered every single health topic on covered every single health topic on your podcast. your podcast. your podcast. >> Still going. >> Still going. >> Still going. >> What do you think you're going to be >> What do you think you're going to be >> What do you think you're going to be covering in kind of 26, 27, 28? covering in kind of 26, 27, 28? covering in kind of 26, 27, 28? >> Yeah, we need to do autoimmune cancer. >> Yeah, we need to do autoimmune cancer. >> Yeah, we need to do autoimmune cancer. We we've got a bunch of things to go, We we've got a bunch of things to go, We we've got a bunch of things to go, but yeah, I I mean, maybe this is a good but yeah, I I mean, maybe this is a good but yeah, I I mean, maybe this is a good opportunity to kind of weave in reading opportunity to kind of weave in reading opportunity to kind of weave in reading and writing to biology. So reading, I and writing to biology. So reading, I and writing to biology. So reading, I mean, people are mean, people are mean, people are >> wearing sleep sensors. This is like >> wearing sleep sensors. This is like >> wearing sleep sensors. This is like commonly done now, right? commonly done now, right? commonly done now, right? >> Um, but you can't write to the sleep >> Um, but you can't write to the sleep >> Um, but you can't write to the sleep system yet. system yet. system yet. >> If you I think in 5 years we're going to >> If you I think in 5 years we're going to >> If you I think in 5 years we're going to look back and we're like, can you look back and we're like, can you look back and we're like, can you believe it? We were like cooling the believe it? We were like cooling the believe it? We were like cooling the room to try and fall asleep. I think room to try and fall asleep. I think room to try and fall asleep. I think we'll still have cooling mattresses, we'll still have cooling mattresses, we'll still have cooling mattresses, >> but like it's going to be so crazy cuz >> but like it's going to be so crazy cuz >> but like it's going to be so crazy cuz there should be a way that you could there should be a way that you could there should be a way that you could just put like a a small um like you can just put like a a small um like you can just put like a a small um like you can cool the core of the body more cool the core of the body more cool the core of the body more efficiently through the palms and the efficiently through the palms and the efficiently through the palms and the soles of the feet. Um there's reasons soles of the feet. Um there's reasons soles of the feet. Um there's reasons for this. The the vascule there actually for this. The the vascule there actually for this. The the vascule there actually lacks capillaries. can pass. You're not lacks capillaries. can pass. You're not lacks capillaries. can pass. You're not really cooling the blood um directly, really cooling the blood um directly, really cooling the blood um directly, but you're essentially um dumping more but you're essentially um dumping more but you're essentially um dumping more heat. This is a cool technology from heat. This is a cool technology from heat. This is a cool technology from Stanford. I mean, I think someday, not Stanford. I mean, I think someday, not Stanford. I mean, I think someday, not long from now, you'll go to sleep with a long from now, you'll go to sleep with a long from now, you'll go to sleep with a little little thing in your palm or on little little thing in your palm or on little little thing in your palm or on your your feet and your core body your your feet and your core body your your feet and your core body temperature will just drop. temperature will just drop. temperature will just drop. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> You wear an eye mask that's moving your >> You wear an eye mask that's moving your >> You wear an eye mask that's moving your eyes back and forth, and within 6 eyes back and forth, and within 6 eyes back and forth, and within 6 minutes or less, you'll be asleep. minutes or less, you'll be asleep. minutes or less, you'll be asleep. >> Um when you wake up in the morning, >> Um when you wake up in the morning, >> Um when you wake up in the morning, you'll flip that thing on, it'll give you'll flip that thing on, it'll give you'll flip that thing on, it'll give you a burst of 10,000 lux light, and you a burst of 10,000 lux light, and you a burst of 10,000 lux light, and then you'll go outside. These are then you'll go outside. These are then you'll go outside. These are trivially straightforward technologies trivially straightforward technologies trivially straightforward technologies to build, but no one's really building to build, but no one's really building to build, but no one's really building them right now because we're like, "Oh, them right now because we're like, "Oh, them right now because we're like, "Oh, we'll just cool the whole room and we'll just cool the whole room and we'll just cool the whole room and we'll, you know, and I'll, you know, we'll, you know, and I'll, you know, we'll, you know, and I'll, you know, look at a 10,000 lux, you know, thing look at a 10,000 lux, you know, thing look at a 10,000 lux, you know, thing over there while I" It's It's just It's over there while I" It's It's just It's over there while I" It's It's just It's so easy to move these things to the so easy to move these things to the so easy to move these things to the body. So, writing to our biology around body. So, writing to our biology around body. So, writing to our biology around sleep is going to be a big one. sleep is going to be a big one. sleep is going to be a big one. >> The read the other forms of reading that >> The read the other forms of reading that >> The read the other forms of reading that I think are happening now that are soon I think are happening now that are soon I think are happening now that are soon going to be writing as well. Well, I'd going to be writing as well. Well, I'd going to be writing as well. Well, I'd love to see not just real- time um love to see not just real- time um love to see not just real- time um glucose sensing, love to see real-time glucose sensing, love to see real-time glucose sensing, love to see real-time cortisol sensing, morning cortisol peak, cortisol sensing, morning cortisol peak, cortisol sensing, morning cortisol peak, getting that. I I mean, I can't getting that. I I mean, I can't getting that. I I mean, I can't overstate the importance of for overstate the importance of for overstate the importance of for everyone, women, men, premenopausal, everyone, women, men, premenopausal, everyone, women, men, premenopausal, post-menopausal, pregnant, not pregnant, post-menopausal, pregnant, not pregnant, post-menopausal, pregnant, not pregnant, kids, you want a big morning cortisol kids, you want a big morning cortisol kids, you want a big morning cortisol pulse and then you want that to trough pulse and then you want that to trough pulse and then you want that to trough in the late afternoon and stay low. You in the late afternoon and stay low. You in the late afternoon and stay low. You get that and you win 90% of the game. get that and you win 90% of the game. get that and you win 90% of the game. But we don't have real-time cortisol But we don't have real-time cortisol But we don't have real-time cortisol measures. people are are working on measures. people are are working on measures. people are are working on these things like right now for our these things like right now for our these things like right now for our listeners there are continuous glucose listeners there are continuous glucose listeners there are continuous glucose monitors and they put kind of a little monitors and they put kind of a little monitors and they put kind of a little piece of like dental floss under your piece of like dental floss under your piece of like dental floss under your skin that monitors glucose in real time skin that monitors glucose in real time skin that monitors glucose in real time normally for diabetics but people are normally for diabetics but people are normally for diabetics but people are working on kind of multi- biomarker working on kind of multi- biomarker working on kind of multi- biomarker sensors that could tell cortisol or a sensors that could tell cortisol or a sensors that could tell cortisol or a variety of things. variety of things. variety of things. >> Yeah, I think that you know real time >> Yeah, I think that you know real time >> Yeah, I think that you know real time cortisol would be very interesting. Of cortisol would be very interesting. Of cortisol would be very interesting. Of course, you'll get little blips of course, you'll get little blips of course, you'll get little blips of cortisol as you stress throughout the cortisol as you stress throughout the cortisol as you stress throughout the day and the real question is can you day and the real question is can you day and the real question is can you bring your cortisol back down bring your cortisol back down bring your cortisol back down afterwards? These blips and cortisol afterwards? These blips and cortisol afterwards? These blips and cortisol aren't a problem if they come back down. aren't a problem if they come back down. aren't a problem if they come back down. >> Sometimes if that whole curve gets >> Sometimes if that whole curve gets >> Sometimes if that whole curve gets shifted to the right a bit, there shifted to the right a bit, there shifted to the right a bit, there actually worse cancer outcomes, reduced actually worse cancer outcomes, reduced actually worse cancer outcomes, reduced longevity. There lot of reasons to want longevity. There lot of reasons to want longevity. There lot of reasons to want that cortisol spike really big and then that cortisol spike really big and then that cortisol spike really big and then have it trough into the afternoon. Um, have it trough into the afternoon. Um, have it trough into the afternoon. Um, so that's one that I'd love to see. Um, so that's one that I'd love to see. Um, so that's one that I'd love to see. Um, and then once you see that, you know, if and then once you see that, you know, if and then once you see that, you know, if at 5 or 6 p.m. your cortisol is riding at 5 or 6 p.m. your cortisol is riding at 5 or 6 p.m. your cortisol is riding high, you know, you'd love to be have a high, you know, you'd love to be have a high, you know, you'd love to be have a way that you could dial it down. And you way that you could dial it down. And you way that you could dial it down. And you could do that through conventional could do that through conventional could do that through conventional methods like long exhale breathing or methods like long exhale breathing or methods like long exhale breathing or short meditation, maybe eating some short meditation, maybe eating some short meditation, maybe eating some starchy carbohydrates. People forget starchy carbohydrates. People forget starchy carbohydrates. People forget that cortisol's main job is to deploy that cortisol's main job is to deploy that cortisol's main job is to deploy energy in the body. This is why it gives energy in the body. This is why it gives energy in the body. This is why it gives you a glucose bump. And there's a reason you a glucose bump. And there's a reason you a glucose bump. And there's a reason why starchy foods we call comfort foods why starchy foods we call comfort foods why starchy foods we call comfort foods is that it provides this sort of energy is that it provides this sort of energy is that it provides this sort of energy that allows cortisol to come down. This that allows cortisol to come down. This that allows cortisol to come down. This is why a lot of people who follow very is why a lot of people who follow very is why a lot of people who follow very low starch diets oftentimes feel really low starch diets oftentimes feel really low starch diets oftentimes feel really stressed or at the edge of stress. I stressed or at the edge of stress. I stressed or at the edge of stress. I can't sleep well unless I've had enough can't sleep well unless I've had enough can't sleep well unless I've had enough starches during the day. starches during the day. starches during the day. >> Interesting. >> Interesting. >> Interesting. >> Now, if I haven't done any exercise or >> Now, if I haven't done any exercise or >> Now, if I haven't done any exercise or anything, I don't really need many anything, I don't really need many anything, I don't really need many starches. But if you're weight training, starches. But if you're weight training, starches. But if you're weight training, you're busy, you're using your mind, you're busy, you're using your mind, you're busy, you're using your mind, you're moving about, then you know it's you're moving about, then you know it's you're moving about, then you know it's 11:00 at night and you're fried and you 11:00 at night and you're fried and you 11:00 at night and you're fried and you fall asleep, and then you're up at 3 in fall asleep, and then you're up at 3 in fall asleep, and then you're up at 3 in the morning, I'm willing to bet that had the morning, I'm willing to bet that had the morning, I'm willing to bet that had you had maybe a bowl of rice with you had maybe a bowl of rice with you had maybe a bowl of rice with dinner, you might actually sleep a lot dinner, you might actually sleep a lot dinner, you might actually sleep a lot better. People don't talk about this, better. People don't talk about this, better. People don't talk about this, especially in the context of ketogenic especially in the context of ketogenic especially in the context of ketogenic diets, which sure, you'll have more diets, which sure, you'll have more diets, which sure, you'll have more energy, but it can really mess up your energy, but it can really mess up your energy, but it can really mess up your sleep. sleep. sleep. >> You heard it here. You can have carbs at >> You heard it here. You can have carbs at >> You heard it here. You can have carbs at dinner. I love that. dinner. I love that. dinner. I love that. >> Please do it. Please. In fact, if you're >> Please do it. Please. In fact, if you're >> Please do it. Please. In fact, if you're going to have carbohydrates at any time going to have carbohydrates at any time going to have carbohydrates at any time should be within a couple hours after should be within a couple hours after should be within a couple hours after resistance training or, you know, maybe resistance training or, you know, maybe resistance training or, you know, maybe 3 4 hours before sleep. Maybe even a 3 4 hours before sleep. Maybe even a 3 4 hours before sleep. Maybe even a couple hours before sleep. It people who couple hours before sleep. It people who couple hours before sleep. It people who reduce their carbohydrate intake too reduce their carbohydrate intake too reduce their carbohydrate intake too much are you're not going to sleep well. much are you're not going to sleep well. much are you're not going to sleep well. You're just not. Um not nearly as well You're just not. Um not nearly as well You're just not. Um not nearly as well as you could if you had some moderate as you could if you had some moderate as you could if you had some moderate carb intake. Um obviously you want to carb intake. Um obviously you want to carb intake. Um obviously you want to try not to eat too close to bedtime try not to eat too close to bedtime try not to eat too close to bedtime >> and so forth. So I think that the the I >> and so forth. So I think that the the I >> and so forth. So I think that the the I do think that the whole peptide thing is do think that the whole peptide thing is do think that the whole peptide thing is you know the the horse is out of the you know the the horse is out of the you know the the horse is out of the stable. I think in 5 years you and I are stable. I think in 5 years you and I are stable. I think in 5 years you and I are going to have a little cocktail. It's going to have a little cocktail. It's going to have a little cocktail. It's going to be one injection or one pill going to be one injection or one pill going to be one injection or one pill and it's going to be a little bit of and it's going to be a little bit of and it's going to be a little bit of pineal in at night combined with pineal in at night combined with pineal in at night combined with something else. It's going to be in the something else. It's going to be in the something else. It's going to be in the morning, something, whatever it is that morning, something, whatever it is that morning, something, whatever it is that you need to um not you specifically of you need to um not you specifically of you need to um not you specifically of course, but whatever I need to, you course, but whatever I need to, you course, but whatever I need to, you know, ramp up my dopamineergic system a know, ramp up my dopamineergic system a know, ramp up my dopamineergic system a little bit to um make sure that I'm little bit to um make sure that I'm little bit to um make sure that I'm getting enough micronutrients that uh getting enough micronutrients that uh getting enough micronutrients that uh maybe I'm going to put a little cloth in maybe I'm going to put a little cloth in maybe I'm going to put a little cloth in there to protect me against Alzheimer's. there to protect me against Alzheimer's. there to protect me against Alzheimer's. I mean, I think all of that stuff is is I mean, I think all of that stuff is is I mean, I think all of that stuff is is going to be common place. The same way going to be common place. The same way going to be common place. The same way that people are not afraid of vitamin D that people are not afraid of vitamin D that people are not afraid of vitamin D or they're taking some creatine or or they're taking some creatine or or they're taking some creatine or magnesium. people are taking magnesium magnesium. people are taking magnesium magnesium. people are taking magnesium is kind of the next wave of of accepted is kind of the next wave of of accepted is kind of the next wave of of accepted supplements I think that feel safe supplements I think that feel safe supplements I think that feel safe enough for most not all people but safe enough for most not all people but safe enough for most not all people but safe enough. I think um most everyone is enough. I think um most everyone is enough. I think um most everyone is going to be doing that and I think the going to be doing that and I think the going to be doing that and I think the cost is going to be low enough that that cost is going to be low enough that that cost is going to be low enough that that statement most everyone is a real statement most everyone is a real statement most everyone is a real statement. statement. statement. >> I love the read versus write breakdown. >> I love the read versus write breakdown. >> I love the read versus write breakdown. I think on the read side it feels very I think on the read side it feels very I think on the read side it feels very clear where the world is going. Like clear where the world is going. Like clear where the world is going. Like chat GBT is already an incredible chat GBT is already an incredible chat GBT is already an incredible doctor, probably better than an average doctor, probably better than an average doctor, probably better than an average doctor, an American can get access to. doctor, an American can get access to. doctor, an American can get access to. >> It knows nothing about you today, but we >> It knows nothing about you today, but we >> It knows nothing about you today, but we have these health information exchanges have these health information exchanges have these health information exchanges coming online. You know, function. We're coming online. You know, function. We're coming online. You know, function. We're building something that pulls in, you building something that pulls in, you building something that pulls in, you know, all of your health records from know, all of your health records from know, all of your health records from EHRs, all of your wearable data, all of EHRs, all of your wearable data, all of EHRs, all of your wearable data, all of your function, blood test results, your your function, blood test results, your your function, blood test results, your imaging, and feeds it into this model in imaging, and feeds it into this model in imaging, and feeds it into this model in real time where it's going to diagnose real time where it's going to diagnose real time where it's going to diagnose issues with you before you even feel issues with you before you even feel issues with you before you even feel symptoms. And we saw like the 1.0 symptoms. And we saw like the 1.0 symptoms. And we saw like the 1.0 version of that in CO when people's version of that in CO when people's version of that in CO when people's wearables kind of realized they had CO wearables kind of realized they had CO wearables kind of realized they had CO before they even felt sick. before they even felt sick. before they even felt sick. And then when we have these continuous And then when we have these continuous And then when we have these continuous glucose monitors that can monitor a glucose monitors that can monitor a glucose monitors that can monitor a whole lot more like the diagnostics and whole lot more like the diagnostics and whole lot more like the diagnostics and read side feels like very kind of clear read side feels like very kind of clear read side feels like very kind of clear where the world is moving. The right is where the world is moving. The right is where the world is moving. The right is super interesting. The right side and super interesting. The right side and super interesting. The right side and that's where I think there are a million that's where I think there are a million that's where I think there are a million more ways this world could go. more ways this world could go. more ways this world could go. >> Yeah. I mean I I mean I borrow this read >> Yeah. I mean I I mean I borrow this read >> Yeah. I mean I I mean I borrow this read write thing from my you know my life as write thing from my you know my life as write thing from my you know my life as a neuroscientist. I mean for many years a neuroscientist. I mean for many years a neuroscientist. I mean for many years we wanted to chart the cell types of the we wanted to chart the cell types of the we wanted to chart the cell types of the nervous system. What are the nervous system. What are the nervous system. What are the connections? So you're looking at the connections? So you're looking at the connections? So you're looking at the hardware. Then it was let's record hardware. Then it was let's record hardware. Then it was let's record neurons, individual neurons, groups of neurons, individual neurons, groups of neurons, individual neurons, groups of neurons, extracellar, intracellular, neurons, extracellar, intracellular, neurons, extracellar, intracellular, calcium imaging, voltage dies. Okay, now calcium imaging, voltage dies. Okay, now calcium imaging, voltage dies. Okay, now let's do causal experiments. Let's quiet let's do causal experiments. Let's quiet let's do causal experiments. Let's quiet those cells, increase the activity of those cells, increase the activity of those cells, increase the activity of those cells in the context of a those cells in the context of a those cells in the context of a perceptual experiment or a behavioral perceptual experiment or a behavioral perceptual experiment or a behavioral experiment in humans ideally, right? But experiment in humans ideally, right? But experiment in humans ideally, right? But it was done first, you know, mice, I it was done first, you know, mice, I it was done first, you know, mice, I mean everything rat, cat, monkey, bat, mean everything rat, cat, monkey, bat, mean everything rat, cat, monkey, bat, but it was, you know, it's got me, you but it was, you know, it's got me, you but it was, you know, it's got me, you know, mice and it was non-human primates know, mice and it was non-human primates know, mice and it was non-human primates and now and now humans. And so I think and now and now humans. And so I think and now and now humans. And so I think when I think about reading and writing when I think about reading and writing when I think about reading and writing to our physiology, it's like let's to our physiology, it's like let's to our physiology, it's like let's figure out what the normal normal figure out what the normal normal figure out what the normal normal patterns of activity are and let's have patterns of activity are and let's have patterns of activity are and let's have simple ways to implement what's needed. simple ways to implement what's needed. simple ways to implement what's needed. Push that cortisol bump a little bit. Push that cortisol bump a little bit. Push that cortisol bump a little bit. Right now it's so crude it's almost Right now it's so crude it's almost Right now it's so crude it's almost funny. It's like, oh, will ashwagandha funny. It's like, oh, will ashwagandha funny. It's like, oh, will ashwagandha reduce this or reduce cortisol? Yeah, reduce this or reduce cortisol? Yeah, reduce this or reduce cortisol? Yeah, people take it in the morning. That people take it in the morning. That people take it in the morning. That makes no sense. You want your cortisol makes no sense. You want your cortisol makes no sense. You want your cortisol elevated in the morning. People will elevated in the morning. People will elevated in the morning. People will take a little bit in the evening and take a little bit in the evening and take a little bit in the evening and yeah, it'll calm them down a bit, but if yeah, it'll calm them down a bit, but if yeah, it'll calm them down a bit, but if they take it for too long, it can start they take it for too long, it can start they take it for too long, it can start to have some offtarget effects. So, I to have some offtarget effects. So, I to have some offtarget effects. So, I always say you don't want to take high always say you don't want to take high always say you don't want to take high doses for for too long. You we're doses for for too long. You we're doses for for too long. You we're cooling the room. Great. Everyone should cooling the room. Great. Everyone should cooling the room. Great. Everyone should cool the room. I cooled the room in my cool the room. I cooled the room in my cool the room. I cooled the room in my hotel yesterday. I love the I love love hotel yesterday. I love the I love love hotel yesterday. I love the I love love love the eight sleep. Yes, they're a love the eight sleep. Yes, they're a love the eight sleep. Yes, they're a sponsor, but I think it's of my podcast, sponsor, but I think it's of my podcast, sponsor, but I think it's of my podcast, but I think it's a phenomenal but I think it's a phenomenal but I think it's a phenomenal technology. So much I miss it when I technology. So much I miss it when I technology. So much I miss it when I travel. But ultimately, we're going to travel. But ultimately, we're going to travel. But ultimately, we're going to be cooling the body. Just cool your be cooling the body. Just cool your be cooling the body. Just cool your core, right? Right. I should travel with core, right? Right. I should travel with core, right? Right. I should travel with a little thing I can put on my feet and a little thing I can put on my feet and a little thing I can put on my feet and the socks that'll cool my core so I the socks that'll cool my core so I the socks that'll cool my core so I sleep and wake me up by, you know, one sleep and wake me up by, you know, one sleep and wake me up by, you know, one way to really improve the amount of REM way to really improve the amount of REM way to really improve the amount of REM sleep you get, not taking anything. Warm sleep you get, not taking anything. Warm sleep you get, not taking anything. Warm your body in the last warm your sleeping your body in the last warm your sleeping your body in the last warm your sleeping environment in the last hour before you environment in the last hour before you environment in the last hour before you wake. REM levels go up. So you want it wake. REM levels go up. So you want it wake. REM levels go up. So you want it cool then really cold then warm. We cool then really cold then warm. We cool then really cold then warm. We shouldn't be relying on external shouldn't be relying on external shouldn't be relying on external hardware so much. hardware so much. hardware so much. >> And I don't and so that's why I think >> And I don't and so that's why I think >> And I don't and so that's why I think the sleep mask thing etc. I also think the sleep mask thing etc. I also think the sleep mask thing etc. I also think the real holy grail in all this is the the real holy grail in all this is the the real holy grail in all this is the ability to dial in cognitive states. I ability to dial in cognitive states. I ability to dial in cognitive states. I don't think I know I'm going to Matt don't think I know I'm going to Matt don't think I know I'm going to Matt McDougall who you know I knew when he McDougall who you know I knew when he McDougall who you know I knew when he was at Stanford now is at Neurolink he's was at Stanford now is at Neurolink he's was at Stanford now is at Neurolink he's phenomenal. Dan Adams I think that group phenomenal. Dan Adams I think that group phenomenal. Dan Adams I think that group is terrific. I think our friend Eddie is terrific. I think our friend Eddie is terrific. I think our friend Eddie Chang, uh, chair of neuros surgery at Chang, uh, chair of neuros surgery at Chang, uh, chair of neuros surgery at UCSF, phenomenal. They're they're UCSF, phenomenal. They're they're UCSF, phenomenal. They're they're reading and writing to the nervous reading and writing to the nervous reading and writing to the nervous system, but I do not think in the next system, but I do not think in the next system, but I do not think in the next 10 years. I'd love to for them to prove 10 years. I'd love to for them to prove 10 years. I'd love to for them to prove me wrong, but I do not think that your me wrong, but I do not think that your me wrong, but I do not think that your hippocampus is going to be pulling in hippocampus is going to be pulling in hippocampus is going to be pulling in twice as much memory at, you know, twice twice as much memory at, you know, twice twice as much memory at, you know, twice the rate or something like that. It's the rate or something like that. It's the rate or something like that. It's just not going to happen. We don't even just not going to happen. We don't even just not going to happen. We don't even understand how the hippocampus does that understand how the hippocampus does that understand how the hippocampus does that under normal conditions well enough yet. under normal conditions well enough yet. under normal conditions well enough yet. But I can imagine putting on a pair of But I can imagine putting on a pair of But I can imagine putting on a pair of glasses to sit down and do some work and glasses to sit down and do some work and glasses to sit down and do some work and your visual field goes and there's some your visual field goes and there's some your visual field goes and there's some sort of level of stimulation, external sort of level of stimulation, external sort of level of stimulation, external stimulation that brings your ramps up stimulation that brings your ramps up stimulation that brings your ramps up your level of focus. You set a timer and your level of focus. You set a timer and your level of focus. You set a timer and for the next 40 minutes you'll for the next 40 minutes you'll for the next 40 minutes you'll experience the kind of focus that you've experience the kind of focus that you've experience the kind of focus that you've only had a few times when you had all only had a few times when you had all only had a few times when you had all conditions right and you'll work for conditions right and you'll work for conditions right and you'll work for that 40 minutes and then you'll click that 40 minutes and then you'll click that 40 minutes and then you'll click that you're done and then you'll take that you're done and then you'll take that you're done and then you'll take those things off and you'll you'll go do those things off and you'll you'll go do those things off and you'll you'll go do something else. I love that. I try to something else. I love that. I try to something else. I love that. I try to myself that's coming. That's coming. And myself that's coming. That's coming. And myself that's coming. That's coming. And I I keep pointing to the eyes like the I I keep pointing to the eyes like the I I keep pointing to the eyes like the the sleep mask that moves the eyes to the sleep mask that moves the eyes to the sleep mask that moves the eyes to make you fall asleep. It's most of the make you fall asleep. It's most of the make you fall asleep. It's most of the access to the brain and nervous system access to the brain and nervous system access to the brain and nervous system is going to be maybe through the Vegas is going to be maybe through the Vegas is going to be maybe through the Vegas through some super superficial through some super superficial through some super superficial stimulation for calming effects or or stimulation for calming effects or or stimulation for calming effects or or other things. Actually, veagal other things. Actually, veagal other things. Actually, veagal stimulation mainly causes alertness, but stimulation mainly causes alertness, but stimulation mainly causes alertness, but um maybe you know some non-invasive um maybe you know some non-invasive um maybe you know some non-invasive technology will get good enough. Right technology will get good enough. Right technology will get good enough. Right now, I'm not really seeing it, but it's now, I'm not really seeing it, but it's now, I'm not really seeing it, but it's coming. But the amount of things that coming. But the amount of things that coming. But the amount of things that you can do to modify brain state through you can do to modify brain state through you can do to modify brain state through this region, just the eyes, ears, and uh this region, just the eyes, ears, and uh this region, just the eyes, ears, and uh and the superficial nerves that run and the superficial nerves that run and the superficial nerves that run around there is just phenomenal. So I if around there is just phenomenal. So I if around there is just phenomenal. So I if I were going to personally invest in any I were going to personally invest in any I were going to personally invest in any companies that were doing that sort of companies that were doing that sort of companies that were doing that sort of thing, that's the body area and the thing, that's the body area and the thing, that's the body area and the sorts of things that I'd be really sorts of things that I'd be really sorts of things that I'd be really focused on. focused on. focused on. >> Question on AI. You've rose to >> Question on AI. You've rose to >> Question on AI. You've rose to prominence distilling kind of complex prominence distilling kind of complex prominence distilling kind of complex health information and studies into health information and studies into health information and studies into something that people can understand something that people can understand something that people can understand easily. this is now something like AI easily. this is now something like AI easily. this is now something like AI can do quite well. How do you think can do quite well. How do you think can do quite well. How do you think about that? How do you use AI in your about that? How do you use AI in your about that? How do you use AI in your day-to-day life? day-to-day life? day-to-day life? >> Well, I use Claude to quiz myself. >> Well, I use Claude to quiz myself. >> Well, I use Claude to quiz myself. Claude is really good at generating Claude is really good at generating Claude is really good at generating tests for me on knowledge. Um, so that's tests for me on knowledge. Um, so that's tests for me on knowledge. Um, so that's where I've been using it the most. Um, where I've been using it the most. Um, where I've been using it the most. Um, I love the idea that an AI version of me I love the idea that an AI version of me I love the idea that an AI version of me could potentially deliver a podcast. It could potentially deliver a podcast. It could potentially deliver a podcast. It would allow me to do other things. Um, would allow me to do other things. Um, would allow me to do other things. Um, sort of halfkitting there. Here's what I sort of halfkitting there. Here's what I sort of halfkitting there. Here's what I know for sure is that there are many know for sure is that there are many know for sure is that there are many easy ways to generate a list of the 10 easy ways to generate a list of the 10 easy ways to generate a list of the 10 most important things to do to get great most important things to do to get great most important things to do to get great sleep. The 10 most important things to sleep. The 10 most important things to sleep. The 10 most important things to do to uh ensure brain health given what do to uh ensure brain health given what do to uh ensure brain health given what we know that it's very easy to generate we know that it's very easy to generate we know that it's very easy to generate a list. But given that why why don't a list. But given that why why don't a list. But given that why why don't people just do those things? And I think people just do those things? And I think people just do those things? And I think it's because there's something about the it's because there's something about the it's because there's something about the human brain where the probability that human brain where the probability that human brain where the probability that we take on a protocol or change our we take on a protocol or change our we take on a protocol or change our behavior is highly dependent on a of behavior is highly dependent on a of behavior is highly dependent on a of course the effectiveness of that course the effectiveness of that course the effectiveness of that behavior as we experience it but also behavior as we experience it but also behavior as we experience it but also how we learn the information. how we learn the information. how we learn the information. >> When you understand mechanism I think it >> When you understand mechanism I think it >> When you understand mechanism I think it gives a higher probability that somebody gives a higher probability that somebody gives a higher probability that somebody is going to implement the advice and it is going to implement the advice and it is going to implement the advice and it may even change the way the protocol may even change the way the protocol may even change the way the protocol works. Now you could say that's all works. Now you could say that's all works. Now you could say that's all placebo or belief effect but maybe not placebo or belief effect but maybe not placebo or belief effect but maybe not right some of it is also the flexibility right some of it is also the flexibility right some of it is also the flexibility that's provided when you understand that's provided when you understand that's provided when you understand mechanism you understand that if you mechanism you understand that if you mechanism you understand that if you can't get sunlight in the morning today can't get sunlight in the morning today can't get sunlight in the morning today you just double up tomorrow because it's you just double up tomorrow because it's you just double up tomorrow because it's a summation system it's not it's a a summation system it's not it's a a summation system it's not it's a window that yes if you miss for too many window that yes if you miss for too many window that yes if you miss for too many days it becomes problematic but once you days it becomes problematic but once you days it becomes problematic but once you understand how it's summing photons etc understand how it's summing photons etc understand how it's summing photons etc and AI could probably deliver that and AI could probably deliver that and AI could probably deliver that information but I don't know that it can information but I don't know that it can information but I don't know that it can build the build it well enough. Um, but build the build it well enough. Um, but build the build it well enough. Um, but maybe I'm just telling myself that cuz I maybe I'm just telling myself that cuz I maybe I'm just telling myself that cuz I don't like the idea of being replaced by don't like the idea of being replaced by don't like the idea of being replaced by AI. But I don't know. I mean, I'd AI. But I don't know. I mean, I'd AI. But I don't know. I mean, I'd probably build the platform where the AI probably build the platform where the AI probably build the platform where the AI version of me was doing it. So, I I version of me was doing it. So, I I version of me was doing it. So, I I don't have a problem poaching myself. don't have a problem poaching myself. don't have a problem poaching myself. >> Longevity, escape, veloc velocity. Do >> Longevity, escape, veloc velocity. Do >> Longevity, escape, veloc velocity. Do you think that's real or fantasy? you think that's real or fantasy? you think that's real or fantasy? >> I mean, [sighs and gasps] >> I mean, [sighs and gasps] >> I mean, [sighs and gasps] I think the way that people are defining I think the way that people are defining I think the way that people are defining longevity now, it's it's got a lot of uh longevity now, it's it's got a lot of uh longevity now, it's it's got a lot of uh pretzel twists in it to try and say, pretzel twists in it to try and say, pretzel twists in it to try and say, well, I didn't say we were going to live well, I didn't say we were going to live well, I didn't say we were going to live forever. right to my you know I'm going forever. right to my you know I'm going forever. right to my you know I'm going to my upload my conscious like if we're to my upload my conscious like if we're to my upload my conscious like if we're talking about this this physical body talking about this this physical body talking about this this physical body that we currently inhabit um minus any that we currently inhabit um minus any that we currently inhabit um minus any robotic architecture inserted I think robotic architecture inserted I think robotic architecture inserted I think it's pretty clear that the genetic upper it's pretty clear that the genetic upper it's pretty clear that the genetic upper limit is about 120 and for most of us limit is about 120 and for most of us limit is about 120 and for most of us it's probably closer to about 105 it's probably closer to about 105 it's probably closer to about 105 so taking great care of ourselves um so taking great care of ourselves um so taking great care of ourselves um aiming for 100 I think aim for 100 is my aiming for 100 I think aim for 100 is my aiming for 100 I think aim for 100 is my motto just aim for 100 healthy Um, I motto just aim for 100 healthy Um, I motto just aim for 100 healthy Um, I think that's doable. I I'm very excited. think that's doable. I I'm very excited. think that's doable. I I'm very excited. I guess it's a little bit of an edgy I guess it's a little bit of an edgy I guess it's a little bit of an edgy topic, but I'm very excited by Tony topic, but I'm very excited by Tony topic, but I'm very excited by Tony Weiss Cory's work from Stanford. Um, and Weiss Cory's work from Stanford. Um, and Weiss Cory's work from Stanford. Um, and he had a company that's now sold, he had a company that's now sold, he had a company that's now sold, Alcheist, um, which talked about factors Alcheist, um, which talked about factors Alcheist, um, which talked about factors in young blood and in exercised blood in young blood and in exercised blood in young blood and in exercised blood that can rejuvenate the brain and body. that can rejuvenate the brain and body. that can rejuvenate the brain and body. So, some of these factors that circulate So, some of these factors that circulate So, some of these factors that circulate after exercise are really beneficial. after exercise are really beneficial. after exercise are really beneficial. And yes, there are factors in younger And yes, there are factors in younger And yes, there are factors in younger blood that seem to be beneficial. This blood that seem to be beneficial. This blood that seem to be beneficial. This gets people worried about vampires and gets people worried about vampires and gets people worried about vampires and stuff, but we're talking about ethical stuff, but we're talking about ethical stuff, but we're talking about ethical uh things here. It provided ethically, uh things here. It provided ethically, uh things here. It provided ethically, gathered and provided ethically, of gathered and provided ethically, of gathered and provided ethically, of course. What I think is really course. What I think is really course. What I think is really interesting is that there are some some interesting is that there are some some interesting is that there are some some proteins that really appear to be proteins that really appear to be proteins that really appear to be rejuvenating. I I also think rejuvenating. I I also think rejuvenating. I I also think if someone came along tomorrow and if someone came along tomorrow and if someone came along tomorrow and said,"Andrew, why don't we collect your said,"Andrew, why don't we collect your said,"Andrew, why don't we collect your blood after exercising for the next, you blood after exercising for the next, you blood after exercising for the next, you know, six months and let's just bank know, six months and let's just bank know, six months and let's just bank your blood so that if you ever have an your blood so that if you ever have an your blood so that if you ever have an injury, you can get some really healthy injury, you can get some really healthy injury, you can get some really healthy of your own blood." I would do that. of your own blood." I would do that. of your own blood." I would do that. It's kind of primitive from the It's kind of primitive from the It's kind of primitive from the standpoint of, you know, AI and all standpoint of, you know, AI and all standpoint of, you know, AI and all these things being available, but we these things being available, but we these things being available, but we know that infusion, blood infusions are know that infusion, blood infusions are know that infusion, blood infusions are beneficial. There's been a clinical beneficial. There's been a clinical beneficial. There's been a clinical trial for this. Yeah, trial for this. Yeah, trial for this. Yeah, >> we know that blood infusions of exercise >> we know that blood infusions of exercise >> we know that blood infusions of exercise blood are even more beneficial. We also blood are even more beneficial. We also blood are even more beneficial. We also know that after a brain injury or a know that after a brain injury or a know that after a brain injury or a bodily injury that things that are not bodily injury that things that are not bodily injury that things that are not just pro-inflammatory circulate in the just pro-inflammatory circulate in the just pro-inflammatory circulate in the blood that are bad for all organs. So, I blood that are bad for all organs. So, I blood that are bad for all organs. So, I think a very low bar but useful think a very low bar but useful think a very low bar but useful technology would be to bank a bunch of technology would be to bank a bunch of technology would be to bank a bunch of my own blood after exercise. And I'm my own blood after exercise. And I'm my own blood after exercise. And I'm like, I'm healthier now at 50 than I'm like, I'm healthier now at 50 than I'm like, I'm healthier now at 50 than I'm likely to be at 70. Mhm. likely to be at 70. Mhm. likely to be at 70. Mhm. >> I would love my own blood at 70. Just >> I would love my own blood at 70. Just >> I would love my own blood at 70. Just get an infusion once a week. get an infusion once a week. get an infusion once a week. >> Totally. >> Totally. >> Totally. >> You know, I I' I'd do that before I'd >> You know, I I' I'd do that before I'd >> You know, I I' I'd do that before I'd get some like glutathione NAD infusion, get some like glutathione NAD infusion, get some like glutathione NAD infusion, which is you probably fine, but I don't which is you probably fine, but I don't which is you probably fine, but I don't know that it provides that much. know that it provides that much. know that it provides that much. >> Last question. You have a pet octopus. >> Last question. You have a pet octopus. >> Last question. You have a pet octopus. >> I do. >> I do. >> I do. >> That is unusual. Tell us about him or >> That is unusual. Tell us about him or >> That is unusual. Tell us about him or her. her. her. >> Van Go. Um, >> Van Go. Um, >> Van Go. Um, >> Van Go. >> Van Go. >> Van Go. >> Van Go. Yeah, it's a starry night >> Van Go. Yeah, it's a starry night >> Van Go. Yeah, it's a starry night octopus, hence Van Go. And then it got octopus, hence Van Go. And then it got octopus, hence Van Go. And then it got even more eerie because Van Go lost one even more eerie because Van Go lost one even more eerie because Van Go lost one tentacle in the in the fan. So it was tentacle in the in the fan. So it was tentacle in the in the fan. So it was like a um so when my lab was in San like a um so when my lab was in San like a um so when my lab was in San Diego before I moved to Stanford, I Diego before I moved to Stanford, I Diego before I moved to Stanford, I worked on a different sephopod called worked on a different sephopod called worked on a different sephopod called cuttlefish, which are like little cuttlefish, which are like little cuttlefish, which are like little underwater monkeys. They're incredibly underwater monkeys. They're incredibly underwater monkeys. They're incredibly intelligent. They're known for being intelligent. They're known for being intelligent. They're known for being great camouflagers. There's also this great camouflagers. There's also this great camouflagers. There's also this twist in their uh sociobiology where the twist in their uh sociobiology where the twist in their uh sociobiology where the males will um camouflage as females, males will um camouflage as females, males will um camouflage as females, infiltrate, and then mate with the infiltrate, and then mate with the infiltrate, and then mate with the females. Um, so I was studying their females. Um, so I was studying their females. Um, so I was studying their vision. They're very interesting because vision. They're very interesting because vision. They're very interesting because they can see in panorama and they're they can see in panorama and they're they can see in panorama and they're very placid, but then when they want to very placid, but then when they want to very placid, but then when they want to hunt, their eyes transllocate to the hunt, their eyes transllocate to the hunt, their eyes transllocate to the front and they generate depth front and they generate depth front and they generate depth perception, stereopsis to to hunt. And I perception, stereopsis to to hunt. And I perception, stereopsis to to hunt. And I was very interested in whether or not was very interested in whether or not was very interested in whether or not they had two visual systems. And uh, I'm they had two visual systems. And uh, I'm they had two visual systems. And uh, I'm very interested in depth perception and very interested in depth perception and very interested in depth perception and and prey capture and how that relates to and prey capture and how that relates to and prey capture and how that relates to bodily states. Just to weave this into bodily states. Just to weave this into bodily states. Just to weave this into what we were talking about earlier. Um, what we were talking about earlier. Um, what we were talking about earlier. Um, when your eyes are focused on a single when your eyes are focused on a single when your eyes are focused on a single point, your levels of of arousal and point, your levels of of arousal and point, your levels of of arousal and energy attention go up. When your eyes energy attention go up. When your eyes energy attention go up. When your eyes are sort of d when your gaze is dilated, are sort of d when your gaze is dilated, are sort of d when your gaze is dilated, like you're viewing the corners of the like you're viewing the corners of the like you're viewing the corners of the room and the ceiling and the floor, that room and the ceiling and the floor, that room and the ceiling and the floor, that tends to make put us into a calmer tends to make put us into a calmer tends to make put us into a calmer state. Some animals only exist in one or state. Some animals only exist in one or state. Some animals only exist in one or the other. We we are unique that we can the other. We we are unique that we can the other. We we are unique that we can switch back and forth. Some other switch back and forth. Some other switch back and forth. Some other animals can, but I was studying that in animals can, but I was studying that in animals can, but I was studying that in cuttlefish. When I moved to my current cuttlefish. When I moved to my current cuttlefish. When I moved to my current home, I converted an art gallery into a home, I converted an art gallery into a home, I converted an art gallery into a living space. I put a gym. I put a place living space. I put a gym. I put a place living space. I put a gym. I put a place to work downstairs where there's no to work downstairs where there's no to work downstairs where there's no Wi-Fi. I don't bring my phone down Wi-Fi. I don't bring my phone down Wi-Fi. I don't bring my phone down there. That's where I prepare for there. That's where I prepare for there. That's where I prepare for podcasts. I do drawing. I'm doing some podcasts. I do drawing. I'm doing some podcasts. I do drawing. I'm doing some illustrations these days for my book and illustrations these days for my book and illustrations these days for my book and a few other things. And then it's like, a few other things. And then it's like, a few other things. And then it's like, oh, I've always loved aquaria. I'm going oh, I've always loved aquaria. I'm going oh, I've always loved aquaria. I'm going to put a freshwater discus tank. And I to put a freshwater discus tank. And I to put a freshwater discus tank. And I put a huge fresh freshwater discus tank. put a huge fresh freshwater discus tank. put a huge fresh freshwater discus tank. I was like, you know, I think I need I was like, you know, I think I need I was like, you know, I think I need sephopods again. So, I got an octopus. I sephopods again. So, I got an octopus. I sephopods again. So, I got an octopus. I got a starry night octopus. And here's got a starry night octopus. And here's got a starry night octopus. And here's what I'm trying to do with the octopus. what I'm trying to do with the octopus. what I'm trying to do with the octopus. This has everything to do with AI. This has everything to do with AI. This has everything to do with AI. I'm trying to get the octopus to report I'm trying to get the octopus to report I'm trying to get the octopus to report to me what it's thinking because I do to me what it's thinking because I do to me what it's thinking because I do think they're very intelligent and we think they're very intelligent and we think they're very intelligent and we say, "Oh, they're like aliens. They're say, "Oh, they're like aliens. They're say, "Oh, they're like aliens. They're so intelligent." But we get the so intelligent." But we get the so intelligent." But we get the camouflage. They're very interactive. camouflage. They're very interactive. camouflage. They're very interactive. Um, but Um, but Um, but an underwater iPad and the appropriate an underwater iPad and the appropriate an underwater iPad and the appropriate use of of touchscreen and AI, I'm hoping use of of touchscreen and AI, I'm hoping use of of touchscreen and AI, I'm hoping will allow this or another octopus to will allow this or another octopus to will allow this or another octopus to communicate something about what it's communicate something about what it's communicate something about what it's thinking. Okay, so how would you do thinking. Okay, so how would you do thinking. Okay, so how would you do this? Right? So, you can't apply a this? Right? So, you can't apply a this? Right? So, you can't apply a typical large language model. So, you typical large language model. So, you typical large language model. So, you have to do it based on the coloration have to do it based on the coloration have to do it based on the coloration patterns on the camouflage patterns. So patterns on the camouflage patterns. So patterns on the camouflage patterns. So it turns out AI can actually learn a lot it turns out AI can actually learn a lot it turns out AI can actually learn a lot by correlating the behaviors of an by correlating the behaviors of an by correlating the behaviors of an octopus with its camouflage patterns. octopus with its camouflage patterns. octopus with its camouflage patterns. The problem has always been that you The problem has always been that you The problem has always been that you have to do that in real time as the have to do that in real time as the have to do that in real time as the animals swimming around and hunting and animals swimming around and hunting and animals swimming around and hunting and doing various things. So the challenge doing various things. So the challenge doing various things. So the challenge now is to get it to interact with now is to get it to interact with now is to get it to interact with stimula that will give enough stimula that will give enough stimula that will give enough information so that this model I don't information so that this model I don't information so that this model I don't know we call it I we don't have someone know we call it I we don't have someone know we call it I we don't have someone more clever than I can come up with more clever than I can come up with more clever than I can come up with something that's not LLM. I don't know something that's not LLM. I don't know something that's not LLM. I don't know something else something related to something else something related to something else something related to camouflage patterns could start camouflage patterns could start camouflage patterns could start revealing that certain camouflage revealing that certain camouflage revealing that certain camouflage patterns relate to certain behaviors patterns relate to certain behaviors patterns relate to certain behaviors which relate to um certain nuance in the which relate to um certain nuance in the which relate to um certain nuance in the behaviors and then it could start behaviors and then it could start behaviors and then it could start teaching itself. Um and then the idea teaching itself. Um and then the idea teaching itself. Um and then the idea would be that the ai would present would be that the ai would present would be that the ai would present something to Van Go or another octopus. something to Van Go or another octopus. something to Van Go or another octopus. I've got more on the way that um I've got more on the way that um I've got more on the way that um would start to influence behavior that would start to influence behavior that would start to influence behavior that could be not just conversations between could be not just conversations between could be not just conversations between octopi but where maybe I could speak it octopi but where maybe I could speak it octopi but where maybe I could speak it would it would uh translate that into would it would uh translate that into would it would uh translate that into octopus [laughter] you call it and then octopus [laughter] you call it and then octopus [laughter] you call it and then we could communicate and here's the we could communicate and here's the we could communicate and here's the reason for doing this okay so there's reason for doing this okay so there's reason for doing this okay so there's this idea that other animals have all this idea that other animals have all this idea that other animals have all this intelligence normally we measure this intelligence normally we measure this intelligence normally we measure that through behavior or through some that through behavior or through some that through behavior or through some you know highly specialized aspect of you know highly specialized aspect of you know highly specialized aspect of their nervous system or body like barn their nervous system or body like barn their nervous system or body like barn owls or you know They all do these owls or you know They all do these owls or you know They all do these fantastic feats or you what you find and fantastic feats or you what you find and fantastic feats or you what you find and I don't like it for instance when I see I don't like it for instance when I see I don't like it for instance when I see oh this guy taught an octopus how to use oh this guy taught an octopus how to use oh this guy taught an octopus how to use a piano I saw that that's not a piano I saw that that's not a piano I saw that that's not interesting actually all that tells you interesting actually all that tells you interesting actually all that tells you that tells you more about how hard that tells you more about how hard that tells you more about how hard humans are willing to work to train a humans are willing to work to train a humans are willing to work to train a different organism to do something different organism to do something different organism to do something pretty rudimentary compared to what pretty rudimentary compared to what pretty rudimentary compared to what humans can do tells you everything about humans can do tells you everything about humans can do tells you everything about humans obsession with teaching other humans obsession with teaching other humans obsession with teaching other animals to be more human I'm interested animals to be more human I'm interested animals to be more human I'm interested in what the octopus understands about in what the octopus understands about in what the octopus understands about the world and can communicate that to me the world and can communicate that to me the world and can communicate that to me because I don't know that stuff. I can because I don't know that stuff. I can because I don't know that stuff. I can learn to play a piano. Why would I want learn to play a piano. Why would I want learn to play a piano. Why would I want to teach an octopus to play a piano? to teach an octopus to play a piano? to teach an octopus to play a piano? That's That's That's >> fascinating. I think you need a whole >> fascinating. I think you need a whole >> fascinating. I think you need a whole podcast outlining your experience. podcast outlining your experience. podcast outlining your experience. >> Yeah. Well, maybe this is what happens >> Yeah. Well, maybe this is what happens >> Yeah. Well, maybe this is what happens when we run out of topics to put on the when we run out of topics to put on the when we run out of topics to put on the on the HLP, but and I'm probably not on the HLP, but and I'm probably not on the HLP, but and I'm probably not thinking about this as cleanly as I I thinking about this as cleanly as I I thinking about this as cleanly as I I could or should, but it was I have to could or should, but it was I have to could or should, but it was I have to say just in kind of, you know, wrapping say just in kind of, you know, wrapping say just in kind of, you know, wrapping this, you know, monologue, it this, you know, monologue, it this, you know, monologue, it you get to the point doing public facing you get to the point doing public facing you get to the point doing public facing health information where you can kind of health information where you can kind of health information where you can kind of feel the saturation point and we need feel the saturation point and we need feel the saturation point and we need more technologies and tools and I think more technologies and tools and I think more technologies and tools and I think that's great and I really am excited for that's great and I really am excited for that's great and I really am excited for what's coming. But the at some point the what's coming. But the at some point the what's coming. But the at some point the conversations become um clear that we conversations become um clear that we conversations become um clear that we need more right and then you think about need more right and then you think about need more right and then you think about this whole vast landscape of animal this whole vast landscape of animal this whole vast landscape of animal intelligence and intelligence and intelligence and people have placed this thing on the o people have placed this thing on the o people have placed this thing on the o on the sephopods like they're really on the sephopods like they're really on the sephopods like they're really smart they know I mean they might be smart they know I mean they might be smart they know I mean they might be idiots for all we know just dazzling us idiots for all we know just dazzling us idiots for all we know just dazzling us with colors I don't think they're idiots with colors I don't think they're idiots with colors I don't think they're idiots I think that they are accessing um a I think that they are accessing um a I think that they are accessing um a certain perceptual landscape and they're certain perceptual landscape and they're certain perceptual landscape and they're thinking hard about what's there based thinking hard about what's there based thinking hard about what's there based on things I've observed and others have on things I've observed and others have on things I've observed and others have observed, but we really need to figure observed, but we really need to figure observed, but we really need to figure out a way to let them tell us what out a way to let them tell us what out a way to let them tell us what they're thinking. they're thinking. they're thinking. >> Amazing. Vander Herman, thank you for >> Amazing. Vander Herman, thank you for >> Amazing. Vander Herman, thank you for coming on the A16Z show. coming on the A16Z show. coming on the A16Z show. >> Thanks for having me here.